Career Growth with Salifu Bah - Part 2

Ebrima Sawaneh: And I know many young people reach out to us in one area. They want to transition from one job to another, from one function to another. How were you able to put this thing? What was the story? Because it was, for me, a successful transition where you are growing.

Salifu Bah: Okay. I know, I know a lot of people will say, oh, is. Is this by. By design or by, you know, the other one? I forget the word a chance. I would say kind of both. Um, in the sense that at any stage of my life at the time, I was not working with people that I, um, officially call my mentors, but they were my mentors. Okay. I will go back my career in Deloitte. I never started as a professional. Staff is good to mention that I started as an intern, but interned as an office assistant. And what I was doing, in fact, when I started was some. Most of the times delivering meals. Okay. And, um, due to my performance and whatnot, completing my card during my internship, I was doing some bank reconciliation for late Omarba. Uh, may his soul rest in peace. Right. And, um, I think I fell in love with the system. And whilst I was doing my internship at the time, I. They will occasionally bring. Auditors will occasionally bring their reports after completing. And, you know, because I. I will be the one to bind the reports. So most of them will tell me, can you cast for me numbers? So, being a card student, I'll be looking at the numbers. Sometimes I'll say, oh, yeah, these numbers, they didn't balance, you know, because they were Moving from the AS2 audit system to W or from Excel to what? Let me put it that way. So those rounding differences. But some of them, you would even realize that the numbers were not adding up. It was beyond just the $1 differences that you have on the rounding. So. And I think that Drew, to some extent, Mr. Jada, and most of the time, when he'll do tax, the way he arranges it, I'll say, oh, okay, I think it can be arranged better or it can be done this way, and I will bind it proper. So what I'm trying to say there is it doesn't necessarily matter where you start from. What it matters is where you want to be. And, um, I think that has been helping me. So during my Deloitte career, a lot of people didn't know, but I touchboard consulting. I did consulting work and I did audit works. Because as tax, you go to the field. So sometimes when I finish early, I'll tell them, oh, can I have sections? I audited GT bank fixed assets. I can Remember then GTSC when they opened newly I was uh part of the team, no tax but I will sift and do some auditing. So I think all these things subconsciously were shaping me. I didn't know but I was just so inquisitive to know oh if these people are doing this I should be able to do it. So you know the late Charlotte used to whenever I see him sitting, eating lunch I'll try to make sure I delay my lunch to sit with him and start asking questions, audit questions and and so forth. So I think that drew me into you know, loving numbers, loving accounting. Then sometime in 2015 I just me being, me being inquisitive. After four years, five years in Deloitte I need a new challenge and Ecobank came calling. Funnily I never applied like how people do. Oh I want to change, let me apply. A friend called me and said oh there is opening at ah Echo Bank. Can you apply internal audit. Guess what it was internal audit, not finance. And um. I can remember meeting with Sua just to you know confirm. Now reflecting back I'm saying oh I was doing proper due diligence even to the employees that um Employers that my potential employers. But those days I didn't know exactly what I was. To be honest if you ask me in those days I didn't know what I was doing. But maybe it was through guidance. You know one of the things that he told me at the time was I still wouldn't forget this Salivu. Don't be scared, you will never lose a job. The worst case scenario you will go back to be teachers. Maybe he has forgotten that. I think it was at LP at the time. LP around opposite American Embassy. So those, yeah those things I you don't forget it as a young, young professional. So I went to um ecobank started with audit after one year. Now you can see my audit experience at Deloitte how important it is now coming to Echo bank within one month. It was a good experience. Single handedly audited branches. Then newly moved branch of um Westfield. My first time to travel to the upcountry around Farafenya. I think that was my first time going to Farafenya through Ecobank and funnily my movement from audit to finance was on my way to Farafenya. My, my boss Alpha told me that oh you know there is an opening at the you know Ecobank Finance. And I think you know Musa told me that possibly you would. He would want you if you are interested you can work there I'm like, oh, okay, if you are interested. You know, I've never worked in finance, but I don't think it's, it's bad because then Mass was traveling, you know, so yeah, for his masters and me being me, I said, you know what, let me go. If people are doing it, I can do it. I've never worked in finance, but I will do it. And you know, I, I went there with a fantastic team. I can remember I'm, um, not. But those days you would say within the banking sector, I wouldn't say we were the best, but we were among the best. Uh, because you have the likes of Musa, uh, they're working. Fantastic boss, Jajuc, fantastic colleague, you know, Ibrahim and Jay came in later. Fantastic guy. The group office helping, you know, a collaboration yourself. I think that's in fact where we met first time, you know, physically I can remember it today. Um, but before that, when I reflect back, I wrote to you on LinkedIn, you know, when I was in Deloitte. So I think moving now. Then I later moved to Access bank because at some point I was. I wouldn't call myself hungry, but I knew exactly. I started knowing what I wanted because I knew after spending some years in ecobank, I've already gathered a little bit of experience on the basic principles of finance and um, you know, the middle management staff and lower. So I needed experience maybe to. The opportunity came at Access. I said, why not let me go and take it. I went for an interview again through recommendation and um, I took up the job despite it was a short period, but again it was a very good experience for me to learn because having to deal with different people, having to be your own boss, controlling people, but more so dealing with bot, which is a different experience as well, dealing with your CEO, having to manage your CEO, you know. And I think my Access experience defined me as, as a leader today, if I could call it that way, because there were a lot of issues that I had to handle at a very young age, I think in my 25 or 24 at the time. So you can imagine. Oh, 27, yeah, 20, 26. 27 at the time. Being an uh, acting CFO of such a bank, which was, yes, pretty much, you know, trying to get a very strong holding, dealing with all divisional heads, if I can put it with the CEO, the demands of the central bank, you know, um, so it really saved me. It was tough, but it really saved me as an, as an individual. Then I left Access for a little while. Then I joined, you know, consulting with Mr. Jata a little bit before I joined the airline. Um, again the airline give me an exposure of a different, you know, industry, different people, how they think in business. And um, if you're doing good, good follows you. So I can remember Alijo, whilst I was in access, he said salifu and we worked on some projects in, in accord. Then he said, salif will work together one day. I don't know whether that they lose as, as they call it at the time, but he knew what, what he wanted. You know. Luckily he went into gnpc. I must say this today because this is where my journey and um, story with him started. Immediately he received his appointment, came to my office and said, you have to apply for this job. I applied, I went there because he saw that he wanted to build a team. There was already an existing team, but he wanted to reinforce a team. And I went to the public sector. If you had asked me public sector, I would say no the previous years. But again, as they say, sometimes when you listen to the elders to guide you, because there were a lot of things that he told me about the public sector that I didn't know because being an accountant general before and all that, with his experience, I know he will not, you know, tell me, put your hands where it is going to burn. I, I know that and um, you know, I consulted few people, I think even including yourself at the time. We, we spoke and I think sua. We spoke on my other friends, the Suleimans, the chairman and so forth. I spoke to them and some said, oh, okay, because you are coming from ahead of finance role. Now you're going to be a uh, finance manager. Does uh, it make sense? But I said to myself, you know what? I think I still, I am not the leader that I should be. Not only I was young, but I didn't have the experience, um, for public sector and you needed that, that guidance. And um, I went in there, end up spending a couple of years there. But again now looking back, I think I would say it's my best experience at JNPC for obvious reasons. My interpersonal skills suit up. My relationship with people suit up. My networking suit up, my ability to control adverse teams up, my emotional intelligence suit up because of the number of people that I was dealing with and the number of stakeholders that you have to deal with with different interests that you have to manage, having to balance that. And I think um, you know, moving now to the Petroleum Commission, which is, you, could you call it government, but now we don't call it central government because we believe we are still autonomous, autonomous out as they call it. Uh, we have maybe a very stretch um um with government a little bit despite this 100 owned by government. But again you know when this opportunity came in for me it was an easy transition because the stakeholders are not much different with DNPC and you know I learned from the private sector to how you, you manage it. And I think those things with friends at any point in time having people that you consult but again sit and reflect on what they have to uh, advise you to make your own informed decision. For me those things really help me. So I would say the friends like yourself, Prima M um and Alius and others, their guidance was very helpful in that career transition. But again I did not talk about my family on, on that part because beyond you know the professional people that you're dealing with, there's a family back home too that really helps you to say oh don't do this, don't talk in this way. My wife, my m. Dad, uh, my mom, my brothers. You know I always. You don't tell them what you do at work but sometimes you have this communication and they guide you on this. So what I'm saying is in, in pivoting your career is always good to talk to people that you truly believe that they are not going to tell you or what you just want to hear. But what they believe is the right thing for you. And if you are genuine you do a self critic you end up knowing that oh these people, what they are telling me is right or is wrong. And I think that's what really saved my um, that career transition. Engaging with professionals, um, engaging with, with family. Because all of these things have an impact in your productivity. But I usually sell tell people this. Just couple of days ago I was talking with one young fellow. I tell him reflecting back I would have, I would not say I would have done things differently but there are certain jobs that I left early. I would not have for instance I would have stayed a little bit longer in Ecobank 1, 2 I would have stayed a little bit longer in Access because at some point it kind of affected me in some interviews that I did with some jobs despite some of them I had them. But I had to sit and um, convince people that know I did this for a good reason. So what I'm trying to say is some people, your CV alone, how you define your CV or your career path could give a perception on people about you without if you don't have the opportunity to tell them so it's always good that before making certain decisions to think long term. Because at the time I was not thinking that, oh, these things will affect me in my career, but technically it does not affect me that much. But I can see it could be hindrances or it could be delay. And so people should look at how they move from one career to another because it could be a little bit, you know, problematic along the way. So I just thought it wise to bring that um, you know, point to make it bold.

Ebrima Sawaneh: Yeah, I think that's important you reflect on both sides because everything not uh, everything goes smooth and uh, uh, perfect. But if I, uh, summarize it, the key point is you have to network because those people, you are able to talk to them because you have built your own network of colleagues or friends at your age group and uh, at the same time people you may call mentor. So you are talking to people at uh, if I call them your level and people who are more experienced than you to give you that perspective. And at the end of the day you took the decision is your decision, you decide what to do. And of course the last deflection point is important to understand whether there are some you could have stayed much longer. At the end of the day, it's about intentional career growth that becomes critical when you are doing a transition. It has to be intentional. And this is why I always encourage young people. It's important for you to have a, A career plan.

Salifu Bah: Mhm.

Ebrima Sawaneh: Because with that career plan, whatever save it may be, if I'm um, being offered a job. Is that something you are in line with that? Just today I got a message from someone on LinkedIn. Uh, it's telling me I'm looking for a CEO role. A CEO? CEO role for a agricultural company in Dubai. But I said I'm not interested. It's a big title here in the uae. It could be a good. But I have something else I'm thinking about. I'm not interested to transition there for now. So it's important when people are doing a career transition, they look at that aspect. Now we'll talk a bit about leadership in the public sector as well as uh, in the. As a regulator. Because where you work in the Petroleum Commission, you are a regulator. And we know that one comes with its own challenges. But let's look at it from a finance director or a CFO perspective. In the corporate world, we know finance help the business. They help in developing a strategy, um, financial in ensuring that the right information gets to the stakeholders like the CEO. But I'M sure many of us are going to be curious. How does the role of finance director support the Commission? Because it's not probably what we are used to. We don't hear about strategy for petroleum Commission, all these kind of things. We don't hear them, but we know there'll be strategy for the corporate. But how does your role help the commission to achieve its objective beyond the conventional traditional accounting and controls, how do you support the commission to achieve its mandate?

Salifu Bah: You know, interesting question because when I was taking this role and having to reach my mentors like you and, and so forth. Ah, I think one of the first thing that I was or I was tasked to do or asked to do for myself was to at least create my roadmap for the 100 days of CFO. And what was fascinating is to see I had to talk about numbers, where you talk about profitability, where you talk about, you know, revenue coming in. Yes, you will talk about revenue in this sector, but not as significant because first what I have to look at, what is the core mandate of the commission? The core mandate is one to regulate upstream and promote hydrocarbon potentials of the country. How do I fit in? 1, you need friendly policy to attract investors. These policies have impact in maybe the unborn child, right? These policies. Because you are talking about a resource that have to be taken off the ground. But before even thinking about those, how do we get these resources off the ground? But as a uh, finance guy, how do I contribute in this? When people are talking about profitability, I'm not talking about profitability. First thing is I'm talking about transparency and accountability because I'm dealing with public responses. Secondly, how do I bring investors confidence, stable regulations, not me, but how the country? Because this is where your strategy has to come into play. Coming up with regulation, maybe defining fiscal policies that, or commercial terms that are very attractive for this. And this required a lot of research in different industries. Sometimes I uh, reach out to you to reach out to certain people outside. But again my participation is to help the CEO in terms of accountability and transparency through the forms of reports. But also to come up with strategies to make sure that investors confidence is upheld in this. And um, all this transparency and accountability have that element in these investors having the confidence. So that's what my role is. So that's why when I started I said now my role is more of dealing with qualitative data than quantitative data.

Ebrima Sawaneh: Mhm.

Salifu Bah: Where you have to look at of course on financial models, if you were to deal with certain fiscal policies on Certain contracts, the finance input is required there a lot. Or currently I'm um, even coordinating that process, um, of developing a fiscal policy and reflecting back. My tax experience is very important from Deloitte and my um, finance experience at Ecobank, my finance experience at DNPC is all coming into play because my even banking relationship because now you even have to understand development loan. If they are to build it, what strategy ah, are we have to use as a country to make sure that we have it? Um, what form of guarantees can investors bring into play? The CEO relies on me to say, oh, parent guarantee or a bank guarantee. I have to say, oh, in this industry should we go for bank guarantee? I can remember one of the conversation that we had was, or the conversation let's go for bank guarantee. And I look at the structures of some of these um, IOCs and um, know that why would I go for bank guarantee if there is patent guarantee? You look at bp which is having, let's say, you know, a billion, billions of billions, why would I go for a bank guarantee? And um, it's easier for them to do that. So some of those basic, I call, you might call it basic as a finance guy, but these are strategies that helps government or to interact with some of these IOCs, you know, and building some of these fiscal policies through interacting it helps a lot in terms of the profitability understanding help you to navigate through this process. So those strategies help you to, you know, sit back and help the direction of the institution because you are dealing with IOCs that have been here for, for the past 150 years, employ lawyers, the best accountants, you know, the best engineers. Um, again what helps you is interaction with colleagues, learn from new experiences or experiences, um, from different sectors that you have learned. But traditionally it's not profit making. Now if you ask me what is our biggest strategy is how do we get oil or how do we fine oil as they call it in Gambia. So that strategy you don't tell me about, sometimes it's confusing when we are sitting and sometime I will say, oh, if the CFO is talking like this, then we're happy. Because now I don't even think about profitability. All what I'm thinking is before you think about profitability, what can we make it enticing to at least get this off the ground without compromising that whatever you do today as well have a future thing. So you're thinking now the strategy of thinking 25, 30 years, that's the industry that I am. Because you're entering in a contract that is okay, 44, maybe five years, seven years, the exploration period. But the entire legend is about 25 years, 30 years, which is extendable to 50 years depending on what resources they are found there. So it's very, it's very fascinating. But I miss the days of where you have to talk about profitability. You know, top 20 customers. Now my top 20 customers, I try to look at it in fact from our data acquisition. The other time I was looking at data, I said oh okay, let me look at the people that are buying our data. Can we pursue those people? What were their interests in the data? What have they found out? How can we pursue them? To see what can we add in more dealing with geophysical service companies, you know, when they acquire data, uh, how they are dealing with it. But most of my biggest contribution on the strategy is on the transparency and accountability. Because you are holding public resources and reporting those key um, factors, both financial and non financial. They are critical in shaping our strategy as a commission. So now profitability is something that I.

Ebrima Sawaneh: Something. Yeah, because you are creating a value in order form. You know, uh, profit is uh, an output, um creation. If you look at every organization has a model, but that model profit is at the end. That's why we call it the bottom line. M. Top line is revenue. And ah, for customers to pay you that revenue you have to create a value. And um, that value creation is what you are doing. Profit will come uh, later. Uh, but as I listen to you discussing uh how uh you work with the other stakeholders within the commission definitely uh, is not a surprise why uh this year April, you have been awarded uh, probably maybe the youngest recipient of that award. Probably for my, for my guest. But at least we could say you are one of the youngest uh finance director in the. In the country. If not the youngest, uh, let someone correct me. But I think from my own estimate you are the youngest finance director in government today. Now I was talking about the award that you, you received in Ghana during the Africa Public Finance and the CFO uh program that happened in.

Salifu Bah: So maybe before you just add that just to. Yeah, just to add on my role. And I think that is where it is good for finance professional to understand that we are partners of our uh, businesses. And now when I sit in rooms, we were sitting with the Minister of Finance who you know their objectives is completely different with what the Ministry of Justice is looking at. Not different per se, but they're seeing things from different angle. Where NEA is looking at, which is the environment, where you are looking at The Ministry of you know, Petroleum is looking at something differently where the GRE is looking at things differently. But you being in the center to ensure that all the stakeholders, you have to manage their expectation within this sector. For me those are defining moments. They give you sleepless nights sometimes and it's fascinating and I think finance professionals should understand that it goes now beyond the numbers. But understand what drives the numbers and what drives those key objectives of your institution is very critical. And um, how do you manage each stakeholders expectation and in each expectation from each stakeholder there is an input required from finance and it's critical to understand those value chains. I just thought it wise to mention it. Sometimes I tell people that, oh I think like a lawyer sometimes, or I think like an economist sometimes, or I take like a revenue authority sometimes. But it's because you are dealing with these people and you have to understand their mindset and filter that as finance to see how best to, to navigate through that process. So it's critical to understand those key stakeholders in.

Ebrima Sawaneh: Yes, yeah, yeah, ye.

Salifu Bah: What it wants to say.

Ebrima Sawaneh: No, they're very important point. I always tell my, my uh, asset, uh CFOs that finance have to be everything. That's my belief Finance, we have to be everything. We don't have to be expert in everything, but everything in the sense that we have to know something about everything. At the end of the day up to now the most common way of measuring performance still stays with finance. Of course we see coming. But even they are trying to learn from finance.

Salifu Bah: Finance. Absolutely.

Ebrima Sawaneh: So if, if finance, that's what I will judge shareholders, uh assess you. The biggest weight up to today is on the financial performance. When government is charging you tax, they don't charge you, they charge you based on what your financial performance. That's where they get more tax is on financial performance. So you have to understand uh, what, what goes in there by understanding various uh, departments, various sectors. And this way a reading comes in. Uh, you have to read things about human uh, psychology, maybe hr, you have to read things about sales things, things about uh, operations in your, in your own case oil and gas sector. So it's important. Now we are talking about your, your, your award that was given to you in April in, in Accra. I wanted to know what does this award uh means to you. But more importantly for me, uh, the people who gave you this award, they are, they recognize your contribution. Now it's one thing to know what this award means to you in your career, but how important it is to recognize other people's contribution in a community because this is a recognition of your own contribution. But as a leader, how important it is to recognize other people's contribution in addition to what these, uh, awards meant for you as far as your career growth is concerned.