From NASA Tech to EU Shelves: How Ukrainian innovative food producer snEco entered the European Retail Market

VG: One, two There is no easy way. We thought that every market is quite the same. You have the international chains, they have the warehouses. From the first meeting with the buyer, it usually takes three-plus years to get the product, on the shelf.

DS: Hi, I'm Dmytro Shvets, your host at the Start Global Insights, where I interview experts from different countries about local business secrets and international expansion experience. Today, my guest is Vadym Gryshyn, a co-founder of the Ukrainian brand snEco that produces crunchy cheese bites. And, we will talk about their story to international markets. Hi, Vadym, and welcome to the show.

VG: Hello. Good to see you. DS: Vadym, your story is quite amazing. So, in fact, you, you were quite quick of, um, turning your sales, from Ukrainian market to European.

could you give us some background about the company and the product and how you shifted from Ukrainian factory to European presence? VG: Yeah. So, story actually was not so short. we started back in, 2016 in Kharkiv, where me and my brother, co-founder Philip, we just wanted to, to diversify our efforts, in business and to start a different company because we have no background in food industry, but we always, loved cheese as a product.

So the first idea was just to start a cheese production company. But then gradually, we understood that, cheese has, the shelf life. It's not as product that we use to sell, and, the transportation and storage should be at special conditions. So, gradually, we, we started to, to look for the technology of how to extend the shelf life of the product and how to make it, shelf-stable, and, so we don't need to use fridge to store it.

And gradually, we, we found that the NASA in the late '60s, when they started to send, people to outer space, and they found out that, every kilo of the mass, that we send into, to space is very expensive in terms of logistics, and that's why they started to think about how to put out all the water from the, from the food, from the, product. and, at that time, they discover the freeze-drying, the lyophilization. they discover microwave drying and a bunch of technologies. So we look, um, into it and fine-tune one of the technologies, which is called microwave vacuum drying.

so step by step, we, actually reinvented the technology, which we then, patented, and now we are using it, To produce, the best, in the world, cheese snacks, which is, snEco. The brand, name is, snEco. And, the product, that we have now is actually a shelf-stable, crunchy cheese snack, which has the shelf life of, 24 months, and we need no fridge to store it and, another benefit of the technology is, that we don't need to use any preservatives, any colorants, or basically any additions to the product.

So we have one ingredient, a raw, very clean label product which contains the cheese only, but the cheese, without the water. DS: Great. Great. Looks like you created a very interesting healthy snack.

And, and how did you manage to go to the idea to export this, product? VG: Yeah. So the, idea of exporting actually was, from the beginning of the company. but at that time, we just started to developing, the distribution in Ukraine.

As I said before, we are not from the food industry, so it was interesting journey for us to understand, every aspect of this market, of how things go. Yeah, but the export was, let's say the next step. So we thought that when we will establish, the distribution in Ukraine, then we will think about another countries. So we work on this several years, and then the full scale war started.

And as I told you, we are from the Kharkiv city originally. this is a city which is located, east of Ukraine, and was, one of the first which were invaded by Russians. So we were forced to move our facility to the west of the country, which is the Mukachevo city, because we have some relatives there, and we just built, the second factory, basically, another one. DS: And Mukachevo is closer to the border, yes?

to the European border. VG: Yeah, Mukachevo is almost on the border, so 20 kilometers from the Slovakian border and from Romanian border from the other side. So yeah. We know from the beginning that our product is, let's say, worldwide, accepted product, so i- it's not, local product, some ethnic product.

That's why the core idea was, to put the product on every shelf of every market that, that we will be able to. DS: It looks like you, you have been working that, quite strategic, yeah? So you, you have been planning the international markets, from the very beginning, and this was, like a huge vision for you, yeah, so to be in, in every supermarket that you can reach to. And, this, visionary, approach requires some strategic steps.

What was the first step that you have made to, be present in international markets? VG: The first step was actually to, let's say, test the market, but not the market itself, but the, buyers of the market and, The best way to do this is to go to some international exhibition to meet suppliers, buyers of the chains, buyers of the distribution companies, et cetera. VG: and to, to get some feedback on the product because we as, in-inventors, we as, founders, we always, love our products as, the children.

But, other people could have other opinion on it. so- DS: Sure. VG: Yeah. That's why the, the first, international exhibition was the, Warsaw Food Expo in, 2024, during the summer, if I'm not mistaken.

and it was the, the, the first step, outside the Ukraine, to get the feedback and, and the feedback was, actually very good. so that's why we, decided that our strategy for the export, was a good idea. and the next step was to understand, the mechanics of how can we actually export the product. but if we are talking about the food, there are some strict, regulations, and certifications and, food safety standards, et cetera.

So it's not so easy to export. VG: And, more of that, our product- … is not only the food product, but it is a animal by-product. So it's made from cheese, which is made from cow- from the milk- which is, made from cow. and that's why the regulation is, … even stronger, the,, in, in, in this area.

just to, for au- audience to understand, the European Union has a, um, so-called traces system, w- which is, a complete list- … of the producers who are allowed to import animal by-products to, European countries. So it's not the standard, it's not a certificate, it's not some, you know, the,, the list of rule that you, need to, follow to be able to import your product. It's just the complete list. So, from Ukraine, for example, there are, several dozens, I think, companies who are allowed to, import products to European Union.

And our company- … was the first one in, whole Zakarpattia region, who has this, permission, so. So you need to be approved by European Union to be, an importer of this kind of, kind of food into the- Yeah … countries of the European Union. VG: And, and the process is very, complicated and long. So it, took us, almost a year to accomplish, to, to complete, all the procedures.

DS: How expensive it is? VG: It's hard to calculate actually because it, it, costs zero. but, you need to implement, some changes- … to your, production facility to, to be ready to, to, to combine, to, to, yeah, finish the inspections, which are the, from the local level, then from the region level, then from the whole country national level, and then from European country to, to, to Ukraine to, to check the facility. Because of the war, we skipped the, the last- … step.

so nobody from Europe come to, to our facility to check everything. But, they asked the, the national… It called the Derzhprodspozhyvsluzhba, in Ukraine. So the na- the national government body that approves- Yes … certification- VG: Yeah, yeah DS: and, VG: and they- And they ask them to, to put on the body cams, when they, check the facility, and they… then they see all the- … video from, from the Europe, and then they, say, "Okay. We, we, we saw enough.

you will get the, the approval." And to, to understand the certification, have you ch- chosen the countries or the markets before that, or you just decided that it will be European Union, and then you checked the list of certification and allowances needed? VG: it is actually the good question because, no, we, we, at that time we have no strategic vision of, of the markets where we want to go. And we saw that, Europe is, close enough, like 30 kilometers.

Mm. so let's start from that. If, we do have, all the knowledge that, we get from the past years, I think maybe we will do the opposite. So we will, we won't start from the European countries.

And we look somewhere else where the certification is easier and where the competition is, less and, where it would be easier to, to enter. DS:. So this process of, of, choosing the focus market, according to some criterias, yeah, and this criteria should be not only the market potential, but also the easiness, of entry, you would, make this step before. Yeah.

So this, this is important to save, time and money. VG: Yes. Yes, of course. And talking more about th- this topic, you, you need to focus on, some particular markets and not to make our mistake.

Because, again, as, founders, we are always, love the product and we think that everybody will, love it, from the day one, and they will want to, to get it, in any packaging, in any, price et cetera, et cetera. After we received this, traces number and, even a little bit before that, we started to go to every international exhibition that we can. So it was, Germany, it was Spain, it was France, it was Poland, it was Japan, it was some efforts to United States. So we just want to spread the product as much as we can.

And again, turning my head, around, I, I understand that, it was a mistake because we, we have, like for a couple of years, we, we have no focus on the markets. VG: And, and the markets are different. This is a key insight that we, that we have. The markets are different, cultures are different, the structure of the market, is different in, in different countries.

VG: So that's why you need to understand the market before you even start to, to change your product for this market. Because, it is also a very important, step. You cannot enter any market with the product that is selling good in Ukraine, for example, because I don't know, the, the American market wants a bigger, pack size. And, 28 grams, which we, have it, it is a small portion for American people.

For the Polish market or for the, nowadays, for the Slovakian market or the, Hungarian market, the mention of Ukraine, on the packaging could be a trigger factor of, not accepting the product, even in, like major international chains. So y- you need to, you need to balance all these, factors. You need to understand them before you spend a lot of money for, exhibitions. For, for example, we, we was, we were in Spain at, Salon Gourmets, I think the, the name of the exhibition.

the big one. but we still, after two years or three years, we have zero clients from, from the Spain. VG: But on the exhibition it's like a great product, great idea, good looking packaging but no DS: No deals in Spain, yeah, be- because the- Yeah, no result … the product is not appropriate for the customers in that country. VG: Yeah.

DS: Talking about the e- exhibitions and in what I hear a lot from the, beginners, the exporters that, just would like to, get some sales, abroad, they, are expecting from expo or from the trade show that, they will go there and sell. And, from your, experience that I hear you, you spent several years going to different trade shows all over the world and w- what is the situation there? Or what would you, advise, to exporters how to treat trade shows, and, how to make them the most efficient?

VG: Yeah. Actually, I, I, I must admit that we were the same. So, we think that, we will sell at the first exhibition, at the second and the third. but, it, it is not working like that.

so you need to meet the buyer once, in Paris, the second time in, in Germany, in Köln, for example, and the, the third time at some local exhibition. And then maybe, you will, get appropriate attention from this buyer. And, at the exhibition, the game is just, started, so you, you need to f- follow up the buyers with, so much more information, between the exhibitions. So you need to tell them about the, your success, you need to tell them about your entry into other markets or about the new products, et cetera, et cetera.

So they just need to, use to, to the idea that a company is existing, that it is developing and that it is a, a reliable partner Because it is a very important, feeling from our experience. DS: You need to build trust, with your potential client, and it takes time, and you cannot actually influence the- too much, this process of, g- getting- Yeah accustomed to you. VG: You, you, you cannot… Yeah. So- some things just need time, and that's it.

Yeah. Because you, you cannot buy the, the trust. You cannot, offer some great price to, to, to get trust. You just need to, to show buyers that, you're attending several international exhibitions.

You have the money first. you have the strategy. You are not the, let's say, one gear company attending one, exhibition and then disappear. So the Ukrainian companies actually has, like, a double trouble with this, situation because we have, the full scale, invasion in the country, and, so-called country risks are quite high.

We are, as Ukrainian companies, need to, make, like, a twice an effort to get the trust from the European buyers. And talking about sales, so what are the countries that you are sold already now? VG: so now we are selling in Germany, in Poland, in Slovakia, in Czech Republic a little bit. And one of the biggest market for us now is the, Nordics, so, the Sweden.

And we are, let's say, in the conversation with, Finland, with Norway. And what, what was the toughest market to enter? VG: I would say Sweden- DS: … VG: because it's, quite unusual for our understanding. So again, I don't know if, everybody, do this mistake, over time starting to export, but, we do.

we thought that the, every market is, quite the same. So you have the international chains. They have the warehouses. They have the buyers.

You need to get the trust from the buyer. You need to sign the contract, and then you start, selling your product. but Swedish market, for example, it, it is quite unique, because, first of all, the, their major chain is, some kind of French cheese, but without the centralized, shipping from the headquarters. VG: and that's why the, every, shop owner decides what to sell by themselves.

VG: And, that's why the importance of the, distributor, of the distributor team and resources is, so much more important than in other countries because a sales representative, just need to take your product and, take it to the, to the shop, show it to the sho- shop owner, and agree that, this product will then sell in this particular shop. And they have like 1,500 shops across the board, across the country, for example. So you need the, to get the reliable distributor w- who has the resources, and the experience, of doing such, DS: kind of efforts.

W- in this case, when, when you are… when you found distributor that covers this, markets. So in, in many cases, people think that this is enough. So you are like selling to distributor, and then it is, his case or her, so their case to distribute this product and find clients. Um, looks like, it is not, yeah?

So you need to, see the whole value chain and, speak with, all stakeholders, on the road to your consumer. VG: Yeah, yeah. Sometimes, yeah, you need to present the product, in the meeting with the distributor and some representative of, of the chain, for example. And to describe your product, to tell your story, and to persuade the decision-maker to, to make the decision.

VG: This is the one case. And another case, y- you, the sales are not ended, when you send the product to the distributor. You need to, to be involved in the process of selling, at places. For example, from our side, we're supplying the, the raw materials for, for tryout, where the people could, come to the, to the shop and try the product.

Because, again, our product is quite unique. It's hard to understand, what is inside the, the package before you open it and try. and that's why, from our experience, the, the best way to, to show product for, for the end customer is just to, give it a try. Yeah, so from one point of view, uniqueness is very good because then you can attract more interest from chains, to diversify, and attract new customers.

But f- from the other hand, you need to invest in market making to, um, make the customer understand what is inside and how tasty it is, because without trying it is, impossible. Okay. Vadym, so i- if we are talking about these countries and the sales process, I, I understand that, still the trade shows are one of the sources, for your customers. So the, the place to find your customers abroad is the trade show.

But this takes quite a lot of time, and you, you need to meet your customers on several trade shows in different places, which means that you need to identify your customers beforehand, yeah? So this is also about the focus, understanding where you will sell, what are the stakeholders, and who might be your client there, and then to follow your client and sell it, through different, trade shows. Apart from trade shows, what are the sales channels? What are the approaches?

How did you sell and find your buyers and category managers in other countries? VG: We, we use several, techniques, let's say. It could be just, LinkedIn, for example. You can just browse through the that the country of focus and the id-identify the, the chains you want to enter and then try to find, some people from that site and, try to contact them, then send the samples if they are interested and then the process go.

the, the other way is to, to talk with your, let's say colleagues. We get some help from, our colleagues who are selling different products to different countries- … a-and they recommend us some distributors or some, chains or, some techniques of how to enter the market. Another way could be, some… I don't know, the exact name of, of these events, but, there is some events where, the organizers are inviting buyers of the chains to… Let's say it's, it's like an exhibition but, a small, size where you have, only, several dozens of the buyers of the chains and, several dozens of the, producers.

VG: and they are meeting in smaller rooms and, even before the event everybody know, who will be, attended. DS:. And, So this is, this is kind of a matchmaking event, VG: Like, like a matchmaking … DS: yeah? VG: Yes.

Yes, correct. DS: How do you find them? Who is organizers and how to find this type of events? VG: So, from our experience, there are some, let's say commercial organizers, so you, you need to pay for it- VG: of course.

But, they find the companies by themselves. So they, they find you, they, write you an email or, give you a call. DS:. So these are, these are the local consulting companies.

Yes, so the, the Austrian consulting company, for example, organizing- For example, yeah … this type of event in, in, in Austria. Yeah. So that means that, for them to find you and invite to this event you need to be present in internet. So y-your digital- Yes … presence should be quite good.

VG: I think, I think they are going, through the lists of the exhibitors, for example. And this is, actually the, the, the next, way you can get the contacts as well- you as an, exporter. Because, the list of the exhibitors, usually contain some of the, distributors or even the chain. DS: Okay.

So the, trade shows, the, um, LinkedIn, then, this type of matchmaking events. What else? VG: Cold contacts by the information you can find in, through the internet, through the, some particular platforms or, from the… Again, you can just,… Let's play this game. Now you decided that, your, target market is, um, Czech Republic, for now.

VG: First thing I would do is to go to some statistic researches, which are showing that the biggest chains, for example, in, in the country. And then you get the list of, let's say, 10 of the biggest chains which are covering, like, 95% of the country. And, if your product in this, 10 chains, you, you get the market. So-.

… the task is done. And then, you are, are trying to get the information about the decision-maker from each of the chain by any channel you can. And, you need to, to be creative. and then you can, go to the LinkedIn, for example, and search for this particular person.

But again, it's usually not working because everybody is the same. Next step you can do is to, um, to invite this person, for example, to your booth, say, at the exhibition. VG: Because, if you're attending three, um, major e- exhibition in the food industry, which is … which are the, Anuga in Germany, SIAL in France, and Gulfood, in, United Arab Emirates, like 90% of the buyers, of the big chains are, visiting those kind of, exhibitions. And, you can try to just tell, the, the person that, you will have the booth there.

And in the ideal world, you can, even, make an, appointment and choose the time of meeting. So in fact, you, you need to have a strategy, that will allow you to get in contact with this particular person that represents the particular client that you have selected based on the prior selection of the market. And that's why this focus is very important because your resources are- Yeah … very limited, and you cannot, do this, with thousands of buyers, so you should be concentrated.

And then you plan how to contact and communicate to this person from different channels. Okay. And, in some time, this communication turns into the meeting, and then the meeting turns into potential deal. VG: Yes.

why it is so important, as we talked earlier- … you can have, for example, only 10 major or three major chains in the whole country. And then it turns out that, you have only three person in the whole country that make the decision will your product be, in this country on the shelves of the, like, 90% of the stores or not? And that's why you, you not t- need to find out and contact like several dozens or hundreds of people. There are only a, a limited group of people.

And, the other way, to go to the market is not to, start the communication with the chains, but start communications with the distributors. This is a might be even easier way because, distributors usually have a signed contract with all the major chains, and the process will take less time. But again, all the distribut- distributors are, receiving, like hundreds and thousands of, these commercial propositions from all over the world, and that the bigger distributor is, the more they, receive this, proposition.

So, you need to be, again, you need to be creative. You need, for example, to pack your, best, products, in parcel and just send it to the office of the, distributor or retail chain, company with the marking of a person's name that you find somewhere in, LinkedIn, if they are not answering your question. And when they receive the, the box, it might, change their mind. So- … again, yeah, you, you, you need to be creative.

And all the easy ways are, already occupied, and- … everybody do this. DS: So this is a long t- long journey, yeah? And you should be prepared for this long journey, understanding your, North Star, your vision, what you would like to achieve, and then do everything that will bring you closer to this North Star by concentrating and focusing your resources and, contacting the proper- Yeah client, et cetera. Okay.

VG: There is no easy way. There is no product, from my experience, and the product that I see and the person that we met at, during the exhibitions who are producing different kinds of products from beverages to non-food, there is no product which sells itself by itself. VG: You need to make efforts, and you need, to be patient, and, everything needs time. DS: Yeah.

I, I think this is because not, the product is bought. In this case, you are not selling to your consumers, and, that's why, the product itself could be the best product in the world, but, the buyers from distributors or the category managers from chains, they're looking- … for a reliable long-term partner. And you… it… in fact, you are selling your company to them, and then you are selling yourself as a person to them. So in, in, in the, at the end, you are selling… like you're, you're communicating person to person.

Yeah. And this is, this is always complicated. This is not… this is like a friendship, yeah? So you, you should, you should, develop this trust, Yeah and only after that, you can get, um, s- some attention.

VG: Absolutely agree. And, even more, you can be a great person, great company, you can make trust with the buyers, and, then you can, sell them even not so good product. VG: So that's why the, the product, in that case, might not be the king. DS: Okay.

VG: And a- a- a- and by the way, this, like patience, it, it is what is very important- DS: VG: To those Nordic markets. It, it was, again, one of the insight that we have from those market. For example, just for reference, from the, you know, beginning of the conversation, from the first meeting with the buyer, it usually takes three plus years to get the product, on the shelf. DS: Amazing.

VG: Because they are planning way ahead. They have, like, stable economy. They not need to be rush, as, as we are. And, … inside their culture, there is this patient.

So you, you don't need to, to push them, as hard as we're used to, because they might not understand this. They are not used to, to this rhythm of the business as we are. DS: Vadym, maybe several words or tips, to the beginners, in this, international journey. What should, one company that is going to be in international market consider and prepare before they are starting this, journey to this markets?

VG: so, first of all, you need to be focused on something , or on everything, basically. So you, you need to choose the, the focus product. You need to choose, the focus market. You need to choose a focus, buyer.

And, you need to make a strategy around this. So you're not done if, if you're choosing a particular product, you don't need to go to, to the market with tens of different products. Just to, to put the one first, and then gradually you can develop. The same with the countries, the same with the, with the clients, with the buyers, with the partners.

So you need to, to choose, several, and you need to, just knock, on, on those doors, week after week, month after month, year after year. And then after you sign the contract with some partner and the sales started You need to go to exhibitions to talk with them, to show them, your presence, to show y- them, the, the novelties, the new products that you have, and just to, again, build this trust. Because from our experience, not only, at the food market, there is no better way to develop, the relationships between the partners as a personal meeting at the exhibition, for example.

Because you, you can, write hundreds of emails, you can have, thousands of phone calls, but, nothing compares with, with the personal DS: Great. Great. Thank you, Vadym. I think this is really valuable to know for the beginners, and not only for, for the beginners, 'cause, in, in many cases I, talk to experienced exporters and they do the same mistakes, not realizing that the systematic approach and consistency and long-term thinking is, required in, in this international journey.

so thank you for sharing your insights and, your experience with our listeners. VG: Thank you so much for having me here. DS: Special thanks to all listeners who made it so far. And if you liked this episode and you would like to get more insights on international expansion, please subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss the next episode.