Keys to Building Something Sustainable & Meaningful with Alex Sanfilippo

Speaker A: What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others echoes into eternity. What we're doing for ourselves, uh, it's going to die when we die, right? But for others echoes into eternity. If you're creating something, you're building a business, you're ultimately helping somebody's life be better. That's legacy building that echoes on for far longer than any of us will ever know. But I think it's a beautiful thing to do. So keep creating, keep doing it.

Speaker B: Welcome to Small Business Casual. You're in the right place if you've got an entrepreneurial mindset and you want to grow a business that's successful, profitable and thriving, but you don't want to want it to get in the way of your time with family and friends. I'm Emily Aborn, and I'm here to guide you through with grounded marketing, practical business ownership strategies, and more as we design a business that works for you. Hello, my friend. Welcome back. Today's podcast guest needs very little introduction on my part. Alex Sanfilippo, you may recognize the name, is a podcaster and the founder of podmatch.com a platform that automatically matches podcast hosts and guests for interviews. In today's conversation, you'll hear what happens when passion turns into purpose and consistency becomes the force behind what he has created, which is a mission driven community built to serve others. We Alex shares all the lessons he's learned through failure, the value of preparation, and why showing up with curiosity and generosity matters more than ever. All right, like I said, he doesn't need much introduction, so let's get into the interview. Hi, Alex. Welcome to Small Business Casual. I'm, um, honored and excited to have you as my guest, Emily.

Speaker A: Thank you. You're. I was, I was telling my wife Alicia this. You're one of my favorite people in podcasting. Like, I love listening to your show and I love getting to hang out with you. So it's seriously just an honor to be here. I'm looking forward to this time together.

Speaker B: Thanks. I feel like from someone of your ilk, that is a huge compliment. You listen to a whole lot of podcasts. So, um, ok, so here's a little fun fact for the listener. I got to help, uh, with Alex's bio, and so I know that he started his entrepreneurial journey a whole lot like mine, like going around to neighbors and saying, will you buy this thing? And in your case, it was golf balls. Mine, it was like bracelets and candy bars and stuff in a shoebox. So I love hearing those kind of like beginning entrepreneurial stories. And I would love for you to go into it a little bit, but I also want to know some of the parts that you don't usually tell. Like what are some of the. The maybe harder or more vulnerable parts of the story that not everybody gets to hear.

Speaker A: Sure, yeah. Um, thank you for asking that. I feel like I kind of go into the. Everyone's interested in the 10 year old kid. The version of Alex selling golf balls like that, that's, that's fun, right? And so, sure enough, that was my, my introduction to entrepreneurship, similar to how you had. I don't know, how. How old were you, Emily? When.

Speaker B: When, like 6. Okay.

Speaker A: Oh, wow. You started for. It was 10 before I was like, I want to do something, you know, like with, uh. So I just started selling used golf balls. We would fish around the lakes. There's a, um, golf course across the street from the neighborhood I was in. And me and some of the neighborhood kids, including my siblings, we go over there, we dig out the golf balls and then we, we'd sell them Saturday morning back to golfers. And so we clean them up and stuff like that was. It was really fun. It was my introduction to, to entrepreneurship. And I got the itch at that young age of just. I just, I didn't care about the money weirdly enough. Like, I just like the whole, the whole thing, you know, like, it was fun and it just was exhilarating. And sure, like, at the end of the day you got a monetary reward for what you did, which was cool, but for me, it never was the motivating factor. Fast forward a couple years when I wasn't cute anymore. Golfers didn't want you to sell their golf ball back to them that had their initials on it. They were like, give me my ball back. So from 10 to 12, it worked after that, I don't know. But that's around the time that ebay became a thing. And I was, I was a kid in the 90s. We played Action figures, we played Legos, we played all this stuff. Turns out you can buy all that on ebay. Like as soon as ebay came out, I was like, wait a minute, the action figures I can't find in stores anymore, uh, are on here. No way. So I just started buying stuff, selling stuff, and got really good on computers. And again, this is in the 90s, like right when, um, I don't know, it was called broadband or DSL or something. I can't remember what it was called there. You know, dial up and There was whatever came next, this was that next thing that now you throw your computer out the window if it was loading that slow. But like, it was the chance to learn how to do it all. And so I got good on a computer. Fast forward a couple more years. This is where I'll kind of hone in on a story I don't usually get to share, but I got the opportunity to be part of a technology startup that was doing virtual tours of homes and posting the MLS when they were for sale. It's very common technology now. If you use any of the big websites that you can go to and look at houses that for sale. A lot of people do this as a hobby now. Um, but back then we pioneered the technology that let you drag around a room and look at anywhere. You can look at the roof, look at the floor, you could drag all around and see everything in the room. And so we pioneered that technology. I was 16, working with somebody a bit older than me, a bit more experienced. But we did, we decided to build a fully remote company. I don't remember the. This was probably 2000 maybe was the year, something like that. And it. So there was no such thing as remote companies. Like that was unheard of. And everyone just assumed we weren't actually doing anything. Like, you're at home playing video games, like I know what you're doing, right? But the thing is, we were using. I, uh, don't remember this, but aol, um, aim, um, AOL Instant Messenger. That's how we talked as a team. We, we just built our own rooms, we built our own private channels. And we built all this, like, all this, like, not legitimate tech to be able to run it because there was nothing on the Internet that let you run a remote company at that point. Like, we were making that up as we went along. We use whatever we could to do it. And that ended up being like a really cool thing for me. And I'll get into the drama of it now. I, I did really well from 16 to 18. I was, I was doing really good with it. And at that point I decided, you know, real estate's gonna be my vehicle to become a success, right? I'm gonna become. My dream was become a Forbes 30 under 30. And real estate was my m. Vehicle to get there. Like, I wanted to be known for it. And so I started investing as soon as I could, as soon as I got turned 18, still have this, this technology startup as well in the space. And then kind of fast forward, these are the years when, um, when real Estate started getting really bad and so I looked like I was doing really well. And I went from one night going to sleep, doing really good to the next morning everything had crashed. To being the most in debt young person that I had ever met in my life. And uh, it was, it was crushing because I had my identity wrapped up in this idea of I'm an entrepreneur, I'm a business guy. That which started age 10 selling golf balls. Right. And it worked its way through into to this point. And that, that was absolute rock bottom in my life. Uh, I did good with the golf balls, did good flipping stuff on ebay, did go with the technology startup, was doing good with investing and having rental property and then doing bad, right? Just like good to bad. And that was really for me an eye opening experience that caused me to actually move in out of entrepreneurship and into more of a corporate setting where I felt safe. It scarred me. It made me feel like, okay, maybe this isn't for me anymore or maybe I'm just not smart enough or not good enough and I can't be a Forbes 30 in their 30s. It takes me 10 years to dig out of this hole that I'm in now. There was all these thoughts and things and thankfully my life changed, uh, and I turned things around. It took a long time, but, uh, I did 15 years in big corporate. But that's part of the story. I don't usually get to tell people, like hearing the high notes. Right. But the low point is the fact that like I had a real failure at a very young age and it took me 15 years to really recover from that.

Speaker B: Wow. Okay. Can I ask how much the debt was? Are you comfortable sharing?

Speaker A: Yeah. Oh, I won't remember for sure. It was hundreds of. It wasn't like anything crazy, but it's hundreds of thousands of dollars. That was upside down. Um, and the real sad thing was that the company though, like I end up, I sold it to the other partner, like air quotes sold it. I think I sold it for a dollar because there was no money in it. It was gone. It was not worth anything. It went from being like a business. It was. There was seven full time people in it, or, uh, sorry, 10. There were seven photographers and three editors that were working with us. There's 12 of us total to just this one person is like, I'll just take it. And I was like, here, give me a dollar. Right? And so the sad thing was like building a big business that was then worth nothing. And then the only thing I had to show for was like, here's my dollar payout and here's my hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt that I have now. Uh, and I don't know the exact number, but I know it was six figures. I know I had no idea how to get out of that.

Speaker B: And you just paid it back like systematically, I imagine through working in corporate.

Speaker A: Yeah, got a corporate job, did 15 years, which I'm really grateful for. I had. I actually, I learned some things about business I needed to learn. Um, and so I, I will never look at that as a bad time in my life. I, I loved it. I actually really thrived in that as well. Um, but at first it was a little defeating because I went, I got in as a part time receiving clerk at a manufacturing company and so like I was breaking down boxes and taking out people's trash and it was like, this is how I'm going to pay my bills. And it took me literally. I mean, maybe not. It probably took me 12 years to get fully back to zero, something like that. And so it was just, I feel like it slowed me down. Like I learned to live life and enjoy it. So I don't make it sound like this is all terrible, but like that first couple of years especially was real bad. And do you remember the movie Emily the Big Short? Do you remember that movie?

Speaker B: Came out vaguely. I'm not a big movie buff. Uh, sorry.

Speaker A: Me neither. But I remember this one because it was about that crash. I didn't watch that movie for like 15 years. I was like, oh, dude, you should watch it. You worked in real estate. I'm like, yes, I'm what the movie's about, you know, like I'm the person who couldn't eat anymore. Like they talk about it. And so it took me years to watch it. I end up watching it way later. I'm like, wow, I really enjoyed it. And it made me realize, I'm like, well, I really had no way of knowing, you know, like, just like all these other people, I had no way of knowing. But it was one of those things where, like that, that, that scar was there for a while.

Speaker B: Thank you for sharing. I, I had a similar experience, although my rock bottom of debt was not that large. Um, and I just remember feeling like all hope is lost. So I super appreciate you telling us that because now there you are, a testament of hope because you have pulled your way through that and, and are, uh, where you are now. So now I kind of want to shift gears and talk about like where Podmatch entered the picture. You can like tell us a couple more steps if you probably need to. But where, where podmatch entered the picture, what it is, and kind of like where on earth you came up with this idea? Like, how did you even. Because, uh, we're approximately the same age. Like, I didn't even know podcasts were really a thing until like 2010, maybe 2012.

Speaker A: Yeah, okay. We, we, our journeys are so similar. Emily, that's great. That's what I found out. Podcast my thing as well. So I didn't know. Um, but yeah, I'll get in, I'll get into sharing this here. Um, it's, uh, to fill in the gap of like that, that time, that 15 years I did in corporate, I, I end up really liking. Like I said, I learned a lot from it. As a matter of fact, like, for anyone who's like, oh man, like, I feel like I'm there, I'm stuck, whatever it might be, learn the lessons you can learn while you're in that space because it might be what propels you forward. The reason I'm such a consistent person, I've worked really well on this, this whole Pod Match thing is the disciplines I learned in corporate. As an entrepreneur, you don't usually get the disciplines of understanding how to, to go to bed at a certain time, to wake up at a certain time, to start, right? Like, those disciplines are learned. Like, no one's like, yeah, I'm gonna do this because it sounds fun. Like, no, going to bed early doesn't sound fun. So you can wake up early to work, right? But when you have an employer that says, I'll fire you if you don't, you learn to do it. And so there's many things from that career that, that have, have taught me what I need, needed to know and who I need to become to do well in Pod Match. And so to me, like, there's, there's really no reason to look at. Life is like, that was the season of like doom and gloom for me. It's like, no, I learned something from that. It was refining through the fire, right? Like, I came out stronger and better. And so for me, that 15 year career, I applied myself the best I could there. I had some good years and some bad years, but toward the end, the company ended up deciding to go public. It was a private company decided we found there was a buyer, went public. I was part of the team that helped with that, which propelled me to the C suite level, which was really cool. It was a fun experience. It was probably, hopefully the only time I Ever take a company public? It was a lot of work, but it was a really great experience. But once it went public, which is about year 13, I realized that I felt more like a cog in the system than someone who could still kind of flex my creativity. And, uh, there's a coin term for this now in organizations called an intrapreneur, which means you operate as an entrepreneur inside of the jurisdiction of a company, so it's your entrepreneur inside of it. And uh, so for me, I realized I couldn't do that anymore. Which, you know, listen, we built a multibillion dollar company and there's red tape everywhere. There is processes, there's all this. And I'll never forget the fact it was just like I kind of had this internal feeling, this thought that was like, it's time for me to move on. But after that long, and after my last experience as an entrepreneur, I was a little nervous. And so, Emily, I discovered podcasting. Uh, and this was a couple years before I made the decision. But I really loved podcasting, going back to that 2010 or something like that. So I first heard it, which I heard it through like the first time at that company, someone's listening to a podcast, I'm like, that's stupid. Wait a minute, how do I listen? Right? Like, the first I heard I was like, that's so lame. I was like, wait, I want to hear one too. And uh, but I was like, you know what, I got an idea. I'm going to start a podcast where I talk to people who have successfully left a 9 to 5 job to pursue their entrepreneurial passion, to learn how they did it. Like, I'll interview them, we'll talk, I'll post, I'll make it valuable. And that's, that's what I did. So I started talking to people and two, uh, things happened. Uh, one, I learned what it would take, and two, I learned what I wanted to do. And so I'll quickly share that. Basically to summarize, these are some most brilliant people I've ever met in my life. So I'm going to really dumb it down for myself here and Emily, so don't. This is no reflection of all those incredible people, but basically what I learned was there's four steps being a great entrepreneur. Number one is find your area of passion. And for me, that become podcasting. Yes, I had my full time job. I was doing this nights and weekends, but that become my passion. Step two is to get into the community that's involved in that area of passion. So podcast My passion. I started speaking all the podcasting conferences. I started meeting, even virtually with. Any podcaster would meet with me just to try to build community among them. The third thing is to find a problem, I always say, a simple problem that that community is struggling with. And the fourth thing is to offer the fastest possible solution. So 3 and 4. I'll never forget this. It was actually the beginning of 2020, before the world shut down. I was speaking at a podcasting conference in Orlando, Florida. And, uh, when I was nearing the end of my talk, I just told the room, it's about 2,000 people here. And I just said, listen, hey, if I'd love to give everyone a hug, handshake, high five. And also, I just have one question I want to ask as many people today as I can. If you'll give me a minute, I'll be at the side of the stage. Uh, we'd love to meet you. And thankfully, my session was before there was a break or an end of day or so. I don't know what it was, but I had a line of people, and I didn't move for hours, and. But I had pen and paper in hand because what I was doing is I was asking this question. Hey, Emily, uh, thank you so much for being here today. Hey, what's one thing you're really struggling with right now as a podcaster? Or what's the pain point that you have? Because I wanted to find that third step, which is the problem, right? What is the problem? And that day, I wrote down a lot of things, but I wrote down one thing consistently, repeatedly, over and over again, which was, Alex, I'm having trouble finding the right guest for my podcast. Not someone to be on it. I can find someone to be on it. I want you to be the right guest, though. I'm like, okay, that's cool. Uh, you know what? Finding a guest, it's so, so much work. There's so many emails that go back and forth. Like, I don't have all their details. It's. It's a lot. There should be an easier way. That's my pain point. And so I just kept on hearing this, and, uh, I went home with all my brilliance, Emily, and didn't know what to do with that. So I was like. I was like, I don't know what to do. And, uh, at this point, the world had shut down, so I was actually still working my corporate job just from home. And so I started doing, like, midday workouts, which was like a dream of mine, you know, I was like, I'm going to work in the middle of the day. And I was, I was outside working out because we're all doing it from home. And, uh, I was just thinking, I'm like, man, all these podcasts are struggling. Like, what, what do you do with that? And then it just like hit me. I ran back inside again. Being a corporate guy brought my, my whiteboards home. I used to have a white. Whole wall behind me was whiteboards. And I was like, I just started writing top corner and I just, I wrote. It felt like I was writing for two seconds. I must have been there for 30 minutes writing this thing out. In the very bottom of right hand corner, my last whiteboard, I wrote down these words like a dating app. But instead of connecting for dates, we connect podcast hosts and guests for interviews. And ultimately, that's what we designed with Pod Match. It's a system that connects the right people together faster and gives you all the administrative details you need so you never have to exchange an email, lets you message right in the platform. And then you can go to your, your virtual recording studio in person, recording, see whatever it is, and have the actual conversation with the right person that you needed to meet. And that's, again, I found that problem and that was the solution we came up with. And that's kind of the story of, of, of Pod Match. Six months later, I put in my notice at my job after 15 years to pursue it full time when we had launched it, to start getting it in front of people.

Speaker B: To your point, uh, I have, I always tell people it's harder to have guests than not to have guests because of all the legwork that is involved. And you, you guys, I mean, it's hard to be a guest sometimes, depending on what the host has for a system, right? You guys make it so, so easy. Like, I literally, it's just systematic and easy. And, you know, I'm a little bit super organized, so, like, I have all those things, but this makes it like, all in one place and it's fantastic. So because it can easily rack up to, you know, 10 different tools that you need or different steps or all of these pieces. You're right. Um, a million emails and things like that. And also I love the ability to be able to find right guests because you really get a much better, like, description of them rather than just like the one email pitch. You get to look at their profile, you get to look at their website, you get to look at their social media. Like, there's just so much more that is contained in there. That is all in one place for us as hosts or guests. I love it as a personally, I love it as a guest too. I've connected to people all over the world and I'm like a repeat offender on some of their podcasts because I just, I just like love them so much. So I have a blast on PodMatch and my listeners know that, ah, very well. Um, when you're, when you're like, I'd love to hear some kind of host and guest, uh, I guess tips, for lack of a better word. But what are you seeing the absolute best podcast hosts and the absolute best podcast guests do?

Speaker A: Well. So, okay, I decided to. I love a data driven approach to this, Emily. So I took some time and polled as many people as I could and it's like almost 3,000 people decided to answer this. And so it's guest and host. And I was like, hey, like, what, what makes a great guest? What makes a great like podcast episode for you? The host. And I learned a lot of things, but what shocked me the most is what people deemed the number one contributing factor to what makes a great podcast episode. And it's the time spent on research and planning and prep before ever getting to the green room, the remote, remote recording studio, or the in person studio. However you're doing it right, like where we are right now, before getting here, how much time and energy was put into it. And so I started like drilling down that. I actually determined that if you do that, you're already going to be in the top half of all guests or uh, your episodes in the top half better than if you just show up and wing it or if you just let AI do all the prep for you. If you're the one that's actually want to put in time on that side of things, it makes a difference. And so there's, there's all like the, um, I guess the administrative side or I mean that's not the right word, but like have your microphone plugged in, have your camera turned on. Like all those things matter. Yes, that's pretty easy. Once you've done that, it's set up. But the prep work is where the time really becomes valuable. Like you use it in the best possible way. So like Emily, before getting to this episode, to us recording this, I've been binging your podcast, which is great because you have a good show. So very easy. But I showed up and like, even before we hit record, you were mentioning something like, yeah, yeah, I kind of, you know, I was like, yeah, I got that. And I understand. I saw that. And you're like, oh, well, you seem like, you know, it's like, yeah, because I listened to a bunch of episodes and then you said you did your work and you've already. You had a beautiful outline. So I wasn't showing up. Like, I wonder what we're going to talk about.

Speaker B: I can't like stand that feeling.

Speaker A: Oh, man, I know. And sometimes I'll listen to a podcast episode and I listened to one that someone sent me. It was with a. It was a very big, well known podcast. I'm not going to say the name because I don't want to call anybody out, but they had on a guest who is in my mind, a very known best selling author. And the host had no idea this person had a book. And like, he's like, oh, I didn't realize he had a book out. Like. And I'm like, I turned it off. I was like, that's absurd. I'm like, all you had to do was go to Google for two seconds. I'm like, so this guy let the guest show up and literally does. They're like, okay, who am I interviewing today? Probably asking someone on his team. Great. Never heard of him. Let's go, hey, how are you? And it's like, that shows. And like, listen, if I want to hear a random conversation, I'll go to a coffee shop and eavesdrop. No, I want something that's actually, that there's a, there's a purpose to. And if you look at some m of the biggest podcasts in the world that people are really loving to listen to right now, I'll give two total opposite examples. Joe Rogan and Stephen Barlett. So Joe Rogan Experience and Diary of a CEO. Totally different approaches, but both of them, they have put in the work. Like, they don't show up. And there's no like, oh, I didn't know that about you. Like, typically, if the guest says something that isn't right, the host will literally say, that's not true because you said this six years ago at this event. Like, they know everything about them, sometimes more than the person speaking can remember about themselves. And that's why people love it, they're drawn to, is like, these people are ready. And so my advice, if you want to be a podcast guest or a successful podcast host on, uh, either side of the microphone, just show up ready. If you show up here ready, you've done more than almost anybody will do. And AI has made people so lazy where they feel like they don't do any work anymore. They're just like, AI will do it for me. I can just show up and read off the questions that are prompted. To me, it's not good content. It's mediocre at best. This is how you get good content, though.

Speaker B: I think it's even making people be able to think of the questions they may want to ask, like, less easily. Right? It's kind of like frying the. You're like, oh, I can't even. I can't even think of it anymore because I just would go to AI So I want to go under, like, a layer under that. Because I think what you actually touched on is having curiosity. I think if you don't have a sense of curiosity about the person that you're talking to and wanting to bring out something new for the person listening that they maybe have never heard before, so we want to make them just as curious as we are. I, uh, really think that that's what kind of drives that. But I'm, like, such preparer. Like, you and I. I see it time and time again. It, like, hurts my soul. I don't. I don't understand, like, it's not just another, uh, appointment in your day. It is something you truly have to prepare for. Like, almost like you would a presentation, but not quite as, you know, practiced or rehearsed, um, if you do such things. When I had my first podcast show, uh, she built this. I used to. I would, like, interview women entrepreneurs. I would read their entire book, take notes, and then, like, go through my notes and go through and make questions before they would show up to my show. They're like, okay, I didn't even remember that I wrote that. And I'm like, yep, I wrote it down, though. The same thing.

Speaker A: When I heard that entrepreneurship show, uh, I would read the book. So I would do one a week. So I'd do the interviews on Thursday, starting Friday. I'd read the next week person's book. And I would know more about it than they. They would, but I would. I'll tell you what. It was very common. Probably same thing you heard, wow, this is the best interview I've ever had. And all I did was read the book, you know, Like, I didn't do anything extra special. I'm not the greatest speaker. I'll just be real. Like, I talk for too long. I should be pausing more. I talk too fast, right? There's all these things that you could pick me apart and say, okay, well, he's not actually that great, but he's prepared and that again, that's that contributing factor factor. And to your point, Emily, I love that you said it's that curiosity. People listen in because they're curious as well. If they tell that they're in a room with other curious people, we feel like we're on the same like, wavelength. Right. And that, that's, that's what really makes it interesting for people to stick around.

Speaker B: Uh, it gives us a break from having to put it on one and a half speed because you talk so fast. So that's great.

Speaker A: Right? I'm working on my speed, by the way.

Speaker B: I'm trying to slow it down. I'm a fast talker too, so I appreciate it. Um, okay. And the other piece I wanted to bring up for guests, I think that you're kind of, we're touching on this, but we haven't like, said it yet is I don't think that there's an over generous you can be with information. So, like, when I go in, I don't care if somebody is going to hire me, I'm going to give them the farm, right? Like, I'm going to give them the whole framework. I'm going to give them all of the information, all of the tips, whatever, you know, to not like, over overwhelm them or overload them. But I used to see people, when I would interview them about their book, they'd be like, oh, well, that's in the book. Oh, oh, well, that framework is in the book. Or that information's in the book. If they want to read that, they can find it in the book. And I, I remember somebody once, they didn't have their, um, camera or. Sorry, they didn't have their mic off. And I heard them, they thought we had hung up and they were saying how pushy I was for information that people needed to purchase the book for. They were telling their spouse. And, uh, I just was taken aback. I was like, I really believe you could show up, get spoon feed every ounce of information that is in your brain. Somebody is still going to go buy your book. Somebody is still going to use you as their coach. Somebody's still going to hire you to be their copywriter. Like, be generous when you're, when you're a guest. Because I think that is another factor that really does create a nice episode

Speaker A: at, uh, the end of the day, as a podcast guest, your job is to develop, know, like and trust with the host listeners that already have this disposition that they do want to know, like, and trust you because you're already on with somebody. That they know, like, and trust. And it's up to you just not to break that trust. But to your point, Emily, if you start saying things like that's in the book, you can buy that. It's developing this layer of, like, hey, uh, there's a gate between you and me, listener. If you pay me, I'll give you that. Right? Yeah. But the thing is, when you develop no like, and trust, people are going to go for it, right? Like, they're like, oh, well, then, great, I want that. Um, and I think that you explained that really well, and that to me, is absolutely huge. And so for me today, like, there's nothing that we could bring up. I'm not, like, I can't talk about that. But if you go to this website, I'll give it, you know, I'll pay. You can pay me for it. Right. It's just not going to happen. And, uh, I think the best. The best guests know, like, hey, given I'm here to give everything away, like, whatever you want, it's here for your listeners. Let's really show up and serve well.

Speaker B: Yeah, I agree. Um, okay, so you are part of, like, this massive, I think, ripple effect. Like, you have all of these podcasters, guests and hosts kind of in the community. What. What is the impact on you, knowing that that's something that you've built? Like, how do you feel? I kind of want to get some of the emotional stuff because I would be sappy as can be.

Speaker A: Uh, yeah, it's, um. It. It's amazing. I'm thankful for where I am to get into the more, like, the heavier side of it, just because I think that that's actually the helpful stuff. The most we want to skip over there was this, um. There's this video that went viral years ago at this point that I still hold on to, and it was called a quantum reflection. A group of different people reenacted and did it. But basically it was this idea of, like, where you are today is busy, stressed, doing a ton of work. Like, you got a great working machine, right? It's incredible. Like, it's amazing. But when you're in it, you're like, man, I'm tired. Right? And some days, like, most days, thankfully, I don't feel like that. Some days I do. And I remember this quantum reflection video when I do, because in this video, what happens is that person and then who shows up as a person from day one. So, Alex, when we're like, this is a great idea. Let's launch pod match. Like, could you Imagine if it would help someone someday, right? Like, that's who shows up with the person who I am today, and that person is so excited to meet the future. Like, no way. We've made it. Like, you have a thriving. It's paying your bills, like, freaking out about it. And the other person, like, yeah, yeah, yeah. But. But hold on. It's not what it seems. It's not all like, you're too happy, right? Like, basically that comes down to. And by the end of the video, it's the person who is there, like living in it, who's succeeded, who's making it. And just thanks. The earlier person saying, thank you. Like, you, you. Like, I needed that. I needed to remember the fact that there's. That this is what I wanted to do, right? I think that so many of us, we get into this thing of entrepreneurship and it starts to make it and we realize it is so much work. It is. It is going to take parts of your life that maybe things that you would love to have, right? And I'll just rapid fire a couple of these things. I love staying up late. I don't stay up late. I have a bedtime. I have an alarm that goes off at 10pm So I go to bed. I got rid of my tv. I love sitting around watching tv. That's. That's fun for me. I sold it because I'm like, it doesn't. It doesn't serve me in my efforts of what I'm doing here. Like with Pod Match, um, I love having a drink. Like, uh, I love having drinks. I don't have any alcohol in the house. There's all these things that I won't do. I love dessert as well. Like, I love sweets. Like, I might not look like it because I work out a lot, but like, I love sweets. I don't eat them like these. And all. All these things make me legitimately sound like a crazy extremist. But the reality is I've built something where I know that if we want to keep it going the way it's going, we have to sacrifice some things that make us comfortable and feel good, including staying up late, including watching tv, including having drinks, including desserts, and many other things right in life. And some days there is no reward for that. It feels like you're just getting beat up for it. But if you step back from just the day to day of it and say, you know what? Like, if I look at my life, my work, holistically, like, for me, just answering this truthfully, I am doing what I Feel like I was put on earth to do, like, I'm a follower of Jesus, follow Jesus from the Bible. And like, for me, I feel like we all have a purpose. And if I have a purpose, it is absolutely 100% what I'm doing right now doesn't mean it's always easy, doesn't mean it's always fun. But most of the time, if I can just step back a little bit and say, you know what, this is unreal what I'm doing. Like, uh, less than 0.01% of people ever get the opportunity to perform at this level, to run a business like this. What a gift. And so to answer your question in a bit of a long winded way that, uh, I do think is helpful is we've got to remember that, like, you are going to sacrifice some things. It's not moving material. A lot of it can seem boring, you know, like, a lot of it can seem mundane. A lot of it can be really tough decisions you're having to make every single day. But at the end of it, my goodness, what you can do to serve those people well. And as an extension, serve the other people in your community, in your life that you want to, if you're rewarded enough financially, like, what a beautiful thing, it makes for a great life. And so for me, it's, it's all about just learning that balance of, like, you know what, I'm, um, in it. But also I'm gonna step back and remember this is really amazing. This is a really cool thing. Um, kind of went on a tangent there, Emily. I hope that that's helpful for somebody though.

Speaker B: It was so great. And I really, I want to kind of end on that note of just like taking a step back from your own life, your own day to day, and soaking in the awe of whatever simplicity or, you know, it might be extravagant, but whatever. It had that moment. Just last night, I was walking up the stairs after my work day and I was like, oh my God, it is like the bet. My. I think my husband was like, singing in the other room some dorky song, and I was like, this is the best. Like, this is just the best. And I have done this. You know what I mean? Like, we've, we've done this together, but like, we're building this thing. And I think those moments of awe are when it's that quantum thing that you've got that you explain. I'd love the link to that video actually too, so we can include that. But. But, um, just that, that moment to step back, I think really, really keeps you grounded in your why. So thank you for everything. This was so fun. This was, like, the best conversation ever.

Speaker A: Oh, thank you. Yeah. I've never been asked this stuff, so thank you. Like, I. And I expected that from you. You're prepared, right? Like, so you asked me stuff that just is off the path. And so thank you. And thank you for giving the opportunity to even again. I've been on 700 plus podcasts as a guest, and I've never been asked this stuff. And I think it was just a gift to get to talk about. And I hope, I hope that a listener hears it and it changes somebody's life. If I can end with one thing, um, what we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others echoes into eternity. And I think that's such an important reminder that what we're doing for ourselves, it's going to die when we die. Right? But for others echoes into eternity. If you're creating something, you're building a business, you're ultimately helping somebody's life be better. That's legacy building that echoes on for. For far longer than any of us will ever know. But I think it's a beautiful thing to do. So keep creating, Keep doing it. And, Emily, you're an incredible podcaster. Thank you again for having me.

Speaker B: Thank you so much. Thanks for joining me on this week's episode of Small Business Casual. If you want more business advice that's a little quirky, not too buttoned up, one less accessory. And, uh, just right. Visit my website, emilyaborn.com and connect with me over on Instagram Elyaborn. I'll be here, cozy slippers in hand, to help you design a business you love.