What It Takes to Influence High-Consideration Purchases

Speaker A: Hey everybody. Welcome to the Brandians podcast series. Go beyond where we take a look at the uh, topics that are affecting marketers today and in the future. I'm your host Brian McHale and thanks for joining us. And today, uh, we've got a little bit different topic than what we've done in the past. Uh, today we're going to talk about marketing, uh, in industries where uh, it's very important that consumers make the right decision. And what we mean by that is, uh, we're talking about categories or industries that are a little more complex where if a consumer makes a decision it might have a long term impact on them or their family. Uh, it might be something that uh, it can be a little risky. Some of those categories could include things like health care. They could include uh, insurance or financial, uh, so very complex type categories. Uh, and so I'm really happy today to have three people joining me on the podcast who are very good and knowledgeable about marketing, uh, to comp complex industries. So first, Molly Neff, associate creative Director at Brandiance. Welcome Molly. Molly, uh, spends a lot of her days uh, in time thinking about complex messaging and ways to uh, uh, be very creative in a complex world. Uh, joining us too is Sarah Bolan. Sarah is an account director at Brandians. And Sarah, uh, is on the client leadership side and also thinks a lot about how to uh, strategically connect with uh, consumers. Consumers in complex categories. And last but not least, Bill, uh, Bercin, our vice president of media. Uh, Bill is uh, here today to help us think about how in the world do we um, delineate complex messages and get them in front of the right people at the right time. So a lot of good conversation I think today. And again thanks to all of you for joining us. Um, I think what I'll start with is just kind of a general question to the table. So feel free to, to kind of jump in. Uh, but um, how would you all answer? What makes marketing different when consumers feel like they can't afford to make the wrong choice. Anybody have a thought on that?

Speaker B: I mean I'll just start by saying they're coming into the situation with a lot of emotion. Um, anxiety. They feel like they might not be educated on whatever um, service that they're looking for. So they're coming in with a lot of emotion and you have to play towards that. You really have to think about their mindset, uh, when they're coming into that situation.

Speaker C: And I would build on that to say for categories like that that are more complex, it's more Important than ever to give the consumer confidence in what you're going to deliver for them. So it kind of minimizes, helps minimize the risk in their mind.

Speaker D: Yeah. And I would just add, I mean we're talking things that have a lot longer purchase cycle or a lot more thought behind them. So you know, from a media perspective, we also the complexity and we're going to get into this a lot deeper, but the complexity really impacts how and where we can put things in terms of messaging.

Speaker A: So we're not talking about the average purchase here. Right. This is much different than I'm going to go out and buy whatever it is off the shelf. We're talking about something that's complex and something that takes some thought, um, or should take some thought, uh, from a consumer standpoint before they pull the trigger. So, um, let's talk a little bit about why these categories are different. And Sarah, I'll start with you. Um, what are some common traits that you would say are across the industries that I mentioned, for example like health care insurance or retail banking or really any other high involvement category that might come to mind?

Speaker C: I think with a high involvement category, I mean it is something that impacts your livelihood, like literally your health or your financial success, um, for you and your family. So I mean across any of those, it's really back to you said at the beginning, high stakes and that's why it's high involvement. Um, so I would, I think that's a common trait among that is the just the impact of a consumer's uh, very base needs, financial and health bill.

Speaker A: Let's build on that. How does consumer behavior change when you're in these types of categories?

Speaker D: Yeah, I would say that again, it goes back to more investigation. Um, I was reading somewhere where in these types of categories consumers aren't as much shoppers as they are more. They were referred to as investigators. And I loved that because they're really doing their research and they may be very brand loyal to something, but they're not necessarily just going to stick with that brand all the time. In these types of categories that are going to shop and they're going to research and they're going to compare and contrast before they make the decision.

Speaker A: So high involvement categories really are less about transactions and more about decisions.

Speaker D: Yeah, I mean, thinking about it like shoppers going into a convenience store to buy a soft drink or go through a restaurant drive through, those are more impulse decisions and emotional decisions and consumers are going to slow down and not jump at something like that. I mean, I'm not going to sign a contract for health insurance on a whim. I'm going to think it through.

Speaker A: So Molly, from a creative standpoint, complexity has to create challenges. What are some of those challenges as you think about it?

Speaker B: I think just gaining trust in so few words or such a small space, because that really is the basis of a high stakes decision. You don't have to build a lot of trust to go to the store and buy a pair of shoes, um, but you gotta have a lot of trust in your healthcare system or your banking provider, um, if um, that's the one you want to choose. So making sure that you're trying to touch on that in as few words as possible is always a challenge.

Speaker A: I think trust is, I think it's a great theme and really a great word for these categories. Um, but trust isn't typically just built overnight with brands, particularly a high, high complex brand. So, um, Bill, what role does media play in helping to build trust versus a lot of times in media you're thinking about conversion, uh, but trust isn't about conversion necessarily. Maybe someday, hopefully, but take some time.

Speaker D: Yeah, I mean in my mind, um, to build trust. Media's role in building trust is not necessarily frequency, just for frequency sake, but being out there. Top of mind. Because when a consumer is making a decision, let's just take banking in this case as an example and they've got four or five different possible solutions or banking brands that they could choose, uh, from. Uh, they're going to automatically start to research the ones that come to mind first, which goes back to top of mind awareness and things like that. You know, I would say that a good frequency and knowing, you know, I also always go back to all of the insurance companies that are out there. I mean it's crazy how much you see them in the awareness type, upper funnel, uh, tactics that really aren't telling you anything at all about insurance. They're basically just more or less making sure that their name is stuck in your mind. And then you start, you know, the consumer starts to make decisions once they get into the nitty gritty of, you know, website research and things like that

Speaker A: just to build on that. I love that insurance example. Um, and anybody can answer this or all can, but I um, think about insurance, right? And many insurance carriers now are using humor to try to sell. So how does that fit with trust? Uh, because you know, they're wanting to build trust. So any thoughts on that, where that falls or how that's working together?

Speaker B: I would say that just building your brand awareness as like an underlying factor as you are also, um, building on top of that with other categories of your business. So each one of the services that you provide, you're going to have a different campaign for each one of those things and you're going to talk about those in different ways. Um, but you always have to have that always on underlying brand awareness so that you are top of mind once somebody is making that decision.

Speaker D: Yeah, I'm sorry. I think about in my experience, and I've worked in all of, not all, but all three of the categories we've talked about. And to Molly's point, I mean there's always that kind of that awareness, always on awareness, that is whether you're telling a deep, detailed story, complex story, um, in that usually you're not usually, you know, Affleck's using a duck to be humorous. And then where you get into the complexity, uh, is, you know, on their website or in their collateral and uh, their mailings and things like that. So, you know, and service lines come into play there too. So, you know, all those guys have different multiple service lines, whether it's car insurance, homeowners, life insurance, so on and so forth.

Speaker A: You were gonna say something, sir?

Speaker C: I was just thinking about like the role of humor, which we know that with the DOC and various insurance, uh, campaigns, one thing it does do besides awareness is then that it creates like a sense of familiarity. And I think familiar builds trust. Familiarity builds trust because you know it. So if you know something, it just gets you a little bit closer to trust. They have to do more and there has to be some other proof points there because of the high stakes. But if you one step beyond awareness is that familiarity and approachability.

Speaker B: Sure. I think humor does a lot of that too.

Speaker A: Yeah. So let's stick with creative just for a sec, Molly. So, um, in these complex categories, healthcare insurance, um, you can't really be self promotional. Uh, in many ways. I mean you are promoting something, but you can't feel like you're self promoting. And what are some ways to get around that where you, where you can promote but you're not feeling salesy?

Speaker B: Yeah, I think that a lot of people use a lot of buzzwords when it comes to that self promotion. But it's really about showing the proof of, you know, you can say you're a leader in the field, but showing, okay, well what are you doing to become a leader? Like where's the proof in that? Um, to give yourself credibility. Um, and then just layering on that and continuing to do that across Time. So yeah,

Speaker A: thinking, um, about that kind of that layering piece and what Molly was saying. Sarah, how does reputation and inexperience influence trust when you think about brands you've worked on here?

Speaker C: Well, I kind of going to go on when you said proof. So I think about the proof points and reputation and how do you establish that. And things like rankings and referrals can help drive reputation. And ultimately I think that's where you know, back to building trust. If consumers see, or potential consumers see others that have had success with your business and again that's like through testimonials or rankings and referrals, things like that, then I think they feel more confident that this person has success, I can have success with them. Um, I think it becomes even more powerful when it's uh, family and friends are of course the first, foremost referral that you would trust. But, but beyond that, other groups are uh, like credentialing almost. But as long as it comes from an authentic source, um, I think that can help drive that reputation and it's super important in establishing trust.

Speaker B: Yeah, I think that becomes part of your kind of ongoing, always on brand awareness is, um, this patient testimonials or customer reviews and things like that and promoting those in a way as self promotion, um, because it does become word of mouth, um, which is a huge part of marketing for these kinds of companies.

Speaker A: So it's a good, so good segue into something I wanted to talk about. Um, a lot of times I've seen brands when they have, when they're in a complex category, um, they think, hey, the more information we can get out there, the better. Um, and often that leads to just consumer confusion because you're hitting them with a lot. Um, and I think consumers can handle complexity. They just don't want to be confused. And so, uh, Molly, how do you simplify without oversimplifying?

Speaker B: I think you have to think about the journey. Um, so for example, if you're creating a digital banner ad, you can't put all of what you're trying to tell them. And one, some people do, there are

Speaker A: some brands that might disagree with you,

Speaker B: but you want to reduce the friction. Um, you want to make it the easiest path of entry, but while still being understandable, um, and approachable. So in that banner ad you want, obviously you have to prioritize your messaging, um, and grab their attention. But then what is the process after that? So you know, what are they clicking through to? What's the next piece of information that they're going to get? Um, and think about how that journey goes and what makes sense for them and what's going to play, um, not play on their emotions, but, um, put them at ease, put their emotions at ease in these situations.

Speaker A: So Sarah, what happens when brands try to say everything at once? I mean from a consumer standpoint, what have you seen?

Speaker C: I think it's just like people saying everything at once. You hear nothing. So you really have to be choiceful. Um, you mentioned confusion. I mean if you say too much, they're going to miss what was the one key point you wanted them to know about your brand or your service? Um, so it could cause confusion. And confusion actually takes away from trust because they don't know what you're talking about. And that's a scary feeling in and of itself. So, um, yeah, I think it's just too much of information is no information at all.

Speaker A: Yeah, agreed.

Speaker D: Becomes noise.

Speaker A: Yeah, it does become noise, you're right. So Bill, how can channels and content from your perspective, from a media perspective, be structured to help reduce confusion?

Speaker D: Well, first off, I'm a firm believer that every channel has to have a defined role in, um, some of those roles. I hate to always go back to awareness and conversion and funnel and all those references, but they do. Um, so in working with the creative team, I have to take into consideration how much do we have to communicate, how much do we have to get across. In some cases it may be as simple as, you know, I don't want to say getting cute, but being very simple in a banner ad or being very simple in an outdoor board that just it piques someone's interest to then go get more information. And that's where all the details fall, if that makes sense. Um, you know, or, you know, that gets into, do you buy 60s over 30s or you know, uh, I mean I'm seeing some stuff right now this summer in the World cup, uh, programming that's 120s and that's not necessarily trying to get more information out, that's just trying to be more entertaining. But it also goes back to when you're putting together media plans for these types of brands and services. You really need to have multiple layers and really truly surround the consumer because you're not going to be able to get it all across in one or two tactics. Um, you just can't, I think, layering

Speaker B: it the creative side of things and channels and the media team have to work together really closely because you can't say the same message everywhere. Sometimes it just doesn't make sense to say the message here and in this place. So, um, you can make it work in your favor, um, by having some complex messaging and, and saying one thing here. Maybe they're going to hear this on social media and they're going to see this on tv. And putting those two together really brings the full idea of what you're trying to communicate to them. So like you said, surrounding them at every point where they are, um, and speaking to them, the things that they need to hear in those moments is something that you have to look at the big picture.

Speaker D: Uh, and the other challenge is that we're talking about industries that tend to have a lot of regulations and a lot of disclaimers and things like that. So I mean, my favorite is, is that you legally can get by with someone talking, you know, five times sped up at the end, and nobody's understanding what that, what that disclaimer is.

Speaker A: But hey, except the attorney.

Speaker D: You've checked that box. So.

Speaker A: Right. Well, and I don't, I don't think consumers necessarily expect simplicity, but they expect clarity.

Speaker D: Clarity.

Speaker A: Yeah. They want to, they want to. Just back to what Sarah was saying. They want to make sure they're not confused, because if they're confused, they're going to tune you out. Doesn't matter how, uh, focused, uh, the message is. If they're confused, it's not going anywhere.

Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, in this day and age, they expect an easy entry. So if anything is difficult at any part of the process, I think that they could potentially just be like, okay, well, I'm out. This is too hard. I'm going to go to the next.

Speaker A: Well, let's talk about that easy entry. I love that area. In a lot of ways we talk about that as accessibility, you know, and just for, just to make sure we're not confusing. You know, sometimes when we talk about accessibility, we're talking about ADA compliance on websites or things like that. But in this case, it really is that point of entry. Consumers, um, knowing where to go to find the information, making it easy for them to find, uh, find the information, um, which is so important, I think, in complex categories because oftentimes when people are engaging with these categories, it's a stressful time. Maybe there's a health. Something that's going on and they need to do some research or, um, financially, they've got to try to solve an issue. And so they've got to get going and try to make some decisions. So, um, in those stressful moments, Molly, how do you make content or creative useful? What are the types of things you're thinking about as you're going down that path.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I agree with you. They're already in this high stakes emotional mindset so you have to think uh, about that even more. I mean, um, so you want to make things as simplified as you can. Um, you want to make it to where they don't even really have to realize that they are investigating or that they're doing research. Um, that journey just needs to be seamless to them. So I think it goes back to um, what is that path? What's the first thing that you're saying to them? Where's the landing page that they're clicking on that they're going to next? What is that message that they need to see next in order to continue, um, into conversion or doing more research to just simplify the process for them as much as possible.

Speaker C: I was thinking when you were talking about the journey, the consumer journey and having brands show up every step of the way with the information they need, which kind of goes back to the media choices, is, you know, that it's not just a, ah, quick, uh, media engagement like a social post. And they act there's going to be multiple steps within this decision making. And so for a brand to reassure them and um, by showing up consistently, uh, and I was just thinking when you were talking about the layering of the messaging or the simplicity of the messaging, that's important but also the consistency is as important because then they get to know, oh, they're saying this again, and they're saying this again. It must be true because it keeps showing up. So I think that's another factor.

Speaker B: When brands as a whole, their brand comes across as consistent and they're not kind, um, of picking and choosing which thing they want to sell to you here. And they're going to do that in a different way than they sell something else to you. Um, and when it's all under the same umbrella, you kind of feel like, well, I can go to them for anything. M. And it makes your decision that much easier because their brand is consistent as a whole.

Speaker C: And I think as an agency, that's our job. That's where we come in. When a client that is in a complex category has all these things, they could say we need to help identify what are the priorities, what are the most important things you should say. You could say all of this, but what should you say at each of these? And that's really, I think like our job to help get to that. Um, because it helps us make decisions too when we have to distill something down to a few words or we have to decide where is this message going to show up. Um, so just knowing like the priorities is I think really important.

Speaker A: Sarah, uh, you mentioned use the word journey, uh, a, uh, couple minutes ago. And a lot of what we were just talking about as it relates to accessibility is it's customer experience. So why should marketing and customer, why is it so important that marketing and customer experience work together?

Speaker C: Well, it's delivering on the expectations you set. So you have to kind of like do what you say you're gonna do or trust is gone. So, um, I mean in our business we always talk about like you don't just you meet expectations, you want to exceed expectations. So as a brand, especially in these high stakes, high involvement categories, you better be able to deliver what you're saying you're gonna deliver. Because if it comes to money, health, your well being and you are let down or you thought the brand was going to deliver on something and the experience isn't there, then you're never going to trust that brand again. And you're going to be actually even more, I think, um, compelled to give the bad testimonial. Never use, never use them. I had this horrible experience. So it's ever important. Back to prioritizing messaging. Pick the ones that you deliver the best on because that will be, then you'll be the most authentic because you know you can deliver it.

Speaker B: Yeah. Delivering on the promises that you're making. So your marketing has to match what you're doing operationally. Um, and like I said before showing approving, um, all of those buzzwords that you're using in your marketing and instead of just making a blanket statement and trying to win business on a claim that you're not backing. Right.

Speaker A: Um, ah, and it's, you know, it's from the marketer's seat, we often will say things like, hey, we can, we can say whatever you want or we can figure out the brand story or the narrative that, that, that fits what you would like to have happen. But if operations isn't on board or isn't even aware of what we're saying, then, um, it doesn't matter what we say because it just, it's going to fall on deaf ears eventually. Um, from a consumer standpoint. But you could also say from an operations standp that they could be sitting there saying, we can't deliver that. So I don't know why you guys are saying this. Yeah. So it really does. The two areas have to work, I think about Even in a non complex category. Bill, I'm looking at you because we've done a lot of work in kind of non complex restaurant and retail. And even in those scenarios, if experience isn't matching up, um, there's nothing we can do about it. It suddenly becomes a non marketing issue. Uh, even if we've got fabulous media budgets that we can put something in front of anybody at any time.

Speaker D: Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, it doesn't matter to me. It doesn't matter what category we're talking, uh, marketing and ops have to sink. Yeah.

Speaker A: So let's get back, uh, just to kind of, uh, wrap up on the accessibility piece of it. Um, if it's about experience, if it's about people being able to find information, one of the first places you have to talk about or think about is search. And uh, what does search behavior tell us about what's going on here, Bill, Are we seeing any changes in anything going on these days or are there things that you're thinking about from a search standpoint in these complex categories that might be useful to marketers?

Speaker D: Well, first off, search is changing all the time, so we have to stay on top of that. But in this particular category, these actually are some of the, when you look at these categories, these are some of the highest spend categories in the search tactic. Um, and in a lot of cases the general population doesn't see that because when somebody is searching something, they're at that very, very bottom of the funnel ready to go and ready to, they're doing their deep research. Um, so when you see the Aflac duck on TV that's out there to the masses, search is one to one in catching, you know, somebody that's, that's lower funnel. Um, and you have to, you have to cover all your bases. So like for example, again, you know, whether I'll use banking for this example, you have to have all your ducks in a row. I keep talking about ducks, but uh, you have to have all your ducks in a row for every, you know, for commercial banking, for retail banking, all of those are literally, uh, every service line is basically a brand in and of itself, if that makes sense. And that's where your keywords that you're bidding on and things like that all have to be very, very thorough. And it's, I mean any category search is so competitive. But the other thing where I was going with it earlier is you could tell the big brands. When you're talking mass media, you can't really necessarily always tell the big brands from a search standpoint. And I would be willing to bet you that almost every brand, major brand in these categories that we're talking about search, if it's not the top of their spend in terms of their mix, it's in the top three most likely.

Speaker A: Mhm. And that makes sense, really. Right. I'm trying to influence at the very beginning and then keep them.

Speaker D: Right? Yeah. Because you want, going back to that whole top of mind awareness you want. Not only do you want to show up as well as you can in search, but you also want to be recognizable as soon as you're seen there. So, you know, somebody searching for banks and they see fifth or bank, they're going to say, oh, I know them as opposed to, you know, if it's a bank that they're not familiar with.

Speaker A: So let's kind of, in a roundabout way, you're talking a little bit about funnel. Right. And, and, and so let's, let's kind of stay there for a second. If you know, we've talked about clarity and understanding and how important those things are and that's, that's further upstream typically. Right. And you can't ever lose that. But that's, that, that's top of funnel. If we still want to use a funnel. Um, but what. At the end of the day, we still want to create some action, uh, for whatever brand we're working on, complex or not. So in a complex kind of scenario, uh, what, what, Sarah, what creates confidence for consumers as they're getting closer and closer to this decision?

Speaker C: I think back to, uh, proof. So if I'm searching and I'm debating between potentially two different offerings or brands, one, if one has more proof points, back to those referrals, rankings, certified. Uh, you know, I'm thinking depending on what the category is, there's any kind of, um, accreditations that you could have. But something that tells me this one's a safe choice. This one's like a proven entity and it's people, you know, whether it's, you know, has the most of something or the most, uh, I don't know, back to like stars. I don't know what kind of ratings. There's a variety of them. But I would say that you can create that confidence with those proof points at the moment when they're ready to go. And so like bottom of the funnel.

Speaker A: M. Yeah. Bill, what about, what about what signals. What signals establish confidence, um, throughout a, throughout a journey that means something to you from a media standpoint?

Speaker D: Yeah, I mean, I go back to that whole of, uh, consistent Messaging, transparent messaging. And when I know we're talking, you know, I'm the media person here. But it really does go back to, you can hit them over the head with as much frequency, but if it's not transparent and consistent and it goes back to the whole confusion thing, you're going to strike out there. Um, but you know, Sarah was touching on like four stars or five stars and things like that. Reviews are another huge thing. Um, that, uh, you know, and that, that can be a dicey area too because there's a lot of fake reviews out there. But reviews is another one for me personally that I think if you've got a solid set of really, really strong reviews, you need to be pushing those out there. And it gets, that gets into a broader thing too of testimonials and endorsements and things like that.

Speaker A: So, um, I've heard that sometimes brands will exaggerate their promises in advertising. Uh, and so, uh, let's say a brand is doing that or is thinking about doing that. Molly, from a creative standpoint and in thinking about that, building that consumer confidence, how can you reinforce confidence without exaggerating promise? Because that's the easy place to go is just promise the world the best. Yeah, but that's not always the right way to do it.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, you have to make a connection with your target audience. I mean there has to be some sort of like relationship building. So if they feel like it isn't genuine, I don't know that it's like that feeling that they get if they're gives them the ick, you know, if I feel like this doesn't seem trustworthy. Um, and a lot of times when you're using those blanket statements or generic buzzwords, that kind of sets off a red flag. Um, so again, you want to think about the emotional state that they're in in these high stakes situations and really think about how you can speak to them in a way that's going to ease their fears or calm the senses, uh, at that moment.

Speaker A: Anything, um, else anybody wants to add on that one before I jump out? It looked like you had something.

Speaker C: Yeah, I was just thinking about like the, um. Now I'm going to say it, I lost my train of thought.

Speaker B: What were you just easing their.

Speaker C: Oh, no, it's what I was thinking is. Which only comes from having true, like insights about your consumer. So we as marketers can say this sounds like the best thing to say, but we need to make sure that it's going to resonate with that person in their whatever that state is. So I think this is again where we back to being authentic and having proof points and building the relationship. All these things we've talked about. We need to make sure it's grounded in like a real consumer insight. How do we know what is most important to them, what their decision making process is? Uh, we talk about like um, key decision drivers at the moment and how they impact consideration and recommendation. That takes like some research. So if many clients have it already and they can share that and we can use that to ground our recommendations. But if they don't, that's where I think we need to ask uh, the question and make sure we get clarity. Um, just to make sure that what we say will in fact resonate.

Speaker B: Yeah, brands should definitely be putting in the work on the back end to make sure that they're understanding the mindset, um, of their consumer. And without that, where are they gonna go? I mean nothing they say is gonna be genuine, um, or something that they're gonna attach themselves to because they're not speaking in the way that the consumer is thinking. So they really should be putting in the work to get down to the bottom of it or know who they need to talk to. Um, because I think a lot of times some people feel left out of whatever category that they're shopping for. So they immediately can um, brush over companies because they're not considering their, whatever it may be, demographic or um, so they really have to think about that too and who their audience is to connect with them.

Speaker A: This is to the table. Is there, is there one thing that you could think of that you'd love to see improved about communication in high stakes categories? Are there trends that maybe you're not liking or seeing or something?

Speaker B: I think going back to not throwing all of the information at once, um, picking and choosing what the best message is, where, um, to put that message to meet the consumer, where they're at. Um, but yeah, not throwing the whole book at them and just simplifying things and clarifying things and making things easier.

Speaker C: And it goes back to the priorities because there's the things that you do as a company and then there's the things that your consumers need. And connecting those dots is the most powerful place. And that can help you decide your priorities. Because an organization could deliver a lot of things, but if half of them their prime prospect or consumer doesn't need or care about as much, it's not as important to them. Then don't spend your time and money talking about that. And also it's knowing your Competition too. Because if you can do five things and your competition can do three of those, like you pick the two that you do uniquely that are going to be important to your. So for me it's about the context and the consumer needs and then connecting to that, that to what your organization can deliver. So just an exercise in priorities, prioritization.

Speaker D: Yeah.

Speaker B: Uh, a lot of times brands, they are doing the exact same things or offering the exact same services, but it's how they're speaking to their audience that makes them go one or the consumer go one way or the other. Um, so I think it's just going back to speaking to them where they're at and where their mindset is.

Speaker D: Yeah, I would just add to that most of these categories, um, have like a point of entry and usually that tends to be some of the more simpler communication and messaging. So if I was a CMO or a director of marketing at one of these brands, my strategy would literally be to focus as much of your, your time, attention and resources towards that. I don't like to say low hanging fruit or easiest point of entry. And then you know, hopefully everyone that's working at that brand is living in, breathing those brand truths. And then they can bring, you know, like in banking, get them in with checking and then start to sell them on all the other products. Same thing could be for insurance, same thing could be for health care. So um, I think it'd be a lot less or a lot. Yeah. A lot less cluttered if we went that route. Mhm.

Speaker A: Good points. Um, okay, so it's time for us to go to our lightning round. Um, and so what we do here is I have one question for each of you and we'll just start right here. Molly. Um, one word that destroys trust in marketing.

Speaker B: I don't know if I could pick one word. I would say those buzzwords again. Like leaders and the best, um, just like generic words. Let's prove it. Let's tell a story. Let's. Yeah, so I would just say those like generic buzzwords in general.

Speaker A: All right, Sarah. Uh, most common communication mistake in complex

Speaker C: categories, saying too much.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Bill. One consumer behavior trend marketers underestimate.

Speaker D: I would say consumers themselves. I think, uh, consumers are a lot smarter than we give them credit at being. And especially I think the younger generations are a lot more savvy consumers than the older generations. And they're researching. Um, a lot of them are very brand loyal from a young age and it's because they've done their research and um, you know, they feel very, very strongly about it. And I don't think marketers in a lot of cases give the consumer that much credit. I think they're a lot smarter than we think.

Speaker A: Um, good. All right, so before we wrap up, one bonus question. So, thinking about, um, the people watching this today, CMOs, vice presidents, marketing, et cetera. What's one piece of advice for those marketing leaders that are responsible for high stakes brands? Any advice for them?

Speaker B: I would say that the consumer isn't always looking for the answer. They're really looking for someone to hold their hand, um, that they can trust throughout whatever process or journey that it may be. So don't try to solve all of the problems with one message or one campaign. Um, make yourself approachable enough that they feel like they can trust you throughout the whole process.

Speaker A: Sarah, Bill, Anybody?

Speaker C: I think I said it before when I was talking about the priorities. Know your priorities. Focus in on that.

Speaker D: I would echo that. And then the simpler you can be, the better.

Speaker A: That's good. That's very simple. That's a good way. That's a good way. That's a good way to end it. And I think, um, we kind of started here. But just to sum up, a lot of what we've talked about today is when the stakes are high, uh, in these types of categories, marketing becomes less about persuasion and more about guidance. I mean, I don't know that we use the word guidance today, but it's really what we're talking about. How are we able to help those consumers through the journey, uh, and keep them once they're on that journey? Well, Molly, Sarah, Bill, thank you so much for joining today and thank you all for watching, uh, this episode of Go Beyond. We hope you will follow and like and give us comments. And also, uh, in the notes you will see that you can sign up for our, uh, brandiance newsletter. So on, um, behalf of everybody here, thanks again and we look forward to seeing you on the next episode of Go Beyond.