UNSCRIPTED · 2026-07-22 · 54 min
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
55 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
Phil Manchester started his career knowing he wanted to work with his hands and fix things - a passion instilled by his father through dirt bike racing and construction work. After exploring HVAC through Hudson Valley Community College in upstate New York, he landed at a dairy facility and eventually moved into field service as an HVAC technician, where he found the variety of troubleshooting problems across different locations rewarding. When promoted to team lead, managing nine service technicians across calls, paperwork, and technical support, Phil initially struggled with interpersonal skills and EQ. Through mentorship from a coworker, feedback from his wife, and deliberate work on himself - including reading leadership books each morning and learning to adapt his communication style to individual team members' needs - he repaired damaged relationships and transformed his approach to leadership. This journey has fundamentally shifted his mindset from purely technical excellence to seeing leadership as a path to helping others develop their careers, a realization that emerged from creating training materials, attending a leadership summit through Service Logic, his parent company, and experiencing the impact of enabling others' growth.
Phil was promoted to team lead managing nine service technicians while continuing to handle his own field calls, transitioning from focusing solely on technical problem-solving to managing people, paperwork, and providing tech support to his team.
Managing nine different personalities and learning how to communicate differently with each person was his hardest struggle; he initially came across as short-tempered and insensitive, which damaged some relationships before he recognized the problem and worked to improve his interpersonal skills.
He started reading leadership books each morning before work, spent time getting to know each team member individually, took mental notes on their communication preferences, and sought feedback from a coworker and his wife about his impact on others.
Creating an orientation training video for paperwork showed him the impact of helping others solve problems they'd been struggling with, which resonated with him and made him open to the team lead opportunity.
Attending the leadership summit for the parent company gave Phil a vision of becoming a leader who helps technicians develop their careers, shifting his focus from his own technical achievement to enabling others' growth.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode contains genuine insights about frontline leadership, generational management, and personal development, but much of the conversation consists of extended personal anecdotes and soft-focus questions that don't advance business understanding. Phil's observations on managing different personality types and age cohorts are valuable, but the density of actionable insights per minute is moderate at best - there's substantial throat-clearing and meandering narrative.
the way that you can respond to one person and you have that rapport and relationship and you can just be direct and to the point and they, uh, you understand each other versus another person that, you know, you need to remember. Okay, like let me start with, hey, how are you?
I always thought I would turn wrenches and never wanted anything to do with the office...but as I kind of started to do more wasn't just tech stuff like creating an orientation training for our paperwork and it started to become cool.
Phil's perspective as a frontline technician transitioning to team lead is valuable and underrepresented in business podcasts, but his specific advice - read leadership books, learn your people's names, set goals - is fairly conventional wisdom. The contrarian note that trades will expand due to AI-driven data center heat, rather than contract, is interesting but underdeveloped. Most frameworks he discusses (five-year planning, self-awareness, generational differences) circulate widely.
you're going to have people like this in the world. And I got to figure out how to deal with them. Whether it's a customer that's like this towards me or another technician, I still need to be there to help this guy.
the whole push to AI has created more, you know, more of these data centers, more of these server banks and more work for us.
Phil is a credible practitioner - a service technician and team lead with ~10 years of direct field experience who is actively solving real management problems with measurable results (team members now call him first, repaired relationships). However, his perspective is limited to one HVAC company and one regional market; he hasn't scaled a business, managed multiple locations, or operated at the strategic level that would make him a top-tier guest. He is substantially more credible than a consultant but not yet an operator at notable scale.
I'm a service team lead at Airtight Facilities
I'm out in the field still, um, doing my own calls. But I'm also there as that buffer between the nine service technicians that are on our team and the manager.
The episode relies heavily on anecdotes and personal reflection with minimal concrete data. Phil provides few specific metrics (team size of 9, age range 20-65, company lunches 3-4x per year), no revenue figures, timelines are vague ("over 10 years," "last year"), and no quantified outcomes from his leadership changes. He discusses generational differences but doesn't cite studies or data. The advice on AI and data centers is conceptual rather than evidence-based.
I have nine service technicians that are on our team
company lunches like three, four times a year, you know, they love that stuff
Sarah asks thoughtful follow-up questions and allows Phil space to reflect deeply, which elicits authentic self-awareness. However, she rarely pushes back, challenges claims, or digs into potential contradictions (e.g., how does the open-door policy actually translate to resource decisions? What happens when frontline needs conflict with margin pressure?). The conversation is warm and exploratory but lacks the intellectual friction that would test Phil's ideas or surface hidden complexity.
I'm curious. You know, you shared that you weren't doing a good job at first and you had to repair some of those relationships, and you've kind of been working on that. What helped you realize that you needed to do things differently?
How have you taken that recognition, like, what are the things you've been doing to work on, you know, being more individualized in how you interact with people
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
Throwing it back to a rerelease of the the very first episode of Frontline UNSCRIPTED - a series from Future of Field Service where host Sarah Nicastro steps away from the C-suite and hands the mic to the people doing the work.Phil Manchester, Service Team Lead at AirTight FaciliTech, joins Sarah Nicastro for the inaugural episode of Frontline UNSCRIPTED - a series that gives the mic to the people doing the work. Phil shares what drew him to the trades, how he made the leap from technician to team leader, and what frontline workers really need from leaders. Originally released in 2024, returning as part of our summer rerelease series.
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
Speaker A: Foreign.
Speaker B: Welcome to the first episode of Frontline Unscripted. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. So we have recorded over 350 episodes of the Unscripted podcast. And if you aren't familiar, that is a weekly podcast where I am talking with business leaders across different industries, uh, mostly service centric in nature, about the challenges they're facing, the trends that they see, the lessons they've learned and so forth. Uh, over many years of doing that, one of the things that comes up time and time again is the importance of listening to the voice of the Frontline, which is what sparked the idea for this new series, Frontline Unscripted. In the this series, rather than talking to business leaders, I will be talking to folks that, uh, are in frontline positions and getting their perspective on, uh, all sorts of different things. We're starting that series today with Phil Manchester, who is a service team lead at Airtight Facilitac. And we're going to be talking today about the question, why not shoot for the moon? Phil, thank you for joining me.
Speaker A: Thank you for having me, Sarah.
Speaker B: Yeah, I'm thrilled to have you here. Uh, when we connected to talk about doing this episode together, I learned so much, and I realized that I spent all of these years kind of focused on this one perspective. And while you learn certain, you know, macro, uh, sentiment from kind of looking at what leaders are looking at. Ah, you know, I learned so much in our conversation, so I'm excited to share that with our listeners. So to start, can you just give, uh, them a bit of the backstory you shared with me so, you know, kind of what you thought you would be when you grew up and then how that kind of translated into what you're doing today.
Speaker A: Yeah, so, I mean, I, I started off life, you know, racing dirt bikes. My dad raced three wheelers. They don't exist anymore when I was that age. So we got into dirt bikes. And, uh, that was one thing that really piqued my interest in mechanical things because I was always out there in the shop working with them on those. And, and then that turned into, you know, going to work with him on his construction sites and learn how to do that stuff. And, you know, really early on I just knew that I like to work with my hands and, and build things and fix things and figure out how everything works. I needed to figure it out. Like, my mom got mad at me a couple times for taking apart vacuums and not being able to put them back together yet. And then my dad had to sit there when he Got home from work, putting the dang vacuum back together because I was bored, and found a screwdriver. Um, so that all led into, um, me getting a job at a f dairy. They make Greek strained yogurt. And I didn't really know what I wanted to do in what industry. I loved construction, and I still love doing it. Um, but I didn't want to do it as a job. I just wanted to do that as my hobby. And ended up being a facilities technician. That kind of took me under his wing a little bit and told me about H Vac, um, in upstate New York. We didn't have a lot of air conditioning, so it's not something I thought about too much. So he took me under his wing, told me about a college HVCC in Troy, New York. They had an H Vac program, and told me, you know, it's a lot of brain, but it's a lot of working on things with your hands. And know, he thought I'd enjoy it. So I said, you know what? Why not? Let's check it out. Um, found out how much it costs, and I, I know I spent $12,000 in worst ways. So I said, let's get it. Let's just give it a try and see if I like it. And here I AM now, over 10 years later, still doing it. And, um, I'm loving it every day.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Most days. Most days.
Speaker B: Most days, yes. Well, none of us love our jobs every single day. Um, so. And I. I know you had said that as you were growing up, your perception of an office job is that you felt like it would feel like you're still in school, you didn't want to be sitting still every day. I guess as part of it, you knew that you wanted to, like you said, use your hands. You wanted to solve problems, you wanted to work on things, build things, fix things. And it was a matter of sort of figuring out what that would look like from a career perspective.
Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, obviously, if most people don't love high school and middle school and all that, I absolutely hated it. The whole sit in a chair all day long and stare at a desk and books was not any fun. And to me, that the office type job, just. That's exactly what I thought it was going to be like. And, uh, whether it is or it isn't, that's just what it clicked in my head was, you know, I was a kid staring out the window like I am right now every once in a while, just liking to see outside, liking to be outside, liking to Work with my hands. And, and the whole idea of going to the same place every day to work on the same stuff didn't really translate with me a lot either. And I did it for a few years. I really didn't like going to the same place. So now being in a service truck, I get to see all kinds of different businesses, buildings, equipment, you know, it, it's just that variety of things. Nothing m, nothing is ever the same during the day. You might be doing the same job, but the equipment's different, the site's different, the customers are different. It just feels like something new every day.
Speaker B: Yeah, that's a good point because when you were at uh, fi A you were working with your hands. Right. But you were in the same location day after day. And so part of it for you was also you like the variety of being at different locations and being out literally in the field and you know, visiting different places, encountering different situations. Ah, that sort of thing. What are some of the other aspects that you really enjoy about your role?
Speaker A: Um, so I mean just, it's always a good feeling when someone, someone, it's not a good thing when someone has a problem but when you get to go there and, and they're, they're over there sweating because it's 95 degrees out and they're, and you know, their business about to shut down and you go there and you figure out what's wrong and you, you basically just made their day. Mhm. You know, they're always so happy, normally are always so happy that you know, oh, I can feel the cool air coming out of the vents now. I'm so happy. You know, it's just, it's always a good feeling like I didn't save the world. But I definitely made their day better, which makes me feel better and it makes me proud of, of what I'm doing. Um, that, that's one of the biggest things and it's kind of translated into when I got this team lead role into helping some younger technicians on our team start to grow and learn and, and be a part of shaping that. We all have um, mentors that, that we, we dealt with and, and we got to learn from and it's, I've had my own and it's cool to now be the mentor and not the mentee and get, getting to help shape these guys futures and get them along to where I know they can be even if they don't quite see it yet sometimes.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And we're going to come back to that in a moment. I want to go back to the one point that you said when you were considering the H vac space. You said someone told you it was like a great combination of brains and, you know, working with your hands, fixing things. How have you found you like that combination? You know, it's not. It's not mindless work that you're doing. Right. Like, it takes a good amount of, um, you know, ability, mental ability to diagnose the issue, to figure out, you know, what's necessary for you to resolve it, et cetera. So there's that combination of, you know, using both your hands and your brain, uh, in all of these different environments day after day. How do you like that?
Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, it's a nice balance because there's some days where I feel like physically I didn't do anything, but I was set. I had to sit there and work my way through a problem with a meter or in a manual and. And use my brain to. To get through this. This issue. And it may be as simple as just reconnecting some wires or changing out one small part that takes five minutes, but it took a couple hours to find that part that was bad. Um, and then there's other days where, yeah, I could turn the brain off and just work and just do what I do. And, you know, it's. You don't. I don't. I wouldn't want too much of the brain, and I wouldn't want too much of just doing the brown. Really, this industry really gives you a nice balance of both, where sometimes you got to muscle things around and sometimes you gotta. You gotta outthink the problem.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And it just creates that where, again, where nothing's ever the same. Each day you get to have some variety and feel like it's something different, and you're doing it differently each day and just breaks up the monotony of the work, work, life.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, I definitely can understand that. I think it's interesting. Um, I've always enjoyed being in roles where I have a lot of variety as well. You know, I can't imagine myself, like, doing a job that is literally the same thing every day, you know, um, that's more formulaic, and some people love that. It's just not for me. Um, so I definitely understand that part. Phil, what would you say is hardest? So we talked about what you enjoy most about the role. What really challenges you, or are there any aspects of it that you have those moments where you're like, ah, I should have went into something else, or I really, really don't like this part.
Speaker A: Um, any day it's cold and raining and I'm on a roof and that's one of them. It's like every time you're out there pressure washing a coolant tower and it's 28 degrees out and starts to rain, you're like, why did I not either have rich parents or go into an office? Um, what kind of the worst days. But, but one of, one of the hardest things. You know, we can always put on coats and get warm and go inside and warm up. But of the hardest things has been like transitioning to this team lead role where when I was a service tech, it was about, here's your call, go do it, figure out the problem, fix it, go on to the next one. Now as a team lead, I have to worry about. So we have a service manager who's in the office. Team lead. I'm out in the, out in the field still, um, doing my own calls. But I'm also there as that buffer between the nine service technicians that are on our team and the manager. Mhm. I'm their first call for tech support. I'm the first call for paperwork support. You know, if they just have a brain fart and need to. A reminder of something they know, but they just can't pull it out of the filing cabinet up there. So learning how to deal with in a productive manner, in a, in a good manner. Nine different personalities.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And how each one of those people should be talked to or one guy, I can just answer the phone, hey, what's up? What do you need? Another guy might think I'm mad or in a bad mood because I answered that way. So that has been the hardest part. And for the good stretch of the beginning of my team lead, um, role, I wasn't very good at it at all. And it rubbed some guys the wrong way. And over the last year I've had to repair those relationships by working on myself and really learning how to, to talk to them. Well, and that's been the hardest struggle because it's a lot of finger pointing in the mirror like, nope, you're doing that wrong. You need to work on that. That wasn't them. They were just asking a question. You answered it like a jerk. You know, that that's, it's been really hard to just be like you're doing stuff wrong and point at yourselves and, and have to actually really work on it and not be able to ignore it. Like as a service tech, like, well, I was a jerk to that guy. But he'll get over it. It doesn't matter. Now they're looking to me for that help. And if they stop calling because I'm always in a bad mood or they think I'm always in a bad mood, or I'm just. They just don't like me because of how I respond to them. I'm doing a horrible job as a leader, team leader, and that can't happen. So that's been an interesting journey over the last, I say, six months or so. Yeah. Kind of, uh, fine tune my EQ skills, I guess, that I didn't think I would ever have to do. I thought I was just going to be turning wrenches and answering to the, the ivory tower. But that's changed.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But it's changing me for the better, so.
Speaker B: Yeah. And I have to commend you, Phil, because the, you know, the self awareness that you just described, to recognize, okay, this is actually a me thing and I need to work on this and I want to do better and be better. Um, I mean, I've talked to leaders that have been leading for 20 years and still haven't mastered, uh, that art. And it's really unfortunate. So I give you a lot of credit that, that early on, you know, you have been able to say, like, okay, I'm not really doing as well at this as I want to, so how do I figure out exactly what is going wrong and what I need to do differently? I'm curious. You know, you shared that you weren't doing a good job at first and you had to repair some of those relationships, and you've kind of been working on that. What helped you realize that you needed to do things differently? Like, was there, was it sort of a collective understanding or was there a moment where kind of a light bulb went off that you were able to kind of point to yourself and take accountability for how things were going and start doing things differently.
Speaker A: I think I got a little lucky in that aspect of I have a guy that works on our team and we've become, you know, good acquaintances and he's not afraid to shoot straight to me.
Speaker B: Hm.
Speaker A: So when I'm doing something, he'll tell me. I also have a wife that's not afraid to tell me when I'm, you know, being a jerk and point that out. And I think it was, it was a combination of, you know, things that I did wrong in my personal life that I didn't notice at work. And when I got put in this position and had now not just, you know, okay, my wife Was just being a little, um, sensitive today and I needed, she'll be okay. Now I have, you know, grown men in the field that can deal with a lot of crap being thrown their way, telling me that I'm, I'm, I'm being an insensitive jerk. And that was a big thing. And we had a guy that started with us, wasn't with us long, and we butted heads really bad. And um, that kind of was another one that happened at the same time where I was like, okay, there's going to be people like this now. I didn't stay long, but there's going to be people like this in the world. And I got to figure out how to deal with them. M. Whether it's a customer that's like this towards me or another technician, I, I still need to be there to help this guy. Even if we're not going to be buddy, buddy. Still got to be there. I still got to help. And figuring out how to navigate that all in a diplomatic manner was, was. It was really hard because I was not good at it. I was still very short tempered and it didn't go well. So his short tenure was very, uh, rough on the two of us.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But all that kind of came together, it seemed like at one time. And it was like, not a light bulb, but a slow, like dimmer coming up, you know, like, okay, you need to start working on this, but it'll be fine till later. And then eventually I was like, nope, I'm gonna ruin a team of guys that were working together pretty dang well, and I'm going to be the cause of things being worse and that can't happen. Yeah.
Speaker B: The other thing you pointed out that I think, um, is a really great observation that is a shift and some folks do it well and others need to work on it too. Is that recognition that not every team member needs the same leadership. Like you said, the way that you can respond to one person and you have that rapport and relationship and you can just be direct and to the point and they, uh, you understand each other versus another person that, you know, you need to remember. Okay, like let me start with, hey, how are you? You know, and kind of ease into things, you know, that that's a really astute observation because that's true. I think today, across all different industries, all different size organizations, et cetera, there, you know, the era of a leader being the person that just tells people what to do is no longer right. So if you're actually there to help people, people require Help in different ways. What's effective with one won't be effective with another. So I think it's really impressive that you learn that relatively quickly. And I'm curious, how have you taken that recognition, like, what are the things you've been doing to work on, you know, being more individualized in how you interact with people and just showing up, I guess better, um, than you felt you were before?
Speaker A: Yes. So I try to read every morning a little bit. Like I'm reading some leadership books and I, I found that I like to read in the morning because right before I go to work, I get to read a chapter of whatever book I'm reading. And if there's something in there, I can take to work with me and try to try to put it into practice that day and see how it works for me and whoever I interact with. Um, and it's just been about learning each guy individually and spending some time working with them, really talking and maybe not all about work, just about them and learning kind of a little bit more background in each person. And then it kind of helped how I had to speak to them, so. And then just mental notes on every guy of just like, okay, this guy likes me. Likes a. Hey, how. Good morning, how you doing? And this person's like, they just need an answer to a question and they want to get off the phone because they don't want to be on it. And that's just something I think take. Took me some time and I think it would take anybody some time. You just got to learn people.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: At least to a certain degree to be able to. I don't even know what the word I want is. Um, you know, working together.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Right. So I think, I think you just, you just got to learn people. And that's not something I've ever had to do.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So figuring it out kind of was like a deer trying to walk. I'm stumbling all over the place, but it seems to be getting better. And it, it's, in the last few months, it's really, it's come around where guys that didn't call me ever for help, now I'm the first call they make, so. And there's one guy that we butted heads really hard, me and him. Now we work together fine. But if something went wrong, we, we were just slamming heads against each other and it felt really good. I, I, um, just awesome feeling. Got chills when he said it. He's like, man, you're, you were light years better than you were six months ago. That's awesome because I feel like I can ask you anything and talk to you about it. I'm like, well, that's what I'm trying to do, so. Thank you. You know, it was just, it was really rewarding to know that the stuff that I'm doing is working.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. Because you get that sense, right, if the interactions start to feel better. But to actually hear that from someone that you're trying to build that relationship or repair that relationship with is definitely very impactful. Um, all right. I love it. So, you know, you said a little bit ago when you were talking about taking on the team lead role, like you said, you never really imagined yourself doing this. You thought you would just be turning a wrench and doing your own jobs day, uh, in and day out. Um, and so I'm curious how you kind of got to the point then that this was an opportunity. And now when we spoke, I think having this team lead role has opened your eyes to, to more opportunities and more potential. Uh, as a leader, you said that you're big on setting goals for yourself. And, uh, how we came up for the title is you said, why not shoot for the moon? Uh, and I just love that. So what do you think kind of helped you shift from this kind of mindset of. Yep, I like this work. I like being out and about. I like the variety. I like problem solving. I like working with my hands. I'm gonna do this forever. To sort of starting to be open to the idea of more and more and more and more.
Speaker A: I mean, that started a long time ago when I was just a kid. I mean, racing dirt bikes is an individual sport other than, you know, your mechanic working on the bike, which is when you're a kid, your dad or your mom, um, you know that no one was gonna make you go do better. So if you wanted to do better, you had to set a goal to do better and you had to work at it to get there. So, I mean, that, that was really big in my life teaching me, you know, I gotta be, I gotta set goals and I gotta, I gotta get to them. And uh, it's. It's kind of what I've always done through life is, is try to set a five year goal. And if I can get to it, great. If not, I just need to try harder until I do. And then as soon as I make it, we're going to set another goal. M. Um, I always thought I would turn wrenches and, and never wanted anything to do with the office. I was like, nope, somebody else can have that. That's not my thing. Um, but as I kind of started to do more wasn't just tech stuff like creating an orientation training for our paperwork and it started to become cool. The feeling that when I would make that and I put the video out and someone's like wow, I've been wondering how to do this for, for six months and now you just showed us how to do it. Thank you. You know, and that helping someone and actually seeing the results of what you did really started to resonate with me. And so we had um, the team lead position come open and I was like, well you know what, it wouldn't be a bad idea, might as well try for it. You know what I mean? My dad always said you can do whatever you want in life, you can scrub toilets, but you better be the best dang toilet scrubber there is out there. So to me that's just keep going, keep trying to do better. Uh, it's just helping my career and, and if I, if me helping myself, if, if I have to do, if I have to help other people to help me, I mean I think that's, it's a no brainer. And then it started to become more of a thought of if I help other people that just helps me personally feel better and eventually I'll, I'll do better just off of that.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: Type of thing. Um, so I just keep pushing to try to get more and once I started in the team lead role that, that feeling of helping people got better and better and better. And then I went to a training that was a leadership summit for Service Logic parent company and I was like, you know what, this would actually be really cool. I think I would really enjoy the switch up at some point to become the leader that I, I know I can be.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: With work and actually help these guys get to where they want to be in their career and not be so much about me anymore and what I need but to help other people has become just kind of grown into wanting to help people with their careers. Um, which is strange because I usually don't, I didn't like people ever at all. And now all of a sudden I want to help people and it's.
Speaker B: Yeah, it's different.
Speaker A: My wife is like this is weird
Speaker B: a little bit sometimes I think it' just you've unlocked a superpower that you have I think is what like you're clearly in my opinion made for that role. Like the fact that you haven't been doing it for that long and you've done this much work on yourself. And um, you had even mentioned earlier, like, not only helping people become what they want or to accomplish their goals, but helping them see their potential when maybe they don't see it yet. I think is, is such a great way of looking at, uh, a leadership role. Um, one of the things I know we're getting really off course, but that's why the podcast is called Unscripted. Uh, that I thought that I would love to ask you is you mentioned you always like to have a five year plan for yourself ever since you were young. And you try and work toward that. And you said, and if I don't hit it, I just keep going. I'm curious if there's anything you can point to that helps you have that attitude instead of, I didn't accomplish it, so I feel defeated, I give up, I'm not going to set a next goal because I didn't reach this one. How do you kind of keep looking ahead instead of spiraling when you don't accomplish a goal you've set for yourself? Or like you said at the beginning when we started talking about the team lead role, like when you have that moment of having to look in the mirror and be like, like it's actually me that's the problem. You know, how do you, you just seem to like, okay, well I'm going to do what I need to do to get better. Then instead of, you know, letting your mind kind of turn negative, is there anything you can think of in terms of how, what helps you do that?
Speaker A: Yeah. So, I mean, I won't go into too much detail, but as a, as a youngin, as a teenager, I got into a lot of trouble all the time. Um, I wasn't a very well behaved teenager. Um, and when people would say, you know, oh, you did xyz, so you're, you know, you're not going to amount to anything in life. That started us fire within me to prove people wrong. That just ain't. It hasn't went out.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And now, now it's not as much as anyone saying I can't do it. It's just if I don't, I'll beat myself up if I don't do something more than anybody else ever will. I don't think I've had many bosses that ever had to like, you did this wrong. Don't do it again. Because they already know I'm beating myself up that I didn't accomplish what I set out to do.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And it kind of, it almost pisses myself off that I didn't do it. And I'm like, well, I guess I gotta just dig down and make it happen. Because if I give up, I'm um, I'm always gonna have the what if in the back of my head and I, I just can't live with that. Yeah, I hate the what ifs in life that, well, if I would have just tried for another month, you know, reading, doing this or that, I could have accomplished what I set out for. And it's so. I just, I just don't want to live with the what ifs in life. I just, I want to set a goal, make the goal. And, and if it, if it doesn't happen on my timeline, which goes, you know, you might set a five year goal to become President United States and that ends up happening in 20. If I gave up at year five, I would have never known. And it just, it's not something that ever worked for me. Um, and, and a lot of like I said that comes from some trouble in my teen years and, and racing, you know, if I wanted race and I knew this guy was better than me, I'd go during the week and work until I was better than him. And if you didn't, no one was going to come save you, no one's going to come push you across the finish line. It's just you and against the world for the most part to make happen what you want, you know, and, and it's just something I kind of try to carry with me because the, the negative stuff, it, it just, it's not good for you and it's not good for anyone in your life to just spiral because something didn't work out just qu.
Speaker B: Well, if you let that take hold, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. Right? Like to your point, if you just keep going, you know, I think sometimes people don't realize how much they could accomplish if they just didn't stop when it got hard. Do you know what I mean? Like it's, if you just to your point, it's like, okay, well I set a goal for five years, it might take me six, but I'm not going to know if I don't keep plugging away at it. Right. And I think you'll do great things as a result. Right. I think sometimes, you know, people let that self doubt creep in too much and it, it can hold a lot of people back. Um, um. So yeah, I think that's really good. So I'm curious. Um, you know, you mentioned that you are supporting now, uh, not only yourself, uh, to get your work done, but these nine technicians, and you said they raid, they range in age from 20 to 65. So we already talked about the fact that regardless of age, they're all different people. Right. And they require different types of communication and a different approach, uh, that you've learned really quickly to be successful in how you're interacting with them. But are there any kind of differences you've noticed, age or otherwise, in terms of like, you know, what they want out of either their day to day employee experiences or their careers?
Speaker A: Oh, definitely. I mean, one of our guys, he's, he's getting ready to retire. So I mean, talking to him is, you know, it's, I relate more to how I can talk to him more naturally. Um, it, and it seems like it happens a lot with the older age group. You know, people are a little bit more blunt a lot of the time and you can just be straightforward to the point and like, all right, let's get off the phone. We don't want to see her texting and calling all day long, which I like. But, um, you know, compared to some of the, you know, the guys are about 20 years old. Some things have to be said a little nicer and maybe tiptoed around a little bit, which I, I don't. It is not a problem. It's just everybody's a little different and learning that is the hardest part. And if you're set in the ways of, um, being too blunt and too honest and just here's your information and buy. It's not going to work for the younger generation. They want, they want a little bit more of the why behind things than just here's the information. Go. They, they're, they're asking why. You know, most of the younger guys on my team, it's like, okay, go do this. Why am I doing that? Oh, okay, you don't even know why. Let's go, I'll show you. And we'll, we'll go over it and we'll show you why we do this, these things so that there's a reason behind it. And you can take that as someone talking back to you or you can take it as, oh, they just want to learn. They don't want to just be told what to do. They want to know why they're doing it. And you know, it, it presents its challenges, but it, it's a good thing. It means they're hungry for knowledge. And I, I love that. I mean, you give me a guy who knows everything but wants to do nothing. Mhm. I'll take the kid who doesn't know anything but wants to do everything.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Every time.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's a good point. What about things like, you know, flexibility or um, recognition versus compensation? You know, like. Well, maybe I don't know if you're having those conversations because to your point you still have the, the service manager who is more of. That's who they report to. Um, I'm just thinking like there's a, you know, we talk quite a bit about the fact that there are not only differences in, across generations of how people prefer to communicate sometimes, but also in what they're looking for, you know, from their work. Like some people might come in at 20 and they have an eye to. I want to progress, I want to, you know, grow, expand. Um, you know, a lot of times we talk about the fact that flexibility is, is more important to younger talent, etc. Um, have you noticed any kind of trends or.
Speaker A: I mean. Yeah, we've, I mean I always talk about, to these guys about, about this stuff to a degree. I can't do much about it at this point. I can still talk to him about it so that if some point in my career I do become a manager, I, I kind of have.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: Stored away somewhere. Um, Yeah, I mean it seems like some of the older generation, you know, they're kind of more like hey, give me a good paycheck, give me an extra week of vacation, a nice bonus at the end of the year and I'm, I'm happy as can be as long as you're not looking over my shoulder with everything I do.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: Where the younger generation definitely, I feel like they, they like more of the connection to, to the team and, and the office. Mhm. Where they kind of want to know those people a little bit and just giving them another dollar which uh, of course everybody wants more money.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But the other stuff like where we started doing you know, company lunches like three, four times a year, you know, they love that stuff. They come to the office, they eat food, we, we put out cornhole and the ax throwing game and you know, it just creates a little bit of camaraderie between everybody and they definitely enjoy that more. You can tell. Kind of the older generation just sits over here after they've eaten and wait to be told they can leave. And you know, uh, the younger guys are kind of more doing the mingling and the playing games and it, it just makes it fun. There's, they want that balance in, in work where it's not just like, I'm gonna go do my nine to five grind and punch away at this, this job. I want to have a little fun when I do it and might be different for some people, but you know, you definitely gotta. It's not a bad thing. It's just boosting morale for those younger guys and making them want to stay with that particular company longer.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And then you got the guys in the middle where I'm kind of. I like both sometimes. Some days I just want to be left alone to do my work and go. And some days I want to cut up and have a good time while we're working and, and you know, it's just, it's a very wide range, you know, between. What is it like five generations working now?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Uh, of what everybody wants and needs. So.
Speaker B: And you have, you always have people that will break the mold. Right. That might be the exception to what you would categorize as the characteristics of what their generation likes or wants. Right. So it goes back to the point you made, which is the importance of getting to know these people a bit like as humans. Right. And just what's important to them? Um, you know, how, how do they kind of prefer to interact and like, you know, who are they outside of work? Right. Like, I think you can be a better leader if you take the time to understand the people that you're leading because, you know, how else are you going to understand, you know, what they value and what they're looking for and you know, how you can help them most effectively. Um, I'm curious, I wanted to ask about the role of technology. So the role that plays in your day to day life now, how you think that will evolve? I mean, AI is a huge topic of conversation. So if that kind of comes into your thinking, what are your thoughts on, um, kind of the, the current use and future use of technology?
Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, obviously technology is a great thing when it's used properly. I mean, we used to, used to have a meter that was in a box like this big and it weighed 10 pounds and you had to carry it around. Now I got one that weighs, you know, half a pound and it does everything. I don't need six different things to do one job. And that one meter does them all. Analog gauges, you know, big heavy analog gauges. Now we got little digital probes that are this big that don't lose any refrigerant. You know, the, the advancement of technology is great. I mean there's certain things that obviously could go be used in the wrong manner. But you know, like, like AI, you know, they talk about, you know, AI is going to come for jobs. Well, certain ones possibly, yeah. Ones that can be repetitive and, and just put to an algorithm and done a million times a minute. That'll be great. But I mean I think we're a long way out of anyone in, in the trades ever getting replaced by, you know, a robot climbing up on a roof to diagnose a unit. Um, but when it comes to AI in, in some of the apps that they're putting it in, it's a, it's very helpful. I mean I, I can search a model number and AI will search the entire Internet for the answer and I can have the answer in, in 10 seconds and a little bit of reading.
Speaker B: Uh, you know, like you have to kind of to your point, you have to know your stuff, right? Because you don't want a uh, false answer and then you're off and running doing the wrong thing or what have you. Like you have to apply your own intelligence to what information it's serving up.
Speaker A: Right. I mean as an apprentice guy who doesn't know anything to trust Google AI, uh, every single time. Don't do that. I have heard some fun answers on there and I'm like, that's not right. I know that.
Speaker B: Like, yeah, I don't know what's right, but I know this is not it.
Speaker A: Like that doesn't sound right at all. I don't know what you're talking about. Um, yeah, I mean obviously we have to know how to use that tool.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: I mean it's not just a blind, like. Okay, that's what Google said. Perfect. You know, you gotta still be able to deduct what, what's right and what's not. But it's helped a lot. I mean now they have AI generated ah, service call summaries. Yeah, I could fill out this information and it gives me a summary. Now again, sometimes those summaries sound exactly like what wrote it.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: It does not sound like a human whatsoever. And where you're gonna have to rewrite half of it to make it sound right. Um, but I mean for certain people, if you're, if you struggle with English a little bit, you know, we're all not, we're not Einstein's out in the field. Not all, not everyone. You know, some of us are not very good with technology and typing and that AI stuff. I mean you type in 10 sentences, it gives you two paragraphs of a nice clean professional write up to hand to a customer. So I mean it's definitely, it's definitely going to help if we use it correctly. But if we start to rely on it too much, it becomes a crutch that slows us down and doesn't do us any good.
Speaker B: Yeah. I was thinking about what you said in terms of, you know, we're a long way from it taking um, any jobs in the trades. And I was thinking about, I listened to a presentation last fall. Um, it was a Harvard Business Review, um, future of Work presentation. It was all virtual, but they had like a day of speakers and Walmart's CEO at the time spoke. Now he has since been, he's, he retired and he, there's a new CEO. But this wasn't all that long ago. I think it was the beginning of November. But he was actually talking. Part of his session was around how Walmart is planning to use AI, like what their AI strategy is and a part that, you know, HBR wasn't going to focus on. But I found so interesting is when he got into sort of talking about the reality, Right. That like it will replace some jobs in, if you think about the retail context, like there are certain jobs that, to your point, they are very formulaic. They are something that technology could do. What they're actually doing is finding people, um, within those roles that want to do something else in the organization. And one of the biggest areas that they are exploring and acting on is um, turning those employees into technicians. Because he was saying we have all of these systems across all of our stores that need fix. There's so many shortages in, uh, trades workers, so why not have our own team, et cetera. So I'm like, how interesting is that, that one of the biggest companies, um, looking at AI, like part of their strategy for how they will redeploy their workforce is into field technicians. You know, like, it's just a really interesting thought.
Speaker A: Yeah. And I mean, and that's like with, with H Vac, the more AI and the more computers, the more data centers. Mhm. The more computing power you need. Well, data centers create a lot of heat.
Speaker B: Uh-huh.
Speaker A: You need people like, like me to go and work on the stuff that keeps all that stuff cool.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Or it all just crashes and it's useless technology. Uh, so this whole push to AI has created more, you know, more of these data centers, more of these server banks and more work for us.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And, and as it expands as far as it's going to go, that's just going to expand the amount of work that we have and that we're going to need to do. And, and it's, it's definitely, I see it, you know, on LinkedIn and stuff, the talking points about, about all that. And so I mean, for, for me and for, for our trade, I mean, it's just creating more work and that means we need more people and there is a shortage. So I'm, I'm happy that companies are, you know, maybe you weren't, you know, your role is going to be taken by that. But if we can help you transition into a role that is going to have a plethora of work for forever, then, I mean, that's, that's great on them.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, it was pretty cool. Okay, Phil, two more questions that I want to ask. One is, um, and I want to go back to your philosophy of why not shoot for the stars? Uh, so with that in mind, if you were to give advice or words of wisdom to a young person, someone, you know, maybe still in school, who is considering a career in H Vac or in the trades, what advice would you give them?
Speaker A: Well, you'll never know everything that's to start with because it doesn't matter how long you do this, if you ask any technician out there, they'll learn something every day. Mhm. If you're willing to, I mean, you can close off your ears, close off your eyes, and just punch through the day and, and not learn a dang thing. But if you keep your eyes open and your ears open and your mind open, you, you'll, you'll find something to learn every single day. I did today. I was helping a guy learn about one thing and he taught me something on something else. And I was like, oh, I never knew that. Cool.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: Um, but this, this in this industry specifically, and I'm sure that it's true across the trades, is it's going to come down to it. You're going to be able to learn, grow and, and go through this industry and make it all the money that you want as fast as you want it. There's our company. You know, training is open.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: You know, here's the training. Do it as fast as you can. When you get it done, let's move on to the next stuff. You know, we're trying to push people to learn more because we know that, you know, five guys are retiring and two guys are getting hired.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: There's a big gap that's going to be in the middle that needs people to, to fill that gap and, and the faster you can Learn the better. I mean, and it doesn't take much. It's listening to podcasts where you're your car instead of jamming out to music, it's, you know, taking five minutes a day to, to, to read something about the industry, whether it be online or out of a textbook or whatever. I mean, if you put your mind to, to, to growing in this industry, you will there, there's no doubt about it. And it's, it's a very rewarding trade. Trade trades are I think in general, if you're that type of person, um, where you're gonna, you're gonna get out of it whatever you put in it. And, and it's awesome. I mean, I've only been in the field for, since I graduated college, about a little over 10 years. I went from knowing the basics from college to working on chillers, which are very big, complicated pieces of equipment that I still do not know everything about. Uh, tons to learn about those. But to where I'm at in 10 years now. It's not the normal. But put your head down, you know, read the books, listen to the podcast, you know, try to soak in as much as you can as fast as you can, and you'll, you'll get it and you'll be compensated well for it. You'll have a comfortable life. I mean, yeah, I'm not, I'm not thirsting. How are over here? But I'm, um, I eat well and I have a house and, And I'm comfortable. I can turn the air conditioner whatever temperature I want it and you know, I got all the things to meet in life.
Speaker B: Yeah, I mean that's uh. Yeah, not everyone can say that. Um, Yeah, I think um, it's really cool to see the amount of opportunity that exists, you know, and I came up in an era of it was you go to college or like you'll never become anything. Right. And I think, I like to think at least like that narrative has shifted because, you know, we kind of realize, wait, we, we need people in the trades. We need people doing these other things that keep the whole world running. And now there's, you know, all of this potential for folks to go and realize, um, the other end of the spectrum, I guess that ah, I wanted to ask is, you know, if you could share with leaders far removed from the frontline work. So not even the service manager, but way up in the ivory tower as you refer to it. Um, what's one thing you would want those folks to know about the frontline role? Whether that's something you've learned from how you've been led or from the work you're doing now in your team lead role. What's something that you feel like there's a disconnect about or that you wish people high up in the organization understood better about the folks that are on the front line?
Speaker A: Yeah. I mean the only thing I've noticed is it's not too bad at my company. It's real good. But sometimes the role of when you get up far disconnected from the field is that it's because you've never done it. Maybe you started out very early in your career for a couple years and that's what brought you to your high up role in, in this industry. But just I guess every once in a while to reach out to those guys. It doesn't matter where you're at. You know, our president Clay, he, he's got an open door. You know, I can walk over there and say, hey Clay, how you doing? And, and talk with him. And that, that to me is, that creates that connection from what I call the ivory tower. You know, peek behind the curtain up at the ivory tower. But it, it, it gets rid of that stigma.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: Where you know, the guys in the field are, you know, oh my God. Some guy sitting in an air conditioning desk making decisions for us. You know, really getting out there and talking to those guys that, that are out there and figuring out what they need and may maybe even if you're doing a day in a life in, and, and not even a whole day. Just come out on the field. See what we do. No, know what we're, we're breaking our, you're asking us to break our backs to make you this amount of money. Know what that really takes? You know, see it in the field. Um, go get your hands a little dirty. I mean you've talked with Greg. You did. Uh, he did, was on your podcast and I've worked with him side by side and he's, he's a high up at service lobby. He was standing on the roof with me with his bag of tools. You know, that, that connection to feel like uh, this is just another guy. He's just doing a different job than I am. Yeah, it helps a lot. And I think that's going to be huge as, as the younger generation comes in to create, to build that trust and that loyalty with, with those technicians that keep them at a company for a long time.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Instead of where you have guys that just job hop from company to company for another raise that Connection with, with those technicians is going to be something that helps you keep them because you're showing that you're really interested in them.
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: And their career. And to keep it, keep it going with your company. I mean, not only saving the turnover cost, you know, you're, you're, you're building up technicians to be exactly what you want from day one apprentice to, to a master tech, you know, as fast as you want them to be and, and having, having some loyalty from them and you giving them some loyalty. And I think that'll help a lot going forward. Yeah, in, in the trades, it's, it's no longer of the, here's your paycheck, you know, have a great weekend. We don't talk about each other. Yeah, it's not, it's not going to cut it going forward.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's really good advice. And I think it goes back to, you know, really a couple super important points you made at the beginning, which is, you know, number one, I love your point about like, no one knows everything. I mean, either does Clay, you know, yes, he's, you know, at the top of the top. Right. But if he's truly a smart person, he also understands that he doesn't know everything. There's always more to learn. Right. We can know a lot, but if you do the work to your point, if you keep your ears open, you keep your eyes open, you invest just a little bit of time and energy into bettering yourself. That means continuing to learn and grow. Right. Um, and I think people want to feel that they matter. And one of the best ways you can show people they matter is by, by listening, getting to know them a bit. And, you know, to your point, at the beginning, you know, realizing that there's no one size fits all to leadership, you have to meet people on their level. You have to, you know, give them the respect of, you know, individualizing your approach enough, um, to make it successful with them. So I think it's great advice. Phil, I'm so happy to have met you. Thanks to Greg and, uh, for you to have come on, I think, um, why not shoot for the stars? I think you could be the next Clay. Really. Um, and I say that in no jest. I'm really excited, um, for your journey. I think the team you're supporting now is really fortunate to have someone who is, you know, doing the work to understand how you can show up better and to continue to grow yourself so you can help them grow in the ways they want to. I just think it's it's really awesome. So, um, I'm really happy that we got to meet and that you came to. To share your story with everyone.
Speaker A: Well, thank you very much. I appreciate that. I mean, I hope one day we can get over. Get up that high up with things, but I'm. I got a pretty early start, so hopefully I got plenty of time to get there. I mean, yeah, it's definitely on my list of goals. So we're shooting. We're shooting for the moon, definitely. Um, but you never know what can happen if you don't try. It won't ever happen.
Speaker B: That's right. Yep. One day we're gonna keep plugging, plugging along.
Speaker A: One day at a time, one year at a time. And we'll see what life brings.
Speaker B: Awesome. Well, I'm wishing you the best and I will, uh, be cheering you on and would love to have you back at some point in the future.
Speaker A: Sounds awesome. I'd love that. And thank you for having me. I appreciate, you know, talking to me and getting the Frontline workers voices out there a little bit. A little bit better and to the masses. I mean, I'm just one person, but this can help. A couple other people want to speak up and get their side of things out too. That'd be awesome.
Speaker B: Yeah, no, I love it. I appreciate it. It's an honor. So thanks again. You can learn more by visiting the home of Frontline unscripted at, uh, future of fieldservice. Com. The podcast is published in partnership with ifs. You can learn more at ifs. Com. As always, thank you for listening.
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