S2, Ep 09: Ella Cookson on Leading Freedom for 2,500 Women

Speaker A: Welcome to Sales Leader Secrets. Get inside the minds of the most successful sales leaders so that you can apply their secrets to your business and inspire your team to grow their sales. I'm Amanda from uspire and I coach and train commercial leaders to support them to be the best they can be for themselves, their teams and, um, most importantly, for their customers. Because that's how you grow sales.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: So sit back, enjoy and hear some words of wisdom from some of the best in the business. So my guest today on, um, Sales Leader Secrets works in the direct selling industry. She trained as a designer and she worked as a studio manager for a company that supplied greetings cards to Marks and Spencer's. Looking for some more flexibility in her life, in 2015, she joined a company called Tropic Skincare in the UK and within four years she has built a team of over two and a half thousand people. Ella Cookson, welcome to Sales Leader Secrets.

Speaker B: Thank you so much for having me, Amanda.

Speaker A: You're very welcome. So, Ella, tell us a bit about your story. You know, what's got you to where you are now?

Speaker B: Honestly, it's actually started from a very vulnerable place. Um, I'd actually had a nervous breakdown and, um, wow. We were trying to save for our third round of ivf, um, and we needed more income. But I also needed something that was going to help me rebuild my confidence and, um, give me purpose. You know, I really needed to find myself again. So that's when I actually found Tropic.

Speaker A: Mhm.

Speaker B: And it wasn't just a business opportunity for me, actually became a lifeline for me.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: And I definitely said yes before I was fully ready, but I've kept showing up ever since and, um, the business has given me, obviously growth as a person. It's given me so much freedom and it's given me community. It really has transformed everything for me. And now I actually get to help other women and a few men rewrite their own stories too. And that feels really special.

Speaker A: That's, uh, amazing. Can you tell us a bit about Tropic Skincare and what the business does? Some of our listeners might not know much about the direct selling industry, for example.

Speaker B: Yeah, sure. So Tropic is one of the UK's fastest growing beauty brands. And what makes it really different is how it's sold. So we use a direct selling model. So rather than going into retail stores, Tropic choose to share profits with people like me, the ambassadors. So we share the products through word of mouth, social media events and one to ones direct selling. It has Actually a really long history. Uh, it was actually one of the first industries that empowered women to earn their own income before we even had the right to vote.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: If you've seen the Netflix, uh, miniseries about Madam C.J. walker, she was one of the first women to build a beauty empire this way by creating products that worked and giving local women the opportunity to earn by sharing them. Wow. And of course, many of us remember brands like Avon growing up. They were legacy brands, um, you know, legacy names that were a huge part of our, our homes and our lives and our communities when we were younger.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Uh, what I love about Tropic, uh, more than anything is that they've taken the idea and completely modernized it. So there's absolutely no risk with the business whatsoever. You're not allowed to hold any stock, there's no pressure selling whatsoever. And you don'. Make money from recruitment, which is very different from other businesses. You only earn from real product sales. So when somebody joins the business, they buy a starter kit which is 198 pound. Um, and that actually, that kit actually contains over 600 pounds worth of full size products and it comes with a 30 day money back guarantee. So if it's not for you, you can just return it and you're never out of pocket.

Speaker A: Yeah, no, I get that. Yeah. It's not like you're putting a great big risk into the business that when you're trying to build sales as well, which is always, I mean in any business that's an issue, isn't it? You know, the amount you've got to invest in order to grow. And tell us a bit, tell us a little bit about the product Tropic. I have used it myself.

Speaker B: Oh, fabulous. Um, so the products are completely natural, they're vegan. Everything's made in our beauty kitchen, in house, in our uh, um, head office in Croydon. And we have in house science specialists in there that formulate the products. It's all fresh to order. So when you, if you say, when you buy a product off the shelf from a supermarket, let's say.

Speaker A: Uh-huh.

Speaker B: It has like a little jam jar shape on it and It'll say like 18 m m, 24 m m, something like that.

Speaker A: I've always wondered what that was.

Speaker B: Okay, so I will tell you. So basically when you buy those products, those products are mass produced in a factory. They're then stored in a warehouse and then they're finally shipped to the, the shop where you eventually buy them from. But that process can take up to five, seven years before you actually Buy the product.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: So that product has got to contain preservatives to keep it nice and, and fresh. So that when you open it, that's when your 12 month, 18 month, 24 months, whatever it says on that jam jar, the 12 M M comes into play. So you know, you've got 12 months from when you've opened it and air's gone into that product for it to be used to get the, the freshness, um, and the best quality from the products. With Tropic, we actually have on the bottom of all our products we have a best before end date because all our products are made fresh to order. So it's all completely natural ingredients and there is nothing in there that's going to cause, you know, any problems, any carcinogens in your bloodstream whatsoever. You actually absorb 60 to 70% of everything that you put on your skin. So with Tropic you can rest assured that you're putting just natural goodness into your body, onto your skin. Amazing. M. And so that, that's the main difference. So you'll never be able to buy Tropic from a shop. You can only buy it from Tropic or the Ambassador family.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And we actually have over 20,000ambassadors across the UK and we've got thousands of Five Star Trust pilot reviews both for the products and, um, the Ambassador experience. Yeah, yeah, that's basically.

Speaker A: Yeah. They really are superb products. I can recommend them listeners, which is one of the reasons I was really keen to ask, uh, Ella to come onto the podcast. So we've gone from a real lifeline for you when you were at a, not a great place in your life and it's brought community, it's brought income and it's brought, it's brought success for you. So when did you sort of first become a manager of Tropic Skincare people, as it were? How does, how did that work? How, how did that work and what it was, what was that like?

Speaker B: Okay, so I actually joined Tropic in September 2015 and um, I joined because I was actually just wanting some extra, extra products, um, to use for facials for some of my clients.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: Because it was at a time when I was recovering and I was just trying to do things gradually and quite small.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And I didn't want to invest in any of like the big skincare brands.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So at first when I joined it was very much. That was why I joined. Um, it was just to, to more income, um, for, for my IVF journey that I was on, but also to introduce a Nice clean product to my beauty clients. So, um, because I just set up this little, very, very small, uh, beauty little business in my small bedroom, um, just as I was in recovery. So um, for the first, it was, it was March 2016, I actually went to an event called the Glammies that we put on, um, each year. And um, a trip came up. And this is what Tropic are amazing at, is they do fabulous incentives. So this trip came up to Finland and um, I was like, wow, this looks incredible. It's not a holiday I would book for me and my husband, but, but if I could get a trip to Finland for free, I would absolutely love to go. So I spoke to my upline, said, well, how do I get on this trip? And she was like, keep doing the sales that you're doing and get yourself to leader. So I was like, right, okay. So I set myself a challenge to bring five people into the business within the next four weeks and get myself to leader. Keep doing the sales that I was doing each month was, which was about £2,000 in the hope that I would achieve this, this trip. And I, and I did. And, and then that was when I got the, the bulk really. Um, in terms of, I loved speaking to people about the product. Um, I was very passionate about, transformed my skin. I was seeing people around me becoming more confident in their skin. And um, I thought, hang on a minute, I've got an amazing opportunity here to actually help not only change people's skin but, but, or, and give them skin confidence, but also empower women to become ambassadors within the, within the business. And um, whether they want to just run a side hustle alongside a full time job or a part time job, or whether they want to do Tropic full time, I can give them this opportunity. And um, and so that's what I became really passionate about. I wanted to not only share my love of the products, but I wanted to share this amazing opportunity to join the business and you know, have more flex, more freedom, more income, um, so that, you know, people could have a better quality of life.

Speaker A: Yeah. So you're supporting, um, you're supporting other Tropic ambassadors who run in their own businesses to grow as well.

Speaker B: Yes, that's it. So um, as your team builds, um, you can obviously m, get promoted to different levels within the business. Took, took me four years to get to the, to the very top level of the business. And so when I promoted, I had quite a large number of leaders within my leadership team. And then those leaders have their own leaders as well. Yeah, so. So you end up, as you grow, you. You just end up heading up a big team of ambassadors, but also leaders who manage, who lead the. The ambassadors.

Speaker A: So. So tell me that then. See, that is very interesting and also challenging, right? Because actually you're lead. Managing their own teams, who are managing their own teams. What's it like? How do you do it?

Speaker B: Well, it's some. It's kind of something you'd learn on the job. I mean, I've always been very much about helping and supporting my team, um, and just showing them what I do, how I do it, and, um, sharing that with them, so making sure that they know that I've got. They've got my full support at all times and just, you know, at first holding the hand a little bit and then, you know, giving them the confidence to, to lead their teams. So as much as, uh, you know, I'm not a micromanager at all, you know, I like people to have the confidence and feel empowered to want to lead, um, their own teams. So I guide, I support and then let them have the free rein to, to go off and lead their, their teams in the kindest way possible. I almost, like, give them a little flick off a cliff in the. In the kindest way possible. Because I think some. Sometimes that's probably sounds the wrong way, but I think sometimes what happens is they, they become so comfortable under your wing that they're like, oh, no, but I'm not ready. I don't know how to do it. And, uh, you've. You've got to help them believe and understand that. You know, you've. You're doing this already. You know, I'm still going to be here for you as a support, but you're just coming out of one support group and you're going into a leadership support group, which I will still lead you with, if that makes sense.

Speaker A: Yeah. So what do you absolutely love most about what you do, Ella?

Speaker B: I love that it gives. It's given me me back. I think that's the biggest thing. Um, and now I get to help other women reclaim their confidence, uh, find freedom and write a new chapter for themselves. You know, seeing someone go from feeling stuck to thriving in their own business is everything. It's a really beautiful thing to see and experience and plus the flexibility to be present. So it's given me more time with my family. I have so much opportunity to travel now, and I've built a, uh, life on my terms.

Speaker A: Amazing.

Speaker B: In all honesty, it. It really does blow my mind that this is what I get to call my job.

Speaker A: Yeah, that. How. How amazing is that? How amazing is that? Uh, there must be some challenges. What would you say your biggest challenges are as a leader in Tropic Skincare?

Speaker B: Uh, so I had a good think about this, and I would say it's mindset, okay? So especially around letting go. So as a team.

Speaker A: Right?

Speaker B: As a team grew and suddenly I no longer knew everyone in my downline personally, particularly around the COVID time, because direct selling in the days of COVID it skyrockete. So in Covid, my, My business actually, um, quadrupled in size.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: Overnight. Um, and that was, that was as much as. It was an unbelievable time. It was a very difficult time at the same time because I completely lost control. And that's the one thing I found really difficult. Actually. I found it really hard because I'd built my business so hands on and so personal and so stepping back and like, trusting others to lead and not needing to be involved in everything, that took some serious growth for me. It, yeah, it brought up a lot around, like, control and identity. Um, but I realized that real leadership isn't about knowing everyone. It's about building systems, empowering others, and trusting the ripple effect that you, as the upline, have, have created. And, and it's that shift in mindset that was a huge turning point for me.

Speaker A: I love that ripple effect because, um, and as a leader, what you throw in the pond to cause the ripple needs to be really intentional, right. And well thought through because it does, good or bad, create a ripple, doesn't it?

Speaker B: Absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

Speaker A: Yeah. That releasing the reins thing comes up a lot in the podcast actually around, um, people saying, actually there is a time at which I need to be able to release the reins and not know everything about everybody, everywhere. Um, so, yeah. Yeah. Okay, so let's, let's talk a bit about a bit more about you now, Ella. So what would you say, um, are, uh, the values or the principles? How do you, how do you lead? What are the principles that you lead?

Speaker B: Um, firstly, I'd say empowerment always. I want every woman I work with to feel capable, to feel seen, and to feel supported. The empowerment is, is huge. Uh, authenticity as well. I don't pretend to be perfect. I think people connect with real. And that's, yeah, that's what I try and bring to everything I do. You know, I show my vulnerabilities. You know, I, you know, I get to spend time with my girls on a personal level as well, so they get to see the Real me and experience me. Um, I'm a very much m. A red color in, when I'm in work mode, but um, in a social setting I'm very, very yellow. So um, and I like my team to see that and see me for the, for who I really am. Um, and then I think the third is around freedom. That's at the, the heartbeat of it all for me. Freedom to live life your way. Whatever that looks like, looks like for you. And um, you know, that's something that I have a lot of now is, is freedom.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: You know, I've, I've worked very hard to get to where I am, to get to the position that I am in the business and you know, no, you know, top position comes without a lot of hard graft. But I'm um, now in a position that I can give myself that freedom and I can work the hours that I want to work on my terms.

Speaker A: Amazing. That's amazing. And um, in terms of how you've got here, what, what's, what would you say the biggest influence has been on your, your own development as a, as a leader?

Speaker B: So going through something as hard as a, as a breakdown, which I did in 2014, that made me really re. Evaluate everything. How I work, how I lead and how I look after myself, which is, is huge. You have to look after yourself. You know, when you, you're leading a team of people. You know, if, if you're not looking after yourself, you're not going to be able to look after everybody else. So.

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker B: That's huge. Also becoming a mum, that's seriously shifted my whole perspective on everything and being, being part of a purpose led company like Tropic, it's helped me step into leadership in a way that feels aligned, not forced. I don't know whether you've um, heard of something called Human Design, but.

Speaker A: No. Tell us about, tell us more.

Speaker B: So Human Design is something that I came across probably nearly a year ago now and um, it's been huge for me. So I've actually learned that I'm a reflector and um, a reflector. There's only 1% of the human population that are actually reflectors and it's really helped me to understand how I show up best. So being a reflector and it's something I, um, I encourage everyone to have a look at Human Design. It's called, yeah, have a look. Um, but basically being a reflector means that I don't actually have um, a consistent energy or identity like most other types do. So I actually absorb and reflect the energy of the people and environments around me. So I'm basically like a mirror. So I, I actually feel everything very deeply and consent really quickly when something is aligned or it isn't aligned. So I, once I found out that I was a reflector this is massively had a, a huge impact on, on me and actually given me a lot of light moments as to why I do certain things. But it's. I also feel that it's a huge benefit to me and the way I lead um, and all under. It's really helped me to understand myself a lot more why I do the things that I do and the way that I do them.

Speaker A: That's you know that doing that work on yourself. However it's common. You know, it's. I'm really sorry to hear that for you that it came from a breakdown but actually it's. You've allowed you to rebuild your life and develop your um, your whole. Well your whole life actually. Family business. Um, and the way you lead, doing that work on yourself is so, so important because you know as you say once you know what, what your strengths are and that reflecting mirror strength is such a, such a. Well it sounds like I'm going to look that up actually. Human design. And we're also going to look at Madam C.J. walker. Yeah, I've got a couple of things to look at is it's so important and you've mentioned the colors. You know we use that a lot in use Byron. It's just so useful to be able to use a language with your team members, right? Mhm.

Speaker B: Oh absolutely.

Speaker A: That helps you to, to understand. And do you use that with your team as well? The human design? Yeah.

Speaker B: So we've actually done a bit of work um to get them all to understand you know, what they are. Whether they're manifesters, um, projectors, you know there's a few different um, types that you can, you can be. So it's a really interesting exercise to do and I think um, colors that you just mentioned as well. So I'm, I'm like very red, um, work very yellow. Socially I m think as well understanding your team and their colors is really is, is important because once you understand your team's colors, you, you work with, you work with them differently. You, you know, you, you coach them differently. You, you know, you support them in different, in different ways. You know, you approach everything with them them differently. So how red within your team is so very different to how you'd work with a green or a blue. Yeah, uh, you know, so, yeah, so I think. I think having the. The colors has been really powerful, but also, you know, for those of you that are interested in the human design side. Yeah, um, I think it's. It's definitely something. It's definitely worth having.

Speaker A: It's a great build.

Speaker B: Yeah, definitely.

Speaker A: So. Great build. So the podcast that we are running here is to kind of is to support people who are thinking that they might be a sales leader. They might not even be in sales, actually. They might be wondering what. What it's like thinking about whether it might be something that they. They move, they raise up to in the future. And so we do like to ask our successful leaders when they come on how, um, what their advice would be to aspiring sales people.

Speaker B: Okay, so I would say don't build your business on burnout. I think that's really, really important. Leadership isn't about doing more. It's about doing what matters and, um, doing it in a way that's sustainable. Um, I think that's. That's really key. Um, you know, you see so many people that, that go into leadership roles, and all of a sudden they think they've got to take on the whole world and do so much more. And, and you don't. You really don't. It's just about being clever about what you do and, and how you. How you do it. Um, so your business can be sustainable and you don't need to have all the answers as well. I think some people trip up because they think they have to be the master of everything. And, you know, when somebody's asking them something, they have to know the answer because they are. Should know, but you don't. You know, the best leaders know how to step back. They know how to create space for others to rise, which is. Is key. And, um, they trust their team to lead that. That's massive. You know, you have to be able to, like we were saying earlier, let go of the reins and let other people lead. Let them rise, let them shine. You know, you want to celebrate your people in your team louder than you celebrate yourself, you know, and lead. Lead by example, you know? You know, you want to stay human while you're doing it all, you know? Yeah, it's, um. You know, I just. I just think to be a. A really good leader, one of the biggest things, especially in Tropic, it's recognizing other people's success because, yeah, you know, one of the biggest things that people will say to me is like, oh, my God, all this recognition. I don't get anything like this in my day job, you know, Tropic. Tropic has given me recognition. I get recognized for my success, for anything good that I've done, for great sales, you know, and that's something I pride myself on with my business. I do recognition all the time. If there's anything that I can recognize within my, my team, whether it be one of my smallest ambassadors to one of my highest performing leaders, I will. I will recognize them, you know, and I do it every single month without fail. But then I also do, you know, little, little drops of recognition throughout the month as well, to shout people out and make them feel special, make them feel, you know, important, you know, make them feel, you know, like they are the fabulous ambassadors that they are.

Speaker A: Do you know what? I absolutely love that. Recognition is one of the key elements of leadership. As you say, it's not all about money and incentives. Although at Tropic, there's plenty of that. It's actually about those little, as you say, those little drips of recognition that make people feel like it's all worthwhile.

Speaker B: Right, Absolutely.

Speaker A: Big lesson there. Big lesson to sales leaders to recognize your team, thank, praise, and, uh, you know, just, uh, show that you value their presence.

Speaker B: Right, yeah, absolutely. And I think as well, uh, another thing that I pride myself on is, you know, getting your team together, you know, and, you know, uh, not only the recognition side, but if you can get them together in social environments. So team days where they can bond, they can connect, they can inspire each other, um, and build relationships with each other so that they, you know, they trust each other and they support each other more. That's hugely beneficial for you as the upland leader, to have those, if you, if, if you can help them make those connections within the. Within the team that they're. They're in. So things like team days and things like that, I would say wherever possible.

Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. So did you hold back your one sales leader secret, Ella?

Speaker B: I did, I did. I don't know whether it's gonna be very different from what other people may say, but I think it's probably quite relevant to the journey that I've. I've had. And that is to give yourself permission to rest.

Speaker A: Oh, that's amazing. One. Yeah. No, we haven't had that.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: We should have done.

Speaker B: You. You know, you can't pour from an empty cup. And I think it's so important. You know, I've mentioned, you know, throughout this podcast about, you know, burnout and, um, you know. Yeah. And looking after yourself. You know, you have to Put yourself first. If you're going to be the best leader that you possibly can, you have to give yourself permission to rest. You have to give yourself time off. You know, you have to give, you know, don't. You don't have to work every hour God sends. You know, that doesn't make the best leader. The best leaders are the ones that, uh, are fresh, that are inspired, that have had time out, they've had time to reflect. Um, those are the leaders that can show up and be a great leader.

Speaker A: Do you know what? I think that's probably one of the best sales leader secrets we've had so far, Ella. It really is. I completely identify with that. That huge to do list that you think, actually, I just need to stop, even though it's not finished and I need to rest.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Fantastic. Well, we are on a Friday, so we're going into the weekend, so I do wish you a extremely restful weekend. Ella. Thank you. And thank you so much for sharing your vulnerability about how you got to where you are. And also, uh, what a pleasure to have such a successful sales leader on, um, uh, the podcast today. So thank you so much.

Speaker B: Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker A: Thank you for listening to Sales leader Secrets and giving us your time today. If you found any of the secrets useful, please do subscribe and follow us. And if you'd like to hear more about how we work with sales leaders, then go to www.theyuspiregroup.com and get in touch. We'd love to hear from you. Bye. Bye.