Scott A. Martin | Groundswell Book Origins

Speaker A: This really is a little bit of a secret for marketing, but now it's become a little bit of table stakes. So if you think of freemium, how many times have you seen, hey, we'll try it for a month or it's the puppy dog closed in. Try it and then decide if you want to, you know, continue on. Now that free doesn't always mean free. The focus is give is the new get.

Speaker B: If you want rapid, healthy and sustainable growth for your business, there's no shortcut hacks and tactics. Promising 10 growth might yield short term results, but won't provide you long term gains. It's time to rethink chasing haptics and shift your growth mindset to unlock the hidden potential within your business that can quickly generate ongoing waves of profitability. Welcome to the AuthorHour podcast. I'm your host, Hussein Al Bialati, and I'm joined today by author Scott Martin, who's here today to talk about his new book called Groundswell, the Unseen Wave of business Growth. Let's flip through it. Hello, friends, and welcome back to the show. I'm super excited to have my friend Scott Martin on the show today. Scott, thanks for coming on, man.

Speaker A: Thanks so much for having me. Aloha.

Speaker B: Uh, yeah, I'm super excited, dude. I got to tell you, perusing throughout your book, I loved all the graphics and, you know, the fun sort of creative ways that you put that together throughout the book. I got to give you some props on that. It looks really cool. But other than that, there's 66 of them, huh? Yeah, there's a lot of them for sure.

Speaker A: I know this is an ambitious project, let me tell you, three years later, for sure.

Speaker B: Yeah, man. But I like that, man. It kind of keeps the flow going. But also, man, your book is really easy to sort of navigate and get pulled in by. I think sometimes business books, marketing books, those kinds of things are all great. However, sometimes it takes a little while to kind of work, you know, warm up and get into the flow of the content. I found yours pretty easy to navigate and get into, man. So I got pulled in quite a few times as I was perusing it. The last, you know, few, I would say, like, you know, I usually have about 12 to, uh, 24 hours, right. To do some research. Yeah, so it was good, man. It was good for me to just kind of navigate through it. But I'm really excited because I picked up some questions along the way and. But before we get into all that, man, I, you know, for me, I love getting to Know you, you know, laying down the personal background, I'd love to know a story or two of you growing up and sort of what led you down this path. And of course, you know, there are many people who inspired me to get on my path, you know, including my father and things like that. And I'd love to know if there was someone in your life that um, perhaps inspired you and you know, maybe pushed you along the way in your path and journey right now. So let's start with that. Let's go, let's jump back in time a little bit and share a little bit of a personal background, if you will.

Speaker A: No problem. You know, I think there's like a lot of people that I can draw from, but probably my first was my father, a uh, self made entrepreneur. Watching him um, be incredibly successful to the point where he retired, it seemed like quite at an early age, in his 30s, and ended up volunteering for the span of about what seemed like about five or six years. And that had him volunteering and traveling around the world. And we ended up moving to the Philippines for a number of years. And I was a missionary kid, you know, I had a pet monkey and, and all the rest. And he went to private school and up in a Quezon City and in the Philippines. And I was there for a couple years. And that experience, really the combination of being an entrepreneur and having impact is really the origin story of groundswell. I mean, if I really think back about, you know, what was the inspiration and just seeing, you know, someone who dedicated his life to making income and, and then basically not working and volunteering and when he came back, you know, through changes in the economy and situations, he had to go back to work, he had to go back into business. And it was really heartbreaking to see him, you know, initially struggle to come back. And I guess for me looking at like, wow, there's someone that was just, I admire and I'm like, he wanted to make impact. And I'm like, is there a way, uh, maybe as a question I've been asking myself subconsciously, uh, to sustainably do that, to be of impact on going and start a business. So if I had someone I would want to haptip, it would be my father for sure. But business and sort of shaping sort of what's grown into what's, you know, I guess now my practice of over 25 years in marketing, advertising, I would say the second is of many is Don Peppers. And Don Peppers, you know, he's an author. Him and Martha Rogers have written several books and one day I saw him speaking, talking about one to one marketing, about personalization. It just, just captivated me about the possibility of creating business engagement and experience on a one to one personal level. So I really see that as being another major component that kind of combined my practice where I was applying what he created as a framework which is called Get, Grow, keep in business. How do you get customers, grow customers and keep customers? I actually applied that to all my clients over decades and I've modified it and that's really what this book is about.

Speaker B: I love that man. It's such a powerful sort of. I uh, would say origin story, which we'll get into a little bit later of course, but I love that, I love giving shout outs to people who, you know, whether they know it or not sometimes, right. They help shape our thinking, help shape our stories. Especially, you know, of course, especially the ones that are super close. Sometimes they don't actually. Sometimes it's like people that you just kind of meet or strangers or someone that has an impact on you. And I think, you know, where I uh, like to take this conversation is about that it's about building connections, about building, you know, those core values in and around your business. And you really emphasize that, the importance of building connections with your audience throughout your book and how you approach growth. Can you share a story about a time when you personally established a connection with a client or someone that you know you had a significant impact on, on your business and how you were able to grow, uh, or perhaps their business and how they were able to grow?

Speaker A: That's an interesting question. You know, it's like across the board over, we're talking hundreds of brand redesigns, clients, probably now in the thousands of campaigns there's patterns and we identify patterns. And you know, usually when people are looking at marketing or doing things, they identify patterns and then you, you look at, let's differentiate those patterns, find which ones do create a difference and then you create your new patterns. And the patterns that I saw was that these successful businesses that were actually bringing down their cost of marketing, doing things differently were building relationships with their customers in a more meaningful way. And then the differentiation of pattern was businesses that were brands that actually meant something to the relationship. It wasn't a transaction, it was something deeper. And that deeper relationship culminated into a more lasting and, and uh, a bidirectional relationship if you will. And then finally creating patterns is. I started testing and trying building community and applying some of my thinking with various different clients and those relationships. Um, a having a relationship with your client that allow you to do certain things for their business is one, you have to have a deep trust relationship. But I would argue that any business relationship that I've been in for the most part, I've had a deep relationship. My focus has been how clients and businesses deepen those relationships in a way to make deeper meaning. And that deeper meaning is what I call a growth loop. And when I break down my book and my four sections, it's the last component, which is transform, which is when you ultimately actually create a deep, meaningful relationship that is so meaningful it goes through three different stages. The first is move. You move a relationship, you move products, you move things that transactional, it's functional. That's how you move your hand from one antiperspirant to move over to grab that other one, which is Old Spice or something, right? But the next step is when you change. I was a PC user, now I'm a Mac user. I was a uh, ah, right guard. Now I'm an Old Spice, right? That's change. And sometimes there's emotion that's there, but that takes a little bit more of a relationship or an emotional state to do that in business. So when you're trying to change behavior, be an agent of change, that's a lot of marketers are you. You have to have some level of relationship with them. And on a commodity like any person is like it's more of a brand emotional connection. On a deeper sense, when you have direct contact with your clients, you have to have engagement, you have to have some sort of level of dialogue and relationship with them. And then last is transform. When you actually are able to transform the way that they see the world, transform the way they will never buy any person in the same way, they'll never do business in the same way. That's when they basically are compelled to tell other people. See, the first one I move, I don't tell anyone when it changes. When I've changed from one to another, I might tell it's word of mouth. That's where most businesses live. But when you change somebody and just think of your personal relationships. When I look at any relationship from a client to anything, when you just, you know, you move them with a message or an idea, they're not going to go show up from the rooftops. But if you change their way of thinking, they're going to probably tell the people like this guy has really good ideas. But when you transform them, they will tell everyone that they know. So to me those are called depth of impact. Which is what you're describing, which is depth of relationship.

Speaker B: That's really powerful, man, because kind of differentiates you from the idea of creating, uh, I know you talk about this in your book too. It's like you call it the hackticks, right? Like the hacks and the tactics that we use to grow, uh, a certain campaign or the ad spend and all that good stuff. And you get this uptick in your sales, of course, but then it kind of falls back down to the baseline, and that's kind of unhealthy. Right? And we got to look at this thing, whatever it is, that we're marketing our business, all those good things, in a more sustained fashion. And you kind of blend, you know, traditional forms of marketing, of course, with modern ways of thinking without the need of, like, trying to hack our way through something. And I really appreciate that. But, you know, one of the key themes I really enjoyed in your book is the value of patience and achieving sustainable growth. Can you describe a time when you had to, like, resist the urge to, to take a shortcut or implement a quick fix? Because, dude, there's been so many times, like, I owned an apparel printing company for almost 15 years, and there were so many times where that urge to take the quick fix, of course, when I was younger did not pan out right. But later I learned, you know, I got to be patient, I got to apply the right processes, all these kinds of things. But can you tell me about a time where you kind of resisted that urge and sort of how that paid off for you in the long run?

Speaker A: Yeah, this is a big topic. You know, the heading on that chapter is patience is the new growth hack. I'm a recovering shoot, aim, fire, you know, individual that was chasing all these haptics and the shortcuts in the effort of growth. And so there's multiple examples. And I have one example that's probably the most salient for me. I started a company called Smallness. It was my own company with. I, uh, had a business partner and Melanie. She's lovely. And we ended up working for a year building, uh, a subscriber base. We had an app, we had followers. We had hundreds of videos shot in Bali, Mexico, I think Nicaragua, Costa Rica and California. And those videos, we're trying to create a more modular workout model where somebody could have this, like, surfer style workout and have these workouts and not have to do the same workout twice. Like, just, uh, somebody who really valued variety. Like, valued, like, I just want to show up and just always be inspired by the Place I'm in, I'm working out. And then you could group them and you could go, no, I want to do the same repeat pattern ones if you wanted as well. But the goal was you technically could actually do, uh, not the same workout in over six months would be the potential. So we did this. It was all video, was all delivered online platform. And a year later we broke even and had different expectations. And so she said, look, you know, this isn't making the money that I wanted. Uh, you know, I think this isn't for me. I'm going to move on to things. I don't know, this is what I want to do. And I was like, no, just hang on. It's like we just built this thing. It's like I can't even believe we broke even the first year. Right? She didn't want to and that was fine. And we shut down the business. Eight months later, Covid happened. That was a salty taste. That would have been a multi, multi, multi millionaire with that product. And you know, it really galvanized that chapter. That is really what I really reflected on. Multiple past patterns, different patterns that I saw and I saw in businesses and I've always seen in businesses where often you're focused on what's the immediate ROI as opposed to what's the depth of relationship this is creating with the brand, with my audience, the people that I want to aim to impact, and the long term residual effect of my brand when I think you need to be mindful of cash flow and this type of activity. But far too often, most businesses, either by the fact that they are not managing their bottom line carefully or well, or not willing to invest, or they're just not patient, they tend to find themselves in multiple situations where they're really leaving a lot of value on the table by not being patient and playing through man.

Speaker B: What a valuable lesson to learn, right? In patience that is so powerful in the sort of belief in sticking something out a little bit longer. But everyone, you know, everyone changes. Everyone comes to things a little bit differently, of course. But yeah, that's a very valuable story. I'm glad you shared that because, you know, I want our audience to know that like man, entrepreneurship is one of those things that it's like magic. It feels like it's happening in front of you and you don't know what's happening. But the back end of what's actually happening, how the trick actually comes to life is so hard and demanding and, you know, requires a ton of patience. And I think, you know, testing Something out for a year. People test things out for. And you know this, right? You interview a lot of people, um, for years, if not decades, sometimes for something works. And, um, sometimes you're a little bit ahead of the curve, and sometimes you're behind the curve. And, you know, that happens in business, of course, but ultimately we have to learn from it. And so learning from that, you talk about your approach, advocates for, you know, giving value to your audience without sort of expectation. You know, this idea of, you know, the give and take. Right. But in your, in your scenario and how you approach this is just give without expectation. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Speaker A: Yeah. I think the world that we're in is so competitive now that the idea of just somebody going, hey, let's just go get customers. The thought of just the strategy of, like, their cattle to be, you know, roped, you know, type of thing, it's just a mind shift change going, what's our gift to the world? What are we giving? What are we actually doing here to make a difference? Now, what I'm describing in this book, for the most part, is really aimed at impact creators. I mean, this is really a perfect hit for them, but it affects everybody. Or they could be applied by everybody. But to me, at the end of the day, if you're looking and you look at the models that have been created, look at freemium models, look at Dropbox, its growth model, Its growth loop was started with a giveaway, right? They shifted their monies off of marketing. They gave the money to the people that were sharing space. They got more space, and they gave space to the people they shared it with. That was a give. And that was actually Sean Ellis's, uh, innovation from Hacking growth, who was on my podcast, and he's made a comment in my book, and because this really is a little bit of a secret for marketing, but now it's become a little bit of table stake. So if you think of freemium, how many times have you seen, hey, we'll try it for a month, or it's the puppy dog clothes. They'll try it and then decide if you want to, you know, continue on. Now that free doesn't always mean free. The focus is give is the new get. It's like, what are you giving? If you start from a place of what are we giving the audience that we want? And so you look, the rise of content marketing, that's about give, give, then get. If you think of a very famous Gary Vaynerchuk, who I'm in his 5DS program since, like, I don't know, I think I was like that back in 2000, and I think it was even 20, 19 or 17, actually. And he had a book called Jab, Jab right hook. That's really jab, jab, jab is give, give, give. It's what you really need to be thinking about in business now is not just like, what am I giving? Just, uh, but if you give it the energy of like, I want to get, it just doesn't work as well. When I see people that businesses and brands that give something with no expectation return going, this is our gift. This is our gift for you. Because the shift that happens in that moment, it's not a transaction. It's the difference between what I call buy and buy. In Chuck from, um, Public Enemy, he's got a famous quote that says, you know, people don't buy from you until they buy into you. And I think that that is exactly what I'm talking about, is by doing this, you're getting people. You're not trying to sell them, and they're going, oh, you got me. You know, it's like, I want you to buy into me. And, uh, it, to me, it changes the dynamic of the relationship which we started with, which is this now starts the relationship in a much more deep and meaningful level.

Speaker B: Man, I love that so much. And it really ties into, you know, just the foundation of how you set yourself up, you know, and you talk about this. We mentioned earlier the importance of finding your company sort of this epic origins and the story that unfolds around that in order to create a compelling sort of brand identity. Can you tell me about a time when you sort of helped a company discover or rediscover their sort of epic origins and how that impacted their growth, their not just financial growth, but just growth as a company to realign that.

Speaker A: Yeah, the epic origins, the details of that chapter were simply this. It starts with the founder. So oftentimes founders want to hand over the keys to a branding agency or marketing company. Go, tell me what. Well, how do we market ourselves? Networks, you know, uh, to me, this is very different. This is going back to your. Is getting the origin story of you, the founder, what's in alignment with your values? What's your epic outcome that you want to have? I find these brands that have these leaders that have these desire to go back to their origin story. And that's why, you know, even when you started this, like, let's go back to some of the stories that started this out. It's because we love, as people, the story. We like the intentionality. We like the start of somebody really bringing forward the origin of their brand, you know, within themselves. And I think of one of my clients, Mitch Hancock, who. He had a brand that he acquired. It was a brand that had been around for 60 years, and it just became clear that they needed to rebrand, which would have been a tough decision, if you can imagine a brand that's been around for 60 years. And we renamed it, and the naming process, and then why we branded that way was it started with his love for backcountry snowmobiling and just the stories that he would have of connecting with his family and friends in the backcountry, and the fact that going back to the Base Camp, these. These campfires or whatever, where, uh, they started at the parking lot before they went on these expeditions, was the inspiration for his brand called Base Camp. And today, that brand, that origin story, is connected so deeply with people that it's created a groundswell, as I call it, where what has happened is he's a dealership, a dealership for a larger brand called Skidoo, spends millions and millions of dollars to promote their product brand. His customers spend $2,000 or something of that range per Skidoo, wrapping our brand Basecamp, over their Skidoos. And why do they do that? It's because they want to be part of something. It's about belonging. It's about community, and it's because the origin story is true, and it's connected to the founder who's building out and following through on his values, connecting with that audience in a meaningful way. They want to be part of it now. It becomes their tribe, it becomes their shop, it becomes them, and they're part of something. So to me, when you look at, that's just one example of many where I really connect the founder owner with the origin story, because you find these little truths that people feel, taste, understand, and connect with. Yeah, man.

Speaker B: Um, that's so powerful. I love that you went there. Because here's the thing. For me, I started this thing. The reason I wanted to bring this up is. Is connecting stories. My personal story, like, I was a refugee. I grew up in a refugee camp, and then I came here in the states, like, 94 or whatever. You know, I've always had this, like, urge to want to help refugees or at least shed a positive light on not only them, but that situation. And the idea of, like, I didn't just choose, wake up one day, just choose to become a refugee. Like, the circumstances of life led me here, right? And so I owned an apparel printing company and I started this thing called Refutees. And it's like, you know, when you order with us, we give back to the local refugee community and XYZ Way. And man, having, you know, being vulnerable and, like, having written that story and, you know, now I've written, like, my book and all this good stuff. That's great. But, like, connecting that to the campaign that we were doing that we started, which is like the Run, Walk, Play for refugees on World Refugee Day. And, like, man, I can't even express to you how many people, like, connect. Not just because of my story that's there, but just the idea that, like, oh, uh, this makes sense. You know, we call it Refutees. And we just started sort of having fun with, you know, what does this mean? And just shedding a light on this world that is sadly, always looked upon as a sad story. But there are so many amazing, remarkable people, right, that have tons of resilience, knowledge, wisdom, um, stories, families that I really just wanted to share. And so I love this part of your book because I deeply connected to it. And I know when I instilled sort of my story and made that, uh, the antithesis of, like, why we're doing what we're doing, it just. Man, it made people just really want to sign up, be a part of it, you know, ask me to come and chat. And so I totally agree with you in the sense that the power of recognizing not only why are you doing something, but really who you are and how that connects to things. Which is why, like, earlier in the conversation, I'm like, who inspired you? Because there's always someone or perhaps something. Sometimes it's like, I've had an amazing guest talk about his pet, you know, his pet dog and how that inspired him, you know, and it doesn't really matter. It's just like, what thing transformed you? Who came along and shared a story or an experience that transformed you? How do you talk about that? And that's really cool, man. I'm glad you brought that up in your book, because it's very important.

Speaker A: It's human. It's human. It's like, it's a truth. And that's what people are. Are. They're not customers. It's humans, not customers. People do not want to be. They're looking and wanting and hoping for things that are true and authentic and meaningful in their life. The days are gone. I mean, there's always going to be room for Commodity or price or these type of things. But there is a segment, a growing segment, a groundswell of people that want their money to do more. That's what this book is about. It's about being a groundswell for good. It's believing this world, a better place, people plan it, and purpose. You know, really looking at connecting with people and why. I mean, it's like almost going back to how we've began. It's like creating more of a community of, uh, people that care and more craftsmanlike. And there's a joy in the fact that you know what you're supporting, as opposed to the fact that I just got this great product, but I have no idea what's behind it. Or you find out later that there's some sort of nefarious way that some child labor was used for it, and it just. You feel you're part of it.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: So I think that this is shifting.

Speaker B: Definitely, man. I totally agree. I mean, I feel like with so much sort of just presence of fake avenues that. Right. That live online, unfortunately, we are seeking more of our truth. We are seeking more people who are truthful and just honest. And the best way to do that is to share your story and be vulnerable and really expose what you're trying to do in the most authentic way that you can. And I think sharing our stories does that in amazing ways. But with all that, like, what was your. I know writing a book is. It's no easy feat, man. I mean, it is a huge thing to undertake and go forth on, especially while running a business and in your case, especially while, you know, doing a podcast and all these things. But what did you learn from putting this book together? What was your favorite part of that journey?

Speaker A: Getting my ideas organized. You know, I think that that's probably, uh, the clarity of which I can communicate my ideas now because I've, uh, gone through the process of writing a book is exponential. The lesson I learned on this first book is now how to write a book. The impact I'm having is I'm able to more succinctly organize my thoughts to basically create the outcome I desire, which is really about positive impact for people and communicating my message to so many people that have a beautiful message. They have an incredible mission, they have a vision for the world. But they come to me usually for marketing, because they're trying to really get that messaging out right. And I really now advocate heavily going write a book because it gives you something to kind of point to for sure. I mean, I can't wait for the people impact that are reading it. But even if nobody ever reads this, I've already had massive success because I've been writing this thing for three years. The success I've had while I've been writing this, my business is blown up because I understand and clearly communicate the power of what I'm doing. So, yeah, amazing.

Speaker B: Very powerful. Very powerful. I can't agree with you more. Uh, same sort of recognition happened for me when I wrote my book. I was just able to organize the stories, the thoughts, the messaging. It was not only developing but really putting them in place. That is very true throughout the journey that does happen. And the clearer you become about your message, of course, the easier it is for us to then take it and expand on it. Right. Or, uh, put it out in the world in a way that actually impacts

Speaker A: a confused mind never buys dropping gems on a man.

Speaker B: I love that.

Speaker A: It's not my quote, it's someone else's. But it's true, right? Like, you know, so buy or buy in whatever you're selling. We're all selling. Like we're selling, we're selling, you know, where are we going to go for our date night with our spouse? We're selling, you know, our ideas. We all in some way, shape or form are looking to make impact, make meaning in our life. So the clarity in which that you create it. But if you understand the steps of influence, a deeper sense of what can move people, stir people, and more importantly, create a groundswell. And that's really what this book is about. It's not just communicating that message. It's like having a combined message, purpose and almost like blueprint so that you can really create a massive outcome. And the real baseline of this book is around sustainable growth marketing. And if you want to create a message, how many of you have created a message and it worked for a bit and it kind of went away. It's like, it's like campaign messaging, right? It's like it worked and that didn't sustain. And you're constantly, you know, changing and evolving. That's normal. But when you can really figure out how can I create something that this message is resonated. So it's sort of like that, that exercise where you tell somebody a sentence and you say it to the person beside you and they go all around the room. By the time it goes the other end, it's not even the same message, right. It's because, you know, part of is like you had to remember the words, the sequence and exactly the order. But when you know the feeling. I call it the brand mantra. What's the feeling you want people to have? People remember how you made them feel, not how you communicate to them. The stories that you tell. People remember stories. It deepens it. But if you have a compelling message and a mission and a vision of creating impact in the world, that's what I call creating a groundswell. When you actually create a growth loop, when you're giving something to the world, you can grow deeper with them and transform the way they think. What happens is other people are compelled to tell your story. And if you can clearly communicate it, all the better. This is what creates a rapid and exponential groundswell.

Speaker B: Yeah, man. Very powerful. Speaking about feelings, I mean, I feel like going through your book, I certainly felt in a way heard. I don't know if that makes any sense. Like, there are so many things in your book that sort of lay out this, you know, the foundation of everything you're talking about. But in a way, as a person who's gone through business and, you know, managed and done the marketing and all these kinds of things and now sort of now really shaved a lot and just focusing on this very mission driven, social impact thing that I want to create right around, you know, refugees, I felt like, heard and I felt especially around the epic origins and, you know, this like being patient and sort of extending the work long term and having a longer vision and just keep planting seeds, you know, that's how I felt. But what do you hope that readers feel when they walk away from the book?

Speaker A: Beyond hope. They feel so inspired to build their own groundswell, to find their gift to the world and create a movement so that we all like, really, it's going to take all of us. It's not going to be government. It's not going to be wait for the next person. And to me, my impact and my hope for people is they'll be inspired not just to go do good. Uh, this isn't about that. This is about business. It's a business book. It's about either shifting my business to become something of impact, to make a difference, to do business differently, to inspire other people to become a business of impact. But most importantly, it's my tagline for businesses. Transforming business as usual into business is beautiful. To me, I believe the scourge of the world is here. I am a marketer, and I'm trying to tell people how to market without marketing, that marketing can be economic waste. It's mostly interruptive. It's actually becoming increasingly impotent. And the reason why is because we want to find a place we're paying money like Netflix to not be advertised to. Or they follow us around. It's like that interruption that to me is short term thinking is, hey, I just want to put some money and interrupt people and browbeat them with my message. Maybe they'll buy. It takes more work and time to magnetize, to, to inspire, to create word of mouth. To me, what I'm hoping is that I'm inspiring other people to market differently, to create a, you know, why can't marketing and be, uh, a beautiful experience? Why does it have to be something that people go, I got to do it, or it becomes a separate exercise of the business itself. So my book, When I Communicated is a salient point where you're inspired to go, I am actually marketing by just being, not doing and by being right, doing the right things, by sharing my message and embedding that into what I do. It can be its own form of marketing. And a simple example of that would be a business that tries to go and they produce ads, they produce campaigns versus creating a program. And maybe that program is to work in the community that they want to serve and they provide something of service that helps them, inspires them. I've done this multiple times, different programs where that actually activity is. It's sort of, it is marketing, but it's helping. That's the give, right? It's like, what are you giving? If you're really thinking about what am I giving my audience, the people, clients, the world that I want to serve, it changes everything. And that's my hope, is that people are inspired to give more and to really look at this framework as a way of impact and look at how can marketing be something that's not interruptive and you know what I call eye and noise pollution. Really?

Speaker B: Yeah, man. I love that so much. It's a very honest and transparent way of doing marketing. I'm excited for your book to go out and make this impact in the world. Scott, thank you for sharing your stories and experiences with me. I'm very grateful to have had you on the show today. I've learned so much. Of course, all the gems all throughout the book is called Groundswell the Unseen Wave of Business Growth. You guys, if you're out there listening to this, please go get this book. It is remarkable. Besides checking out the book on Amazon, where can people find you and connect with you?

Speaker A: Very simply, groundswellorigins is my business dot com. If you go to groundswelling.com that'll be the direct link to the book. So if you bought the book, go to groundswelling.com and there'll be some expanded case studies, access to the community and a workbook that we're going to be producing that's going to break down the origins, build, give, grow, transform framework and you'll, uh, be able to connect with other people and hear the stories of people are actually building groundswells. And then lastly, just Scott Martin. Scott, Adam Martin on Instagram and Twitter. Easy just hit search groundswell Scott Martin. You'll find me.

Speaker B: Scott, absolute honor today, my friend. Thank you for coming on the show.

Speaker A: Thank you. Thanks for having me. Yeah.

Speaker B: Good luck on your book.

Speaker A: Mahalo.

Speaker B: Thanks for joining us for this episode of Author Hour. You can find groundswell the unseen wave of business growth right now on Amazon. For more Author Hour episodes, subscribe to this podcast on your favorite subscription service. Thanks for joining us. We'll see you next time. Same place, different author.