Are You a Dream Manager? How to Help Employees Set and Achieve Goals

Speaker A: What I think is so cool is because most people are not asking about your dreams. You get to be that person. Like, can you imagine you're the leader in their life that started asking them, uh, about their dreams, and they might be caught off guard, but they're going to really think, oh, what are my dreams?

Speaker B: Hello, and welcome to this episode of HR Unplugged. Are you a dream manager? How to help employees set and achieve goals? I'm your host, Vanessa Brulot. Are, uh, dreams important in the workplace? For many, dreams aren't just personal. They're powerful drivers of motivation, loyalty, and even performance. In this episode of HR Unplugged, we sit down with Kate Vollman, CEO of uh, Floyd Consulting, to explore the power and why they matter for HR leaders and the rest of the org. We'll talk through how dreams have a profound impact on employee engagement, why tapping employee motivation is critical for retention, and how you can create a culture where people feel inspired to grow personally and professionally. Hey, everyone. Welcome to today's episode of Adrian Plugged. We have an awesome guest for today's episode, Kate Vollman. Kate Volman is the CEO of Floyd Consulting, a company dedicated to helping organizations build dynamic cultures, attract and retain top talent, and create workplaces where people love coming to work. Founded by Matthew Kelly, the Floyd team certifies dream managers, provides business and life coaching, and implements leadership development programs to help individuals achieve their personal and professional dreams, which is so cool. Kate is also the author of do what yout Love, A Guide to Living youg Creative Life Without Leaving your Job, and hosts two podcasts, Lead with Culture and Create for no Reason. Kate, thank you so much for joining me today. What did I miss in this intro? Tell us something else about you so our audience feels like if you're with us right now.

Speaker A: Oh, I love that. Well, first of all, thank you, Vanessa, so much for having me on the show. This is, uh, this is so cool. And one of the things that we have in common is a love of books. It was so interesting hearing you talk about. You're into more fiction, and I am more into, uh, nonfiction. So it was just. That is something that I feel like brings people together when you have, like, a love of books like that.

Speaker B: Yes. And you had some really valuable recommendations. Like, as soon as you heard all the things I was interested in, you're like, oh, have you heard of this? Have you heard of that? That? I love it. Well, let's get into it. Let's start with the big one. Are dreams really important in the workplace? And if so, why?

Speaker A: Dreams are important for so many reasons. And in our culture today in the workplace, you know, 70% of the workforce is disengaged right now. But when you think about that, how sad that people are going into the office, they're going to work, they're stepping into their home offices behind their computer and they're, they're not excited, they're not engaged in the work that they're doing. And that's not only a work problem. People are disengaged in their own lives. Like this is a problem in all areas of our lives. And one of the questions, really, the question that you can ask someone to instantly boost engagement is what are your dreams? It is the one thing that connects all of us, right? So like we, everyone on the planet has dreams. Now. Some people have lost touch with their dreams. They've buried them deep inside. They don't talk about them anymore. So many people have not been asked about their dreams in years, if even ever. And this is why dreams are important. Because we can't expect people that are disengaged in their own life to show up at work and become engaged in work to fulfill a beautiful mission that an organization has if they don't even want to get home and fulfill their own life's purpose and mission. And so that's why it's incredibly important. And some leaders, when they talk about, oh, dreams, that's, you know, what is that? How is that important in the workplace? It's essential in the workplace. Like we have to be dreaming together as a team in order for people to grow personally and professionally.

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Speaker A: Uh, thank you.

Speaker B: You're too kind.

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Speaker B: that because as you were kind of talking about, that made me kind of think of your daily battery a little bit. And when I'm like reading my, my fiction or fantasy and even doing the things that I love or have my dreams like those are the days I'm doing those kinds of things outside of work. My battery is a lot more open in the workday. And so it's just like I, I think of that, that battery life A little bit in that importance of that dream. So I love that you talk about it kind of impacts both, it's in both places the disengagement's happening, which is so it's like we know it, but hearing it is also shocking too.

Speaker A: Yeah. In fact, I, I, I was just speaking at an event last week and I love sharing with people that when Matthew wrote the book the Dream Manager, after it was this huge success, he started telling people, he's like, I almost didn't write this book because it seems so simple, like care about people, like treat people like people. And then this concept, this, which is everything that we believe at Floyd, which is your organization, can only be the best version of itself to the extent that your people are becoming better versions of themselves. And so we want to work with people like you, Vanessa. Uh, right. Like people that have interests outside of work. Because if you're engaged outside of work and you're excited about some of these things, you're going to come into work with so much more energy and enthusiasm. And that's the thing that's so interesting with leaders is coaching is a gift that you get to give your people. And when you start asking your team members what are your dreams and you know what's important to them. Right. Like leaders of an organization, CEOs founders, they care about the company because that is one of their dreams. And that's not to say that other people don't care about the mission, they do, but they have their own personal dreams and they believe that if I work for this organization, great, I get to fulfill this mission. But also I'm going to be able to pursue my dreams. When I go home, I'm going to be able to go with my family and take vacations and build my own skills and develop in ways that I want to develop. And so we have to know the motivations of our people if we expect to help them grow in whatever role they're in at the company.

Speaker B: Mhm. Yeah, it's, it's that well rounded quality of life. If you care about that, like, oh, that's amazing. I hope other people are just as excited as I am talking about this topic because I absolutely love it. And so I'm, I'm, I'm curious too, as we're kind of going down that path. Like how have you seen cultures where dreams are discussed more openly change in terms of productivity?

Speaker A: I absolutely love our clients because everyone that has a Dream Manager, the impact that they start seeing almost immediately is remarkable. So we will hear stories. I Had a, a CEO that called me and this person, they had gone through the Dream Manager program and they were achieving some of their dreams. And they called to tell me, I can't believe that this person just walked out of my office. Like he's, he's a different person. Like this program changed him. Like he came into the CEO's office to thank him for implementing the Dream Manager program. And the CEO could tell that he was a more confident person, a more strategic person, thinking differently. Like, when you're helping people not only achieve their dreams, but you're feeding them new content that helps them grow, that's going to spill over into other areas of their life. So if they're learning in their personal life how to be more strategic, better communication with their spouse and significant other, you know, uh, that's going to convert into better communication with team members, understanding more how to communicate with team members. There's a whole session in the Dream Manager all around the genius of your personality, understanding that Vanessa is different than I am and like, how I need to know, are you an extrovert? Are you an introvert? Like, how do you communicate? What are, are the best ways that I can motivate you to. Not just to do the work, but just in, in general. And so we see it all across the board from all of our dreamers, just the confidence boost, the skill set that they're developing because you're feeding into these people. I mean, so most people don't know what it's like to have a coach. They don't know what it's like for someone to care about them. And so you see that strategic mindset shift into, into their business, which is awesome and kind of like what you just said, right? Like you go home and you do your things that fill your cup. And I don't know about you, but there's so many times where I'll be reading or writing, I enjoy writing poetry, so I'll be reading a book or writing poetry and I'm thinking, oh, I'm gonna use this same language in like a landing page that I'm writing or an email blast that we're doing or something. So all of those skill sets kind of work together and that's creativity, right? Like when you're taking different cross section of different areas of your life and you're figuring out how do you use them for the greater good of creating something that didn't exist before.

Speaker B: Can you give us more detail about how that change happened? Like, what was the process like to see the change in the example you gave, it's not as simple as just asking people what their dreams are. It sounds more like a one on uh, one situation.

Speaker A: Yeah. Well, Matthew created the uh, a Dream Manager certification after writing the book and he was very intentional about the content that he created. And it's essentially a life coaching program. It is the ultimate life coaching program. And when your dream manager, when our certified dream managers, they come to us, they get certified, it's a two day training. Then they go back into the organization and they launch the program and people sign up and you are a life coach for your people. So every session when you meet with your dreamer. Yes. A big part of it is what are your dreams? And you talk about what are your one year dreams, your three to five year dreams and your five plus year dreams. You get them really thinking and then every session you do hold them accountable to what are the steps that you need to take in order to fulfill these dreams. And then you're also reading the Rhythm of Life, which is new content that you're getting fed and you're also going into different areas of your life. Spiritual, emotional, physical. It's like I said, the genius of your personality, time and energy. It's your spiritual component of your life. There is a space in there for professional, your professional self. Like it's all different areas. There's obsession on relationships. How do you have better relationships with the people in your life? Not just your co workers, but your family, your friends, your significant other. And you go through all of this content. So every session you're seeing this growth. And one of the things that I find so interesting is a dream manager could have six sessions with six different people. And after they read the Rhythm of Life and the coach will ask them what is the one or two lines that really resonated with you? What resonate out of those six? You might get six different answers from six different people who read the same thing because they're going through something different. And so you get to watch this beautiful unfolding of these aha. Uh-huh moments and these people coming back to a session and lots of dreams that we see, I would say the top like three dreams that, that most of our dreamers have are getting fit, like losing weight, like lots of those buying a home. And a lot of people want to build a deeper relationship with their spouse, with their significant other. We've seen a lot more of that. And so when you get to work with someone and you start seeing, oh, I'm having more date nights and we're communicating Differently or we learned all about the genius of our personality. And I went home and talked to my spouse about and had her take the assessment. And now we get to talk through that and then you get to do that with your kids. And so you watch this beautiful transformation every single month. And Vanessa, one of the coolest things is we will work with some clients. They will have had a dream for years and years. I worked with a guy one time, he had a dream of he was talking about writing a book for five years. Five years. It was in the background. I'm going to do what I'm going to do it. And you know, we all have these in someone listening is like, yes, I have that dream that I just haven't done anything with. And within a year he had written his book, written and published his book. And then guess what, the year after he wrote another book. What wrote two books in two and a half years. And it was a dream that he had for five years and because of um, coaching and someone holding him accountable and really helping him figure out those baby steps. And so we see that all the time. We have people that have wanted to, whether it's a material dream or there's all different categories of dreams. But Annette will say, I've been talking about this for years and I thought it was going to take me a year and a half to complete and they got it done in a year. Or someone who had a five year dream to go on a safari and she made it happen in two years. And it was just like the most incredible thing. And so you're really empowering your people to say, hey, you can achieve these dreams, like you absolutely can. It just takes that accountability and those small next right steps. And I think oftentimes we over complicate our dreams. And so to have somebody to have a coach that's there, that's supporting you and holding you accountable and encouraging you. Vanessa, you know, I mean, in hr, like you're in the people business. Like people are so challenged and there's so many people dealing with so many crazy things in life and they don't have someone to talk to.

Speaker B: I love the examples you gave because it's, it's kind of like your own like little dream bestie, like you said, like a lot of people don't have somebody to go to, but creating that atmosphere for people to feel like, okay, I can talk and I just need some of you, my accountability bestie and help me get to where I need to be. Like, I think that's, that's Brilliant.

Speaker A: Everyone needs accountability. Oh, um, and one of the dreams that I didn't say, but it probably is like one of the top ones is financial freedom. And that's another thing. We really empower people through the program. In fact, there's two sessions around finances because every dream, every or most dreams have some type of price tag attached to it. And you would be surprised at how many people have never even created a simple budget. And when you start to do that again, you're empowering people to build a better future for themselves.

Speaker B: Mm mhm. Well, what's your advice for folks that aren't following the Dream Manager program?

Speaker A: Why? I would say why are you not? No, no.

Speaker B: Simple way that people could like use it.

Speaker A: Absolutely. So here's the thing. A lot of people, when they come to us, they have read the book. So I would say if you have not read the Dream Manager and you are a reader, read the book. It will inspire you. Even if you never get certified or anything. It is such an inspirational read. And it's a short read. It's a fable about a janitorial company that was dealing with a lot of retention issues. And because of the Dream Manager program, they were able to boost their engagement, get people to stay and they achieved a ton of dreams. So I would say definitely read the book. And if you don't read the book, a small step, start asking your people about their dreams. Like the one thing when you have a one on one, hey, what are your dreams? Now your team members might be like, what is happening? Like what is this? I've never been asked and I don't really want to tell you my dreams, but start asking them and kind of start to build that culture. In fact, a friend of mine was just sharing with me, he was at this event that I was at the other day and they started this like dream culture. So they have a little wall where you put your dreams. So in the book Matthew talks about having a dream wall. So you can have this like dream wall and people can share their dreams. In fact, some of our clients, it's so cute, they'll send us photos of one of them has um, it's in the hallway, this huge long hallway of what are your dreams? And they just want, they just stick their dreams on there. And you know what? Not everybody wants to share their dreams and that's totally okay. But the people that do and they put them on the wall and. And then when that dream is achieved, you get to celebrate, you get to excited for each other.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: Like it's that's so cool. And in fact, that's one of the things that our dream managers tell us, is that even after just a couple months, the culture shifts. The conversations in the boardroom, the conversations that when people are just discussing things in the hallways, it's around, hey, John, you look great. What have you done differently? And they've started working out and getting fed and so. And you start to. To really be cheerleaders for one another. Yeah.

Speaker B: And for HR professionals, kind of pivoting from there. What are some. Some m. Practical ways to start conversations about employees goals and aspirations?

Speaker A: Well, I would say just start with that simple conversation, that simple question. What I think is so cool is because most people are not asking about your dreams, you get to be that person. Like, can you imagine you're the leader in their life that started asking them about their dreams, and they might be caught off guard, but they're going to really think, oh, what are my dreams? What are the things that I really want for my life? Uh, not everyone is so reflective that they're thinking about what do I want for my career or what do I want from my family over the next three to five years? And to be able to really dream about that and talk to someone about it, just asking that one simple question just to get started, and then you start to know and uncover some of the things that, that your people want. So I would say the quickest thing that you can do is just start incorporating that into your conversations with your people.

Speaker B: Yeah, well, and the thing that I love most about that is that, uh, kind of goes into a lot of leaders don't even ask those questions. And so then they get to the point of they're losing people. You mentioned retention earlier. And all of a sudden you're doing a stay interview because you're like, okay, I don't want you to. But you're like, oh, this probably could have been a simple question to understand what are their goals and could you have further development, like the individual development path, and help develop them in a way of, like, helps them in their career, but also supporting them personally so that they can, like, reach their goals? Because maybe that could have retained them as well.

Speaker A: Yes. Oh, my gosh, it's so funny that you mentioned stay interviews, because we have a client that they do stay interviews, which most companies don't. Right. They do exit interviews. And you're like, wait, they already left. Stay interviews are, uh, there's a reason why they exist and that. And they're beneficial. And one of our clients, when doing the stay interview, 55% of their employees cited the dream manager as a major reason they're staying. Because they have a coach.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker A: We had someone that shared with me that they had a senior level leader. After a couple months into the program, the leader came into the HR manager's office and said, I love this program. And I just wanted to let you know I was offered another role. I was actually considering leaving it, but you implemented this program, and now this proves to me that you care about me for me and you want to support me in my dreams. And I thought, oh my gosh, this person was going to le. Was going to lose a senior level leader. And just because of that culture that they're building and showing your people, no, we care about you. Like what, it's 50 to 200% of an UM employee's salary that it might take to replace that person.

Speaker B: Yeah, it's a lot.

Speaker A: Yeah. If you are a manager, if you are a leader, you have to have uncomfortable conversations. There's just no way around it. And you'll have to let people go and you'll have to bring them in and tell them when things aren't going well and it's not fun. But what I really appreciate is when we do our workshops, I always ask, we do this one section where we ask people like, what do you love most about your past leaders? And one of the things that shows up every time is they were tough but fair. Tough but fair. And I feel like I really appreciate that because, yeah, sometimes leaders, we need to be tough. But as long as you're fair and your people know that you have their back and that when you come to the table with an uncomfortable conversation, you can sit down with them and you can just be honest and, hey, this is not going to be a fun conversation and just set the table. And so that's a skill that we all have to learn. And whether you're an HR or you're a leader or whatever. But that's where I think this program helps so much because you're learning about the person and their dreams. So you can just come to the table with them. Of, um, you know, I, I value leaders. Our clients are incredible leaders because they care about their. And they've had to sit people down and say, it's not working out, but let me help you find your next thing. Like, your place might not be here, but let's help you find something. And so I think that those are the kinds of things that when we see in the world and, and I get it, it's, it's not all over because lots of people would disagree and they say that corporate culture and everything is just a mess. But there is still leaders that care deeply about their people.

Speaker B: Yes, yes. If we put ourselves in the shoes of a head of HR or even someone new to HR that's responsible for these initiatives at their org, how do they go to their leader and get them on board with even just starting these conversations between managers and their direct reports, like what's the roi? And conversation around engagement.

Speaker A: I don't want to repeat myself, but I'm going to because I think this is kind of a new way for some leaders to think. And so I would say, and from our experience, have your leader read the book. We have HR professionals that will love the book and they give it to their CEO and their CEO is usually, I love this, let's do something with it. We have to get started or not. Right? And so I think just starting the conversation around, hey, what could we do? And like I said, even if you just read the book and you started having these conversations, you put up a dream wall, you started asking your team members about their dreams, you're going to start to see a shift. And so I think that's really the biggest thing, is just introduce people to this concept, which again, so simple. And when I say the words, your organization can only be the best version of itself to the extent that your people are becoming better versions of themselves, everyone's probably nodding their head and we know it to be true, but our actions don't follow that belief. And so this gives you a very easy, applicable way to start building that culture in your organization.

Speaker B: Mhm. When I think you hit the nail on the head too, of like, it's be simple first, like start small. And it kind of goes back to what you had mentioned earlier, you know, with the question, like start with the question first. And once you start small, you start seeing the ripple effect. And then if that's something that they decide to implement, then you've already started that ripple effect. And even the book, you know, that's another one. So I absolutely love that. Have you found that certain industries or businesses are more open to this type of shift in thinking around employee engagement and retention?

Speaker A: So the cool thing is it applies to every industry, every size industry. We have clients that are, they have 15, 20 employees, all the way up to 25,000 employees. Obviously it's the rollout looks different, but it's across the board. Your employees, they might leave to go down the street to Some other company for five extra dollars an hour. So you have to be able to have. We need to have programs that incentivize people to stay above just that extra however much you're going to get per paycheck. We have banks, we have manufacturing companies, we have home services. We're in healthcare. I mean, it's across the board. It really comes down to. To the leadership. I always tell people that our clients, we're not in the business of trying to convince someone that culture matters. Like, the leaders that we work with, they know culture matters. They're actively searching for programs to develop their people and to help their people grow and that. So I would say it's more the kind of leader, the kind of person that if they read the book and they had not heard of it before, they're like, either, like, yep, I get this. Let's do something with it. Or not. So that's. It's not really industry. It comes down to the leadership.

Speaker B: Well, that's a wide variety, wide range.

Speaker A: Oh, yeah, it's all across the board. It's so fun. We get to work with so many different kinds of, uh, just so many different kinds of people. All different industries.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. I was thinking about how sometimes leaders are afraid to have personal conversations with employees. I've met leaders who, they're like all data analytics. They're like, I just want to know numbers. I just want to have a quick conversation. I don't want to talk about fluff, you know, and just get to this. And then the personal conversations just left out. So there's that side of things. Then there's also those leaders I mentioned of just the fear of. Of being too personal and getting away from the work. So what kind of advice would you have for those types of leaders who might be in those two buckets?

Speaker A: I'll share an example because I have a friend who was leading a team of mostly men, and he went into a new role as the CEO and most of the company were women. And so he immediately said, I noticed the difference. Like the communication style is different in both. And he was kind of the guy that you're talking about, very data driven. Just, let's just go down to business. That's all we need to talk about. And so what he discovered was that. And this wasn't just for women. I mean, it's everyone, uh, I'm just sharing with you, like, what he was kind of getting into. So he was recognizing and noticing some things. And so he shifted. He started shifting his conversations and he started having More of these conversations around, hey, how was your weekend? Or what did you get into? Or what are you passionate about? What do you enjoy doing? Or tell me about your kids. And so because of that he started seeing them, he had a much better relationship with them. They would show up to meetings differently, they would show up more engaged because it was kind of like, not that you're trying to be friends with people, but you're, you know, you're friendly with your co workers, right? We're with them a lot of hours throughout the day. And so I thought that was so beautiful because that's what we see, right? Uh, when leaders start, if you show someone you care, think about the loyalty that they're going to have with you and the trust and the knowing that if they do have a challenge, they can come to you and talk through something with you. You're not going to go to your leader with a marriage problem or something and trying to work through with them. But that's the beautiful part of coaching. Your coach isn't there to tell you what to do, uh, and to solve your problems for you. Your coach there to help you, uh, support you, ask you great questions so that you get into the right answers so you can figure out the answers to your challenges. So I would say if you are a leader who is, does not feel comfortable asking that question, I would say step out of your comfort zone a little bit and in your next one on one, just ask your team member, what are some of your dreams, like what are you passionate about? And just see what they say and then just start that conversation.

Speaker B: And you said something really important. There too is the definition of a coach. You're not there to give all the answers, you're there to ask really great questions. And I truly believe that every leader should go through like some sort of coaching training, like how to be a great coach. Because that's very different than just telling people what to do and giving all the answers because then you're allowing that person to develop and grow.

Speaker A: Oh my gosh. Absolutely. In fact, Matthew Kelly's book, the Culture Solution. In it he shares the six principles of a dynamic culture. And principle number six is create a coaching culture and create a coaching culture like you. We need to be better coaches. Being great coaches means listening. It's not giving advice, it's helping lift your people up, it's helping them grow.

Speaker B: Mhm. Yes, yes. And the more that that's done at that leadership level of like having that really great coaching with employees, I chance to bet there's Some stats out there somewhere that shows that there's kind of a decline in employee relations issues. When there is more coaching, there is more communication that happens with leadership. Like, I. I definitely would be interested if. If there was some case study on that.

Speaker A: Oh, yeah, I'm sure there is. I mean, the thing that's cool about coaching is, I know still a lot of companies still do, like, annual performance reviews, but we always encourage quarterly performance reviews. And when you're meeting with your people on a consistent basis and you're eliminating any expectation gaps, you're not surprised. Uh, your people should not be surprised by things that are happening. And so that's what coaching is. Right? Like, you're continuously talking with them. If there's a issue or something comes up, you're not waiting a month. Most of us have probably experienced at some point when some. When you go into a review of some type and your leader says to you, well, remember two months ago when this happened and this was a problem and. And you're thinking, well, why didn't you say something to me two months ago so that we can learn and grow and can. Can and move forward with it. And so that's where coaching comes into play is like, your people should always. I think everyone deserves to know where they stand in your organization and the relationship you have with your. With each of your team members. And again, I mean, that's what we're here for, right? If you're helping your people grow, your organization is going to grow. That's the bottom line.

Speaker B: Yep. Yep. Where's my miniature microphone? And that's when I drop it. Yes. Well, you shared a great story in our prep call about the Dream Manager program and the business finding out about an employee who was homeless. Could you share that story with our audience?

Speaker A: Yeah. This was. I mean, this gave me goosebumps and just, like, tears in my eyes when I found out about it. And we were working with a leader and a big. A big organization, and they implemented the Dream Manager program and started obviously coaching them. And there was this employee who showed up on time and was happy, and everything seemed fine. And because of this program, they opened up. They finally felt comfortable enough to open up and let the Dream Manager know that they had been homeless. They were living out of their car. They were having a really challenging time, obviously. And because they found that out, they were able to support that person and help them get back on their feet. And when you hear stories like that, that's what I'm talking about when I. When I say that there are leaders out there who care, like leaders who care about. And they have CARE programs in place to be able to support their team members when things like that happen. And in fact, I'm part of C12, which is an incredible organization of Christian business leaders. And a lot of them have those kinds of programs like CARE teams and programs to help people. And how many of your. Especially if you have a lot of employees, we never know what's happening in people's lives. And so to be able to support them in that, I mean, can you imagine how loyal that person's going to be to that company? Even when that person leaves, they're going to talk very well about, about that company, maybe even introduce, uh, a friend or something to replace that person. And so those are the kinds of things that we get to do in leadership roles. And so I can only imagine how many people are in tough situations and they just wish they could talk to their leader about it. And there might be a really something really helpful that people can do to support them.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker B: They're just seeking that safe space.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And it goes back to that principle of people shouldn't feel like they're just butts in the sea. They should feel like they're human beings that are cared about.

Speaker A: Yes. Because we are like, we are human beings and with hopes and dreams and, and all of, and all of that. And so I get inspired because obviously I'm in this business, so we see it every day. And I see leaders that are encouraging people to pursue their passions outside of work and doing things really exciting that they love. And you know, my book is all about creative pursuits. You don't have to leave your job to take a dance class or garden or write a book or start a podcast or do something that you've been really excited about. You can do both of those things. And I think to be able to have leaders that know that's important, to believe it's important and to encourage that is, is really valuable.

Speaker B: Yes. Well, uh, it's such an inspirational story too. And it's just a great reminder out there, and especially for HR leaders, of how can you better enable and empower the leaders within your organization to know how to navigate conversations when somebody brings up something really difficult? My final question for you. What final advice would you give to an HR leader who wants to start building a culture that values dreams and personal growth?

Speaker A: Ooh. The first thing that I thought of, Vanessa, was write down your list of a hundred dreams. How about get started with yourself. Like, when's the last Time you wrote down your dreams. And in the dream manager, Matthew shares the 12 categories of dreams. And there's dreams. Lots of us have professional dreams, material dreams, financial dreams. But what about psychological dreams, creative dreams, spiritual dreams? So create your list. Like get yourself dreaming again. And then that one next step would really be to just invite other dreamers. Like go into your department if you, if you're part of an HR department. Hey, have a little day. Maybe bring in lunch and just this is going to be our dream lunch. Let's, let's talk about our dreams and you're going to learn more about each other and then maybe that will turn. That will be the kind of catalyst to then start bringing this into the organization.

Speaker B: Now I want to go and set up a dream lunch, but maybe I just won't tell my team members what it is. I'm just going to call it dream lunch. Make them guess. And I'm getting a little. Yes.

Speaker A: You know what's a fun exercise too? You could have people write down on a piece of paper a dream and then put it in a hat. And then everybody, you pick one out of the hat and you say it and then you have to guess whose dream it is.

Speaker B: This is so brilliant. It's like apples to apples. But better. But better. But better. All right, well, thank you so much for joining us on today's episode. A big thank you to our guest, Kate. It was so fun to have you on the podcast and all the great little golden nuggets that you shared with us today. For our listeners, check out our show notes. You'll find links to resources we think are helpful with this topic. We invite you to Visit us@hrmplug.com where you can sign up to be notified of all future podcast episodes and view the latest episodes in podcast format. Stay tuned for our next episode. Thank you for tuning in. If you enjoyed today's episode. The best way to subscribe support our show is by leaving a quick review. It should just take a minute and it will help us find more great listeners just like you. Today's episode is brought to you by BambooHR, the complete HR software. Simplify HR with award winning solutions for everything from hire to retire with bamboohr.