AI for Growth: Lessons from Leaders John Hayes

Megan Driscoll: Welcome to AI for Growth Lessons from Leaders. Today, I'm really excited to have Dr. John Hayes ⁓ joining me today. ⁓ Dr.

Hayes, I'm gonna have you introduce yourself, tell yourself a little bit about what you do. But the topic for today is gonna be AI for medical practices, which I have not done before, and I think this is gonna be really exciting. John Hayes Jr: Yeah. Yeah, Megan, thanks and thanks for your invitation.

So John Hayes Jr., I'm an MD practicing in direct primary care in neuromuscular skeletal medicine. ⁓ Really, really exciting combination, completely private healthcare, which is exciting and couldn't be happier doing it. Megan Driscoll: Yeah, cool.

Tell me a little bit about that specialty before we get started about AI, neuromuscular. John Hayes Jr: ⁓ So my background is pretty extensive. For many years I practiced ⁓ as a DC and a clinical nutritionist. About 18 years ago now, I got very heavily involved in treating chronic pain and particular peripheral neuropathy patients.

One thing led to another. My entire career I've always kind of dived into research and that type of thing. Fast forward ⁓ three years from the original start, we developed treatment devices to help these patients, then dietary supplements. ⁓ Fast forward a little bit more, published a couple of books, two books actually on peripheral neuropathy.

One called Beat Neuropathy was a self-published bestseller. And the second book was a patient handbook called I Beat Neuropathy. And now we have manufactured for us treatment devices, dietary supplements, and other modalities to help these patients. it is a subspecialty.

helping neuropathy and chronic pain patients right inside primary care. And because I do what's called direct primary care, we don't take any insurance. There's nobody looking over my shoulder and said, no, you can't do that. ⁓ you can only do this.

⁓ you can't do that. So it's great. It really is great. It's great for me.

It's great for patients. Saves the patients a ton of money because we're not dealing with any insurance BS, frankly. So it's a great way to practice. Megan Driscoll: Yeah, I love that.

⁓ John Hayes Jr: And the other half of my career for people that are interested is for the last 18 months now, I've been recruiting ⁓ independent physicians and physical therapists that want to join my team and put this into their practices. I went to med school, prior to med school and before residency, I had like 50 licensed treatment centers around the world that were using our protocols. And so we're reestablishing now that I'm actually back in practice full time. Which is great, yeah.

Megan Driscoll: I love that. If there's one supplement you should take for neuropathy, what is it? John Hayes Jr: There is no one supplement. It's misnomer.

And that's really the key. That's really the key. It's a system. It's got to be.

And we actually published the research to prove that. yeah. No. Correct.

That's a good point. Good point. Yeah. Megan Driscoll: It's a system.

Yeah. Well, there's never a one hit wonder. And that's true with AI as well. Actually, there's no one hit wonders.

There's no one piece. Yeah, exactly. So tell me a little bit, because I think this is going to be interesting for medical practices whom are wanting to get on the train, wanting to get on the AI train, right? To make their lives easier, save time, increase revenue, whatever it is.

So yeah, maybe we could just start with some of the things that you are implementing in your practice right now. John Hayes Jr: Sure. Yeah. Yeah, so how it started for me is going back about four or five years ago, I started with a really, really wonderful social media expert.

And he said, look, this is the drill. You now have an opportunity to make things easier for you in terms of creation and that type of thing. So at the time I started to do some research in chat GPT, which I still really love, by the way. I love everything it's become ⁓ and doing some just general research, not clinical research by any means at that particular point in time.

But it's evolved substantially. What happened to me about, gosh, 18 months ago is I needed some assistance on interpreting. ⁓ radiology results like a perfect example. I sent a patient for what's called a hipatofibroscan, which is a test for liver fibrosis, fibroidic liver disease, and so on and so forth.

And you get the radiology report back and some of them really good, but they have a lot of stipulations. So this is this, this is this, this is this. And so one night I'm just sitting here at this desk. thinking, hmm, I could use a little help on this just for yucks.

I'm going to put in a chat, GPT and see what it says. And I was blown away. say, can you stage this liver disease for me. Yes, here it goes.

then before I actually went further with it, I saw I went to Medscape and then went to some other medical platforms like, God darn, this is like incredible. Talk about time saving and a huge, huge advantage. And so I've started to do that more and more. I'm a huge fan now of Medscape and Doximity, but Medscape in particular is phenomenal AI.

Anybody that's a licensed physician, ⁓ my God, you know, Megan Driscoll: So the tool built within the platform. ⁓ John Hayes Jr: Yeah, and anybody who's a licensed medical physician, you can get the full Medscape platform. There's no charge for it. It's incredible.

It's always been a wonderful source of ⁓ research. I used it in my previous career, and especially in medical residency, I used it all the time. And now just to have that feature inside is a game changer. It really is.

Megan Driscoll: So in terms of AI, so how the AI is working is you're kind of giving it a prompt and saying, this is what I've got going on. This is my, this is, is that how you're using it? John Hayes Jr: Yeah, well yeah, you know, exactly. Yeah, typical situation.

this is really important because I find myself now I'm like just blown away how much time is actually saved. So I have XYZ patients. She has drug allergies, blah, blah, blah. She does not tolerate this.

She's got these symptoms. She's got these clinical results. What would be your recommended course of treatment? And then it'll come back and ask me additional questions.

What our labs look like and so on and so forth. And then by the time you're done, like, holy cow. And of course, so this is a thing. It's a tool.

tool. It does not mean it's always right, but double checking it in Medscape it's easy because you can just search inside regular Medscape which is like an encyclopedia and it's like blows me away. It's incredible. Megan Driscoll: Yeah, it's like a, ⁓ it's just indexing things faster, right?

I you still need your MD brain to decide, right, if this is the right information, but then it's indexing it so quickly that you're getting to that, like, narrowed down answers faster, and then you can kind of take the next step. John Hayes Jr: Much faster. Yeah, ⁓ yeah. Sure, for sure, for sure.

Yeah. Right. Yeah, so what I've done for other docs that are listening is oftentimes what I'll do if it's a question, I'll pop into PubMed, which is the government database, pop into PubMed. And this is kind of funny too.

I'll never forget when I was a resident, one of my first months on internal medicine on the floor, I'm walking around, I had this attending doctor, she was just phenomenal. Megan Driscoll: Mm-hmm. John Hayes Jr: And ⁓ I said to her, how do you know all this stuff? Or she says, ⁓ I just Google it.

So it was like the beginning. But now that we have all the other resources, it's true, though. It's true. Because in this age, a paperless age largely, we have so many more tools at our fingertips.

Now with Google AI and other things out there, it pulls data from a lot of different places. And it's a game changer. If we use it right, it's a game changer. It really is.

Megan Driscoll: Yeah. Yeah. I actually, in my chat GPT, have, so I do projects. I have a paid account, obviously, and I have project folders and I have a health project folder and I've already trained the health project folder sort of what I want.

I want, when I asking you a question, I want you to go to both to PubMed and to Google and to, you know, essentially look for out of the box sources for information when you're answering me on any question that I have. So don't give me an answer unless there's some supportive data. John Hayes Jr: Mm-hmm. Sure.

There you go. Yeah. Megan Driscoll: And then I kind of gave it some parameters, like I would like research that's only in the last 10 years. ⁓ So I want kind of like up to date stuff.

so I get really, honestly, like people come to me and I'm like, well, this is what I think you have, but it could be a variety of different things and you should go see a doctor. But I've narrowed it down for you to these two things that I think. And I also do it for, like you just were talking about allergies. I also do that to my mom.

I do my mom's medication and she takes a bunch of stuff, obviously. John Hayes Jr: Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Right. There you go. Yeah, for sure. Megan Driscoll: And so whenever we're like getting prescribed something new, I'm not really always taking their word for it.

I'm dumping all of the list into Chachi PT and saying, you know, where are there things that I should be worried about? And it actually has been really helpful to say like, you can take these two things, but you should take one in the morning and one at night. And I was like, ⁓ I can do that. Cause I do your pills for the morning and night anyway.

So yeah, there's like a lot of like really practical tools for the regular person to be able to use too, but. John Hayes Jr: Exactly interaction checking. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Correct. Megan Driscoll: I didn't know about Medscape, so that's really actually quite cool. I might add that to my project folder saying I'd like you to go on Medscape as well. John Hayes Jr: So there's this if you're not a physician there's limited access to it but there is there's some public access to it I believe so it's good.

Megan Driscoll: Cool. Yeah. Tell me a little bit about how you're using AI in like running your business and ⁓ in client acquisition and if you're doing it in any of those spaces. John Hayes Jr: Oh my God.

this is, it's funny we're having this conversation today because when I first met you, I was talking about this a little bit, but this past, this is a true story. So this past weekend, because I'm now targeting independent physicians and physical therapists, I had been doing some traditional marketing, working with marketers and with social media ads. And then, I have a business coach too, I said to him last week, I said, you know what, the problem is I'm not attracting the right clients.

I'm not pulling people that are fully independent or are sincerely interested in what I'm doing. How do I fix this? So what I did a week ago, I stopped everything I was doing. The marketer I was using, I said, I'm done, not doing this anymore.

⁓ I had somebody else who was working for me part time and I said, sorry, but this is not working. I literally spent this past weekend, ⁓ mainly in chat GPT and I said okay this is my issue these who people I would love to talk to what are your recommendations and literally it came back Megan with just a litany okay it asked me some questions then it came back with okay so given where you're at here's what I recommend you should use Apollo AI you should use Apollo AI But you should start very small, would, and literally full instructions, you just start with three separate lists.

Don't spend a lot of money. And these are the titles of three separate lists you should put together. And okay, so well, how do I find people to help me? Well, Upwork, which I've used before, but don't spend more than 25 to $50 an hour, because this is a test.

I'm like, holy cow. Unbelievable. Yeah, it's incredible. It's just it's an Megan Driscoll: So you know that's what I do.

Yeah. So what I do basically is you give me your niche. Like, who's our avatar? Who are we going after?

And I use Apollo, but I use a couple other places too. And I also use LinkedIn Navigator, Sales Navigator. And essentially, I use AI tools on the back end to scrub the data. So in LinkedIn, as an example, I can pull everyone's email addresses off the back end within a couple minutes.

John Hayes Jr: You know, it's such a great tool. Sure. Right. Megan Driscoll: And then I actually go through quite a few stages of AI scrubbing so that when we do start reaching out to people via email, that they open it because they're real legitimate email addresses that aren't going to bounce.

So I get between like 70 and 80 % open rates. ⁓ And then what I do in addition is all of that. So I kind of been trying to calling it a little bit like company in a box because what I also do is create the CRM on the backend so that everybody we're reaching out to. John Hayes Jr: I There you go.

Yep. That's phenomenal. That's great. Sure.

Yep. Megan Driscoll: not only gets initial like outreach, which says, hey, I'm Dr. John Hayes. This is what I do.

working for, you know, I'm looking, I run this, are you interested in exploring this kind of therapy? This is my offering, whatever. Once you, excuse me, once you go through that, I essentially put them into a CRM and now you're automating and connecting with them forever. So people leave me within 90 days with like a CRM with like 5,000 people in it usually.

That's like what we populate. So, ⁓ so yeah, so, basically what he, John Hayes Jr: Right. Yeah, we're doing the same thing. Yeah, it's incredible.

Yeah, it's incredible. Yeah. Megan Driscoll: Apollo, well, what Chachi VT told you to do is essentially what I do for companies. Because oftentimes it's like, it's still a lot of work for you to manage it and mine it.

And to be honest with you, the automations on the backend of the CRM, I use Go High Level, are pretty, they're not easy to use and there is some like connectivity. So I actually have, I employ a full-time Go High Level expert. So he, yeah, cause it's. John Hayes Jr: Correct.

Correct. I do too. I do too. Makes a big difference.

Huge difference. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

But you know, the nice thing about that because, you know, with Go High level because for any doctors listening, it's a wonderful patient CRM. It really is. And, you know, using... Megan Driscoll: really, really hard to do it yourself.

And if something breaks, you're like, ⁓ what do I do? Yeah. It is. are you using it, so are you using the CRM for both patient, like client acquisition purposes, or are you also using it to manage your existing patient load?

Both, okay. John Hayes Jr: Yes. Yeah. Both.

actually. Yeah. You know, I've got, like yourself, a really good expert who's helped me set it up. I've been using it now for about 18 months.

It's a game changer. Yeah. It's a total game changer. Megan Driscoll: It's a game changer, yeah.

I've tried to, I think people, some small businesses are almost like afraid to do it. ⁓ John Hayes Jr: Listen, they are afraid. They are afraid. And so this is one of the issues, too, for you people out there, you know.

In my opinion, the only thing that's going to fix healthcare is more doctors saying no and being private. There's so much BS out there and there's so many physicians that are so upset. One of the most exciting things I've seen this week is on X there's a doc out in Colorado, it was an ED doc for 20 years, set up an urgent care. He calls it direct, I think, direct urgent care or something like that, direct emergency care, DEC or something instead of DPC.

His clinic was slammed the first couple of weeks, know, saving patients literally thousands of dollars. versus going to the emergency room. There are direct surgical practice now, DSC, direct surgical care and so on and so forth, but it requires an entrepreneurial mind and an entrepreneurial bent. You have to, you know...

Since I was a kid a teenager I was told I was unemployable because I didn't want to follow anybody else's rules always my own only my own rules So and I'll take that as a compliment like Dan Kennedy said back in the day be unemployable Drive your own, know I tell people all the time build your life first and build your practice around it and that's what I've always done and that's why I had to try to help people but it's Easier now than it's ever been if you just learn the technology step up and learn it But sadly there's still people out there now like some Megan Driscoll: you John Hayes Jr: physicians aren't even good with email.

mean, come on. So it's different world. Megan Driscoll: I know. And I think, yeah, I totally agree with you with regard to the private pay market.

mean, like, if we talk about the emergency room, I had to go to the emergency room not long ago and I got like a $750 bill. I mean, I have private health care. pay, I think I pay $40,000 for my family's health care. Like, it's not cheap.

And I was like, on top of it, I'm still gonna pay $750 to show up at the emergency room. I was thinking to myself, John Hayes Jr: Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ yeah, yeah, it's not.

Megan Driscoll: I don't think I'll ever do that again. I'd rather wait and just see because yeah, yeah, yeah, if you're having a heart attack. In my case, it wasn't as big of a deal. I definitely didn't probably need to go there.

But it was the weekend, and I was like, I don't want to wait till Monday. But I do think that there's a real need for this. And I do think that that's kind of some of the direction that we're going to go in. So now with regard to managing your patient load.

John Hayes Jr: Well, if you can. this is the thing. Yeah, Right. Yeah.

But see. Mm-hmm. Megan Driscoll: Do you use AI for anything like managing your patient load, like reaching out to them? Do you put out like a newsletter or anything like that?

John Hayes Jr: Oh yeah, well we publish twice weekly newsletters. do big on social media, have been forever. We do a lot of videos, a lot of static posts. What I've been doing now more is it's so funny because my patients know up to this too and I have a woman who's a wonderful marketer and last week she printed out this gigantic thing.

Okay, so this is how AI is finding you. And I went and looked at it and said, yeah, I'm doing most of these things but I'm going to make some changes to my website. I'm going to list more of this. And one thing I started to do last week is just kind of Megan Driscoll: Okay.

John Hayes Jr: you know, when I do like a TikTok video, because there's so much back and forth, I'm like, ⁓ my god, just stop. I started putting research links into some of those articles. And doctors are responding like, holy cow, Dr. Hayes, I had no idea.

See, here's the published article right here. But it contradicts what you were saying. So I said, but that's why put it in here. So we'd have an intelligent discussion.

Megan Driscoll: Yeah. I mean, you're onto something. Yeah. I mean.

You've really ⁓ embraced this, which again, I think is rare to be honest. ⁓ It really is. And it's like, how can we get people to feel more comfortable? mean, we're talking about two separate things.

We're talking about like client acquisition and just like having a, having a system. It's really a sales system. What is your client acquisition system? You have to have one.

You can't just say, I'm going to post online or do Google ads and think that that's going to be enough. It's not. So there's that. John Hayes Jr: Yeah, it is.

No, it's not. Correct. Megan Driscoll: And then there's the other piece about embracing social media and really figuring out what really works and playing with it enough. And I think that's a piece where ⁓ what I find, what I hear a lot and ⁓ experience myself just is like the time, the time invested.

So talk about how you're managing that. Like how are you managing the time it's taking you to do that versus managing like your patient load and like having a life outside of work as well. John Hayes Jr: Right. Right.

So this is something I taught a course on almost 20 years ago. I hire incredible high school and college students. They're tech litter, they're savvy, they're polite, they're timely. They know a lot of this stuff and they run circles around me and a lot of this stuff.

⁓ So they've been an immense help. ⁓ That makes a big, difference ⁓ because Go High Level is enough to just sit down and edit stuff and tweak things and coach them and that type of thing. the other thing I like about Go High Level too, Megan, is you've got the media platforms right in there, which is really cool. But you know what?

I think another really important point this. If you're in private health care and you're a physician especially and you think you don't need to know this, you're gonna suffer. Patients are doing this. Hello?

Patients are doing this. They're using all the tools. They are on chat GBT. They're searching for you.

They're searching for answers. They come in with a boatload of questions and you tell them something. They're going home and they're researching it. You know, you know the the rate on people searching now AI versus just Google regular Google search just like through the roof.

Yeah. Megan Driscoll: SEO is dead. mean, I think the numbers went, so I think we went from like 30 % of people are finding, ⁓ searching and finding what they need on AI, then the following month in one month, it went from 30 % to 40%. And, and actually, ⁓ actually did a podcast on this a couple of weeks ago, which ⁓ ultimately what we, what we talked about was that the criteria by what, which AI is giving John Hayes Jr: Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Megan Driscoll: recommendations is not the same as what Google is giving with regard to recommendations. They're very different.

And it's almost like we've gone with old is new. So there's a lot of like better business bureau, they're pulling from better trust pilot, ⁓ recommendations, reviews, things that like we kind of didn't think were important anymore. We thought we could kind of like bypass that with social media and getting in front of people. And now it's come back into fashion.

So it's really interesting. And there's quite a few, I think, website, quite a few AI companies actually who are built around this. John Hayes Jr: Mm-hmm. Correct.

Correct. Mm-hmm. Right. Megan Driscoll: put your website in and it'll tell you how it's scoring on AI, which is I think what you referenced.

And I do think that that's actually a really good thing to do because I think that's kind of what's gonna happen. mean, if it's jumped by 10 % in one month, we're probably talking about by the end of the year, 90 % of searches will be happening in AI, which is insane. You know, I'm doing a podcast with someone next week and I'm interested on your take on this. She's a leader in the field.

She's been working with large language models since the 90s. She has... John Hayes Jr: Right, exactly. Yep.

Totally, Yeah. Megan Driscoll: started and run and exited multiple companies. She basically only, I mean, the fact that I have her on my podcast, I'm psyched about, but she also just kind of exclusively works with like the big companies like Nike and Pepsi, and she's advising them on AI. And her take on this, which I found is incredibly interesting, is that 90, I don't even wanna say this.

90 % of small businesses are going to be out of business in three years. John Hayes Jr: They very well could be. They absolutely could very well be. Megan Driscoll: And her reasoning for it, which I think is interesting reasoning, is that they have been built to this time not with AI in mind.

And it's kind of like bolting AI onto the company in the best ways you can, right? Or not doing it at all, like just kind of being a wait and see, right? Bolting it's better than wait and see for sure. Let's bolt on anything you possibly can.

But what's gonna happen is they can't compete with companies John Hayes Jr: Right. Sure. Yep. Megan Driscoll: who are starting with AI as the beginning.

like they're starting AI from the get-go. what she's saying is she's like, as an example, the company I just started two weeks ago, I have 50 people working for me for free. I have 50 AI agents. You can't keep up with me.

There's no chance. And she's right. She's absolutely right. And so she thinks that there's gonna be kind of like a bloodbath of small businesses.

And then what will happen is, companies will restart with a totally different mindset on how to even build from the ground up because they'll be starting with AI in mind. ⁓ And that's what she's basically training some of these large companies to do. Forget everything you've ever been taught about business. Forget everything you've ever been taught about marketing.

Forget everything and you're gonna have a totally different new mindset as you move forward. And she said it's incredible that it is happening. She's seeing people in real time forget everything, but that's really, really hard for small businesses because They're not sitting cushy in a seat at Nike with a salary, right? John Hayes Jr: You know, no, mean, listen, I mean, wake up and get it.

And look, you can build a good team. You know, you know, there's better than anybody. You just build a good team. have to you have to have people that are helping, but you don't have to spend a fortune.

You can save a fortune to save an absolute fortune. Megan Driscoll: One of the things that I'm doing now is I'm training my own AI agents. So I hope to have like five or six by next month. ⁓ And then what I want to do is teach other people how to build their own AI agents or build them for them basically.

⁓ So that you would have your own marketer, you would have your own administrative assistant, would have, you know, all the, all the really like jobs. That's right. That, and they're just running all the time working for you on the weekends. Yeah.

So cool. John Hayes Jr: There you go. Yeah. Good for you.

Perfect. Perfect. That'd be great. The tools for the business.

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. It's good stuff.

It really is good stuff. It just is. Megan Driscoll: So I wonder, so what's your, ⁓ like when you think about your practice, so you have one office, is that right? You have one place that you're in business.

Okay, so what's your like larger plan for growth? John Hayes Jr: Right now I'm in office, yep, yep. So my larger plan for growth is I'd like to have some additional direct primary care practices on the South Shore of Massachusetts, which is where I live. That's what I like to do.

And I fully expect the ⁓ as the neuropathy and chronic pain thing expands, I really, really, I want to have hundreds, if not thousands of independent physicians and physical therapists helping 30 million people that need real help because they're not getting it now only because we're not trained as physicians to, you you're trained to, okay, So peripheral neuropathy, onboard certified family medicine, life family medicine examination, how do you treat peripheral neuropathy, gabapentin and lyrica, two questions, 30 million people.

Because that's kind of how we've, you know, we've been taught and we are in this country, we are way behind what's been done in Europe for a lot of these pain things. You know, Europe has been using low level light therapy for years before it was done here. And some of when I did my original research going back even 18 years ago, the I was finding that was done in Europe on electrotherapy and neuro stim not just you know clinical side effects but metabolic side effects I'm like what you did this research actually found this metabolic side effects and doing this stuff it blows me away and now it's just like no they just want to you know let's have with all due respect let's just have another very expensive drug or new procedure or let's do a spinal implant stimulator for a hundred grand Megan Driscoll: Well, and I'll tell you too, some of those drugs have a lot of side effects.

I know my mom was put on gabapentin and didn't do well on it, like really didn't. What do you think about on like red light therapy and things like that? John Hayes Jr: I use a ton of it. I've been using red light therapy for years, years and years and years.

In fact, I worked with Thorolazer from the UK back in the day, and I was one of the first physician offices that had a red light therapy bed in the office. I've been treating pain patients with this, and not only pain, but so many other illnesses ⁓ with red light therapy for years. And so we've got some new stuff coming up on that too. Good.

Megan Driscoll: Yeah, so I have a panel in my house and I do stand in front of it and the other thing I'll tell you, I appreciate this. John Hayes Jr: There you go. Yep. There you go.

Yep. Megan Driscoll: I have a red light hat because, ⁓ well, menopause will make your hair fall out. So I've learned. And actually I have all these baby hairs that have grown since I've started using it.

Yeah, super cool. I love that. Okay, so you're really looking to expand through like a teaching. You're going to be teaching other physicians and physicals to sort of learn this protocol, if you will, basically.

So you're basically selling the protocol that can be used by other people. John Hayes Jr: Yep, there you go. There you go. Look at that.

Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Correct, correct, yeah. Well, yeah, so we actually licensed treatment centers ⁓ mainly for ⁓ intellectual asset protection. Even with that, ⁓ I decided to go to med school and people that kind of, with all due respect, ripped me off, basically built like multi-million dollar businesses.

So mine's next. anyways, exactly. But the other thing too is because Megan Driscoll: Yours is next. Yours is next.

No time like the present. John Hayes Jr: I love what I do, I do consulting and a lot of this stuff is now implemented in how we coach doctors. You're gonna be independent or you're gonna be happy in medical practice or physical therapy, wherever you're doing. It's a new world and it changes, ⁓ my God, it's incredible, it's unbelievable.

Yeah. Megan Driscoll: How do you think AI, sort of getting into the final question, how do you think AI will shape your business moving forward? Like what are the things you're worried about with AI and maybe what are the things that you're excited about? John Hayes Jr: No, you know, I think it's just, I think it's you have to be a good CEO.

have to be, you have to realize this is the world we're living in, guys. You're not gonna change it. You may not like it, but tough. It's just what we're living in.

So you may have to set things up differently ⁓ and teach people more. Like even one of the high schoolers that worked for me, that works for me, yesterday afternoon, busy. ⁓ afternoon in the office, said to her, I said, okay, so Kelly, go to Medscape, log in as me on my desktop over there, and I want you to go to the AI feature first, and I want you to search ⁓ Paget's disease, and then when I come back later in the day, you're going to tell me everything you about Paget's disease.

Boom. So that's one of the clinical aspects. And then she also just go high level. So she's in there, you know, posting with me, you know, we'll create videos together.

She'll do some wonderful static posts. And these kids are incredible. They're good writers. They're thoughtful.

And sometimes they continue to blow me away. So I'm just going to continue to do more of it and realize that, you know, the tools I'm building, they're going to ditch. It's just a really, really unbelievable, unbelievable pace of change. Megan Driscoll: Yeah, well, I agree with you.

I'm looking forward to what comes next. I do think that we're a little bit in a time of real wonder, real like. John Hayes Jr: Well, we are. We are.

But look, you have to be careful. ⁓ I've got a patient right now who literally lives her life around Claude, and she doesn't seem to be able to do anything unless Claude says you can do it. That's bothersome. That's bothersome.

Yeah. Megan Driscoll: ⁓ yeah. Claude is, I have had the experience of working with Claude and being like, Claude, that is, you are, I like what you're saying. I mean, Claude is, think much, ⁓ I use, I like Chachipi, Chachipi tea is my favorite.

I'm getting into Claude for like coding and things like that, which I think is better. But Claude for personal issues is kind of really great. I love the way he speaks to me, you know? John Hayes Jr: Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I do too. Yeah, my favorite too. Yeah.

Yeah. But you know, those, so a lot of it's good, but sometimes it's like, no, you have to take a pause here. This is not clinically relevant or, you know, it doesn't know everything. like it's not.

Well, it's already an issue now. If you think these patients aren't searching. Megan Driscoll: So. ⁓ yeah.

100%. Yeah, and I think this is going to become more of an issue for physicians actually dealing with the mental health aspect. Yeah. John Hayes Jr: Everything you tell them or everything they think they have or any medication they want and side effects and all that stuff before they come to you You are you are not informed because they are they absolutely are and they think I'm right to do it Well, they were right to do it.

Yeah, they have a right to do it. And if somebody questions me on that I said, okay. Well, that's really really good point I wasn't worried that let me check it against my resource. I'll let you know So yeah Megan Driscoll: Right.

Yeah. So it's better that you're ahead of it too. You know what they're finding. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, amazing.

We're spawning off all these little, all these little doctors who kind of want to know what's going. mean, but again, I also think it can be quite helpful to come in and say, Hey, this is what's going on. This is what, this is the research that I've done. This is what I think it might be.

You know, could we rule that out? You know, and, and, and that's, there's a lot of like, ⁓ empowerment for a patient to feel that way, to go to a doctor and say, like, this is, I'm, I'm, something's wrong. John Hayes Jr: Yeah. Right.

Sure. Megan Driscoll: You know, because I do feel like in some instances, and especially with women's health, I know this to be true because I've experienced it, where you'll get this like, ⁓ it's in your head or this is just what happens. And it's like, my hair falling out is not just what's going to happen. Like, I'm not just going to be okay with my hair falling out.

And I don't want to necessarily take a pill, you know, something that has side effects for it either that I have to be on for the rest of my life. So, you know, I think there is some empowerment. And when a doctor can respond to that in a positive way and say, John Hayes Jr: Right. Yep, exactly.

Yep. Great. Sure. Yep.

Exactly. Right. Megan Driscoll: Let's rule that out. Let's think about that too, that you've done that research.

John Hayes Jr: Exactly. And just be open and realize this is the world we're living in. It just is. And it's not going away.

The world is changing so fast. So fast. Megan Driscoll: Yeah, exactly, the patients have access. Yeah, I agree.

Well, this has been an awesome conversation. I so appreciate your time. How can people find your practice and like where are you located? What's your website?

John Hayes Jr: Of course, yeah, my pleasure. Yeah, so I'm in Marshfield, Massachusetts, ⁓ and you can go to my website, drjohnhaysjr.com. There's links on there for physicians and physical therapists.

There's also patient links, and there's also a link to our neuropathy site, neuropathydr.com. ⁓ Thanks for having me, Megan. I appreciate it.

All right, take care. Bye-bye. Megan Driscoll: Dr. John Hayes, Jr.

com. Great, super. neuropathydr.com.

Amazing. Thank you so much for coming today. I really appreciate it. It's been a great conversation.

Bye.