From Celiac Diagnosis to 20,000 Grocery Stores: Feel Good Foods CEO Vanessa Phillips

Speaker A: Coming up in this episode of Professional

Speaker B: jealousy, there's no 9 to 5 in being a founder. Even when I'm sleeping, I'm working. It's an extension of myself. I want to build a brand that I can grow into, not grow out of. He would say, yes, I can. Repeat after me, yes, I can. And it followed me through my life. I was told to really just give up any hope of ever being in the food business. I was devastated. I didn't want to accept that.

Speaker A: Hello, I'm Natasha Jakuboski, chief, uh, innovation officer at Anomaly, a marketing agency in New York. And this is my podcast, Professional Jealousy, where I'm lucky enough to Talk to founders, CEOs and creative, interesting people that I'm impressed by and, and one to learn from and maybe a little bit envious of. Um, today I'm talking with Vanessa Phillips, the co founder and CEO of, uh, Feel Good Foods, a lineup of gluten free, um, and all natural snacks and meals in over 18,000 grocery stores. Uh, so good to, uh, so good to have you here. Um, for anyone that doesn't know Feel Good Foods, can you give us the elevator pitch?

Speaker B: Sure. Well, first of all, thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to be talking to you. Feel Good Foods is a frozen food brand that's all gluten free and focused on all of your nostalgic favorites. It's indulgent with simple ingredients. I started it after, um, having a diagnosis of celiac disease. And after going gluten free, I missed a ton of food, so became determined to recreate all of my childhood favorites, but in a way where I could enjoy them and eat them as an adult.

Speaker A: Yeah, that's amazing. Um, and, you know, it's that classic kind of entrepreneurial. Aha. I had a problem and then I solved it and, you know, created a brand. Can you talk about, I mean, you were in the restaurant business. I was saying before we started recording that I've, uh, I've enjoyed, uh, your restaurant, Friedman's. Um, can you talk about how you went from, like, the diagnosis to thinking about, um, actually creating a brand for everyone to enjoy?

Speaker B: Yeah, so I actually grew up. I grew up in New York City in the restaurant industry. My family, um, owned bagel stores when I was a kid, as well as Chinese restaurants. So restaurants was always incredibly familiar to me. I always thought, you know, one day when I was a kid, I was like, one day I will own a restaurant. I thought it would be more fine dining than what my parents did. But it was definitely something that seemed like a really natural transition for me. And I also always loved food. Like, from a very early age, I was incredibly adventurous and curious. I, um, have, you know, all of these memories eating, you know, soft shell crabs at 3 years old with, you know, a black bean sauce. Um, I was just like this little epicurean that would eat anything and nothing was scary. But as I, you know, went into my teenage years, I was privately struggling with a lot of symptoms that I just couldn't explain and I couldn't trace back to what I ate. I knew that I was eating something all the time that was making me feel sick, but it was very confusing and like I said, just like really hard to trace. I would eat something in the morning and then not get symptoms for, you know, sometimes 24 to 48 hours. So I had, you know, these symptoms that I was battling. And finally, when I was in my sophomore year of college, I was diagnosed with celiac disease and was told by doctors that I had to go on a very strict gluten free diet. But also I was told to really just give up any hope of, um, ever being in the food business. They, um, told me that I needed to start ordering my food with no seasoning, no flavor, just grilled chicken, steamed veggies. And that was, that. That was like the prescription for me, for life. And I was devastated. I didn't want to accept that. And I also challenged it. Um, there wasn't a ton of information at that time about gluten free diets, but I just knew that, um, the ingredients that I could eat could do a lot more for me. So I, um, you know, started working in restaurants and I teamed up with a chef and together we opened Friedman's, which was, you know, first of its kind, uh, gluten free, quick service cafe, but that really focused on a lot of favorites that, um, were foods that I missed that I wanted to bring back to consumers.

Speaker A: I mean, and it was early, like, I feel like gluten free suddenly entered culture and became, you know, you saw every kind of food company jump on the kind of bandwagon. Suddenly everyone was gluten free. But you started, uh, before that. And I loved, I think I read that your mission was to, to make food that tastes. Doesn't taste like cardboard for people to enjoy. Um, looking back, did you think it was going to move into feel good foods or how did you make that transition from Friedman's to feel good foods?

Speaker B: Yeah, I actually did. And, you know, when we opened Friedman's, um, I think we were surprised by how many guests were coming in and ordering gluten free food. So it exceeded our expectations from that perspective. We knew that it would be popular. We knew that it would, it would resonate because, um, it was inside Chelsea Market and it really kind of tapped into like, what the Chelsea Market, um, you know, people who worked in Chelsea Market, what they were looking for. It was like really delicious, um, sandwiches and salads and, and you know, kind of like a lot of it had a lot of like southern influence. We did like fried green tomatoes and it was great for brunch. So we weren't surprised, um, by the success of Friedman's, but the gluten free component was surprising. And we were getting people from, frankly all over the world that were, we had a, at the time we had a gluten free guest book and we were getting people from all over the world that were signing the guest book saying, like, please open a gluten free restaurant where I live. And it was, you know, Des Moines and you know, uh, Canada, like different countries. Right. So that kind of got me thinking, like, how do I reach more people? How do I get inside people's homes? I want to be able to give a solution to what the deprivation that people are living with outside my 35 seat restaurant. Um, so that was, you know, kind of like, I think the light bulb moment for me that it was going to be more than just Friedman's and it was going to lead to being a national food brand.

Speaker A: Yeah, amazing. Um, and definitely kind of mission driven. It's such a clear focus and it's interesting just seeing it kind of align with getting people getting healthier. You know, I definitely thought, I don't think I am, um, gluten intolerant, but I definitely go for those options. So it's a nice kind of confluence, uh, of different trends that you've kind of, uh, um, leaned into. What was the inflection point?

Speaker B: So I, you know, I did not know anything about launching a frozen food brand. And I, you know, I, I think that if I had done more research and I had known more, maybe I wouldn't have done it. So I think it's great that I didn't know anything because I just went in and I just started doing. And I think also that's sometimes what it means to be an entrepreneur. I had, um, figured out with my partner how to make gluten free pot stickers. We, um, you know, didn't know how to scale it necessarily, but we knew how to make it and we knew how to serve it on our restaurant menu. And we were running Friedman's and we were blown away by the demand for gluten free. So we put the pot stickers in a Ziploc bag and we sent it off to Whole Foods. And I remember typing a Word document on how to prepare them and, you know, put them in a pan with some. Some oil and water. And I had like, a mock up of what the packaging would look like if it ever actually became real packaging. And I sent it off to Whole Foods. And. And I. You know, it's funny because looking back now, I remember a lot of people in my life kind of laughing it off. They were like, oh, you're so cute. You're so funny, you know, But I knew that it was going to launch in Whole Foods. I didn't know how and I didn't know when, but I knew that it was going to. And I believed in it and I was passionate about it, and I believed that there was a need for it. So even though I blindly sent the samples in a Ziploc bag, um, I wasn't very surprised when we got an email back two weeks later letting us know that it was indeed launching in the North Atlantic region of Whole Foods. But that was when I had to have a crash course on everything consumer packaged goods related. And that was, you know, when the work really began.

Speaker A: Yeah. That's insane. So how long till that. From that email to getting into Whole Foods?

Speaker B: About four months.

Speaker A: Oh, my God. Insane. Yeah.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Um, and that's where you did brand name packaging design, figuring out the how to manufacture.

Speaker B: Yeah, we had to learn all of it, and we had to learn all of it very quickly. Um, the brand name, we actually, um, we had had another name and we found out that it was trademarked. So, you know, these were just some of the early learnings. Yeah.

Speaker A: What was the trademark name that you first wanted?

Speaker B: Feel Good Food Matters.

Speaker A: I mean, Feel Good Food, I think is better.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And Feel Good Foods really, it really spoke to me. Um, you know, I was coming from this, you know, personal struggle with not feeling good for so long. And one of the. The foods that I missed most was what I ate growing up at my dad's restaurants, which was pot stickers. So having the first product be gluten free pot stickers, it. It truly made me feel so good. It made me feel so good physically, it made me feel so good emotionally. So it, the name resonated with me right away.

Speaker A: Yeah. And it, it kind of works on many levels. It's feel good physically if it, if, especially if you're suffering from a, uh, gluten intolerance. But it also, there's just something nice about naturals. It feel good in terms of product quality. And also, who wouldn't want to feel good, you know, even if you have none of that? It's such a good name. And then, um, yeah. Did you, who did you bring on to help you?

Speaker B: For a while, it was just me and my co founder. Um, you know, we were really scrappy. Uh, we moved to Boston, um, and demoed every single day, actually twice a day, um, at Whole Foods, just the two of us for the first four months. And you know, I look back so fondly, um, those were the good old days. You know, it was really just two very passionate founders that went all in and, you know, nobody is going to sell your brand better than you. And we just got so much drive and joy over standing in Whole Foods for six hours a day telling every shopper why they needed to try a gluten free pot sticker. And from there we scaled quickly. You know, that was a really incredible trial for us. And I remember four months later, we came out with gluten free egg rolls and, you know, spread nationally pretty fast.

Speaker A: Yeah, um, yeah, amazing. Um, did you have to raise money? How did you, how did you get this thing up and going?

Speaker B: We did that. You know, I would say the capital side of the business was another element of just my early naivete around, you know, how much it really takes to, uh, grow a frozen, uh, food brand. You know, for the first few years, we were really scrappy. We, um, went to friends and family and, and, and strangers. And, you know, my, my partner was really much better at it than I was. We'd be in the elevator and he'd be like, hey, can I tell you about a really exciting frozen food brand? Um, but, yeah, we were, we were really, really scrappy for, for years and, you know, really choiceful around who we partnered with. And um, you know, we, we kind of bootstrapped it. And then, um, you know, many years later, once it was more established and we really had distribution that we could stand behind, we went out and did more of a formal raise.

Speaker A: Okay, interesting. Um, you did say that if you kind of known more, you might not have gone into Frozen. Sounds hard to me. Um, out of all the categories, you know, I guess a fresh yogurt might be hard. Harder, maybe. I don't know. Like, if you were starting again, what would you change?

Speaker B: I think if I were to start again, I would probably still do frozen because it's the most authentic to me in terms of, you know, what I miss and what I think there's a real need for. I think there's other categories. Grocery stores that are probably easier. Although, you know that saying if you put your problems in the middle of the table, you'd probably. And you had 20 people in a room, everyone would take their problems back. So I think every category has its own challenges. Um, but yeah, I mean, frozen definitely is, is a, is a challenging category for sure. The reason I think I would do it again though, is because, you know, being gluten free or even not being gluten free, like, the way I eat is like, I want indulgent, nostalgic, um, savory, delicious foods. Not so much a cracker, but like, I love mozzarella sticks, right. I, I love soup, dumplings and egg rolls. So these are foods that I love, their foods that I give to my son. I, um, think that they also are foods that really bring people together. It's, you know, it's really fun to have, you know, a dinner party or a Super bowl party or to give your kids something after school as a snack that's not just like a chip. So I, I probably would do it all over again the same way. Um, maybe I would just have more knowledge so I wouldn't be so surprised every time there is, you know, a headwind.

Speaker A: Yeah. Um. What, uh, what were the biggest obstacles in getting consumers, investors, uh, you know, retailers to buy into the brand?

Speaker B: When we first launched, the category frozen snacks and apps wasn't even a category in natural. It wasn't even a door. So we, um, had to educate retailers why gluten free, um, and not even just gluten free, like why natural appetizers deserve shelf space. We were really up against, um, very legacy, um, established conventional brands that had an ingredient statement. I mean, they still exist today, but they had an ingredient statement of like 97 ingredients. They had a very, very low price on shelf. And we had to challenge that. That is not the way. You know, just because consumers want to indulge doesn't mean that they want to indulge and not have real food. So it, it was, we were very early. We were the first brand to really go into this category and create this category. And it was very challenging to get, um, not so much consumers. We knew the consumer demand was there, but it was challenging to get retailers to want to give us space because there was really no one else at that time. Doing what we were doing.

Speaker A: Yeah. Especially beyond the more kind of traditional naturals, like Whole Foods type channel. Um, any, any piece of advice that you'd give someone starting a brand in that kind of emerging category, literally kind of creating category.

Speaker B: I just would say you just have to believe in it. I mean, you have to be obsessed with it. You, um, have to be so stubborn. And no matter how many no's you get, no one is going to change your mind that this is the best idea in the world. If you're even slightly on the fence, it's not going to work because you will definitely receive a lot more no's than yeses. And, you know, whenever I would get a no, it would just fuel me, it would drive me. I'd be like, oh, I'm going to show them. So, um, but that's because I believed so deeply in what we were doing.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. And I, I think, you know, and that might be part of your entrepreneurial kind of, you know, personality, I guess. I mean, I've spoken to a lot of founders and there is like, I think you kind of have to have that slightly, like, I'll prove them kind, um, of mentality, like taking criticism and then backing down isn't necessarily a winning trait for, for a founder. Um, what, what other kind of skills or traits do you think, looking back, helped you succeed as a founder?

Speaker B: I think just being kind of more of this general list and really learning so many different skill sets that are needed to build a brand. So I, you know, I wasn't super, I wasn't, you know, ever, like, super skilled in like, one area. Um, I really tried to learn very quickly, um, all aspects of my business. And I felt that, like, in order for me to really be able to build this to, to, to the scale and the ability that I wanted, I had to understand every part of this business, every single, you know, nook and cranny. So I tried to do my best very early on to learn the aspects of building a business that maybe didn't really even interest me that much. Um, or the areas that were kind of more intimidating to me that I would have probably shied away from before starting Feel Good Foods. Um, but I just felt it was important that I know all of it, not just the, um, parts of it that I liked.

Speaker A: What are the bits that you feel like you like doing and the bits that you hated doing?

Speaker B: I love building brands. I love getting really close to my consumer. I love, um, intimately understanding what it is that the consumer wants and misses and what excites consumers. So, you know, the. The brand side was always really where my interest. Um, I, you know, was like, I think that where I added the most value, um, I also was. It was very personal. I felt that I was my consumer. So I loved being out there and meeting our consumers and really listening to them and then using that to drive innovation, um, branding and coming out with products that I was hearing that they wanted, um, the operations side of the business. You know, I did not have any experience in manufacturing. I can tell you that growing up, I was not walking a manufacturing floor. So, you know, learning the manufacturing side of the business and just everything it takes from making the product and then that entire journey to having it, um, you know, end up on a grocery store shelf. I mean, that is. That is quite a journey. And I was intimidated by that process early on. Um, it wasn't anything that I had any, um, you know, history doing. So, you know, it was something that at first I was like, oh, I'm. I'm gonna leave that to the others to figure out. Um, but then I just leaned in and, you know, now today, I love it. I love all the parts of what makes feel good foods feel good foods. But, um, that was definitely the most unfamiliar part for me.

Speaker A: Yeah. Interesting. Um, what do you think? I'm always curious, especially having kids. And, um, uh, what in your upbringing do you think helped you think like, this, helped you with this kind of thought? I'm gonna create something for myself. I'm gonna. I'm gonna be a founder.

Speaker B: My. My father is an entrepreneur. And, um, you know, from a very early age, I have so many memories of the way that he encouraged me. And, you know, looking back now, he's incredibly profound because I used to go to him a lot with m self doubt. I would have, you know, whether it be like, a project at school or, you know, something that I needed, um, his, you know, advice on. And he would always, like, he would never give me, like, direct advice about what I was coming to him with. Like, if I said to him, oh, I really need, you know, you to help me study for this test, he wouldn't necessarily sit down and, like, unpack the material with me, but he would always say to me, just say, yes, I can. Yes, I can. And I'm like, well, that's not what we're talking about right now. We're talking about this big project I have, and I don't know how I'm going to get there. And, uh, and I really want you to go deep with me on this and figure it out. And he would say, yes I can. Repeat after me, yes I can. And it's followed me through my life. I mean till this day. He's still, you know, we laugh about it now because it was totally his mantra and it, it resonated. And I remember going through so many different circumstances in my life where I would be walking into a room and I would have that self doubt again and I would just repeat, yes I can, yes I can. And it fueled me. It really got me through a lot of times of self doubt.

Speaker A: I mean that's pretty amazing. And I guess as a, I know you, you have kids, um, I'm sure you think about that, uh, as you bring up your kids. That's such a nice and surprisingly easy kind of thing to think about. Just reinforcing and creating that kind of affirmation. Yeah.

Speaker B: And it was so simple, you know, it was just three words. Um, you know, and I think a lot as a parent today, I'm always trying to find these profound ways to reach my teenager. Um, but sometimes it's just the most simple, straightforward sentiment that works.

Speaker A: So yeah, I think, I mean like, you know, that really resonates with me, Stephanie. It's like how do you, I think it is that uh, like classic growth mindset like which you talked about before, you know, never give up. Think uh, about I'm going to show you. And I think that is part of the yes, I can. You know, it's like I can, I can do it. If I work hard, I'm going to do it. And yeah, amazing how you've kind of transitioned from like a scrappy startup, uh, founder to now scaling, uh, and really growing this business from founder to CEO. Like what have been the biggest kind of changes, um, and ways that you've had to change?

Speaker B: Uh, you know, it's, it's so interesting because I was just having this conversation with um, someone the other day that I, I still feel like a scrappy founder. Um, I still feel the same as I did when we were a $5 million company. Like, it, it, it's, the mindset actually hasn't changed that much. Um, I, you know, for better or worse, I still a lot of times just do it myself. And I'm a huge believer in being part of the team and not outside the team. So I very much roll up my sleeves and I just get in there with everyone and do it because I operate very much from that place. Like there's a job that needs to get done and let's all Just get it done. So I don't know if I feel much different now than I did five years ago. Um, obviously as the company has grown, um, the needs have changed and the stakes are higher and it's more complex and, but the fundamentals are the same. And I think my mindset is very much the same. I think that when you're a founder, you kind of are always, uh, you know, coming from that place of like, I'm going to be a doer and I'm going to get out there and I'm going to sell my mission. And I don't know if whether you're $5 million brand or $100 million brand that, that really ever changes.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Interesting. Um, what's the hardest scaling decision you've had m. To make so far?

Speaker B: I think the one, um, decision that we kind of always come back to a lot is you can have, um, an idea for a product that tastes delicious and, um, you all, as a team, get really excited and rally behind it and you think that it would be received really well by consumers. But that's not where the work stops. Right? So not every idea is an idea that we can execute on and scale and launch. And I think that that's challenging because sometimes I just fall in love with a product and I want to launch it so badly, but the economics don't make sense or, you know, it doesn't work with our manufacturing system or process. So I think it's, you can. For me, I've fallen in love with products before and foods and I, and I've been sad that I can't bring it to life. Um, and I'll, and I'll become attached to it and, you know, and I'll like, still dream about the bench samples like months later that I no longer have. So I think just like getting attached to, to products that I'm, you know, unable. Uh, but I've had products that I have loved and we've brought them to market years later, years later, like five years later. So it's sometimes just not the right time right now.

Speaker A: How do you, uh, you know, I think your, your brand has a really clear kind of, um, almost, you know, framework for, you know, for innovation. You, you're at the intersection of comfort food and specific kind of natural and dietary needs. So you have a kind of, you have clear guidelines. But how do you think about innovation and figuring out, you know, do you do consumer research? How do you test new products to figure out if there's product market fit? Like, what is your Process for beyond the can we make it, will it be profitable, et cetera. Like, how do you figure out if this is going to be ah, something that consumers want?

Speaker B: I will. The process has evolved. Um, if I'm being completely candid, the process early on was just me and my, me and my partner.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And we, I would say to him I missed this and then he would make it and then I'd say now I miss this and then he would make that. Um, but that obviously has evolved over the years. We, you know, now rely a lot on data. Um, we, you know, look at kind of the total frozen food market and then we try and find voids and see what's missing. We take a lot of um, inspiration from what's happening outside grocery stores. We look at trends in restaurants. We look at behavior of how people are eating, what they're gravitating more towards these days. We pool our consumers a lot. We'll ask our social community, what do you want to see us make next? Um, so you know, it's, it's, it's a lot that goes into it. We have a in house R D team and we are constantly cooking up food. I mean it's every day it's like, what's for lunch? And um, you know, we also get a lot of inspiration from one another and we do a lot of roundtable conversations. We talk about food, we talk about what we like, what we don't like. And sometimes we just land on something and we're like, yes, this is it, this is it.

Speaker A: Amazing. How has your consumer changed over the years? Like I feel like you're in a category that in many ways stays the same and then in other ways you've got like, you know, the growth of gluten free becoming mainstream. You've got GLP1s coming in and you know, changing everything. You've got things like Maha in the like, how, how have you, how do you think about your consumers and your potential consumers and how have they changed in the last few years?

Speaker B: I think our consumer base has just grown um, significantly. When we first started we were pretty niche and we were um, really speaking mostly to the gluten free consumer, whether it was the celiac consumer or the gluten intolerant consumer. I mean there's many reasons why someone goes on a gluten free diet, but I would say that was our core consumer. And today the majority of our consumers actually don't um, have any issues with gluten. You know, we still have that, you know, that very loyal consumer base that is gluten free. But, um, most of the consumers don't have any issues with gluten. A lot of them don't even realize that it's gluten free. Or they. We call them the curious consumer. So, so they are shopping the frozen aisle and they're looking for something that's convenient. Um, you know, a lot of moms will buy our foods for their kids or they're looking for, you know, a meal hack. Right. Like, there are. Our foods work really well where you can make it into a meal. It's a side dish to a meal. It's, you know, before the meal. So we get a lot of curious consumers that, you know, see the packaging and they say, oh, these ingredients are very simple. Um, this looks like it could solve a problem in my house, which is like, what's something that I can make that's quick and easy and then from there what keeps them coming back is that it's delicious.

Speaker A: Yeah, delicious. But driven by. I want something healthier. So it kind of great that it's gone beyond gluten free. That's now an equity versus the driver.

Speaker B: Yeah, you know, we do not, um, you know, the bar for us is not like, how does this hold up to other gluten free foods? We don't want it to taste gluten free and frankly, I don't think it does. Um, you know, most of the team can eat gluten, so we are testing our mozzarella sticks against a mozzarella stick made with wheat. Our jalapeno bites next to a jalapeno bite that has wheat. Um, also I, you know, I have a very good memory, so I remember what mozzarella sticks taste like. And that is what I am getting back to like every day. Like when I, you know, come out with a gluten free, uh, feel good foods, gluten free product. I'm being brought back to that childhood memory of eating it as a kid.

Speaker A: Yeah, no, totally. Um, what do you think mainstream food brands don't really understand about your consumers?

Speaker B: Um, probably that our consumers are not that far apart and not that different. And I think that, you know, consumer, um, behavior has changed and I think consumers are demanding more. Um, and that's, you know, why we're resonating so well with them. I think what was once accepted is no longer accepted. Just because you're buying frozen food doesn't mean that you don't want the same experience as if you were eating out as at a restaurant. So, you know, we're really, you know, I think the consumer was buying these, these foods before, but that didn't mean that they didn't want something better.

Speaker A: Yeah. Um, is there anything in, you know, are there any trends right now that you're interested in and that are exciting? I mean, like, how, how do you think about the food category beyond, beyond just frozen? Like, how are you thinking about, uh, what's going on these days?

Speaker B: I mean, we're all about offering something for everyone. So I, you know, I really don't like to be too focused on one trend or being niche. I really want to create a brand that is timeless and that can create legacy. And I think the best way to do that is to really pull everyone and to try and create something for everyone. So if you are, you know, gravitating towards more protein, we want to have an option for you. If it's still really important for you to, you know, be, um, you know, less protein, but you really want to have more of that. Like cheesy, indulgent, no meat. We're going to have something for you too if you're dairy free or gluten free or, you know. So like, I really want to have something at the table that if there's 20 people that come into a room, you know, 20 people will be able to find something on the table from feel good foods that they can enjoy.

Speaker A: Yeah, amazing. Um, what makes a good brand for you?

Speaker B: What makes a good brand for me? Like from my brand or when I'm shopping?

Speaker A: No, just generally. Yeah, when you think of a good brand, like what, how, what, what is it that makes it good, but they

Speaker B: just like very transparent, um, authentic. I really want to connect with what I'm buying and what's inside the box. Um, you know, I want it to evoke a feeling for me. Whether it's, you know, like nostalgia or, you know, it's just brings me joy, you know, for me, you know, a brand that gives me the, you know, like the emotional, like, ooh, this is, this looks good. Right? So, like, I seek that out and it's not just food. Like, I can have that, that reaction to a skin care product. Right. So, um, but I want to have an emotional reaction, um, to a brand. And that's what I try to do with feel good foods as well. Um, it has to speak to me.

Speaker A: How do you, how, uh, how do you market? Like, what, what is your main strategy? Uh, especially as you scale, especially as you're more mainstream. Um, like, what is your marketing strategy?

Speaker B: We rely a lot on, you know, social. Ah, really tapping into our community. Um, you know, really getting, uh, the product out there and, you know, getting it into people's mouths. Um, so, you know, through, like, influencers who we think speak to the product. And again, it all has to be very authentic. I mean, honestly, we really haven't, um, done a ton around marketing because we have really just gotten right to the source and gone to our consumers. Um, but it's just for us, always comes down to, like, if you taste it, we believe that you will buy it. So, as you know, we were just very focused on getting into people's mouths and getting the word out there in a. In an authentic, organic way.

Speaker A: Yeah. Amazing. I love that. Um, I mean, your name. The brand name, obviously, is food. So, uh, can you see yourself growing into a. Beyond the frozen aisle? Like, what are your ambitions for the brand moving forward?

Speaker B: Anything's possible. You know, I love that the brand has the ability to really flex and go anywhere. I. You know, I said early on, I remember, um, the. I was raising money, and someone said to me, oh, you guys make pot stickers? That doesn't really seem like a. A brand that should be called Feel Good Foods. And that was, at the time, all we had. And I said, well, that's intentional, because I want to build a brand that I can grow into, not grow out of.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So I love that it has permission to go anywhere. And. And we'll see. I mean, really, like, who knows?

Speaker A: I, uh, will see. I mean, it definitely. It feels like, I mean, beyond the brand name, which definitely can go anywhere. You know, you're kind of at the intersection of quite a good few, whether it's trends, headwinds, whatever. You're. I mean, it's a. It's a super interesting place that you find yourself. Um, any other, um, things that you wish you'd known earlier or. I'm trying to kind of like you. You feel very intentional, very growth mindset, and I love that. And. And I'm. I'm for all the people out there that aren't quite as, uh. I, uh, don't know, realized. You know, like, what is. What is stuff that you wish you'd learned earlier? What are things that you know from your journey you think people can learn from?

Speaker B: I mean, I could never, uh, count. It would take me. I could. It would take me a long time to count all the mistakes that I've made, but I learned so much from every mistake. Every single mistake got me to where I am today. So I'm m. Incredibly grateful. For how little I knew, to be honest, because I have literally witnessed over the life of this company my, my, my brain grow. And you know, I, I think about this a lot as a parent, you know, about, you know, education and going to business school and having all of those degrees and, and I didn't do that. And I, I literally learned on the job. And I did not follow a very traditional path, but it was my path and I loved every minute of it.

Speaker A: Yeah, that's amazing. Um, are there any, like, what's the biggest mistake that you think has actually helped your business grow?

Speaker B: Ooh, I don't know if we've had any. One moment where I would say that was the moment that was, that was bad. I think it was a lot of, um, trip ups along the way. Um, I remember early on I've told this story a lot. We, our first production run, um, so very first production run. I was so excited. I was like, okay, it's done. It's out in distribution. The dumplings are on grocery store shelves. And, um, within a week we started getting a lot of consumers reaching out, saying that it was turning to mush. Um, it just wasn't, it wasn't cooking in the pan. And I looked at the packaging and I realized that I had left out the step and the cooking instructions to cover pan with lid, which is quite crucial when you're putting water and oil in a pan and to steam and essentially kind of like crisp up the pot stickers. The water needs to evaporate and it's not going to do that if it's not covered with a lid. And I was absolutely shook because I, you know, knew that every single person who was buying them was not going to be able to, to cook them if they were going to follow the directions. But luckily we had only shipped out, I think like 1500 cases, which at that time seemed insane. Um, but we had a lot of product that hadn't left the factory yet. So my partner and his parents, his parents were, went to our manufacturer and they hand stamped probably 25,000 cartons with this red stamp that just said cover pan with lid. I remember their hands were so sore. And, um, it was just what we had to do. But it taught me the importance of slowing down and not rushing to send something to print before you proof it and then proof it again. Um, today a mistake like that would obviously be a lot worse, right? More than 25,000. But, um, that was, that was, you know, within a week of launching. So those types of mistakes happened a lot in the early days, but we figured it out.

Speaker A: Yeah. Amazing. Um, are there any, uh, tools or practices you do personally to kind of work on your own growth or self discovery or just, you know, feeling, feeling grounded every day?

Speaker B: A lot of tools. Um, not just one. I, you know, I work with a business coach, which I would say, um, everyone should do, but find one that, um, you know, you can be vulnerable with. Um, because, you know, a lot of times I truly just don't know. You know, I just don't know. So I need to talk it out and, um, I sometimes just need to have that safe space to really vent. Um, for me, like, my form of meditation is movement. I, you know, have to exercise. Um, you know, lately I've been traveling a lot and I've. Even if I'm just going on the treadmill for 30 minutes, if I don't find a way to move my body almost every day, I start to really feel it, um, in my work and in my time at home. So I would say that the two main, you know, for me, like the, the two main tools is movement and then having a safe space and having somebody that I can really be vulnerable with and, and share everything that I'm going through. Um, you know, in, in leading and running a company.

Speaker A: Yeah. Amazing. Um, how long? How long, Just out of curiosity, how long have you had a business coach? Like, when did you bring that into your, into your life?

Speaker B: Um, I would say like three years ago.

Speaker A: Yeah. Um, and, um, do you have mentors?

Speaker B: I do, I have a lot of mentors. I, um, would say that, um, my, my number one mentor, um, because it's, you know, industry agnostic, would be my dad. And, and so much of that is because it doesn't really matter what you do, it's how you show up. And, um, you know, the best thing that he taught me is I could do anything as long as I believe in myself when I show up. So whether it was starting a food company or if I'd gone into a different industry, it didn't really matter. It was just that belief in myself and that has carried me through any, you know, it surpassed anything I could have learned from, you know, in, uh, from an educational perspective. Right. It's just waking up every day and just being able to say to yourself, I have got this. Yes, I can.

Speaker A: I love that. Um, we're running out of time. Um, I'm going to do a few quick, uh, fire questions. Um, so we'll start with a frivolous one. What's your desert island food one? Thing.

Speaker B: Blueberries. I love blueberries.

Speaker A: Blueberries, not frozen.

Speaker B: I eat a lot of blueberries.

Speaker A: Okay, that sounds good. Um, best career advice, worst career advice you've ever had?

Speaker B: Um, the best career advice would probably be ignore all the signs. And the worst career advice I ever got was go back to the drawing board.

Speaker A: Why.

Speaker B: Why did someone tell me to go back to the drawing board?

Speaker A: Well, why was. Why was that bad?

Speaker B: It was when I was starting feel good foods.

Speaker A: Interesting. Yeah. So you're like, no, I'm doing this. Um, okay. Um, is there any, um, any. Anything that you wish you'd learned earlier? Uh,

Speaker B: I would say probably. I wish I learned earlier that there's really no such thing as overnight success. And you'll hear stories and you'll think that there are, but there are years and years of, um, work that went into it before. You know, the founder or the brand is telling about that moment. And I, I really was, um, very foolish in thinking that I was going to be able to accomplish everything I wanted very quickly. It takes time. And, um, I think that I would have probably, um, been kinder to myself if I had known that sooner.

Speaker A: Yeah. It kind of reminds me of my next one of my other questions, which was, uh, what's the biggest misconception about being a founder? Because I think there is that kind of glamour associated with it in some parts of the world. So. Misconceptions about being a founder.

Speaker B: Well, I don't find it very glamorous at all. I, um. You know, it's always with you. There's no 9 to 5 in being a founder. Um, even when I'm sleeping, I'm working. It's, it's, it's an extension of myself. So, um, you know, there's really no time off. There's no out of office. Um, I, you know, think and live and breathe this brand all day.

Speaker A: Um, what do you think your superpowers are, uh, that have helped you succeed?

Speaker B: I am very persuasive, uh, which has helped me, I think, in sales. Um, you know, I. When I was younger, my parents grew up, said I was stubborn. Um, but, um, when I want something, I don't give up.

Speaker A: Interesting. Um, anything that you're trying to get better at?

Speaker B: I'm always trying to be a better listener. You know, I, um, I think that I, for myself, have found that I learn the most when I'm listening. So I try and do that more now.

Speaker A: Interesting. Um, any, any belief about business that you think you've changed your mind on as you've, uh, progressed

Speaker B: I mean, I, you know, business in general, um, I would say just that, you know, it takes, um, an insane amount of grit, um, more than I realized. I was talking to my dad this morning actually, and I said to him, I don't think you really appreciate how hard this is. And he. And he was like, no, I don't think you appreciated how hard this is. I know. Um, so, yeah, I continue every year to just be blown away by how hard, how much grit it takes to stay in the game.

Speaker A: Amazing. Um, what does success look like for you? Personally?

Speaker B: I already feel successful in what I've been able to bring to the world through our food. Um, but I want to keep doing more of it. So I want, you know, every year I think, like, I want more. I want to be able to bring more. I want to be able to continue to excite people and, um, you know, give them something to feel good about. And while it makes me feel really good and makes me feel really successful, to know that I've even been able to touch a small number of people through Feel Good Foods, it's not enough, right? Like, I'm like, well, what else do you want? What else can we do? Um, it's incredibly motivating for me. And the bigger Feel Good Foods gets, and the more homes that I can touch, the more successful I'll feel amazing.

Speaker A: So, last question. Uh, tell me, uh, someone or something that you're professionally jealous of.

Speaker B: Yeah, I would, I would. I would say. I was gonna say my dad, but, like, I feel like I've already talked about him a lot. I, I really love, um, ah, Emma Gerday. She, I think that she's done an incredible job, um, you know, building a brand that really speaks to women and feeling empowered, um, in their bodies. And, you know, I, I think that just really being able to speak. Speak to a consumer that way, um, so directly and making women feel powerful is, you know, something that I, you know, want to be able to do with Feel Good Foods. So, um, that's. That's probably a, ah, woman that I would say.

Speaker A: Okay, I, I love that your dad and the f. Uh, one of the founders of. She a founder of Skims?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, those are two pretty, Pretty amazing, uh, pretty amazing people. Um, Vanessa, thank you so much. This has been just so interesting and inspiring, and I have no doubt that anything that you could put your mind to, you're gonna get done. Uh, thank you. This has been amazing. Um, thank you so much for, uh, listening, watching. Uh, please subscribe. Tell someone to subscribe Listen, uh, we have lots of other episodes with lots of other founders and creatives, um, and innovators. You can find them on Spotify, Apple, uh, YouTube, professional jealousy dot com. Get in touch if you have any questions, feedback or importantly, want to see, uh, any people, particular people featured. Um, quick thank you to Shimmy, uh, my producer and, uh, yeah, until next time, thank you so much.