SALES with ASLAN · 2026-05-07 · 30 min
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
56 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
ASLAN's new research project comparing buyer and seller perspectives uncovers a stark disconnect in B2B sales. While 98% of reps believe they'll hit their number, buyers reveal they're significantly less dependent on sales representatives for information - increasingly turning to AI and self-research instead. However, the research identifies a clear competitive advantage: 90% of buyers say they'd be more likely to consider alternative solutions if presented by a seller acting as a trusted partner who understands their business, provides unique insights, and delivers customized solutions rather than pushing products. The top inhibitors of buyer receptivity are lack of preparation (37%), aggressive pitching, product-centric questions, redirecting buyer concerns, and pressure to commit early. Conversely, 90% of reps recognize they're perceived as vendors rather than partners, and 80%+ believe they'd be more successful if seen as partners. The research reveals sellers need to shift from product expertise to business problem expertise - becoming advisors with a distinct point of view on solving customer challenges, including willingness to discuss competitive offerings. Organizations that invest in coaching and training reps toward a buyer-centric, consultative approach have significant competitive advantage, especially given 50% of even loyal customers would switch vendors for a seller demonstrating superior business acumen and custom problem-solving.
Almost 50% of buyers surveyed said they're significantly or somewhat less dependent on the rep for information, increasingly relying on AI and self-directed research instead.
Lack of preparation was cited by 37% of buyers as the top inhibitor, followed by aggressive pitching and product-centric questioning.
50% of buyers said they would switch vendors if the competing rep demonstrated better business understanding, provided unique insights they didn't know, understood their specific business challenges, and offered customized solutions.
Yes - 90% of reps surveyed acknowledge they're perceived as vendors rather than partners, and 80%+ believe they would be more successful if seen as partners by customers.
90% of buyers are significantly or somewhat more likely to open up and consider alternatives when the seller demonstrates credibility, provides business insights, shares unique perspectives on solving problems, and is willing to customize solutions.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode delivers solid, grounded research findings about the shift from transactional selling to consultative partnership. However, much of the content reiterates well-established sales truths (prep better, listen more, understand the customer's business) rather than breaking new conceptual ground. The research data points themselves are useful but often presented with minimal drill-down or surprising implications.
40, almost 50% of the customer buyers are saying they're significantly or less dependent on the rep for information
37% said lack of preparation... was the number one answer
The core thesis - that buyers want trusted partners, not product reps - is the dominant orthodoxy in modern B2B sales training and has been for years. The research validates existing frameworks (business-centric selling, consultative discovery) rather than challenging or reframing them. The framing of 'custom solutions' and 'having a point of view' are familiar repackagings of consultant-selling models that have circulated extensively.
you know something I don't know, you've got something unique
have a point of view
This is a two-person studio episode with no external guest. Speaker A (presumed to be from Aslan) has conducted relevant primary research on buyers and sellers, which adds some practitioner credibility. However, the absence of an external expert, a customer voice, or a contrarian perspective limits the episode's ability to stress-test ideas or provide fresh viewpoints. The hosts are familiar with the topic but not positioned as unusually senior operators.
we talked to buyers... about 500 buyers, people that buy solutions in a B2B environment. And we talked to almost 500 just shy of 500 sellers
Speaker A: Tab, we're back in the studio
The episode anchors claims in stated research findings with percentages: 40-50% dependency decline, 37% lack of preparation, 82% rep perception of resistance, 90% trust partners, 50% switch-vendor likelihood. Specific behaviors are named (product-centric questions, aggressive pitching, pressure to commit early). However, no named customer examples, no dollar figures, no specific deal outcomes, and no timeline details on the research execution. The data is quantified but not granular.
40, almost 50% of the customer buyers are saying they're significantly or less dependent on the rep for information
37% said lack of preparation... was the number one answer. By the way, when we, as we talk about this, you're going to see that the numbers don't add up to 100 because we basically ask all the participants in the research to select all that apply
The hosts engage in friendly back-and-forth with some follow-up questions and collaborative thinking, but the conversation lacks edge or productive friction. Speaker B mostly validates Speaker A's points rather than pushing back or drilling into contradictions. There are few sharp follow-ups that expose tension (e.g., the claim that 98% of reps think they'll hit their number vs. the stated headwinds gets acknowledged but not probed deeply). The tone is warm but lacks the rigor needed to interrogate the research findings or their implications.
I believe that
That's exactly right
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
In the latest episode of Sales with ASLAN , Tom Stanfill and Tab Norris unpack new research from nearly 500 buyers and 500 sellers. New buyer-seller research shows buyers are less dependent on sales reps for information. Learn why sellers need to become trusted partners, not product representatives. The headline is simple, but uncomfortable: buyers don’t need sellers for information the way they used to. AI, digital research, peer networks, and internal buying committees have changed the role of the rep. But that doesn’t mean sellers matter less. It means the standard for earning trust has gone way up They dive into why ... - Buyers don't want representatives but partners - Unique Insight and custom solutions create movement - Lack of prep loses trust - Business discovery has to replace product pushing Tune in to learn what this research means for you and how you can help shift your team in the direction buyers want.
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
Speaker A: Tab, we're back in the studio. Is, uh, those of that are, are loyal fans. I don't know if it maybe fans might be a little over, maybe a little strong. A little strong. But at least regular listeners. How about regular listeners? We're going to talk about something today about a research project that we have never done at aslan.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: That's going to support our latest truth. I think we're on number six in our 30 truths that we've learned over 30 years. Uh, and it comes out of a buyer seller research project, which I'm super excited about because we both not only talk to the seller, hey, what's your view of the world right now? What are your challenges and what do you need and how can we better support you and how do you see the world? We also talked to buyers. We talked about about 500 buyers, people that buy solutions in a B2B environment. And we talked to almost 500 just shy of 500 sellers. And so we're going to share a little bit of that survey as you know, to, um, highlight the next truth, which is buyers trust partners, but not reps. Yeah. And that's becoming evidently clear when you look at the, the feedback.
Speaker B: Yeah, that's awesome. Well, I mean, I'm excited because I know this project's been going on and I'm like the listeners a little bit here. I haven't dug into all the research and I haven't seen all the results. So I'm very curious to see what comes of this.
Speaker A: Yeah. Well, there's some bad news, right? There is definitely some bad news. The bad news is 40, almost 50% of the customer buyers are saying they're significantly or less dependent on the rep for information. I mean, uh, and we obviously know what's happening. I mean, they're, they're, they've adopted, they're getting more information from AI and they are moving. They're saying, I don't need, I don't need to talk to the cell, I don't need to talk to a rep. And I think that's our main point today. They don't need a product rep. Yeah, I don't need to talk to a, a representative of products, um, because I can get what I need. Now there's, by the way, there was a, there was a small group which I found really interesting. 50% said I'm dependent more on a rep. And I, I think what that means is they're dependent upon a type of seller that we're going to talk about today that really can help Them navigate all the confusion. And we got it. And I think there's some, there's some, definitely some positive news. The other, the other negative news is reps are saying that, um, 82% of the customers are becoming more. Or 82% of the reps that we, that we surveyed said customers are becoming more resistant to sales.
Speaker B: Yeah, I believe that.
Speaker A: Yeah. So, um, yeah, so that's, that's, that's the bad news. There is some good news.
Speaker B: Uh, okay. You want to share the book with some good news with us?
Speaker A: Well, the good news is, is the, the buyers were very candid about why they would look at a solution. They're coming into the meeting and they're quickly deciding if they want to engage, but they still want to engage. But they're quickly deciding they want to engage and they're telling us why. They're like, if you've got something unique and if you know something I don't know, which is what we've always been preaching, you know, you know something I don't know, you've got something unique. Even though I have a solution bias, and that's an important word, I have a solution bias because I've done my research and I've got an idea. I'm, um, coming into every meeting quick with like, I think I know what I need. You got anything? No, I'm off. Right, right.
Speaker B: I'm seeing that. That makes total sense to me.
Speaker A: Yeah. Um, but the other thing that was interesting, not only would they look at a new solution, they're telling you why they would look at a solution. They're also telling you why they'd switch vendors. So we ask a question and we said without anything happening negatively, basically. I'm sure the question was phrased a little bit differently, but basically saying you have a loyal, you're loyal to a vendor using existing customer, nothing happens bad. Why would you switch? 50% of them said they would switch if. Same answer. If the rep had something to offer that they did not know about, they had a better solution. They provided insight, they understood my business, they could provide custom solutions. So it was all about those big things. You understand my business. Yeah. Know something I don't know about a better way to solve my problem. And ah, you're willing to provide. I think this is, this is the biggest adjustment is you're willing to provide a customer solution. That's what they want.
Speaker B: Okay. It has to be completely connected to their world. And if it's not, they're just, they're not even. They don't Want to talk?
Speaker A: Yeah. But the custom piece is important because it's like I want a product, I don't. I just going to buy a product off the shelf. It's almost like all products and services are on the shelf now.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: But if I've got to make sense out of all this and put it all together and I need to trust somebody to help me do that, I'm in. But if you're not going to do that, if you're just going to rep a product, I'm out.
Speaker B: Yeah, that's good. So what, are there some specifics that you can share that are really driving this that you saw from the research?
Speaker A: Well, the, one of the things that, you know, when we ask them, um, what inhibits. It's kind of like I've talked about the positive.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: You know, like understanding my business understanding, you know, customizing solution, providing insights. The other thing we ask them is what on a negative side, you know, what, what inhibits like on the negative. What, what, what don't you like what you want and what don't you want?
Speaker B: Okay, so you got real specific data around what they don't.
Speaker A: You said what, what does the seller do that inhibits your receptivity?
Speaker B: That would be good. I'd love to hear that.
Speaker A: The top three answers were lack of preparation. I mean it's, it's like the basic stuff. Lack of preparation, pitching aggressively. 37% said lack of preparation. That was the number one answer. By the way, when we, as we talk about this, you're going to see that the numbers don't add up to 100 because we basically ask all the participants in the research to select all that apply. Okay. Okay. Um, so we didn't make them choose, but lack of preparation was. 37% said that. And that was the number one answer. The second one was pitch aggressively. You know, it's like you're basically coming in, you're unprepared, you don't know what you're talking about. You don't get me. I mean you're basically saying be other centered and have something to say. Yeah, it's like, you know, and I know it's easy for sellers to go, okay, I know what I do, I know what I got my talking points down. Uh, you know, just come into like, it's like they don't really want to change. And that's one of the things we'll talk about in a second.
Speaker B: Well, can I ask, uh, here's. Because here's what I think is driving that. If you tell Me, if you agree, is now all the buyers know that the person that's calling that their. Their seller has access to so much information. And if. And it just looks lazy if you didn't do anything to prepare and. And know about me before we have a conversation.
Speaker A: Yeah, it's like I'm talking to my, you know, my, uh, what do you call it? Agent. My AI agent. Whatever that looks like. Yeah, yeah, we will call it. And I'm getting all this information about what's happening in the world. And then we got. We've got sellers who are showing up, reps are showing up. And, you know, and I think a lot of this can be related to account management. It's like, what do you need? How can I help you? Any. Any. Anything you're working on that you need me to quote? And they're like, yeah, yeah, a lot of reps are doing that. And I think. Or they're coming in saying, I got the greatest thing you need to hear about it. Which again is easy. Basically the easy, mundane stuff the customer is rejecting. Yeah.
Speaker B: Well, the two. The other two are closely aligned. The pitching aggressively recommended solutions in our kind of connected. It's almost like, hey, come prepared and develop something that's not about aggression or about pushing, but it's about solving my problem.
Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. That's exactly right. Um, the other way we ask the question is what behaviors immediately reduce. If this question was to the buyer, what behaviors immediately reduce your openness to engaging.
Speaker B: Interesting.
Speaker A: And this kind of connects the way.
Speaker B: Great question.
Speaker A: Yeah. Uh, they ask product centric questions. Was number one answer it all. I mean, it's just all validates what
Speaker B: we've seen 30 years.
Speaker A: Yeah. It's like. And they get it. Yeah. Oh, you want to know, hey, do you have a need for this kind of wire? You have a need for this kind of software. You need whatever. They're not understanding the business they're not having. They're not stepping back and being, you know, what we call a trusted partner. Whether you're trying to figure out what's happening in the business, how can I help you get there? I'm, uh, providing insights that you trust me because I'm trying to figure out what's best for you. Not try to rep my product. Yeah. The other, the other tide for that, for asking product centric questions was interrupt or redirect their concerns. Yeah, whatever.
Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Ah, yeah. Hurry. I'm not really.
Speaker A: I didn't. That's not in my career to sell something. And you're talking about Something I don't want to talk about. You know, you're kind of annoying me. Customer. Yeah. Yeah. And then, and then, uh, the last one was pressure to commit early.
Speaker B: Yeah. Gosh.
Speaker A: Yeah. Pressure to them to commit too early. And I think this highlights so much to take away from this, but I think this highlights the need for reps really understanding or developing a buyer centric process. Yeah. Right. Where are you in the journey? It's, it just speaks to self centeredness. It's like, hey, this is what I need to do. This is what we've talked about in our meetings. This is where our pipeline is. This is the pressure I'm getting in my business. So can. Are you ready? Are you ready? Are you ready? Are you ready? Can we do it now? Can we do it now? And I've been on the other side of that call of uh, that meeting versus where are you in the process? Let's help you navigate and adjust our process or what I'm going to recommend based on where you are. So that's not, that's not new. What was shocking to me, Tab, is the most shocking thing is reps do. There's some, there's some denial and schizophrenia going on with sellers because like 98% of the reps felt like they were going to hit their number.
Speaker B: Really?
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Wow.
Speaker A: When you'd ask them what they need, they need a lot. They're like, but I need all this. I need more people.
Speaker B: But I really don't know what I'm doing.
Speaker A: I believe I'm very. It's like they're overly optimistic. Yeah. Uh, which is a problem because it's almost like they feel like, I mean if they think like they're going to hit their number then uh, why really change?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And so I think that's a challenge for enablement and you know, and leaders and coaches.
Speaker B: I, I think that's a big takeaway, Tom.
Speaker A: It's.
Speaker B: It should be. It should light a fire in all of us that lead sales teams.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: You know they're going to be overly optimistic, which is good.
Speaker A: You want that.
Speaker B: And I know we got to manage it properly.
Speaker A: You got to manage it properly. And I want to, I want to because I've been kind of focused on bad news. But I really do want to underscore this that 90% of buyers say that the seller that has credibility provides business insights, sharing a. You sharing a unique perspective on how on a better way to solve the problem basically is trustworthy and knows what they're doing and is willing to provide Custom said. They said they are more likely to open up. And here basically consider an alternative solution. That's at a high number.
Speaker B: Yeah. That was 90%.
Speaker A: It was 47 significantly and 43 somewhat significantly. So I combine those two.
Speaker B: Wow, that's incredible. So would you say, you know, uh, and you've alluded to this a little bit, but I uh, wanted to clarify, do you think because like you said, it's kind of schizophrenic. I mean we've got, you've got reps are overly optimistic and then you're hearing this from, from the buyers. Do, do we really think that reps think they need to be a trusted partner?
Speaker A: It's a great question because this is what can. And I, I, yeah, I can't, I can't. I mean I'm glad that they said they think they're going to hit their number. Right. You don't want to rep going, I'm not going to have my number. Right. But here's, here's what I think is the most telling stat that answers your questions. 90% of the sellers say they're perceived as a vendor.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: It said even after months of working with an account, 90 said they're going to. And 80 something percent said they believe that if they were sought, they were, they were seen as a partner, they would be more successful. So they get it. Yeah, yeah, they get it. But it's. Change is hard. I mean like if I've been selling for a long time. Yeah. You know, and, and uh, the way that I've been doing it's been working or somewhat working or I've got a good product or I've got a good, you know, it's hard to really change until the wave hits the beach. You know, it's like.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And um, so, and I think my hope is that the information here will send a message to organizations that they now have to change.
Speaker B: Okay.
Speaker A: Right. The, the buyer speaking. And we now have to change. And the good news is there's the competitive advantage is there. I mean I see this as good news for any organization that's like, we're ready, we're ready to do something. We're ready to really invest and move our reps into a different direction and support them. And they're asking for it, by the way. That's one of the things if people want to uh, see the report.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: They're telling, we ask questions. What do you need? What training do you need? What skills you need? All these questions were asked and they're saying what they need. And it all lines up with what the customer, the buyer, is saying they want. So there's a lot of. We're there.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: We just got to pull back and say, okay, well, we got to do the work to change. We got to have the conversations. And by the way, people have to coach. It's like people, uh, still aren't coaching, which is going to be our next research project.
Speaker B: It's just driving me in crazy. I mean, anyway, I don't. That's for another. Another day. I was curious about this question, um, and I wanted to see if this was in your, you know, results at all, because this is. I'm seeing is that there are a lot of organizations that have these account managers or account executives.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: That are trusted partners with a significant number of their customers, but they're not with a lot of others.
Speaker A: So it's defending.
Speaker B: When they're defending, they are just crushing it. So I feel like that's an easier shift. You know, like they see the value in it, but then they're stuck in their old ways with people that are. That are grow or acquired. Did that come up at all?
Speaker A: Well, I think that's evident in the, uh, the buyers saying they'll ship, they'll change vendors. And so that's. There's a race to becoming a trusted partner is what I say. So, like, their customers, their buyers are saying, yeah, somebody would. If somebody would quit just following up with me and serving me and just giving me what I'm asking for, but they really started understanding my business and providing unique solution, I'd switch. But as long as nobody's going to do that, I'm going to stay with my current partner.
Speaker B: I got it. I got, uh. So. So even though people are, you know, are doing a good job defending other people, are doing a bet, are doing a better job picking those people off. So you've got to work on your pipeline. You've got to be growing and acquiring and doing other things too.
Speaker A: Well, I don't know if they're doing it. The customer is just saying they'll switch.
Speaker B: Okay.
Speaker A: Okay. So I didn't. We didn't find that out. But. But. But basically they're saying the buyer. We're kind of pulling the decision maker aside and saying, look, if we did. If somebody else did. Okay, so you've been using XYZ company all this time to buy your. Whatever components M. They're your preferred provider. Okay. And you're. And you've had no problems with them. And they're like, yeah, okay. So why would you. Would you work with somebody else? And he's like, yeah.
Speaker B: And they say it just like that.
Speaker A: Yeah. 50% of them said, okay, well, why would you work with somebody else? Well, if they did this for my business.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: If they understood me better, if they understand what's out of my business, they're not talking about products, and they. And they're providing insights, and they're telling us things we don't know, and they're leading us to better solutions. Yeah. So if nobody's doing that, you're safe. Um, but it's definitely, definitely a challenge. And, and by the way, for organizations that are hitting their number by defending, you know, either the account share that they have or they have all the account share, to me, you know, the. The. They just. I'd be looking over my shoulder.
Speaker B: Yeah, we all should be looking over our shoulder. All right, so, um, any. What are the big takeaways? What do you see is like, all right, what do we do with this?
Speaker A: Yeah, the net. Net of it is, um, so customers are speaking, decision makers are speaking. They need partners. They trust partners, not reps. Okay, so that's the big takeaway. So that begs the question, how do we do that? How do we.
Speaker B: What are the critical steps?
Speaker A: I think. I think, uh, you know, this. This is a. This is a training program. Right. But just to kind of give people some. Some things to chew on is, I think, the place to start. Besides removing the need to. You're like, we got to get. You got to get them to embrace the need to change. Right? So let's just. Let's set that aside. Like, that's an obvious. They've got to wake up. Right. We've got to help them. And ensuring they're going to embrace the need to change, we need to look at, you know, what's the barrier? Is it fear? That looks like ego, you know, disguised as egos. Like, I'm really afraid. I don't know what to do. You know, we got to have those conversations. Hey, this is what we're seeing. You know, what you're seeing. So what's going on here? Is it maybe we don't think there's payoff. Maybe there's a competing belief, whatever. We got to get into it. We got to figure that out. We got to address it. Okay, so that's number one. And that's.
Speaker B: But I think that's a really important thing to say is.
Speaker A: Is take.
Speaker B: Take advantage of this information. Get your people talking. How do you respond to this information? Do you guys Agree with this? Do you disagree? Yeah, I think that would just be, I'm just being real tactical here. I think that would be a great way to get some of those conversations going.
Speaker A: I think that's great. I think that's obvious or that's a great, great recommendation. Yeah, yeah, that's a really good point because yeah, that's, that's one of the purposes of this is just say, yeah, you know, people may read this report, go, well, there's nothing new here, but it sure gives me data to prove my point. Yeah, One of the great things about research, I think the number one thing and I think, I think this, this would change everything if a seller who became a partner had a point of view like they became an expert. Like, look, this is what you do, you understand how to solve this problem. And by the way, that includes, we say this all the time. That includes representing all the options. Like that's uh, one of the questions we ask, what do you want a seller to do? Which I didn't really get into that on this when I read earlier, but one of the things that the buyer said is 90% of the buyers said, I want to know, want to know about the competitive offerings. I want my seller to talk about competitive offerings. Yeah, but understand what are all the options? See the world from the customer's point of view. What are the, all the options happening, what's happening in their business and say, become an expert at how to solve this problem beyond a product or service you sell. So think about it as a problem that people have and how does it do solve? Have a point of view. Ah, like, you know, we want to have a point of view on how to change a sales organization which is way more involved than the training we provide. Right. It's just what has to occur for an organization to, to transition or transform from one place to the next. Right. You got to have a point of view. You got to be able to stand. And I've seen reps, reps that really are high performers, which I've, we've, we've witnessed that they, they have a posture, they stand a certain way, they talk a certain way and they go, this is what I believe. And there's passion that comes out of that. And I think versus a rep that says, well this is what I do. And if you have questions about it. And I said, ask a rep. Not too long ago we had all this high level meeting with a big buyer. Many people were on the table and the lead seller, a senior guy, I said, so, so what's your role here? Like what, what, you know, after this is after the meeting. Because I was kind of curious as to why things didn't happen that I thought should happen in the meeting.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So what, what's your role here? He goes, when that guy pointing to the customer has a question about how all this works, I hope they'll call me. Wow. Because he sees himself as an educator. Right. He sees himself as, I know my stuff. And if you have questions, I'm going to answer that. And that's a beautiful thing. Right. Be an expert at what you offer. But see what he, what he needs to say is like, you run this 100,000 square foot facility and for you to do that effectively and manage logistics much more than what I offer. Here's how to do that. And I'm an expert at that and I'm passionate about it and I talk about it and I write about it and I think about it and I post about it. And so I think that's, that's number one. I really do.
Speaker B: Wow. Well, that's. Yes. 100. You got me fired up just sitting right here. I mean I just, it's. And I think we, at least, I think a lot of people know that, but it's great to be kind of re inspired around that. I think, I think, I think it elevated.
Speaker A: Like let's get excited. Like let's, let's change. Like the world is not gonna, the, the rep is not going to survive.
Speaker B: Yeah. It's like we gotta get our mojo, you know, you gotta have that mojo, you know. And I think a lot of reps, I mean, encourage reps. Figure out ways to get your mojo going again and yeah, action. I think a lot of reps get tired. They get, they need to be re inspired.
Speaker A: Yeah. It's like, well, they got a lot of negative information coming at them. It's harder to hit your number. And you know, AI's feeling like, am I going to be replaced as a seller, as the customer? The customer doesn't want to talk to me as much. All these negative things. And so it's easy to get negative and live in fear. Right. That's natural. I do the same thing I said, but it's like, no, they do. This is what's so great. They do want more. And they're going to need a human that they can trust. And LinkedIn published, uh, a research report and it's like the trust. They called it the trust advantage. If you guys, I think it's free, you can get it, but it's basically saying, what can you offer that I can't?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And it's making sense out of the world. And I'm in this role as a customer. I mean I was, I've been in a situation recently where I had to buy something and I got all this conflicting information. But I'm all going to AI to help me figure this out. I need somebody and then, you know, to help me make sense of it. And when I would talk to the reps, they would just talk about their products.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: I'm like, no one's helping me make sense. I don't know to believe. I, I don't. And then by the way, which whichever tool I use tells me something different. I don't know the right prompts to ask. I mean, I, I don't know what I know. You know.
Speaker B: Yeah, it sounds like that's another takeaway. It needs to be product, you know, more, more business discovery and solutions than product discovery. It sounds like that's a takeaway.
Speaker A: That's a definitely takeaway. Yeah. How do we understand. And this is where we ought to start.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Like who? Uh, you know, and I get it, if you're talking to somebody who buys products, they're not going to want to talk about their business probably. But by the way, if you ask business level questions and they can't answer them, then the next question you say, well, who would we talk to? Because. Right, because the people that are just buying products, they're in trouble too. Yeah. Right. So they need to establish more value. So if you're helping them, think like a consultant. Let's together look at what's happening with the business and you're going to build credibility in your organization. And so if you're saying, hey, well what, why are we doing this? Where'd this come from? What is the organization trying to do? Where are you now? Where are you going? And they go, I don't really know. I was just supposed to buy this stuff.
Speaker B: Well, and that, that is from just my data, from working with a lot of sellers all the time. You know, what I'm hearing is we're getting more and more evaluators. We're having to start lower.
Speaker A: Yes.
Speaker B: More evaluators, which makes sense because of AI and all the things like go get all the data, go capture. And if we play that game and we don't ask the business discovery questions, we're not going anywhere. And we wonder why we don't get higher because to drive that it goes back to being. I'm trying to solve this solution there. So I think it all connects back to that. These are some tactical things under. What did you call it? Have a point of view.
Speaker A: Point of view.
Speaker B: Be passionate.
Speaker A: You're highlighting something. I just remember that came out of the report. One of the number one things the seller needs, said they need help with is getting the buyer to talk about, talk openly about their decision drivers and share information. I think it's because it's moved virtually. Right. It's hard to have face to face.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: It's hard to get them to open up. It's harder to create receptivity. And they may not even know. Yeah.
Speaker B: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A: So they've got to learn. To your point, if I'm talking to the evaluator and like, they're not. They're like, look, I was good. I was, I was told to go buy a Chevrolet that looks like this.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And you start asking me questions about what are we doing with the car and what's. I'm like, I mean, um, I don't really know how to answer questions. I'm just trying to fill in these boxes. Yeah. And so they need help into how to navigate that conversation and how to help position in a way that it's best for the customer to have a deeper level conversation if they're uncomfortable having it because they don't know how do we help them be comfortable. One other thing, Tab and I know we're kind of getting, uh, a little, uh, about out of time. One thing I do want to say though is, and I think this is the biggest, maybe I should say, I think this might be the hardest shift is never do the same thing twice.
Speaker B: Tell me, what do you mean by that?
Speaker A: In other words, everything you do, you do with a buyer, the customer needs to be custom.
Speaker B: Oh, yeah. I had that conversation yesterday with a potential, with a prospect, and it was funny. Uh, and she was asking me all, have you worked with this kind of company in the super specific of this kind of deal? And we're kind of going back and I just kind of stopped and I just said, you know, I can give you a list of all these companies, but you know what I've realized? Everybody's different. If I've worked with 25 different distributors, when I'm talking to you, I'm talking to you. And, and, and you'll be different. And she, it was funny. She just went, you know, you're right. And it, it really does validate exactly what you're saying.
Speaker A: That's exactly. Yeah. And every time we talk to a new customer, and they start talking about our program, and we somehow get to, you know, how do we customize and what's our process for driving change? And all this kind of thing we always say and we believe it, and if you look at all of our programs, they're all different. Is that you don't need an ASLAN program. You need a. You need your program.
Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A: Right. And it's a pain in the. It's a pain in the pain. It's. So every big business wants to scale, so they come up with these ways to scale, and they need to do that. And it makes sense to make your business scale. But part of scaling your sales organization and your business has got to help reps learn to adjust versus memorize this, do this. Here's your playbook. Go get them. Do what I tell you to do, say what I tell you to say, and go get. And to some degree, for some people, maybe they've got the most innovative product and they just need to take the message to market. Yeah, go get them. God bless you. But. And that's great, you know, but if. If you're seeing shrinking market share or you're seeing headwinds on the horizon, we got to look at the customer, we got to step back. And this is the way I always like to think about it. I don't know what they need. I don't know what I. What I. What I can sell. I have no perceived, you know, biased about what to wreck. I'm like, I'm gonna start over what is going on? And then I'm gonna. Then I'm gonna come back to my portfolio and go, now what do I have that I can help them? But if I let go all my stuff that I offer, just set it over there and just go, like, tell me I'm gonna start it from scratch. Blank slate. We talk about one of our podcasts, talk about clear our cash, and then. And that's. That's the key. But the problem is, if you do that, people are going to get confused. Yeah. And so we got to figure out organizationally, how do we equip, give them. Uh, there's a lot of sellers that are like, I could do that. Just let me. Right. But the system's not set up for it, and there's other sellers, like, I don't know what, uh, I mean, that's a challenge for me. So they need more support.
Speaker B: Excellent. Well, this has been great, Tom. Um, I mean, tons of insight. I'm excited to dig into the meat research and more depth, but thank you. This was great.
Speaker A: Yeah, I'm excited about sharing, uh, it. And what we'll do is we'll package. In the process of getting. I mean, within a week or so, it'll be packaged. I don't know when this is going to air, but it may be by the time this airs, it'll all be packaged. And so we're not making it available. We've got a group of sales enablement that's part of our advisory group. It's, uh, called C Group Sales Enablement Advisory Group. So we make it available to our members, but if anybody else wants to see it, we're going to say, great, if you want it, we're going to. We'll meet with you and walk you through High Level what it offers. But it's. It's really. We created this specifically for our membership and for our ability to serve our customers better. So that's the purpose, but we can definitely figure out a way to get it in the hands of anybody that's interested. Excellent. All right, man, well, thanks. Thanks. Good to see you. Tabby, uh, thanks for joining us for another episode of Sales with Aslan. And, uh, let us know how we can serve you, Sam.
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