Good, Better, Best: How Installers Actually Choose Home Batterries - EP 61

What's this story with Australian sport champions that suddenly start to promote brands in the solar industry? Uh you know, that's fascinating. Just recently we saw some horror stories on the news happening in South Australia. I think an establishment full of batteries that caught fire.

That there is actually installations happening with no qualified Sparky on side, and then there is a sparky that goes around on different days to take selfie and doing the compliance, and that's how these companies are able to offer these chip deals because they're presented by your energy answers. Biofront companies. Um, how do you go about picking a battery? Very good question.

Um, look, it's man and agency, we have um six core values, and one of them is innovation. Yeah, so we're always on the lookout for new technologies in the market and keeping ourselves up to speed with what's happening across the industry and um also doing a bit of a competitor analysis because we have long-standing partnerships, and you know, sometimes if a new product comes uh um in the market and it's better than um the current uh you know, the the one that we currently use, then we have an obligation to look into it in order to always offer the best options for our customers.

Yeah. What about you? Look, sometimes I get labeled with the red shiny car syndrome. So I love new things, like I'm a marketer's wet dream.

So I think at the time everyone was having their separated inverters and batteries. So I think uh there's been some players that were doing it, but uh say ESY, they were an early coming to do so. So yes, SIG always had the the integrated uh inverter and battery system. Not a lot of other players were doing it.

So when a new product came in that had a similar sort of integration design by combining the two, uh I had to give it a go. So all in one solution seems to be the the go at the moment, right? Yeah, it's the norm now. Having like a separated inverter and battery, like for me, it's like not very aesthetically pleasing.

Like so I'm a sparky myself, so I love something that just looks smick, it's all integrated in the one. You're not having a bit of a spaghetti mess of cables and corrugated conjured everywhere. So definitely having an integrated system is what we choose. Oh, it looks much better.

And um, even if the customer has already an existing solar inverter, solar PV, there is the opportunity to remove that and integrate it with the all-in-one solution, right? Yeah, definitely. So, like obviously, depending on how old the system is, but if we can remove that to have it all integrated in the one, so you're not having two, three inverters all over your garage wall, then yeah, it's not always possible because sometimes uh up on the roof is the dog's breakfast, right?

And uh messy non-compliant cables, and um, we can't always do the DC coupling with the existing system. That's right, because once you touch it, you're really you're obliged to bring it all up to standard. So if we can separate and just have an AC coupled system, great. How did you get to start your business?

How long have you been around? So Lenargy, I started six years ago with my brother Winston. So we both come from sort of different backgrounds. His is more so like finance and economics, and I'm an electrician, so I did my time on the tools installing solar and batteries for years.

So we joined up um so yeah, we joined up together and um to be Lenergy, which is like local energy, so we're trying to be uh the area's local energy partner for solar and battery solutions. And what's your uh main area? Main area, so we're currently operating out of two. So HQ where I live is now a beautiful part of the world, the Southern Highlands in Mossville, but we also have a uh office in Newcastle, so we're sort of servicing all up everywhere in between.

Amazing. What about you? Where are you servicing? So um we started in 2017 serving uh Sydney Metro and quickly expanded to ACT and um Victoria the year after.

We had also an operations uh team in uh in South Australia. Um but so you guys at the moment you're in a few pies. Yeah, look, uh there's been uh a lot of different rebates over the last uh few years, and uh yeah um as we know the solar roller coaster is uh it's been challenging. So you know, some states have worked better than others in different times, yeah.

So South Australia was amazing. Uh a few years back when there was a South Australia rebate was very generous for batteries, and in fact, South Australia is now one of the um states with the highest penetration of energy storage. Um, then there was the Solar Victoria rebates that sparked uh a lot of demand in Victoria. What do you what do you find about the Victorian market?

It's got a bit of red tape, a lot of rules and regulations that aren't as strict in say other states. Like how do you find it there? Look, um, with all due respect, Lincoln, I believe that um Victoria is the highest regulated uh and um probably together with ACT. But for good reason?

Uh for good reasons, yeah. Because um there's been a lot of uh bad installations happening over the years, and uh having regulations in place protects consumers. Uh and um it's important that when we look at the overall picture and and also how to approach customers, we you know, as a company we need to factor in the um, you know, the all the admin cost and and compliance costs. There is uh a um uh electrical, independent electrical inspection in Victoria.

Yeah, that doesn't happen in New South Wales, right? So there is uh more cost involved when it comes to installation in Victoria NACT. Do you think we should bring that into New South Wales? Um, I think uh that's the approach that now the government is taking, having more uh uh audits and inspections on um installation since the federal budget rebate.

It's not compulsory yet, but I think uh if we had that way, it would be beneficial for the overall industry. So being say in in lots of different states, like fingers in a few pies, if you had a range of say 12 to say a dozen different battery brands, that would be a bit of a uh logistical nightmare to manage, wouldn't it? Oh, absolutely. Absolutely.

Um historically, we've never done more than three brands at a time. Yeah. Okay, so uh good, better, best, it's our approach. Yeah, and uh when we talk about good, it's not necessarily uh um you know uh inferior to the best, but yeah uh it comes with different functionalities and different uh um also customers' profiles.

Uh um some batteries are more affordable than others, yeah. Some batteries um are more expensive because of the branding, and you know, there is different um options out there, but our approach has always been good better best. Yeah, because it comes in a range of, say, would you say it's the price points that is most important or what's important uh in features? So having uh three different batteries positioned in the sort of different price range, it's um it's key for us to be able to support as many customers as we can.

Yeah, not everyone can afford the uh Rolls-Royce uh of the batteries, um, but some people want that. But some people like you don't need it as well, so it's like correct. Yeah, um some features uh might not be needed by homeowners, like full house backup, something that some batteries, you know, it's a very strong point for some of the batteries now very popular out there. Yeah, but some people never experience a blackout in their own uh in a lifetime at their household.

So yeah, it can be years. So if the blackout protection is not moving the needle of a driving motivator, what would you recommend for, say me, where I just want to save some money? Oh look, our um top-selling battery at the moment um uh is a Sun Home. Yeah.

So that is uh what we believe is the best value for money when it comes to offering um a solution that's um uh state of the art in terms of technology, all in one solution, DC, AC couple, yeah, stackable uh modules and scalable over time. Yeah. And um in terms of backup functionality, it offers essential loads backup, which is what most people need. Yeah.

Yeah, in in any case. Uh because if it's a blacker, you don't really want to have your underfloor heating on or your air con. Uh, because you just drain it straight away. Correct, correct.

So it's always a balance between having uh as many appliances on backup and you know having the the battery draining as uh as as low as possible. Um it's a balance there. Um but you know, these days, um with the federal battery rebate, people are installing uh 50 kilowatt hour standard and uh five kilowatt inverter. Yeah, that can be a big issue, right?

It can because you're not just you're not being able to produce enough power to charge 50 kilowatt hours, especially uh in winter as well. So I know with the uh what's becoming increasingly more popular, say in New South Wales, is the three hours of free electricity. So I know that's going to be pushed more so, say, uh in July, but there's already some retailers that are offering it like Glowbird and OVO. So some people who can't have enough to uh area on their roof space to put more panels or they don't have the budget, they can charge the battery during that window.

Where if you have the five kilowatt inverter and 50 kilowatt hour battery, you're not you're charging what, like one third of it, like 15 kilowatt hours. So I think there's um uh a big hole when people start to push that and they're gonna start expecting to get that uh charging the whole battery in that time. And they've been shoulder the the short stick uh with the inverter choice. Yeah, look, uh talking about the three-hour free power legislation that's coming into effect the first of July.

So every retailer will have to offer that. Yes. It looks great on paper for homeowners, but what I've seen already happening is retailers um increasing their uh supply charges and their uh rates in order to cover for these three hours because they're not gonna put it, you know, that are out of their own pocket. Yeah.

So there's a lot of smoke and mirrors with uh retailers, so I hope none of them are listening or um might have to blur out the company name, but they're just hiding costs on there. So I've seen already uh within a month of the same electricity bill and the same charge, you can see the the spike in the daily network charge. It can spike up to say 50 cents, which is like crazy. Um, so uh the safest bet if you can do it is just have enough solar and battery stores that yeah, you don't need the three hours, but it is a great perk.

Amazing. Um and when it comes to your product range, um, do you offer more than a couple of products? Uh you know, when it comes to batteries? Look, we do a similar like good, better, best.

So depending on what the customer needs and what their budget is, like if like do they want full home blackout protection, like single and three phase, then we'll steer them in a certain direction. But if they're like most that just struggling with the electricity bills and just want to save a bit of money, then we we like having something at that more affordable price range. That affordable price range comes with its own risks of uh uh quality gear, though. So, like, say we have been sold the dream or customers have will come to us, say, can you get us this battery?

And sort of um growing, then looking at that, looking into detail, we would try it. And like first, like I've been burnt firsthand about poor quality products. So, like everything works great when it does, it's when it doesn't, you want to make sure that you've got that after-sale service and support, not only from the installation company, but for the manufacturer, you want to know that you're gonna be supported and uh yeah, we've been burnt. So that's why we choose products very carefully, and that's why the ESY Sun Home uh we love because they if there ever was a problem, we know we've got that support.

We know uh Jerry, we've got a dedicated account manager and they've got a presence here in Sydney and New South Wales. So uh, if there was something uh that would happen, like in and touch wood, it doesn't, but say if it does, we've had that support, um, quick turnaround and quick replacement if ever we need it, uh, where we've learned the hard way when we don't have that support. We've got customers calling up, where where is it, why isn't this not working? And at the end of the day, that affects us, Daniel, like it's your business as well.

So it's quite 100%, 100%, Lincoln. And um, I mean, talking about the um you know, the selection of batteries, right? Is the market leaders, SIG Energy Tesla, for example, yeah. And um, you know, you you cannot go wrong if the homeowner wants that and if you offer that, yeah, without it.

You cannot go wrong. Um, but what we've seen since the federal battery rebate has come into play is that in that entry-level space, there's been so many different brands popping up. And uh new battery every second week. Yeah, our team of consultants every you know, every second day, they come up to me and say, Have do you know this brand?

Oh, can you see, can you uh can you look into this quote? I never heard of this brand. Oh, do you think this battery is good? And they show me quotes that you know their customers are um uh sharing because you know it can be very confusing and daunting for customers when they do the research and then they see that there is this amazing deal on the battery, 50 kilowatt hours for less than $5,000.

Yeah. I mean, seriously, do you still believe in Santa Claus? Uh well, sometimes I like to. But yeah, it is hard, and especially when you've got, like, say, a good-looking sports star that's endorsing the products, what could go wrong?

So um definitely encourage homeowners because it is a very overwhelming space. Do your due diligence, do your research, look at the battery brands, how long have they been around, who's offering it? What's are these companies reputable? Like, check out their reviews.

And so uh the best way place to start is um by going and checking insulation companies who are uh experienced being in the market for a while. What are they offering? Why are they offering it? And if you want a good um idea of how that company operates, check out their reviews.

So yeah, what's the story with the Australian sport champions that come out of retirement? Maybe they you know didn't manage their finance really well uh uh since retirement, and uh they suddenly start to promote brands in the solar industry. Uh, you know, that's fascinating. It is fascinating.

I'd love to talk uh more poorly on it, but I'm only a little fish, Daniel. I don't want these big players coming after a small guy from the Highlands. So we um you were talking before about the this big battery stacks on five kilowatt inverter single phase, right? Which is nonsense when it you know when it comes to charging, discharging the battery and really being efficient for homeowners.

Um ESY Sun Home just recently came um came into the market with uh a great innovation, which is the 10 kilowatt single phase inverter now. Yeah. And um that's great. That's great for our for our clients, right?

It is great. Like there was a massive gap. That's why I say some other brands say SIG Energy, they had the variety of different options and the flexibility of it. And even though that say um having that more affordable option, say the the limitation for a lot of them was their inverter capacity.

So they didn't have the five or the 50 kilowatt hour stack. So uh ESY has been great with that, say, five, six kilowatt inverter range. As this battery rebate came in, everyone's wanting bigger storage though and bigger systems. And so that their limitation was only having that um that small range, but to sort of listen to the feedback of their consumers and the installation companies, and now they've brought out the larger 10 kilowatt single phase option with as well as the 10, uh, as well as the three-phase options with the 10, 15 kilowatt uh inverters.

So now they're not pigeonholed to only serving a small uh consumer base based on a small electricity bill. We can be able to help it for for all households now, so of any shape, sizes, and budgets. Yeah, and let's be honest with yes, uh uh with um Easy Sun Home. Yeah.

So their single feed range goes up to 30 kilowatt of storage. So a five or a six kilowatt inverter coupled with the 30 kilowatt storage is um a good pairing. And it's a yeah, it's a good pairing. But for those homes that are using, say, 40, 50 kilowatt hours a day plus, there was that gap where we couldn't use that product for them.

So now I think it's uh it's changed the game by having their new product range. We can install it on all uh bills no matter how much they're using. Plus, the 10 kilowatt inverter now allows people to install more solar because the the five and the six were limited to eight kilowatt? Yes, that's right.

So yeah, that's about like a small household for like two people. But if you've got a large family, you've got a pool and uh heat pump, then you're gonna need bigger capacity, and you're gonna need more solar and you're gonna need a bigger battery. What's uh the percent I'm curious on this one, what's the percentage of your customers that have an existing solar PV on the roof, and when considering a battery, then they want to add extra solar. I'd say the percentage varies depending on which area we're in.

Um and they can a lot of people are increasing their usage over time. So more and more people are adding EVs, and then they don't have enough uh solar to charge that storage. So, in those circumstances, if the panels are only say a couple years old and there is enough roof space, then we can add additional panels into the uh inverter and battery system. So that's the benefit of having the integrated inverter with the battery that if we want to add more panels on, we can, and we're not having another three or four different inverters.

Yeah, and in our experience, actually, we have a lot of customers that come to us for batteries. Yeah, and then when we do the full assessment, um we realize that the solar is actually not generating uh uh much at all. Yeah, so that you know we're talking about old systems five, ten years plus old, maybe sometimes even less than three kilowatts. And customers think, okay, I'll just add the battery to that and then they resolve the problem.

But yeah, the key in um in a in a great uh energy storage solution to work well is actually having enough PV generation to be able to charge the battery and have the juice that's needed to to power the home, right? Yeah, yeah, exactly. So in um in many circumstances with our customers, um um we actually remove the existing systems and then place larger systems with new technology panels and having the flexibility of a product like ESY Sun Home that can be DC couple and AC couple at the same time, yeah, uh works perfectly with um you know both circumstances where the customer has a good solar PV system installed and we just AC couple the battery, or where you know there is the need of extra solar in some cases removing the current solar setup and adding as much as we can on the roof.

Yeah. So when selecting a battery, you don't want to just go all in completely uh without testing and trialing it. So before you brought the ESY sign home to your sort of product range, how did you find um the first couple? Or did you just go completely in or good question?

Um so as I mentioned earlier, one of key uh values is innovation. And we have a team of um about 12 plus energy consultants that basically come to me every week with um different quotes, different products, and um um you know it is uh one of my key responsibilities to make sure that as a company we always offer what's the best available in the market to our customers. And um when it came to researching new products, um about two years ago, actually, there was a New South Wales rebate that was launched at the time, so the interest for batteries was uh heating up in New South Wales specifically.

Uh and at the time we were using uh for our good so entry-level battery, we were using a different product, but our experience um uh wasn't the best. And I won't name a shame, uh, but um uh we installed more than uh 250 uh units of this specific brand, and um the after installation failure rate and problems that our customers experience was um was um appalling. So when it came then to okay, let's revise our product range because you know, as a as a director and um and and business owner, you want to make sure you are not caught up with huge liability with your customers' uh warranties, and you know, it is our obligation and also our uh primary responsibility to make sure our customers are happy, not just when we store the system, but for the lifetime duration of that system that we weren't for 10 years plus, right?

So it's important that we pick the right HANA that not only gives us uh great pricing so that we can pass the best uh offer to our customers, but that gives us the best after-sell support. And in terms of specs, and you know, the specs of the product they need to be state of the art and the quality needs to be great to um you know withstand the Australian harsh uh weather conditions, right? So um picking easy sun home for us was uh was through this process. Of analyzing uh okay what we currently offer and what we can do better in our product range, looking at the competitors, looking at the emerging uh uh battery technologies and the different specs, like all in one solution.

You know, two years ago was not the trend. So we look at okay, what is the um opportunity with this particular battery? It can be stackable, it can be scalable. Um, the company has a um solid presence in Australia.

In fact, they're only about 20 minutes away from our office in Castle Hill. And um also for me, it's very important uh to meet the team behind it and meet the um whoever is running the business in Australia and and trust that person because um you know trust and uh owning up to your own word when you make a promise is what always strive for as an individual. And when I see that there is the same reciprocated from um the business I'm dealing with, then for me is a is a is a great tick.

Yeah, yeah, definitely. So our guys, we've got a lot of uh our own installation teams, so our own electricians, when we're trying to pick a battery, um sending them to a bad battery or a bad roof, like a slate roof, uh they they kick and throw the toys out of the cot. So we need to make sure when we're sending or picking a battery that not only does the customer have a good experience, that our installation teams also enjoy uh doing it. So that's why when we uh we were interested in bringing a new range on, like the ESY sign home, because it combines both the inverter and the battery modules and it's integrated.

When we first did that, there's always a risk when trialing a new product. 100%. And you you mentioned the ease uh of installation, like yeah, when you run your own teams, right? You you cannot just throw uh 10, 12 different products, different batteries uh uh to for them to install because then they don't specialize in anything, right?

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. So when we sent, we actually picked one of our most uh um talented installation guys, his name was Ben, and when he did it at the time, we were very curious to how the installation went, and they were done by say like 2 p.m.

because he said because it was just modular, they weren't mattering separate 10 kilowatt hour battery modules here, there, and everywhere. They got it done, commissioning was a breeze, and it's definitely now one of his favorite batteries to install. 100%. Well, I believe at the time we decided to go for a pilot of five units installed to trial and test the product and also to get a feedback from our um installation teams, and um it was unanimous.

Everyone loved the product, easy to install. Uh, you mentioned the modularity and how um simple it is for our installers just to stack up the modules um and um also the ease to deliver the products to the customers, uh um and um yeah, everything was a um top tick for us. Yeah, and as a retailer, now that we're trying to uh find installation partners, which is a hard in itself, uh even when speaking to to new people and new electricians, one of the first questions that they even ask is what brands do you offer?

What products do you offer? And from our experience having conversations, uh it's uh uh they're quite pleasantly uh surprised, not surprised, but um they're generally quite happy when we tell them what our product range is. So we've got the we've got the Sig Energy, but we also also do uh the ESY Easy Sun Home. So I've heard from when speaking to them, oh I'm so glad that you don't do X, Y, and Z.

So I don't want to again name and shame. Yeah, it's a it's a company's reputation on the line. Yeah. Um and um, you know, I feel like sometimes uh these these days installers are very picky, let's be honest.

Everyone is uh um super busy and uh installers um can pick and choose, and um they only want to deal with companies that have a great reputation. Yeah. Um and um and that offer good brands. Yeah, because they know they can also charge more if it's the case, right?

Yeah, that's what's happening in the market at the moment with electricians and installation teams. Yeah, that's right. And uh they also because they're the ones doing the actual installation, they don't want to do stuff that isn't reliable, that they're gonna have to go back out and have to fix if there's um Wi-Fi Dow commissioning problems or this, that, and whatever. But uh that's why they're careful, like you just mentioned, who actually they partner with, that who's the installation company, who's the retailer, and what products do they use.

Yeah, you touch on the monitoring and commissioning, that is a big part of the installation of a battery. Oh, yeah, because you know what we find is uh electricians these days um they also need to be a little bit of IT technicians, yeah. If the product is not um, you know, up to uh the highest uh um IT um standards, right? It's um uh we find in the past with uh some brands that we install uh installers were getting frustrated that they couldn't uh pair the Wi-Fi or the commissioning was taking too long.

And um that's not the case anymore with uh ESY Sun Hum. Yeah, it's a good point. So we like I'll put my hand up, we have trial different products, especially when uh customers come to us wanting, say, a certain brand. It looks good on paper.

We'll try it, it's new to the market. What could go wrong? Uh it's generally the commissioning, and whoever gets the who gets the most frustrated by that is the installation company. We've had scenarios where our teams will be out for hours on site, and that just it's just completely unacceptable.

It shouldn't take hours, it should be 10, 15, 20 minutes to commission something. And the fact that that you can have that speed and that ease of commissioning with the ESY Easy Sign Home is why our install teams love using it. This is a uh tricky question. Uh oh.

But what do you do when customers come to you and say, Hey, I have this quote here. Uh, can you do this battery for me at a better price? Uh look, it's hard. You're seeing it uh everywhere at the moment, especially with the uh the endorsed superstar.

Um you gotta have to do your research. It's very hard. We try and stand our ground. So the price is what you pay, value is what you get.

Just because it's a good price doesn't mean it's a good deal. So it can be compared to say putting a roof on your home. So that's something that you want to do it once and do it right. And uh uh the only thing more expensive than a good roofer is a bad one.

So the same that can be said about the sole and battery industry. So the only thing more expensive than uh a good battery brand or a good installation is a bad one. So people don't understand they're putting uh an electricity plant inside their garage in their home, and people are doing doing this or shopping around like they're shopping for uh TVs at Audi. You know, what I've heard, I mean, installation is something that um is the key element of the whole equation, right?

And sometimes customers don't understand that installing a battery at your home is not like installing a fridge. No, the fridge is delivered to your home, placed into position, and then you just plug it, right? It's not the same thing. And um that's why it's highly regulated because it's a complex electric, it is a complex electrical installation that is um you know can compromise your entire electrical system in the house if something goes wrong.

Yeah. And and we've seen the bad examples and you know horror stories with solar in the past, and we don't want this to happen in our industry now with batteries, okay? But there are you know there is always a risk when you offer something for too cheap because there has to be some corners. Uh there has to be some uh corners to cut to be able to offer these uh these cheaper prices.

And normally where the corners are cut are on the installation side. And one of the things that I've heard, and it's now you know a very big rumor in the industry, that there is um actually installations happening with no qualified Sparky on side, and then there is a Sparky that goes around on different days to take selfie and doing the compliance, and that's how these companies are able to offer these chip deals because they're actually not installed by qualified Sparkies. So supply was a big issue, especially sort of uh last year, late last year, when the battery rebut was going nuts.

How have you found the supply for seas why? Oh mate, it's been an incredible uh journey the last um nine months, hasn't it? Um the demand has been exceptionally high, where yes, there's been some big issues in the industry with supply, and um some brands have suffered more than others. And um, you know, as a company, we were lucky enough and grateful that we always plan in advance with our uh partners, right?

So having a strong partnership with only a few brands means that you are in constant uh uh communication with them, you plan ahead, you have your forecast, and then you order your containers in advance. So having processes in place as an organization and a strong relationship with our key partners is essential. So we were able to plan ahead and have our containers available when we needed to install for our customers, especially from 1st of July onwards. Uh, we heard some horror stories and um a lot of issues um in the industry with uh you know some brands not having batteries for more than three months, and some companies that had promised installations to their customers not be able to fulfill for more than 90 days.

I mean, we we have experienced some issues, but to be honest, not for uh uh local um we we've experienced some issues, but not because of shortages of stock, but because of shortages of qualified sparkies and technicians to install batteries. And uh as a company at Smine Energy Answers, we will never compromise the quality by hiring just random people to install these batteries. So um we want to make sure that there is qualified and experienced people to install these batteries, and that's why in some cases we had to postpone installation simply because we didn't have the right people to handle the job.

Well said. Yeah. Um but what's been your experience uh uh in terms of um stock supply, specifically from um easy sun home? Look, I'd have to yeah agree with you.

Like say at the end of last year, it was going sort of nuts. Everyone was trying to get in before the sort of the rebate drop. Uh, and a lot of people, especially a lot of manufacturers, could never have expected the the demand that they needed to produce for the Australian market. So I think there were some constraints, but it wasn't limited to to one.

I think it was uh all round in in my experience anyway. So the only way to prepare for that is um yeah, like have those relationships with the suppliers, like you said, limiting your product range to have better partnerships so that there maybe maybe there was a little bit of favoritism, if uh um like you would have imagined. I think you took a lot of our um batteries when we needed them most. Well, but here is the thing uh when you establish such strong uh punishes, and you know it's a give or take, you know, you you deliver on your promises, you deliver on the expectations that you set, then you know when you looked after when two of the main wholesalers that's supposed to distribute the products come to you and ask for stock from from you and say if you can give some products for their own customers, you know.

Yeah, wow. So in in that case, I feel very grateful. Yeah. Yeah, I think the ESY sign home stock has always been uh relatively okay.

Like as you were saying before, uh, there were some brands, especially on their newer models, which again I don't want to sort of name and shame that uh people were trying to get them installed late last year, and their actual brands or that type weren't even getting fulfilled stock until sort of uh mid to late January. So that's that just goes to show that people weren't, some manufacturers weren't prepared for the demand and they they couldn't keep up. And customers had to pay more because the rebate reduced on the 31st of December?

Yes, yeah, that's a conversation I definitely don't want to have. So that's why it's important that uh uh we plan in advance, definitely. Yeah, and ultimately, if there is no stock on time and the rebate drops, then who pays for it is the customer, unfortunately. And um, you know, with the new rebate structure that's um kicking off from 1st of May, we will now experience two rebate drops every six months, which means having reliable uh stock supply to be able to fulfill on your expectations and promises to customers is key.

Yeah, and it is a drop, but it's it's I see it as somewhat of a good thing as well, because we might uh weed out a lot of the sort of 50 kilowatt hour batteries with the five kilowatt inverters. I don't think they're gonna be as common now with the drop because it's gonna make a bit of a substantial difference uh to those systems. Oh, you're talking about the the change of the uh you know rebate calculation, right? I was just referring to the drop in the value that's happening every six months, but yes, yeah more importantly, from 1st of May, um bigger batteries will not get the high incentive, the incredibly generous incentives they were getting before, up to $18,000 for a 50-kilowatt hour stack was insane.

And that favored those cheaper brands offering um you know crazy deals out there. Um so you know, um what I've seen in the market's been also a little bit of a grit factor from consumers saying, okay, oh well, if I can get this much more and only pay this much less, then wow, that's amazing. You know, so that's been a grit factor for sure. Yeah, but don't call it the solar coaster for nothing.

So for us, the customer experience is everything. We've built our brand of uh referrals and our reputation, and it takes a long time to uh to build it and it can go away very, very quickly. So uh a lot of our business is referrals, and we've done a lot of the ESY Sun Home for that more affordable option. And every single week we're getting over a dozen uh new leads of customers trying to refer people because of the good experience they've had with not only Lenargy but with the ESY Sun Home.

100%, 100%. It's um you know, when you when you pick a product and you offer to thousands of customers out there, and then you see that customers are happy, that's the most important thing from our uh point of view, and it's important that they're happy not only when the installation is completed, but also when an issue arises, right? So we've seen instances where you know there was um a particular customer I remember that uh we performed the installation and um um there was an inverted that on arrival, so you know, just wasn't working was faulty, which you know it's been uh one of probably out of 400 installations we've done, so uh rare occasion, but the support that we received from Easy Sun Home has been um you know first um it's been incredible.

Like they organized a technician to go on the same weekend on a Sunday to actually replace that inverter and make the customer happy. Yes, and that's the other great thing of Easy Sun Home. They don't only have representation from you know um account managers and uh support technicians on the phone, they also have their own field technicians that can help in um situations where customers are really unhappy, or if there is a problem um that involves um you know extra expertise.

And um yeah, that's that's something um you know on another level. Yeah, my advice would be to homeowners who are considering a different uh battery brand is is get on Facebook, join the Facebook forums or Facebook groups of say ESY, say Sig Energy or Fox or whatever, and you're gonna see real experiences with no filter of uh their experience with the battery brand, uh things they like, they're often posting their installations to say rate my install. And if uh and I and I do join them, so when we're selecting a battery brand, I want to see what the customers uh what they think of it.

So when I'm in the ESY Easy Sun Home Facebook group, and you get an overwhelmingly uh amount of positive uh reviews and support in that um in the group. 100% these days social media drives uh I mean drives everything. And uh the Easy Sun Home group is um so popular. Like we have some happy customers that became ambassadors and they just posting on the group, and every time there is a question they uh comment and um yeah, they they refer smart energy answers, and that's the you know the great great satisfaction.

Yeah, and I think if you're seeing those deals that look too big to do look too good to be true, uh there's a particular brand that you may you may see, go to Facebook, join that group, uh, because I can say there's some that and we've chosen not to install it uh because of the the consistent negative feedback or the the oh this isn't working or I I didn't have any backup circuits in a blackout. So do your homework, join the groups um and see what it's like for other homeowners.

The safety is um is paramount for smart analgentis for our customers. We want to make sure that we install a product that's reliable and it's built to last and is the safest that can be in the market. And we've seen a lot of the cheap products, cheap batteries in the entry level, um, especially those social media deals, um, they don't have that. And more importantly, the companies that are offering these deals, they haven't been around for six months or maybe not even a year, two years.

I mean, how long have you been in business? How long have you ridden this uh solar roller coaster, Lincoln? Look, we've been in the solar coaster uh personally myself, so I've been on the tools inside of my apprenticeship like 10 years ago. So uh Lenargy's been going for six years, but we're seeing uh a lot more uh common these people that have been around for only a couple of years and some even six months that are just trying to capitalize on this rebate.

Yeah, well, as Manana Jan says we've been in business nine years, personally in the industry for almost 15, and I've seen so many companies coming and going. And every time there is a new rebate, there is more comers, and there is what we call the flyby niters. They're here just to get as many cheap deals that they're for customers, making the smallest amount of profit they can make, because there is no profit in these deals, and there is no uh let's be honest, uh, a decent profit is very important for an organization that wants to sustain the industry and wants to grow sustainably over time in order to offer the service uh and the aftercare to the entire customer's fleet that they install over the years.

Because solar batteries are complex electrical installations and something can go wrong uh over the years. And it's very important that the company is around to support the customers because there is so many orphan systems out there from company that disappeared, they just left customers high and dry, and then now they have to start all over again, you know, install again new solar PV. Um, there is already customers that have experience of batteries that are not working installed six months ago, and the companies are no longer there.

Yeah, yeah. It's um yeah, we've even seen uh companies forcing uh a particular solar and battery system on the homeowner. Uh, and as you know, you only get one shot with the federal battery rebate. So they got sold a an inverter that was too small with a battery system that was too big.

Uh, and that battery type they stopped actually making it, it was actually redundant. So uh they couldn't just add on to it, they couldn't change something, they had to completely rip it out, which just left such a sour taste in this homeowner's mouth. That's right. There you only have one shot at the rebate, right?

As a homeowner, yeah. You can only take it once, so do it right from the first set. Yeah, that's right. So do it right from the first go.

Look, safety is really important, especially with battery brands. Some people have a sour taste from stuff they've seen on TV. Uh, like a real popular brand at the time, LG, has had a massive recall. So uh for a lot of homeowners, they are concerned about safety.

And some of the new battery brands say uh come, say some of the new battery brands like SIG and East Wire, they actually come with an inbuilt fire suppression system, which a lot of the other cheaper brands don't actually have. So for us, that's uh gives us and the customer peace of mind. Absolutely. Far suppressant was one of the uh key uh items that we um looked into when um selecting ESY Sun Home as uh our main product for the entry-level range.

Yeah. And um, you know, hopefully we'll never have to be used for our customers. Uh but we've seen already some horror stories out there and um um you know there was something recently in South Australia, wasn't there? Yeah, there was a warehouse um full of batteries that took fire, and uh, I'm pretty sure that they didn't have uh this brand didn't have fire suppressing in there.

So yeah, um well by the way, Lincoln, it's been a pleasure um to get to know you and get to know about your business. Uh I'm very pleased that um we are uh partners in um you know this uh in this journey with um ESY Sun Home. Yeah. And we can probably share tips and um um you know anything uh about the product uh support for our installers going forward.

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