How Leaders Can Positively Impact Employee Experience, with Lisa M. Sanchez

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Speaker F: Lisa Sanchez, welcome to the conversation today.

Speaker E: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Speaker F: It is a real pleasure you're joining us from California. I'm south of Salt Lake City in Utah, Today we're going to be talking about employee experience and what leaders can do to have a positive impact on that. Of course, leaders are going to impact employee experience one way or the other. And, you know, ideally it's in a positive way, not in a negative way. We want everyone to have a fantastic experience. We've all been there. We've all worked with bosses who are kind of either incompetent or jerk bosses or things like that. And that really, really negatively impacts folks in the workplace. But the opposite is also true. When you work with a really great leader, it can make all the difference in the world. And there are some pretty simple, consistent things leaders can do to really dramatically improve that employee experience. So we're going to unpack that and explore that together today. As we get started, I wanted to share Lisa's bio with everybody. Lisa M. Sanchez is an author, life coach, and the Vice President for Employee Experience and Engagement at Art Center College of Design in Pasadena, California. She leads a team dedicated to enriching the experiences and engagement for faculty and staff. Critical to this work is her direct work with abide or access, belonging, inclusion, diversity and equity, and organizational culture. Born and raised in la, Sanchez received her bachelor's degree in Communication Studies from California State University, Northridge, a master's degree in Organizational management from the University of Phoenix, and is a certified professional life coach. Uh, I could go on so many really cool things about you and your background. But before we continue with the conversation, anything you would like to highlight for the audience?

Speaker E: I'm ready to get into the conversation. I bring 30 years in this space of human resources. I put that in air quotes. Because it has transitioned over time, and now more than ever, the employee experience is elevated.

Speaker F: It is. The employee experience is absolutely elevated. And let's start there. Anyone who's in the audience today surely has heard the term employee experience. Unless you're a complete, um, you know, new person to the. To this arena, um, it really does drive so much of the conversation these days. Uh, but I also find that different organizations, different leaders often think about employee experience quite differently. So for you and for your organization, you know, what do you mean by employee experience?

Speaker E: Absolutely. So we know that this field of human resources has transitioned over time. Right. Back in the olden days, we called it personnel. And then over time, it has transitioned to people and culture. Because HR practitioners have a pivotal role not only in culture, but the people experience. Right. And so what I want folks to recognize right away is that Covid created a whole new employee. Yeah, the Values are different. Family became much more cherished and important. Work life integration, as I like to call it, versus work life balance. It's integrating that, uh, into the employee experience. Because when I started in this field of HR 30 years ago, we used to say, leave your problems at the door. Right. And I want to just wash my mouth out with soap for every time I said that. Right.

Speaker F: Well, I mean, it's still a super common saying in mindset. Like, lots of people still hold on to that. So.

Speaker E: And it makes me cringe. And so the employee experience is recognizing that people do bring their lived experiences to work. Now, that's not to say we should be inundated with being psychologists and so forth. What it does mean is that we have to understand that how they live outside of work makes its way into the work environment and that impacts their productivity, their engagement, how they communicate and interact. Coming out of COVID we moved into this hybrid environment. Why? Because child care was impacted. Uh, people were taking care of their elderly parents at home while trying to work. They've got the kid at the table doing homework, and those experiences still exist. When we talk about how leaders can effectively impact that, we have to be uber m good listeners. We have to understand employee concerns, but at the same time, we've got a business to run. Um, right. And so while we are understanding that employees bring their lived experience to work, we still have to make sure that employees are connected to mission, vision and values. So that's making sure that we get their input, that there's transparency in decision making, that we set clear expectations. For example, the other thing that came out of COVID is that people want to make sure that the work that they're doing is meaningful, that it is connected to their values. People want to feel like they get recognition for a, uh, job well done and that there's growth in the organization. But at the end of the day, we have to make sure that we increase our communication, that we increase collaboration, and that we're bringing people to the table for real input about what's happening in the organization. And that's how I think leaders can make an impact there.

Speaker F: Yeah. Awesome. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I think the COVID pandemic and everything associated with that, um, really created a context where people could challenge some long standing assumptions about the workplace, about work, how work was designed. Um, you know, certainly the whole butts and seats, you know, mentality that has been so pervasive, um, throughout business culture for such a long time and amongst many leaders, um, you Know, that was directly challenged and organizations are forced, right, to allow people to work remotely, uh, unless you were, you know, in certain occupations. And then people realized very quickly that, hey, um, not only does the butts and seats model not make sense in many cases, um, but it also negatively, it can negatively impact folks. You know, when you're, when you're talking about the desired flexibility that people have. And so people even, even people who were resistant to working remotely, you know, during COVID they realized, hey, this is actually the flexibility is really nice. Hey, I really enjoy not having to commute a couple hours every day. Um, I really enjoy, you know, autonomy and flexibility and all those sorts of things. And, and it's interesting now because now many executives are, are doing return to office mandates and requiring folks to be in office at least part of the time. And you know, in many cases it' grid model, um, and you know, trying to balance between flexibility, um, autonomy, but also making sure that, you know, they're maintaining that the values alignment, the culture development opportunities, uh, and those sorts of things. And so a lot shifted in the past five years and we're still navigating it. And layer on top of that, on, on top of that you have ongoing disruption via, ah, you know, advanced technologies, AI, machine learning and such that shifting the way work is done, the way work is designed, layer on top of that kind of. At least in the US it's this way in many parts of the world. You know, we're, we're in a really divisive kind of political, social, political environment right now. Um, you know, so you work, you know, with abide, access, belonging, inclusion, diversity and equity, which is one way to frame it. You know, people often say DEI or DEIB or whatever, whatever terminology you're using. You know, I think it's fair to say that that has largely been politically under attack, um, especially in recent years, which also is changing the landscape of what it looks like to focus on employee experience, especially for those who aren't, you know, straight cisgender white guys like me. Right. Like anyone who falls into a different, um, you know, different identity group may feel, you know, challenged right now, may, um, not feel safe, may not feel seen or heard or, or valued in the way that maybe they, they were starting to feel, you know, in the wake of the George Floyd murder and other happenings in 2020, when organizations seem to start to lean in more towards inclusion and belonging. Right. And now it seems like they're backpedaling, right?

Speaker E: Absolutely. It became almost a window curtain approach after George Floyd Right. All of a sudden people were high. Hiring chief diversity officers with no real goal behind that position. It often lacked budgets and staff, a clear direction. Policy statements were being issued. We were getting all these emails, whether it was where you shop or where you bank. Suddenly you were getting emails about the CEO's position on DEI. And now we see what's happening under this current administration where there's this dial back and organizations are paying a heavy price for that. And I'm not going to mention the major retailer, but I think you know who I'm talking about, that there was a real backlash and pushback from the community, from the people who took issue with dialing back. And here's what I think happens or has happened with dei when you think of dei, as you know, I like to call it abide, because I think access and belonging needs to be included. I just shuffle all of those letters and call it abide. But what happens is when you treat them as programs or an initiative, it takes away the importance. I think it's time that we reframe our language. These should be organizational values. These values really shape how employees experience work, their growth, their sense of belonging. And honestly, everybody, everybody benefits from DEI or bi. You just think about how one accesses a building. We may not consciously think this is DEI or bi, but it is lactation spaces, holidays, floating holidays, using gender neutral restrooms or gender neutral language, all of those are important. Adapting your health benefits that you provide to your employees to not just focus on, um, the traditional family, but the modern family. Families look different today. And I just don't understand why this is so painful. Pay, transparency. Everybody wants fair and equitable compensation. Everybody wants career growth. People want to feel safe in their work environment. But when you call it a DEI program, it gets lost, it gets muddied. And, um, so there's this reframing of DEI or BUY so that it's more organic in the organization because policies, they run its course, initiatives certainly run their course. So we just have to think about it differently. And that's where I think leaders make a real impact here.

Speaker F: I completely agree. And whether we're talking about DEI focused stuff or just, you know, other general elements of employee experience, um, the window dressing approach doesn't work. Right. So certainly in the wake of the George Floyd murder, um, you know, there's been an ongoing, like, political tension around all of this for a long time. Like, that's not anything new. It's just been ramped up more. And in part, you know, I think it was a, you Know, a backlash towards kind of this feeling like the pendulum swung too far one direction and, and people were feeling uncomfortable about that. But part of it was people were noticing that a lot of what was coming out after, you know, the George Floyd murder was window dressing. They were realizing this isn't real. This is, this is, these are, you know, slogans on the wall, a statement on the website. You know, this is performative. And if it's, if it's just performative, then very quickly people start to feel, um, you know, it doesn't engender trust. Right. Like, you want, you want to feel true connection to the meaning, the purpose, the values of the organization, not just a PR spin of what people might be putting out. And, and that certainly, you know, I think was a part of, of why we're seeing pendulum swings, um, because I agree with you. I think most people, there are some who probably don't, but most people, you know, don't wake up in the morning thinking about how they want to, um, squash minorities or, you know, certain or anything. They, they, they just want to, they be treated fairly. They, including themselves, they just want to feel like they belong and that they have opportunities to contribute in meaningful ways. I think pretty much everyone agrees with that, and it's unfortunate that it's become so politicized and labeled in certain ways that it's, it's, it's hard now to have these conversations. But if you, if you get back to the basics of just like, common humanity, like, we all want everyone to be treated fairly, I think, um, for the most part. Right. And, and, and if we can focus on that and have that values, alignment between, uh, our leadership and what they're actually doing, not just saying, and the people that are coming into the organization, I, uh, think everyone's going to be way happier. And so getting past the performative stuff, whether it's dei, whether it's any other aspect of an employee experience, you have to really walk the walk, not just talk the talk. You really got to do it. And people see the difference. It's so easy to notice.

Speaker E: Yeah, it's very easy to pick out. And I would just say for HR leaders out there, when you think about all of the disciplines that we lead, whether it's talent acquisition, recruitment, whether it's comp and benefits, whether it's learning and professional development, just go down all of those disciplines and think about how you can organically create spaces for everyone. There's this idea that DEI is just for black folk or it's just for black and Brown people or is just for the disadvantaged. And we've got to clear that all out. It is about creating opportunities, fair opportunities for everyone, and then let the best person win. Right. When I think about talent acquisition, I'm suggesting an organic way to do talent acquisition is to make sure you're doing due diligence to cast a wide enough net so that people have access to that job posting, they have access to interview, etc. And then they have to weed out the bias.

Speaker F: Weed out the bias that can artificially.

Speaker E: Absolutely. And leave out the bias. Yeah, absolutely. And you go down the line of what's, what sort of, um, benefits are being offered to employees. Is it only targeted to the modern family, the mom, the dad, the dog. Right. And the children and the white picket fence? Or is it same sex couples? Think about your programming and don't get so rigid that it's a policy or a program or this or that. Just think about treating all aspects of your workforce fairly and equitably and letting them show up as their authentic selves in a safe space.

Speaker F: Yes.

Speaker E: Is really what it's about.

Speaker F: A safe space. Literally, uh, physically safe space, but a psychologically safe space.

Speaker E: Psychologically, absolutely.

Speaker F: Yeah. Emotionally and, and just an example of how things have shifted. So again, I'm a straight cisgender white guy. I know I have lots of layers of privilege. Um, but you've articulated like there's lots of different forms of diversity. Um, and there's socioeconomic diversity, there's, there's, there's cultural background diversity, there's, you know, mindset and cognitive diversity. There's all sorts of different things. And I happen to come from, you know, very low socioeconomic background. So I have like lots of layers of privilege in other ways. And, but that's one, you know, where I do have that. And so I have life experiences that are different than some people, you know, just because of that background. And so that's something I bring with me. That's, I bring that with me to my conversations. And um, everyone has that, you know, everyone has different forms of diversity that they bring with them to the table. And so we can, we can see that we can value that and let people, everyone know that they're safe, uh, to bring that with them and to have that inform their leadership, their, their, their decision making, their, you know, how they work together in a team, all of those things, and it becomes really valuable. Um, and if it's leveraged, it can be very valuable to the organization.

Speaker E: If it's leveraged, yes. If it's leveraged. And those are, I think, the diverse perspectives that really help organizations thrive. Uh, there's definitely a benefit to bringing diversity into an organization, but we have to remove this idea that somehow diversity means quotas. And that's not what we're talking about here.

Speaker F: No, no. And an example of something that has improved, um, just in the last decade quite a bit, and that is, um, around maternity or paternity leave. Right. And there's still room for this to improve. Um, but when I first started, I have six children. Um, you were talking earlier about, like, during COVID and having the kids at the table. Like, oh my gosh, my wife and I both working from home with six kids all at the kitchen table, all of us trying to do schoolwork and work work and trying to do all that. It was.

Speaker E: Exactly.

Speaker F: But, but, um, I. For. For none of the children. My, my youngest is 12. And so, um, paternity leave policy did not exist for any when any of my children were born. Uh, so my wife had maternity leave, but, uh, there wasn't any paternity leave. And gratefully that has changed. Like now the organization offers, uh, you know, the opportunity for, for any parent or caregiver to take that leave, which is such a huge improvement. I wish it would have been around when I was, um, having kids too, but at least it's around now. And, and I think it's an. It's a good example of like a, A relatively small tweak to an existing policy, um, to just allow it to apply to not just the moms, but also to the dad.

Speaker E: That's a benefit of dei, though. That is a direct reflection of dei. Ah. That people don't rec. Because they think it's just black or white. It's, you know, hiring enough, uh, black and brown people. But when we think about employee experiences, it includes everyone. Everyone benefits.

Speaker F: Yeah.

Speaker E: And so I think that it's changing that perspective on what it means to work in an organization that values DEI or abide. It's making those opportunities available for all employees, including a white male cisgender straight of that.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker F: Literally everyone benefits. And, and everyone can see, you know, if you communicate well, everyone can see how they benefit. Um, and. And I think that's an area where perhaps we've fallen short as well as we just don't communicate it as clearly or as well as we could or should. Um, and I, and I want to highlight too, when we're talking about employee experience, we're talking about the entire life cycle from recruitment all the way through exit. And hopefully they come and you know, they, they come into the organization, they feel valued, they have an opportunity to contribute, they stay, stick around for a while, you know, you. But, but the whole life cycle of, of that individual matters and, and sometimes I think we just really forget that. And we will even talk about employee experience, we'll even really prioritize it, but then we'll have a really crummy, you know, um, recruitment and, and hiring and onboarding process, you know, that really turns off a lot of people. And that's part of the employee experience, the, the applicant experience, you know.

Speaker E: Absolutely.

Speaker F: And so, you know, we talk about customer experience all the time. Right? Um, one of the reasons why employee experience has become so important is a realization that especially in certain high tech fields, um, and types of jobs and such, that we just have pervasive talent gaps and labor shortages and it's a hyper competitive labor market. Um, I mean, in certain types of industries and certain types of jobs, it's insane. Like the, the types of offers that people are getting. You know, you'll have someone with a strong technical background who might have five or six offers at any given point in time, you know, with insane salary offers and bonuses and, and sign on bonuses and such. And so like, how do you, how do you deal with that in an environment where you're trying to also just run your business? And, and it comes back to the holistic employee experience. The whole life cycle. Treat people well, Let people know that you are an employer of choice, that you are a place where everyone wants to work, where they want to come and they want to stay because they have opportunity, because they can grow, because their values align and because they, they feel that they truly belong like that. That is the environment that we want to create. And we have to get past the window dressing. We have to get past the. Just the empty words. And we have to actually do it. And when we see policies, you know, policies, procedures that are out of alignment with that goal, then we have to make adjustments. Right?

Speaker E: So that, so that's one of the reasons why we changed our name away from Human Resources. And I went through a process in 2022 to sell, if you will, changing our name from Human Resources to the Office of Employee Experience and Engagement. And in large part that had to do with coming through and out of the pandemic. Um, but what it highlighted for us is that we needed to be more people centered, we needed to be people centric in order to impact the experiences that our employees, our faculty and staff were having. And so when you think about that, our little slogan is, we care about employee experiences from hire to retirement and everything in between, because that's what matters. That's what helps people be productive, thrive, engage, participate. And those are all deeply rooted in our organizational culture. We were just talking about DEI or abide. Those have to be foundational to your organizational culture. It's almost like the sturdy legs of the culture, of the environment. Because if that's shaky, has cracks, you're not going to have people running towards strategy. I'm a huge fan of culture eats strategy. For breakfast, I always say pick a meal, right? Doesn't matter which meal, your culture is always going to eat up your strategy. When people don't feel seen or heard, when they don't feel like they have a voice at the table, when they don't have opportunities for growth, when they don't see transparency, those things create a disgruntled or unhappy employee. And they're not going to be running to that finish line to get to that wonderful strategic plan that was just created. And so when you strengthen your organizational culture that's rooted in abide, you have a much better chance of getting those strategies done.

Speaker F: Absolutely. Well, Lisa, this has just been a, uh, fantastic conversation. I know at the time I need to let you go and get on with your busy day. But before we wrap up, I just wanted to give you a chance to share with the audience how they can connect with you, find out more about your work and, uh, then give us the final word for today.

Speaker E: All right, Final word. Oh, I like that. I'm going to leave that for last. But to contact me, you can reach me at my employer, Lisa SanchezArtCenter. Eduardo, part of what I do, I'm an author. I wrote a book called Looking for Love in a Garbage Can, A Journey of Healing How I Survived an Alcoholic Environment. So while the title of the book is catchy, if you will, there's a deep story about a wounded girl who would show up at work because she came from a dysfunctional work home environment. And how I showed up at work. And that's why it changed who I am as an HR leader. Because I know that there's another Lisa Sanchez out there who just dealt with the rampage, a drunken rampage, from their father or their partner or their spouse. Right. And so Looking for Love in a Garbage can is how I dug my way out of that in order to be who I am today. So it's a self improvement, self help book. Looking for Love in a Garbage can is available on Amazon.com um, last words of the day is recognize that while abide or DEI is being attacked, if you will today, you can reframe that to be more value focused rather than a program and initiative. But last and final word, Be kind. Choose to be kind.

Speaker F: Choose to be kind. I love it. Lisa, uh, thank you so much. It's been a real pleasure. I encourage the audience to reach out to get connected. Find out more about what Lisa can do for you. Check out the book and as always, I hope everyone can stay healthy and safe that you can find meaning and purpose at work each and every day. And I hope you all have a great week. Thanks for joining us for this episode of the podcast. We hope you stay healthy and safe and please join us again soon.

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