Tom Schwab on Podcast Guesting, Building Authority, and Leveraging Audio for Business Success

Welcome back to the Beyond Business Podcast where we go beyond revenue and tactics to talk about relationships, leadership, legacy and real growth. I'm your host, Catherine Martin Fischer and today's guest is someone every entrepreneur, coach and expert needs to hear from if you want to grow your trust and authority the right way. So Tom Schwab is the founder of Interview Valet, the leading podcast guest marketing agency helping businesses turn conversations into real relationships, influence, and long term growth.

Tom, thank you so much for being with us here today. Well, thank you for inviting me. I'm excited for the conversation, and I love the idea of just going beyond the business side of the real impact that you can make through your business. So Tom, what inspired you to start on the journey that you're on and what you do and how you serve the world?

Yeah. I think it's really this idea that we're all one conversation away. And, you know, I'm an engineer. I'm a big fan of automation.

But this idea that, oh, you're one funnel away, I reject that. Everything that has been great in my life, right, my best clients, my best employees, my best partnerships. Heck, my bride did not come through a funnel. She came through a conversation, and to me, that's that's the magic.

And especially in these days of AI now, I think it's more powerful than ever. I agree with you. It's you know, I many years ago when I was building businesses, one of the things that I did was it was it was almost like that human funnel. I love the human touch, and I love what you're talking about with automation, but also that human touch in in in the conversations that you have with people.

And so how would you say that you're able to help businesses to learn how to do this instead of just, you know, depending on automation? Yeah. So I think you go back to first principles, right? And how did our grandparents grow the business, right?

Talking to the right clients or right customers. Well, how did they do that? Well, they found out where they were, right? And that might have been the country club, the chamber of commerce, wherever it was.

And then it went to, you know, as seen on TV or as seen on radio. Well, today, the easiest way to do that is to find where they are, and podcasts are so popular now. And it's easy where you can get on a podcast, tell your story, get that know, like, and trust, and, you know, people will either turn you up or turn you off. And the amazing part today, it's not only that the your clients are listening, but also the AI that's referring them.

Right? There is no doubt today in 2026 that AI indexes all of the podcast interviews. So when people are talking about how do you get recommended by Claude and ChatGPT, You gotta be heard on podcasts. What would you say that most business owners misunderstand about being a podcast guest?

I think most people are under this idea that more is better, that it's just a numbers game. Mhmm. So the idea being well, just go on lots of podcasts and tell your story, and there's people that are teaching that. Well, you just go on and you tell your story.

The truth is, Katherine, nobody cares about my story. Right? Years ago in my last business, a client called up, and he said, you guys are just like Preparation H. And I was like, excuse me?

We're like hemorrhoid ointment? And he's like, no. It's a compliment. Right?

He says, you provided fast relief. You came recommended. And that's when I sort of struck me is nobody cares about our story or our service or our product. They care about their pain, the pain in the rear end.

So I think if you can get in front of the right audience, tell them, show them that you understand the pain, you understand the problem, then you can start talking about your solution. And I think that's what too many people miss that they think it's just a numbers game. I've just got to keep talking and telling my story. No.

Talk to the right audience and focus on the problem they want to solve. It is about the problem that they want to solve, isn't it? What would you say is most why is it more powerful to actually have podcasts or be on podcasts than using ads? Yeah.

It's there's things that are efficient and then things that are effective. So it's very efficient just to buy an ad, To throw something up there or send a million emails or buy a top spot in a Google ad, something like that. It's efficient, but not necessarily effective. And if you think about, you know, if somebody wants to have a conversation with you, right?

If you went and talked with them one on one, you know it's very, very effective. So it's this idea of not just being efficient, but being effective. And I think today people want to buy from the person they know, right? Especially if you start talking about services, not products, Right?

I I used to joke that the earbuds, right, with the the cords on them, I don't care who made mine because they were disposable to me. They went through the wash once a week. It was a commodity to me. I don't have to know who's doing that.

But if it's somebody that's a coach, a consultant, even somebody that's got a business that helps mine, I wanna know what their values are. I wanna know who they are. And I'll give you an example of this. Early on, one of our clients, Gavin Zuklinski, started a company called Acuity Scheduling.

And he got on podcasts and he told about how he built this for his mom. And she started to use it, and all of her friends used it. And as he got new features that they wanted, he put it together, and then he built this company, and it was out of Pennsylvania. And now was there any difference between Acuity Scheduling and ScheduleOnce or Calendly?

Probably not, but I knew Gavin. I knew what his team stood for, and so I'd never switch. Well, fast forward, when they started to look at acquisitions, his was the first acquisition by Squarespace. And part of that was his churn rate was so much lower than other people's just because his was built on a conversation, a relationship, not just an ad.

So I think there's something about, getting not only sales and clients from it, but better clients and more loyal clients. And at the end of the day that's what we're trying to do is make impact and make value not just do transactions. That is awesome. I love that point that you're making there.

What type of businesses do you feel would benefit most if they're not ready yet, to do podcasting? Yeah. I think as we found from the last eleven years, there's certain things to look at. The first one is, are you a national business or are you very regional?

Right? I live in Kalamazoo, Michigan. A friend of mine's got a great stereo shop. Right?

He'll in in install home theaters and everything. But if you're not within 20 miles of Kalamazoo, you're not his client. And he would have a very inefficient way of going out on podcasting, talking to the nation, and only being able to service a small area. Another thing is that is it a relationship sale or is it a transaction?

Do people have to know, like, and trust you to buy it or is it just a commodity? And then the next thing that we're really seeing is I think today in 2026, there's so many people that are getting lost in this sea of sameness where you sound like everyone else. So I think those people that want to be known as a category of one, they want to be seen as the only choice, not just a choice. Well, it's really hard to do that off of an ad or a brochure.

You've got to talk to people and explain that. So those are the people that tend to do the best on podcast interviews. Well, that is a good way to segue into what separates a forgettable podcast guest from one that drives leads and influence. Great question.

And, hopefully, I've given a sort of a a case study, and I'm memorable by this time. I always look at it as when I'm on a podcast, I want people to either turn me up or turn me off. Either way is fine. Right?

But I hear so many people that'll come into a a podcast interview, and the first question is, so tell me about yourself. And it starts, well, I was born here. Here's my hobbies, all the rest of that. And it's like, that's nobody asked for the biography and worse yet, at the end of forty minutes when they are finishing up that first question.

Right? So I think what makes memorable is to start with what you believe. And that's what I did, right? The idea of, I reject this idea that everything's funneled in automation.

I believe it's in conversation. People are gonna turn that up or turn that off. And I think today, starting with what you believe, what your vision is, that's gonna attract the right people because at the end of the day, too many times people were talking about, well, how do I get more leads? How do I get more likes?

How do I get more clicks? Well, are all vanity metrics, right? From a business perspective, we're trying to maximize for impact and you know you're making impact when people will pay you money for it, right? The people that are making profits, they're making impact.

So I think this idea of going on a podcast and trying to be generic, being warm water, being forgettable, sort of putting yourself in that sea of sameness is a perfect way to fail. You wanna come out there and be clear of who you are, what you believe, who you serve, and people will be drawn to you or repelled. Marketing should be magnetic and a magnet doesn't attract everything, it just attracts the right thing. Now what are your thoughts on the difference between being a guest on a podcast and hosting a podcast?

It's a question of the platform. Right? And I always think of this as should you be an Uber guest or excuse me. Should you be an Uber driver or an Uber passenger?

It's the same platform, but it's different goals there. Right. So I think it's the same way when you're a podcast. Right?

Being a host is a great way to nurture your current leads, to nurture your current, clients. But this idea, if I build it, they will come, that never works. So the way to go out and get new exposure, to get new leads, to get known in new audiences is going out and being a guest. The other thing that I'll throw out there is that being a guest, you get more benefit and less work.

So at after this interview, we're gonna say goodbye and I'm gonna go on with my life and Catherine and her team are gonna go and they're gonna edit it. They're gonna get the clips. They're gonna do all of this. And they do all the work and I think the guest gets the majority of the benefit.

And even with AI now, it's been shown that you get more authority if you're on someone else's stages than your own. So I don't think it's an either or, it's really what your goals are. I love that. Well, you know, being a host is being the owner of the house and then being a guest is renting the house.

And so you're renting the space basically for that period of time. Not that there's money exchange, but it's a difference in perspective. But I like I like the perspective that you have on that. What would you say is the difference in a guest that is is using storytelling versus an expertise guest when someone's being interviewed.

Yeah and there's different types of experts and a friend of mine helped me understand this. He's a lawyer and a lot of times people will say, well I'm not an expert. Well the legal definition is someone that knows more by their their training, their study, their life than the average person. And so if you're working in your business, you know, eighty hours a week, you're an expert in that industry.

And so sometimes people say, well, I don't have a PhD in it. Well, not all experts have PhDs. And I think sometimes it's that expert that's walking along with you, right? That they're a peer and sometimes they're easier to relate to.

Then you've got the expert that may be, you know, the the Sherpa that's done it so many times. Right? So they can do that. But then you've got the the expert that's the PhD and often they don't do nearly as well on podcast interviews because they don't have the stories.

They may have the facts and the figures, but the problem is is that 70% of podcasts are listened to sped up. Right? No one's gonna remember that I just threw out a stat there. Right?

That will be forgotten, but the stories are the things that people remember and apply to them. So that's always a big thing of telling stories that are memorable and meaningful to the audience. So I want to ask you what your opinion is on someone who has not done, you know, just because of the audience that we have. So on the Beyond Business podcast, you have a tendency to have people who are anywhere from a startup up to maybe a 200, you know, employee kind of company.

And in that case, what would be your advice to them if they're like, I've never guessed it. I've not you know, why would I even do this? How, you know, how do I even start? Like, how do they get over that initial feeling of, you know, being able to get their message out there?

Yeah. I have to look in the mirror on this, and my role is CEO, and that stands for chief evangelist officer. Right? I know what CEO or chief executive officer is, and I've got a couple friends that are CEOs of publicly traded companies.

The job that you and I do is not the same as them. Right? We're not dealing with investors and the SEC and regulations. I look at it as my job is to evangelize for our category, for our company, and for our clients.

And so part of that is going out there and evangelizing, being the face of the company. And I'm not comfortable with that, right? I don't want to be an influencer. I don't want to be a celebrity.

But someone has to lead. Someone has to be the voice of that. And I said early on, I don't like the sound of my voice. Well, that's fine.

Other people do, and you don't have to listen to yourself. Or I don't like the way that I look on camera. Nobody does, right? But you still have to go out there and evangelize and I think one of the things that we did was a few years ago, we did a survey of our clients.

And you know, Katherine, what was interesting was that the majority of them were introverts. These were people that didn't want to go out with the fame. They didn't want to talk from a stage, but introverts are great guests because they're great at having one on one conversations. Right?

This is the same conversation you and I'd be having if we were on Zoom or if we're having a cup of coffee. Right? Anything like that. And introverts love real conversations.

They love one on one. They love talking about things that they're passionate about. And I always say, what are things that everybody is passionate about? You know, their kids, Right?

The kids and their family. And if you're a business owner, well, your business probably counts as as one of your kids there too. So when you go out and talk on a podcast or talk on a panel or talk on a stage, you know, nobody's gonna ask you your opinion on global affairs or macroeconomics. They don't care about that.

They just care about what you're there in your expertise, and, you know, you've got stuff to share that share with them. And so it's one of those things where I think as leaders, need to lead and we need to communicate. That is awesome. What would you say that hosts can do more of to create powerful conversations and not just interviews?

I'd say what you're doing here from the standpoint of listening, asking up follow-up questions, and having a point to it. Right? I would say before you get into any conversation, you should think, you know, why am I talking to this person? What do I want them to think afterwards?

What do I want them to feel? What do I want them to do? Start a conversation with a purpose. Right?

And just don't rant. And that's I I love at the very beginning, you set the intention with me, with the audience of this is what we're here for. The Beyond Business Podcast, this is what we believe. This is what we do.

And I think that draws people and it also very, makes it very clear of why we're having this conversation, and having it meaningful. And it's just not, like I said before, just somebody coming up and I just want to tell my story. Tell your dog. Your dog will listen.

That's so good. Well, how would how do you feel that guests and hosts could both collaborate better to so that they're able to resonate with both audiences? That is a great question, and I think it's it's gotta be a win for everyone. Right?

A win for the host, a win for the audience, a win for the guest. So always look at that. And there's that whole thing. I can't remember.

I think it was in a marriage book that I read at one time. And it's like, if both people do fifty fifty, your chances of hitting a 100 are slim. Right? Because there's gonna be Ziglar.

Is that Ziglar? Ziglar. Zig has been not with us for a decade, but he still impacts us. So I look at it as both come in and do a 100%.

So bring the energy. Yes. You know, if if somebody is having an off day, try to help them along with that and especially after the interview. Too many times people will start to think about I'm a podcast guest or I'm a podcast host.

Mhmm. Drop the word podcast, and let's go back to what it means to be a host and what it means to be a guest. Right? And I'm gonna just talk about it from the guest side.

If somebody invites you, respond promptly. Right? It's rude not to to respond to the invitation. Then acknowledge it and confirm with them that you're excited for it.

Right? We talked earlier this week, and I mentioned, hey. I'm excited for the interview. Right?

If somebody invited you to their home, and, you know, all of a sudden, it's Friday night at 7PM and they haven't heard from you, they're starting to think, are they gonna be here or not? And that puts stress on on it. And even if they show up, there's, there's some stress there. So another thing, we always teach our clients.

There's three ways to show up early, on time, and rude. So that same thing. Right? Life gets in the way, but, typically, don't show up more than ten minutes early because they could have another interview going on, and you don't wanna disrupt that.

But be there at least five minutes early because they're starting to worry, oh, are they are they coming? Are they gonna be here? No. Show up early and, to show up late or even on time, that's rude because it puts a lot of pressure.

So that's to be a guest. Then think about it after you're a guest, right? After you're a guest on a podcast, after you're a guest at someone's home, what do you do? You send a thank you.

Now that could be that could be a gift. That could be a note. That could be an email. With podcasting, one of the best things that you can do is share the content.

Right? So when this comes out, I'm gonna share with my audience. Right? I'm gonna promote it because once again, it's this shared content that we've built together here.

And so that's important because if you don't do that, you can get a very, very bad reputation as a guest. It becomes transactional. It feels like you just tried using the audience. Right?

It it feels nasty. And when you go to that next podcaster and say, oh, I would love to be on your show. They're gonna look back and say, well, what other shows have you been on? And if you didn't promote them, why would you promote my show?

So go back to everything that our mothers taught us about being polite, what it means to be a guest, and and just think about that. And then from the host standpoint, I guess it's flipping it and just thinking, what can I do to make this guest feel comfortable in my home, right? And you did that here of sending the things beforehand. We talked a little bit beforehand about how things would go, so it wasn't just I walk in and the camera's going.

I think try to be more human than transactional. Thank you for sharing that. You know, one thing that, you know, you want to keep in mind is that so many people who are starting podcasts, they may not like, we're on our third season now, and they are going through a learning curve. And they may not know all the things, you know, that are the appropriate things to do.

I know that it it has been a learning curve also, you know, for myself and my team. And but I I just value when someone takes their time to be on the show and on Beyond Business podcast and to be able to share their knowledge and give our guests some tips. And what would you say are two to three tips that you would like our audience to be able to walk away with? So the first one I talked about that this is not a numbers game.

Right? More is not better. Better is better. And today, there's this idea that, well and there's a a company out there that they're the punchline for the joke for most podcast hosts, and they'll say, oh, you can pitch a thousand podcasts in the time it'd take you to pitch one.

Well, you know what? Just because it's more efficient doesn't mean it's more effective. Right? So find a a few podcasts that you think you could bring value to.

Right? If you want to do this and listen to them, give them a rating review, then reach out to the the podcaster and ask about being a guest. Right? Talk about what you can offer them.

And people say, well, that's not really efficient. No. But it's very, very effective. So that's the first thing.

Just worry about getting on one or two podcasts. Then the second thing is do a good job on the podcast. Right? Podcast host, no podcast host.

And at the end of it, if you had a good time, if you'd like to do more, after they stop the recording, ask the host. You know? Are there any guests that you would like to meet? Or I really like doing podcast interviews.

Are there any other podcasters that you may know of that you think I'd be a good fit? Remember that old commercial, and they told two friends and so on and so on and so on? It's that same thing. If you do a good job on a podcast, do a good job, you'll probably get two more invitations out of it.

Right? So that's number two. And then the third one is while we call this a podcast interview, I think that's a misnomer. Right?

And our company is called Interview Valet, and I just told you it's not an interview. It's a discussion, right? An interview is when you're interviewing me to be the busboy and you've got five or six questions to ask me, right? That's a job interview.

This is a discussion and I think people want to listen in on discussions. So just think about it that way, that one to one of do a good job, have a discussion and good things will happen in your business. Thank you for sharing that. What would you say business owners may not know that they don't know?

Something that they don't know that they don't know. Yeah. This one struck me early in my life and it's it's I think it'll be put on my tombstone. Everybody knows me for this.

And it's the phrase, what's ordinary to you is amazing to others. And let me explain how I came to this. So I was in the Navy, and I was on an aircraft carrier. And the first thing everybody asks you is, did you watch the aircraft take take off and land?

And it's one of these things where you can always tell somebody that's new to the ship because for the first couple of days, they climb all the way up there. It's like 14 levels to get up to Vulture's Row. That's what it's called. And after about two days, you're just like, well, this is normal.

Right? Most people would would pay anything to be up there. And after a couple of days, it's like, well, this is normal. A friend of mine is a neurosurgeon.

Right? He is actually cuts in people's brains. And to see him at a party one time, and he was talking to somebody that was an electrician and explaining to him, how do you set all this up? How do you make this automatically work work?

How come when I walk in here, the lights come on? How does that actually work? And so to him, that was amazing, right? And he just looked at it as neurosurgery.

That's just a job. So I think all people should remember that. What's ordinary to you is amazing to others. That if you if you graduated from fourth or fourth grade math, you are amazing to second grader who's trying to figure that out, and we've all got something that we can help other people with.

That's a great point. Thank you. What would you say that, in three to five years podcasting will look like for you know, where's it heading in the next three to five years for business owners? I always say I'm amazed they still call it podcasting.

I thought the name would have changed years ago, right? Podcasting comes from an iPod, a broadcast on an iPod And most of the audience now is going, what's an iPod? Just Google it. You'll find out.

So I think this idea of podcasting, it's really more on demand media. Right? So right now, somebody is listening to a clip of this. Is that a podcast?

I don't know as long as they get the information. Somebody else is listening to it on SiriusXM. Is that a podcast? I don't know.

It's really that on demand media. But I think as we get more and more AI, we're gonna go there to find the old answers because that knows all of history. We're gonna start going to podcasts to start thinking about what's the future look like, and that's what I'm excited for with podcasts. That's great.

I love that perspective on that. I wasn't expecting that. That's awesome. If if someone was building a brand legacy, Why should they podcast why should they be podcasting and have that to be part of their long term strategy?

Oh, think capturing your voice and your stories digitally is amazing. Right? What I wouldn't give today to hear my dad talk or ask him a question. Right?

He's been gone for twenty five years. But the technology now exists where you can make an AI clone of yourself, but you need the content to do that. And so I think so many people now have all of this content out there, and the thought leaders can put it into systems where they can almost be immortal, where people can talk with them. I've built one, and while I'm not immortal, my team likes it a whole lot more because they say when they talk to my clone, the answers are sharper with less ums and tangent stories.

And the other thing is that we've started to put it up there. You know, if somebody wants to talk with me, I'm always willing to open up my calendar and have a conversation with them. But most of the time, they just have a quick question and to be able to go there ask that quick question is just amazing. A mentor of mine, Al Ramadan, who's one of the fathers of category design, introduced me to this idea And over Thanksgiving, I went for a walk and talked with his clone and I was able to get so much information from that.

Now, still not the same as sitting down with Al and have a cup of coffee, but it's just amazing. So I think anybody that's trying to build a legacy, start capturing your content. And today that could be, you know, Zoom calls and the recordings, your webinars, the podcasts, because that data is what's going to fuel the future. You know, you share when you share that, my first thought was, well, we've had family members that have passed, and how many times do you just want to hear their voice?

And years ago, we didn't have this as an option. But today, with all of this building of the content and recordings and whatnot, it's just so beautiful that you actually get to hear the voice of whether it be a parent, it be a sibling, someone that you no longer have the ability to have a conversation with. And that's what came to mind when you said that, is we're building not only a legacy in business and in in branding and everything that we're doing, but also for our families.

And when you start thinking about legacy, right, and it's I love how you're going on this business because there's transactions, right? Making a buck is not that tough, right? Just sell fentanyl, you can make money from it, right? I wouldn't suggest that it does a lot of harm in the world.

All the rest of that is like losing weight. Losing weight's not hard. Cut off a limb, you'll lose weight right away, but that's not the goal of it, right? And the same way with business, it's not just about making a buck.

It's making an impact and making that legacy. And as we think about legacy, audio is so powerful because somebody's going to be watching this video twenty years from now, and they're going to be making fun of my hairdo or whatever. Right? It's like we talked about Zig Ziglar.

If you watched one of his videos, it would probably be laughable. Right? The big pork chop butt or, sideburns or the size of his lapels. But when you listen to his his message, it could have been recorded thirty years ago, but that voice and the message is timeless.

And so that's why I think audio will withstand the test of time. I agree. It's so interesting because I've been hearing, you know, so I get still get all the emails from them. And I I had the opportunity to be able to go to Success at Sea with him and with the Redhead and their entire team.

And it was just so beautiful. So now when I hear his voice, it takes me back to that those years that I did all of that training and all of those lessons and I learned so much and it was so impactful and I feel like so many of those who have come before us have impacted our lives in so many ways but now we are the next generation taking all of this information and paying it forward and doing that for the next generations to come. So I'm you know, just I just needed to say that because I feel like that was that was just inspired me what you just said about all of that.

And think about it. That was that was thirty years ago or maybe thirty years ago when he was recording some of that stuff and how difficult that was. He had to go to a studio, it was so expensive. Then he had to put it on the little cassettes for me, right?

Yes. So that I could listen to it. And today, you know, there's a lot of problems in the world, but there's no better time to be alive. We can have this conversation.

People can listen to it for free, you know, and so there's no excuse not to really share what you've learned. So tell me, what does success beyond business mean to you? To me, it's the impact. Right?

The stories that people will tell. And, you know, I I tell stories about the first boss that I ever had, right, when I was in high school. He impacted my life so much, and I've had the chance to go back and talk to him about that and thank him. And to me, that's the things that are meaningful over just what did you, what award did you get today or what did you make, right?

To me, it's that legacy and that impact. And as long as I'm moving towards that, I'm successful every day. Doesn't mean there's not a lot of ups and downs every day, heck, every hour, but as long as you're moving and making progress, that's success. And so if you wanted to leave our audience with anything at all, what would that be?

Well, I don't wanna just have a conversation and then say, good luck. Right? I wanna give some resources here. So Mhmm.

If you go back to interview valet with av. Right? Com/bbp. So beyond business podcast.

Everything that Catherine and I talk about will be there. I'll put a link to my clone. So if you wanna talk with me night or day, ask me any questions, but that'll be there. I wrote a book.

You can buy it on Amazon, but I'm happy to give you a copy, free. That's right there. It's called podcast guest profits, how to grow your business with the targeted interview strategy. And then if you'd like to grab time on my calendar and talk and say, how could I use this in my business just the same way you are to talk to our ideal clients and the AI that refers them?

All of that will be back at interviewvalet.com/bbp. You know, Tom, this was just such an amazing conversation, and I just appreciate the value that you've added to our audience and just all everything that you've been able to offer us. So again, I would love for our audience to please be able to reach out to Tom because if you really enjoyed all that you heard today and you feel like it's a value to you, then, you know, go ahead and reach out to him.

Get on his calendar. So I wanna thank you. This was just I I really enjoyed it. I really enjoyed just our conversation together, and and I I appreciate all that you've shared with us here today, Tom.

Thank you, Catherine. So, again, this is Catherine, your host of the Beyond Business Podcast. We had Tom Schwab today. And if you'd like to reach him at valet interview dot com.

What's that? Valet dot com. Did it backwards. Interview valet dot com.

I apologize. Please go ahead and reach out to him. And thank you again. This is our first podcast in 2026.

Super excited that you were here to share this time with us and looking forward to our next one. So thank you. Have a great day.