Digital HR Leaders with David Green

The episode introduces the Instinctive Drives framework with clear explanations of the four drives and their practical application to AI adoption. However, much of the discussion involves restating the same core concepts across multiple speakers without introducing substantially new ideas. The middle and latter sections recycle the framework application rather than building materially different insights.

“The first number is what we call the instinct to verify. The second the instinct to authenticate. The third is the instinct to complete. And the last one is the instinct to improvise.”

“AI adoption ah, is no longer a technology problem...it is now a human adoption challenge for organizations.”

The core insight - that AI adoption hinges on human psychology rather than technology, and that different instinctive profiles succeed at different project phases - is relatively fresh for HR audiences but not groundbreaking in organizational psychology. The framework itself is proprietary but the underlying idea (personality typing for role allocation) is well-established. The application is incremental rather than transformative.

“AI adoption ah, is no longer a technology problem. Um, AI is available to every one of us through a browser. Human language, uh, natural language, very easy to use. Um, it is now a human adoption challenge for organizations.”

“when I hear AI, I think opportunity. When Paul hears AI, he thinks risk. Like there's no judgment there, it's just a reality.”

Mike Flanagan is a corporate VP at Microsoft with direct responsibility for customer success and AI adoption at scale, giving him credible practitioner experience. Paul Burgess has 35 years in human motivation research and is working at enterprise level with Microsoft. Both are substantive practitioners, though neither is a C-suite operator who directly runs a business or drove transformational change as a CEO/founder.

“Mike Flanagan, corporate Vice President for Customer success at Microsoft, whose team helps organizations around the world realize the value of their AI investments”

“Paul has studied the innate, unchanging instincts that shape how we think and communicate and make decisions. Recently, Microsoft and Instinctive Drives partnered”

The episode lacks concrete data, named customer examples, or quantified business outcomes. While the speakers reference customer patterns and the Microsoft partnership, no specific companies, metrics, financial results, or detailed case studies are provided. Claims about success remain illustrative rather than evidential.

“you know, some people are wired to seek certainty and security. They see AI as a threat. So they raise their hand to be on the project team, but not because they're excited, it's because they're scared”

“classic um, change management frameworks, I'll pick Adkar because it's easy. Um, it tells you what has to happen for change to stick.”

The host asks reasonable open-ended questions and allows guests to develop ideas, but rarely challenges claims, probes for specifics, or pushes back on unsupported assertions. The conversation flows smoothly but remains largely confirmatory. There is minimal follow-up that tests the framework's limits or explores counterarguments.

“Paul, can you explain to our listeners what they say about Mike, about you and about me?”

“So Mike's talked a little bit about, um, how Microsoft's obviously using it with customers. When we think about the people needed to drive successful AI adoption, you know, who do we need?”