How to (Actually) Use Intent Data Effectively - Real Use Cases

1 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:35,079 SPEAKER_00: Hi everyone, welcome back to Demand Decoded. 2 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:38,039 Dan here with you, joined by Phil in the studio today. 3 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:41,240 And in today's episode, we're going to be talking about intent 4 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,240 data in B2B GoToMarket. 5 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,119 And in particular, I suppose we'll touch a little bit on 6 00:00:46,119 --> 00:00:49,239 actually what intent data is, where it comes from, but I want 7 00:00:49,239 --> 00:00:53,239 to focus most of the time on the practical use cases and how you 8 00:00:53,239 --> 00:00:57,799 actually apply intent data to B2B Go to Market because a lot 9 00:00:57,799 --> 00:01:01,560 of people promise a lot of things when it comes to intent 10 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:05,560 data, and it does seem to be reaching some sort of consensus 11 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:10,680 that the future go to market will be largely dominated by 12 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,719 what you can do with intent data and you know how you can use 13 00:01:13,719 --> 00:01:17,799 intent data in your marketing and sales motions. 14 00:01:17,960 --> 00:01:23,799 But I haven't seen tons of like real life applications of intent 15 00:01:23,799 --> 00:01:27,799 data showing us what it can do rather than the just the 16 00:01:27,799 --> 00:01:30,120 classic, oh well, you can prospect with some of this 17 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:30,359 stuff. 18 00:01:30,439 --> 00:01:34,840 Like, how is like marketing orgs as well, and even sales orgs, 19 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:38,359 how can we think outside the box to use intent data and how do we 20 00:01:38,359 --> 00:01:41,879 apply it effectively to get the maximum value out of these 21 00:01:41,879 --> 00:01:43,159 pretty expensive tools? 22 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:43,719 SPEAKER_01: Right. 23 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:47,560 It's one of those areas where you don't indeed you don't see 24 00:01:47,879 --> 00:01:53,000 many going deep on how they've operationalized it, and it's one 25 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:57,000 of the marketing topics that tends to be dominated by the 26 00:01:57,000 --> 00:02:02,120 software vendor choice paradigm, which is who's the best vendor 27 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:05,079 to do this for me and what and what should I use? 28 00:02:05,319 --> 00:02:10,840 Um and and not a lot on I applied it in this way, and it 29 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,120 delivered this result for me. 30 00:02:12,519 --> 00:02:15,319 So it would be good to lift the lid on that and hopefully you 31 00:02:15,319 --> 00:02:16,920 know encourage others to do the same. 32 00:02:17,079 --> 00:02:17,719 SPEAKER_00: Yeah. 33 00:02:25,079 --> 00:02:27,879 Just a quick one before we get into the episode because I've 34 00:02:27,879 --> 00:02:30,680 got an offer that I'm sure all of you will be interested in. 35 00:02:30,920 --> 00:02:34,519 AEO is something that every B2B marketing team is trying to 36 00:02:34,519 --> 00:02:37,560 figure out right now, and most just don't know where to start. 37 00:02:37,719 --> 00:02:41,159 But at Blend, we're offering a full AEO analysis of your 38 00:02:41,159 --> 00:02:44,759 brand's AI visibility, and we'll walk you through exactly what we 39 00:02:44,759 --> 00:02:46,280 found and what to do about it. 40 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:49,960 From full prompt analysis against your competitors to a 41 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,159 citation analysis where we'll look at different content types 42 00:02:53,159 --> 00:02:56,280 and how you're being cited for those and mentioned in those, 43 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,479 and what you can actually do to be mentioned and cited much more 44 00:02:59,479 --> 00:03:02,439 for your brand, and what content you should create going forwards 45 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:04,680 and how you comprise that strategy really. 46 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:08,280 We will drop a note in the uh description of this episode in 47 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:10,599 the show notes, and you can go over there, request your free 48 00:03:10,599 --> 00:03:13,319 AEO audit, and we will deliver that to you. 49 00:03:15,319 --> 00:03:19,000 I think just quickly defining what intent data actually is, 50 00:03:19,159 --> 00:03:21,560 because really we've got we've got a couple of different 51 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:24,759 buckets here when it comes to intent intent data, and this 52 00:03:24,759 --> 00:03:28,840 might be teaching some people how to suck eggs, but um, you 53 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:33,960 know, first party intent data is very different to the intent 54 00:03:34,199 --> 00:03:37,240 data tools and platforms out there which are capturing 55 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:38,439 third-party intent. 56 00:03:38,599 --> 00:03:42,120 So, first party intent data is everything your own system, your 57 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:48,520 CRM, is capturing around, you know, like uh email submissions 58 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:52,599 on forms, and then you know, the activity from those based on 59 00:03:52,599 --> 00:03:56,280 cookies that have been applied to your website and track 60 00:03:56,280 --> 00:03:59,319 activity in your ecosystem of control. 61 00:03:59,479 --> 00:03:59,800 SPEAKER_02: Yeah. 62 00:03:59,960 --> 00:04:03,000 SPEAKER_00: Um, and then you've got third-party intent, which is 63 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:08,199 like behavioural data captured outside of your own ecosystem of 64 00:04:08,199 --> 00:04:08,520 things. 65 00:04:08,599 --> 00:04:13,319 So you've got providers, um, like review sites and like 66 00:04:13,319 --> 00:04:21,159 aggregated data that will share that data with third-party um 67 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:25,240 intent data platforms to kind of like aggregate information about 68 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,759 your company and other companies and like share this data. 69 00:04:28,919 --> 00:04:31,399 And you know, this is all small print stuff, like when you sign 70 00:04:31,399 --> 00:04:34,120 up for tools, and there's probably tons and tons of tools 71 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:38,680 that I definitely don't know about that are sharing data 72 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:43,800 about you know research topics and things with intent data 73 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:46,840 platforms that that none of us know about because when we just 74 00:04:46,840 --> 00:04:49,639 click like agreed to terms and conditions, we're uh we're 75 00:04:49,639 --> 00:04:51,319 agreeing to the sharing of this information. 76 00:04:51,639 --> 00:04:52,040 Quite. 77 00:04:52,199 --> 00:04:57,720 Um, I suppose reverse IP intent uh is kind of like a bit of a 78 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:01,079 separate platform because it's not third-party intent data 79 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:02,040 necessarily. 80 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:05,879 SPEAKER_01: That's like first party data at the anonymous 81 00:05:05,879 --> 00:05:09,160 level, sort of thing, in terms of knowing which IPs have been 82 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:10,040 on your domain. 83 00:05:10,199 --> 00:05:12,680 Um, most of us can track that through the tools that we have 84 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:15,639 available to us, but it doesn't quite cross over into what the 85 00:05:15,639 --> 00:05:19,720 third-party platforms are able to aggregate and present as one. 86 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:22,040 Um, so I think you're right about the distinction there. 87 00:05:22,279 --> 00:05:22,519 SPEAKER_00: Yeah. 88 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:24,360 So, you know, we've got is there any? 89 00:05:24,439 --> 00:05:25,800 I'm not missing any there, am I? 90 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:30,040 SPEAKER_01: Um no, you know, I think that first party is 91 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,959 fantastic because it's where you have the ability to de-anonymise 92 00:05:33,959 --> 00:05:39,639 the data, so so you know more or less exactly who is doing what. 93 00:05:39,959 --> 00:05:43,319 But of course, the limitation there is how much of that you 94 00:05:43,319 --> 00:05:46,040 can possibly know, and it will only get you so far. 95 00:05:46,199 --> 00:05:48,920 It's it's the end of the food chain, not the beginning. 96 00:05:49,319 --> 00:05:53,639 The third-party uh platforms provide uh something that's 97 00:05:53,639 --> 00:05:58,360 very, very different in the form of aggregated behavioural data 98 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,199 across many, many sources, yeah. 99 00:06:00,519 --> 00:06:06,120 But any attempt to de-anonymise it or you know bring it down to 100 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:10,279 the personal level will be to some extent inferred. 101 00:06:10,439 --> 00:06:10,680 Yeah. 102 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:14,279 You know, that that there's going to be some assumptions 103 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,959 being made there because they won't know for the most part, I 104 00:06:17,959 --> 00:06:21,160 think, who the individuals are that are performing the actions. 105 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:22,040 SPEAKER_00: Yeah. 106 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:27,720 That yeah, so like when you come to third party and reverse IP 107 00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:32,120 intent data, this is pretty much there are there are a couple of 108 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:34,920 tools out there like RB2B, which I haven't tried out to be fair, 109 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:37,720 which might be amazing, but I'm talking from you know experience 110 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:39,240 here because that's all we can do. 111 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:44,600 Um third party and reverse IP lookup is at an account level. 112 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:45,639 Yeah, yeah. 113 00:06:45,959 --> 00:06:49,079 For the like 90% of the time, it's gonna be at an account 114 00:06:49,079 --> 00:06:49,240 level. 115 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:50,040 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely. 116 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:52,759 And I think one of the most important things um, you know, 117 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:57,000 when when it comes to uh you know using intent data is 118 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:00,040 understanding what it is, you know, and and what underpins it. 119 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,079 And for the most part, we all have a right to privacy, yeah, 120 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:08,519 which is why we're not in these data sets, you know, until we 121 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:12,360 give up that right to privacy, you know, for certain 122 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:13,160 applications. 123 00:07:13,399 --> 00:07:16,279 And so, you know, technologically the providers 124 00:07:16,279 --> 00:07:17,399 can't overcome that. 125 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:20,680 Uh it's a it's a it's a barrier that they can't cross. 126 00:07:20,839 --> 00:07:25,800 Um, you know, there are and there are technologies which 127 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:29,079 make it all possible, uh, you know, and the static IP 128 00:07:29,079 --> 00:07:32,839 addresses of companies with known domain names and DNS 129 00:07:32,839 --> 00:07:35,879 settings is the sort of like foundational level of 130 00:07:35,879 --> 00:07:36,439 technology. 131 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,480 It it all tracks back to those sorts of like fundamental 132 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:43,240 principles, and when you when you know that and when you think 133 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:46,199 about it like that, you understand what you can get out 134 00:07:46,199 --> 00:07:48,439 of them and what you can't get out of them, and that helps you 135 00:07:48,439 --> 00:07:48,839 to use it. 136 00:07:49,079 --> 00:07:52,600 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, it so yeah, it helps you to use it, 137 00:07:52,839 --> 00:07:56,519 but it also creates some potential problems around how we 138 00:07:56,519 --> 00:08:00,839 frame and think about intent data because I I almost think 139 00:08:00,839 --> 00:08:05,240 about it in like the traditional lead generation sense where you 140 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,959 know we might capture somebody's email address and then send them 141 00:08:07,959 --> 00:08:10,920 content thinking that if they're looking at this content, it 142 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:12,199 means they want to buy from us. 143 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:12,519 Right. 144 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:14,680 I mean, that's even at a first party level. 145 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,959 Intent data at the third party level gets even further away 146 00:08:17,959 --> 00:08:18,199 from that. 147 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:22,439 When we think about a primary use case of third-party intent 148 00:08:22,439 --> 00:08:27,879 um data is topical and I can't remember what most of them call 149 00:08:27,879 --> 00:08:27,959 it. 150 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:29,319 I think it's like topic data. 151 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,200 So if somebody's searching research interest, you know, 152 00:08:32,279 --> 00:08:32,759 that kind of thing. 153 00:08:32,839 --> 00:08:37,559 If somebody's searching for a particular category or topic, um 154 00:08:37,879 --> 00:08:41,639 then you can collate those accounts that are searching for 155 00:08:41,639 --> 00:08:42,360 those things. 156 00:08:42,519 --> 00:08:44,360 But you don't know who is searching. 157 00:08:44,519 --> 00:08:49,240 You know, if you think of a company with 5,000 employees, 158 00:08:49,399 --> 00:08:53,399 and if somebody's searching for email marketing tool, that could 159 00:08:53,399 --> 00:08:56,839 be an intern, it could be the CMO, very unlikely. 160 00:08:57,079 --> 00:09:00,839 Like it it could be somebody in sales or customer success that 161 00:09:00,839 --> 00:09:04,279 are trying to like launch an email, or in I don't know, the 162 00:09:04,279 --> 00:09:05,159 service department. 163 00:09:05,399 --> 00:09:07,159 It could be literally anyone. 164 00:09:07,399 --> 00:09:12,039 So we do have to be careful when trying to almost create this 165 00:09:12,039 --> 00:09:16,600 false confidence in intent data that, oh, if that company is 166 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:19,559 researching for you know this particular topic in our 167 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:21,559 category, they must be buying. 168 00:09:21,879 --> 00:09:25,480 SPEAKER_01: It's not it's a signal, yeah, but it's not a 169 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:28,919 signal of absolute confidence that that is the case. 170 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,559 As you say, there are you know, there's a great many uh 171 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:36,600 employees at these companies uh, you know, who are on the web you 172 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:39,159 know stumbling across content in some respects. 173 00:09:39,399 --> 00:09:45,399 So you need to use other filters logically to uh minimize the 174 00:09:45,399 --> 00:09:49,000 false positives that you act on in hope that they are true 175 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:49,480 positives. 176 00:09:49,799 --> 00:09:53,720 And like as you suggested, but that harks back, you know, to 177 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,720 the to the days of lead scoring and uh and using some first 178 00:09:57,879 --> 00:10:01,960 party intent data, such as they downloaded this guide, yeah, as 179 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,759 a as a strong signal of something that it wasn't. 180 00:10:04,919 --> 00:10:08,360 And that's very, very true here um as well. 181 00:10:08,519 --> 00:10:13,320 It doesn't it doesn't correlation isn't causation, we 182 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:17,879 need to use other methods of filtering and and activating 183 00:10:17,879 --> 00:10:19,559 that data to try and increase our confidence. 184 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:21,399 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, for sure. 185 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,759 Um not to say it doesn't work, not to say we can't use it, and 186 00:10:24,759 --> 00:10:27,320 we're gonna talk next about ways we can use it. 187 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:33,399 Absolutely, it's just um yeah, making sure that uh we 188 00:10:33,399 --> 00:10:37,399 understand the risks uh uh around how we position it like 189 00:10:37,639 --> 00:10:41,000 in the business and its true use case potentially. 190 00:10:41,399 --> 00:10:44,600 SPEAKER_01: You know, that that reality will explain why for 191 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:49,080 most people you know the response rate, the return rate 192 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:53,720 will be low digits, just as they are for cold email, because 193 00:10:54,039 --> 00:10:58,519 because there isn't a high degree of confidence and overlap 194 00:10:58,679 --> 00:11:04,279 in the sample set if you take a give me it all and I'll and I'll 195 00:11:04,279 --> 00:11:06,279 message everybody type of approach. 196 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:09,000 Yeah, some of them will be researching and in market and 197 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:11,960 might respond to your message, but a great deal won't because 198 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:14,679 it will be in sort of an erroneous signal about their 199 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:15,159 intentions. 200 00:11:15,399 --> 00:11:18,440 SPEAKER_00: Uh one thing to touch on on third-party intent 201 00:11:18,519 --> 00:11:22,759 as well is the other angle, other than um you know the 202 00:11:22,759 --> 00:11:25,639 topical side of things, you've actually got all of the company 203 00:11:25,639 --> 00:11:28,519 and personnel information that comes along with like company 204 00:11:28,519 --> 00:11:31,639 news, scoops it's called in some platforms. 205 00:11:31,799 --> 00:11:35,879 Uh but if we just call it news and like company updates and 206 00:11:35,879 --> 00:11:39,480 information, within this bucket, you've got things like funding 207 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:43,639 rounds, you've got like new C-suite executives, you've got 208 00:11:43,639 --> 00:11:46,919 changes to the I mean, there are so many, like the list goes on 209 00:11:46,919 --> 00:11:47,320 and on. 210 00:11:47,399 --> 00:11:47,559 Yep. 211 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:52,440 Um, like could be new technology added to the stack, um new 212 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:55,799 product launched, like lots and lots of intent signals here. 213 00:11:56,039 --> 00:12:00,360 And the the thing to bear in mind here is how you can match 214 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:04,840 your buying triggers and category entry points to the 215 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:07,639 intent signals because that's going to bring you closer and 216 00:12:07,639 --> 00:12:09,159 more relevant with those things. 217 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:16,360 So, for example, if you're marketing a um finance platform 218 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:21,240 and you found that most customers come to you after 219 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:23,720 they've raised funding, for example. 220 00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:27,480 Well, we can find the intent trigger for companies just 221 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:27,960 raised. 222 00:12:28,039 --> 00:12:31,000 It might even be very specific, like Series B funding or 223 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:31,320 something. 224 00:12:31,399 --> 00:12:33,159 Like you that's very niche. 225 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:36,039 Don't know why that would be, but you know, let's just say it 226 00:12:36,039 --> 00:12:36,279 is. 227 00:12:36,519 --> 00:12:39,799 Well, that could be a really good intent trigger point for 228 00:12:39,799 --> 00:12:42,519 you to go after because it matches so nicely with your 229 00:12:42,519 --> 00:12:43,480 category entry point. 230 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:44,120 SPEAKER_01: Yeah. 231 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:48,519 A lot of businesses will find if they analyze their pipeline and 232 00:12:48,519 --> 00:12:53,080 revenue that the triggers, you know, some triggers reappear 233 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:57,000 quite frequently, and they can often be in that news category. 234 00:12:57,159 --> 00:12:57,240 Yeah. 235 00:12:57,399 --> 00:13:02,200 Um, you know, a new hire in the correct seat, a new event in the 236 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:06,840 company's, you know, journey that very highly or highly 237 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:10,440 correlates with your inquiries, pipeline, and revenue. 238 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:14,200 And so if you're able to find that match, then you're able to, 239 00:13:14,279 --> 00:13:18,840 you know, lean into with a high degree of confidence that 240 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:19,480 opportunity. 241 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:23,879 It's a double-edged sword, however, because so are lots of 242 00:13:23,879 --> 00:13:24,360 other people. 243 00:13:24,919 --> 00:13:29,240 You know, it is it's it's true that there will be many other 244 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:34,679 businesses using the very same intent signal to identify the 245 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:36,279 potential opportunities. 246 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:40,440 Yeah, so you have got to think about how you can refine even 247 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:44,360 further and how your message can be differentiated from those 248 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:48,840 others because you will not be the only one triggering off 249 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:52,600 funding round or new CFO, yeah, for example. 250 00:13:52,919 --> 00:13:55,799 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, even when I I um got promoted to director last 251 00:13:55,799 --> 00:13:59,000 year, I think I had like yeah, at least not loads, but like 252 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:03,159 five emails across the next week or so that was like, congrats on 253 00:14:03,159 --> 00:14:04,200 the promotion type thing. 254 00:14:04,279 --> 00:14:05,159 Yeah, here's our product. 255 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:07,000 Okay, yeah. 256 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:10,759 I knew that they had some sort of criteria there. 257 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,480 SPEAKER_01: That's interesting, and five is a lot less than I 258 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:13,799 expected. 259 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:18,279 So maybe a sign that they're using the the news event, but 260 00:14:18,279 --> 00:14:22,120 also geographic targeting, size targeting, yeah, and being a bit 261 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:24,440 more intelligent about it, which is a great thing, because you 262 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:28,120 know, you're more likely to give some attention to five emails 263 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:28,840 than five hundred. 264 00:14:29,159 --> 00:14:31,080 SPEAKER_00: It's probably the business size as well, right? 265 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:35,879 Like if we were exactly if I was a new CMO at Canva. 266 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,000 Different stories, different stories probably get you know 267 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:43,320 five hundred um emails the next day after that news is 268 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:43,639 announced. 269 00:14:43,799 --> 00:14:45,000 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. 270 00:14:45,399 --> 00:14:48,679 You were targeted in the in a you know by those that wanted to 271 00:14:48,679 --> 00:14:49,960 get in your inbox ultimately. 272 00:14:50,039 --> 00:14:52,519 SPEAKER_00: So you know, a use case off of that, like even in 273 00:14:52,519 --> 00:14:55,720 our scenario, is that we found through our Ask Elephant 274 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:58,840 workflows, which run on every single sales, discovery, and 275 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:03,399 consultation call, that there is a key buying trigger and 276 00:15:03,399 --> 00:15:05,720 category entry point, which is new marketing leaders. 277 00:15:05,879 --> 00:15:09,080 Typically, new marketing leader comes in, they want to assess 278 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,559 the landscape around them, they want to look at their current 279 00:15:11,559 --> 00:15:14,200 agency usage, they want to look at their website, their 280 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,879 conversions, their pipeline, and in a lot of cases look for new 281 00:15:17,879 --> 00:15:19,559 vendors to support them in that. 282 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:24,360 And that is a core um moment where a lot of people engage us 283 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:28,200 as a as a like marketing function that can help them 284 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:32,200 drive pipeline, like execute their website properly, etc. 285 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:36,440 Um, so that would be a key thing for us to then go and create, 286 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:41,320 well, we have um, you know, sequences based off of that 287 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:42,679 particular intent trigger. 288 00:15:42,919 --> 00:15:44,120 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly. 289 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:48,039 SPEAKER_00: Um, okay, right, some more use cases to throw out 290 00:15:48,039 --> 00:15:52,840 there because I kind of like to break this down into two 291 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:54,519 different sides. 292 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:59,320 Because I don't want to abandon inbound completely when we think 293 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:02,200 about intent data, and typically the conversation does that 294 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:05,240 because it doesn't touch on how you can use intent data for 295 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:08,600 inbound, it's just how we use intent data to go outbound to 296 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:08,759 people. 297 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:10,039 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, very true. 298 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:13,960 SPEAKER_00: But you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna use HubSpot's 299 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:18,600 biointent uh tool here as an example because it's just in the 300 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,279 tool, which is like really helpful. 301 00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:23,639 Um, but one thing that I think a lot of businesses could be doing 302 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:28,039 and that we're doing, and I'll share some data on how effective 303 00:16:28,039 --> 00:16:33,639 that's been versus other um methods, is curating LinkedIn 304 00:16:33,879 --> 00:16:37,399 audience targeting lists based off of intent data. 305 00:16:37,559 --> 00:16:37,879 Yeah. 306 00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:43,159 So rather than creating your cold list based on um, you know, 307 00:16:43,399 --> 00:16:47,720 your audience uh job titles and functions and size and things 308 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:51,639 like that, or even like an account list that you just are 309 00:16:51,639 --> 00:16:54,919 just cold, but you think they're kind of in the right area, you 310 00:16:54,919 --> 00:16:58,840 can actually use intent data, which is still closer in terms 311 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:01,799 of signals that somebody is buying, particularly at a 312 00:17:01,799 --> 00:17:03,240 reverse IP level as well. 313 00:17:03,399 --> 00:17:06,759 If you can tell an account has been on your website, then we 314 00:17:06,759 --> 00:17:10,200 can use like HubSpot's buyer intent tool, which is already in 315 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:14,440 the platform, create lists for accounts that are, you know, in 316 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,720 this size, like niche them down in in the ways we want, and 317 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:20,279 actually look at accounts that have been on our website in the 318 00:17:20,279 --> 00:17:23,799 last 90 days or accounts that are researching these topics, 319 00:17:24,039 --> 00:17:27,000 pull them into a list in HubSpot, integrate that with 320 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,200 LinkedIn, and then actually start advertising to accounts 321 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,480 that are showing some form of intent, whether that even if 322 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:34,599 it's low intent, right? 323 00:17:34,679 --> 00:17:38,200 Like a research topic, it's still better than completely 324 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:38,519 cold. 325 00:17:38,680 --> 00:17:39,640 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely. 326 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:44,920 Um, what a great way to sort of operationalize intent data in a 327 00:17:45,559 --> 00:17:53,160 pragmatic way that is aligned to the inbound, you know, 328 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:55,799 demand-gen marketing mindset. 329 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:59,480 Yeah, that's not to say we exclude outbound, as you say, 330 00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:03,559 but you don't have to you don't have to go outbound to begin 331 00:18:03,559 --> 00:18:06,759 making use of intent signals, you know, construct your 332 00:18:06,759 --> 00:18:10,599 audience, target your advertising at them, and 333 00:18:11,799 --> 00:18:14,920 increase the likelihood that they will visit your site at 334 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,119 some point in the future, and if you're doing inbound well, you 335 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:21,480 know, convert, express their interest because you have an 336 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:23,319 offering that's relevant and valuable. 337 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:29,720 And we know how effective that type of conversion journey can 338 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:29,880 be. 339 00:19:18,779 --> 00:19:22,299 In one place, intent data signals in the platform, list 340 00:19:22,299 --> 00:19:25,180 generation, sync to LinkedIn, target your campaign and 341 00:19:25,180 --> 00:19:28,779 advertising at them, um, and then monitor what happens 342 00:19:28,779 --> 00:19:34,059 thereafter, who's seeing the ad, and then who's also coming to 343 00:19:34,059 --> 00:19:35,660 your website and converting later. 344 00:19:35,980 --> 00:19:38,619 SPEAKER_00: One way to measure this um effectively, because of 345 00:19:38,619 --> 00:19:42,460 course we want to know that if we're using intent data in our 346 00:19:42,460 --> 00:19:45,900 LinkedIn um campaigns, that is more effective or less 347 00:19:45,900 --> 00:19:46,220 effective. 348 00:19:46,460 --> 00:19:50,619 Um Fibla ad uh, we had Adam Holmgren on the podcast a few 349 00:19:50,619 --> 00:19:53,339 episodes back now, obviously co-founder at Fibrill, like 350 00:19:53,500 --> 00:19:56,299 awesome, awesome product and big fans of it now. 351 00:19:56,460 --> 00:19:58,859 Um, you know, I can see in our Fibra account right now, 352 00:19:59,019 --> 00:20:02,619 literally have it open that um in the last 90 days, you know, 353 00:20:02,700 --> 00:20:07,339 we've spent just shy of 10 grand on LinkedIn ads and it's 354 00:20:07,339 --> 00:20:11,579 influenced 18 deals in the pipeline, given us an efficiency 355 00:20:11,579 --> 00:20:18,220 multiplier of 157x on that, um, with a 39x on deals that we've 356 00:20:18,220 --> 00:20:19,980 actually won, which is 10 out of that. 357 00:20:20,220 --> 00:20:24,140 And you know, that that for us, because they are good sized 358 00:20:24,140 --> 00:20:28,380 deals as well, is a a very efficient use of that budget. 359 00:20:29,019 --> 00:20:33,980 And if we compare that to campaigns that were used without 360 00:20:33,980 --> 00:20:35,579 that, the efficiency was much less. 361 00:20:35,660 --> 00:20:35,900 Right. 362 00:20:36,059 --> 00:20:39,579 Our ability to actually generate pipeline and the multiplier on 363 00:20:39,579 --> 00:20:43,500 pipeline was much less than 157 and like converted into revenue 364 00:20:43,660 --> 00:20:45,180 less than like 39x. 365 00:20:45,660 --> 00:20:50,299 So if you are able to connect your LinkedIn campaign 366 00:20:50,299 --> 00:20:52,940 performance with pipeline, with revenue, and of course, you 367 00:20:52,940 --> 00:20:55,579 know, this goes back to things we've touched on on the podcast 368 00:20:55,660 --> 00:20:59,420 in in the past about connecting like your pipeline and revenue 369 00:20:59,500 --> 00:21:03,980 because it's so important to have that connected view of your 370 00:21:03,980 --> 00:21:07,259 activity, like your LinkedIn campaigns, all the way through 371 00:21:07,259 --> 00:21:12,059 to your CRM because it enables you to to look at like variances 372 00:21:12,059 --> 00:21:12,539 like this. 373 00:21:12,619 --> 00:21:18,059 Like if we use intent data in our audience segmentation, does 374 00:21:18,059 --> 00:21:20,460 it make our LinkedIn ads more effective or less effective? 375 00:21:20,619 --> 00:21:21,660 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 376 00:21:21,819 --> 00:21:25,180 And you're not you're not going to be look driving or looking 377 00:21:25,180 --> 00:21:29,660 for or see the result in the form of direct clicks and you 378 00:21:29,660 --> 00:21:31,180 know trackable conversions. 379 00:21:31,259 --> 00:21:35,819 That so you need that Fibrillar allows us to bridge that gap um, 380 00:21:35,900 --> 00:21:40,460 you know, and see the results or the effect of that campaign in 381 00:21:40,460 --> 00:21:44,779 pipeline, which enables uh enables us to you know optimise 382 00:21:44,779 --> 00:21:49,180 and ultimately defend that strategy to ourselves and and to 383 00:21:49,259 --> 00:21:53,740 and to the you know the the finances, um bearing in mind 384 00:21:53,740 --> 00:21:56,859 always that you know attribution information needs to be taken, 385 00:21:56,940 --> 00:22:02,460 you know, yeah with with uh awareness of its flaws, but it's 386 00:22:02,460 --> 00:22:07,900 it's it's a signal which is very valuable and way better than no 387 00:22:07,900 --> 00:22:11,180 signal as to what effect those intent-driven campaigns are 388 00:22:11,180 --> 00:22:13,740 having in terms of our you know most critical business APIs. 389 00:22:13,819 --> 00:22:14,700 So that's a great story. 390 00:22:14,859 --> 00:22:17,660 The ability to see all the all of that all the way through and 391 00:22:17,660 --> 00:22:22,140 improve performance by using intent data um and targeting it 392 00:22:22,220 --> 00:22:27,660 whilst not um you know, in our case, requiring things we don't 393 00:22:27,660 --> 00:22:29,180 have in order to get that working. 394 00:22:29,259 --> 00:22:29,740 It's brilliant. 395 00:22:29,900 --> 00:22:32,940 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you know what, it's made me think about 396 00:22:33,259 --> 00:22:37,019 our access to and like thinking outside the box with intent data 397 00:22:37,019 --> 00:22:39,420 as well and where we can access intent data. 398 00:22:39,660 --> 00:22:44,460 Fibbler is a source of intent data because you can almost like 399 00:22:44,619 --> 00:22:49,980 layer on a higher intent engaged audience via your Fibr data now 400 00:22:50,059 --> 00:22:53,500 because you can see if you're running a LinkedIn campaign to 401 00:22:53,819 --> 00:22:57,900 like I don't know, uh low, medium, and high intent topics 402 00:22:57,900 --> 00:23:01,339 that HubSpot are flagging, you run those, but then you actually 403 00:23:01,339 --> 00:23:03,259 start to see that okay, 20% of that. 404 00:23:03,660 --> 00:23:06,539 Audience in our LinkedIn ads are highly engaged because you know 405 00:23:06,619 --> 00:23:09,579 they've clicked on our ads a lot or they've engaged with it, etc. 406 00:23:09,819 --> 00:23:09,980 etc. 407 00:23:10,140 --> 00:23:11,339 Fibra's going to tell you that. 408 00:23:11,500 --> 00:23:11,740 Right. 409 00:23:11,900 --> 00:23:13,819 Well, we have that data in HubSpot. 410 00:23:13,900 --> 00:23:18,859 We can then create another list of highly engaged companies that 411 00:23:18,859 --> 00:23:23,339 have been um, you know, they that have seen our ads more view 412 00:23:23,500 --> 00:23:27,259 for impressions, they've been more engaged with our ads, so 413 00:23:27,500 --> 00:23:31,500 it's giving signals that they are more interested in in what 414 00:23:31,500 --> 00:23:33,980 we're saying in our message in our ads. 415 00:23:34,140 --> 00:23:37,980 So, you know, then we have a higher intent layer, and you 416 00:23:37,980 --> 00:23:39,579 could go again if you really wanted to. 417 00:23:39,740 --> 00:23:41,500 SPEAKER_01: And um and what would you recommend? 418 00:23:41,660 --> 00:23:44,299 Would would that be you might go with a new message to those 419 00:23:44,299 --> 00:23:44,460 people? 420 00:23:44,619 --> 00:23:46,220 Yeah, because more bottom of the funnel. 421 00:23:46,460 --> 00:23:50,059 Or yeah, uh, you know, more researched, more familiar with 422 00:23:50,059 --> 00:23:50,779 the topic. 423 00:23:51,099 --> 00:23:54,299 So, you know, most businesses have got at least an idea of 424 00:23:54,299 --> 00:23:56,940 what a sort of multi-layered campaign message might look like 425 00:23:57,339 --> 00:23:59,500 for cold versus retargeting, for example. 426 00:23:59,579 --> 00:24:02,779 You could take some inspiration from that and like lean into 427 00:24:02,779 --> 00:24:05,980 that intent, that that that engagement with a new message 428 00:24:06,140 --> 00:24:06,779 bottom of the funnel. 429 00:24:07,180 --> 00:24:09,900 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like this is we don't do that, for example, 430 00:24:10,140 --> 00:24:15,180 but I would do it if we had a larger audience required more 431 00:24:15,180 --> 00:24:19,259 volume than we currently need, which we don't, um, and yeah, 432 00:24:19,420 --> 00:24:21,420 like needed that layered approach. 433 00:24:21,579 --> 00:24:25,180 We don't need that right now, but I would absolutely be doing 434 00:24:25,180 --> 00:24:30,140 something like that if we had the audience volume and the need 435 00:24:30,460 --> 00:24:33,339 for more like volume to come through the door. 436 00:24:33,579 --> 00:24:35,339 SPEAKER_01: And I like it because it's it's grounded in 437 00:24:35,339 --> 00:24:39,819 what intent data can really tell you and not something that we 438 00:24:39,819 --> 00:24:40,779 wish it could tell us. 439 00:24:40,940 --> 00:24:41,099 Yeah. 440 00:24:41,259 --> 00:24:44,940 You know, it it's based on the the facts that that you know 441 00:24:45,099 --> 00:24:47,339 that those tools enable us to see. 442 00:24:47,500 --> 00:24:51,259 Um so it's got good, you know, it's got good rational 443 00:24:51,500 --> 00:24:52,700 justification for it. 444 00:24:52,779 --> 00:24:56,140 Um and I can see why that would drive a positive result, you 445 00:24:56,140 --> 00:24:59,660 know, rather than just spend money that we never saw back 446 00:24:59,740 --> 00:25:00,059 again. 447 00:25:00,460 --> 00:25:01,019 SPEAKER_00: Absolutely. 448 00:25:01,259 --> 00:25:05,579 Um another one that we could set up in marketing to I suppose 449 00:25:05,579 --> 00:25:08,859 this is like bridging the gap in the engagement territory between 450 00:25:08,859 --> 00:25:12,700 marketing and sales, is intent-triggered reactivation of 451 00:25:12,700 --> 00:25:13,259 accounts. 452 00:25:13,500 --> 00:25:16,940 So if there is already an account or a uh a person, this 453 00:25:16,940 --> 00:25:21,019 is more account level though, in the CRM that's maybe gone quiet 454 00:25:21,019 --> 00:25:23,980 for you know three, six, twelve months, and then they start 455 00:25:23,980 --> 00:25:25,740 showing intent signals again. 456 00:25:25,900 --> 00:25:30,539 That could be third-party intent signals, like via topic research 457 00:25:30,619 --> 00:25:35,339 or new hires perhaps, or at a first-party intent signal basis. 458 00:25:35,500 --> 00:25:38,220 Basically, any intent that's showing us they are kind of 459 00:25:38,220 --> 00:25:41,180 re-engaging in our category or topics, that's a great 460 00:25:41,180 --> 00:25:45,660 opportunity to probably flag them to an SDR, or if you have 461 00:25:45,660 --> 00:25:49,259 come up with some like repeatable process that enrolls 462 00:25:49,259 --> 00:25:52,380 them in a particular sequence for um that. 463 00:25:52,539 --> 00:25:55,259 I mean, I haven't seen that done particularly well because I 464 00:25:55,259 --> 00:25:58,380 think then we're getting in the the realms of like recycling 465 00:25:58,380 --> 00:26:02,299 leads in that in the old sense and never really saw that 466 00:26:02,299 --> 00:26:02,700 working. 467 00:26:02,940 --> 00:26:04,380 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? 468 00:26:04,619 --> 00:26:09,579 Because I suppose what you're talking about there is that 469 00:26:09,579 --> 00:26:13,339 intent data doesn't have to exclusively produce net new 470 00:26:14,220 --> 00:26:14,619 records. 471 00:26:15,259 --> 00:26:17,019 You know, a lot of the time it will. 472 00:26:17,099 --> 00:26:19,579 We'll use that system to identify new companies who are 473 00:26:19,579 --> 00:26:26,059 in market, but once that company's in your CRM, that that 474 00:26:26,059 --> 00:26:29,019 doesn't mean that they will never be in market again, never 475 00:26:29,019 --> 00:26:30,140 research that topic again. 476 00:26:30,299 --> 00:26:35,180 And so I think again, whilst you can take lead recycling too far 477 00:26:35,420 --> 00:26:39,099 and sort of basically never give up like a dog with a bone, you 478 00:26:39,099 --> 00:26:41,180 can also do it strategically. 479 00:26:41,259 --> 00:26:44,380 You can also say, well, we may have the record already, but 480 00:26:44,380 --> 00:26:50,700 we've got a reason to re-you engage, re-entertain this record 481 00:26:50,700 --> 00:26:52,220 around the block again. 482 00:26:52,380 --> 00:26:57,259 Um, so I think that's just using the the right records at the 483 00:26:57,259 --> 00:27:00,299 right time, regardless of whether they are new in your CRM 484 00:27:00,299 --> 00:27:00,779 or existing. 485 00:27:00,859 --> 00:27:06,619 Yeah, um, as opposed to perhaps just never letting go and never 486 00:27:06,619 --> 00:27:08,539 giving up uh on somebody. 487 00:27:08,619 --> 00:27:10,859 Uh, I can think of a couple of companies that have done that to 488 00:27:10,859 --> 00:27:11,579 me over the years. 489 00:27:11,660 --> 00:27:12,539 Uh Relentless. 490 00:27:12,859 --> 00:27:16,460 Relentless, yeah, even though there's no you know signal or 491 00:27:16,460 --> 00:27:18,539 reason to be hopeful about it. 492 00:27:18,700 --> 00:27:19,500 Yeah, I like it. 493 00:27:19,740 --> 00:27:24,460 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that that's um like account level um 494 00:27:24,700 --> 00:27:27,980 intent data, most platforms will call that, where you basically 495 00:27:27,980 --> 00:27:32,299 have like a list of companies on your watch list, and you can set 496 00:27:32,299 --> 00:27:36,460 up notifications to flag the owner of that account or contact 497 00:27:36,539 --> 00:27:39,660 if any of these your chosen intent signals show. 498 00:27:39,740 --> 00:27:40,859 Um that's probably the way to say. 499 00:27:41,099 --> 00:27:43,019 SPEAKER_01: And I mean, presumably all of that can be 500 00:27:43,019 --> 00:27:46,779 driven by like uh you know ICP like targeting. 501 00:27:46,859 --> 00:27:50,700 So you your system will know which companies are you know 502 00:27:50,940 --> 00:27:53,660 theoretically attractive to you, so you that's automated. 503 00:27:53,740 --> 00:27:53,980 Yeah. 504 00:27:54,299 --> 00:27:57,420 And for some of those companies, you'll have named contacts in 505 00:27:57,420 --> 00:28:00,619 your CRM, you know, so you will know the person to go to, which 506 00:28:00,619 --> 00:28:01,420 might be one strategy. 507 00:28:01,660 --> 00:28:04,460 And in other situations, you you won't have that contact, but 508 00:28:04,460 --> 00:28:07,019 you've got a play, you've got a method of going out to the 509 00:28:07,019 --> 00:28:09,259 account and trying to get those contacts. 510 00:28:09,339 --> 00:28:09,500 Yeah. 511 00:28:09,660 --> 00:28:10,859 So you've got a lot of options. 512 00:28:11,099 --> 00:28:11,980 SPEAKER_00: Absolutely. 513 00:28:12,299 --> 00:28:17,900 Last use case I have for marketing is any kind of event 514 00:28:17,900 --> 00:28:21,099 or webinar leads that you're trying to attract. 515 00:28:21,339 --> 00:28:24,779 Because, you know, if we can identify the right accounts at 516 00:28:24,779 --> 00:28:30,059 the right moment, inviting them to a like webinar or an event in 517 00:28:30,059 --> 00:28:33,500 your category on a particular topic that we know they might be 518 00:28:33,500 --> 00:28:35,660 researching is better than just cold. 519 00:28:35,740 --> 00:28:40,380 Again, it's like we are giving ourselves just a bit of an 520 00:28:40,380 --> 00:28:44,140 advantage, more probability that they will engage with us based 521 00:28:44,140 --> 00:28:48,380 on intent data might not work, it might work, like it might 522 00:28:48,380 --> 00:28:49,660 land on the right person. 523 00:28:49,819 --> 00:28:53,259 Um, probabilistically, we are just giving ourselves a better 524 00:28:53,259 --> 00:28:56,220 opportunity to hit the right person at the right time with 525 00:28:56,220 --> 00:28:56,940 the right message. 526 00:28:57,099 --> 00:29:01,579 And yeah, driving event and webinar attendees can be tricky, 527 00:29:01,740 --> 00:29:05,660 but if you find the right moment to hit somebody with that 528 00:29:05,660 --> 00:29:09,420 message because they are interested in that particular 529 00:29:09,420 --> 00:29:12,140 problem that they're trying to solve, that can be a really good 530 00:29:12,140 --> 00:29:12,700 way to use it. 531 00:29:12,940 --> 00:29:13,180 SPEAKER_01: Yeah. 532 00:29:13,339 --> 00:29:17,740 If you try to invite your entire TAM to every single event you 533 00:29:17,740 --> 00:29:21,900 run, you're going to uh enjoy pretty poor results, um, you 534 00:29:21,900 --> 00:29:23,900 know, and they won't particularly love it either. 535 00:29:24,140 --> 00:29:29,259 So being able to, you know, intelligently narrow down the 536 00:29:29,259 --> 00:29:31,420 pool increases the odds of success. 537 00:29:31,579 --> 00:29:31,740 Yeah. 538 00:29:31,900 --> 00:29:34,460 Yeah, you know, uh, I think that's a very, very sound 539 00:29:34,460 --> 00:29:35,259 strategy too. 540 00:29:35,420 --> 00:29:37,339 Um, like you say, give yourself every advantage. 541 00:29:37,420 --> 00:29:39,180 It's a noisy world out there, yeah, right. 542 00:29:39,420 --> 00:29:42,059 Everybody's getting heaps of messages all the time. 543 00:29:42,619 --> 00:29:47,339 A key, a key factor in standing out isn't just content that 544 00:29:47,339 --> 00:29:51,660 stands out, it's being selective about who you send and who what 545 00:29:51,660 --> 00:29:53,579 you send and when and why into who. 546 00:29:53,900 --> 00:29:56,700 Those are all advantages to build around your campaign. 547 00:29:56,940 --> 00:30:00,619 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, and and those points go directly into 548 00:30:00,859 --> 00:30:03,900 the outbound sales side of this as well. 549 00:30:04,059 --> 00:30:04,380 Right. 550 00:30:04,619 --> 00:30:08,859 Knowing, you know, who you're targeting, what your message is, 551 00:30:09,019 --> 00:30:13,019 and why you're reaching out to them are all super important 552 00:30:13,099 --> 00:30:13,500 things. 553 00:30:13,660 --> 00:30:18,539 Otherwise, your outbound motion is no better than just like 554 00:30:18,779 --> 00:30:22,220 blasting thousands and thousands of people with a cold message. 555 00:30:22,299 --> 00:30:26,779 It's yeah it's so, so important that we're using intent data in 556 00:30:26,779 --> 00:30:32,380 outbound to make our lists much, much smaller rather than larger 557 00:30:32,619 --> 00:30:36,859 because the intent signals should be able to curate a 558 00:30:37,180 --> 00:30:41,819 tighter list that are organized around buying triggers for our 559 00:30:41,819 --> 00:30:44,059 category and things of interest. 560 00:30:44,299 --> 00:30:44,859 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah. 561 00:30:45,019 --> 00:30:47,819 If uh you know, if you look at where your pipeline comes from, 562 00:30:47,900 --> 00:30:52,140 it is going to predominantly come from the small percentage 563 00:30:52,140 --> 00:30:55,980 of people for whom your offer is relevant at that moment in time. 564 00:30:56,140 --> 00:30:56,299 Yeah. 565 00:30:56,460 --> 00:31:01,420 I.e., they're in market, they're in ICP, they've got a reason to 566 00:31:02,059 --> 00:31:07,180 be attracted to you, you know, com along with certain other 567 00:31:07,180 --> 00:31:07,819 competitors. 568 00:31:07,900 --> 00:31:08,140 Yeah. 569 00:31:08,299 --> 00:31:11,420 You've got a you've got a disproportionate, you know, 570 00:31:11,740 --> 00:31:13,819 reason to win that business. 571 00:31:14,059 --> 00:31:16,380 That's where your energy needs to go. 572 00:31:16,700 --> 00:31:21,180 Be it just spraying and praying across, you know, your whole ICP 573 00:31:21,180 --> 00:31:25,259 category, yeah, you know, is is not what produces the results. 574 00:31:25,660 --> 00:31:29,819 They're always going to be in that set of there's a reason why 575 00:31:29,819 --> 00:31:31,099 they're in our pipeline now. 576 00:31:31,180 --> 00:31:31,259 Yeah. 577 00:31:31,420 --> 00:31:33,099 Reason or reasons why they're in our pipeline. 578 00:31:33,339 --> 00:31:35,500 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and this is kind of what we've touched on 579 00:31:35,500 --> 00:31:41,420 before when it comes to like company news and uh updates that 580 00:31:41,660 --> 00:31:43,259 that give us a reason to reach out. 581 00:31:43,420 --> 00:31:46,619 And you know, we kind of joked about having tons of emails 582 00:31:46,619 --> 00:31:50,140 based on these signals, so that this isn't a prospecting lesson. 583 00:31:50,220 --> 00:31:52,539 Like I'm not a prospecting expert anyway. 584 00:31:52,700 --> 00:31:56,380 Um, I'd much rather talk about the inbound side of like ways to 585 00:31:56,380 --> 00:31:58,220 use this because it's where I'm more comfortable. 586 00:31:58,299 --> 00:32:02,940 But I am starting to get to grips more with how we use 587 00:32:02,940 --> 00:32:06,140 intent data in an outbound motion. 588 00:32:06,380 --> 00:32:09,980 Um, and yeah, in particular, like using these signals, 589 00:32:10,140 --> 00:32:14,380 drawing them in from Zoom Info or even um, you know, Apollo or 590 00:32:14,380 --> 00:32:18,700 HubSpot Bio Intent itself, and actually using those in 591 00:32:18,700 --> 00:32:22,220 outbound, or you know, we'll touch on agents, I suppose, at 592 00:32:22,220 --> 00:32:22,539 some point. 593 00:32:22,859 --> 00:32:25,339 SPEAKER_01: I mean, I I I for one would definitely like to see 594 00:32:25,339 --> 00:32:28,140 the issue that was raised by LinkedIn a couple of years back, 595 00:32:28,220 --> 00:32:33,500 you know, now resolved, whereby marketing and sales teams were 596 00:32:33,500 --> 00:32:36,299 largely targeting completely distinct cohorts. 597 00:32:36,380 --> 00:32:39,099 So they were targeting different people altogether. 598 00:32:39,339 --> 00:32:45,099 Um a clear, well, both the seal both the sign and the reason 599 00:32:45,099 --> 00:32:47,579 that sort of go-to-market efficiency was low. 600 00:32:47,740 --> 00:32:47,900 Yeah. 601 00:32:48,299 --> 00:32:51,180 Because they need to be targeting the same people with 602 00:32:51,180 --> 00:32:53,420 the same level of finesse. 603 00:32:53,579 --> 00:32:57,980 Um, and intent data is an opportunity to be really, really 604 00:32:57,980 --> 00:32:58,460 aligned. 605 00:32:58,539 --> 00:32:58,700 Yeah. 606 00:32:58,859 --> 00:33:01,500 Um, and so as you say, while marketing is our sort of 607 00:33:01,500 --> 00:33:07,099 wheelhouse to an extent, we're very aware of the need to bring, 608 00:33:07,180 --> 00:33:10,140 you know, for go to market to incorporate inbound and outbound 609 00:33:10,460 --> 00:33:12,220 that works effectively together. 610 00:33:12,460 --> 00:33:16,539 And you know, both teams can be run in a way that just again 611 00:33:16,859 --> 00:33:21,420 sprays, throws stuff at the wall, see what sticks, or you 612 00:33:21,420 --> 00:33:25,660 can be aligned with one another and targeted and intentional 613 00:33:25,660 --> 00:33:28,539 about it, um, and that'll produce great results. 614 00:33:28,779 --> 00:33:31,819 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I haven't looked at the latest 615 00:33:31,819 --> 00:33:36,299 report on the touch points required for a B2B bar journey. 616 00:33:36,380 --> 00:33:38,700 I think last time I looked at, I'm sure it was somewhere in 617 00:33:38,700 --> 00:33:40,859 like the 20 regions, maybe even higher. 618 00:33:41,099 --> 00:33:45,500 SPEAKER_01: Okay, 20 exposures to for something. 619 00:33:45,740 --> 00:33:47,740 SPEAKER_00: There was a hockey stack report like ages ago, 620 00:33:47,819 --> 00:33:51,019 which is the last one I looked at, but it's a lot anyway. 621 00:33:51,500 --> 00:33:55,819 And we know that if you've seen a brand, like you can just tell 622 00:33:55,819 --> 00:33:57,339 this from personal experience as well. 623 00:33:57,500 --> 00:34:00,299 If you've been exposed to a brand over and over again and 624 00:34:00,299 --> 00:34:03,339 you've started to resonate with the message that they have um 625 00:34:03,500 --> 00:34:06,380 applied, it doesn't matter where that is, it could be on a 626 00:34:06,380 --> 00:34:09,900 billboard walking down the street, it could be like on the 627 00:34:09,900 --> 00:34:13,579 back of your water bottle, it it could be a LinkedIn ad, it could 628 00:34:13,579 --> 00:34:17,579 be a connected TV ad, it could be a series of outbound messages 629 00:34:17,579 --> 00:34:18,059 to you. 630 00:34:18,380 --> 00:34:22,460 But we know that not just marketing, but go to market as a 631 00:34:22,460 --> 00:34:26,779 whole is a connected suite of actions and activity and a 632 00:34:27,099 --> 00:34:28,460 process that happens. 633 00:34:28,699 --> 00:34:35,659 If we're running um intent data both in an inbound marketing 634 00:34:35,980 --> 00:34:40,220 way, those are two connected words, uh disconnected words, 635 00:34:40,380 --> 00:34:44,940 um, and a sales way, that we have more chance of that company 636 00:34:44,940 --> 00:34:48,539 engaging with us because they've seen our brand in multiple 637 00:34:48,539 --> 00:34:54,059 places over, you know, multiple weeks, um, in different formats, 638 00:34:54,140 --> 00:34:57,420 in different varieties with different messages, our outbound 639 00:34:57,420 --> 00:35:01,260 messages is gonna land better and have a higher chance of 640 00:35:01,260 --> 00:35:03,900 engagement because of the resonance with our brand. 641 00:35:04,140 --> 00:35:04,779 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah. 642 00:35:04,859 --> 00:35:07,579 But you know, brands are strange things in terms of how they do 643 00:35:07,579 --> 00:36:16,790 their work, right, uh conceptual uh at a theoretical level. 644 00:36:17,110 --> 00:36:24,790 But if you can be present, you know, in multiple places that 645 00:36:24,790 --> 00:36:31,350 your ideal customer sees, and there is a frequency of exposure 646 00:36:31,350 --> 00:36:35,269 that doesn't cross the line into you know assault, yeah, and 647 00:36:35,269 --> 00:36:40,470 there's relevance, like your brand can become quite uh 648 00:36:40,470 --> 00:36:45,350 positively viewed in their mind, even to a degree beyond what 649 00:36:45,350 --> 00:36:46,230 you've earned, right? 650 00:36:46,390 --> 00:36:51,510 Brett, like because we we we trust what we know and we know 651 00:36:51,510 --> 00:36:53,030 what we've seen a lot of, yeah. 652 00:36:53,190 --> 00:36:57,750 So it's becomes a very strong angle to work these two things 653 00:36:57,750 --> 00:37:01,750 together around a very, very you know tightly defined audience, 654 00:37:01,990 --> 00:37:07,430 intent data being a great way to build a quality audience um to 655 00:37:07,430 --> 00:37:12,630 produce yeah, like mental availability, yeah, brand 656 00:37:12,630 --> 00:37:16,070 affinity, trust and preference, and of course pipeline. 657 00:37:16,150 --> 00:37:16,630 SPEAKER_00: Yeah. 658 00:37:16,950 --> 00:37:20,790 I think the last um thing on outbound, like there's lots of 659 00:37:20,790 --> 00:37:22,470 different ways you can execute outbound. 660 00:37:22,550 --> 00:37:26,790 You can flag tasks based on intent signals, you can run 661 00:37:26,950 --> 00:37:31,269 sequences automated that you've written yourself or that sales 662 00:37:31,269 --> 00:37:34,150 want to go ahead and write, or you can start to experiment with 663 00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:37,670 things like agents, and that can be like HubSpot's prospecting 664 00:37:37,830 --> 00:37:42,150 agent, clay, um, loads of other tools out there that enable you 665 00:37:42,150 --> 00:37:49,590 to use agents to research companies, research contacts, 666 00:37:50,150 --> 00:37:55,510 collate intent signals, and use those in um outbound sequences. 667 00:37:55,750 --> 00:37:59,590 And I have been pretty impressed with the output that's possible 668 00:37:59,590 --> 00:38:01,510 from HubSpot's prospecting agent. 669 00:38:01,590 --> 00:38:01,750 Yeah. 670 00:38:01,910 --> 00:38:05,670 When it came out, had some flaws, but they've released a 671 00:38:05,670 --> 00:38:09,910 new version, updated version, that enables you to curate 672 00:38:09,910 --> 00:38:13,030 instructions at a level that it listens to a lot more 673 00:38:13,030 --> 00:38:13,910 effectively now. 674 00:38:14,390 --> 00:38:18,310 And yeah, um, I would encourage everybody that's thinking about 675 00:38:18,310 --> 00:38:22,870 how to use their intent data more effectively to check out 676 00:38:23,030 --> 00:38:26,470 these ways that might be a lower barrier barrier to entry to 677 00:38:26,470 --> 00:38:30,310 actually start to play around with how you create this kind of 678 00:38:30,310 --> 00:38:35,670 like a dual intent data um system between marketing and 679 00:38:35,670 --> 00:38:39,990 sales, like using advertising plus um some sort of prospecting 680 00:38:39,990 --> 00:38:43,510 as well, like layer in prospecting agent, um trigger it 681 00:38:43,510 --> 00:38:47,830 in a workflow based off of uh an account entering a list that 682 00:38:47,830 --> 00:38:50,790 meets you know this criteria, then then fire it into 683 00:38:50,790 --> 00:38:53,590 prospecting agent for the contacts that you have. 684 00:38:53,910 --> 00:38:58,070 And yeah, it's it's actually quite insane. 685 00:38:58,310 --> 00:39:00,950 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I think we're turning a corner in this 686 00:39:00,950 --> 00:39:04,390 regard where we're gaining the ability to you know have control 687 00:39:04,710 --> 00:39:09,430 and governance over you know AI, uh over agents that can do this 688 00:39:09,430 --> 00:39:13,670 work for us in a way that means we're holding ourselves to 689 00:39:13,670 --> 00:39:15,910 account for the quality and the relevance of it. 690 00:39:16,790 --> 00:39:21,750 Everybody will have had you know fears of you know huge amounts 691 00:39:21,750 --> 00:39:24,870 of AI spam and AI slop, and it's it's definitely happening. 692 00:39:25,190 --> 00:39:30,310 But I think we're all agreeing that parts of our process for 693 00:39:30,310 --> 00:39:36,950 outbound and prospecting can be orchestrated and AI powered 694 00:39:37,190 --> 00:39:42,630 without losing all you know all of the things that made it 695 00:39:42,630 --> 00:39:47,670 successful, you know, when humans were operating every 696 00:39:47,670 --> 00:39:48,310 aspect of it. 697 00:39:48,470 --> 00:39:49,910 It's a new way of doing it. 698 00:39:50,070 --> 00:39:53,190 It's a it's a new way that it takes some getting used to, but 699 00:39:53,190 --> 00:39:56,390 I think it's becoming it's becoming the norm, and there's 700 00:39:56,390 --> 00:39:58,550 no reason to fear it and not do it. 701 00:39:58,710 --> 00:40:03,190 Yeah, you you do just have to uh you know use these tools in ways 702 00:40:03,190 --> 00:40:08,710 that you you know feel confident are gonna add to your brand as 703 00:40:08,710 --> 00:40:13,350 opposed to detract from it and and erode it because you can 704 00:40:13,350 --> 00:40:14,150 easily go wrong. 705 00:40:14,310 --> 00:40:17,269 Yeah, normally that's gonna be a scale thing. 706 00:40:17,590 --> 00:40:20,230 Um, because the tools have got good enough now to be able to 707 00:40:20,230 --> 00:40:22,950 create messages with the right prompting and the right 708 00:40:22,950 --> 00:40:25,990 architectural thinking about how they what they output and why. 709 00:40:26,070 --> 00:40:27,269 Yeah, you can get there. 710 00:40:27,670 --> 00:40:30,790 SPEAKER_00: I still haven't um enabled prospecting agent to go 711 00:40:30,790 --> 00:40:32,150 totally autonomous yet, though. 712 00:40:32,390 --> 00:40:34,310 I don't know when I'll get to that point. 713 00:40:34,630 --> 00:40:35,430 Not yet. 714 00:40:35,590 --> 00:40:38,630 Um right now it's like I have to review every email. 715 00:40:38,790 --> 00:40:41,750 For the most part, I'm just clicking approve, but I don't 716 00:40:41,750 --> 00:40:42,070 know. 717 00:40:43,110 --> 00:40:48,070 It feels like a big leap to just have an agent then sending 718 00:40:48,070 --> 00:40:51,030 emails that we're not even seeing on behalf of the 719 00:40:51,030 --> 00:40:51,430 business. 720 00:40:51,750 --> 00:40:53,750 SPEAKER_01: I think I think that's normal, and I think 721 00:40:53,750 --> 00:40:56,790 that's a perfectly like okay journey to go on. 722 00:40:56,950 --> 00:40:59,990 You know, we've never done it at scale the other way, yeah. 723 00:41:00,230 --> 00:41:03,670 So we're not coming from a world where there have been messages 724 00:41:03,670 --> 00:41:07,670 going out from our domain or organization at volume, and we 725 00:41:07,990 --> 00:41:12,390 and we've been conditioned to know that they're not all going 726 00:41:12,390 --> 00:41:13,190 to get a response. 727 00:41:13,269 --> 00:41:15,990 Yeah, we've got that, we've got to come to terms with that. 728 00:41:16,070 --> 00:41:19,030 Yeah, I I wager that it will not be long before you flip that 729 00:41:19,030 --> 00:41:19,350 switch. 730 00:41:19,510 --> 00:41:19,750 Yeah. 731 00:41:19,910 --> 00:41:22,150 Um, and I would I would encourage it. 732 00:41:22,310 --> 00:41:26,070 Uh always keeping an eye, you know, we we need to we need to 733 00:41:26,070 --> 00:41:31,670 keep monitoring, but not being always in the loop when we're 734 00:41:31,670 --> 00:41:33,750 not, you know, when we're not adding anything. 735 00:41:33,910 --> 00:41:36,630 And you know, it sounds like you've already got our 736 00:41:36,630 --> 00:41:40,550 prospecting agent to a level where for the most part you're 737 00:41:40,550 --> 00:41:42,630 happy to approve and pass it on through. 738 00:41:42,790 --> 00:41:44,710 So I think we're close to being long. 739 00:41:44,950 --> 00:41:47,750 We can become a we can become a monitoring function rather than 740 00:41:47,750 --> 00:41:49,750 a approving function in that chain. 741 00:41:50,070 --> 00:41:50,310 SPEAKER_00: Yeah. 742 00:41:50,470 --> 00:41:54,150 I do think um, yeah, just on like prospecting messaging and 743 00:41:54,150 --> 00:41:57,910 things, um, because from what I've tried in the different 744 00:41:57,910 --> 00:42:02,550 variants, we still need to be mindful that there is like a 745 00:42:02,550 --> 00:42:09,110 mutual some some sort of like value exchange in our outbound 746 00:42:09,110 --> 00:42:09,670 approach. 747 00:42:09,910 --> 00:42:14,150 Just using intent signals to say, oh hey, like seeing you've 748 00:42:14,150 --> 00:42:17,350 been promoted to CMO, do you want to buy our product? 749 00:42:17,510 --> 00:42:21,430 Like, out of the box, a lot of these prospecting tools will do 750 00:42:21,430 --> 00:42:21,590 that. 751 00:42:21,750 --> 00:42:24,950 It will look for the signal, look for your product, and say, 752 00:42:25,110 --> 00:42:28,470 Hey, seeing the signal, check out our product. 753 00:42:28,710 --> 00:42:29,830 Pretty like weak source. 754 00:42:30,150 --> 00:42:33,670 Still, you know, we've got to put our marketing brains behind 755 00:42:33,910 --> 00:42:37,190 what's the offer, what's the value we're adding here, why 756 00:42:37,190 --> 00:42:40,870 would anybody want to respond to us or want to engage with us in 757 00:42:40,870 --> 00:42:45,510 any meaningful way based off of this intent signal or and this 758 00:42:45,510 --> 00:42:46,390 thing they're receiving. 759 00:42:46,630 --> 00:42:47,190 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah. 760 00:42:47,350 --> 00:42:52,870 And that becomes the the sort of that's the the essence of what 761 00:42:52,870 --> 00:42:56,150 it is to be a go-to-market professional in the AI era. 762 00:42:56,310 --> 00:42:56,470 Yeah. 763 00:42:56,790 --> 00:43:01,830 You've got to put the effort goes into the setup, the the 764 00:43:01,830 --> 00:43:05,510 architecture, the prompting, and the creation of something that 765 00:43:05,510 --> 00:43:11,670 outputs a message that is, you know suitable for transmitting. 766 00:43:11,750 --> 00:43:13,910 You know, we we live in a society, thank goodness. 767 00:43:14,070 --> 00:43:17,350 And it, you know, if you want a response, you've got to be 768 00:43:17,590 --> 00:43:22,390 thoughtful about what the other person has going on and give 769 00:43:22,390 --> 00:43:22,950 value, though. 770 00:43:23,670 --> 00:43:27,269 The the mantra to give value before you ask for it still 771 00:43:27,269 --> 00:43:28,870 carries a lot of a lot of weight. 772 00:43:29,110 --> 00:43:32,630 If you simply pitch slap everybody that you know even 773 00:43:32,950 --> 00:43:36,230 thinks about researching your topic, you're not going to get 774 00:43:36,230 --> 00:43:36,790 great results. 775 00:43:36,870 --> 00:43:39,430 It'll frustrate you, it'll frustrate those that pay the you 776 00:43:39,430 --> 00:43:43,190 know, pay the budget, um, and most likely end up in you know 777 00:43:43,269 --> 00:43:45,830 some something uh it getting terminated. 778 00:43:45,910 --> 00:43:46,230 Yeah. 779 00:43:46,390 --> 00:43:53,110 Um, so better to yeah, plan, build, refine, and and then 780 00:43:53,350 --> 00:43:57,830 launch that sort of thing rather than switch it on and just let 781 00:43:57,830 --> 00:44:01,670 it do what it thinks you know it will is good enough. 782 00:44:01,910 --> 00:44:02,470 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah. 783 00:44:02,630 --> 00:44:07,510 I think to kind of round us out on this one, intent data is full 784 00:44:07,510 --> 00:44:08,070 of data. 785 00:44:08,230 --> 00:44:10,790 There's more and more data, there's more and more signals 786 00:44:10,790 --> 00:44:14,950 added all the time, and it's not about the volume of data you can 787 00:44:14,950 --> 00:44:15,190 have. 788 00:44:15,510 --> 00:44:18,390 More doesn't mean more effective. 789 00:44:18,630 --> 00:44:22,150 It's about acting on the right signals, identifying the right 790 00:44:22,150 --> 00:44:27,030 buying triggers, um, and prioritizing the data available 791 00:44:27,030 --> 00:44:29,110 to you rather than trying to act on all of it. 792 00:44:29,190 --> 00:44:32,470 It's not a magic list of buyers that are ready to buy from your 793 00:44:32,470 --> 00:44:32,950 business. 794 00:44:33,110 --> 00:44:36,870 Like, please don't be misleaded by that because it's really not, 795 00:44:37,030 --> 00:44:43,910 but it tells you at least the areas to focus um and yeah, 796 00:44:44,150 --> 00:44:45,830 gives you signals to act on. 797 00:44:46,070 --> 00:44:50,070 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think if at all possible, there's real merit 798 00:44:50,070 --> 00:44:56,470 in like staying practical about this and trying where possible 799 00:44:56,630 --> 00:44:59,670 to reduce hype and set expectations. 800 00:44:59,910 --> 00:45:03,670 Uh so much so that I think you know it would be even better if 801 00:45:03,830 --> 00:45:08,310 the use cases for intent were coming up through the 802 00:45:08,310 --> 00:45:11,910 organization from the people delivering demand that go to 803 00:45:11,910 --> 00:45:14,870 market, be it on the on the marketing side, the sales side, 804 00:45:14,950 --> 00:45:18,950 or the combined function, you know, and and being introduced 805 00:45:18,950 --> 00:45:24,950 by them to deliver a strategy that's got you know legs, uh 806 00:45:25,510 --> 00:45:27,670 rather than the top-down. 807 00:45:27,910 --> 00:45:31,990 I've heard this platform's amazing and should get us 100 808 00:45:31,990 --> 00:45:34,630 meetings, you know, by tomorrow, figure it out. 809 00:45:34,790 --> 00:45:35,190 Yeah, yeah. 810 00:45:35,350 --> 00:45:39,670 You know, if we can control and lead, we can put in place 811 00:45:39,670 --> 00:45:44,950 programs that have real you know merit and are not just spam, you 812 00:45:44,950 --> 00:45:46,470 know, spam on rails. 813 00:45:46,550 --> 00:45:46,790 Yeah. 814 00:45:46,950 --> 00:45:49,670 Um, so try and be, yeah, try and be on the front foot there 815 00:45:49,830 --> 00:45:53,510 because there's a world of opportunity in this data, it's 816 00:45:53,510 --> 00:45:55,830 incredibly useful, incredibly powerful. 817 00:45:55,910 --> 00:45:59,430 Um, but you've got to harness it uh, you know, in ways that 818 00:45:59,430 --> 00:46:05,190 produce for the recipient the right the right experience in 819 00:46:05,190 --> 00:46:09,110 order for you to get back the the value that is possible. 820 00:46:09,430 --> 00:46:09,830 SPEAKER_00: For sure. 821 00:46:09,990 --> 00:46:11,750 All right, let's wrap it up there. 822 00:46:12,150 --> 00:46:15,030 Hopefully you enjoyed this episode of Demand Decoded. 823 00:46:15,110 --> 00:46:15,910 Um, yeah, interest. 824 00:46:16,230 --> 00:46:19,190 We haven't dived into uh intent data yet, I don't think. 825 00:46:19,269 --> 00:46:22,150 So that was cool to do that, and yeah, thoroughly enjoyed that 826 00:46:22,150 --> 00:46:22,710 episode. 827 00:46:22,870 --> 00:46:24,950 And um, yeah, we will catch you next time. 828 00:46:25,110 --> 00:46:25,670 Bye everyone. 829 00:46:25,910 --> 00:46:26,390 See you.