Mastering LinkedIn for Business Growth_mixdown

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Because your agency deserves better. Join us as Kirt Schmidt welcomes LinkedIn strategist Nicole Osborne to share how to break through fear, show up authentically, and unlock business growth on LinkedIn. Don't miss these actionable tips to boost your authority and connections. Hello everyone, and welcome to Schmidlst.

I'm your host, Kirt Schmid. I am excited you're going to meet my new friend Nicole today. Nicole, how are you. Oh, I'm excited to be here.

I've been planning this for a while, so I'm really pleased today. This Today, Today is the day. So Nicole, tell my audience a little bit about what you do and who do you like to work with. So I'm Nicole, the founder of wunder Stars.

I'm originally from Germany, but I'm based in the UK in Kent and made so my idea clients are either really fought for agency owners or tech founders who usually do amazing work for their clients, whether it's digital transformation or SaaS products, but they find it really difficult actually to show up on LinkedIn in an authentic way, do you know, Not the kind of AI hype and one hundred times growth, but actually really authentic with their human voices. So I work with them on a done with you strategy program.

I call this the LinkedIn Activator Playbook. As well as coaching. It is so important for founders to get involved in this because there is certainly something you can't just easily outsource. So this is what I do.

Yeah, and I've been doing it now since twenty nineteen. Obviously I'm still a spring chicken cord, right. That's right, yes, exactly. You know, let's talk.

I want to jump right into the elephant in the room when it comes to LinkedIn. It's very polarizing. Some people really enjoy it and other people loathe it. And the word that I hear is cringe.

And now a lot of that usually comes from younger folks, right, but I also hear it from all all walks of life. You know, why is LinkedIn? So polarizing, do you know, I get it, I love it or hate it. Frankly, I see it as a business tool now if you can make it work for your business and you get the returns which makes your time spent on it worfit and you can find some enjoyment when excellent.

So I really think it depends on what you want to do, who you want to attract. I personally, I like about LinkedIn that I don't feel that I'm interrupting people's day because they're there to learn something new, make new connections, talk about business, talk about their struggles by challenges for hopes. So I really like that about it. Now, well, I don't like so much any longer.

You know, it used to be a platform where you could just really achieve a lot with organic marketing. One of the reasons about really felt thrown too. It's very efficient and you could do a lot about actually paying for paid media. Now this is changing, you know, as for all platforms, and we have to work through it and latest algorithm bits and that.

But frank if you're not doing this to please an algorithm, this is about getting in front of the right people, people who people would love to work for their companies, and I think of that, Linkedlin is still the most powerful platform al But when it comes to social media networking. And so you work with a lot of leaders in this space, what is their challenge? I mean the ones that I've talked to obviously, just you know number one, they're like, I think I should do it, but I just don't know what to do.

But there's also again I think there's a bit of they don't want to be that guy. I hear that some version of that phrase a lot nicole. They don't want to be they don't want to be that person and talk to me about like how, how what's the mindset that you try to help these folks with when it comes to LinkedIn, because I think it works for anybody, people finding a job, people trying to grow their business. What sort of mindset should I have with LinkedIn?

Yeah? I mean he's so right. We hear this all the time, right, LinkedIn is not Facebook. If I put myself out there, what will my peers think?

Another LinkedIn Berlin wallafia. I hear a lot is I have nothing interesting to say, or maybe I'm not expert enough, so people end up sounding really stiff or bit post nothing at all, and could you know it's a little bit like you and I when we first connected. Of course we found it really interesting what we each had to say, but we connected as human beings spares. So the mindset shift is seeing it as a platform where you meet people and you have individual conversations.

You need to listen, you need to know who you want to talk to, and also be realistic. It isn't the sort of thing where you have overnight success. Of of course, this is what a lot of people want us to believe, but truly, no one rais out there and sits on LinkedIn and says today I want to buy something. Founders need to build trust.

It takes time. They have to be really targeted with their efforts. So, yes, have realistic expectations and just trust yourself as a human being. With curiosity, you can attract the right kind of people.

Just be focused, and just know everyone has posed LinkedIn burling walls of fear, and it's your opportunity to actually push through it. You know, one post, one story saying and just one braver decision at the time, we can do it and could I'm sure you agree. Whenever we do something good for our business, it happens in the zone of fear, it doesn't let this is where growth happens. So people want to use LinkedIn, Well, it's time to step into that and really push those boundaries.

Yeah. The the advice I give people is that you have a reputation and it's up to you to let other people control that story and narrative or are you going to at least contribute to it. And I think that's where I like LinkedIn, and people already do this. I know people who post to Instagram all the time, but then they think LinkedIn is like someplace taboo, and I think again, it goes back to like you said, like, what are my peers going to think?

What are people I used to work with think? And you know, people I'm connected to, and the first thing I tell them is nobody cares. Nobody cares. Why did Why did?

Why did nobody? Why does nobody care? Well, because you haven't given them a reason to care. Yeah, you haven't.

Even you haven't. You know, you're saying no for other people. That's what my mom used to always teach me. Don't say no for other people.

And that was a very powerful lesson when I learned. When I started going out and starting to look for jobs and look for clients and different things. As I was building my business. Is that, you know, I had grown up waiting for people to pick me right to to you know, I subment my resume, I fill out a A an NDA, and I fill out I respond to an RFP, and I'm waiting to get picked.

And I figured like that's sort of how business and life just goes. And then when I got a little older, I realized like, oh, I could just pick myself. And once I did that, everything changed. And then I became a lot more confident on LinkedIn and other platforms because I had just decided to pick myself.

And I think that was the most powerful transformation for me. That was really, really really fascinating that inside, because often what holds people back with LinkedIn is actually some really outdated beliefs, which I'm not serving them any longer, do you know, I think You and I and Refreshment we started talking about jogging and how I said I was so proud that three times a week I go jogging, and frankly, I don't see myself as a natural runner because I hated it as school. We didn't have a right, sports brass and Eastern Germany where I was shouting at us Curtly years later, I'm now starting to go maybe okay, forty years later, I'm now starting to go jogging because I decided this is belief, it's outdated, it's not serving me.

Let's get a really good sports bra. Let's have some motivation and Frankie, I meant jogging with my son and I wanted to show him his mother could do it. He gave up when I carried on. So find out why it's worth actually voting for yourself, advocating for yourself, and how you can push for that pain barrier.

I love that story. Could mothers are the best rite? Let's just say this. That's great.

You know, first of all, i do have to make a comment about sports brace. I'm being from Germany. I would figure with German famous German engineering, there would be there would be the best sports bras available out there. That's not a former Eastern Germany.

Sorry, I have to make that distinction. You know, when we all came down in nineteen eighty nine, I was thirteen, and brass and former Eastern Germany were really bad unless you were one of these athletes. Which very really pushed to compete. Okay, that context is helpful.

Okay, anyways, I digress, But you know there is a lesson there because I think getting out of your comfort zone is something that's scary for anybody, right, and I totally understand that it takes time to learn to get comfortable with being uncomfortable. The way I described it to a recent CEO I was doing some coaching with at an agency was I had to get to the point where I was bored being nervous. So I had to do it so many times that I just got that being nervous about it was just kind of boring, and I just got on with it.

And that's I don't know if that's just a natural skill or it's something you got to teach yourself. And I'm guessing that you probably have some frameworks and things that you work people through that helps them get through that. Right Yet, do you know I found out really early on that it's not so much LinkedIn know how, And of course it's really important to know what will it is, algorithm is, and you know how you can optimize things, but it isn't actually a lack of knowledge.

It really is that fear and their motivation. So yes, I do have frameworks, and one of my favorite tools really is vm code, which tells people what their motivational makeup is, So what sort of activities do they feel drawn to or what other things they really like to avoid? And I do was really early on in the journey of working with people. Actually it's part of the onboarding because when you tackle something people are not comfortable with, it really helps to figure out, you know, how do they normally get done things done, what really really motivates them?

So sometimes maybe I would set challenges slightly differently and I would explain to people why maybe being unique or evoking recognition with not their favorite things, not the things they get out of bed on a Monday morning. And yeah, in terms of frameworks, I think it's really important on LinkedIn to go beyond just sharing forought leadership, because yes, thought leadership is really important, but without relatable context, without showing people what your values are, your beliefs, your unique expertise, easy to ignore thought leadership.

Right. So my latest fine work, and I've been working on this for a while, is actually how people can become that relatable expert, but expert with shows I have sound judgments. I get you. I know the problems you're talking about, and I'm talking about the things you care about versus the things I care When i'd say you, I mean, you know your ideal bias.

Because we really want to show that we can walk and we're shoes. So yeah, really important to work all these things step by step, and yeah, pushing people out of their comfort zone, but also letting them learn by by making some mistakes, by having some early successes. So yeah, I'm really enjoyed doing that with my client's absolutely, and I'm sure could that's exactly what you did with that CEO. You helped them feel less nervous.

Well, I mean, and you know, I try to try to teach from experience, and you know, I don't go as in depth as you do, and I don't work with people as long and for you know, but I try. I try to get the ideas across that that it is more of a mental blocker than it is a technical skill, because you can't learn a technical skill until you get over the mental blocker. So speaking of technical skills, let's talk a little bit about LinkedIn as a platform. Like you mentioned earlier, they used to be really good for organic growth, and now they've kind of turned that ratchet down.

What are some of the big changes you've seen over the last couple of years in LinkedIn and where do you see things things going and what should people be thinking about are being focused on when it comes to using LinkedIn as a platform to build authority in their space. Yes, so great question. So first of all, some of the key principles of classical marketing really haven't changed. Right, know who you are talking to, what they care about, how that links to your services, and really be very specific who your company can help the most.

Use all of that juicy insight to really optimize your profile and your company page. So really make sure that it speaks to your audience that is really clear who you for, how you help them, what impact they can expect. Because everyone always worries about posting. I do as well, but really your propriately isn't set up correctly, you know, you can really lose that click completely, So do that first.

In terms of re developments, at the moment, of course, everyone is talking about US three sixty through, which reminds me always coffee. But essentially it's the language model which LinkedIn users to classify our trustworthiness who they should put our posts in front off. So it's actually really important now to be really focused on who your niche audience is. Taking two to three core areas of our topics you're interested in, they're interested in, and consistently talk about both consistently engaged with the audience who's interested in that.

So it does feel a little bit like we're putting us for a little while in a jail. Also well arguing with because before you could be more organic with what you talk about. Now you really want to be structured to really train the algorithm who to show your content in what you are an expert in. So yes, right for the algorithm train LinkedIn, but also know there is a human at the end.

Right, So really I would say concentrate fifty to fifty. In terms of wherey platform is going, we are going to find even more additional ways of increasing premium subscribers. There's a new model coming out. I've not been given access to it yet.

Obviously we have sales Navigator and we've got our LinkedIn ard. So it's going to go to a place where really is that clever combination of boosting your most successful or gunny pos doing some thought leadership ads. Maybe if you have a free webinar boosting that. I've actually brought a paid ads team on, a paid as expert on my team, because nowadays you can't have a really effective LinkedIn strategy without considering what the options are in terms of amplifying you post them, getting more in front of your audience.

In terms of where it's going, I would like to see it going to a place where actually the platform more and more still rewards really authentic content. And it is actually the moment there that you know you can't comment with AI. It kind of really says, no, don't do that, you can't have engagement pots, which is a really really good move, and I want to see more of that because we all get sick and tired of posts which all have the same templates and it's the same stories ten years ago, our time exist and I had this strategy and the taught with that.

So I really want to see more encouragement of these human stories because let's face this, we learn, yes, partly from data, right, of course data and statistics are really important, but we want to know if someone has been in our shoes and face similar challenges and really learn from these unique insights. So our hostess. Whilst, of course AI content creation makes things more efficient, I hope the platform still remains focused on human stories and elevating them. Yeah, that's the danger with the Facebook of vacation right where people are like, well, it's becoming more Facebook.

But again I think that Facebook isn't even Facebook anymore. So it's a weird comparison, Like because what you're seeing in the people that you're actually interested in, just like you said they are, they're telling relatable they're giving relatable information, not just information, not just you know, here's how to use cloud code or some thing. Yeah, but it's like a personal story about you know, something that that are transformation. Right again, any good story that you know you can go and read like the perfect like story arc and like it's been used for thousands of years in human history.

We're still the same people. We like a good story arc. You know, we like to see, you know, where what's happening and what's the transformation and what's the result and yeah. And do you know, most people then they hear you and I talk about stories, immediately their place of fear goes into this negative inner chatter.

I can't possibly overshare, I can't possibly share anything to private And do you know Cold, I absolutely agree. Being more relatable on LinkedIn isn't about oversharing, isn't about being louder. It's actually about being really strategic about the stories you are sharing. You know, moments would show what you believe and what your values are, how you deal with complicated situations.

So those I would classify as private. If we then go to okay, so what's too personal? So two private apologies are just make so we grey's partal stories? You know, what do you think about?

What are your values? How do you deal with complicated situations? And then there are stories which are way too private, and those are the stories where they don't serve your audience, they don't serve their business. And do you know, Cord, do you mention your mum earlier?

I always think what my mom say if she saw us on social media? Right, finding my mum isn't on social media, So it really is my regard for saying what would my potential clients think? And say, It's just something I want them to see and Cold. Once you've chosen those stories, it's such a powerful marketing asset because suddenly you build up trust and people are ready for your expertise to land for them because you've got that trust with them.

And it's such an important step. But do you think about how do we become a relatable expert on LinkedIn? Yeah, and again you don't have to dive in and start posting every day and start you know, making videos and becoming an influencer and all these things. Like what I find with some of the best leaders that you know I follow and work with.

I mean, they're they're just sharing when something comes up, but it is consistent, you know, It's it's not once a month or anything. It's usually once a week at the minimum. And it's really interesting to follow their story and their journey. And I just I find it interesting because again it's it's a place I go to to learn more about what's going on and what people are up to.

And the thing I always tell people, you know, every you know, every single client that I've ever gotten from LinkedIn has never liked a post or commented on a post. Yes, they've never They've never engaged. So you know, people are like, oh, what's the stats and the numbers? I like, I don't care what my stats and numbers, impressions and all those things are.

What I care about is my conversions. And that's all I care about. Because I I on LinkedIn, I haven't had necessarily a growth problem, but it's always been a conversion challenge and a lot of people it's easy to grow, but it's hard to convert. And what I find is is that most of the clients that I or prospects that I pick up via LinkedIn, they don't engage with the content.

They're just they're looking at signals, just like we look for signals and like is somebody buying or not buying in those sorts of things. They're looking for those trust signals, like you talked about can I trust this person? Is this? If I contact this person, are they going to give me a hard sell?

You know? Can I just ask them a quick question and they're not gonna like send me fifteen emails afterwards? You know? Absolutely?

Do you know? It's so funny, isn't it. We treat measurement on LinkedIn like a little bit, But we were taught at university, right or we're going to be on the platform. They're going to see your posts and they're going to sign sign on.

But that's not the reality or a reality is someone is looking around to learn something new. They are looking for his trust signals, and the best thing you can do is that when they have a problem you constantly talk about, they already know you and they see you as someone who can help you with it. So at least you're worth of getting that call to be pitching to them. Or maybe someone in the network says, hey, oh gosh, you're looking for such as that, or you've got to speak to Court he's amazing at agency transformation.

So you really have to pick what conversations do I want to be part of. What do I want people to think that I'm not in the linked in roman be really strategic about it. But yes, I do have a model, a wunder content model. Essentially it's got four tracks and one truck and there it is very much dedicated to lead generation.

So it's posts either for example, polls or something which is really a particular problem and how I solve it and encouraging people to reach out. So I do think it is important to design a percent percentage of your post to really be a both middle stages of the end stages of convert conversion, but do know you won't get any engagement at or hardly any engagement on it. And that's absolutely fine. You know, if that one person reaches out to you in MEDMS and you get them on a call and best sign up to your program, and it's done its job.

But it's vanity metrics CODEVET can be very exciting, of course, but if they're not converting, then it's absolutely pointleous. Right, yeah, for sure, for sure. Well, and that's again my strategy has been pretty simple, is that I post things that I think people are going to find interesting, engaging, and then in the middle of that, I post things that are more direct, more call to action y, And what happens is my impressions sort of just sail over. Even though that those get less engagement, my impressions still just kind of sail over that gap and move on to the next one that's going to get more stuff.

So what I see is is that all those people that are liking, liking, liking my content, interacting with my content, lingering on my content or whatever, They're still going to see that post and then and then, but I'm not going to even though they don't engage with it, I don't lose that momentum because I move right on to another you know, more less CTA type thing. But it's important to your point that I remind people what I do because people don't remember. People don't remember, Like you mentioned your profile being the first thing you need to really focus on, because I should be able to look at your profile very quickly and understand what do you do and how do I work with you?

Yeah? Right, very quickly? And you know and it is it? Is it that I hire you as a as a as a business, Do I hire you as a person?

Do I hire you as a contractor? Like those are important things business owners want to know right away when they're looking to solve a problem because how you engage with them also will impact how they choose who can actually help them as well. Right, yeah, absolutely, And you wanted to be optimized for search by that search on the platform and also search via AI tools and court. You know, you had a great article recently about what you've learned from linked to some of the people you talk to, and one of your points you've made in this is yes, absolutely optimized for search, but know that you are selling to a person, so what talking points can you actually offer which show that he's human and that makes it comfortable for someone to reach out.

So I think you talk about biking, right, biking, I don't viking. I talk about being married to a brit and loving pretzels because from Germany. So find something you can mention which shows what kind of person you are, because. Yeah, yeah, that you're real, right, that you're not a and that you're not somebody who's actually you know, in Southeast Asia pretending to be a person in New York selling stuff.

Right, Yeah, you've got to You've got to put something real in there, and even whether that might not be optimized for the algorithm, but for the person who does find you and it actually is digging deeper. You want to have some talking points, some stories which show what you are about. So, for example, one thing I do. I set up a business when I had a toddler.

It was probably a bit mad toddlers about a year and a half and now he's eleven. So I talk about sometimes about being a working parent because most tech funders, agency founders, you know, they have kids as well, so it's something they can relate about. One of my clients, he's a tech founder and every now and when he talks about the challenges of digital parenting because his clients, you know, marketing directors will react to that. This is something we can all relate to.

So so fine. The thing you have in common with your tribe? What is it you can talk about? Which if you think about called if you and I we met at a party or networking, you in if we want to make it memorable, we will talk about something human.

Fact I agree. I'm not going to say to you use the cord, how much is your program on how quick you will exactly? Hey, wait before can you sign this NDA before we start networking? So don't be afraid of showing that site now, don't go over the top.

So it can't just be all stories. All relate to the content. You know, you really have to show your expertise as well. But be strategic about it and don't be afraid to experiment because you know called.

The thing I see most often is that people have this drive to make things perfect and then nothing is ever good enough. I don't let themselves learn what lends with their audience, and you just lose up on these opportunities to your competitors who might be more comfortable on Linkedn's you don't want that to happen. Yeah, Like again, things I learned from my parents is you know, people's opinions of you is not as fragile as you might think it is. So it's okay, You'll be fine.

Absolutely, And what's the worst thing that can happen. You can delete a post? Can I just remind people of that? Exactly?

Look, yeah, exactly, Elon Must does it all the time. You can delete, you can just say crap and just delete it, and none, You're just nobody cares, right, even though you know people will screenshot his stuff, but they're not going to screenshot your stuff, So you'll be fine. Right, and surprises you and when you do share a story of impact which catches the attention people remembered. And you know you mentioned earlier really wisely about the silent community on LinkedIn.

So people who are on LinkedIn that might react to something they're never common because you know they're that not their thing. They feel shy or nervous about a by I don't want to come across us exactly, yes, but you know, at the moment you buy interviewment to an event or pick up your newsletter, you will find out, oh my god, I've read this story, we remember this and it surprises you. But if you'll never share any stories like that, you're really missing only opportunities.

Yeah. I can't tell you how many times when I was building my agency back in the day when I was that, I'd be in my third or fourth meeting with a client and you know, we're talking about a very large project and all this stuff be third or fourth meeting, or we'd be in the workshop to start scoping the project and things, and they mentioned something about how they liked my LinkedIn stuff, and it was like, well, you've never, you've never, you know, you know, we're connected because usually, like if I got a prospect, one of the first things I do is connect with them on LinkedIn, right, so I can learn more about their background and who they are, so I can have an easier conversation with them and ask them more questions and learn more about them.

Right. And but like, yeah, they they didn't really like to post. They never commented on it, like there's nothing you know, And I was just like that is just it's just crazy to me. But I see why people get turned off of LinkedIn, because again, if there's this silent majority, right, because what's the stat now?

Is it like four percent of users actively post regularly two weeks or something? And oh actually that's I mean very different. But the latest I heard was one point eight percent. So you actually even if you just post, you know you mentioned earlier, posting once a week, that is a really good frequency.

I usually, you know, if you really after grave two to three times a week. But yeah, the majority of people don't post, so you have an opportunity to be and be talked to you by just posting once a week. Do you know cold thing that I always find that people always used to complain a lot about email about how spammy it was. Right, Yeah, we still got on and use this for our marketing.

Didn't really can because sorry able to do you know with LinkedIn if the majority of people are being very spammy and doing the selsy thing as and you know the connect with you in immediately you get a pitch which is not relevant to you and you never even ask for it. If you can demos s right, ethical selling skills, so consultative selling skills, so actually really building a relationship for us and providing value serving them before the idea of sales comes up and you stand out in a really good way.

Yeah, every challenge is also an opportunity. I feel the biggest challenge is that that people just burn't use a platform if LinkedIn doesn't find a way to manage the spun right, because we do get way too much of it. But it is an opportunity to also stand out and to connect in a general good way. Yeah for sure.

Well, Nicole, I could talk to you all day, and I'll have to have you come back on the show. But I really enjoyed our conversation. Thank you for sharing as much as you did with everybody. If I want to get in touch with you, if I want to connect with you, obviously, LinkedIn is probably a good place where should I go?

Yeah, absol the code, thank you so much for having me, and LinkedIn is the best place, so search for Nicole Osborn. My website is Wunda sales dot com. But yes, LinkedIn will be the easiest way, And anyone who with the question just wants to tackle maybe some of their fears. I'm always happy to share some advice and tips to make LinkedIn a better platform for as many people as possible.

Thank you. Yeah, awesome, Nicole. Thanks again. Yeah, if anybody has any questions, I'll have links in the description so you can find Nicole easily.

Thanks again, Nicole, I really appreciate it. Thank you very much. Thanks for listening to schmid list. If you found this episode useful, a quick review goes a long way.

To learn more about the work Kurt does helping businesses grow with more clarity and profit, visit Schmidt Consulting dot group. Have a great week.