Episode #23 - Party Crash your Career and Life with Allan James Moore

Speaker A: Welcome to this edition of Talking HR with Lori and Lisa where as always, our goal is to give you a real look at today's HR world through the sharing of experiences, knowledge and inspiring people practices. I'm your host, Lisa Fuller.

Speaker B: And I'm Lisa's co host, Lori Rilkoff. We're back after a long hiatus and are pleased to have Alan James M. Moore, or just Al as he likes to be called, as our guest today. Al is a storyteller who has Traveled to over 50 countries and worked on four continents, managed diverse workforces in both English and Mandarin. He holds a Master of Arts and Leadership degree and has held leadership positions for more than 20 years for Fortune 500 companies. Al began his speaking career doing stand up comedy at the Comic Strip and the Laugh Stop or Laugh Shop comedy clubs. He is now a professional keynote presenter speaking at conferences all over the world and is the author of an upcoming book which he's going to talk to us about today called Party Crash your life and Career. Welcome Al.

Speaker C: Thank you very much for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

Speaker B: So Al, we're really excited to have you because Lisa and I both read your book and it was fascinating and really insightful, um, in terms of how people create opportunities for themselves. And this is your first book. Can you tell us a little bit about what brought you here to writing this book?

Speaker C: Yeah, absolutely. It was really in our careers we kind of find ourselves in these positions where we're stagnant and we're, I call it wonderfully stagnant sometimes because you've, you've really hit a plateau and you're very comfortable. It's not all that imposter syndrome time where you're trying to figure out how to, what do you do and how do I do it and, and uh, all these challenges that you're facing and then you hit this plateau and you think, uh, this is fantastic. But then there's something not quite right. Um, you know, things are a little bit more beige. The green isn't so grass, whatever you want to call it, or sorry, the grass isn't so green, whatever you want to call. Um, and I kind of, kind of hit that spot with both, um, you know, my, my professional career, um, and my professional keynote speaking and my speaking bureaus were like, it's time to write a book. And they, you know, all five of them kept on me and on me and I kind of wanted to break up that, that stagnant state that I had, that I had become at that comfortable state that I'd become, uh, that I'd gotten into. And this was the biggest challenge that, uh, that was facing me. So I really had to take on the challenge. And, um, I was inspired, uh, you know, consulting with a, with a book writing consultant, someone who had a, um, a bestseller, Steve Donahue. And they said, you know, I told him some of my stories and he's like, we've got a book here. We've got a pretty decent one, so let's do this.

Speaker A: So that's so exciting. And as I, as Laurie and I mentioned, we've read your book and we won't give anything away to the audience yet. Uh, we'll let you sort of tell the story, um, because it's very fascinating. But tell us who, who are you speaking to? Who's your audience? And, uh, you talked about being stagnant in your career. So it sounds like maybe later on in your career. Is that the audience you're looking to reach or share a little bit more?

Speaker C: Yeah, I think it, uh, it's not specifically an age thing necessarily. I think if you're stuck, these are, these are some simple. I mean, it's, it's more, it's more story based, of course, because stories are sticky and, and stories are enjoyable. You don't really want to read a big, thick how to kind of manual. I mean, I don't want to read it. I've read so many of them, obviously. I know, I know you have too. You're at, uh, you're at Royal Roads like I was, and yet to read some stuff that was tough to get through. Uh, so I wanted to write a book that, um, that was exciting and could help people. Anyone who feels stuck, uh, you know, if you're 18 years old and you're just getting in, like, how do I break through this? What is my philosophy? What lens do I look through to view this, this world, this career, my life. And party crashing, I feel, is a really simple lens, uh, to kind of motivate you to go into spaces that you don't necessarily feel comfortable in, but you really need to be in in order to, you know, grow and move your career and your life forward. So, um, I would say that, yeah, possibly it might be younger people, 18 to 35 might benefit the most. But, you know, you're in, you're in your 50s and you feel stuck, uh, go, you know, adopt the party crasher, uh, mantra would definitely be beneficial.

Speaker B: So Al, you and I talked a bit, uh, previous, uh, to our session today about how the ideas that you present in the book may be linked to HR as a profession or in terms of how HR folks or even management, uh, can help employees through these concepts that you present. Can you elaborate on that for us?

Speaker C: Yeah, absolutely. I, you know, some people kind of mistake the party crasher thing, uh, when they first kind of hear of it and they say, oh, yeah, this. So this is kind of like, um, you know, leave your job and go party crash. Another job that you want to be in. And I'm like, no, no, that's not it at all. I've been at the same company for 16 years. I mean, it's changed logos at the top, but I've been sitting in the same chair. And this has been, uh, like a career playground for me. I have crashed laterally, um, and I have crashed vertically within all, within this large company that I, that I've been working for. So I, I feel like for HR sake, when they're trying to, you know, motivate their workforce and, and trying to find things that move people towards really what they're, you know, their, you know, their, their, their spot of power, their spot of influence, their part, their spot of strength, um, I think party crashing fits right in with really what HR. Because it's so difficult from HR's perspective, especially in a large company, um, to see the talents, the hidden talents of all these different people. I mean, the company that I work for, day job, is 60,000. So how is HR going to see that gem, uh, of a human being that's, that's down here or over there or over here, Especially if they're not an extrovert, um, you know, or if they're, or if they're not lined up with the right project or whatever it is to be seen. You're going to have to party crash. So I think really hr, it's kind of helping hr, uh, you know, with their succession planning and moving people up, um, by them moving themselves up and saying, hey, I'm here and I see myself this way and I really want to try and get into this space. How can you help me do that?

Speaker A: I love that. And I even think virtually now in a virtual world. It's even harder to be seen in organizations, um, and stand out because you're not in the hallways having the quick connections with your colleagues and your peers or other leaders across the organization. I absolutely love the term party crasher. It's so fun and relevant. Uh, um, and I love how you use it to encourage your readers to seek life's opportunities in those moments. Um, and not waiting around for that invitation. So you speak a lot about that and getting outside of the comfort zone. Um, so how does one start going about doing that, particularly if they're in a comfortable state or a stagnant state? How do you start pushing yourself?

Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, if, if there's no, no changes that are existing inside your company or inside of your world, uh, it's, the first thing is really to approach your, your manager, uh, your supervisor, your manager, and say, listen, I've been, you know, working in this same job for the last ten years. Uh, I feel stagnant. Um, I really want to challenge. What, what can I offer? I mean, is there something, you know, with another team member that I can trade off? Uh, or even someone in a higher position? I have a friend, 54 years old, just went to their boss and said, look, you know, I'm the, I'm the VP of Finance, but I've. Everything's beige. Uh, you know, I'm not. And, and, and he, he had read this quote. He said, a ship in port is safe, but that's not what ships are built for. And it hit him right in the face and he said, I got to get back to the, the journey, you know, when I. Not the destination. I'm at a destination, I want the journey. So he went to his boss, he said, can I trade off tasks with somebody else? And they said, well, you know, everybody else on your team is kind of at a lower level. So, you know, and, and he was like, that's fine, it'll challenge them. So some of my tasks, I hand it to them. And it also helps succession planning. And the, you know, the, the, the director, I suppose, of, of that department or his boss was like, actually, yeah, and they realized that they had become stagnant. Um, their fireside chat with my friend had become. You good? Yeah, I'm good. Okay, cool. Uh, for like 10 years. So it really, it took them. Sometimes it takes the individual to party crash because you're not always going to be seen, you're not always going to be invited.

Speaker B: So Al, you mentioned, um, along of these lines about reframing your philosophy about failure. So how does that connect with what you were just mentioning there about sort of pushing your own boundaries and, and how people can, you know, sort of rethink about what failure might mean?

Speaker C: Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, great question. Uh, failure is usually viewed as a negative thing, and a lot of times it is a negative thing. Sometimes it kind of hurts. Uh, but there's something unusual that I discovered about my Own personal failures. Um, um, I might. It was always my dream to be a professional athlete. I moved all the way over to Scotland to try and become a professional soccer player. I made it to a semi pro level and at that point it was very clear to me that I wasn't going to progress uh, beyond that. So I flew, you know, I flew over to another continent and I failed. But I clearly answered the question of am I good enough to become a professional soccer player? And the answer was no. Now some people that might be, they might think, oh, that's a terrible thing to actually know. I don't want to know that. And I can tell you that it's a wonderful thing to know because it freed up all kinds of life energy, uh, and focus energy away from soccer. So now soccer is a hobby. So I'm 23 years old. I've got my answer. Soccer is now a hobby and a wonderful hobby that I still play to this day. But now I'm focused on something else. What's next? And the journey to get to that failure meant I'm all the way over on some wet field in Scotland and all that it took to get there, I used that um, to refocus and all that energy and everything that I'd learned to focus on something else. So, so really failure, uh, you know, it really, really needs to be looked at in a different light, especially if you go for something.

Speaker B: Okay, thank you. That was a good, good, uh, explanation for that. I thought the story was really interest, um, you know, just the uh, the idea that people try something and they don't succeed. You know, it can be discouraging, but it doesn't have to be discouraging. It's just more about self discovery.

Speaker A: Well, and I think that's what's so exciting and, and encouraging or reframing as you, as you put it out, to look at your life differently. Like I always look at failures as well as that there's no such thing as a mistake. Those are learning opportunities. And, and I think sometimes how you frame it in your own mind as well as so important on how you set yourself up for success. Like you said, it stings or it hurts or you know, but, but it also means that maybe there's new opportunities as well, that you're opening up the door for One thing, I really liked and, and I couldn't believe the story. So I, I, we won't share too much because we want people to, um, uh, the courage that you had and some of your stories were just fantastic. But I was really, um, interested in learning more about having a John Wing in your life and what a difference that, uh, made because I'm like, oh, I want, I want a John Wing. Where's my John Wing right now? You're never too old for a John Wing, so I'd love to hear more about John Wayne.

Speaker B: Al's gonna have to say now what a John Wayne is.

Speaker C: I know, I know, absolutely.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker C: And I don't mind you sharing little, little bits and pieces of the book. No, no problem. It's not some, some big secret. I'm pretty open about it. I actually share quite a bit of it on LinkedIn anyway, so. And we'll provide a free chapter for, for your viewers to m. Enjoy. Um, John Wayne. Yeah. Unusual situation. I'll give you the quick Cole's notes version of it for your listeners. I was attempting stand up comedy. It was 2005, it was at the Yuk Yuk's Comedy Club in Edmonton. I'm about to go on stage. I'm shaking like a leaf with nerves and my face is white as a sheet. And this angel, John Wayne, who at the time was Canada's top domestic comedian. You would see this guy on TV two or three nights a week, and he walks over to my table and I'm, um, just blown away by, well, what does he want? John. What does John Wayne want with me? He sits down, he. And he says, you know, basically, you're, you're nervous. This is your first time, isn't it? And how about I take you through some breathing and visualization exercises, see if we can bring down some of that nervous energy.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker C: What, you know, what a great offer. What a kind offer. Of course, please. And he really helps to bring down my nerves until it's my turn to go on stage. And the nerves just return with a vengeance. The MC's called my name. Uh, my legs are shaking. I can hardly walk. I'm hyperventilating. I see an exit sign and I go for it. I'm like, this is too much for one person to bear. I'm not meant to speak in public, you know, Message received, I'm out of here. And as I'm going towards the exit, long dark hallway towards the exit, I notice there's someone standing in front of the door. I get a little closer and it's John Wayne. And he's blocking the exit. And he says to me, hey, Al, you'd always regret it. Now you're practiced. You're ready. Now get up on that stage and kill it. I got A great feeling about you, man, and I'm never wrong about that. And it just, right in that moment, all that nervous energy just was instantly purged and it was replaced with a feeling of confidence. I went up on the stage, I delivered my set exactly how I had planned it over and over and over again. They laughed at every joke. They gave me a wonderful applause as I came off stage. Uh, just an unforgettable moment. And if he hadn't staged that mentorship intervention, um, he hadn't been my ally, I wouldn't be, uh, a keynote speaker today. There's no way. Because I would have always associated public speaking with pain. And of course I don't like pain. So, um, so that's really John Wayne. And the thing about a John Wayne is that I never would have found the John Wing if I hadn't at least gone to the club, um, because I was petrified of doing stand up. But my friends were like, you got to do it, you got to do it, you got to do it. And somehow I got up the courage to be in that club and to be signed up and all the rest of it. And from our couch, um, you know, constantly being on virtual or whatever, not being engaged in, uh, our communities, we're never, ever going to find our John Winks. So we have to get out there.

Speaker A: Uh, I love that story. It just put a smile on my face because that, uh, that takes a lot of courage, you know, especially when you're young and standing like. I can't even, I can't even imagine. I have full admiration for comics getting up on stage and musicians because I have neither skill. Yeah, so. Well, obviously you're a good, ah, comedy person.

Speaker C: So not a musician.

Speaker A: Yeah, not a musician for me either. So. So you talk also about, um, subject matter experts or SMEs. How does that, um, differ from a mentor and, you know, what does that look like?

Speaker C: Well, I think that John Wing, quite obviously, you know, at that point, 30 years in comedy, possibly 25, 30 years, something like that, he's, you know, on all the for laughs, comedy festivals and stuff, he's obviously a subject matter expert, so his opinion really, really matters. Um, there's, you can get opinions, uh, from everybody on everything, right. But they don't, they don't always matter. Uh, so I, I really encourage people to try and find a way to get in front of a SME, no matter what it is you're doing, whether it's comedy or if, I don't know, if you're an archaeologist, you know, get yourself in front of a SME, somehow we go to a conference and find uh, them on LinkedIn, whatever it is, get in front of them, have a conversation with them, um, listen, you have two ears, only one mouth for a reason. And then share with them your um, ambitions towards the field. And that is, that is one of the surefire ways of uh, getting an ally. Um, so that night John Wayne was my ally. Um, and you know, sometimes your allies can become mentors and they can actually teach you more about, about their, their craft. Um, and then they can become advocates. So they're actually going around saying hey, check, check this person out. They're, they're, they're made of the good stuff, you know, so that's, that's the whole process for that.

Speaker B: So Al, you mentioned allies and uh, the two in your book you talk about two different types, inside and outside allies. Um, can you elaborate more on that?

Speaker C: Mhm. Yeah. So basically an outside ally is what I, what I see is somebody who's not necessarily in the established, quote unquote party that you want to get into. Whether that's something in life or if it's something within your company. Um, maybe there's someone, um, you know, for example, I just talked about archaeologists. Uh, so maybe you're trying to get into the archaeology stream within an environmental uh, division of your work or something. And you know, um, you know, somebody, maybe a, a friend's father who's an archaeologist. So that's an outside ally. You go and talk to them and you say listen, I'm really trying to uh, make inroads, uh, you know, with, with the archaeology department, am I and my work, um, what are the right buttons to push? Um, who would you recommend that I talk to? Do you know anybody that's in my company? Um, and, and quite often they do right these kind of, whether you know, it's archaeology or entertainment or even hr, um, people know people because you go to conferences and you're on LinkedIn and you're, you know, you're uh, part of these groups or whatever. Um, so that's an outside ally. They can kind of point you the way on where to go and how to get there. Um, once you're inside the party then you know, you find those people that are, that really have influence, really, that can, can really help you understand what it is that you need to do and maybe you know, mentor you and maybe become ah, advocates for you. And so that's an inside ally. They can actually physically open the door for you and let you in.

Speaker B: Okay. And you say that, um, you really get into aspects about vulnerability and saying that it's actually essential, um, to success. And again, a lot of people wouldn't associate vulnerability with success. They would maybe view it more as a weakness than a positive strength. How would you explain that to someone who's, who's concerned, uh, about being vulnerable and pursuing success?

Speaker C: Well, uh, the first thing I would say to anybody interested in the topic is to go straight to Brene Brown, uh, the absolute foremost, uh, expert, uh, on, on the topic. Michael Mead is another one, uh, to go to. These are people that I've, I've consumed a lot of their information about vulnerability and they've kind of set me on the right path for this and I've converted it into my own, um, kind of version of, of the truth as it, as it applies to me. Michael, um, Mead, one that talks about our vulnerabilities are. Sorry, our talents are hidden behind our vulnerabilities. And if you think about that, anything really worth having in life, any skill worth having in life, you typically have to look on the other side. You have to be vulnerable and you have to put yourself out there. Um, even, even the most talented people that you can think of in our society, um, LeBron James, the basketball player. Adele, the, the amazing singer. I mean, she's born with that voice. She probably worked on it to cultivate it somewhat. But, but at some point LeBron James had to go out to the basketball court with the older kids and ask if he could play. Uh, and it was probably, he got rejected a bunch of times. You're too little, you're too little. But he had to keep going. So there was a vulnerability there, but he had to confront it and overcome it in order to find, oh wait, I'm possibly the greatest basketball player ever. So even, even LeBron James had to confront his vulnerability. Adele, same thing. Um, she still apparently gets nervous in front of audiences. Barbra Streisand still gets nervous in front of audiences after five decades of, of pretty much being amazing. So our, it's our vulnerabilities that, that are hiding our, uh, our talents.

Speaker B: So you've also described it as kind of being like a roadmap to success. How does vulnerability, uh, reflect being a, uh, like a roadmap? Mhm.

Speaker C: Well, uh, I think that, you know, for me, um, getting into this, the speaking world and keynote speaking, what I'm doing right now, I mean, there was really nothing in life that terrified me more than speaking in public. It definitely, people think, oh, you know, you're, you're lucky that it doesn't bother you. It was like, bothers me every time. And I have to meditate to get on stage. I have, I have a musical playlist. I go to a secret room, I get, I unravel it. I do this meditation, um, gratitude meditation. And then I kind of get to the spot and it's 30 seconds left and I'm ready and I'm good. But, um, clearly my hidden, my talent was hidden behind my vulnerability. So really, the vulnerability, the thing that's like, oh, no, it, it actually, it's, it's intriguing to me because now I look at it and I go, oh, that's interesting. Uh, that feels uncomfortable to me. Well, well, what's behind the curtain? So it really is a roadmap. Instead of like, whoa, let's, let's keep that out of the way. Let's not confront that. It's actually a place to go. It says it's like a big green arrow going this way.

Speaker A: Yeah, it kind of goes back to that perspective of it is part of your learning journey about who you are and growing and stretching and pushing, pushing yourselves and, you know, the concept of party crashing. And I envision a younger self where I was very shy and, um, you know, and I would have been petrified to do anything like that. And, and along the way, you, you see yourself looking back and go, where did I transform along the way? So if I'm speaking to a younger version of myself or yourself, what would you tell yourself and how would you encourage others to develop that skill set?

Speaker C: Absolutely. Uh, we all have different risk tolerances, of course, and I think that, uh, you have to honor those risk tolerances. There's a lot of motivational speakers who want to go for these big wins and they want to transform Lisa and Lori into completely different people who take big risks and quit their jobs and push all their chips and their money into, you know, this, this idea of your dream. And, um, but that it does, it's not sustainable. Uh, the people who come back from those three day conferences down in Florida, um, they only last about three or four months because it's not aligned with their values and their risk tolerances and eventually it becomes too uncomfortable for them to bear. Um, and so really it's, it's a very low percentage of the people are that way inclined. Uh, so I really think that, um, you know, for. If I'm talking to a younger person who really feels stuck, I would say that you decide how much risk you're willing to Take. And any amount of risk is good. This is not a thing. I was at a, you know, a speaker's conference recently. All speakers. It was hard to get a word in edgewise. Extroverts go on, me next. Me next. Um, and a lot of them were like, al, you have to quit your day job. Have. You haven't quit it yet. You haven't quit it yet. Why didn't you quit it? And, you know, I don't, I don't snap back. And they're being friendly. They think they're being helpful, but it's like, I've got two daughters that are about to enter university, so I need to protect my downside. And that's what makes me feel really comfortable. If I quit my job, I do earn enough in the speaking space to quit my job. Uh, but if we have another Covid, oh, well, what do I do then? There's no benefits, there's no, there's no severance. There's no anything. So I would, I am not interested in pushing people out of their comfort zone because it's not sustainable. They have to be pushed within their comfort zone. And even that, if that's a matter, if your party crash is just walking up to your boss and saying, um, you know, I'm, I'm interested in anything that, that comes up, not even specifics. If that's it, that's a party crash and give yourself maximum credit for it and build on m. That.

Speaker A: I like that. That sounds like something you could, you could just challenge yourself of going, okay, I'm going to pick one or two little things today, and I'm going to party crash that. And that might be having a conversation with a stranger or, you know, just engaging in a different, different question with somebody you come across and meet or go up to your boss if you haven't done that before. So I love that there are some small, tangible steps somebody can take to, to build that skill and kind of progress forward.

Speaker C: Absolutely.

Speaker A: Stretch, Stretch their comfort zone a little bit, risk safely. Yes.

Speaker C: I love that it works.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: So, Al, you, you also talk about how active luck might play a part in sort of unexpected opportunities that come up. So how does active luck play a role?

Speaker C: Okay, well, here's where I lose all credibility.

Speaker A: Uh,

Speaker C: I, I, I'm not overly spiritual, but it just seems as though when you take positive steps, you take positive actions towards goals, uh, there seems to be some lucky occurrences that fall into place. Um, you know, you, you, you get into a, uh, you decide you're, you're Like I remember one time I was in Phoenix, Arizona and I was actually thinking, I was, I'd had a little bit of a rough patch with the speaking thing and I was, I was thinking about um, quitting. It. It just kind of occurred to me and I was just, you know, just uh, and I, I had ordered an Uber to head to the, to the Phoenix airport. And um, the Uber driver is uh, is a, a part time motivational speaker. Like it' interesting human being I think I've ever spoken to. They were a former sheriff, they were a former pastor, um, they were a former radio host. And now they're, they're driving Uber part time, but they're, they're building this motivational speaking business. And, and he told me on that 30 minute trip all the things that I, that I needed to hear at that exact moment. There's no other person that could have been placed right there at that time other than, than that guy. And I, when I, when I dropped, when he dropped me off, he was just like, this is no accident, is it buddy? And I go, no it isn't. And him and I are, him and I are buddies to this day. We collaborate. And um, I'm, I'm um, probably going to speak at his conference this year that uh, that he's built his way towards and he's now got a big conference with lots of speakers. So that's active luck. That's what I think of it.

Speaker A: Yeah. I, I love, I love that story and it, it's really encouraging because as you said it's. I, I think gratitude plays a strong role in that as well. When you're thankful for the things and you, you express your gratitude. I, I have a philosophy that positive things come your, your way and maybe you just look at it negative things more positively, but I'm a firm believer that that does open some doors for you and puts us into places or experiences that you kind of have to question sometimes. Like how did that happen?

Speaker C: Yeah, I, yeah, for sure.

Speaker A: Yeah. How does following a party crashing philosophy reduce feelings of regret?

Speaker C: Yeah, I mean we, we're all here for a reason. Um, we're, we were endowed with these different skill sets and uh, you know, we get into jobs that are, that are comfortable and sometimes they don't exercise these different skill sets that we have. Like I said before, a ship and port is safe, but that's not what ships are built for. And with the party crashing mantra, whether it be, you know, the, the, the baby steps, uh, of risk or whether it be a bigger risk where, where, like, like for me with the, with the speaking thing, I, I knew at, at some point, I knew that I meant to do this. And for me, I just couldn't die with my song left inside me. Um, so really, uh, you know, it's, it's really about um, pursuing what you're meant to do and if you don't, um, it's kind of like what Les Brown and um, Denzel Washington actually gave a commencement speech, um, a few years ago. And they talk about the ghosts that are around your bed and, and you're around your deathbed and they're saying, hey, we came to you, um, when you could have done something about it and you ignored us. You did nothing about it. And that absolutely terrifies me even more than speaking in public, right, than, Than doing stand up comedy or going over to Scotland and um, you know, having the, you know, I kind of got my, my butt handed to me a few times in front of like fairly large audiences. There's nothing that's more scarier, uh, the more frightening than, than regret of not even trying. So I think with the party crashing kind of mantra, uh, downloading regret, um, or the possibility of large regrets later on when you can't do anything about it is, uh, is a, Is a pretty fierce motivator for me.

Speaker B: I think that ties in with the concept that you also introduced in the book. Um, here you're saying that party crashing philosophy reduces feelings of regret, but it also can help lead us to a life of significance. So help help our listeners understand that more. Because I, I find that quite interesting. Uh, I think those two ideas go hand in hand.

Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, regret is it like I said, with, you know, the Denzel Washington speech is a real driver for me to pursue those things. And uh, those things that we've all been endowed with, uh, are like, if we exercise them, um, at least even, even partially, um, or to their fullest extent, that is a significant contribution to, well really the, the world, um, our society, uh, our families, um, our friends, you know, where. Wherever we're at. Um. So I really think that it's, it's almost uh, our responsibility to pursue those in order to live a life of significance, um, which is our, our greatest contribution that we can make.

Speaker B: I, I think that life of significance is tied to you writing this book. For you, for you certainly, um, it must make you feel that that is a contribution. And you know, I, I've really enjoyed listening to uh, you today, Al, and, and the ideas that you had in your book. And I I, um, that's a learning experience writing a book. Is there anything that you could help our listeners learn from your experience about writing your first book?

Speaker C: Yeah, don't, uh, do it.

Speaker B: Just feelings of regret coming in now.

Speaker C: Nice. I like how you turn that. No, no, it's, I actually am a little bit serious. Don't do it unless you're really passionate about it. If it's, if it's, um, a labor of love, you'll, you'll, you'll half step. Um, and nobody, you know, there's enough books in the world. We don't. You know, that's what I realized soon on. It was more work than I thought it was going to be, but luckily I had a great mentor and, and he kept saying, not good enough, Al. Um, you need to make it more interesting. You need to make it more intriguing. You need to dig deeper. Um, so, you know, using the, kind of the book as a metaphor for whatever it is, uh, you're, you know, the listeners are interested in doing. You, you've got to dig deep. None of your goals, none of your dreams exist at a surface level. They just, they're just not there. Uh, they're behind your vulnerabilities and they require an, an incredible amount of work, no matter what it is. Um, they, they require so, so much work work. Um, you know, ah, first draft, no second draft, third draft, fourth draft. Just keep digging until you, you find what is, uh, what is gold, um, within, within your work.

Speaker A: I think that's really meaningful the way you had said that no matter what your goals and dreams are, you have to dig deep. They're not going to just show up on your doorstep. It, it means you're going to have to put in some time. You're going to have to put in some pain many times as well. So these things don't come just on, on a golden platter, as they say. So if you're really interested in, in growing and trying new experiences and living that life of significance, it means you have to go deep. I think this is a great way to sort of share that final thought with our, our listeners. So, any other final thoughts and, and please share how we'll be able to get your book. Um, it's, it's great, great work. So, uh, you should be, feel very proud if that's your first book because it was a very, very good read.

Speaker C: Oh, thank you so much for, for the feedback. Um, yeah, uh, basically the book's going to be coming out in about, uh, three months. It should be, should be ready to launch, um, should be available at, uh, on. On Amazon. Um, you know, and. And if anybody wants to kind of connect with me in advance of that or, or, you know, during, after, whenever. Um, I hang out on LinkedIn a lot, so. Alan James Moore, uh, on LinkedIn, and I love to chat. I love to interact with people on LinkedIn. Um, I, I consider LinkedIn kind of the adult stable. Uh, so, you know, um, we, we kind of govern ourselves. If anybody's, uh, talking too much about politics or, or, um, you know, throwing mud at other people, we, we. We stop that. We put our stop to it ourselves. We don't. We don't need the administrators to, to pop in, so. I, um, love the conversations I have with, with people. Please, please hit me up there.

Speaker B: I'm.

Speaker C: I'm, um, always willing to chat, so.

Speaker A: Awesome. Ah, well, now I know who to contact, because I actually have that. I want to write a book at some point in my life. So I'm like, huh, uh, maybe you've come into my life for a reason today.

Speaker C: There you go.

Speaker B: He's your.

Speaker A: He's your Johnny.

Speaker C: I don't know if I'm writing one, Brook. One book is. I know a few things. I can point you in the direction of a SME.

Speaker B: There you go.

Speaker A: Yes, yes, exactly.

Speaker B: Well, thanks so much, Al, for joining us today, and, uh, we look forward to your book coming out, and I'm sure our listeners are going to want to learn a lot more. Thanks so much.

Speaker A: Thank you.

Speaker C: Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it. Take care

Speaker B: of sa.