Nodes of Design#120: Ikigai - The Art of Designing Your Dream Job and Purpose with Alice Au Quan

Speaker A: Tips on career path is to like take a piece of paper out or a journal, sketch out what your ideal job looks like. You know what would bring you joy, fulfillment and peace. You know, it could be a drawing, it can be a story, um, you can write five scenarios out. It can be anything. And what you can do is take, you know, what is the perfect day or week look like and sort of look through these scenarios where you're, you know, unhinged and not necessarily hemmed into maybe the paradigm that you're in right now. Use those patterns and signals to help iterate what you want your career to look like.

Speaker B: Hi everyone. Thanks for tuning in to notesoft Design to help support our mission spread knowledge. We have a very special guest joining us today. Let's welcome Alex Kwan, a design executive, futurist and quantum thinker with an outstanding track record of driving innovation. Alex champions a human centered design first approach to business, believing it can shape a better future for everyone. Over the past two decades, this belief has fueled her leadership journey, helping companies leverage cutting edge technologies such as generative AI, LLMs, AI and blockchain to identify untapped opportunities, solve user needs and accelerate growth. She has since held design leadership roles at global companies like Google, Walmart, E Commerce and Procter and Gamble as well as high growth startups with fintech like Ripple where she has crafted transformative user experiences. Fun fact, she even worked on Mosaic, the first Internet browser. A, uh, creative and business leader, Alice's career spans ux, product and brand design, consistently delivering user value and business impact, earning her multiple patents. Her leadership philosophy is rooted in inclusivity and compassion with Ikigai and purpose driven leadership central to her mission. Today we are thrilled to have Alice with us to discuss Ikigai, the art of designing your dream job and purpose. Hey everyone. Before we dive into today's episode, I wanted to quickly share some exciting news. My new book, Loads of Wisdom Lessons from 100 Creative Visionaries is officially out. This book is a cumulation of insights and experiences gathered from interviewing some of the most inspiring minds in various creative fields. I'm thrilled to share their wisdom with you all. You can find the links to purchase the book on Amazon in the episode description. Be sure to check it out and let me know what you think.

Speaker C: Hi everyone. Thanks for tuning in to Notes of Design. In this episode we have a very special guest joining with us. Hi Alice. Welcome to Notes of Design.

Speaker A: So nice to be here. Thank you so much. I'm honored. Thank you.

Speaker C: So Alice, how was your day so far?

Speaker A: It's been lovely. It's very sunny. And, uh, I don't know, over here in San Francisco, we've been getting a heat wave, so it's been nice. How about you?

Speaker C: Late night, Midnight here. But, um, exciting day I had today. I went to a plantation drive and we have planted some plants. And also it was fun and I'm very excited for our conversation today.

Speaker A: I am as well. Thanks again.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So if you could give a brief about yourself to our listeners out there.

Speaker A: Things that has become my mantra as I head, uh, into the new year is that I believe a human centric design first approach to business can shape a better future for everyone. So I kind of consider myself a grounded futurist. I like to have one eye focused on the horizon, envisioning new landscapes. I'm a futurist and I love really thinking and daydreaming about the future. Uh, but then there's another side of me where I kind of keep my feet grounded on the present because I really love solving problems. And so I find myself doing that, you know, from washing the dishes and, you know, uh, taking care of my kids and doing various different things all the way to, like, obviously in my job as a design leader, uh, for user experiences, one of the things that I like to say is that I consider myself, uh, an entrepreneur, uh, or an intrapreneur. Uh, I love doing zero to one, uh, whether I'm at a small startup or a large company. And so you'll see me, like, relentlessly driving for action, pushing agile, uh, so that we can just create products that people love. So that's a little bit about me. Um, the last thing I'll say is that in my heart of hearts, I love designing for good. And if there's a way to solve user problems that are creatively at the intersection of social and business impact, that is truly what I strive for, is, uh, thinking about how I can tie what I do, uh, to making meaningful change in the world.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So what was your journey into design? How did you start, and what are your tips for the beginners on starting the design journey?

Speaker A: Oh, that's such a great question. Um, and of course, I always love hearing other people's stories too. Um, so thanks for asking it. Okay, well, I'll start a little bit about, you know, early in my childhood, I, uh, was really drawn to, to creativity. You know, whether it was visual design or interior or making clothes for my Barbies or, um, doodling. I always found myself with a notepad and pen kind of sketching things all the time as a kid, kind uh, of much like ethnographic research, um, which I'd later use in my job as a UX leader. You know, a little bit of things about my hobbies. I loved math, but I also really love creative outlets like, you know, musical theater, singing, um, playing the piano. And so this, this blend of the analytical and the artistic was, you know, a big part of deeply shaping, um, my approach to design. I, um, think it's about science and art, it's holistic. And so that's kind of my early childhood. But I'll, you know, I'll kind of talk a little bit about my next chapter, which is about my, my parents, my dad in particular, and his immigrant story and how that's really shaped me as a designer. You know, I'm sure for those of you who are immigrants or come from immigrant families, this may be familiar to you. Uh, I have immigrant tiger parents. Surprise. And they really encourage me towards more, you know, practical career paths. So, you know, kind of doctor, lawyer, accountant, you know, just make sure that, you know, hey, they came over here with no money, you know, make sure that their kids are okay. That's, that's kind of what, uh, parents from that background generation think about. So my father was one of nine brothers and he was the only brother to get an education. And actually his nine brothers pooled whatever money they had and they sent my dad on a one way ticket to the States to study and um, pursue the American dream. His journey was rooted in perseverance and he expected the same from me. So my senior year in high school, he gave me a large stack of annual reports. I don't know who does this, but my dad did that and he asked me, what do I notice about them? So I literally thumbed through every single one and then came back to my dad and said, well, there's no women anywhere in any of the leadership positions. And he's like, what else do you see? And I said, well, there's no people of color anywhere. And he said, alice, this is what the world looks like. So you're going to have to work 10 times harder than everyone else to be successful. And so that really set the bed for my approach, my grit, my who I am as a leader, who I am as a designer, who I am as a human being. So that leads me to my college years. And so you can imagine going into the arts was out of the question. I distinctly remember having a long conversation with my dad. I wanted to be, you Know, I was like, oh, I want to be a singer. No, I want to be a news anchor like Connie Chung. No, you know, that was pretty much out of the question. So out of doctor, lawyer and accountant, I picked door number three because I liked math. Anyways, one of my best friends from high school was studying something called graphic design. And I didn't really know much about it, but you know, we would study together and I found myself wanting to do her homework and not mine. And that's when it clicked and I realized I wanted to pursue design. So I built a portfolio behind my parents back and I applied to the School of Art and Design. And essentially after all that, I wasn't accepted. I was pretty crushed. But I wasn't going to give up, right? My dad taught me perseverance, grit. And so instead I went to the dean of the school and I asked for feedback. I figured I'm going to get in and I'm going to figure out how to get in and the first thing is figure out what I need to do. So a 30 minute conversation with Tom Kovacs turned into a three hour conversation and Tom decided to give me a chance. And so I was allowed into the program on probation. And six months later I was at the top of my class and I, I got a full scholarship. And that's when I told my parents that I had switched majors. So the funny thing is, is all of the lessons that my parents taught me, I used back on them. Isn't that great? Anyway, so that's my college years and that's how I ended up in design school. And actually during design, I got a chance my senior year in college to intern at the national center of Supercomputing Applications, which is ncsa. Uh, and I got to design pixels and work on the first Internet browser, Mosaic. It was kind of my first brush with ux, before UX was even coined a term or named anything. I mean, I was just trying to make sure that I could pay my way through school. And so I worked a lot of jobs and that was one of them. So it was pretty exciting, um, to think about that as part of my origin story. And then from there, after college, I landed my first role at P and G, uh, and immersed in user research and found my career dedicated to user centered design.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice, for sharing such an inspirational journey. So Alice, what are your tips for beginners on starting the design journey?

Speaker A: Well, these are some things that I wish someone told me when I was starting my career and beginning. But um, I'd say there's three that come to mind. One is cultivate curiosity. Always ask, what if? It was actually my friend's design work that made me think, what if I pursued design instead of accounting? And so I would say, always ask, what if? Uh, I love staying on top of, you know, the market trends, reading articles, seeing what's happening in the world. Because all of these little signals, they like, they, they guide us like a compass, uh, into like, what things are really resonating with us. So I call this what if Domestic. The second one is embrace experimentation. So I, uh, actually like to call this flossome or being flossome. Uh, Kevin Kelly, uh, he's also a futurist. And, um, he was like the former founder of Wired magazine. Anyways, he and I were chatting in a conversation and we were talking about this topic of experimentation and creation and um, iterating and all of that. And so he shared this story with me. He's like, you sometimes need to throw hundreds and hundreds of pots on the potter's wheel before you create a masterpiece. He's like, it's not like you would sit there and mold a pot for five months until it's perfect. He's like, just make a thousand of them. One of them's going to hit. Hit it. And so early in my career, I was a bit hesitant to fail. And I learned that failing fast and iterating and creating lots and lots of versions, prototypes, is actually the way to go. And it's part of the process. And the last one, which actually dovetails nicely into the topic that we're, um, going to spend time on, is ignite, uh, your golden ikigai. So to me, the keys to success lie in igniting your ikigai, which is exploring, you know, what truly inspires you, what you're passionate about, what you love, what the world needs. And so this isn't really just about your career path. It's a journey of self discovery and to find your unique voice in life. So I'd say those are the three things that I would share with with people that are starting their journey.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice, for such wonderful tips. So let's get started into our episode today. That is ikigai, uh, the art of designing your dream job and finding your purpose. So in your experience, what are some of the common misconceptions people have about finding their career purpose? And how can design thinking help address these misconceptions?

Speaker A: Well, I'm so glad you asked this question, because oftentimes we just focus on the you know, the good stuff, and, you know, we sanitize everything. Um, but I know a lot of people struggle with finding career purpose. And, you know, the story that I'd love to tell here because I always love visual metaphors. Imagine a bullseye that you're trying to hit with an arrow. Career purpose is not trying and trying and trying and trying to hit this red target. Instead, if you step back and broaden your perspective of the scene that I'm painting, you know, don't be too zoomed in on that specific, let's say, job title or I have to get into this company. You know, your purpose is so much bigger. And so if you think about it, your arrows have been hitting many targets all along, and you just haven't seen them yet. So that's kind of like the visual metaphor here. I really believe purpose is way more fluid than it's. It's like design thinking. So it really encourages, like, that iteration, that continuous learning. Um, so that's. That's like the visual metaphor I wanted to share. I think one misconception that I find, um, is some people think that their purpose is solely revolved around your passion. And so I think design thinking helps you strike this balance between passion and practicality. Um, part of ikigai is, what does the world need? One of the things I also like to encourage my team and mentees and other people that are, you know, seeking tips on career path is to, like, take a piece of paper out or a journal, sketch out what your ideal job looks like. Um, you know, what would bring you joy, fulfillment, and peace. Um, you know, it could be a drawing. It can be a story. Um, you can write five scenarios out. It can be anything. Um, and what you can do is take, you know, what does the perfect day or week look like, and sort of look through these scenarios where you're, you know, unhinged and not necessarily hemmed into maybe the paradigm that you're in right now. Use those patterns and signals to help iterate what you want your career to look like. So, um, those are just a couple thoughts on the topic.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So ikigai is often described as the intersection of what you love and what you're good at and what the world needs and what you can be paid for. So how does this concept relate to finding your dream job as a designer?

Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, this, to me, is the money question. Um, I'm sure this is something that everyone is asking themselves, you know, especially when they feel stuck or they're in a job that is soul sucking, um, you know, whatever that is. But what I would say as I've been doing Ikigai for 20 years, ah, at the core of it, it's actually the pursuit of well being and a fulfilling life. So if you look up ikigai, uh, it's actually not necessarily about career, it's about how to live a long and happy life. And there's these, you know, super centurions who are over 100 years and you know, some of them live in Okinawa and you know, some live in other parts of the world in the five blue zones. But they eat really healthy, they exercise, they make things with their hands. And so uh, when I was researching this I realized that it's really this delicate balance between being, which is who we are and doing, which is what we engage in. And so I think we need to find the be doing, um, not just one or the other, uh, one of the things that I've done personally for my ikigai, I'm going to share a personal connection that has really like deepened my relationship with this concept. So my maiden name is Al. Uh, it's the chemical symbol for gold. Um, growing up it was nice having a last name that was so short and uh, you know, I always got to stood at the front of the line in class because you know, if they alphabetize. But anyways, um, so I was a chemical symbol for gold and to honor my family. And as I mentioned, you know, they've profoundly shaped my, you know, who I am. I've intentionally woven the symbolism into this framework and I'm calling it Golden Ikigai. And so this reimagined ikigai represents the purest form of purpose. And it's what I'm you know, working on my book about this. So I'm super passionate about that. And this is something that has helped me um, tie together uh, ikigai. Um, if I think about it more in terms of my, you know, more my work and my career purpose, I'll kind of break it down a little bit. Um, if you think about golden ikigai as this lifelong journey, um, you know, when I think about what I love, for me what I love is envisioning the future. 0 to ones creating something from nothing innovation. When I think about what I'm good at, it's been user centric design, emerging technology solutions and then when you think about now, you know what the market increasingly demands and needs. It's AI driven products. So for me I've really carved out a career path that takes these Three things that resonates with all of the things that light me up and get me out of bed. Um, and so that, to me, is what finding a dream job is. And so if you take your own story and fill in the blank, you can start to begin to do the same.

Speaker C: Thank you, Alex. So could you please share a personal story or an example from your career journey where you have applied ikigai principles to design a more fulfilling work life?

Speaker A: That's such a good question. Um, I will have to say, finding fulfillment, first of all, is much more than just work. I'm sure everyone knows that, but some of us who are, um, maybe, you know, overachievers, you know, it's hard sometimes, but it's a balance between professional, personal, emotional, spiritual. So I kind of want to set the stage and let me start there. Right. It's holistic. But I'll tell a story early in my career that maybe can bring this to life a little bit. So in the beginning of my career, as I mentioned, my first job out of school was at Procter and Gamble. And I, uh, also had a chance to work on, um, E Commerce Beauty, which was like Web 1.0. I had this incredible manager. Her name is Wendy Allen Smith. So shout out to Wendy. She gave me this advice that really sticks with me and that surround yourself with greatness and you will be great. That mindset was really pivotal for me. So as I was saying, there was an opportunity to work, uh, on a P and G&VC funded startup. And she knew that I was really itching to get into that space and so she encouraged me to go for it. She's like, hey, this thing, this Internet, go work on the Internet. It was kind of up and coming and becoming a thing. So, uh, for me it meant moving from Cincinnati to San Francisco and diving headfirst into something radically new and different. And, and so that was kind of like my first ikigai pivot. And I did that for three years. I loved every minute of it. I was building this startup from scratch. There was no playbook. Um, in retrospect, I realized that, wow, this is my jam. And so if you break that down right, what I love, zero to one startup, what am I good at? Curiosity, experimentation. And then what did the world need? Personalized beauty. Now, needless to say, we were 20 years ahead of the game. Um, but it was such a fun ride. Now I'll talk a little bit about my second ikigai pivot too, because working at a startup, I didn't really have much of A personal life. So I was just, you know, as we were talking about holistic ikigai, one of the things that I really wanted to do was get married and have a family. Um, that also is a, you know, is a purpose. That's also something that you, you know, if you're sketching out your thoughts on your own journey, like, don't just talk. Think about professional, think about your goals and your purpose, uh, outside of that. And so, you know, someone was saying, alice, if you want to get married, you've got to make yourself available. You're always working. So I needed to prioritize my personal life as much as my professional. And I shifted to working at Target. And after this change, I met my husband. And 20 years later, we are still going strong. So it's really, you know, your golden ikigai. It really evolves over time, so be patient with it.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alex, for sharing such wonderful, uh, stories with us. So how could designers incorporate Ikega into their work, not just for themselves, but also to create product and services or experiences that help others find meaning and purpose when they use them?

Speaker A: I love the idea of giving back and finding more meaning. It's, it's certainly something that's top of mind for me. Sharing principles, sharing these, this ikigai framework, uh, it all, it helps spread goodness and allows others to find. So part of the reason why I'm here is for that very thing. I love sharing. And, you know, please steal this, take it, use it with your teams. You know, when I think about designing, um, our own dream job, we, we are essentially focusing on ourselves. But as designers, we're always thinking about the user. Right? You know, we're always thinking about their problems and solving them m on their behalf. That's like what we think about every day. And so often I think the user is telling us what the world needs and what problems need to be solved. So to me, ikigai is a big part of what the world needs. So, I don't know, take this whole AI, you know, S curve, this big boom that we're seeing. Take that as an example. How would we integrate that into this headspace? Right now in AI Driven ux, I like to consistently ask, like, okay, how can I improve people's lives? You know, to me, designing with purpose starts here. If an AI powered experience doesn't make the experience better, we really shouldn't do it. And so designing with purpose is constantly asking. Just because we can doesn't mean we should. So these are kind of some of the questions that I use to guide how I think about designing products, services and experiences.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So how do individuals uncover their passions and talent and how can this be leveraged to transition into their dream career? Because oftentimes designers are lost in their own world. So how could they use these frameworks to get out of that and uncover their passions?

Speaker A: I believe that this whole thing is a journey of self discovery. And a simple tip I would share is make time. I think often what we do is we are, you know, we're chasing after the next role or the next promotion or nailing it on a project, and the last thing we do is invest in ourselves. And so in order to discover your passions, you actually need to make time for it. You can't, you know, you can't do this if you don't have, uh, downtime to do the deep work. And so, you know, for me, I think everyone should have a passion project. Like if you don't have a passion project that you're doing where you're not getting paid for it, there's no deadline, you know, you're not getting rated on it. All of that pressure that sometimes confines our ability to really figure out, like, what do we love? What, what are we passionate about? So, yeah, find a passion project. I'll, uh, give you two examples of two people that really built their careers off of their passion project or their passions. One of them is Simone Geertz. She's a Swedish inventor who describes herself as Having started her YouTube career by creating shitty robots. Um, I believe her first, uh, her first invention was a toothbrush helmet. And so she really encourages people to ask questions through the process of creation. And anyways, you gotta look up her YouTube. You need to check out her website. It is so inspiring. Um, the second one is actually personal. It's my sister, um, she is a commercial photographer in New York and she made this book called the cone of Shame. And she lost her dog Tartine to an illness. And it resulted in, you know, inspiring her to create this series because what she wanted to do was take something that, you know, is really humiliating to dogs, uh, post surgery and make them really beautiful and majestic. And I'm telling you like it's a picture book, but it is so, so, so inspiring. So you can see like a little bit of examples here. Anyways, um, so one of the things that I always tell people is like, try the glove on for size. You know, does it fit? That might mean exploring volunteer work, coming up with that passion project, doing a, ah, pro bono thing. To help a cause. You know, each of these things will allow you to kind of dip your toes in a different industry, uh, without the pressure of this full commitment, um, and whatnot. So those are some of the things that I would say are really, uh, helpful.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So, Alice, many people face challenges and setbacks when pursuing their dream jobs. How can ikigai be used to navigate these obstacles and stay resilient?

Speaker A: This is actually something that's very deeply personal for me. Um, it has truly been. You know, while you might see this, like, wild LinkedIn profile, there's a lot of war stories and setbacks and challenges that, uh, is behind the scene. And so one of my core beliefs is really, you know, embracing who you are, your strengths, and your learnings throughout life. And so one of the things that I would say to, to your question, Tej, is, you know, how can we play to your strengths? You know, when you're focusing on what you're good at, you build your confidence naturally and you're going to gravitate towards companies and roles where you are going to excel. And I think that, um, if you play to your weaknesses, the exact opposite is going to happen. One of the books that I love and I've done with my teams and personally I taken the test like three times, is Strength Finders. Um, so if you haven't read that book, like, check it out. Um, I think often we fixate on the one piece of feedback that our manager gave or, you know, it's kind of like that spinach in your teeth moment. Um, and we just overlook our strengths and we, we kind of cast shade over, um, our superpowers. And our superpowers is something that we can really use to tackle real world problems and, uh, show up as our best self. So that would be, my first point, would be play to your strengths. The second point would be learn from your past. One of the things I keep saying, you know, I shared that my. In my childhood, I did a lot of sketching. Um, sketch. Write it down. Think through all the moments in your career. Think through moments in your life where you really felt like you were in your creative flow. Those times where you felt so energized and engaged, that time just flew by and you didn't even realize that the day had gone by. Write down those memories. Why? What, what about it? What did it smell like? Who was there, really? Mine. Your history. And think about that. Because all of these past experiences can guide you toward what you truly want for your future. The other thing that I would say as well, is the framework kind of talks about what you're good at, what the world needs, what are you passionate about? I think it's important also to acknowledge and write down what you're not good at. So what was the thing that you failed at? Um, what did you try out and realized, okay, I'm not that great at riding a unicycle, so I'm not going to do that again. Um, sometimes setbacks often reveal, you know, important insights about yourself. And so I think it's important to kind of look at it from both sides, uh, as you think about, like, what your purpose is. Um, and then my last point is, uh, you know, always be learning, stay humble. It's always a good one. In life when you're dealing with setbacks, like, don't give up. You know, more often than not, I would interview for a job and I wouldn't get it. Just like, I went into design school, and at first I didn't get it. But what ended up happening is either a better job came along, or the company just designed a specific job for me. And had I taken the original job, it would not have been operating in my strengths. So these are all things to think about as you're thinking about your next pivot, a life change, um, the dream job that you're looking after. And if you're going through a setback right now, we all always can use a pep talk. So find your people, find your tribe. But I will share this as I have experienced my own setbacks. Remember this, no matter what challenge you are facing, no one, no place, no situation can take away your purpose, your values, your identity. It's your story.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So how do you see the concept of ikigai evolving in context of future of work with increasing automation and AI advancement?

Speaker A: That's a great question. Um, I've definitely been thinking about ikigai in that context. Uh, actually, what's really cool is if you look at the word ikigai, AI is the last two letters a little Easter egg? Um, but anyways, okay. All that to say is one of the questions that I've been pondering. Um, because obviously everyone's thinking, is AI going to take over the world? Are we going to all lose our jobs? If you're into science fiction, um, are we going to head into this dystopic moment where machines are going to rule? You know, shout out to any of you Battlestar Galactica fans, um, the Cylon Cylon thing used to be my, uh, my phone ringer. Okay, I'm nerding out. But anyways, I was thinking about what. AI can't do that. Only humans can. And so I was thinking about that and uh, some of the things that came up was, well, AI can't be. They don't have empathy and compassion. You know, uh, AI doesn't have ethics or morality. AI can't come up with an original thought or have a conscience. AI doesn't have intuition or gut feelings. And I would argue that, you know, when it comes to creativity and imagination, which is something we as designers do, a lot of the AI can't come up with anything original unless. Unless you take your creativity and imagination and put that into the prompt. So as you, if you think about that in the context of the future of work, the idea of, you know, golden ikigai, it actually helps us see that while machines can take over, you know, repetitive tasks or augment things that we're doing, it actually helps us think about how we can refine our sense of purpose, uh, and focus on what makes us distinctly human. You know, think about it. All of you who are, there's an IC track and a manager track. All of you guys out there that are managers, guess what? AI cannot people manage. I don't think that AI can do a good job. People managing, giving you an annual review, um, you know, coaching you on a situation. It may be able to augment and help a manager do that. Right? And so, and Those who are ICs, you know, again, they don't have original thought, creativity. They cannot invent things. So I think I can amplify and supercharge what we do. So, you know, we need to, if we want to have a, uh, role in influencing the world that is coming, you know, we need to participate in it. You can be completely, you know, scared and ah, fearful about this technology or you can embrace it and help create a better world with more responsible AI. So we need to focus more on being human.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice, for sharing all these wonderful insights with us. So could you please share with us how does your day look like? Any interesting stories?

Speaker A: Sure. Um, well, I love flower arranging. So actually during COVID one of the things that I love doing, uh, was getting my flowers from the grocery store and putting together a beautiful arrangement like ikigai. I love ikebana. Um, that's a class that I took and it was just like, oh, uh, we need to find moments in the day where we are doing something with our hands. We're de stressing ourselves, were thinking about nature, you Know, going for a walk. That's one thing that I personally try to see. Even if it's 10 minutes of your day, um, you know, do that. Uh, one of the things I do do is, um, I'm a Christian. And you know, you may have different religion, but I do like to start my day, uh, with prayer and meditation. Um, I do a devotional for, for you listeners out there. You could be doing something else. You know, you can, um, meditate, you can, uh, you know, pray in your religion. Um, for me, it really helps balance, you know, ground me back to like, who am I not? What am I doing all the time? Because my identity doesn't lie entirely on what I do. It's who I am. You know, someday when we die, it's not going to be like, oh, this person, like, got this deadline done. It's going to be like, hey, Alice was a kind human being who listened to me when I was going through a tough time. And so I think we got to remember that sometimes we get so kind of stuck in our back to back meetings. Um, one of the other things that is hard to do, but, uh, I. One of the gals in my networking group said, hey, you know, we do everything on computers and blah, blah, blah, like, why don't you. We go back to like a day planner. So I got this new day planner called the Clever Fox. And I'm starting to use that again. And, uh, one of the things that it does in there is it has like different worksheets and stuff is priorities. So I'm trying to do, like, what's the one thing I got to get done today and what are the things that are, you know, nice to haves? Um, you know, check your priorities recalibrate. You can do that for the month, the week and the day. And I think the last one, you know, the first one was make space for creativity. Uh, the last one is reflect and recharge. So sometimes at the end of the day, one of the things, um, one of the things that I used to do when my kids were little is I'd be like, what's your rose and what's your thorn? And, um, you can do that as adults. You can do that, uh, in the workplace. You know, what's one highlight that one win from the day, from the week, and what might have been a failure or a big flop or an experiment you tried that totally went sideways. Um, you know, what did you learn from that? How can you give that back to your team or to other people? And the other one, I would say is sleep.

Speaker C: Thank you so much, Alice. So we'll conclude the show by few of your recommendations on your favorite books and people who inspired you the most in this space.

Speaker A: So I always like to show and tell. Um, the first book that kind of started me on the whole ikigai journey is this book called the Japanese Secret to a Long and Happy Life. That then since launched me into reading like a ton of ikigai books. But I really like this. You can see I got like every page. Mark. Another book that I like is Draw to Win by Dan Rohm. It's an amazing book. It's all about sketching. It's super powerful. Um, the other one is a selfish plan to change the world. Finding big purpose in big problems. And I know you said three, but I'm going to give you an extra bonus. Bend Not Break by Peng Fu. Memoir, like, so inspiring. Um, so these are the books, the people that inspire me. I will. I have two that I thought about. Um, first of all, this one's probably not a surprise. John Maeda. I have been following him and fangirling this, this guy since, um, my college days when he had tap, you know, Typewright. Uh, I have, like, a lot of his books. I've been following him, going to many of his talks. Uh, he is the VP of design and AI at M Microsoft. And anyways, I'm sure you already know, but if you haven't read his design and tech report, look them all up. Read them a million times. It's so good. The other person that I wanted to share that's been inspiring me, like, more recently is, um, an Asian American woman, Tiffany Yu. Talk about purpose driven leadership. She is such a powerful inspiration, um, for her relentlessness in advocacy for, uh, the disabled and really just creating more of a voice for those who have disabilities. So she founded an organization called Diversability. Um, she has a TED Talk. Anyways, I won't go into the whole thing, but you gotta check her out and her story. I guess I will. You know something, as I think about, you know, Golden Ikigai, you know, first of all, I am inspired by you, Tej. I think it's super awesome that you started this podcast and you've been doing this for five years. You're giving back to the community, you're elevating others, you are giving people inspiration. And I just think that's amazing. So I definitely want to acknowledge that and I'm inspired that you took this on as a passion project. Um, I just hope everyone that's listening to this can find their purpose. And if Golden Ikigai can help you in doing that, um, I will have felt like I've done something good in this world. So I really hope everybody can find their happily ever Ikigai. And um, feel free. You know, DM me on LinkedIn. Um, you can check out my website, aliceal kwan.com. ah, I'm always down to chat Ikigai or if I can help your team, um, on this topic, totally happy to do that. Um, but most importantly, I hope everyone has a wonderful time finding their purpose and have fun too.

Speaker C: Thank you so much Alice for such wonderful recommendation and this means a lot coming from you. So thank you so much Alice once again and we are looking forward to have you again in our upcoming episodes. Thank you so much for your time.

Speaker A: Sam.