Selling Without the Aesthetic: Marketing in ‘Unsexy’ Industries With Rhianna Clavering

Speaker A: Hi and welcome to the Social Commuter podcast, the Marketing Podcast, keeping you up to date on the go with your

Speaker B: hosts Georgia Smith and Eloise Fenwick. We have an absolute goldmine of an episode for you today.

Speaker A: We're speaking to Rhianna Clavering from Pestfix about everything, social media, networking, she even speaks about mentors, the power of LinkedIn. Honestly, you cannot miss this.

Speaker B: Let's go speak to her. So now we are with Rhianna to have a very exciting episode talking about all things building a community, marketing, her journey, more importantly, how you can get into the world of marketing. So would you like to start by telling us a little bit about you, where you work now and um, what you've gotten up to?

Speaker C: Hi guys. I'm RHIANNA and I'm 22, soon to be 23. And I currently lead the marketing for a, uh, pest control supplier. Not as glamorous as I thought I'd be, uh, going into with my career, but I've got to say it's. I've been working there for seven months and it's absolutely brilliant. A little bit about my journey. So I actually started as a degree apprentice when I was 18 doing a digital marketing degree at Chichester Uni. Normally digital marketing degrees are three years but because it's one day a week at uni it was four years. Um, and so I graduated in July of this year. I was doing it for a music distribution, um, company. So basically if you are on, you know, we had artists all over the world, um, you know, and they're on YouTube and they want to release their music onto Spotify, Apple Music, Deezer, so your typical digital streaming platforms, we've released it for them. So that was a little bit about sort of my prior aspect into marketing. But alongside that we had the opportunity to do off the job hours and so I coordinated work experience placements with companies like Goodwood working in their digital departments. Um, for like the rival. I did H Power, which is an equestrian events agency. So we did the Raw Windsor Horse Show, London International Horse show, the uh, Platinum Jubilee celebration for the Queen. I did some production running with a company called Tilted Hue. So I did a Mattel M Barbie X very photo shoot and then I also coordinated my. This is just like I'm reading off my cv, but it's like I did some work freelance marketing for a recruitment company. So really my journey has been quite varied and I've had quite a lot of hands on experience throughout it. So yeah, that's me in a nutshell.

Speaker A: That's Amazing. I just want to draw on the fact that you just said you did a degree apprenticeship and on your off the job hours, organized placements. That's impressive. Insane. Like, I mean, I'm doing an apprenticeship as well, so I completely get the full like off the job hours and having to log them and the amount of hours you got to do. Um, and the thought of actually organizing placements in other companies as well is absolutely crazy.

Speaker B: Really, really good going. Yeah. Good on you.

Speaker A: That's insane. That's really cool. Um, I think may I start with the pastfix? So I absolutely love the work you've done with Pac Fix. It's amazing considering it's a brand that isn't necessarily 1m that you would think for social media. Obviously it's not the most exciting of all brands.

Speaker B: Technically glamorous. Yeah.

Speaker A: But the social media presence is so, so funny and just amazing. So basically we have a bit of a posh worded question for this basically, but what approaches to marketing do you take to breathe new life into an industry that isn't naturally exciting or social media friendly?

Speaker C: Right. So obviously, like I say, pest control, it's not the easiest on social media and I think that's exactly why it's fun. I always joke, I say I thought I was going to go into the luxury industry and then I start my new role and we launch a new product which is rodent sealant that is made with synthetic diamonds. So here we go. I'm still marketing luxury. You know, we've got our diamonds. Um, but it definitely forces me to think creatively. I think I focus on things like education, humor and relatable content to break down the barriers. Um, one of my biggest things that I go to for sort of to stay relevant is national holidays. Like for instance, today we posted a dressed a rat as an F1 player. A Formula 1 driver, not player, that's my bad sport, short terminology there. Um, and it made it like a little gif. And that, you know, was quite fun. Um, but I think on the flip side, one challenge that we have is we cater to two quite different audiences. You know, we've got our professionals and then we've got the amateur audience. So someone like me who's wanting to just buy a rat trap for their home, um, and I think having the contrasting interests, not every idea hits the mark. So I think the key thing here is, you know, learning, adapting, moving forward. And, you know, ultimately it's about finding those creative angles that, you know, capture people's attention and curiosity. So Like I said, we did the rat, um, the rat gif and that was kind of AI generated imagery and then I edit that and make it more cartoon style and I think that makes it more visually appealing and also resonates quite well with um, predominantly male audience. It's, you know, I always think pest control is quite typically traditional and scientific and almost a bit more sterile. So having that, because we need that to show our uh, you know, our thought leadership and that we're trustworthy but having then the fun side that relates to current sort of trends and events. Yeah, that's how I go about it.

Speaker B: We saw that post, didn't we? Yeah, we had a stalk at the LinkedIn, of course, it's quite funny and we had the F1 bits on this morning so we felt very relevant to the time with all the new races coming out, season coming out. So it was quite good. So changing just slightly. So you found obviously so many great opportunities for yourself, like we talked about before, finding those out of office, you know, different work hours, what creative ways have you made opportunities for yourself in marketing? So have you taken advantage of situations other people might not have?

Speaker C: I think quite early on I realized that waiting for opportunities wasn't going to be enough. You know, I, I actively create them. So Goodwood weren't advertising for work experience H. Powell and you know, they weren't and so I wrot I took initiative, I wrote them the email I looked at, right, who's running that department and can m I just offer my services for free, you know, and I think so often we're told, oh, don't do this for free, don't do that. But actually that is how you're going to build your own portfolio and there's nothing wrong in it. I know I'm really fortunate that I could do that alongside my degree apprenticeship and I know it's not always as easy as that, but there are also other ways so, you know, you can connect with mentors on LinkedIn. I'm really, really grateful to have, you know, power to ask for guidance through some really high up business people. And then I've joined communities like girls in marketing and women in tech SEO and you know, expanding my network that way has allowed me to learn from people already thriving in marketing. So, you know, you've got to think outside the box. I think a big thing in the journey of, you know, getting experience is that fear of rejection. You know, hearing no is a part of the journey. It builds resilience and actually, you know, it leads to opportunities that you know, they transform my career. And I think I've gone off a bit tangent there, but if I bring it down in a nutshell, it always comes down to mindset. So we can be creative in the sense that we can maybe do like a little portfolio. And, um, I always see on TikTok, um, marketers that have done, like, they take a brand and they redo their social media and that's led to great things for them. And I think if you take that example and take my example, it's that curiosity, always asking questions and looking for those opportunities, linking it to your passion, you know, finding what genuinely excites you and then that will make it enjoyable. And, um, expect to hear those no's and keep moving forward. You know, using those mentorships, using those case studies, experience will always take you further than you think. So start small and then you can make it bigger. I think I went off on a bit of a tangent with that one. But does that make sense?

Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker B: We love a tangent as well, don't we do.

Speaker A: And I think, like, initiative is make or break in most jobs in how to progress in your career, you've got to take initiative. And it's something that, like, I find people coming to me asking for advice. I'm always saying, you've got to take initiative, you've got to make these opportunities for yourself. And it's amazing how you've done that for yourself. I just wanted to go on a bit of a whim here and ask, just, um, kind of unpack that a little bit more because it was really interesting what you were saying about, like, getting mentors through LinkedIn and having those connections that way. So how would you recommend people go about that, uh, to grow their career?

Speaker C: I think for me it's always right, what are you passionate about? So I love horses. I'm a horse rider. I unfortunately have just had to sell my horse because of work time. I just did not have time. But anyway, I think. So that led to me, well, wanting to go to H Power. You know, they ran Olympia like, well, it was Olympia at the time, but now the London International Horse show, their events that I'd been to, and I'm like, I wanna, you know, I want to work on that. I want to say I've had an impact there. And I think, you know, when I then went on LinkedIn, you can actually look at the job role, you can look at, uh, the company. And I think if I was to say, right, I'm going to go and try and organize a Work experience, placement. Now, let's just take H. Para as the example I'd go on. I'd find who works in the department, whether that be a sort of more junior position or whether that be the person that runs it. You know, both are equally as important in the company. And, um, you know, just reach out, send. Not just a random connection, send one with a note and just say, hi, I'd love to learn a bit more about what you do. So then you start building the. The sort of conversation from there. One of my mentors, Nikki Gatson B, she told me this amazing, uh, framework for building sort of the first communication. Right. It's. And I never get it in the right order, but it's name, same, fame, aim and game. So your name, you introduce yourself. Same. You know, where is your common ground? Is it that you, you know, my common ground with them would be, ah, I love going to your events. Um, but it could be that someone went to the same university as you. Someone did, went to the same school. Um, your fame. What are you known for? You don't have to have. You know, I could say that I was, you know, I was nominated for an award. I don't need to do that. You know, what makes you unique? Name, fame. Name, same, fame, aim. You know, what would. What are you wanting to sort of get out of your conversation and gain? You know, like, I think if we're talking about organizing a work experience, you can say, you know, I'd love to maybe take on a role like yours one day. And you're relating it that way. And that framework was actually for a cv, but it's also been great for writing cover letters and for building those connections on LinkedIn.

Speaker B: That's a really good template. I don't think I've heard that before either. I mean, we always hear big podcasts talking about how important it is to have those mentors and have those people to look up to. It's a really good framework to go off, though. I think it's good to remember we're gonna have to write it down.

Speaker A: I know somewhere. Yeah, a really, really knowledgeable episode, actually.

Speaker B: Taking notes, having a listen.

Speaker A: My next beautiful. My next question, um, is about communities. So what is your top advice for building invested communities of real people and local businesses around your own business? Business on social media.

Speaker C: Okay. So for me, building that genuine community comes down to authenticity and providing value. You know, like I said, I work and not really a typical. The industry that you think you're going to go into. I don't. You Know I didn't all my other experiences from events and then like recruitment and then sort of a theater like because I worked um, for a local government run theater at one point as well. And all of them, whilst they're different industries, they all have the same thing. You don't treat your audiences as numbers, you have to interact with them. You know, we're supporting local businesses by collaborating or cross promoting and we're showing the real faces of the people behind our brand and I think that really builds the community. I mean I caused a bit of a stir on social media the other day because I posted a company photo and not a photo from a company of using our bird netting and I had a comment say I hope you are going to promote other companies. Well I went back and said I always like send me a photos because I'm always asking on social media for those photos and it was like, you know, you're always going to get different things but that's actually part of building the community. Having that sort of, well, you know, that sassiness from a cup from someone in your audience. Well, you know, let's bring some sass back, let's have a conversation. Um, I think for me one thing I've always said is, you know, you can't promise virality. Uh, it's ridiculous. Socials are so, you know, unpredictable. They're so volatile. You know, I could be a celebrity and get no engagement yet. I could post a video of me, you know, nobody walking down the street and it could get thousands if not millions of views. But that consistency and that purposeful engagement. So having that comment saying, you know, that bit of sass, you know, it matters more than those followers and you know, I can then respond personally to comments and messages. I can share that user generated content and you know, champion that local business. And I think, yeah, oh, one thing about community, I think for Pest Fix, it's a, not a glamorous group but Facebook groups, um, you know, rap busters, it's been pivotal in driving online sales. We've got these traps called black cats. Um and they're quite a good trap and Pest Fix are a great price especially with their trade prices is and posting them and just engaging to comments of people looking, you know, posting stories with their black cats and liking them and they were comparing the sizes of the rats that they've caught. This, I can't believe I get interested in this now. But you know, all of those things I then actually helped basically sell out all of our black cats and then we had to wait ages to get them in stock. And they said, right, no more commenting. And the Rat Busters group, because, you know, we have nothing to. We have no more black cats to sell. And it's like, you know, people love it when you take an interest in what they're doing, doing. And I think, yeah, so that's how I would build all, like, the community side of things.

Speaker A: I love that. That's so authentic. Like, I. To build on this. I went to Mad Fest the other day. I don't know if you've heard of it, but that big marketing and ads festival. Yeah, it's fantastic. And I watched a talk with Aldi and so art. So I work for McCann. So McCann did a talk with Aldi and they were talking about, um, like, building authentic communities. And basically just what you said with that sassiness, and they called it sibling relationship, where it's not always, like, you don't have to be completely nice with each other. Like, you kind of say it how it is or like you give back that sass and it actually, you would. Like. Some people would have thought that would damage the relationship, but actually, most of the time it just brings it, uh, like, a lot more stronger, makes it much more interesting for everyone. And so I think that's really resonated, actually.

Speaker B: Yeah, uh, it's exactly what you just said. I love the fact that they're comparing rat sizes. I could not do your job in the slightest. I'm petrified of rats. It's like one of my biggest fears. But you seem to be smashing it with a new rat love, which is just great. Yeah.

Speaker A: And I also think there's so much value.

Speaker C: Sorry. I can now actually buy rodenticide. So not rat love. But I joined Petfix and we have this training academy and, um, they, you know, they encourage all their staff to do all of the training academy and get knowledge. And, you know, I found myself going back into, like, school mode and wanting to get the best grades. I was a bit of a geek and I had to get the best grades. So I'm there really note taking to try and, you know, get the highest grade in the class against all these pest controllers to buy to, you know, to know about rats and the safe use of rodenticide. Like, what is going on?

Speaker A: That is so funny.

Speaker B: I think that's so funny.

Speaker A: I do think it's the power of a good marketer, though, to be really invested in your brand. Like, I think we've all found that, like, when we're marketing for a brand you become their biggest advocate, like, everywhere

Speaker B: you learn about it. And I love the fact that you've learned about Bratz. I mean, I probably couldn't do the same level as you, but if it's something you find interesting, absolutely, go for it.

Speaker A: Yeah. I think there's so much power as well in, like, getting so nitty gritty into those groups and those communities, like,

Speaker B: as a brand, understanding them, understanding the people you're challenging.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker A: Showing up as one of them.

Speaker B: Um, yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So much fun joining the group.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Group chat in the middle. I think it's fabulous. So I will hit you with one of my questions before. I don't think we have many left, though, but it's been a very, very insightful episode so far, so I'm absolutely excited for this one. So let's go for. What advice would you give someone who feels stuck because of the lack of formal marketing experience? So obviously you've spoken a lot about an apprenticeship. I got into it through, like, freelancing. You got into it for freelancing, then an apprenticeship. Uh, so we've got, you know, all come from very different angles of it. None of us technically have gone through the authentic route that, you know, the stereotypical degree you do at a level you do your degree, you go into, like a normal graduate scheme. Yeah, exactly. So how would you give someone that's feeling a bit stuck or worried that they've not gone that normal route advice?

Speaker C: I think the way you've worded that question as well, the fact that it's the normal route. You know, I was in, um. I've been speaking in schools quite a bit recently as a little sort of passion project and speaking. So I spoke to year nine business girls, but then I'd spoken to sixth form students as well. And we're so often taught the black and white route of you have to go to university and then actually when you come out of university, you don't have experience. I, you know, I may have done one year longer for a degree, but I'm technically then three years ahead of someone else that's graduated because I've got four years experience. So when I graduate, they'd have had one year. So I'm not saying that makes me better, but what I'm saying is there are so many alternate routes that the formal marketing experience does not have to exist. You know, it's not the only thing employers look for. What really matters is, you know, showing your initiative, showing your creativity and showing your willingness to learn so you can start building experiences. You Know right now with online courses, with digital internships, girls in marketing, which I mentioned earlier, uh, they do their online um, internship. I can't remember the, it's like dmi, dmip, whatever the phrase is. But you know, they do that I think every year and that's what actually made me sign on to their community because I did that internship. You've got so many online courses through LinkedIn, HubSpot, you know, Google, and they can provide you that sort of practical, real world experience that maybe you can't go out and get. Like I said earlier, uh, you can actually create your own opportunities and build that portfolio by identifying maybe some brands on social media that you can sort of create a case study for. Um, you know, or you can get in contact with small businesses or local charities in your area and say, you know, I'll give you this bit of time on the weekend, it's only an hour but you've got something on your cv. And I think with that CV we're always taught that, oh my God, we be, we need big numbers and results. Well, no we don't. So my, my work experience with Goodwood, the number that I put in my CV for that one is that, I think it was like, you know, you've worked with, I can't remember the exact number, but you prepared an app for millions of people to use. You know, so you've quantified the sort of, you've quantified the impact that you've contributed to without actually sharing any results. So it's, you don't always need those tangible results. You don't always need to actually have gone out and got work experience because your online courses, you know, or your case studies, you can say, I did this for a brand that has excellent X amount of followers and extra and this is how it's improved. And for instance, with that, you know, like bulb idea here, I don't know if it would work but let's just say I did a case study of a brand and redid their social media or something like that. I could actually maybe get in contact and send it to the set, their social, um, media team now and ask, what do you think of this? Do you have any feedback? There you go. You've just a built a connection and baby, you know, you can quantify an impact there. You can say, well, the social media manager, this, this and this said this, this and this. Does that make sense? Like does that.

Speaker B: Yeah, no, I think, no, it makes total sense. I think it's so important and we always See, people do that, you know, feed, uh, glow up of sorts for other brands, even though they have no direct relationship to them. So it's good to think about, instead of just posting that, maybe get in touch with them. And it's just about those connections that you said it's so important to build those connections. And I mean, you've given us so many ways to do it. I feel like we've got a book on how to build connections now. It's absolutely fantastic.

Speaker A: It's incredible. Uh, we only have one more question left as well. It's just like, really sad. Um, and that is how did you identify the transferable skills that positioned you for success in marketing?

Speaker C: Right. I really love this question because it's like it just goes to show with all my, you know, my background, I've gone from pest control now to events and, um, music to theater, uh, to recruitment. So they're all really, really different industries. And I think early on I realized that marketing relies on building connections, combining that strategy and creativity and taking initiative. So I think I, you. And I'd read job descriptions and I'd look at, okay, so that one's got this, that one's got that. And, and where were they aligning? Um, and then I speak, you know, with the mentors, so to sort of discuss, right, this is what I'm passionate about, this is what I can do, and these are what these job descriptions are asking for. Where do we link there? And I think the key thing is, is having that self awareness, you know, reflect on those experiences, recognize what you're good at. Ah. And then I know we don't always like to, you know, you know, especially women as well, but confidently explain how those abilities, you know, apply. So for marketing and, you know, what other projects can you bring in, whether that be in high school that you can, or, you know, what other hobbies or personal interests can you bring in? And pretty much anything can transfer, but you just need the confidence to clearly communicate them. And I think that that's, you know, that's what positioned me for success. I'm not, you know, I'm, I'm not going to say I'm naturally confident. Um, I also, a year ago today would not have thought I'd be sat here doing a podcast. I can talk for England. But as soon as you start to put pressure on something or anything like that, you know, I, I, I just, I would not have thought I'd be doing it. So, you know, project that confidence on yourself and then you'll be able to really identify where those connections in your knowledge can sort of show your transferability.

Speaker B: Fab.

Speaker A: That is fantastic. I feel like I've had a whole like motivation class.

Speaker B: Yeah, we should be working till midnight. I sort of accepted that's how my night's gonna go now. But uh, honestly I think this has

Speaker A: been gold dust in ah, networking, making these connections because I do think that is the way forward 100. It's all about who you know.

Speaker B: Community is the future of marketing. I feel like we've been saying that for God all year years now, which is crazy. But it's time for, I like to say my favorite part of having a gas on is the little quiz. So I will get out the timer. For anyone that hasn't seen this part before, we will go and ask the name. I think we give 30 seconds. Any trends, updates, anything you can think of that you've seen in the past few weeks, I will not judge you. If it was over a few weeks ago, just recent to an extent would be fab. So if it's an audio that you've seen going well or any trend, literally anything you can think of, just give it a go.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: I believe in you. How are you feeling?

Speaker C: I'm not good at this. My mind goes blank. But.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker C: I reckon I can do three, which, you know, 10 seconds of one, that's like, that's a good ratio for me.

Speaker B: Okay, give it a go. All right, I will go too.

Speaker A: In depth.

Speaker B: Just reel them off, reel them off. You don't even have to try and describe them. You'll be fine. Self motivation. All right, let's go in three, two, one and um, go.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker C: The Sabrina Carpenter tour. You know, they were all sort of arguing about whether influencers work and not, um. Oh gosh, see mine blank and I already had three. Um, you've got. Oh, I saw something on LinkedIn about perspective in marketing. So it was like up close and far, far away. Uh, uh, uh, I said three. I want to do three. Um, then minimalist content, so brands, you know, and influencers doing less on social media than normal. That's probably my 30 seconds, isn't it?

Speaker B: Okay, that was exactly 30 seconds, to be honest. So you did do three seconds. And you did, you planned it very well. But that was fab. I think we've. Everyone gives a mix. I like the detail that people are going into now with that. I know it does our job for us. It's great.

Speaker C: Like we need to give some context. I can't just say like a random thing. Otherwise I Could, you know, just be making it up. But then maybe that's the way to win it.

Speaker B: Maybe that is the secret.

Speaker A: Well, the thing is we. We obviously, in our podcast, we update on these every week, so we kind of. We know, like, pretty much everything that's

Speaker B: happened, so we won't. We'll let you off if any of them are. Yeah. But thank you so much for coming on the podcast. We honestly have learned so much today. Haven't we had the best time speaking to you? Yeah. So much for people that want to get into the world of marketing or people that just getting a bit stuck and want their next steps, want a bit of mentorship. You've been very, very helpful. So thank you for coming on.

Speaker C: I've really, really enjoyed it. This is actually. So this is my first time speaking on a podcast. Like I say. I've done a couple of recent speaking in schools and six forms, and then I also hosted, um, a networking webinar for girls in marketing with junior marketers, and that's all happened in the last two months. Before that, I've not done anything like this. So thank you guys for being so lovely and sort of talking me through it and things like that. It's been great.

Speaker B: It's been amazing. You gotta get all the podcast bookings now, but thank you.

Speaker A: Thank you.

Speaker B: What an amazing episode. She knows what she's talking about, doesn't she?

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: We haven't really dived into the whole mentoring world yet, so it was so interesting to talk about that and really get to know more about that.

Speaker A: Yeah, I feel really inspired, actually. I'm literally gonna go on LinkedIn right after this.

Speaker B: I'll be messaging you. Watch out on LinkedIn, guys. Eloise Fernwick's on her way to start harassing you all on there. I think it's great, but honestly, it was a fab episode and we have some great guests lined up, don't we? The amount of interest we've had has been amazing about guests.

Speaker A: Yes. I'm m excited for that. If you would like to be a guest, fill in our form. Linked in our Instagram caption. Um, it's always a fun time over there. Um, yeah, we are booked up for the rest of the year, I think,

Speaker B: which is the craziest thing. We never expected to say that, but, uh, what more do we want?

Speaker A: Everybody who's applied so far, and we can't wait to see who does. On that note, if you have really enjoyed our episode and you want to keep watching in the future, please subscribe because we really, really appreciate it.

Speaker B: We appreciate it. We celebrate when we get a new subscriber, we go, oh, look what's happened, like.

Speaker A: And subscribe.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: And follow if you're watching on Spotify, actually. And also you can follow us on Instagram, TikTok, LinkedIn, uh, ocialcommuterpodcast.

Speaker B: You've got them all fab. But thank you all for watching and we will see you next week by.