Over A Pint Marketing Podcast · 2026-07-22 · 1h 15m
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
52 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
Angi Krueger's career trajectory offers a masterclass in organizational growth and personal development within a single firm. Starting at Core Creative when it had one shared cell phone and one email address for the entire company, she progressed from production artist to VP over 24 years, witnessing firsthand the agency's evolution from startup to handling major accounts like Aurora Healthcare, PrimeCo (later Verizon Wireless), and Milwaukee Tool. Her background in graphic design from University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee informed her creative foundation, but her real education came from the entrepreneurial grind at Core - learning to work on the business rather than just in it, managing teams, and eventually leading business development efforts. What makes Krueger's story compelling for B2B operators is her emphasis on company culture, the emotional weight of scaling (hiring and firing), and the unique value of the "See It, Live It" brand philosophy that Core developed - positioning brands identically inside and out. Her decision to eventually leave Core for OwnersEdge represents a significant career pivot worth understanding for anyone navigating leadership transitions in service-based businesses.
It's Core's approach to brand positioning where the brand is externally and internally the same thing, built from the inside out. The philosophy emphasizes solid brand strategy first, then uses insights to create emotional campaigns that connect with audiences.
She credits the entrepreneurial culture and sense of building something bigger than herself, combined with strong leadership from the four partners who started the firm. She felt genuine emotional ownership in the business from the ground level, which kept her engaged despite industry challenges like losing accounts and having to lay off staff.
The agency had zero experience in that industry initially, but received an introductory meeting that snowballed into a three-year engagement. Milwaukee Tool became such a major account that it eventually required dozens of dedicated staff and dominated the agency's capacity and growth.
She progressed from production artist to associate art director, then senior art director, director of creative services, and eventually VP, taking on increasing management and business development responsibilities as the agency scaled.
She worked at Milwaukee Magazine in their production department, then as an intern at a small graphic design business, and her first full-time job was as a graphic designer and production artist at Mark Travel Corporation from approximately 1996-1998.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode contains useful career and business insights - particularly around long-term company building, the transition from agency to corporate marketing, and CMO strategy in a holding company structure - but is heavily padded with personal anecdotes (tennis career, beer preferences, college selection) that consume roughly 20 minutes of a 75-minute episode. While the Owner's Edge and brand-building sections offer substance, the density of novel, non-obvious ideas per minute is diluted by storytelling that, while charming, doesn't meaningfully educate a B2B operator.
When you're small, you wear a lot of hats and you're involved in everything. You know, we didn't have traffic managers. We didn't have AES. We didn't have a client service team.
It's garbage in, garbage out, right? I need solid, solid strategy, solid messaging. Solid differentiation.
The guest recycles standard frameworks (brand strategy, digital infrastructure, SEO/lead generation KPIs, finding product-market fit in new business). The ESOP holding company model itself is somewhat novel, but the discussion of how to execute marketing within it relies on conventional wisdom: do brand work first, establish websites, measure what matters. Little contrarian or first-principles thinking emerges; the insight that 'everyone is a business development resource' is solid but well-trodden.
Your brand is externally and internally the same thing. And that brand is built from the inside out.
We're approaching the, uh, way I'm approaching it is brand is first, right? Brand and digital infrastructure.
Angie Krieger is a solid, legitimate operator: 24 years at a growing creative agency (rising to VP), direct involvement in new business development and scaling, and now CMO of a diversified holding company with real portfolio companies. She's not a thought-leader or consultant - she's done the actual work. However, she is relatively junior in her CMO role (~1.5 years) and her current context (holding company with no established marketing infrastructure) is atypical, limiting the breadth of advanced lessons she can share about mature B2B marketing execution.
I was one of core's first employees, really. Um, the company had been existence maybe two to three years. Um, when I was there, there was four owners.
I moved into a role of what we call director of creative services then too. So I got more into the management side of the business
The episode names specific companies (Aurora Healthcare, PrimeCo/Verizon, Milwaukee Tool, Owner's Edge portfolio: CCNN, Bacom, Qcom, Impleco, Ashen Spencer) and mentions concrete numbers (70 employees at Core at exit, $5M - $50M portfolio company range, some employee ESOP holdings over $1M). However, most claims lack hard data: no revenue figures, conversion metrics, campaign ROI, timeline specifics for turnarounds, or quantified marketing impact. Statements like 'we got great wins' and 'it's working' remain vague. The discussion is rich in names but sparse in numbers that would let an operator calibrate her own decisions.
I think I want to say core is over 70 employees. Uh, when I started, you know, like I said, I was one of the first employees or probably five.
We have, right now they range uh, across the board. So CCNN was the founding company. [...] all more mid market size companies
The hosts ask reasonable open-ended questions and show genuine curiosity, but rarely push back or challenge claims. When Angie discusses organic growth vs. deliberate strategy, the hosts nod along rather than probe deeper. Kurt's observation about relationships overriding vertical experience is solid, but he doesn't follow up with hard questions: How much did Milwaukee Tool's familiarity with you matter vs. your pitch? What did you propose they do differently? The conversation meanders - few tight follow-ups, little productive tension, and the hosts defer easily to the guest's framing. A strong interview would excavate the tension between wanting to 'do brand strategy' while admitting budget constraints and competing priorities.
You know, if I could, you know, uh, comment, really. Question for you, Angie. And one of the. One of the things I love about doing this podcast, I just love. It doesn't even matter what we're talking about if we're talking about engineering, advertising. I just love the stories
I gotta ask, how does a Milwaukee Tool, which is a behemoth, I mean, it's a big national player. Mhm. How did that meeting, that initial meeting come about?
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
#196 From the achieve - Kurt and Pat meet up with Angi Krueger. Angi is…well…she is a lot of things. A long-time member of Milwaukee's ad community, storyteller, brand builder, and now CMO at OwnersEdge. Here's what they cover: Her start in the marketing game. Her 24-year run at Core Creative Making the leap from agency to client side of the business What's a day in the life of a CMO like What metrics she's tracking What's her superpower The TV show that changed her life Here's how you can
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
Speaker A: We are back. It's another episode of Over a Pint. This is the last one, Kurt, for 2023. We're bringing it on home for another year. We've got Angie Krieger on the podcast today. The. This is going to be a good one to close up the year. I'm excited about it. Let's get started. You got me Pat McGovern, director of new biz at Acedia. You got Mr. Kurt Lingo, my sidekick, my main man who's always with me during this, uh, these podcasts. And today we have on, um, Angie Krieger. Angie is the CMO at Owner's Edge. That's just part of her story. She is a longtime member of the ad community here. We're going to get into a lot of good stuff. Angel, welcome to the podcast.
Speaker B: Well, thank you very much. I'm really honored to be here. I'm an avid listener, and so it's really surreal to actually be the one being interviewed on this podcast.
Speaker A: Yeah, this is it. This is it. Uh, thank you so much for being on here, Angel. Like we said prior to, you know, hitting the record button, we got a little tradition here at Over A Pine. We like to talk about what we're drinking. It's the. What's Today's date? The 20th. It's basically the holiday for everybody in Milwaukee. Okay.
Speaker B: Pretty much, yes.
Speaker A: So, Ant, what do you got in front of you?
Speaker B: Well, this might be wrong to do, but I actually have a. I have a lakefront brewery glass, but inside, I have a what's left of summer Shandy from Leinenkugel from the summer. So that might just be wrong brand confusion. Right. But, um, it's what I have. You know, actually, I had. It's good to keep drinking this because, you know, summer is past, obviously, but my. My son graduated from high school this last summer, and believe it or not, this is still leftovers from his graduation party. So that's what I have,
Speaker A: Mr. Lingle.
Speaker C: Well, and I don't think, you know, in this case, Angie, I don't see it as brand confusion. I see it as you're spreading the love around to two different brands. So therefore, you post copy, we're gonna. We're gonna promote both brands. All right, What I've got here is, um, I think I had this last time, and it just so happens to be what I have in my fridge right now. But I've got great brewery up in Sheboygan. It's Three Sheeps. I love what these guys are doing. This is their offshore West Coast Style ipa. Um, I love Three Sheeps, I really do. I think they're doing some great stuff. But, uh, that's what I have today, so. Cheers.
Speaker B: Love the label.
Speaker A: And, uh, uh, I'm going to continue with the Lakefront Brewery. I've got a River West Stein here going on, so that's what I am enjoying here today. I'm going to crack this open right now. Oh, yeah, that sounds good. All right, enough with the beer talk. All right, let's get into this and why don't you start us off, give us a little bit of background, give the millions of our fans a, uh, lowdown on your background.
Speaker B: Yeah, um, it's a long one, I'm sure, but, um, when I started out, I guess back in the day, just picking where I was going to go to college. What are you going to do when you grow up? Um, I wasn't really sure. Um, I actually took a lot of mechanical drawing classes and that type of thing back in high school. And I loved that. I thought I wanted to get into engineering, um, completely opposite side of the brain. So that was kind of my intent. Um, however, my guidance counselor really never clearly informed me there'd be that much math involved with engineering. So anyway, um, when picking a school, I actually went, uh, to University of Wisconsin, Milwaukee. Um, and I chose UWM because they had a lot of different types of majors, including engineering, architecture, that kind of thing. Um, but ultimately I wanted to play college, um, sports. And so I actually was fortunate enough to receive a scholarship to play tennis at UWM. So they were newly D1, um, and it was just a really fortunate, serendipitous, um, situation for me. So I was able to do that plus go to school. And ironically, I have a college age student now, a college freshman, and he was going through this similar process, trying to figure out where he wanted to go. And it's just kind of fun because when I look back, um, it was such a, just a unique experience that I had. And I was very lucky that UWM was so diverse that I knew in the first three weeks engineering was not the major for me. I mean, it was a little crazy, but I just never forget sitting in a chemistry class after like two classes and being like, this is way over my head already. So, um, fortunately they had a lot of majors to choose from. And ironically at the time, I don't know if you guys remember this is gonna date myself, but back in the 90s, there was a show on TV called 30 something. Do you guys remember that.
Speaker A: Oh yeah.
Speaker B: And I would watch that show. I was like, what, what are these guys doing? They look like they're having a lot of fun and this is really kind of cool. They own this firm. And so anyway, I, you know, obviously it was advertising, right? So I started scouring UWM's majors and uh, landed in graphic design. So actually that's my background and that's what I majored in. I came up the art side of the business. So, um, yeah, that's how I started things out.
Speaker A: And when you were at UW Milwaukee, did you play tennis all four years? Did that continue?
Speaker B: I did, yep. Nope. I played all four years of tennis. And actually kind of a little segue to that is that I actually got to play a year of basketball too. I had a really hard time deciding which sport I wanted to play in college. And I'm only 5 6, a little short and uh, there's no way I was going to make a D1 basketball team. But crazy enough, my junior year they had um, season ending injuries for several players. And um, I had been taking basketball as a class and the um, assistant women's basketball coach was the teacher and it was co ed and she pulled me aside one day after class and was like, hey, I've seen you around the athletic building. What's boring sport do you play? And so will tennis. And um, I, my high school coach actually played for the same coach that was there now. And she said, she said this is going to be some kind of strange, but we're having open tryouts. You know, you could talk to your tennis coach and it might work out with your season, but you know, would you be interested in trying out? And it was like a dream come true, you know, I just, I had that opportunity to do that and um, yeah, made the team and it was fun. I only played that one season and it was a rough season for them because they were short players. But I'll tell you what, it was just an amazing experience and I'm so glad I got the opportunity to do it. Yeah, it was really, really cool. I mean, I got to play on Notre Dame's floor. I got to play on Iowa State's floor. I mean, it was just, yeah, it was just a really fun experience for me. I said it was kind of the Rudy of the team though, right? It was like we were losing by a lot. I got to go in, which was a change from high school, but it was still, it was still really fun. Um, and it was a different, very different experience than tennis Too, so. But that was also fun, so. Yeah, I bet. I bet that's kind of my background of where I started from an education standpoint. But then, you know, it was like, okay, now I got to get a real job. And, um, so I was, you know, really trying to find some internships. When I was in college. I, um, I worked for Milwaukee magazine for a while and their production department. Um, and then I leveraged the fact that my best friend from high school's boyfriend or fiance at the time started up a little graphic design business. So I said, hey, you need an intern? And so I kind of forced myself into working with them. And, um, it was a really good experience. They showed me the ropes and, you know, gave me a little bit of training right out of the gate. Um, but then, you know, when it came to that first job, um, I landed my first job with the Mark Travel Corporation, which worked for as well. Um, and I worked in their in house design department as a, uh, graphic designer, production artist.
Speaker A: Okay.
Speaker B: So I started out there, and fortunately, that's where my. Met my husband, too. So that was a very good stint. And some of my best friends came from there as well. But then, you know, after working there for a year or two, you know, it's like, okay, I got this taste of corporate life. I understand this. But I. My dream was really to work on an ad agency at some point. So all of our department, you know, my roommate and I were looking for jobs, you know, in the newspaper. Because that's what you did back then in the 90s.
Speaker A: Right on.
Speaker B: So we'd be scouring the job employment section every week. And then she found one one day and was like, hey. She actually had a little more experience than I did. So she said, hey, I found something that I think is a good fit for you. They're looking for somebody that's, you know, more of a production artist and not an art director. But it's at a small agency here in town. Um. Um, you know, why don't you apply for this one? I'm gonna apply for this, right? So. All right. So I applied for the job, and that job was, um, at Core Creative. So that's how I found my job there. And that's a whole nother story. But, um, yeah, that's how I ended up working there and ended up being there 24 years. So kind of crazy.
Speaker C: That's an incredible. That's an incredible run. You don't hear about that. Definitely not in our industry, much less anywhere. So. Wow.
Speaker A: Very cool.
Speaker C: Great story, too.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Kind of fun.
Speaker A: Angie, before we move on to Core Creative, uh, go back to Mark travel. What years did you work there at?
Speaker B: Oh, geez, that's going back. I'm guessing 96 to 98.
Speaker A: Man, I joined in 98, so I must have just missed.
Speaker B: Oh, right, yeah, for sure.
Speaker A: Must have just missed you. Anyway, um, another small world type of thing. Okay. You get to Core Creative, you do a 24 year run over at Core Creative, you move from production artist up to vp.
Speaker B: Right?
Speaker A: Talk. Talk to us about that. Right? I mean, like Kurt was saying, that's just freaking bananas, man. Like, no one stays in.
Speaker C: No, no.
Speaker B: Right. I know. And people would ask me that all the time, why are you still there? How are you still there? Um, you know, and really, uh, well, I'll kind of, you know, gosh, we're gonna have a whole nother podcast about that career journey. And I'm so forever grateful and thankful to how I matured as a person and in my career. Staying at one company, I mean, I think that's like you said, that is really rare. And because of where we were at in our maturity and where we grew to, allowed me to grow in my career too at the same time. So, um, you know, when I started, I was one of core's first employees, really. Um, the company had been existence maybe two to three years. Um, when I was there, there was four owners. PR person, a part time biz dev person, and Ward, one of the partners. Wife kind of did our bookkeeping. Right. So this was really, really small out of the gate.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Um, the partners started the agency from. I can't think of the name. Anyway. Well, they, they, they were at another agency and started. Started this on their own. And so it was very much kind of still a startup when I joined. Um, and this will totally date me, but, um, you know, when I started, we had one email address for the entire company and we had one cell phone that we shared.
Speaker A: Right.
Speaker B: So it's like, okay, who's going out today? We're going to share this cell phone. So, I mean, that's. And we were just so small at the time. Um, but, so when I first started, I was really an associate art director and most. And worked mostly with the four partners. So two of the partners had art director backgrounds, two of them were copywriters, and I was one. I was the one kind of filling in the gaps. And so I was helping get their work done mostly on the art direction and design side. But, you know, anyone that's worked at a small Company. When you're small, you wear a lot of hats and you're involved in everything. You know, we didn't have traffic managers. We didn't have AES. We didn't have a client service team. We're really just one unit. So, you know, that entrepreneurial spirit, I think, was what got me excited. Right. Because I was building this with them. Um, right from that ground floor. Sure. But then over time, uh, we landed some early campaign work with Aurora Healthcare.
Speaker A: Okay. So.
Speaker B: And that began to really take off. Um, the piece of business fueled core's growth, I would say, in the early days, working, you know, within several divisions, uh, within the state. Eventually, it just kind of started to organically keep growing. Um, we had a few smaller B2B clients to, um. And we worked also with PrimeCo, um, which ended up turning into Verizon Wireless on the PR side. And that started to grow as well, too. Those were the two pistons firing the engine that kept that new business going. And we pick up things along the way, but like I said, we were really just building the business from that ground level and trying to start forming some layers within the organization as well.
Speaker A: Hey, Ange, let me ask you this. Was the Aurora business, the. The, um. Uh, uh, primeco. Right. Was that. Did that fall in your lap? Did you guys. Were you guys out pursuing that?
Speaker B: You know, that's a really good question. I was thinking about that as I was going back, and I. I can't remember what the initial connection was. I. I feel like there was a relationship, like Jeff or one of those partners knew somebody, and it just. I don't think we actively pursued it. I think it was one of those things that just organically happened. Right. But then as we got into. So Aurora was broken out to these different divisions. Right. So we were working with one contact person and then started doing some campaign work, and then it just started to spiral into more, and then we had to start hiring staff to support it, so.
Speaker A: Right, right.
Speaker C: You know, if I could, you know, uh, comment, really. Question for you, Angie. And one of the. One of the things I love about doing this podcast, I just love. It doesn't even matter what we're talking about if we're talking about engineering, advertising. I just love the stories, and that's kind of the business we're in. We're in the business of telling stories and building stories. But I'm listening to you describe kind of your background a little bit, and a couple of things stick out to me. And it's like you hit it on the Head. You said it earlier. It's like one. When you got to college, you figured out pretty quickly that this wasn't for me. But this is. So right away I'm thinking like, no fear in being able to pivot. You know, that it's not easy to do sometimes when you're. You kind of get stuck in a lane. And you did that. Then you go to core in its infancy, entrepreneurial. And you said it yourself, that probably started to infiltrate into your DNA to who you are today. It's like you were there when it was young, all hands on deck. And then my final thing I want your comment is like, you know, for you to be there for almost a quarter of a century.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker C: Say it that way. You're seeing something from. I don't want to say start to finish, but if you know where I'm going, and I don't think many get to see that perspective in the business world. Can you just maybe talk about that? Because I think that's unique and I think that gives you a different vantage point probably today and whomever. Because you're seeing it, you saw quite a run from here to there. And I think that's. You don't get that unless you made the commitment.
Speaker B: Yeah, for sure, 100%. I mean, that's, that is truly part of my DNA, which is why it was really hard to make that decision to leave. And I know we'll get to that later, but, um, yeah, I think there's something unique. And I talk to kids a lot of times in college, you know, they want to get that interview with somebody in the, in the space that maybe they want to go in. And you know, it's. You can start in any different area. Right. I mean, everyone has different career paths. Um, but to be part of more of a startup organization is a unique one and it's a unique opportunity and there's a lot of ups and downs. I mean, we learned a lot. I learned a lot in that business and more not just about my own career and where I wanted to go as an art director, creative director. Right. It was. It. Over time, it became more important to me, as when you're starting at that ground level to help make the business success succeed, more so than where am I going in my career. Right. I mean, of course that's important, but when you can work at a company where you really feel part of building something bigger than yourself, it's, it's, it's really valuable, you know, and that's. It's hard. It's really really hard to find. And a lot of that comes with culture and the people you work with and all those things. But at the end of the day, you know that what you're doing is, is helping grow something. And, uh, that's just really cool. And that is that my DNA and all that started with core, and there was certainly ups and downs. I mean, you guys know the ad industry, right? It's. It's challenging. It's really challenging. And it's really hard to work with people you love. And then you lose a big account and you have to let people go. You know, that's, that's terrible. You know, uh, worst, worst part of our jobs. Right. But it's the reality of our business, too. And so I think that's, that's what's unique about it as well. It's just, you just, you have such more of emotional tie to the business when you're starting at that level.
Speaker A: And why don't we talk a little bit about now? Core is starting to get some momentum. You got some pretty decent accounts, revenues coming in. Uh, you have the challenge of having to grow, which is not always easy, right? Yeah, but you kind of like, take us, take us through your timeline at the, at the, at the agency. And also, if you could, how would you. How would you. For people who aren't familiar and listen to this, Core, uh, is an advertising agency. What do you guys specialize in or what? When. When you were there, Right?
Speaker B: I mean, first of all, that vernacular has not gotten out of my language. I say we are us all the time, and I say it at owner's Edge. I said, listen, I'm sorry, I worked for core for 24 years. I don't know if that's ever going to come out of my language. Um, but, um, yeah, Core has two distinct business models. Um, they have a design services model and a brand services. Almost little. Two business units within one. Um, but on the brand services side, it's, it's really about the positioning of, um, of branding. And there's a unique approach that Core takes with. We call it the see it, live it philosophy. Right. So it's, it's. Your brand is externally and internally the same thing. And that brand is built from the inside out. Um, really, really strong at, um, you know, brand strategy and then taking the insights from that and turning it into emotional campaigns that connect with audiences. Just incredible talent there that can uncover that. And it's really fun to do because as we all know, any good brand or any good marketing campaign starts with a Solid brand strategy. Right. So I think that's what makes them, uh, unique and that's what the, you know, core is really, really good, good at. Um, so yeah, I mean, but as far as the, the path to get there and, and focusing on how we grew to that point, um, if I kind of go back to when Aurora came into place and we started to grow, ADD people, you know, I, my career path went then from M, you know, helping put all the fires on the production side to like, wow, we gotta staff up. And Angie, we needed you to help lead more of these from a. Promoted to like senior art director I think was my title. Um, and so then I own more of my own accounts that I worked on. And then of course we hired some account executives and traffic managers and it just started to grow. Right. Eventually I moved into a role of what we call director of creative services then too. So I got more into the management side of the business as far as, um, not only serving my own clients, um, but hiring people, firing people, um, you know, starting to focus a little bit more than on the business and work or uh, in the business. I'm sorry, working on the business versus in the business. Right. We got to that point where the partners are like, okay, this organic growth is happening. This is great. We've got one of the biggest healthcare systems in the state under our belt, but how do we, how do we grow? And there's non compete issues there, right, when you work with a big brand like that. So we thought, we, you know, thought, hey, we got to go out of state, we got to go a little bit more national with this and started to leverage that healthcare experience to kind of find a little bit more of a niche. So, um, over time, um, we formed this director team that really was more of a leadership level at the organization again to focus on the business versus in the business. So we started to think more big picture. And at the time, you know, the partners had decided along with us too, you know, hey, we need to focus on business development and growth. And we've had biz dev people at core before, but they're kind of on an island or it became kind of everybody's responsibility. Right. Whoever had time, um, we'd bring five people out on any new business prospect. But we knew we had to be more disciplined to grow. And I was at a point in my career where I was like back to being part of the core level, no pun intended, of when we started the business. I was ready for the next challenge of my career too. And I thought you know what, I would love to take that on to help lead, uh, our business development. And really, you know, I'm not a salesperson by any means, but from a marketing standpoint, I wanted us to practice what we preach and just be the best at what we could do to help us just bring some new business in. Well, just as we were starting to do that, along comes Milwaukee Tool. So, um, you know, my new roles kind of, I have one foot in the door was I'm still an art director, I'm still hiring our staff, and then I'm now helping with new business, putting together more, you know, purposeful, you know, pitch materials and whatever else we needed. And then we get this call to meet with Milwaukee Tool. Well, I can't even go to that whole story because it's just a long one. But the longest short of it is, is that, you know, we had zero experience in that industry. Um, we had an introductory meeting that just snowballed, completely snowballed. And for three years I worked almost, well, I worked in that part of the business to help kind of figure out, to help grow it and then hire more staff around it. So Milwaukee Tool kind of became this whole new behemoth really within the agency and kept organically growing and we kept just working really, really hard for them and just doing what they needed us to do. And just our team just was incredible. I mean, just really helping them build a brand, you know, from. Really rebuild the brand from the ground level. So that was, that kind of took my eye off the ball of new business. Um, but that was new business, right? We were, we were growing something that got in the door. And today, I mean, I'm not even sure how many employees, um, at CORE solely work on Milwaukee Tool. It's, it's a really unique, amazing partnership that they have.
Speaker A: Um, Angie, I gotta ask, how does a Milwaukee Tool, which is a behemoth, I mean, it's a big national player. Mhm. How did that meeting, that initial meeting come about? Is that something you guys were after for a while?
Speaker C: Yeah.
Speaker B: You know, I would tell that story to every new employee that walked in the door at core, because even though new business is, you know, it is that you have to be accountable as a person and as a leadership team for new business. But at the end of the day, all your people can be eyes and ears for you. And this was somebody that, um, had worked at core, was an intern at one point, came back and she was at us. I think it was like a agency softball thing. And someone said to her, hey, I think Milwaukee is looking for, you know, talk to somebody. Would you want to connect? It was, it was something so organic like that that we got a call and said, yeah, we'll just, you know, I, I won't ever forget. I was at the office, I was wearing jeans and whatever and. Hey, you want to go out to Milwaukee Tool this afternoon? Sure, Angie. You go out, you know, like, so that's how it started, you know, and if you're hungry and you're willing to learn and, and your clients can sense that they, they're going to gravitate to that, you know, like I said, we had zero experience in that space, but we were hungry and we were ready to do what they needed us to do and, and learn with them.
Speaker C: So, you know, Angie, on that, uh, because we want to obviously hear more about, uh, your other stuff, but I got to stick on this for a second too. It's like, I love that story, and at some point it'd be great to learn more about it, but I love it. Everyone is new business developers. That is the philosophy everyone should have. And you are absolutely spot on. You do not know when an opportunity is going to come up. Um, the other thing is, I like about that story is you had just said yourself we didn't have any experience. Um, and without going into too much detail, there is a reason that they selected you despite the agency not having the experience. And I think that in itself is a lesson there. There probably was some dynamic going on at that table where they just, they liked you all. They loved how you thought there was synergy. And I think sometimes we get stuck on that where it's like, well, we have no vertical experience. Therefore, I'm like, maybe not. It's like you can still build those relationships even though you don't have that direct experience. Sometimes they just like how, uh, you think and they like you.
Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. And it's the willingness to just dive in and roll up your sleeves and do what it takes and putting your ego aside and listening, listening to what the client needs and helping them, you want to help them succeed. So that's really what it's all about. Um, oh, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker A: But no, I was going to.
Speaker B: Oh, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker A: So you get Milwaukee, uh, Tool. The agency continues to grow. Andrew, what I want to, I want to ask you, and I have this in, uh, some of the questions is just when you do get into nupis, what was your approach? Like, how did you view it? What was your kind of method of getting the Core name out there.
Speaker B: Yeah. So I guess after we kind of solidified more of that relationship with Milwaukee, I went back to focusing on new business and us as a team to say this is great and it's organically growing, but now we have this new industry experience. Right. That we didn't have three years ago. And so where are we going to focus when it comes to new business efforts? And so when I really could take, uh, the time to focus on that, you know, I scoured everything is like, I want to be really good at this role and how can I be really good at this role? Right. So it was scouring all these, you know, industry experts. Right. It's the, it's the, you know, David Bakers, the Tim Williams, the Blair Ends is the Mirrens of the world. Right. Agency, new business, um, areas and just try to just immerse myself in those spaces. And I think at the end of the day, you know, what we had to do is just focus on our positioning where, where do we make the most amount of money, where do we see the most growth opportunity and what are our employee is going to be happy about working on. Right. And so there, there's always that battle internally. Now we have this, you know, large client that's in an industry that is there more work there, you know, where do we focus? Because the worst thing you can do in new business is be all things to all people. Right. And, and that's hard for an agency because we're really good at a lot of different things.
Speaker A: Sure.
Speaker B: Like what is. But at the end of the day you have to have some sort of focus. So um, you know, when I got back into focusing on that then it was uh, it was just all in on trying to market ourselves in position ourselves and get some alignment around that and really start to own that space and be present in that space a little bit more so that we would build a name for ourselves.
Speaker A: You know, it seems, um, as someone who does a lot of new biz, I totally understand that. Right. We can get more business if we focus. However, the story you've told up to this point has been one of, hey, all of a sudden we got Milwaukee Tool. We don't know anything about that. Hey, all of a sudden we've got Aurora. We don't know anything. Like was, talk to me a little bit about the process of getting people on board of going we're this, not this. Right.
Speaker B: Yeah. And it's, it's, you know, you don't necessarily have to put all your eggs in one basket. But from obviously, um, from a marketing perspective, you do kind of have to own something and there's not unlimited dollars. Right? Yeah, you might have unlimited resources because you have a whole staff of marketing and talent. Right. But they put their clients first. Right. And your efforts are always going to be, I don't want to say secondary, but it's kind of the reality, right? You put your clients first. That's where you're making your money. So it's, it always becomes that, that, that battle of, you know, how do we use those resources most effectively? But, um, you know, answer your question about that is I think just having the focus is good. But we always had the rule of, you know, listen, if something comes over the transom that maybe isn't in our industry, but it's a good fit, you know, you really have to identify your, who is your right fit client, you know, what is the, and be super transparent with them right out of the gate about that. Because if they meet all the criteria where we've done work similar to this maybe before, maybe not. Right. But you know, here's what potentially could be spent. Here's a service that they would need. You know, given the point in time in your business, you have to make that decision and sometimes you would say yes to it. And there's a lot of power in saying no to the wrong kind of business that comes in the door. So it's just having that discernment and that flexibility. Yes, you need to have focus. However, you have to be open minded too. And you have to be smart based on where your business is at at the time and you can't open the door and you're going to make mistakes. Sometimes it's a bad decision, sometimes it's a good decision, but that's part of the business. Right?
Speaker A: Right. You, um, started off at core when you said you were one of the first hires there. By the time you leave, how big is how many people approximately working there?
Speaker B: I think I want to say core is over 70 employees. Uh, when I started, you know, like I said, I was one of the first employees or probably five. So it grew quite a bit. And it's being, you know, I think part of that success. Success goes back to, um, really good. The three partners that are there are amazing people. Right. Um, and I think that's what keeps a lot of people there as well too. Um, but then just really their willingness to, um, be open minded and run a smart business. You know, I think that was one thing that we always tried to do. We wanted to be creative and do all the fun stuff. But at the end of the day, we really focused ourselves to be just smarter at running a smart business. And that's. That's hard sometimes, but it's. I think it's part of the success of why Core is where it is today.
Speaker A: So then somebody comes knocking on your door, or how did this take place? You're at an agency for 24 years. Obviously you're. You just said this. You're a big part in helping the growth.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: You. You have been able to, uh, over that time, kind of continue to grow, to continue to find new challenges.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Talk to us now. Make the pivot Ange into your CMO role.
Speaker B: Yeah. So, you know, my last few years at Core, you know, I guess what was my title? My title is vice President of marketing and business development. Really. Right. So, um, I was part of our executive team, our leadership team. Um, 100% transparency. I mean, I knew what was going on in the business. We were very transparent with our potential, succession planning, how that was going to work, um, and was a very much part of all those conversations. And honestly. And I just told this story last week, I presented a rebrand of our. Of Owner's Edge to our board of directors. And I was telling the story because it's so 100% true. I really pictured myself working there for the rest of my life. And I know that sounds crazy, but when you're part of something that you start from the beginning, it's, It's. It would take a lot, obviously, to leave. And, um, we were just about to transition into even more new roles where, uh, partners were a little more. They're still in the business, but more of a board of directors letting some other people take the reins a little bit more. And I was really excited about that. I love the people I work with. Um, great relationships there, too. And they were like a second family to me, really, you know, um, and never had an intent to leave, ever. So I wasn't looking at all, um, not one bit. Um, and so the story is, is that, um, I had been involved in a leadership group called Vistage. I don't know if you guys have heard of Vistage. It's, it's actually mostly set up for CEOs of companies, but they started what they call key groups. So it's. It's leadership within your company that maybe reports to the CEO, but isn't the owner of the company. Right. And it's like this peer group you meet monthly. You have a chairperson and this peer Group becomes your. Your peer group. Right? It's. It's a confidential group that you can talk to, bounce ideas off to. And I just thought that was always really important for my career growth too, because I had been at CORE it so long, right. I had to get outside the walls of the agency and be exposed to other businesses. Um, so I'd been part of that for years. Um, and I had somebody in my group that had left the group. We were no longer in the same group. She actually worked at Owner's Edge, and so I knew a little bit about it, and I was only in the group with her for a short time. And back in the day, we had acquired core, had acquired, um, GS Design, a design, ah, web design firm. Right. And so when we went through that acquisition process, I just, I called her up and said, hey, you know, I know I don't know a lot about your company, but I know you acquire companies and you're in hr and maybe there's some things we're forgetting. Would you mind just talking to me a little bit? Just maybe talk to our HR person? Is there anything we need to know? And so she was just really helpful to me. And then fast forward two years ago, I guess now, or a little over a year and a half, she calls me up, says, hey, Angie, I wonder if you could help me out. Um, our company is going to be looking for a cmo, and we're a bunch of financial, um, people. And we don't know a lot about marketing, but we do know we want to use it as a strategy to grow, Grow our companies that we acquire. And, um, we want to make sure we're doing this right and we're speaking the language and understanding this. So what she decided to do is put together this focus group of, um, probably there was probably eight of us on the panel, I would say, um, but she tapped into our network and got all different people from all different marketing backgrounds to help collaborate over three different sessions and help really form this job description, um, with them. Right. So I told Ward, my boss, and our partner. I said, hey, guys, just so you know, I'm doing this, you know, I'm helping out a friend, whatever. Yeah, great, whatever. So I did that, went through these sessions, and at the end of the day, basically, we looked at things and we had to write a job description or they did, and with our feedback. And when I saw it, I was like, oh, gosh, this is not gonna work. Like, you're not gonna get the right person for this role. Let me just take A stab at it. I'll, I'll take it back. I'll rewrite it based on what I think and how I'm hearing everybody talk and how I think this is gonna best fit the needs of your business.
Speaker C: Sure.
Speaker B: So I went back, I wrote the job description, and then I come back for the last session, and they're like, okay, we've, we think we've nutted this. We've met with our own internal executive team. We really like where this is going, and now we need to kind of market this position. Right. Well, I read at the job description gets thrown in front of me, and it's basically what I wrote. I mean, I think they tweaked like, two different things. Uh, and they're like, well, now we're going to put this on LinkedIn. I'm, um, like, okay. And so during these sessions, the CEO, uh, would pop into our meetings every once in a while. Her name is Lisa Reardon, and she was the founder of Owner's Edge. And so she would pop in and listen to our conversations, but not be the whole time there, the whole time. But I got to know her a little bit through these sessions and just a very dynamic personality. And I was like, that's really interesting. And I, I, I took one look at this kind of LinkedIn job post that they put out there. I said, well, let's see. First of all, you're not going to find this person by just posting this on LinkedIn. Second of all, this person's gonna come to look at all your profiles of your companies, and they're all not very good. And, you know, you have nothing describing what your company even really does. I'm like, no one's gonna understand it. And I said, lastly, if this person is reporting to you. And I looked at Lisa and I said, you have a very dynamic personality. That's an attractor. At least let's have some video to have you talk about this position so the person understands your vision for this company because you have a really unique story to tell. Right. And so left there that day and was like, well, I'll keep my eyes and ears open. Kind of good luck, you know, Nice to meet you. Let's stay in touch, but I'll try to help you find somebody. So I went back home, I went back to work. And then, like, literally three hours later, I get a phone call from my friend Lynette, who got me into this, and she's like, so Lisa wants to have lunch with you and talk. She thinks you're actually really good fit for this role. And I said, lynette, listen, you know my story. I'm not interested. Like, I am very happy where I'm at. I'm flattered that you think I, you know, but, you know, uh, no, I'm like, okay, fine, I'll have lunch with Lisa, you know, right. Good person to network with, whatever. And so I had lunch with Lisa and I'll tell you, that was a life changing conversation because, um, when I really sat down with her, and not just in that one meeting, but several times after, you know, I was kind of in denials. Like I wait a minute. She's like, I don't think you really understand our business model and really understand what we're trying to do. And you know, let me explain this to you. And she sat and explained to me about the esop, the diversification, the long term plan, the reason why she started the company. And it was like I couldn't stop thinking about it, right? And you know, back to the entrepreneurial side, being part of a startup myself, um, I got it. One, ah, hundred percent got it. And then I couldn't forget about it, you know, And I kept thinking about the long term vision. I thought, oh my gosh, these companies have been uber successful with, I don't say zero marketing, but kind of zero marketing, right? Like, if they actually could even just do some basic blocking and tackling, how much of an impact could I make on this organization? It could be huge. Right? So again, I was in denial for a long time and I just kept slowly. She was very, very patient with me. Um, just really one on one, had a lot of conversations and it just started brainstorming about where this could go. And it's just all of a sudden, before I knew it, I had a job offer on the table and I was like, oh my gosh, what am I going to do? I was really torn. Really, really, really torn. It was the hardest decision I ever had to make in my entire life. Um, but yeah, it was tough.
Speaker A: Let's talk about this.
Speaker C: Courage. It takes courage for sure.
Speaker B: Yeah, it was, it really does. It was really tough. But it takes a lot of trust and belief into the mission of the company you're going to. And I 100 trusted and believed in her, you know, and that was a big part of, part of it. And she started the business, so.
Speaker A: And before we get into, uh, I want to hear about the lunch and the thing, the button she pushed, uh, in you, in getting you to, uh, uh, convert and move over to CMO World. But if you could talk to us about Owner's Edge, what is it? Talk to us about the company.
Speaker B: Yeah, Right. And I think this is the interesting part that I had said the other day when I was going through this rebranding per se or refresh of a brand of Owner's Edge. I said, I told that story to the board of directors. I said, listen, until I really knew the story, like the nickel didn't drop for me. And so we have an incredible story to tell. We need to tell it right. And so we're like the biggest hidden secret around, I think, because we're such a unique business model, so we're really employee owned and we're truly driven to grow. So Owner's Edge is really a, uh, 100% employee owned ESOP holding company. So we have right now in our portfolio we have five diverse companies. Um, and we're really structured to acquire new companies and invest in the organic growth of the existing businesses. So that's how we're made up right now. Um, our vision is to have 10 companies in our portfolio. Right now we're at five. But I think what's really unique is at the end of the day, and I was probing and probing and probing this for the last year that I've been there to try to uncover what our brand promises, our unique sales proposition, all these things, and actually market Owner's Edge a little bit. Um, it's just really that everything that we do at, uh, all of our operating companies is to deliver value to our employee owners so they have a pathway to their American dream. And I know that sounds cheesy, and I prodded and prodded and dug and peeled back the onion on that. And I couldn't tell you with more confidence that it's not more true than that. The reason why the company was incepted essentially was all about, um, you know, protecting and serving the sustainability of wealth creation for every employee owner. And there's a lot of ESOPs out there, but we are an ESOP holding company, so it's very different than just having an employee owned company. And so there's a lot of intricacies there too, but hopefully that helps you understand how we're kind of made up. So each of our businesses are very diverse range, uh, in size right now from like a, you know, 5 million to $50 million size. Right. So all more mid market size companies and our acquisition targets are going to start to get bigger as we go and try to bring them into our family.
Speaker A: Gotcha. Okay, so owner's Edge is the holding company. You have diverse businesses. Can you talk about some of the, just the, yeah, just some of the individual of the five that you have there in the portfolio.
Speaker B: Yeah, right now they range uh, across the board. So CCNN was the founding company. So that's the one located in Brookfield, all across the straight wiring, cabling, communications, um, they're pulling cables and putting wireless WI fi network systems in big hospital schools across Wisconsin, all that. Um, so there's that and then um, that was the original company that started the esop. It's itself that company turned into an employee owned company. Lisa was the president of that organization. And then in order to grow the esop, that's how the whole holding company came into play. Okay, so um, there's cnn, there's bacom, which is another large organization that's really mission, commission mission, um, critical communications. So they work with flyer, fire, police safety, school systems for safety in general and communications. So like think Motorola, Panasonic, two way radios, laptops, that too, and full security systems. Um, but then there's qcom, um, Technologies, which is up in the Appleton area, which is a robotics line, manufacturing line, integrator. So that's a very unique company. Um, there's Impleco, which is also local, kind of a spin off of Bacom where they do uh, audio communication solutions, um, work in the event center space, work in the B2B space to do tours and things. Anything that's with you know, listening and hearing. Yeah, um, you know we have clients like Amazon and Disney and just really big clients. It's a small company but a very powerful one. Um, and then our, the most recent acquisition is a company called Ashen Spencer. And I would say they're the one that everyone's like, wait, where did that come from? That's a very diverse business. So they are. And especially for all of you out there in the advertising marketing industry, if you don't know about Ashton Spencer, they're the biggest hidden secret around for producing world class, high quality, original, real music that you can use for, for advertising and any sort of new media. Right. So rather than going to your ICE docs, whatever, you can actually have real composers do your work, uh, do amazing music for you. We have a music collection that's existing that they can customize and create original scores too. So you know, they work with the biggies and you know, the Carmichael Lynch's, the, you know, they're producing Subaru spots, Mercedes, BMW, you name it. I mean amazing group. So yeah, that makes up our portfolio
Speaker A: Right now, that's bananas. Okay, so you're CMO now in your role, Ange, Are you. Are you branding storytelling for all those individual brands, or is your focus on owner's edge overall?
Speaker B: Well, all of the above and all the.
Speaker A: Okay, got it.
Speaker B: You know, when I came in, like I said, I really just had to audit everything. And, um, there was no infrastructure I don't have. We, they had fits and starts of marketing professionals, like maybe at each one of the companies. And like I said, literally some have done zero marketing other than having a website existing. Right. So, um, we had, you know, we can't do everything at once. I'm only one person actually do have a counterpart. Um, her name is Sam, who is amazing. She actually used to work at one of the operating companies called Bacom as a marketing person there. But then she left because she was like, there's no career growth really for me. I'm kind of on an island. And, well, once she realized that we were going to build this from kind of more the executive level and look at it bigger picture, she wanted to come back. So I think that kind of says a lot too. But anyway, yeah, we're, we're kind of going around the horn, right? Like, I can't do everything at once. And honestly, I need to learn all about these businesses. Um, so we're approaching the, uh, way I'm approaching it is brand is first, right? Brand and digital infrastructure. So it's, you know, our websites are our new business generator, obviously for all of these companies, and we need to treat it as such. So right now things are kind of all over the place. So my goal is to have some consistent platform use. Um, and then as we go through each company, because again, we can't do them at once. We have to start with some basic brand strategy. I mean, we're not going to go to the level of depth that I would have done at core, for example. But, you know, let's get our unique sale proposition, some key messaging. Who are Personas? Like, who are we targeting? How do we say we're different? You know, what's our differentiator? Like, those are meaningful discussions we need to have. And actually I'm learning through that process too, because I don't work in each one of these businesses.
Speaker A: Right.
Speaker B: So we're kind of going around the horn. So we started last year with, uh, Implaco, which, um, we launched a new website, helped with a rebrand. They had four brands. We took them into one. Um, and again, these companies are all at different levels of Maturity. So, um, I'm treating each company in this organization like infancy level. You know, just they've never done almost saying they haven't done any marketing before at all. And starting at the ground, ground level. And so taking everybody through that process is challenging, but it's a good one. Right. Just to peel that onion back and figure out who they are and what makes them different and where do we need to focus to grow this business. Right.
Speaker A: Yep, yep. And you've been there how long? Two years you said?
Speaker B: No, no, not quite. It's about a year, a little under a year and a half, I'd say.
Speaker A: Year and a half. Okay. I'm dying to find out. Angel, when you got in there, what were just some of your big surprises, both good and bad? Like, okay, now that I'm on the other side of the table, right. I'm not at the agency anymore. Right. Um, and you're coming in as a CMO and you're faced with certain realities of life. Like, I don't have a lot of support, I don't have a lot of budget. You know, a lot of people who I'm interfacing with here really don't get marketing. Uh, they may get sales right, but they don't get marketing right. And why do I need a website again? Like, tell me, so what are. Those are just some of the things, you know, I'm just guessing just from being around the space for a while. What were some of the surprises that you've saw and experienced?
Speaker B: Yeah, no, well, you hit it right on. I mean, that's, that's. And I, I listen, I knew, I knew that. And I think the biggest reason why I knew this would work too. And I, I, of course I have to be patient and work with every different company in a little bit different way because again, they're all at different levels of maturity when it comes to marketing in general, or leadership for that matter. But it's, it's having that leadership support and buy in of our executive team. Um, so I'm on, you know, owners, the way owners are structured, I'm on our high, I'm on our executive team. So I get to be part of strategic planning for all the businesses. And that's a lot. There are a lot of meetings that I'm sitting in. But I have to tell you that's one of the advantages Owner's Edge has as a holding company is that Owner's Edge supports and drives strategic planning for all these businesses. Very, very, very disciplined, well run businesses. And you know, Lisa, had identified that earlier. And the rest of the executive team, you know, in order for marketing to be successful, they need to be at this level because they need to understand and see and help strategize what each business is, you know, to be able to figure out, no, we're not. You know, yes, we're going to give you marketing dollars to invest, because we're going to invest if it works. Like, that's why we're here, to invest in the right areas to grow these companies. That's our intent. We don't just buy these companies and let them be who they are. We're trying to buy these companies so we can grow them and grow and grow the esop, right, for all of our employee owners. So that's just a critical piece is being at that level so I can hear and listen and be part of that. Now I can't even do that right now out of the gate, because with five businesses plus the operating company, uh, doing all of this, like, I'd be in meetings all day. So we had to again, prioritize where are we starting our marketing efforts first? And those are the ones I started to sit in to be, you know, part of. Um, but, but as far as, you know, how to approach it, and the surprises I had is really, you nailed it. I mean, it's a lot of education, too, of just educating people. Why? You know, first of all, what's the difference between branding and marketing? Second of all, a marketing position is a team effort, right? This isn't. One person can't do all these things. Um, and, you know, again, our executive team understands that. But every different business has to be approached in a different way and has different needs. And we have to kind of re. Educate and show what we need to do for kind of basic blocking and tackling 101 to lay that foundation so that when we actually start doing some more marketing, we can be super effective. So it's, it's really foundational level stuff I'm still doing with all these businesses.
Speaker A: Do you, um, do you have to spend a. I'm going to say this at this point in your career, um, with Owner's Edge, do you have to spend a disproportionate amount of time educating internally simply because the things you're talking about, angel, they just. Branding just takes a while. It's not like I press a button and, you know, I see the results. It's like, okay, we're going to do this stuff three years from now, you're going to be glad we did it, yeah.
Speaker B: I mean it, again, it depends on the audience and the person and all of that. But I, you know, I think they get it in concept, um, and the value of it. And even as I'm going through part of this process, you know, I'm, I needed to find digital infrastructure because the digital part is so, so, so important. And like I said, things were just kind of all over the place so I couldn't go in and say, okay, we're going to spend 50 to 100 grand on each of these businesses just to get our branding figured out. Right. Like we don't like some of these companies barely even had a marketing budget. Right. Um, people there didn't understand what things cost. I know what things cost. You know, I came from the agency side. I know it's realistic, I know how to do it. Right. But there's a cost to that too.
Speaker A: Right. Right.
Speaker B: Um, so, you know, yes, I do spend a significant amount of my time somewhat educating. But uh, again I have the support and the trust and the buy in from our leadership team and I'm also flexible. Right. I mean I'm not going to go in, you know. Yeah, I'm going to ask for more money and a budget. Uh, but you know, how's the business doing this year? Right. You know, like how can we afford this and if we can't, at the very least there's some basic foundational stuff we just have to do and that is some of the brand strategy work and get a minimal viable website up there that's functioning, that's built right from the start that we can measure the back end stuff around and be able to control ourselves too so that we don't always have to rely on outside sources. But I'm never, I'm never building an in house agency here. I got to rely on partners to help us make this happen. But I don't have a lot of money right out of the gate. Right.
Speaker A: I mean. Yep. No, I hear you, I hear you. Um, one of the things that I'm curious about Angie, is that when you now are working with five different separate, um, industries businesses within the portfolio, you're looking to add five more at this point in time. Do you have kind of your punch list? So for example, if you were, if Lisa Reardon or I'm m assuming she's still the president, is that right?
Speaker B: Well, she's the CEO now. She's actually moving, um, transitioning to our board of directors as the executive chair. So we're going to have a co C model coming up starting in January 1st, where two of our op co leader or, I'm sorry, two of our members of our executive team becoming co CEOs. But she's going to be responsible more for acquisition strategy in her new role.
Speaker A: So Lisa, Lisa comes to you and says, hey, anchor, um, uh, right after the. Right after the new year, we're buying this company, Company X. Yeah.
Speaker C: Right.
Speaker A: So I'm putting that on your radar. The new year comes. Andrew Krieger sits down. Do you have. You're like, okay, here's the first thing I look for. I go through X, I check Y. I'm looking at Z. What are the. What's that, like, punch list that you go through now to see how to kind of assess the patient? Where does this brand fall at? Right.
Speaker B: That is pretty much what it will be now. I haven't been part of that process yet. Um, you know, when I started, our last acquisition was Ashen Spencer, and that was before I got there. M. We need to plan that out. And actually still, you know, depending on where they're at, you know, the new company we acquired could very well have a marketing person in a role there. Right. They might be successful in doing the things, you know. Our goal as a holding company and not, uh, is not to come in and fix what's not broken. Right. Our goal is to elevate and accelerate where they have gaps or needs. So part of it is just assessing where they're at. Do they, you know, what is their website like, who's their target audience, you know, and that, that would be part of that process and where they would fit into the mix as far as how involved we get as a holding company when it comes to marketing specifically. It depends. It depends where they're at. So, you know, we'll know, I would think, pretty early on, you know, where, where there's some opportunity there. But we have to. To go through the same process that we would go through with any of our current operating companies. And that's starting with brand messaging, differentiation and, um, you know, knowing who you're targeting in your Personas. We've, we've. And you're in your digital platform that those, those are foundational elements we have to have out of the gate no matter what. And if they're more mature and they've got that all figured out already, great. I'm not gonna, I'm not going to, you know, break it if it's like I said, if it's working. But if we can elevate it. Yeah, we're going to come in and re. Go through this brand process and, and discover, you know, is this the right thing for you? Could we be doing this and doing this better? So yeah, we'll have to cross that bridge when we get there. But it'll be fun to be part of for sure.
Speaker A: What break down your day for us? Like, you know, where, where's the pie chart? Like, how are you dividing your time, energy and effort?
Speaker B: Well, right now I'm one man down because. And I cannot, I'm literally counting down the days. So my counterpart Samantha gets back from maternity leave, so she's been out the last three months. So I've really kind of been a woman. But, um, no, it's, it's. My day is all over the place really. And it depends. Like I said, we're starting with certain companies as a need first. So there's some companies that barely even touched. Right. Um, but the ones that I am involved in, you know, a lot of times it can be, you know, talking with that, you know, a lot of email communication, you know, I'm remote obviously here today, but you know, our companies are all over so, you know, having. There's not as much in face time as I would like, but I try to get face to face as much as I can, but it's a lot of coordinating and explaining and organizing and working with partners to help build some plans, um, budgeting. I've been going through that, you know, foundational infrastructure. There's some days where I'm, you know, we had, we had no foundational infrastructure, right. So I had to set up some creative asset management websites. I had to set up, you know, we use SharePoint and Office and got everything in the cloud because we're on max in marketing and everybody else is on PC, you know, so I mean, sometimes it can be more that technology side of things. Organize, organizing things. And sometimes it's leadership meetings and strap planning. I mean it's all over the place. So it's never. One day is never the same from the next, that's for sure.
Speaker A: Um, in terms of, um, in terms of. How do I want to phrase this? Um, the things that you are tracking, like, how are you assessing how far you're coming along? Right. Like, what are the things that you look at and go, okay, great, these are my milestones. This is what I'm hitting. This is where I got to be by X point.
Speaker B: Yeah. Right. So as we go through each company kind of one at a time, like I said, the foundational stuff of that brand strategy work and Digital infrastructure has gotta, gotta take place. Right. So that's a very integral process of building the site and kind of getting, you know, getting leadership sales involved. How are you working? So part of the checklist right now has been very elementary, I don't know, very again foundational. But I, you know, we're using some of these new businesses, we're using HubSpot as our main tech martech stack. Um, not all of them are there yet, but part of that is to get some consistent reporting structures in one place and everyone can start speaking the same language no matter what operating company they're part of. Um, but we can start measuring some key metrics in that system so that what's important to them, right. What's their key business strategy? For some it is a looser touch point like brand awareness which I know is hard to measure. But for some companies that is going to be uh, more the vanity metric stuff because they haven't done marketing before. Right. For another company that is more mature, like an Implaco, who is really a marketing driven company, we 100% can look at our metrics, we're looking at our SEO, we're looking at lead generation, we're looking at all these things in a dashboard consistently and we're seeing if we're moving the needle or not. So those KPIs are going to be very different prioritization wise based on where they're at in each organization. But the non negotiables from my perspective as a CMO is we have to have the brand strategy and we have to have a minimal viable website that that's going to be, you know, good enough for us to track all this and build this foundation that we can, we don't have to build it all in a day. It doesn't have to be perfect out of the gate, but let's just get it to a point where we, you know, can escalate on top of it and prove that some stuff is working. Right. I mean I think that's an important metric too. Like let's, let's get some wins early and prove that we're winning here. And let me tell this story internally because if it's working, we're going to keep investing. I mean it's as simple as that.
Speaker A: Totally understood, understood. And you've got so much experience, you've got such a cool background. Um, just from listening to you talk now, you're just touching a lot of different things. But the question is, what's your strength when you think about all the different Things that you do, but where's your superpower? And it's like, you know what? I do a lot of things. Good. But this thing is. This is where I really shine. What is that?
Speaker B: Yeah, you know, that's a great question. Um, it's. It's funny you asked that, because I would probably answer it differently than. Well, first of all, I asked that question of Lisa, who's my boss right now, CEO of Honors Edge. I said, so if you had a. If you were. If I were to ask you, what's my superpower, you know, what would you think it is? And she said, oh, hands down, it's. You have so much energy, and you bring energy to everything you do here. And she said, it's really just changed, you know, who we are as an organization, because everything you do, you bring it with energy. And I was like, oh, well, thank you. I mean, I knew that, but I guess I wouldn't have answered the question that way. It's just part of who I am. And then I went and asked Rob, who's going to be my new boss, uh, as the new CEO, the same question. And he pretty much gave me the same answer. I said, okay, well, this is good consistency here. That's. That's good. I probably originally would have said. It's just, you know, my background in the agency world has given me this opportunity to bring a unique perspective to this role, and I think that's what my superpower is right now, because I. I've worked with small businesses. I work with big businesses. I know what things cost. I know how to work with an agency. I know an agency needs a marketing partner to work with. They can't be working with the CEO. Right? Like, I mean, it's. It's all those things that I would have said it was. But it was actually really fun to hear what they had to say. And I do try to bring a lot of energy to everything I do, because marketing's fun, right? Like, we're not doing brain surgery here. We should. This is fun. We can. We can grow these businesses if we, you know, if we do it right and have fun while we're doing it.
Speaker A: You know, earlier in the conversation you talked about, you had one email for the agency, you had one cell phone that you passed around that I'm sure weighed about 15 pounds, right?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: When you had to take it with you. Now you're CMO of Owner's Edge. You're looking at the marketing for five different brands, plus Owner's Edge Angel. How do you keep Up. You seem to me like. No, seriously, you seem to me like a student of the space. Uh, you mentioned earlier about when you got into the new business thing, how you threw a shoulder into. I'm going to be reading these periodicals, I'm going to follow these people, I'm going to do this stuff. How do you keep up to date? Because this is a space that is fun, but, man, it's changing, right?
Speaker B: Daily it is. And, you know, after my first couple months at Owner's Edge, I would come home at night and I'd be like, say to, uh, Brian, my husband, said, oh, my gosh, my head hurts. Like, just, just, like taking this all in is so much information. Um, how do I process all of this and where do I start? I mean, this is just, just. It was a bit overwhelming. And I remember Lisa saying to me, she's like, angie, you're gonna be a year, year and a half in, and you're still not gonna be up to speed on all our businesses. I was like, what? You're crazy. And she was right. I mean, it does take some time to learn them all. Um, but, yeah, I think just in general, um, how do I stay up to speed on all that is, you know, then there is the marketing world, right? It's like, right, that's just changing daily. And I guess it goes back to, um, you know, I, I do, I. I consume, I listen to podcasts, I'm constantly scouring LinkedIn, I'm diving into things, I'm dabbling AI different, you know, all that kind of stuff. AI marketing, podcast, actually, I listen to that one and then that makes my head spin even more. I'm like, oh, my gosh, I need to spend like a whole nother thing thinking about this, right? But, um, no, I mean, it's really. I don't know, it's. It's a lot. I mean, it really is a lot. But I think at the end of the day, I have to stay focused on what I need to do to get these businesses up and running. I mean, I could jump ahead to squirrel. Like, how can we use AI to do this? You know? Yes, I know that's going to be an amazing impact and help me and our team a lot. But again, until we have the brand identified, who we're targeting, you know, the basic one on one stuff, the foundation, a really good website with basic tool. Like, I'm not going to be able to use those tools to their effectiveness because it's garbage in, garbage out, right? I need solid, solid strategy, solid messaging. Solid differentiation. Um, defined all of that in order to use all those tools. So it's a lot. But, um, like I said, it's fun.
Speaker A: Last question for you then. As you are getting the brands up to speed, you have to be thinking about how am I going to, how am I going to be developing, um, my team here? How are you approaching that, Ange?
Speaker B: Yeah, um, that is a good question. We're still kind of figuring that out. Um, I'm playing and my counterpart Sam are kind of playing the role of. There's different phases of integration. When we work with these new companies that join our portfolio. There's really that integration phase where we're kind of doing that auditing. And that's where I'm saying I'm starting with all these businesses integration. And then it's um, or I'm sorry, incubation. And then it's more of an integration. Right. Where we kind of. We've got the stuff figured out now. We need to, uh, maybe put someone in that role. Right. So we're now determining, okay, like for example, one of our businesses, even though we haven't go through that full process yet, they're more mature as a company. And we're like, we could really probably use someone in that role to build with us because we need marketing leaders at each of these business to some degree. Now some could be shared. It could be like maybe somebody works on two brands. Um, but we need marketing leadership in all of these organizations. And so we have to go through and when the timing's right and we have, and we're kind of, Sam and I are kind of playing that role now to get these companies up and running to a certain place and then we will do that. And I don't, I don't. We're never going to have. I'm not building an in house agency model, you know, I'm not doing that. But I do need leaders and even each business to help strategize and execute. Right. I mean, and help with, you know, I want to set them up for success and not have them start at the ground level and be driven by like sales or something, you know, like, like that's important too. We need to integrate and be arm and arm with sales. But marketing needs to be more strategic and more driven by the business goals. Right?
Speaker A: Yep.
Speaker B: So, yeah. So we will start staffing. In fact, um, I'm going to be looking for talent really soon. So that's, um, that's exciting.
Speaker A: Yeah, that's really exciting.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: You, uh, I know I said this was the last one. But you, you mentioned that. Hey, you don't want to build up an internal in house agency m. Why, why is that?
Speaker B: Uh, we don't want all the. Well, first of all, I know it takes a village and you need a lot of specialists. Um, and could we do something like that potentially. But then it just, it just gets complicated and kind of like in the agency world where, um, how do you prioritize? How do you not treat yourself last? You know, it's just, you start to, you're focusing on that more than just actually accelerating the growth of these businesses. So. And I'm under the. Listen, you know, I came from the agency side too. I will rely on whomever I'm working with to bring me the ideas and be up on the latest and greatest to be more efficient so that we can meet our goals. Right? Yep. I, I can't be all places at one time. I can't know then. I mean, I do know the technology, I'm in it, but I'm not going to know. I really want, you know, whoever I'm working with to bring those ideas to me and bring those solutions and um, partner, partner, you know, really partner with us to help us grow and understand that I'm not going to have all the money out of the gate. But if it works and it keeps producing, guess what?
Speaker C: What?
Speaker B: We're going to keep investing. So it's a little bit of an educational process there too. But, um, the, the complexity of managing a whole in house creative staff would be a lot. So, um, we're going to rely on those partnerships moving forward and we don't want all that overhead at the whole holding company level either. That just wouldn't necessarily work in our business model.
Speaker A: Gotcha. Angie Krieger. This has been amazing. I knew this was going to be really cool. And you know what? I feel like I could talk to you another two hours. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Thanks so much for sharing not only your story, where you're going, uh, your new journey. It's just been awesome. Angie, you've got the last word. You're the guest. How do people find out more about you? Owner's Edge? Whatever you want to come up, this is your time.
Speaker B: Like I said, by the time the podcast airs, we'll probably have phase one of our rebrand of, uh, Owner's Edge itself. So there'll be a little more information, uh, there on our website, which is ownersedge.com to learn more. Um, but my main takeaway here is that again, I want to just tell our story because this is such a unique business model and people don't truly understand it. And I can just guarantee that if anyone really understood our business model and wants to learn more, talk to me. Because we have a lot of operating companies in our portfolio are going to be growing more and more. If you can jump on this and be part of it and get it, you're going to be so happy because we have a great culture and this employee ownership is truly gifted to you. Okay, yes, you have a 401k, but once you understand, I mean, if you worked. If I had worked here for 24 years at owner's Edge, I mean, there's people at some of our operations that have over a million dollars in their portfolio right now from the East ESOP alone. And that's an amazing story. Right. So it's, it's almost sounds too good to be true, but it's. It's 100% gifted to you. And this diverse portfolio is unique. It's not just you're an ESOP or you're based on the performance of your own company. It's all these companies together. So it's really, really unique. And our growth trajectory is. We've got our vision out there and we're, we're ready to make it happen. And I, I'm going to be looking for talent on the marketing side. So I guess that's my big message is that, um, one of our operating companies is probably in position to have kind of that sole. I don't even want to describe the title yet because we haven't defined that, but they would probably be reporting to the president of that organization a little bit more on their own, helping drive marketing, but working in tandem with a team through Owner's Edge. Right. Um, there's probably. I'm going to be looking for potentially an intern over the summer for graphic design help. I mean, that's another thing, people. There's so much work to be done just to make things look better and more current. So that's something I'll probably be looking for over the summer as well. Um, that's got some experience that can take what we're doing and run with it and have fun. And then, you know, there's probably room for more marketing staff over time. Again, once we get some of these operating companies to a state where we can support that and maybe they would work on multiple brands is still. Still not sure. But I'm gonna be looking for talent in the space. But beyond that, if you look into a lot of the different companies. There's a lot of opportunities to get in, whether you're an engineer or. I mean, there's so many opportunities because our companies are just so diverse. So that's awesome.
Speaker A: Where do they find you, Ang? You got a email? You got a LinkedIn? What?
Speaker B: Sure, just go. Go to my LinkedIn profile. Angie Krieger. No E with Angie. And, um, that's probably the best way to reach out. Um, I'm on there all the time, so I'd love to, uh, learn more about you. And if you want, learn more about us, I'm happy to share that.
Speaker A: Awesome. An thanks so much for being on. That's a wrap, all.
Speaker B: Ah, right. Thank you. I really appreciate it. It's been.
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