Choosing The Right Solar Installer: Don't Make This Mistake - EP56

Thousands of Aussie households are bracing for more cost of living pain with power prices to surge across three states. Power cost over the last like four or five years has gone up like twice as fast as inflation. And man, inflation's been jacking up too. This is where you're at right now.

But like, hey, two or three years, you're gonna be dishing out more and more to the power company. Like people have seen it. They've seen those carroffing costs, it's really hurting them. I think some of the politicians tell us that the power bill's gonna go down in the future, so then your math wouldn't work.

Well, I mean, even better, like power, like power bills going down is good for everyone. So I mean, yeah. But do you believe it? Oh no, no, absolutely not.

No way. I mean, the retailers are like private companies, like it's a market game, isn't it? They'll go up as much as they can get away with before everyone jumps ship. Presented by Your Energy Answers.

Welcome to the YEA podcast. And today we have somebody fully immersed in the industry. It is Chris Pemberton from The Sun Sellers. And Chris actually wants to help end customers and people who sell solar batteries to actually, I suppose, open their ears and listen to each other so that the salesperson actually gives to the end customer what the end customer needs.

And so they both walk away with a better experience. At least that's what I understood. Did I get that not too badly? Oh mate, you nailed it.

You nailed it. I'm I'm pumped to be here. Yeah. I mean, if I nailed it, we can basically finish the podcast now.

So um you're you're kind of very passionate. We we went to a pub just before now and and had a chat, and and Chris really, you know, there are some people you meet in the solar game and they just ooze it out. They just live it. You know, they they they still remember the first system they installed.

You installed yours on the wrong roof, did you? Pretty much, pretty much. What happened there? I mean, I was um I kicked, I was just, you know, in the Sparky game, electrical, aircon, all of that.

And my um my friend was like, hey, you should do solar. And I was like, mate, I've got enough headaches on my hand with all of this other stuff. I'm not adding another headache, right? And he was like, Yeah, but you can knock on doors and get free leads.

I was like, mate, you have me at free leads, spend millions on marketing, right? So I was like, knocked some doors, got a lead, went back to my mate. I was like, okay, I've got a lead. I got a solution, I got a sold solar system, but I have no idea what to do next.

No, well, no, that was the that was the next, next problem. The first problem was like, how do I go and sell it? And they were like, they built it on pylon for me, and I went and I sat down, and the neighbor, they were like, Oh, that's our neighbor's roof. I was like, I didn't even know how to use pylon, so I couldn't save myself.

So so you so your drawing for the system that you wanted to install and show was actually on the neighbor's roof. Exactly. And you walked into the customer and you didn't work out that that was a different looking house. And it didn't have I had no idea what I was doing either.

But somehow I still managed to explain. Did you get this? Did you close the sale? I some miracle got it and still got and got a bunch of electrical work out of it.

And then and you installed it on the right roof. To my best, to my knowledge, yes. And they were very happy. Yeah, yeah.

So that was the day I was like, oh my god, I'm done with driving around fixing light switches. Solar's the way forward. Yeah. Why did a bit more margin on solar than on a switch, is it?

Yeah, yeah. Look, I mean, like, especially if you're in, you know, growing a business and mump spending money on marketing and stuff, you don't you you're not going to make any money going around fixing light switches, are you? Like that, the whole service game is a bit bit hard. So it was really hard.

So solar just it like it's just for me, I enjoy sales and and like helping people, and there's just nothing better than the solar game because what what other market can you a like help people save money? B, they don't actually have to give you any money, right? If you if they're financing it, and you're looking after the planet, and that's the conversation that we get to have every day. I just feel super blessed to have it, yeah.

Well, are you selling me here? But um the solar game, I'm actually saying to you, I worked out just recently potentially I've been ripping people off for 20 years trying to sell them solar, and I tell you why. When we started, the feed in tariff was 60 cents, and that was a significant part of the income for the solar. Yeah.

And then the feed-in tariff came down and down and down, and I would argue that out of the four and a half million solar system or thereabouts what we got out there now, so take the ones with the battery away, so we're sitting at four mil or so. The majority of people leave their home in the morning, they're not timing their washing machine to run in the middle of the day. It's just nobody could be bothered. They come home at night, they do the stuff, and during the day their system generated the electricity, exported it, and they got 10, 12, 15 cents for it.

So during the day they accumulated maybe seven, eight bucks. They traded that what they used at night, and the end result was a low bill. Well, that game's completely finished with the three, four cents feed-in tariffs, and maybe coming even lower. Or maybe you have to pay to export.

So my point to you is solar by itself is now completely dead in the buck, but not in the buck, yeah, in the buck too. You're not getting the money and in the butt. But my point is without a battery it other than being pensioners huddling around the place all day and going to bed at 6 30 at night, I cannot see solar by itself, or maybe businesses running it where the machines run the same time during the day. But anything else, I think solar needs a battery now.

100%. I mean, and thank like thank God the government came to the table and started throwing money at that equation because it just made it just so easy and make it so much sense for people. Because the people like you talked about that got solar and it's they've and their bills just keep creeping up because the cost of power at night just keeps creeping up. And then they're running around saying salt scholars solar's a scam because they're bill, you know, they've still got a bill.

And then the poor solar installers get blamed because they got sold the dream, and then like, you know, it's it's actually that power cost has been like going up way faster than inflation. Well, look, the energy retailers would have never really liked solar because they just mean that's another competitor in their game, right? And they've been thinking about it literally for years, and they put the supply fee up more than inflation to get their profits still increasing. But now they've found a way to screw solar by taking the feed and tariff away.

I know. And the government actually let them do it. I know, I know. And I don't get it.

I mean I mean, they take that off me with four cents, and my next door neighbor sucks it up and they charge him 45. What a beautiful margin. Yeah, yeah. So, so so I actually feel ripped off because I I set the example.

I um the government comes to me and says, listen, mate, um the kids in schools they need more vitamin C. We're going to subsidize an orange juice program for schools. Could you just grow a few oranges? So I do, you know, plant the stuff, the trees are growing, I water, I fertilize, and I get paid well for the first crop, which is in this case the solar.

And the second and the third crop is okay, but it's going down a bit. By the fifth crop, they go, Well, sorry, there's so many oranges out there, we can't really afford to pay you much anymore. I invested. There was a playing field, and you know, I believed into capitalism, and what happened?

I got screwed. Yeah. So what do you feel like chill out, you got your solar system back, the money's already come back to you, and now you're just losing profit? Or do you think inherently it's rather unfair that the people not paid anything for the feed-in tariff?

Well, I mean, I'll I I'll I'll give you a different point of view on that because like from a solar um business owner, right? We're we're out there promising customers a certain result. And so, like, you know, back in the day, we're saying this put up a system, it's going to get rid of your bill. And like, obviously, we want to be like have a high level integrity.

We're like promising something, we want to, we want that result. And then, but no one could have like seen that come in where they just come and just pull the rug out of from anyone. And so you I actually feel kind of bad that people people that like had solar and weren't getting a bill are now getting a bill. But again, thank God for the batteries because get one of those in there and yeah.

I mean, normally when people get ripped off, let's say by an insurance company or by superannuation where they haven't put in the right fund, a couple of years later, there's a class action to sue, you know, whoever made those bad decisions. I want to see the class action by all the solar owners on the energy retailer for ripping us off on the feed-in tariff. Now, they might say, oh, there's too much solar in the middle of the day, there's no more value and all that. Hang on.

Would you agree with this statement? Solar since 2010 has exponentially grown, even if since 2007-8. And every year you could see it, it's kind of nearly like a graph like that. It was always going a little bit higher than the future predictors thought of, so it was always more successful.

But after about the fourth year, you would kind of go, okay, maybe we bent that curve up a bit. So you could easily predict how much solar was going to be in the in the channel, and therefore the batteries that would be required to make that useful. I mean, you know, there are people forward planning in energy energy retail that completely missed the f boat, and we are now getting ripped off in our feed-in tariff for that lack of planning. So I think there should be a class action against energy retailers so that we get at least five or ten or fifteen cents back in the feed-in tariff.

That's just my personal opinion. I think everyone watching this needs to write a bloody letter to somebody. It's ridiculous. We've been snitched.

Now, look, um, and you know what happened, talk about these oranges they took from me. The government now took them, and with those three hours of free power, they're taking it of me and they're giving it to somebody else for free and making themselves look good on my infrastructure. Yeah, it's a bit smelly. Yeah, I mean it's it's it's it's that's I mean, push back, tell me I'm over.

Well, I mean, the the three hours I suppose like the three hours is good for people that can't like fill their roof with solar, though, you know, they can top up the battery. So no, but you see, that's another thing in the battery rebate. I actually think the battery rebate should have been allowed for people also without solar because they like apartment dwellers could have it and then fill it when it's cheap and use it when it's expensive. Yeah, but you actually must have solar.

You cannot get the battery rebate if you do not also have solar. You've seen those um solar you chuck over the balcony balustrates, maybe try try to work that a bit. Again, not a bad idea, not a bad idea, but unfortunately, at this point in Australia from a regulatory framework, they're actually still not allowed. Oh stink.

So sorry. Now, just to let you know a little bit more about Chris, so he's actually got two legs of his business. He actually sells solar in the kind of wider Byron Ballinar area, but he also has a business where he trains people on how to ethically sell solar and batteries. So tell me, how does that program work?

So And how did you get into it? Oh so I think the the f where to start with that is to maybe help the listeners, which I'm sure they understand is in the Because it's video, we actually have viewers. Viewers, viewers. So if we're being politically correct, the viewers, I'm sure they understand, but we'll we'll paint the picture for them.

So in the solar industry, you've got you've got the um you've got like the hardcore ride or die sales and marketing, like retailers, and and they've got a bunch of salespeople running around like high um getting good like juicy commissions and selling no matter what the cost. Like that's that's quite what what did you have a statistic on that? Like 45% of what's what city was like that was. Well, we have some big players, which in some cities do up to 30, 40 percent of margin in that city because they have 15, 20 vans out there and they take a big market share, and they you can always see them because they're up the top in the Google Ads as the sponsored one.

Yeah. Uh and look, a lot of them don't do necessarily a bad job. There's sometimes been a smaller retailer and they have grown. Absolutely.

There's definitely exceptions to that. Like they there's always exceptions to the rule. There's always um, you know, really solid players in in every space, but generally you got that that side of that, and then the other side is like the the people that uh you know, lots of the online quoting, like you know, the offshore call centers. Cricketers in the market, cricketers, yeah, just just basically bang, bang, bang, just like lot, like they they don't know no one is really out there caring about the customer or taking care in customized solutions.

It's a cheap price, cheap, cheap price. And and and to be like on it to be honest, if you if you're gonna win at that game, you've got to be the cheapest, right? If you're just punching people quotes and not taking any care in that um scenario or or or or putting the customer first, then you've got to be the cheapest. Like so that those are the two models.

Now, and I'm sure everyone kind of has a bit of a gist of that. Now, the the best value install installation you can get is is the middle ground, which is the the solar installers that um they they do their own installs, but they also usually work for the the big retailers. So and they and up till now they've been a lot of them have just been like they've just been kind of at the mercy of the retailers just chasing work and all of that sort of stuff. But the reality is those installers are always gonna be the best value for the end customer because the end customer gets their own installer from start to finish.

They get to use someone local, they get to use someone that's like trustworthy, has integrity, and is always gonna be around for them, right? The problem is that middle ground, and and everyone agrees that's that's the win, getting someone like that to install your solar. Problem is the middle ground, they they don't really, they're either too busy or they don't have the the right systems and processes to actually help end up installing solar for the um customers. They're too busy working for the retailer or running around, you know, working for low margins and and not really having a brand to build because they're too busy over here.

Yeah, so those I kind of I kind of partly agree, but I also partly disagree with you, and this is going to be an interesting conversation because by the end of this, um hopefully you're not getting punched here. I think you've painted it a little bit too black and white. Yeah, yeah. Um, I do totally agree with you that when you buy cheap solar, just go to the club and do a bit of gambling as well because you will not get the care, you're not getting the aftersale, the warranties are very useless, and it's the 3,200 and whatever.

And now they've added battery to it, so now you're really playing the Russian roulette. Do not buy cheap solar. I've been in an industry for 20 years, I've seen 800 companies come and gone. Um, and they go usually, they sell on the price.

So as soon as you open the website and the price slams you in the face, as a 3,299 for this and that, and there's some famous person hugging the panel. Run. You will that company in many cases has had a history of different brands and different furnixing in the past, and they do it over and over. And by the time you one day ring them to get service, you will find it's not there.

And a lot of the reviews, they are not actually genuine reviews. You can buy this stuff, so it's very hard for an end customer. But on the other hand, when I talk about the bunnings and the origins and the IKEAs, again, there's no way I would touch them because they're all using subbies, which again less care in and out situation. And yes, you probably have a better warranty because those cast those companies are likely to be there.

But a lot of times they go, Well, what did you do for the maintenance? Where's your maintenance regime? Four years, five years later, there's a bit of like and grow another panel. They will push back on the warranty.

Do you really think you got the pockets to start arguing with an IKEA or an ALDE or a Bunnings on the warranty? Do you have the lawyers and the money? No, you don't. So again, I wouldn't touch them.

I really think they've gone onto the solar bandwagon for one reason, which is to make as much money as possible. But the truth is the end customer service level is about as good as an IKEA piece that's on the local council tip four years later because it fell apart. Sorry, I'm not a friend of them. And then you get to the middle ground, which you talked about.

But you describe the middle ground only as the solar installer, the little guy with a van that now needs a bit of help of selling. A lot of times the little guy with a van might have been like that in 2007 or eight, and he's grown his business now, where he has one or two guys in sales, where he has one or two guys additionally in install. He might still do his install a little bit himself, but the key is the guy has electrical background, he actually knows how to install. When he looks at a switchboard, he knows what he's talking about.

So I would actually include in that middle ground that you think are the good guys and the best guy to buy from all the kind of local regional companies, maybe with a shop shop front, up seven, eight, ten, up to fifteen people, I actually think those type of companies. Uh and even look, there is there are some very ethical companies. I want to mention on Solar Hub, they're in Canberra, they go all the way from Wollongong down to Eden. I couldn't find a more ethically inclined company that I have worked with.

So the point is you can even get those larger companies that still have the right attitude. Local, focus on quality gear so they don't have to furnix and run away when the warranties are coming. And yes, they're not going to be so as cheap as the cricket uh variety people, but you long term get a better outcome because the system lasts longer and you make more money. So, having established all of that, those are the people that you're looking after?

Actually, yeah, you've uh the the small and medium businesses like that, you've just described like a lot of our awesome clients inside Sun Cellars. So it's the people that have a bit of a team so they can like sell it, deliver it, like look after the customer, and and it's a yeah, the little guy in the van, it's a he's still got a little long way to go as well. You know, he's still got to figure a few things out, like a few headaches to figure out before you can come. And what happens with the little guy in the van, those single guys, yeah.

Monday they're in electrical insecurity, Tuesday they're in solar and batteries, the solo and battery boom goes off, they're back in security and and and doorbells, and then you're trying to find them to come back, and they go, Oh no, that company, we're not doing that anymore. So I would actually say to you, just the guy with the van, I would be careful of him too, because they're very opportunistic. I suppose again, there's yeah, it's exceptions there because you can take as it all just comes down to integrity.

If you have someone with a lot of integrity, it's like they're the solar is a great solar industry is a great vehicle right now. They can get into the game and they can they can learn like how to like you know look after clients and build something relatively easy at the moment because everyone's buying solar, like everyone wants solar and battery. True, but uh, can I actually give you that the battery rebate actually hasn't been that good for some distributors, which you would possibly think I'm crazy to say that?

Do you know why? No, tell me. Okay. Whenever the government gets involved with rebates, there's always winners and losers.

When they announce rebates, for example, and then they get announced to be enacted for six months in six months. Guess what? The next six months hardly anybody buys. You know, those kind of situations.

Now, in this case, if you were selling string inverters, which was the bread and butter of a solar system, guess what happened to all the ones that were in your warehouse when the government announced the rebate? They're still sitting there because everybody when I wants hybrid inverters. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what about solar actually also slow down because a lot of existing solar system owners just want an AC coupled battery?

Yeah. So from that perspective, the rebate from a distributor point of view, yes, I mean make good money on the batteries, but all the other parts of the business are actually a bit slow. So it's not all honeymoon and we're making millions for everybody at the moment, it can be struggling. But coming back to your program, so you believe if somebody who sells solar and batteries spends a bit of time with you, they can create a better outcome for the end customer, is it?

Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean, the the thing with it is that sales is service. So if you can go to a customer and and like um if you're just like everyone else, you're like punching out a pylon proposal and saying, we're we're the best and pick us, and here's the quote you you're still you're still playing like the numbers game, right? And like um if it's it's really just about like slowing down with the customer and providing really good service in terms of like um walking them through exactly how the system's gonna work for them, how it's gonna benefit them, and helping them decide what they want, like not just saying, like, I think this is gonna be what's best for you.

You can kind of do recommendations, but you walk them through the journey so they really feel comfortable about like investing. Investing in something that's obviously going to be a really um massive win for them. If you meet a husband and wife team in the purchasing and you sit in front of them, who tends to make the final decision? Well, um, I mean, you're you're already doing so you've you've already um doing something right if you've got uh both homeowners present.

We call that a two-legger in the sales game. Um like you never want to have a one-legger, right? Like um, but um that that it's usually um it's you it's it's 50-50. I don't know.

What I mean, what are you uh who who wears the pants in your in your relationship, Marcus? I know in my family, I'm the boss with my wife's permission. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So but I mean what's important is having both homeowners present.

So like people think it's just a sales thing, but you as a solo installer like or a um business owner, you've got a lot of expertise to share. You've got a lot of knowledge and you really care about the customer. So you want to sit there and you go, you want to go through everything and you want to help them understand and then help them decide. So it's like it's important to have both people there for the decision.

It's not we you're not gonna, it's not one way or the other, yeah. But I mean, you are a relatively evervescent person. So if you would be mineral water, you're not distilled mineral water. You're the one with the the you know the bubbles coming out.

Yeah, that one. Yeah. So how do you in a half decent time able to explain racking or panels, inverter solutions, you know, influence on builds, behavior changes, batteries now, maybe the EV charger, maybe the EV that's coming, um, maybe a catch power or an eddy type of product with the hot water. But there's a lot of stuff to explain, and then you like to kind of explain things a little bit like me, quite quite detailed.

Are you spending literally two days in those people's homes? Oh, that's why I talk so fast. Like I just cover everything in in one hour. No, no, it's about it's about figuring out what's important for the customer.

So the first thing you do is figure out what's important to them. Uh, most the the reality is most people just want to save money. Like that's that's why most people go solo. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, no, no.

Solo is there to save the environment. We're all there for that. Out of 10 sales, how many want to save and hug the environment, and how many do it for money? Um, it's I think one out of 20 is a in the is probably a frother over saving the environment.

I love those people, and we'll get into a massive banter. I'll give I'll probably like give them a couple of books to read. Like I love Saul Griffiths writes good books on this. Got a box of his books in the van, actually, yeah.

So you're handing these books out to people. Because I had my own copy and then I gave it to a customer once because I was like frothing, we were frothing together, and I was like, I have my copy, I'll get another one. And he loved it. So I was like, you know what?

Anyone that's a greenie, I'm gonna give them one of these. And and it's great, you know. Yeah, so but yeah, you figure out what's important to them about the system. And most of the time, people obviously they just want a system that they that that they can trust is gonna save them money, um, and and and that, and a company that's gonna like back them up for the system, right?

And the the the art of um the art of it is to um help them understand how it's gonna save them money so they don't actually have to trust the the sales guy, because even if we like think we're like you know a technician and it you know, trust us we're a technician, blah, blah, blah. At the end of the day, that you they you're there to like you're there in a sales capacity, right? And there's so little trust for sales. So you just gotta you gotta help them understand that it is actually a win um and they are gonna be a lot better off and walk them through that.

And then um what I've found is it's already sells itself, yeah. Okay. Now it would be a different sales process in the olden days with solar than now with the solar and battery, isn't it? Really?

Because because or is it the same? I mean, I would have thought maybe the outcome being the cheaper build is the same, yeah, but explaining how the battery and the solar together help save money versus the olden days with the high feed and tariff how solar sold money, they're two different angles. Could you explain like what is actually the difference? Sure, actually it's it's the same.

It's it's the it's pretty much the same equation. It's the numbers you the numbers are a little bit different, and so at the end of the day, the the like the main thing about like most people care about is saving money, right? So you've you you've obviously you look at their power bill, and whereas solo used to be like it's gonna take like you're gonna only have to buy half the kilowatts and you've got to sell back a bunch to make up for the night. Now the battery means you don't have to buy kilowatts at night.

So it's a similar equation. Uh you've still got to pay for the daily supply charge, and you you've got to sell back a bunch of kilowatts for three cents to try and take a nudge out of that. It's no, you can't even take a nudge out of the supply charge anymore, but that's all right. So you're gonna end up still with like a $30, $50 bill or whatever every month.

Um, so you you want to chuck that onto the you know the finance cost. And the aim of the game for everyone is is the repayments plus the power bill gonna be less um, you know, the power bill after the solar battery goes in, is it gonna be less than where you first walked in the door? That's the thing. So, meaning, just to clarify that if you had a $600 power bill every three months, yeah, by the time I buy the sole and the battery and the finance and all that, I should still have less than 600.

There should be a little bit of a benefit, and over time, as I own the gear and I don't have to pay the repayments anymore, that's when I really float like a butterfly. Yeah, and not it, not even um over time once the system's paid off. You might like, let's say you even get someone to break even on that equation because they want to like future proof for an EV or whatever, so you just you oversize a bit for what their power bill needs, so they're like breaking even or whatever.

They can now use whatever, they can use more power without being guilty, like you know, pump the air con, things like that. But also over time, um, at the power power cost over the last like four or five years has gone up like twice as fast as inflation. And man, inflation's been jack it jacking up too, right? So, so over time it the power cost is gonna keep going up.

So we we actually help our customers like understand that fundamentally. Like, but like the first thing we want to look at is like, yeah, this is where you're at right now, but like, hey, two or three years, you're you're gonna be dishing out more and more to the power company. Like, people have seen it, they've seen those skyrocketing costs, it's really hurting them. So um the So they're resting that pain point.

Yeah, so so you're your people are it's really great once you pay it off the system. You don't have you know very little bills, but even even while you're paying off the system, and the if you hadn't done it, the cost of power would have gone up and up on you, so you're saving more and more every time the power the cost of power goes up. So even if you're breaking even straight away, then it's still a massive win. Yeah.

But but uh I think some of the politicians tell us that the power bill's gonna go down in the future, so then your math wouldn't work. Well, I mean, even better, like power like power bills going down is good for everyone. So I mean, yeah. But do you believe it?

Oh no, no, absolutely not. No way. I mean, it's the the c the the retailers are like private companies, like it's a it's a market game, isn't it? Yeah, like that the o like that they'll go they'll they'll go up as much as they can get away with before everyone jumps ship.

But hang on. We're now getting three hours of free power. Yeah. What do you think that's gonna do to the cost of the electricity on the other hours?

Yeah, yeah. And then then and even worse, what about the the poor renters that can't afford solar and and the the you know, it's um it's the same theory, right? Yeah, someone's gonna pay for someone's gotta pay for it. Yeah.

You mean if it's free for somebody, somebody else needs to pay for it? Yeah, that as the cost of power goes up because of everyone's gone solar and stop giving the retailers money, then then um The ones who are left. The people that can't get solar and battery are the ones that are the most stitched up out of anyone, the ri the people renting. So just just for the atmosphere of the podcast, yeah.

When you tell how people get stitched up because they can't get solar and all that, just smile a bit less, don't look so happy. These people actually feel sorry for them, yeah. No, I do, I do. It's it's it's it's the yeah, it's just the painful thing.

It's a life, laugh cris situation. Right, right. What do you think about all this vilification of gas where people say, you know, you shouldn't have gas hot water anymore and this and that, and get out of it and it creates asthma and all that. Um is there a big concern out there in the sales community, like when you talk to end customers about that?

I don't think anyone's so worried about their like dying from a gas leak or anything like that. Um, or you know, but they they the the gas bills are still going up as well. So if you can help people like get rid of a gas hot water and chuck in like a heat pump or something like that, then it's just another win because the heat part the then you're you your hot water is then powered by um hot like by solar as well. So it's like everything going down that electrification path, which is amazing.

Yeah, right, right. Everything in your house can be powered by solar, it's just get rid of the gas and then you're saving money there too. But if you now have to fill the battery, yeah, and then down the track there's EVs coming, and if you have two in the household, you potentially let's say drive 80 Ks or so, but there's 20, 22 kilowatt hours, 25 kilowatt hours already just on the EVs, yeah. And now the night consumption is got to go into the battery, and during the day, let's say we do 20.

So then it's quite easy that I suddenly need 50, 60, 70 kilowatt hours uh to be basically to go for that full electrification. And at that point in time, a lot of the roofs are not big enough to actually put the solar that you need. I mean, in the olden days we had a little solar and we go, just take a smidgen off your bill, and now we go the biggest solar possible because all these other electrical needs will come with EVs. What do you do then when you have a too small roof?

Well, let's hope they extend that free three hours in the day to uh a bit longer, eh? No, but I mean I'm I'm bringing this up because we had a debate before, and I'm like this particular panel here, yeah, yeah. And um by the way, they're not sponsoring this program yet. Well, don't ask me any questions about them, then or they'll scare them off.

My point is my point is this yeah, that they're made in a 500 now in the normal footprint, yeah, while a lot of installers are still using a 440. And my argument is why would the hell you're buying a 440, which is basically our eco's technology from three years ago? Yeah, wouldn't you want to, if the roof size is limited, wouldn't you want to get the biggest possible solar system on there, which means you would want to use the highest efficient panel? Yeah, I mean I absolutely agree.

However, they're just first to market with the 500. Everyone will catch up with that in a few days, and then it'll all be the same thing again. Listen, they're just a few weeks early with the 500. Listen, listen, you'll be working very hard here to get your credibility up.

A few days, you're just cut back. You've misspoken there. I think a few, yeah, in a few months, others will have 500, but then the ACO will be sitting at 550. All right, there you go.

But you're not using them, are you? No, we're not, I know. I I mean I have we have used them. Some people want Aiko, we'll put on ACO.

Right, right, right. Yeah, yeah, we're not like against AICO, yeah. Right, right, right. They look good, they're a good looking panel.

You've got a pretty house, don't lose 20 grand on it by putting an ugly panel on it. Anyway, just a just a little something because I just see the model at 500 and I'm going, gee, so that was a really old one before, so that's 465. That's about a year ago. Anyway, coming back to but would you agree high efficient panel is is how you drive a big solar system?

Yeah, for sure. And if you're up for like replacing the odd optimizer once in a while, you can throw optimizers on all the panels too to raise the efficiency a bit more as well. Right, right, good, good, good. So now let's talk about your program.

So, what do you actually it's mainly solar installers and solar salespeople that come to you? It's called Sun sellers. What is it? Is it like a half an hour uh hand holding with you?

You look in their eyes, or what do you actually do? And how long does it go for? Oh, look, there might be a bit of woo-woo stuff in there, but um it's um And by the way, I'm not getting paid to do this podcast. Um, he hasn't taught me anything yet.

He just he he he approached me at all energy. He I kept on running and I just couldn't tackle him. He tackled me down. I think it was near the um Yingli panda.

I was kind of fell on the panda, he got on top of me and he said, I need to come to your podcast. And and I was kind of in that choke. And as I was getting blue, I kept on saying, and so that's why he's here. Uh he's very persuasive.

Um basically he doesn't give you an option for no. There's there's definitely a proposed like that too. Um I mean, there's some truth to it. There's some truth to it.

I um I I definitely fanboyed when I bumped into Marcus and um I was like, Oh, you're the famous guy from the podcast, and um convinced him to come sit down with my um camera guy and do a quick interview. Yeah. But tell us now about Sun sellers. Yeah, so we so we have the middle, the middle pocket, right?

Because we're like the belief is that like um if we can give them the systems and processes and tools and ability and the skills to you know help articulate their value to the end user, then everyone wins. The end user's got a good quality local installer, and the installers are like, you know, making enough, getting enough jobs that they don't have to work for the retailer. They can have how they can, you know, sell for healthy profits and not worry about the little guy because sorry, not the little guy, the the cheap online stuff, right?

Because that that's one of the biggest that when the people come to me, they're like, you don't you don't understand, like there's the my market is so flooded, there's so many cheap prices you can't sell for it like in order to run a healthy business, blah blah blah. So we just help people that are a bit stuck in that way, and um, and yeah, we just what are the three or four things without you know, we give you the program for free today on the podcast. Yeah, please subscribe.

I'm happy, I'm happy to um but I mean give me some of the key points that you would take away if I visit your program. Uh don't be pushy, is that one of them, for example? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because I think the the besides the those are the two main things when people um come and um uh come to me for helpers.

One is they're like, yeah, we you don't understand it's it's just a flooded market, it's hard to sell. And then they're um but that they then they also say, Oh, and you know what, I don't like being the pushy sales guy, so I'm not made out for sales or whatever, right? And and I totally get it because sales guys have a bit of a bad rip and you know the the movies in the 1980s and people going hard. And look, in this in this day and age, if you're a pushy sales guy, you are dead in the water, you've got no hope anyway, right?

So it's it's all about really is it nowadays pushy that the wolf of Wall Street wouldn't survive? No way. The cust customers are way too like smart, educated, um cynical. They've got like sales resistance up as soon as that's what you got working against you.

As soon as you walk in the door as a sales guy, you've got that everyone's got a bloody uh wall up, right? Like that they they're like, and even like they're you can see that in the body language, can you? Well, I mean, no, no, not it's necessarily it's more when you go in and maybe like ask if they want to like rock and roll with it or something, then they'll they'll put it up because you know that they're like they've got a few concerns that that you haven't managed to kind of lay on the table.

And and if you don't deal with the concerns while you're there, then then it's just gonna pop up as I want to think about it, right? So the the thing is is uh as we teach people how to like a communicate the value, articulate like that um it's like uh helping a customer understand the difference between crap solar and good solar, right? Um and then and we should nowadays always say now solar and batteries. Solar and solar batteries.

It's actually now we we've always been selling solar, selling solar, selling solar. It's now solar and batteries because we lost the two back wheels, which was the feed-in tariff, and we're replacing it with the batteries, otherwise the car's going nowhere. But I'm not trying to bloody give you hard. Solar and batteries, all about solar and batteries.

Yeah, yeah. So that, yeah, so it's about it's the the the the thing is is it's about having a framework to help the customers unpack their concerns. And you want to do that during your while you're walking them through the process. So when you go to ask them if they want to rock and roll um and get it all sorted, there's not many things left to object, right?

They call it objection handling, but it's just about having a genuine conversation um to help the customer you know make the right decision. Can I can I play that with you for a bit? Can I be the obstruct uh customer? I don't know.

No, just let's just try one. Okay. I'm a bit worried because our tiles are quite old, and if you have a really fat installer, a lot of the tiles might be cracked. What do we do about that?

Yeah, well, uh well that I mean that's a s that's you've just given me the easiest objection to overcome. So let me and and and you can overcome that by obviously giving them the right solution, which is like whatever's in your framework in your tool belt about like you can bring tiles, or do they have tiles, or we help with tiles, and and we'll give the we'll put the skinny guy on the like that's that's an easy one, right? But we're we're we're this is a really good um this is a good subject.

So what happens though, right, is you might not have told me that. You might tell me you want to think about it. And the only concern that you have is about a fat guy on the roof when you don't need to have that concern, but you're too shy to tell me that you're worried about your roof. So you say, Chris, let me think about it.

Because I look at you and I go, shit, hit me on my time. But the the art is to encourage the customer to uh to lay the objections on the table so that you can have a genuine conversation and help um help make uh shift the belief around what is um possible or like a good result for them um to a point where they're just like happy to move forward. So it makes logical sense. So you're tickling out of them all the objections, isn't it?

That's the art, is it? Yeah, and you want to cover them mainly during the presentation so you don't have to do all the tickling at the end. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you you you just you it's and it's about having the right framework for that.

Yeah. So how did you learn all this stuff? I probably got honestly, I got my sales skills from I I started a uh street photography blog back in the day, and it was like um humans of K Road. Have you been to Auckland at New Zealand?

Uh yes, I have actually. K K, you know K Road? It's it's like um I've seen a lot of murals at one stage somewhere. There's murals on K Road, so you probably probably K Road.

Um it's murals everywhere, but let's go. You've been you've been there. Um it's like there's like brothels and churches side by side and like op shops. It's like a crazy eclectic like stretch of road.

And it's like it's insane, it's like just a crazy uh like array of humans. Are you in New Zealand, are you? Kiwi, yeah, yeah. You are a Kiwi.

Kiwi, yeah. Oh shit, and we let him in the pot. Oi. Yeah, but you didn't really let that.

I could look, this may be my German ear, but I couldn't pick up the uh the accent. Oh no, I've been trying to hold on to it for 10 years. You've just ruined my day. I've lost it.

No, but most Kiwi people are really nice. Thank you, I think. Um, yeah, so that's So you were in New Zealand, you were an aspiring artist. Yeah, so I was taking um, I was like, the the blog was like going up to people on the street and like talking to them about their like deepest, darkest secrets, and then asking to put it online, right?

That's street photography. So I was like doing that and like just all the time, like talking to people, getting doing that, getting like um getting good photos, putting it up online. It was um, yeah, no, it was good, it was uh quite a um popular blog, so I went pretty um pretty hard on it. So, how was that finance model on that?

Finance model I mean I went broke chasing my passions of an art being an artist, that's for sure. Um, so yeah, but that was where I got the people skills, I think. I'll attribute it to that because I never actually had any real sales training. Yeah.

Did you get a few rejections on the art type thing, or did you just really bulldozed along? Like, you know, did people go, oh no, I don't want to talk about that? Do you get that? Or do you kind of find a way through it?

You mean the street photography? Yeah, people would be like, who are you? Get away from me. Yeah, yeah.

I pushed, I mean, I pushed the art before I started a business, I pushed the artist thing really hard. I like, I like, you know, traveled the world, did art shows, like even got invited to do a TED TEDx talk. I was like trying to chase my passions, but I went just so broke doing it. I was like, I've got to go start a business and try and make some money.

And then how did you move into electrical? Did you do a proper apprenticeship or you you kind of changed? Yeah, no, I did it in New Zealand apprenticeship. Yeah, I was like, my I just remember my whole apprenticeship.

I just had audio books in my ear, just learning like self-development, spiritual, like all of this sort of stuff. I was like a kid in a candy shop when I got my hands on Audible. Do you have Audible? Uh no.

I I I have the app on my phone, but I don't use it that much. But uh you might get me into something there. Yeah, if you're gonna download Audible, first book you should ever listen is Think and Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. Like it'll like definitely shift your mindset.

It's the most sold self-development book of all time. So what do people kind of get when they leave your course? Do they feel they got fleeced and this guy done a sales job on me, or do they kind of really thank you for everything you've given them? Yeah, lot, lots of thanks.

I mean, every pretty much every client I've ever had has given me like a raving video testimonial. And um I like we've got like plenty of plenty of like epic success stories. Like I had um, I had uh one client, Corey, he came on, he was turning over about 400 grand um a a month already. So it's already a weapon, super nice guy, really knowledgeable.

And when I talked to him and I'm here and I said, Oh, so you're just asking people like if they want to go ahead on site, and he's like, No, no, no, I'd do that. And I go back to the office and I send, I was like, mate, I was like, this is gonna be the easiest client ever. Just ask for it while you're there. And he um within two months, he had his first.

Million dollar month. So he single-handedly turned um sold a million dollars worth of solar. That was before the battery rebate. Right.

And then yeah, and then I think um so so so do I read you correctly that a lot of people are in the sales discussion, explain how solar loss goes and batteries, see a lot of nods, get a rapport with the people, but then actually are too shy to say, Are you okay to go ahead? Yeah. They kind of don't want to feel too pushy and they walk away, and then by then 15 other guys fill the gap, is it? Yeah, or if they if or if they're in the moment and they're out and their customer says, This is this is a great guy, they want to go with you, but you don't if you don't um move forward, then they can end up going online and seeing some of those cheap prices you talked about, and then they're like, Oh, we don't know, and then they get stuck in this.

Sometimes customers never buy solar, so it's kind of your duty. If you know that you're definitely like the best value out there for the customer, because value is not price, right? Value is like you know, if you've got integrity and you know you're gonna back that customer for life, you're gonna you're gonna look after anything they need in terms of solar, like you're always gonna be there for them. If you know that, then you it's kind of like your duty to kind of help them like make the right decision and not get stitched up.

So um, like it's um it's about knowing to how to like have that conversation with the client. Yeah. Why do you think solar is such dominated by kind of some stitch-up companies who literally just want to put it on, give you a 20-year warranty, but never ever expect and want to be back in your house because it's 400ks down the road. Why is solar specifically like that?

Or I mean you've been in the electrical game before. Is it like that in there as well? No, I think solar's uh yeah, solar's so it's a it's its it's its own babe, it's its own unique thing, right? Like I think I think what solar companies don't realize is that, and even the um people that are installing solar and they if they don't understand the the the numbers as well, is that like they'll be selling for like a good month, but they there's not enough um margin in it so that if like like if you have a bad month, it'll take them out.

You know what I mean? So some people just don't understand, or they're just selling and they're just selling on the good months, or like when the rebate's good, boom, boom, boom, and they'd they have there's no planning for the bad months. So it's like you want to be able to make sure that you can um have a healthy business model so that you can be there for the life of the the system for the customer because then every everyone wins. So that's that's that's the problem.

People are just a lot of companies are just short-sighted. Like that's it. We got a series at the moment where we actually go into older systems, eight, ten, fifteen years old, and some of them with local government, and we found a hundred kilowatt system that have been turned off for the last four years. Yeah.

The aircon guys came, did a maintenance call, felt a bit scared about the solar, turned it all off, and forgot to turn it back on. Nobody had noticed. So my point is um when you get to older systems, eight, nine, ten years, a lot of customers don't really have a maintenance regime for solar, and maybe that's because the solar guys in sales told them it's a set and forget. So there's a lot of sad solar stories out there with systems that are not fully functioning as they could because end customers just getting ignorant about solar.

Why do you think that is, and what could we do about it? Well, I think we've come a long way. So, what we can do about it, the solutions are already there. If you've got a company that actually like cares about um their customers, then they'll have a really good way to monitor the system in the background and they'll get a red flag.

Um, like for example, I uh my I bumped into my client the other day at the sushi joint, and he was like, Man, you guys are good. And I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I know. I'm like, thank you, but tell me more. And he's like, Yeah, I've I got a call, I got a call, um, and it was your team, and they're like, your system's offline.

And I was like, Yeah, well, I moved house yesterday and took the modem, so it's I've that's why. And they were like, okay, no worries, bye. And like that's the type, that's the level of like service that should be in the solar game. If a system goes down, it's not up, it's not even up to the customer anymore to know about it.

It's up to the people that installed it because they're we've got the systems and processes to monitor it and reach out and stuff like that. So people don't realize that when they they're buying solar from the cheap guy, right? They're like done and duffed, and then they're not even like you said, they're not going to realize when it stops working or or have have a bit of a problem with it. So um I suppose that's what what was the first part of that question?

That was the solutions here, guys. I was so fascinated about everything. Yeah, I kind of got completely kind of snowboard bound as well. But I think it was a bit about, you know, what can we do that customers care a little bit more about the system long term?

Because I've seen a lot of old systems that had no maintenance or anything like that. Actually, so that yeah, that's a really good point because what happens, people have old systems and they're like, can we want a battery? And like, you know, and a lot, and uh, even they're like, oh what you know, what what does a battery cost? This sort of stuff, right?

And like if you're good, if you're like if you're an expert in the field, you're not gonna just say, okay, here have a battery, give me some money, have a battery, right? Because that would just be so bad form. Right, because the little solar system that they have that's kind of like this size, the battery's this side, and this will never power this. Yeah, you throw a couple of kilowatts in there if you're lucky, right?

So, and even then, people, people pe people with solar that's like four or five years old, that they were maybe someone like a 6.6 kilowatt went in or whatever, like they just say, I want a battery, I've got solar. Like, even then, that's still a stitch up sometimes because they only have like a handful of kilowatts spare. So you really, even if you want a battery, you really still want to sit down with someone that knows what they're talking about with solar and and actually um have that service where you can walk through and like understand everything before you make a buying decision.

But but hang on, hang on. I don't get this. I mean, seriously, y I was with you all this time. We held hands, we walked through the freeway.

Cuddled on the panda, we we we we survived, you know, trucks dodged them. But now, seriously, okay. I got a customer ringing, he's convinced with his 6.6 he's doing fine.

He only wants to buy battery. Yeah. You now interrupt that thought flow and tell him that he's wrong, and he actually really needs 10 or 15 to go with this size battery with his current consumption, yeah. And actually what he was thinking is wrong.

Yeah. And then you are up against the bloke who goes, Yeah, 6.6 beauty. I give you the 50 kilowatt hour battery, no problem, 499, 50, cheapest on the market.

You'll never have a bill. Yeah. And he'll bullshit so much to this customer who should have really had a bigger system. Yeah.

And then that customer is going to be so happy that he's going to be reinforced by this one guy, and you are actually contradicting him. Do you think he still likes you? Yeah, Marcus, you just described the industry at the moment, like with the rebates and everything and all these battery, these battery um sales companies just boom, boom, boom, like they just don't care about the customer, and that, yeah, that's what we're up against. But we we would essentially um we wouldn't we would never install a battery if we didn't have enough data to say it was a good idea.

So if you can't if the customers like just if they just are not willing to kind of look at it, they're just not our customer. Yeah. It's just not worth it. Right.

Yeah, yeah. Right. But you never tell a customer they're wrong. I mean, that's 101.

You've got to try and like get, you know, tell them like, hey, let's just have a look at this. No, no, you put the German accent on and say, I'm really sorry, but you don't understand solar. That's that's that's you know, is is is that in your course? Oh well, I mean, no, but I feel like it should be.

It's what not to do. Don't never sell with the German accent. Yeah. Yeah.

All right. Okay. Good, good, good. So if I give you the opportunity here to put a plug for your program to the solar installers and even to end customers.

So I'm gonna give you two 30-second sneak bit plugs here. The first one is your program, what will it do for me if I'm in the solar sales um industry or solar installation industry? And I've already been selling for 10, 15 years, I really don't think you can teach me anything. Yeah, what's your program doing?

All right, look, as long as you're a solar installer that can actually handle a bunch of installs, like so when the sales picks up, um, then like those are the people that we like to help. And so if that is that if you can f if you do fit in that um uh bracket and you do have concerns about like the industry and like cheap prices ruining the industry and stuff like that, the good news is you don't need to worry about that. You um you want to make sure obviously you're just um your your margins are healthy so that you can like be there for your customers and provide a premium service and then learn how to sell in that way so that your business can be really healthy.

We um every few months we do like an award ceremony with our clients because we have like a coaching group. Um, and like it most of the time people are like doubling their conversion rate. They're going from like closing like 20% of their deals to 40%. Like I had a client recently that went and uh he came on board, um he was like making like 30 grand a month.

Um and after two months on the program, he he closed single-handedly 450 grand. So he Yeah, but I mean that's also true in the middle of the battery rebate now where basically if you can uh hold a fly squatter, you're gonna kill a fly. Yeah, so let's make the most of it. Yeah, yeah.

Thank you, Marcus. 100%. You want to be making the most of it. You want to be making sure that you're you're there to like get get batteries into the customer customers' houses so they don't get stitched up with um the wrong solution and um and you know have a good business doing it.

So and and the program is called Sunseller. Sunsellers.com.au plugging.

And not Sunsavers, that's one of the solar companies somewhere in Australia. I'm sure I'm sure somewhere somebody will be called Sunsavers. Uh don't go there, they can't teach you how to sell solar batteries. My hold on, my 60 second plug time window is not over.

What is that? My you gave me 60 seconds to plug you only cut me off after 25. I think it was more than 25. But go go for it if there's more to sell.

Uh I mean, essentially, like the group of business owners is where it's like only one in 20 that apply, we actually we actually let in. So it's uh we really are focusing on just a certain Oh my god. One in twenty you only let in. Yeah, it's about you're like a bouncer at some point.

But it's about having the right mate, the amount of mm like money we've left on the table, just like making sure we get the right fit in the program. But it's uh for me, I'm we're doing this like for fun as well. We really enjoy the community of solar business. It's like the bloody film school when I wanted to go 30 years ago.

They only took 20 for 2,000. Um I got in. Yeah. Um good on you.

After three years, shows something for persistence. Um, so what's the profile? She's got to be good looking. What what how do you get in your program?

Why are you so elitist? Oh, it look, it's a it's a mindset thing. Like, so like if if people are like keen to come on and learn and expand and like you know, and like um build like a really solid like system and sales system in their business, we can help with everything. We roll up our sleeves, we help them build it out and everything like that.

We're not gonna put in the effort for a business if we don't think they're actually gonna roll with it. So that it's it's it comes down to like a many different things, it's just about having the right vibe in the group. I we protect the vibe, like it's like we're having fun, we don't, you know. It's so if you're um if you're just like kicking around looking at like, you know, maybe like uh how to sell solo for like really high margins and like you don't really like care about the end customer or anything like that, you're just not our you're not our type of people.

Oh okay. It reminds me years ago, um one of my dogs got pregnant and and we had five pubs and we decided to sell them, and we actually did job interviews with the people who wanted to buy the pubs, and then uh the next door neighbor came in and we said, Oh, why would you like to have a new dog? And they said, Uh our our existing one is getting too old and we're gonna get rid of him and uh we need a new brand new one. And uh we didn't give him a dog, we felt that wasn't a good enough reason.

So you're basically saying if people just walk in and and and say the platitudes of why they want to be in your program, but you don't really feel the passion to do the right thing by the customer, then they're not necessarily getting the gig. Exactly. That's it, yeah. And it and it it just helps everyone in the room, like everyone's leveling up together, everyone's sharing wins every week, and like, yeah, it's really awesome to to see and be part of that as well.

So we we wanna So you're kind of like a coach, pretty much, yeah. Like I and I've always enjoyed coaching, like I've been a sales manager for over a decade. I've won like awards for like sales leadership, and which like proves that like I'm not I'm not just a sales frother, I've actually created some sales weapons over the years, right? So it's really rewarding seeing people like take the take the um take the lessons and actually get really solid results.

It's like the most rewarding thing, which is why I'm just like loving it, absolutely loving it. Yeah, but now there was another 30 seconds or even 60 that I wanted you to share your knowledge for the end customer. So, what are the kind of three or four key tips for an end customer when they're looking for solar battery as to what kind of company they should pick? That's a good, yeah, good question.

So definitely um, I mean someone local, like you got to really make sure they're local because it's a 30-year product, right? It's going on your roof for 30 years. You want to make sure that if you've got an issue, that you're not gonna have to wait like three days for like someone to the like a retailer to find someone in the area to come and look at your system. That that's probably that's a good scenario.

Usually they don't find somebody for three months, yeah, or they try and pin it on like the installer that did it who doesn't want anything to do with it because it wasn't their brand. Yeah, yeah. So first one local, preferably with maybe bricks and mortar. Got that.

Yeah, I mean, definitely like you want to look up the reviews as well. Like, um, reviews are like a signal of like customers. Like, if you look up solar, the solar industry, and there's so many reviews out there that are all like they were great at selling me solar, but like, man, they were hard to get hold of after that. And there's so much out there, like it's like every it's almost like every second company.

But some of the really cheap shonky stuff, I don't know if they purchased the product review reviews, but I read those and I go, they're not real. So they are actually fake reviews about as well. Yeah, yeah, but they that still doesn't filter out the the bad no, you've got to always go for the low ranking because they tell you the truth. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So that that's that's you you want to filter, you want to have a good read of the reviews to make sure that there's no one bagging out the after sales, and it's it's a it's a you can't hide from that. If you're not doing the right thing by your customers, it's gonna pop up, right? Right, right, right, right. What about the gear they use?

I mean, there's some really cheap and nasty stuff, there's more quality brands. Does that give a bit of an indication? Uh yeah, I think um so that some people like you want to be able to choose as well, right? Some people, if you're really just wanting to save money on your power bill, like you don't want to sometimes an installer will come in and they're like, yeah, this is the best system and blah, blah, blah, and this is what you want, blah, blah, blah.

But the price tag's up here. And so, especially if like your your power bill is only like four or five hundred bucks and you want to like, you want to get rid of the power bill, but that if you're putting it on finance, you don't want those repayments being more than the power bill it got rid of, right? So then you want and you want someone that can then maybe recommend like a more affordable option that's not still something that's gonna stitch up. So you do you do want an installer that like has a bit of a range that's gonna suit your so they can give you a good better best, is it?

In terms of maybe two or different quotes with different gear and you have a choice. Yeah. Different panels, different batteries, different inverters, then maybe come with two different proposals. Wouldn't even call it good better best.

I'd uh you you I'd call it uh maybe two options because if it really is about saving money, you just want a good quality um battery that's not going to break the bank so that the yeah, the repayments are actually putting you in a position where you're saving money. Look, the truth is with a lot of batteries, uh even some of the better ones. Uh if I mention Sun Grow, yes, they've been in Australia for 12 years, they've got 80 people in their backup unit and in sales. Um you know, you'd be on safe hands, but a lot of the others could be a very good battery, but they've been in Australia only relatively new, and so therefore you really just don't know.

There's a gambling element on it, especially the ones as you call them, the more affordable ones. So we just don't know. Yeah, you definitely want batteries that have been around for a little bit, regardless. It was saying, like, I was I've been following your channel for a while, so I've I I just watched the all energy that you did from the year before, and it was like you we were looking you were walking around shooting at batteries, talking about batteries, and it's just like my god, it's only been one year, and none of those batteries are even in the market.

And so it's like like you said, it's like picking a winning horse, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But look, uh, it's been very interesting. I really enjoyed it.

Uh, you see, you have a lot of knowledge. Um, anybody who wants to improve their sales skills at the moment, uh, but can I be make a bit of a prediction? Jover. I don't think this podcast will get your phone ringing hot.

I don't, yeah, it's no, no, it's not because of what we talked about, but everybody who's got two arms and even just one leg and a and a fake leg, but has known sole owned batteries is out there at the moment installing. They don't have time at the moment for self-development and for how to improve their sales skills because they're all it's like the gold rush in Bendigo. They're all there somewhere digging and trying to find the gold from the battery rush, isn't it? Really, seriously.

And now, coaching group, we have little mini parties, which is like the we had someone come on the other day and can I do the finger on air? Like they were like to the to the to uh they were like, we just we just got rid of our last retailer. So it's what so it's they're busy installing for retailers. The idea is we like help them get rid of the the retailer and keep all of the money in their pocket so that they can um you know grow their brand.

Just to explain that, some of the installers they do used to work for Origin, for AGL, for Energy Australia, even for very large companies, and then they also try to run their own little bakery on the side. And what Chris is saying, you know, you don't want to work for an origin, you don't want to work for an AGL, you really want to work for yourself, you want to grow your own business. Um, maybe down the track, those guys employ other sales staff and grow the company in this business, but you don't necessarily want to be installer for somebody else because long term um those companies send the customer your way when there's a headache sometimes, but long term uh it's possible you feel there's more money to be made and a more satisfaction if you run your own business, is it?

And you can really look after your clients. Whereas if you're working for the retailer, you're just you're you you you there's a filter between you and the client, isn't it? Really? You still want to do the right thing by the retailer, but you you care a lot less about the situation than if you're installing for your own client and like you know, clients become your friends and you look after them and all of that sort of stuff.

So it's a lot better when you're like doing that yourself. But what you're saying is they're too busy working for the retailers to focus on sales. What I'm saying is come see me, I'll we'll help you turn that around real quick. Yeah.

All right. Well, listen, hopefully, this was an interesting discussion with somebody right embedded in the industry. Started as an electrician installing light switches and uh improved himself to solar and battery. You want to improve your overall just listen to him.

Maybe he's got something on offer. Sunsellers.com.au.

That's correct. Yeah. Okay. And soon he'll expand back to New Zealand when they let him back in.

Thanks, thanks for watching. Please support the channel by liking the video, hit that subscribe button, and ring the bell so you can check out all our other videos. Want more energy answered? Visit your energy answers.

com for quality energy products, tools, and calculators, and find your quality local installers. You're still here? I'll see you next time. Bye.