Ruby He (CPA) on How They Use Data + AI to Drive Mortgage Leads

Speaker 2: Ruby, welcome. Thanks for coming onto the show. I was intrigued when I spoke to the other day at our networking event. So a lot of, a lot of people are talking about AI and adoption. A lot of people were talking about in terms of theory. And when you, when you were telling me about the stuff that you'd done, your background and how unique that is and what you've already finished, I thought it'd be a good idea to talk.

Speaker 1: Thank you for having me, Jeremy.

Speaker 2: And yeah, just to get a more practical feel of on the ground where small businesses can use it. So normally the way I like to go through it is, you know, we definitely go through our history. So we build your street cred, where you came from, why should people listen to you? ⁓ And I usually like to put the pricing question at the start. Like what is it that you're offering? How do people, you know, if they had to get the first bite of the apple, how do they get in touch? Right. Because the thing is I feel like I'm listening to the shows where it takes too long before they get to that part. And by the time they get to that part, the listener probably thinks, well, I can't afford it anyway. You so I want to get that out of the way. So we're not like trying to sneak that into the show. You know what I mean? So you're not trying to that. And at the end, you can tell everyone again. What is it that, you know, how do people get a hold of you, et cetera.

Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, sure. Yeah, so people can get hold of me through my website, rubystrategic.co and I offer a free 15 minute consultation and from there the consultation will be $300 per hour. then usually when they start engaging with me, I'll do a proof of concept project with them for about $3,000. And then from there we can do phased projects usually is about $30,000.

Speaker 2: Yep. Sounds good. And then if we, so if we can, if we can call out a target market today, so who do we really want to be talking to today?

Speaker 1: Mortgage brokers. Yeah, the owners of mortgage brokers. Ideally having more than five staff members.

Speaker 2: Right. So in a typical mortgage broking business, what's the setup? You've got the owner who usually was a mortgage broker and him or herself, right? And then they got too busy, hired like a staff. like is it local VA? it... ⁓

Speaker 1: Yeah, usually they will have a couple of brokers themselves in Australia onshore and then they also have support over in Philippines, Nepal or India.

Speaker 2: Okay. That's, that's the usual set up and they grow from there kind of thing. then I know that, going into your history, your, your, your history is actually like, I can't tell when I sit here look at you, but you were saying how you done like a, implementation and you were the GM for how many staff was it?

Speaker 1: Yes, correct. Yeah, the company is actually about 350 people and I was the general manager of operations. Yeah. Yeah. So I don't deal much with the sales and marketing side of things, but everything that to do with operations such as finance, customer service, HR, data, tech, IT, that's all under my remit.

Speaker 2: Really? That's crazy. all of these departments, different personalities, different things. Combining. So your strength and your angle coming into this AI game, like because there's so many people doing it, right? But your angle is really like, it transformation?

Speaker 1: Unsure offshore Yeah. So it's more like from the leadership team point of view. Cause so since I'm the leader in the business and I get to see the business problems and I get to see the pain point and I know what sort of problem that I want to solve and then combine with my knowledge of AI and put it together to, to provide a solution.

Speaker 2: The project that you did work on over there and many others after I'm sure, but that, that particular one was about introducing AI or, was it?

Speaker 1: No, can I tell you the Yeah. Okay. So this is back in 2023, you know, when chat GPT came about and then there's a lot of hype about AI and all the business owners were like, ⁓ my gosh, we're going to die. And in like 12 months because AI is taking over, we have to do something about AI. And at that time, you know, the, the leaders was like, And then the first thing they did was like, we're going to hire a head of AI, which a lot of businesses do, which they did. But then the head of AI was very focused on tech side of things. And so then the first implementation was not, it went nowhere. So then that became my problem because I was the general manager, even though I didn't have much of an AI tech background. So then I thought, you know, let's use the first principle thinking. Let's go back to the basics. What sort of problems that in the business that we think AI could solve. So I learned some basic stuff for what AI can do. There's the natural language processing, which is chat GPT. And then there's, you know, the visual, the vision can read documents and stuff. So then I come back to the business problem. What sort of problems that we were facing at that time? It was a lot of repetitive questions like customers asking and that's taking up our human customer service a lot of time. that company is a real estate company. And then the clients constantly asking, when is my property settling? When is my land settling? Then I thought, okay, let's try to get AI to solve this problem. So then I went ahead and then think, okay, so what sort of team members I need? I need AI developers. I need data people. And I need like a of like a portal developer to develop an interface that the client can interact with the AI. I assemble a team and then I say, give me like a proof of concept or MVP, minimal viable product. And then from there, so they gave me the minimal viable product that could answer that question. So the AI is, we had an open enterprise grade account that can access to the language model. And then we also connected with a data warehouse that's got our property information. And then we built an interface. The whole lot allows the AI to interact with the clients based on the actual property information and give them the data of when is their property settled because that date actually varies. It changes.

Speaker 2: So with the head of AI when they came in, Like, so when you're talking about data warehouse, we're talking about putting a team together and who to hire, et cetera, right? Like, I'm sure, no, no, I shouldn't ask this way. Maybe there's a different way to ask. So in terms of the person who was on more on a techie side, I mean, they would have left some remnants of ideas for you to work towards, right? Like you couldn't have started from zero because You would have saw the good things they've done. You're like, well, they haven't put the right team together. You know, they're not considering the human factor overall. don't know the business well enough.

Speaker 1: Yeah. He did, ⁓ like he's very passionate about AI. And that's kind of like a bug I caught because initially I didn't know anything about AI. Right? I mean, it's quite a new concept and then he was passionate.

Speaker 2: If he's early, that's early, that's very very early.

Speaker 1: That's what chat GPT just came out

Speaker 2: Just release, yeah. So when you were putting together the people, when you were saying the repetitive questions or that, like how much buying do you have to get from the people? Was that where the broke down was? When it's like, when you hire someone that's super techie.

Speaker 1: think the biggest obstacle for the tech head of AI was he just came in, he just got hired. He doesn't even understand what we're doing as a business. And that's actually a long learning curve where I was hired by that business in 2020 and I started off as a head of finance and starting. You start off like doing cashflow forecasting. have to learn every aspect of the business and I know where the bottleneck is. So that took away a lot of learning.

Speaker 2: So in your implementation of going forward for, for Rubi's strategic, is that the angle you're going with? you, are you recommending people do it internally? Like is that the angle you, you're going to, well, you're going to spot opportunities for them. And then, because you can't know a business like they do as well.

Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a very good question, Jeremy. So, I mean, a lot of business problems, you can go back to first principle thinking, right? So I would be working closely with them because a lot of businesses, might be lacking that particular person that's understand operations and also understand tech. if you think about business people like a red color and tech people are blue. They're very logical. Business people are very passionate. I think I'm kind of like a purple in between so I can translate for each other.

Speaker 2: So, so your role as in your engagement, like your value proposition is more like you are going to do a bit of, I don't know what the right word is, but like mentoring coaching kind of thing. Like.

Speaker 1: Consulting, will always consult from the beginning and start, my consultation would always be starting from the business problems. And a lot of business problems are very similar, especially if it's within the same niche. So, so it's usually is like customer service and you know, like there's a lot of repetitions and yeah. So I will be asking the questions of to the, to the business owner, like where is your time go? Where do you think is not adding value? And that's really repetitive.

Speaker 2: In your case study and you know, in your case studies that I went through, there was talking about the guardrails you put on for the AI, right? Like there's just going, I'm going from memory now. So one of the things was anytime a question is answered, there's transparency into the broker knows about it, right? And there's also the next day you get to review it and they get to escalate it. Right? Okay. So just say mortgage broken business. One of the quick common questions goes, where's my loan at? Is it unconditional, et cetera, right? I don't know. I don't pretend to know about mortgage breaking. I've taken out like one loan or two loans. ⁓ So to me, that's all right. Yeah. This is where I'm going to challenge. Okay. And I'm sorry if this comes off, like I'm trying to start a fight because I'm not. So if I ask the first question, right. And now I'm going to ask follow up questions like, well, why is it taking so long? Why are you missing any documents from me?

Speaker 1: Okay

Speaker 2: You know, like you tell me, you know, when I submitted 2026 tax returns, did that get approved? Like, where are we? I've talked to a broker. Do you know what mean? I want to hear the voice. I want to hear the certainty of it. And I think when a business goes to like the 300 men head of operations, head of finance, yeah, cool. Like they're going to need that system. Before like a five man team. Do you, do you still see it? you still see it? That real talk.

Speaker 1: Yeah, so like for a smaller business, like I do talk to those business owners and then they don't feel comfortable for AI to engage directly with the clients, which I think is totally fine. Like I'm not avoiding that question because sometimes I don't suggest them to use AI. If it's like for a smaller business, your brand is yourself. And you want to have that personal touch. And then, and if the business owner doesn't feel comfortable with that, then I don't push them to have to adopt AI for customer service side. Then I say, let's look at the workflow. Let's look at the paperwork. Like there is, there's another mortgage brokering business that we are currently looking at talking to in Melbourne. They've got about 10 staff members. And then he's like, I don't feel comfortable for AI to talk to my customers. It doesn't matter if it's in a website format or, or, or calling. So then I said, okay, how about anything to do your workflow that's taken up a lot of your time? He's like, yeah. So my staff is saying compliance. We spend a lot of time checking the pay slips and bank statement. And then I say, okay, so we don't have to use the natural language processing ability of AI. Then we can use the vision. you know, the optical side for the AI to read the document and we can build the logic to find out what is not adding up. Cause some people fake their payslip. They get AI to make a fake payslip. And then we use AI to pick up.

Speaker 2: Okay. So surely like there must be so many people rushing to do what you're doing. I know you've got programs here, you've got programs, you've got stuff that you're working on and people are probably even faster than what you're doing. Right. And they, mean, they probably already started in 2000, you know, long, long time ago. Right. So to me, like when I sit across you, like the difference is you, you know what mean? Like I want to talk to you. I want the person to be like, if someone, if anyone engages you, They'll want you, right? Yeah. And do you think out of the box solution can overtake what you're doing? Cause I'm sure someone's working on that now. They try to do one for the mortgage broker. They try to be the authoritative tool for mortgage broker industry. Yeah. Is that what you're aiming for or not really?

Speaker 1: No, I don't want to aim to build tools like out of of box solutions because that needs a lot of money, a lot of funding. Developing a product needs a lot of money and then I don't want to go out there and asking for funding. But where we specialize is we, the people can come to me and say, Hey, I'm thinking about using this tool. There's actually a lot of AI tools for mortgage brokerings.

Speaker 2: I don't know any about the development.

Speaker 1: And I'm not aiming to cover everything. And then the good thing is about those tools, they've solved very specific problems. Some of them is like talking about policies and I'm not an expert of policy because I'm not a broker myself. So then I can give them a consultation of, here is your stack of tools. How do you make the best use of it?

Speaker 2: I think, I seriously think that is top value. I'm not even joking. Cause I know that in the marketing world every day, you you got these towels, they look like game, like tokens. You know what mean? There's like 16 of them. Some people might get excited looking at that. I don't, I don't think small businesses do because that means whatever they were using is probably outdated. They're thinking, well, like they will go to sleep thinking, well, every day, like, is there a better tool to replace my tool? know, and somebody has to be on the other end and biased, telling them about that. Yeah. Somebody has to tell them. I think even on a drive here, I think that is where the most value is added. Like ongoingly, telling them what's out there, telling them what's already replaced, whatever they're currently using. Yeah. level of discernment and your industry expertise is going to be the winner. That's what I think.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. I'm not ambitious of building my own tools because there's already a lot out of there.

Speaker 2: So you're just testing a lot of it, you're talking to a lot of people around that stuff.

Speaker 1: Proactively ⁓ until some brokers is asking me about

Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. stay grounded in terms of business problem. I always know what I'm representing. Like we are business people. Like we're representing like business, helping them solving business problems.

Speaker 2: So me also in very small micro business and dealing with small businesses a lot, right? So lot of what you're saying is professional services, right? Can this work for blue collar at a certain size?

Speaker 1: Yeah, like definitely. like you're talking about tradies. think they need more help because they generally don't have time to, I was talking to a removal of this morning before I came here actually. So they just don't have time to think about systems and, and ⁓ software. So, so I can mean more holistically. So I know this may be like we're moving away a bit from AI, but I think the AI is the Tip of the iceberg underneath it is your data, your system, and your people. So you need to look at them all together. So I was like saying, I provide consultation holistically and sometimes people come to me asking me a AI question. And then that actually exposes a lot about other things in their business. Just like one of your blog posts is talking about, like you need to, you need to make sure that your process is in line, your data is clean for you to make the most use of the AI. So for blue colors, I feel like they either don't have a system or the system is messy or they have a lot of, they sign up to a lot of apps and now they're all tangled.

Speaker 2: The reason they're doing a lot of that is yes, they don't have the time to do that, right? And also like their mentality compared to us sitting in an office, not sitting in an office, but like white collar, right? We were settled, conversation, coffee, they're brutes, man. Like these people cannot sit still. There's a lot of swearing, there's a lot of like skepticism. They look at you not like, they say, what do you... What are you in this for? What are you getting out of this? Like there's no, and a lot of time, especially with tradies, it's their own money. Right? So it's their own money. So they're not managing other people's money. Do you know what I mean? So margins are huge. think that's why they act the way they act. And I think that, well, I drew two circles here because I think that there's a, yes, it's AI and that's where you're coming in as, but you also like doing more of a broader business consulting kind of thing, right? That's where the VIN diagram overlaps.

Speaker 1: Exactly

Speaker 2: you okay with that, area? Cause I mean, you've got an accounting background and everything, which helps a lot, right? Cause you know what you're talking about. You know the books, you know all of that stuff, right? And you had an opera, you had operations, which is massive. So when you're consulting, do you feel comfortable moving away from AI and small business?

Speaker 1: I actually, I actually don't feel comfortable to go straight to AI without looking at this system. Because again, if we use the iceberg analogy, like you cannot have AI floating with no ground. The nerve foundation. then I think there are a lot of AI experts feel comfortable of just selling them a tool and have a quick transaction. But I'm more for long-term. And I say that AI is trained on your business data. And where does the data come from? You collect it with your system, which is CRM and all of that. And if you don't have those foundation, then what you're using AI for is just a bit like a question and answer with chat GPT and you're not fully utilizing the power of AI. And that's not what I'm here for. I'm here to give you a holistic solution. So, so if I, if I think that AI is not right for you right now, then I'll tell you, say, okay, let's look at your data first. Let's sort it out. Let's look at your system. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2: roadmap for them. have very much same problem, right? Cause I advertising and when you go to businesses and I know that there's a lot of notes we have here about, more of like the, the maturity of the business. So the problem that I go into when I go work with blue collar is like, they might not ever get some maturity. You can hang around cause you've got stuff to do, right? And you can't be the consultant while they're getting there. Do you know what mean? So. The business owners like that, they got four or five vans on the road and they might be also blue collar, very busy, know, lunches. Like how do we get that data game going? Do you have a methodology for it? ⁓

Speaker 1: Yeah, then I'll start with the CRM. Do they have a CRM? So then if they don't have a CRM, I'll ask them to get a CRM and my team can help implement.

Speaker 2: The team comes in. They have to do a lot of it themselves. So it's getting it in place for them, making it easy for them. And then they can say like, all right, so this is SOP. Every time you do a job, do this.

Speaker 1: Cause cause I don't see myself as like just pure consulting and just talk. And then here's the plan you go implement.

Speaker 2: So your people comes in and helps. That's a different value prop. Okay, cool. So let's not use a real example, like the remove-less, right? Let's use a hypothetical. Like, can you me an example of how people eventually make use of a CRM? Like a small business with AI.

Speaker 1: Yeah, like, mean, like if people are starting to considering that, I want to scale my business, I want to grow. And then, so then they would have marketing activities, whether it's into engaged professionals like you or, and then when the leads come in, then you need to put the lead somewhere, right? You need to have a client management system. to be able to track them, follow them up and then also have the track the stats as well. Like how long does it take to convert and what's your sales velocity and who referred to you and what are the other services that you can sell them. And that's all the power of CRM. for take HubSpot for example, and also GoHat level, those are the CRM that we normally recommend to clients. Then And then we also then connect the CRM to a data warehouse in the cloud, could be Azure or Google cloud. Then we, you know, then we do a lot of analysis for them about the business stats.

Speaker 2: Let's just say, let's give a practical example. Let's not, ⁓ sorry, let me say this again. Let's not use a like obscure example where it's a very small business. Let's say it's good size, right? 3000 people on the email list, right? Pretty clean data. Who referred them? Where they get it from? What's the average monthly, you know, invoice? How long did they usually stay before they churn, for example, right? And what's the current, you know, intake? So just say that's organizing the warehouse, start a warehouse already. Right? So the AI will come in, like your, your thing, like I'm trying to ask where is your, like, do you add your value compared to someone who's trying to do it on a cheap, try to do DIY.

Speaker 1: Yeah, so I can give you one example of a real estate agency in Queens Gold Coast that we're helping. So they have a database of 50,000 people and then their goal is to be able to outreach to them and ask them if they want to sell their house. Right? So that's their problem proposition.

Speaker 2: Yes.

Speaker 1: Then what we did is they, they CRM is called Racks, which is a very standard release date software. then we connect that with a data warehouse and we clean the data and then we use AI to send out text messages to have a natural conversation with the prospect, prospecting seller and then say, Hey, we're, we're about to sell this house in, your street. Would you like to be in the loop about how much is going to be sold for and then have a conversation from there? And usually the, the, either be replying, not interested or not interested. And then the human agent will call based on the, the, the interest level. Our AI is also assessing the sentiment of the responses as well. And then give the, give them a scoring of, ⁓ call this person first. Right.

Speaker 2: Cool. So, yeah.

Speaker 1: Exactly. So then you have, as you can see, that's several items together. So you have the AI component, which is what they come to us for. But then we started with the CRM and then we also have the data warehouse and then the AI ⁓ components as well. And all the answers again, it comes back to the warehouse that we store that. And that's the chat history.

Speaker 2: Big time.

Speaker 1: is a good asset to the business. So this is the custom AI solution that I make a typical project and make for our clients. Then I say that the reason that, cause initially they wanted to buy Rita, which is the third party software that's made by Cortellit. And I said, I'm not against you buying it. You can buy all sorts of tools. can also help you implement, but if you want a future proof your business, cause they initially came to us that say, how do we survive in the age of AI? I said, then you need to have a customized AI for your own business. And that can be your mold. Because this AI will be trained on your data. So data... Yeah, because if you use a third party product, your data goes to their software, their data warehouse. Where I built a software data warehouse for you. And then all your data, the chat history will be in that, ⁓ in there.

Speaker 2: Yeah Yeah I can see, I can see as you're talking, my head's going to like scripts, effective scripts, training, right? Cause some brokers are better at calling time to call like time from, AI is telling you this is urgent, this is good. And you're calling like eight hours later, I'm going to know because I've got the AI tools to analyze what is he doing? I can train, can promote, I can find out reasoning. I can find out the words, the time that they should have. interjected or something like that during a conversation. I can use it all for training. can actually use that once, you know, I can't see it for the remove this year, but once you finish that job, I love to chat to you and then tell me like, you know what I mean? It's different. This is massive. Like, you know, this is massive database where the other ones you'd be using a different way. And I'm fully with you about this. So we touched on several things I want to touch, which is the, the, how SME is used, how we measuring. how like success is which very easy, how we measuring and how your solutions, custom solution and your value, value prop. So the last thing I want to touch on is the people aspect of it. Because I was talking to my friend who works in a pretty high placing AI and he's explaining to me that it depends who you're talking to in the business is that is your success of adoption. If the person feels like this is going to get rid of me, like, would he be on board, dude? You know what mean? Like, why would he talking away? Why would he, he just like, he's got the boss's ear. Yeah. Do know what I mean? Like he's not going to, the boss doesn't always have time to talk to you. So you've been delegated to one of his people, AI, the head of AI. And if they suspect that, you know, things going to change a lot, they might not be comfortable with it. And when I was reading your bio and your posts, sometimes you did have to move people on to your last role. Right. You had to promote people who deserve the shine, deserve the daylight. And some people who weren't on board, who were no longer aligned had to be moved on. Yeah. Right. So on a people aspect, how do you see yourself navigating this in small business?

Speaker 1: Yeah, I think AI is not just about the tech and the tools is more about the cultural change and the people management is a change management. It's a process actually. So you're exactly right. If the people resist it, then it's not going to go anywhere. doesn't matter how much time you paid for consulting and get a fabulous PowerPoint presentation. It's those money is all going to be wasted.

Speaker 2: We have to get buying but-

Speaker 1: Exactly. So, so before you do anything, like we have something called project sponsor. So from the leadership team. So first of all, somebody in the leadership have to want to do this. Right? Cause they pay the check and then they are responsible for the ROI of this project. And then they also responsible for communicating to the staff member why they want to do it. Right? So. It's a bit easier if internally, so then when I was a general manager, I communicate. Right. But then when you are an external person, then I need my twin within the business. Right. And we have to see eye to eye. So a lot of those work is done in feasibility study. I wouldn't take on a project. There is no buy-in. If I feel like the chance of this project. failure rate is pretty high, then I wouldn't want to take it. So there are some people, they come to me because they are forced by their boss. And I could tell, I'm like, you're not really interested in getting this off the ground. You just want to the box, do you? And it's Exactly. Then we're just not going to go ahead. And then, so the internal person, which is my twin, they have to have all this change management meetings with the team and then just say, Hey, you have to

Speaker 2: But, ⁓

Speaker 1: get onto it and what's the benefit not like in the threatening way because because a lot of things that are like a lot of clients that I engage with is they have they want more capacity. Yeah. They don't need to fire people but they want to take on Yeah. Exactly. So then just be transparent. But if somebody says hey like I want to do this so I can fire a hundred people then I'm like it doesn't sit well with me.

Speaker 2: But they wanna do more with their people. Doesn't sit well either. Can I just say something? This is an as we wrap up and I'd love for you to promote your thing again, but I just want to say this. How, like, would you say your current business, right? Would you still say it's in like the earlier phase of things as you're building up?

Speaker 1: It is early in, in terms of like, feel like the market is still trying to sauce out about AI, but in terms of the maturity of our tech, people, some people has been, our team has been with machine learning ever since 2016. Back then they don't call it AI. Now they call it AI. So our tech maturity and also my implementation skills, cause I led so many projects. It's not new right? So I'm very confident on.

Speaker 2: Take care, all right. It is not a new-

Speaker 1: comfortable with it, but the market, cause there is a lot of AI hype and they're confused about do I buy a tool and then just.

Speaker 2: education, lot of education, lot of noise, had to get cut through. And I feel like my point is I feel like, you know how you are, you got criteria before you work with them. has to be certain thing, cause success rate, right? Why would you do something like failure and all that? I think that you, you, I have the same problem. Okay. I have same problem when I first started, right? Many years ago. So I'll have to take on some jobs I didn't really want to take on. You know what mean? I feel like if you put too many conditions, it's like, cause people out there, they'll take out anything. Yeah. then they would have got to maybe it'll work. Maybe it wouldn't, but that is burned forever. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Like if they go with a cowboy, like if your remove list doesn't go with you, but go with a cowboy and they implement some other boxing doesn't work. Like that guy's done with AI forever, Like, you know what I mean? So we lost that lead and they got a bad experience. So sometimes I think we have to. take a bit more risk of success, think. That's what I think.

Speaker 1: Yeah. I know. Maybe like, I felt like I'm a bit laid back. I think I need to be a bit more aggressive because there are some people came to me, they already got burned. There's one, there's one client was like already burned several hundred thousand dollars on somebody who just being irresponsible, like get this, get that. And then, and then he was like saying AI, agentic AI and web three blockchain. then they just kept keep on. That's another thing I would like the audience to know is if somebody comes to you with all these fancy terms and there's nothing underneath and you sense it's too good to be true and highly likely it's too good to be

Speaker 2: A hundred percent. That's what I think I wanted to start with the street cred. What is he working on? you know what mean? Like where's the world have you practically touched on? Like with your own hands and all that. And that, that's why I think that that's very important. Yeah. Looking my industry, same thing. SEO, you know, many years ago was the exact same thing. And, and a lot of it, a lot of it is hype, but cool man. Like, yeah, I think this really, I think we really covered off everything. Is there anything that you feel like we didn't cover that well?

Speaker 1: I just would like to go deeper on this anxiety about AI. There's a lot of small businesses owners. They talk about like, is my business going to disappear in three or five years? look, we don't know what the future is going to be like, but what you can do at this stage is to build your mold, right? And your data is your mold. Your process is your mold. And how do you future-proof? for that and you will, you want to have build your asset, your data warehouse, your CRM, your system, your processes, and you want to have a customized AI that's trained on your own data. So those are the things that I would like the business owners to start thinking about. I know some of them, like if you're a, just by yourself, you have one or two team members, maybe that's too much for you. But the moment you get to five, 10 people, Instead of just thinking about buying tools, you need to think about have your own AI.

Speaker 2: So you mentioned having the moat with in terms of data warehousing, their own data processes. I will even add to as people. I think they have to, I think they have good people. ⁓ have a team of 10. I really can't see myself and you know, AI is really, really affected marketing. Right. For me, luckily in a good way, because you know, they got rid of the copywriters and all that, right? Cause AI is a language model. It's getting better at analysis, getting quicker, but I can't see.

Speaker 1: Exactly.

Speaker 2: like removing of the team. think I want to upskill them. So they're like fully like in the game. Do you know what mean? Like fully, fully in the game of it. Yeah. No, that's, think it's a good point. Yeah. Why don't you tell the people where they can find you and how they can engage with you again, in case they, you know, want to talk more.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. So they can just find me on my website, rubystrategic.co and, or I'm also active on LinkedIn.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yep. they can, when they get engaged with you, they can start with a 15 minute consultation just to make sure it's a good fit. If they want to do a longer one, you're looking at 300 plus GST, you chat to you for an hour. And then the process is from there, you can actually build out a proof of concept for them. Yes. Investigator, investigator situation, proof of concept. And then they can either go ahead or they can abandon from that point. Exactly. let's what's more interesting.

Speaker 1: Yeah Yeah proof of concept is normally two weeks to three weeks and then they can see how we work and we can also source out how

Speaker 2: That's very important, I think to see just to cause then they see in action, you know, all the glosses gone. They're spending a lot more time with you to make sure they're still comfortable. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing, man. Well, I really appreciate coming on the show and I see you when touch base again in six months or whatever. See where you go working on.

Speaker 1: Thank you, Jeremy. Thank you.