Leadership Unlocked

Speaker A: Welcome to the Coaching Outcomes Podcast with me, Karen Frost. Two decades ago, I discovered the perfect synergy drawing on my background as a senior leader and bringing it together with my dedication to seeing people grow and realise their full potential. Since then, there's been no turning back. As an executive and business coach, I found my passion and purpose, my mission to leave a lasting impact on people's lives. Create professionally and often personally too. Join me as I explore the transformative influence of coaching and leadership development one conversation at a time. I'll touch on the latest leadership trends, invaluable insights and practical tools by drawing on first hand experiences and uh, showcasing inspiring stories of those I've had the pleasure to work with or alongside. It's good to have you here.

Speaker B: Learn everything you can and later you will discover none of it is superfluous. And that is my attitude towards life. I will learn whatever I can. We always have to be authentic to ourselves and we can't pretend to be someone we're not. One of the things I've learned in life is we can learn something from everyone. And I have now in the intervening years really taken on what I can learn myself as being an informal mentee from people across organizations and also how I can give back.

Speaker A: Today I'm talking with Pauletta Brown. Pauletta and I go back a few years because I was instrumental in terms of her leadership development. Pauletta's profession is as a general counsel and she's worked for a number of corporations and she and I have stayed in contact.

Speaker C: Pauletta, you and I, gosh, I can't remember the first time you and I met, but it was very much on the global senior leadership program that Mitsubishi ran with us for a number of years. It's great to make a connection with you and have a conversation today about the importance of leadership development. So if I start with that question, how do you think leadership development has helped you in your career from the point in time when you did that, ah, year of leadership development work with us?

Speaker B: Karen, thank you so much for having me. We met back in 2015. It's been just about a decade now when I was invited and was participating on Mitsubishi's leadership development program. I've had about a decade of my career since then, which has allowed me to reflect on many of the things that you taught me at that point in time. I thank you for that. I think what leadership development meant most for me at that point in time is that it was my first opportunity as an executive on a leadership team. My background is I'm a lawyer and had been hired as the first lawyer in an organization. And so very much was focused on being that mentor, advisor, legal subject matter expert, overseer, guardian of an organization. Then I was, uh, allowed to participate in this leadership development program, which gave me the opportunity to explore myself as an overall leader within the organization. And what are the roles that I could play, not just in my subject matter expert role or my role as a guardian of the organization, but my role as being the only woman on the leadership team and my role as being a thought leader, a, uh, mentor, a coach, an influencer, all of those types of roles that you often play when you are the lead lawyer in an organization and when you're on an executive team. And so by being on a leadership development course, I had the opportunity to have a structured environment in which I could learn a lot of these skills. Skills, or if not learn them, understand the skills I already had and how best to deploy them. And so this leadership program gave me a framework to start exploring who I was as a leader in a leadership environment, both from a theoretical perspective, but also a practical perspective. And so you helped start me on that journey and that certainly continued in the past 10 years of my career.

Speaker C: And thank you for that. And then, uh, it's really important, isn't it, to think about the fact that when we do our leadership development programmes, of which we've done many over the years, we often have our subject, uh, matter experts with us that come as part of large leadership teams and so on. And it is that transition, isn't it, from the fact that, yes, you are the subject expert, that never changes, that never goes away and you continue to learn on that. But there is always a moment in time where you start to think, actually, I am a leader, aren't I here? Yes. And how do I do that? What type of leader do I want to be? What is my natural style of leadership to be able to explore all of that in a safe environment like we did for that period of time?

Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. And I think it helped me reflect on my own strengths and abilities, which we all have. As a leader. I think there's many schools of thought in terms of whether you, you accentuate your strengths or you also work on your weaknesses. But I think it's obviously a combination of both. Through the various assessments we did and conversations with my peers on the cohort, I was able to learn about my strengths and what I could deploy to help my colleagues, my teams, my extended teams, my organization, because we always have to be authentic to ourselves. And we can't pretend to be someone we're not. We obviously, obviously have our weaknesses and those elements of the program that help me identify my weaknesses, some of which we will work on our entire lives. And that is just a growth opportunity for us forever. But there's things that we can then incrementally improve. And I felt that I incrementally improved on those during the program and have continued to work on them. So I think it was a safe opportunity to work with people across my organization. Some I worked with on a daily basis, some I didn't. And then working with professional coaches to think through what that means, how to show up as my best self in whatever situation, whether I'm a subject matter expert or asked to be a leader or a manager.

Speaker C: Yeah. So that authentic self and that self awareness is really important, isn't it? And you said that was one of your big learnings. What other uh, learnings do you think that you took from that specifically for the program in terms of the application

Speaker B: into your world of work for the self awareness? I think it grounded me in many of my strengths in being an empathetic listener, of being very thoughtful. I am an introvert, but being thoughtful about the environments in which I find myself, how I connect with other people, uh, through our work, I have noticed that uh, I really focus on them. In the intervening years I've had direct reports, I've managed teams. I've also served on other leadership teams where I've had to influence and grow. And that thought of self awareness in how I show up authentically has been a theme. As I have moved on to managing bigger teams or being in more cross cultural environments. I've had to adapt my leadership style. But it all comes back to being aware of who I am authentically and not pretending to be someone that I'm not. I can always do better. I can always be a more active listener to do and employ specific behaviors to help me better interact with the specific people I'm dealing with. You have to know your audience, know your team and know your counterparts. But at the end of the day, knowing how I communicate and the information that I need to receive, uh, to participate and be my best self and be the subject matter expert and leader, all of that comes full circle. It's been a journey because we learn from every different environment in which we find themselves in. So starting from a great base, I've continued that self exploration journey over the past 10 years.

Speaker C: If we start looking at some of the specifics from the program, is there Anything that you still use that resonates still that you go back to, I've

Speaker B: certainly seen spoken to a number of those, but one I would particularly highlight is the cross cultural learning. At the time that we did the program together, my company was a subsidiary of a larger Japanese organization. There was a lot of work we did about the interfaces between more Western and Eastern influences and the way that people communicate both in a business and a professional environment. That was very eye opening to me. Since then, I have worked on a number of projects across different cultures, both Japanese and Indian and European, South American. And in each of those contexts, I have gone back to the first principles of understanding different cultures, understanding how they work and how I need to communicate better. So I appreciated the foundations that we did to explore those concepts and have definitely taken those learnings and continued to do my own research as I find myself in different situations.

Speaker C: That understanding, because of being in a global organization is incredibly important and it's something that we've always had in our leadership programs. Interestingly enough, we were doing a program with the team that deals a lot with China just a few weeks ago, and we shared with them the whole idea of the difference between, for example, European or British cultures and the way that China looks at the world deals with big emotional things like communication, trust, change, all of those different things. And, um, to a person there was eight of them. M all said, boy, oh boy, I wish we'd had this a few years ago because it was like, now I get it, now I understand it. And it's a bit like being a parent. Nobody actually teaches you this stuff, do they? Until you're actually in the middle of it somehow or other. And so, yeah, uh, the cross cultural stuff always hits a sweeter spot with a lot of people when we do that on our leadership and team development programs. So I'm glad you're still using it, which is great.

Speaker B: As I have found myself in new projects with new parts of the world or working with other team members that may have less experience than I do. I have actively encouraged seeking specific, uh, cross cultural training for our teams on particular projects to make sure that we set ourselves up for success. I felt that it was so important for people to understand how to conduct themselves and be respectful and effective in a given situation, which obviously varies across cultures.

Speaker C: Yeah. Any other areas of it that really jump to mind or that you're using on a very regular basis, like that example?

Speaker B: I think the coaching and mentoring, because I think that was something that at the time I had no direct reports I had many peers, people both above or more junior to me and at higher levels in the organization that I interacted with. I didn't feel that I had people that I directly had to coach and mentor, but through our, through our discussions in the leadership development program and the various materials that you prepared, I really started to think about how I could be a coach and mentor to other people in an organization, even if they weren't directly reporting to me. One of the things I've learned in life is we can learn something from everyone. And, and I have now, in the intervening years, really taken on what I can learn myself as being an informal mentee from people across organizations, and also how I can give back. It really challenged my thought of how I could coach people, how I could help them through various change scenarios, various difficult situations. People often come to a lawyer anyway because they see us as a counselor, as someone able to solve difficult problems, being able to think more complex. There's a reason lawyers are called counselors because in many ways we are a counselor. So that is a natural part of it, but that's often in a specific problem solving context of a particular issue or concern versus thinking of myself as a people coach, as being a people mentor. I've always liked working with people. I've always liked teaching with people, teaching people. And so this really has been something that's important part of my leadership journey. And one of the things I'm proudest of in all of the organizations that I've been a part of are the more junior people that I've been able to help develop simply because of the time that I've spent with them. I really appreciated being able to think of myself in a different context and get certain skills that I've since developed and sought other skills and built on that knowledge foundation to be able to add something else to my leadership profile.

Speaker C: Yeah. And I think as we include all of that within our, uh, programs, there's two elements to it. One is around actually receiving coaching and mentoring, which you've got as part of the program, so actually experience it. But the other one was then around actually what is the leader as coach or mentor and giving you those skills about what is an effective mentor. I have a mantra which is never be without a mentor. And I, uh, never am. I've always got somebody that I'm talking to that is wiser, more experienced, whatever it might be, that will hold that space for me. So it's really lovely to hear that's what you've been offering and what you've been doing for a number of years now because those individuals will have benefited significantly from your wisdom and your experience. It's good to give back as well though, isn't it? To help others in that respect.

Speaker B: I've been tremendously fortunate in my life, Karen, from all of the people that have taught me so much and given me their time and their wisdom. You and I have had this friendship after the formal program and I very much value that and I learned from everyone and. And I find in it's fish, especially in periods of turbulence personally and in the world, the connection we bring to other people and how we can offer ourselves, we give back in return. I have certainly seen the blessings come back to me tenfold for the time I've spent with other people and people have shown up for me. The universe protects in those ways and how we can give back is how we get back as well.

Speaker C: I'm fascinated by the fact that what you do for a living gives you those skills. Naturally. Council is the word often used within all of that. For me, whenever we've got people in the program that may be a little bit more commercial in their outlook, that sales and marketing side of it, enabling them to understand the importance of leadership development and how they evolve and develop their leadership skills, that art of leadership and then offer the counsel in terms of coaching a leader. The leader is a mentor. When you see that transition as well, that's a big jump for some people. It's incredibly rewarding to see that. And it changes their outlook on things, their targets they've got to hit and all of those things. But it changes their outlook on things, which I think is fantastic to see.

Speaker B: And I think it approaches how you do things. It's not necessarily what you do, but how you interact with people. And by having those sort of natural leadership skills. I think even in a sales and marketing perspective, other people are more drawn to you. Your customers may connect with you in a different way. So at the end of the day, life is about relationships. Life is about connections. And so everything that we can do to increase our ability to have better connections with people in whatever job role we have, is immensely valuable both for ourselves and for the people that we interact with.

Speaker C: Anything else that uh, resonates with you still? That

Speaker B: I think just gratitude. Gratitude for the opportunity to improve myself, to think about other things outside of my day to day life. I still have all of the documents that you provided, so they were valuable. They're in a binder that has traveled with me over the past 10 years and I reflect on them from time to time, so. So I think it's gratitude for those learnings and for those organizations that take the time to invest in people. Development is one of the, in training or one of the first things that get cut in difficult times, but they pay their rewards. You may not have the budget for a huge development program, but the individual coaching and mentoring of particular leaders that need some time and attention and it's an incremental journey. You don't magically go to the doctor, get a surgery and you're all well. Leadership doesn't work that way. It's about self reflection. It's about development. That's the word, right? And development takes time. If you're committed to doing it, if you're committed to employing external and professional resources to help you do it, then there is a payoff, both immediately, which I felt in my first organization that put me through this training, but also over time, over a decade and hopefully going on from there. I always say, hey, I was selected for this program, they believed in me, they helped develop me, and now I'm going to continue. I do a lot of personal development work. I've signed up for courses that challenge me in other ways, personally and professionally. And it's because of that basis of knowing the value of pushing yourself to explore new ideas and new skills.

Speaker C: For, uh, somebody starting off in their career not having direct reports, but then progressing in organizations or going to different organizations. Is there a piece of advice that you would give?

Speaker B: I think it's the same motto that is my favorite motto in life. I think It's Hugh of St Victor, it's learn everything you can and later you will discover. Discover none of it is superfluous. And that is my attitude towards life. I will learn whatever I can. Even some random useless piece of trivia. You may be at a cocktail party sometime and you're able to connect with someone because you've learned something. One of my closest friends from childhood always says, my insatiable curiosity. And that's really the way I view the world. And I encourage everyone learn. You never know where it's going to lead you. And so as a young professional, what can I learn about my company, about the world traveling, which I highly recommend, doing all of these things to get yourself out there. That's how you progress. It may not be directly up the corporate ladder at your current organization, but it may be laterally somewhere else. It may be in a completely different career field. By challenging yourself to learn and grow, you're going to go somewhere you're not going to stay still.

Speaker C: That is a fantastic motto for life. And then obviously, doing a leadership development program like you did for that intense set of months is like a boost to that learning that you can then take back. And it certainly wasn't superfluous, was it? Because you already talked a lot about some of the things you learned on that program, how you're still using them.

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker C: It's really good to him that it was valuable, and it really remains valuable to you. So thank you so much for that. I really appreciate it. It's lovely to hear how you've been using it.

Speaker A: Thank you so much for listening to this coaching outcomes podcast with me, Karen Frost. I hope you enjoyed it. Take care and goodbye for now.