S2E9: Your Team Already Knows Who Should Be Fired

Speaker A: Welcome to People on Purpose, where each episode we explore how founders can navigate building businesses where people and profits can coexist on purpose. Now, if you're here and you're listening to this episode and you've clicked on it because of the title, and you probably need to listen to it for some reason, but then that means you're in kind of a bad spot. And I just want to start off by saying that nobody really wants to be in a position to let someone go. Nobody really wants to have to work out an exit with their employee. Whether you are initiating it or they are. Nobody really enjoys this process. At least nobody that I think would listen to this podcast. Um, um. And actually, I think that one of the biggest, biggest reasons that we know that we're compassionate leaders, we're not jaded, you know, all of that stuff is because of how we feel when it's time to actually let somebody go. So I know that I generally like to create an environment within the listeners, within our teachings, within my clients, where we try to accept as much accountability when things go wrong as possible. And I'm learning in therapy that the reason for that is because it helps us to feel like we have a little bit more control when things are not always in our control when it comes to people. And when it comes to people, you can't talk about people without talking about culture. So especially in this episode, I think you're going to see that the culture plays a role in so many elements of your business. And while we normally dig into how culture creates successful environments for people, we're also going to talk today about what happens with your culture when something goes wrong and what you need to do as a leader, what you need to prepare for as a leader when these situations arise. So without, you know, absolving anybody of any accountability, I think that we should start by just bringing to the forefront that firing somebody is not a failure of leadership at its core. The relationship that your employee had with your company, with their job, with your team, is not a one side, one sided experience, one sided relationship. If you've done the best you can around creating experiences within your organization that have created space for people to be successful and someone still isn't meeting those standards or your company isn't meeting their standards, it doesn't mean that you are a bad leader, a bad boss, a bad business owner, anything like that, that there are a million ways to do a good job and there are a million ways to do a bad job, and all we can really do at the end of the day is our best. So, uh, what I did want to point out is that while it's not always a failure of leadership, if you avoid it when it's necessary, that is, when you are not doing a good job as a leader, if you're putting off the experience of firing someone because you don't want to have to suffer through the implications, the conversations, the repercussions, then that is that avoidant mentality is going to inevitably be something that is going to deter your business from success. Whether it's having a difficult conversation like this or addressing a difficult elephant in the room when it comes to potentially repositioning your ideas in the market, understanding that, uh, that something you tried isn't working, um, putting out an offer and having it fail the most successful entrepreneurs fail the most. So keep in mind that while firing someone is not a failure of leadership, avoiding it when it's necessary usually is. That doesn't necessarily mean that you're a bad leader overall. There's a million things that can happen in a situation with another individual. There's a million perspectives, uh, basis for understanding all of that good stuff. The main thing that I want to address is that we can feel so bad when we're letting somebody go, and it can feel like it's our fault. It can feel like you know a lot of things. But if you're listening to this because of how timely it is for you, just remember that most of the time being fired is a rite of passage and people can have experiences in their life that help them to be better. You know that you're always going to end up being a villain in somebody's story. So what you can control is how you do it and how you protect your business and how you protect the rest of your team as a result. One of the hardest days I've ever had as a leader is when I actually had to terminate someone who I genuinely liked as a person like it. I literally said in the meeting, I know I'm going to be a villain in this story. And I am emotional doing this. But after measuring it so many different ways, there was just no way I could avoid it. And if we continued going forward, then it was going to create a toxic situation because the standards weren't necessarily being met. And it was all kind of rooted in a, in a, uh, misalignment of desires of the relationship for us both. So at the core of the issue, it was better for the company, it was better for the bottom line, but it was also hopefully going to eventually be better for this individual, and that's at least the perspective I like to take, is that if things are going perfectly and you still have to let them go, then there's probably something missing there and the whole story is not really being told. And maybe you're not being a hundred percent honest with yourself about the lessons that you should be taking from this, but if you're a small business owner, you're going to eventually face this moment too. There's no way around it. If you can go through your whole business and say that you never had to fire anyone, I would be highly suspicious of, uh, the behaviors that you were accepting or the growth that you were achieving. Because your business, unfortunately, should grow out of talent. It should go through ups and downs. You should have really high highs, and you should also have really low lows that require you to make adjustments to your bottom line, your expenses, your payroll, whatever the case may be. And it also should push you a little bit in the direction of how am I going to get to the next level of my business and do I have the right team in place to get me there? And sometimes that can have some really difficult conversations. I think it's really tempting to try to idealize your way out of it and to say, oh, well, maybe my standards are just a little bit too high, or maybe I'm, you know, asking for too much, or, I don't know, at least they're doing some work. I don't know if I can handle this right now. But there's lots of studies out there. If you're on the fence right now, there's lots of studies out there that are telling us that when we have an underperformer on the team, the entire team actually performs less well. So at the end of the day, whether it's a bad apple and there's a bunch of negativity being brought to the forefront in your business, it also creates negativity as a ripple effect through the rest of your team. Same goes for low performance. The difference here is that performance is actually a compliance issue. And it's not just a strategy issue. It's not just a dang, I wish you did better um, issue. It's not a. We entered this collective relationship between the business and the employee, and I have to settle for what they're bringing because I am not allowed to fire people because of some weird like TikTok you saw about at will employment or something. So employee exits are a touchy subject. There's no doubt about that. And I know it can be really really hard. Especially when you're thinking about all the unique dynamics that small businesses bring to the table. Small teams are much more personal. We always want to fire people when there's a real reason behind it. And it can be uh, difficult to get to a place where you're giving feedback, but then the only feedback you can give is that they have to be let go. And that's very harsh and it's very scary. And it can deeply affect people's livelihoods. We also, small business founders tend to hire based on trust. So and I have a whole episode about that previous to this. And that means that, uh, trust is an emotional characteristic. So if you're building your strategy around trust, you're going to end up in a situation where things feel a little bit more personal when it's time to question where these things are leaving off. We also have employees that know personal details about our lives. We've been vulnerable, likely sharing situations with them. So it can feel like you're putting somebody out into the world that now dislikes you and knows a lot about something that you are trying to protect. We suffer from guilt a lot. We have a lot of situations in small business where we have to deal with our emotions. That's why we always say entrepreneurship is like the biggest self discovery journey you can have. And honestly, entrepreneurship and the embracing of growth can actually completely change your life. But that doesn't necessarily mean that we want to see ourselves as the bad guy, you know, and technically when we have people on our team, we are creating situations where we are going to be relied upon for their income. And a lot of times people have goals that have to do with their finances. And to have their livelihood be directly impacted is not something that we should take lightly. And I want to just example or uh, like kind of write out, I guess some of the ways that we need to take these types of conversations seriously and remove the emotion as much as possible. Because in many situations, the more highly emotional the conversation is, the more likely that you may be in a situation that is going to impact compliance. So essentially, if you are in a position right now where you just know somebody needs to be to be terminated, there's going to be some conversation around that towards the end of the episode. So some like tactical tips. But I also have another episode in on the up and uh, up that can walk you through the framework of letting somebody go that could be fairly helpful depending on how you're approaching this topic. For that reason, we're not going to spend too long talking today about the way that you're going to run this conversation, there's plenty of resources out there for that. Um, but what we are going to talk about is how we got here in the first place. So hopefully if this happens to be a timely discussion for you, then you can think about some of the ways that we can do better in the future. And, or if you're thinking about it but you're putting it off, maybe one of these is going to call you out a little bit and spur you to take action in one direction or the other. So the first mistake that you could make is that leaders often wait too long. There's a lot of second chances. You're avoiding difficult conversations, there's performance issues, things are costing you money. Um, there's direct financial impact to not having these conversations, which is causing a lot of stress across the board when it comes to your other team members. Cross functional communication. Um, basically the standard you walk by is the standard that you accept. So, so if you're not a hundred percent sure why there is something going on with this employee, or you feel like it just isn't getting any better and you feel like you've been really clear in your communication, then you want to make sure that you're getting to a place where you're not waiting too long. Because the other employees on your team are going to believe that that type of subpar performance is something that can be basically expected from you as a leader. The second thing that leaders sometimes do is they don't set clear expectations. And that can be a fuel for a really difficult conversation with an employee, both on the compliant side as well as just on the side of risk when you're bringing up these discussions. So as a leader, it's going to feel like you're arming yourself with a bunch of negativity when you go into these conversations. But if you don't have documented and clear cut explanations of ways in which the employee is not performing their duties the way that they should be, then you need to take a step back and start there, have a direct conversation. Because that way if we're always aiming towards when it's time for me to terminate someone and they don't expect it or they didn't see it coming, that's usually when you're going to start to hit compliance markers as well. Now there is some times when we have some people that are just a little bit delusional and maybe in those cases that's not what we're talking about here. But in this particular case I think that if you are hesitating because you feel like the employee is not going to be expecting this to come and it is a performance related issue, not a layoff or something like that, then actually take a step back and do the due diligence to ensure that the employee has been provided plenty of opportunity to improve. That is going to protect you on the compliance side. Another thing that leaders sometimes do, especially when it comes down to making these decisions, is that emotion does take over and we start to lean on our emotions and use our internal bias to maybe make a decision that isn't very good for our business. At the end of the day, we have to be able to balance the compassion and the people side of business with the profitability. We know here at People on purpose that uh, profits and success of employees can go together. People can be cared for while the business profits. But unfortunately the only way that works out is if everybody is doing what they're supposed to be doing, including you as a leader. So realistically, by creating an environment where there is a high level of continuity between the behaviors that are expected and the way that you are interacting with those behaviors, then you are protecting your business. But you're also protecting your culture because that is showing the rest of your team that you're diligent, you're focused, and it's important to you that these paths are being followed. And when you are talking through these things, emotion can take over your decision making process. And it's very important that you're able to remove as much emotion as you can while you are initiating on these types of practices. Because making the decision requires you to set some emotion aside. But also when you're executing on the decision, there are things that you need to make sure and highlight in their experience on this call because there is going to be some compliance regulations that you'll need to pay attention to. So it's better to function as your emotions on the sideline and have them show up in a compassionate way, but not in a justification type of way. Like I felt this when you failed at this. That's not helpful and it's actually a very toxic form of leadership. So what I really want to make sure that we touch on real quick is that there are legal realities to letting people go. So at the end of the day there's. It's really important to have documentation that is in line with the expectations that your employees have on your company. The second piece is to remember about protected classes. So individuals within your organization that might be considered a protected class if you're not 100% sure what that is. That's actually a really easy thing for you to Google. But we're talking things like pregnancy or military status, even sexual orientation. Please also keep in mind that different states sometimes take that a tiny bit further. The third is a retaliation risk. So major situations that happen in the workplace on a personal level to an employee and their ability to share with you as a small business owner or what's going on in their life is a beautiful and wonderful place to be if your employee is functioning at a high level. However, if someone discloses something to you that they feel like they might be able to be judged for on another level, then it is actually really important that you are considering that if the termination is timed poorly around that type of sharing, then there could be a retaliation risk involved. Finally, we have consistency. So at the end of the day, if your process for termination varies from employee to employee, then that, uh, is going to open up a big red flag. And it's quite frankly one of the things that's going to be the most dangerous when it comes to your compliance and getting in trouble. Your job as a leader is not to create spaces where people are safe to work however they want. It's to work in a way that is still productive for your business. And that's where the discussion around at will employment comes into play, because it's highly misunderstood. People do have a right to work. They have a right to show up to their job and do a good job and go home to the extent that it is beneficial for the business. So for small business owners, sometimes we hold back because we think that maybe we won't have a right to terminate somebody because once you give them a job, you're locked in for life. Employment relationships are not marriages. You are not locked into something that could be costing you money, time, energy, resources. And basically, you don't have to settle for somebody that isn't bringing to the table what they were intended to bring to the table. We have to do everything we can to make sure that we're setting people up for success. But at the end of the day, a termination is a legal thing that you can do. There's almost no situation in which you are documenting performance, communicating it clearly to the employee, and then making a termination decision that is going to get you in legal trouble, at least not for very long. Most of the time with our clients, because they are well resourced in this area, there may be an employee that goes out and talks to somebody and says, hey, listen, I got Fired from my job. Um, I didn't show up to work for two days, but the policy said it was no call, no show for three days. So do I have a case? A lot of times attorneys will be like, I don't know, let's find out. And they'll send out some discovery where you have an opportunity to send the documentation that you've created to support your decision over to um, their attorney. The attorneys will look at that paperwork and decide whether or not they have a case. It's not scary to get contacted by an attorney if you are well resourced in hr. So keep in mind that you as an employer do have a right to fire people that are not profiting, they're not bringing a profit to your company. You just have to do it in the right way. So keep in mind that most termination lawsuits don't happen because someone fired an employee. They happen because the story around the termination does not make sense. And so there is space in that story where for the employee and their attorneys to try to figure out what exactly happened. So that is just something to note, especially as we talk through the next part of this process. Everything in HR should tell a story. So from your employees files, uh, to their experience, to the patterns that they perceive from you, to the documentation around their behavior from your side, all of that should be kept in really straightforward records that you can refer back to. You should be able to share your employees individual employee file with me and I can advise to you on what your rights are based on the documentation that I see. That is how much you should be doing on a day to day basis to ensure that you have the documentation you need if something isn't going the way that it should be going. So realistically you do need to make sure that you understand how to document the patterns that you're seeing. You do need to make sure that you are having performance conversations in order to make the decision, but also to explain to the employee what's going on. And finally, you need to be incredibly direct in both disciplinary discussions as well as the termination meeting. What I usually like to tell people, and this is sort of the piece, uh, about actually running this through a lens of the compliance side and also how the conversation should go is it should be very, very short and very, very sincere. So at the end of the day you should be able to just like if I asked you why'd you fire that person? You'd probably list off the reasons. You should actually have had enough conversations up to that point that you can ask the employee you won't. Do not do this. But you can ask the employee, you are being terminated, do you know why? And they can list them out. However, that is not what we're doing in this discussion. We are under the assumption that you have clearly explained how you want them to be performing and you've also been show the ways in which they haven't. So if they, in the perfect world, you can say, hey Jessica, why am I firing you? And they can say, because I was late six times I've been turning in documents late. And it seems like I don't actually have the skills to complete this job based on my work. That's not going to happen. The employee is not going to see it that way. That's why we are the leaders. So at the end of the day it really should be straightforward. I'm sorry to bring that bring you into this today. Um, you don't necessarily have to apologize, but basically just laying it out there, I'm going to cut to the chase. You are being terminated from your position. This is based on performance. As we've outlined in previous weeks. The reasons that you're being let go have to do with your ability to. And you can kind of just put something in there, but realistically it's not even important for you to go over the individual reasons with the employee with the exception of. This is a termination based on employ. This is a termination based on performance. Um, in other situations, for example, if you have to lay someone off, it's also very important that you're able to tell them that too. This is not a performance based discussion. This has to do with the needs of the business. And I am, um, I do apologize for having to go through this and I know it's a tough day. So basically I wanted to be clear. This is you being terminated from your position. It's considered a layoff. It's not performance based and HR is going to take it from here. That's as much as you should do. Um, there's definitely some, I guess, additional factors that have to do with documentation and follow up and making sure that everything is documented on your end. And so for that we highly recommend that you check out our clean Exit bundle which is going to create or going to show you how those templates can help support you in making sure that you're getting what you need to get in order to have a clean termination that provides clear documentation and the story that you're telling to whoever might ask one day to protect your company is clear cut and straightforward. What we really want to prevent. This might sound like common sense, but there are many business owners out there. That fire out of, you know, we've all seen it, we've all seen it on movies and stuff. There's plenty of employers out there that fire people based on just how they're feeling that day, or they're emotional or something pissed them off. There's also people that, you know, maybe uh, an employee essentially tells their boss that somebody sexual harassed, sexually harassed them and then they get fired the next day. The laws that prevent wrongful termination are not created to get you in trouble for firing someone for not doing their job. They're to protect employees from getting fired for things that put them in danger. In order to make sure that companies are taking radical accountability about the experience that their team is having so that they may perform work in a safe and functional environment. There's no situation in which a company is going to be totally raked over the coals if they have documented, laid out experiences that led to this performance moment, especially if they were communicated to the team. What this may mean for you is you may have decided to fire someone and you may not have the proper documentation in place. So it could mean a delay in order to better protect your business. And I highly suggest you reaching out to counsel, whether it's uh, us or even legal counsel, depending on the state that you're in regarding the next steps there. So one thing I did want to talk about is that termination is highly impactful on culture in a small business. There may even be situations in which other team members have contributed to the knowledge that helped you realize that somebody isn't doing their job. So it's not necessarily going to be this big secret thing that something's going on or somebody's getting let go. Even in teams of up to 50 or 100 people, there's always going to be some type of discussion or need to address the situation at hand. And it is really important that you are running this through a cultural lens because some companies are going to have a much more open and direct culture regarding types of decisions like this, especially if they are because they affect the bottom line of the business or there was a lot of cross functional balls that were being dropped. You can step into your leadership mode here and make sure that you are honest, clear and direct around changes in staffing. You don't have to give every single reason why, but you can set expectations about how things are going to be moving forward. So I highly suggest in those situations where somebody was, you know, maybe bringing the Other rest of the team down is to have a moment where you're reinforcing that cultural moment where you're taking termination and you're utilizing it as an opportunity to reinforce culture, to reinforce how you want people to treat each other, how you want them to act, how you want them to behave. Remember that your team is watching. So it is really, really important that how you treat people is a reflection of the culture that you're trying to build, that you're trying to model. How transparent you are is going to set the standard for how culture should be handled in the future. That means that people should know what they need to know and nothing else. They're also going to be watching how fair the process has been. They probably have friendships and relationships with their team member. So it would be really helpful for you to try to see it through your team's eyes before you take action. Has this team member been told enough times, have they been warned? Have they been coached? Have I done what I can to get them to where they need to be? And that is what your team is looking for. They're not looking for everything to be perfect, especially if they have witnessed that there has been a ball dropped here and there. That's why probably the most likely situation, um, you can just assume that your team member that you let go is likely not going to tell the full story. And that's okay. You may be the villain here, and that's fine. But what I do want to say is that is highly probable that your team will have a shaky moment following the termination of a coworker. And there's nothing wrong with it, but try to utilize it as a way to move forward effectively and efficiently and also through the cultural lens of what, how you want it to be perceived. At the end of the day, people are going to take what you say and they're going to see what they want to see, and they're going to hear what they want to hear. But you do have an opportunity to leverage your ideas about what you want your culture to look like in this moment. And really, uh, honestly, at the end of the day, firing someone poorly can destroy your trust with your entire team, whereas firing someone thoughtfully can be a moment to strengthen it. That is all to say that there are things that you absolutely should not say when you are letting someone go. Whether it be about compliance, culture, relationships with the rest of the team, whatever, across the board. These are not things that should come out of your mouth. When you are letting someone go for performance. You should not say this really isn't about performance. Obviously. You don't want to give mixed messages. You want to be clear, straightforward, direct and to the point. You don't want to say, we just think you would be happier somewhere else. Their feelings are not your responsibility. And the other one, we're going to give you a great reference. First of all, that erodes trust within your leadership because we do not. Our word is everything and we do not want to be out there promising that we're going to be providing references for people that didn't do a good job. It is really important that you're clear and respectful and you're really brief so that the message that comes across is exactly what you want it to be. Now, for someone like me, that is struggles with brevity, this can be really difficult. Sticking to a script, things like that. But going in with a strategy and feeling backed up by your well resourced HR team can be a great thing to do. If you are their leader, the sooner you can get them to a third party to finalize the discussion, the better. So it is your responsibility to have that initial discussion. It is the right thing to do in my opinion. It's the brave thing to do and it gives you a chance to speak on behalf of your company in defense of your company in a situation that could potentially be a make or break moment for your business. There is so many implications to having people on your team that you don't benefit from. Not just cost wise and money wise, but also in the way that it affects your culture. So by creating an environment where you are pushed to protect it, by leveraging these relationships, you have to make sure that you're standing by everything that you are saying. And by being the person that's having this conversation. It is your responsibility, unfortunately to do that. But it is also an opportunity for you to learn and grow and to get better. Because you will make these decisions more quickly when you aren't having to do them for the first time. So in the future you may not hesitate to let someone go because you may have had the experience in the past to know that you can handle it. That will help you be a more agile leader. M Now realistically I've had to fire people and it's never fun. I have. They stick in my head. Just as I'm thinking about this, I'm thinking about two particular situations that really, really sucked. And I think that it can be difficult at the end of the day in a position to have to say I'm taking away your livelihood and there's Nothing you can do about it. And also this is kind of on you because of the skill set that you bring to the table. Laying people off is even worse because it's a, you know, usually a money failure that maybe you're not able to fully provide, which also feels really bad. There's no situation in which letting someone go is fun. But, and this is just like between you and I, realistically, sometimes the most respectful thing that you can do for them, for your team, for your business, is to let them go. And if you wait too long, toxicity, resentment, and like literal culture killers will thrive within an environment that you're trying to create. And you're just going to feel like you're in quicksand all the time. So at the end of the day, I think that I've heard lots of stories and lots of perspectives about terminating people and letting them go. We always have in the back of our head, you know, when people record terminations and they post them online and there's this person did this thing and that person did that thing. But at the end of the day, like, I'm in hr, like, I'm kind of used to being the bad guy. And one of the things that I've learned over the years is that we can't have everything be like, oh, yeah, I'm totally like doing the Lord's work here by firing this person because they're not good at their job and they would be happier somewhere else. We can tell ourselves that at the end of the day, but we have to take radical accountability for the environments that we create that lead to these things. And, uh, my goal always is to have a situation with my team where by the time we get to termination, there's been enough conversations that they already know what's going to happen and they don't need anything but a confirmation that it's not working anymore. I have so many nightmare termination stories. And I promise if you follow this framework, you're not going to end up on TikTok or people there. People are going to say stuff about you either way. You could have the most beautiful conversation with an employee and it could have gone perfectly well with absolutely no hiccups, no bumps in the road. They could have thanked you, whatever, and you could still hear about it later from somebody else. So realistically, we want to make sure that everything is as clean cut as possible. We don't always know how people are going to react. So if it does happen to be a situation in which it could go one of two ways and you want to see how the conversation goes before you make a decision. That's a very, very rare thing. Most of the time, if you're sitting down in a termination meeting, it should be kind of like, cut and dry, quick to the point, and it's over. I've heard about people doing, like, terminations for, like, an hour. Like, people are sitting on a zoom with someone for an hour. Like, it's almost like a performance review where they're just ripping into them for an hour. I've heard about founders apologizing, it's okay to be like, I'm really sorry that, um, it turned out this way, or, I'm really sorry that this is happening, but it's not really okay to be like, I'm so sorry I have to fire you. I'm so sorry I have to fire you. It's just what they said I need to do. It's just blah, blah, blah, blah. Take full ownership for your role in this. This is your decision. Stand firm in those values. Another thing is that sometimes employees will try to negotiate a little bit, and you have to be ready for that. Just remember, start the conversation. Be clear, direct, and straightforward. Try to make it so that there's a way to pass them off to someone else. Um, if there is a negotiation or something like that happening, it can be something just as simple as, I'm so sorry, but this is a final decision, and I'm not open to negotiation right now. I know I say sorry way too much, but hopefully you get the difference versus, like, I'm so sorry I have to do this. It's actually, like, you can be apologetic about this experience because it does suck to be fired, and you want to be compassionate to them, but you don't want to have any sorry. Like, I regret doing this. Apologies are, uh, for regrets. And so make sure that if you are saying anything like that, it goes into compassion. So I really think that there's a lot of discussion around how this deals how we deal with culture. And it really depends entirely on what your culture is for how you deal with the rest of your team. But one thing that I do want to point out is that your team already knows who should be fired. They likely knew before you did. So if you are worried about the cultural implication of a termination, just remember that. And if you take nothing else from this episode, remember that every time you make a hard decision, it's an opportunity to further your culture into where what is going to get you to the next level of your business. So even though it sucks, try to Reframe that. Thinking around this is just one step closer to the next level of my business. And if you feel that your employee has is being surprised by being let go, it's a big red flag. So just keep in mind, stick to the script, let them go. But also make sure that you have your ducks in a row should everything come up otherwise. And if you haven't consulted HR prior to terminating somebody, that's a huge mistake. HR is the same laws, whether you know fairly similar laws, um, especially in this regard, whether you have two employees or 5,000 or 30,000 or an international team, you do have to follow the same laws. So make sure that you are not skipping over the basics of ensuring that you have what you need in order to make sure that you're protecting your company. When you're making difficult decisions around people. Those are some of the decisions that are going to highly impact how things are going to shake out in coming years. So thanks for sticking with me on this one. I promise next week's episode will be more fun, but if you are going through this, I'd love to hear about it. Of course, like, my lips are sealed, so just send me a dm. Um, I'm also happy to support UM in any way that we can through our Clean Exit bundle. You're going to have lots of resources in there that are going to help you to make sure that you are getting everything exactly how you need to in line to move forward. And then over the coming weeks, we're going to talk a little bit more about the cultural implications of performers that maybe aren't hitting their marks and how you have plenty of opportunities to lead them, even if you think that you don't. And I am really excited to hear your guys's discussions and interactions around this too. So I hope you have a great rest of your week. And if you have to fire someone, best of luck. It.