The State of AI for Entrepreneurs in Mid-2026 | Ethan King

Speaker A: I'll never forget this feeling where I gave an AI agent a task. And, uh, I was just trying to. I didn't believe it at first. I was skeptical. I was like, oh, can this really do things? Is it really going to process my inbox? Is it really going to organize my download folders and post these blogs for me and things like that? And then I gave it a test that I thought it was going to fail at and it came back with done.

Speaker B: Entrepreneurs Organization proudly presents EO 3 360. A podcast that explores entrepreneurship with a wide perspective, moving beyond business to those insights not often shared by high profile thought leaders. I'm Dave Will, your host and a fellow entrepreneur. I encourage you to find one idea from this conversation to better your business or yourself. Listen, subscribe and enjoy. Ethan King, welcome back.

Speaker A: Hey, Dave, it's great to be back.

Speaker B: Thanks, man. I'm happy to have you here. You are my, um, you're my AI Go to guy. That's. That's, that's how I think about you, Ethan King. And I think it's. It's, um, what's so cool about that is. And this. Actually, I'm going to start with this question, but you, you're not what I would consider to be like a, uh, super. You didn't come from a technical background. Yeah.

Speaker A: Nerd. Is that what you're going to say? Nerd?

Speaker B: You're not, you know, you're not like an IT guy. You're not a developer.

Speaker A: No.

Speaker B: You know, soft. You're not even a software guy. Like, you are a, uh. In fact, this is your second time on the podcast. The first time it was about your entrepreneurial career and, um, what led you to writing a book and building out your business and ultimately I think selling it. And, um. Did I get the right. You sold it, right?

Speaker A: I didn't sell it, no.

Speaker B: Oh, okay. Well, I just gave you credit for selling a business for billions of dollars. Uh, I swear you told me that. No. All right, never mind. But, um, but you somehow transitioned really early in the process to being this AI, uh, advisor for entrepreneurs, which I think was much needed in an organization like EO at least three years ago when you started doing this or two and a half or whatever. I'm kind of curious, so. Well, actually, let me finish the intro. So, in a nutshell, you're this entrepreneur that saw an opportunity pretty early on to help people embrace AI. Um, you. Early on, you wrote a book called ChatGPT to double your business in 90 days. What's so cool about that, I have that, uh, I'm looking at it right now on my shelf over there, and it's an awesome workbook, like a really good workbook. And I still reference the, uh, the spreadsheets that you give away with, uh, collections of prompts and so on. Um, but even in the title, the fact that you're leading with ChatGPT means it's a little dated, right? Like, uh, Claude clearly has taken over in the past six months. Do you agree with that? Does that make sense?

Speaker A: Well, oh, yeah, Claude for sure. But the Chat component, I mean, you've probably witnessed with ChatGPT, it's kind of, it's deteriorated a bit, and maybe it's in comparison to Claude or in comparison to Codex. And that may be where OpenAI is devoting their attention is to Codex, because we've moved into the Agentic era. And for your listeners, um, Codex, while it has a different name, is made by the Same Makers of ChatGPT, and you can chat with it in plain English, even though it has the word code in the name of the app. Don't be fooled by that. You can chat with it in plain English and it can actually build stuff for you and do things for you, like execute tasks for you. So I talk about that a lot in my second book.

Speaker B: So, yeah, I, I just looked up, it says, so ChatGPT is moving away from being, uh, just a traditional chatbot. Maybe that's the keyword. Just, uh, OpenAI is redesigning in it into a comprehensive super app and an operating system for work. They're repositioning and, and I suspect the repositioning because of the ground they've lost to Anthropic.

Speaker A: Ah, right, Because Anthropic, they've already done that, where the Claude app has the chat feature and the cowork and the coding feature, all right there. So I, I, I, I'm assuming that that's the, they're going to make a similar move with OpenAI. That would only make sense.

Speaker B: You know, the, the moment I knew that they were in trouble was about, I want to say, three, four, uh, maybe it was six months ago when we were, uh, telling our team, hey, we want to buy everybody access, we want to buy a team account to ChatGPT and Claude. Uh, which one do you want? Like, which one would you like to be part of? Every single person. This is, by the way, this is a time when ChatGPT was just still dominating everybody. Everybody in my company was like, yeah, I'll go with Claude. Every single person. Wow, like, huh, that's really interesting. Like, the tide is shifting a little bit. So you wrote, uh, chatgpt to double your business 90 days. Your most recent book is, uh, let AI do your work so you can live your life. What's, uh, shoot. What's the key word? What's the big word on that?

Speaker A: Done.

Speaker B: Done. Thank you. The name of the book is Done. For whatever reason, I didn't put down my notes, but done, let AI do your work so you can live your life. And that's what triggered my phone call to you, my email, my text, my. My message. I don't remember how I reached out, but I was like, hey, uh, I'd love to have not just another podcast on AI, but like, an update. What's going on out there? And so that's why I invited you back. I see you as, like, really having a good grasp for how entrepreneurs are using AI, and I thought it'd be a great, um, timestamp in the middle of 2026 to talk about where we're at today as it relates to AI for entrepreneurs. Sound good?

Speaker A: Totally. So the shift is AI went from chatting to doing, and it happened pretty suddenly, like at the beginning of this year. Yeah, you probably remember this. I mean, it was a pivotal moment for people who were paying attention to where it's like, oh, wow, this, uh, can actually do things for me. It's like having a person working for me, but it just happens to be AI. And the reason that's the reason I titled the book Done is because I remember that moment. Done describes a feeling for me because I'll never forget this feeling where I gave an AI agent a task. And I, you know, I was just trying to. I didn't believe it at first. I was skeptical. I was like, oh, can this really do things? Can it? Is it really going to process my inbox? Is it really going to organize my download folders and post these blogs for me and things like that? And then it. I gave it a test that I thought it was going to fail at, and it came back with Done.

Speaker B: I was like, I don't know, a great name for a book. So good.

Speaker A: So I went and checked it out, and I think it was, um, the first task I had given. It was, like, to catch up on 12 blogs that my human assistant forgot to keep updating my weekly blog. So we were, like, three months behind. So we were 12 issues behind, and I had started messaging my human assistant. I said, wait a minute, I wonder if all this agentic stuff really works. Let Me try to give this to an AI agent and see if he can do it. And yeah, it came back done. And not only was it done, but it was done well, it was in my voice. Uh, the picture was there. I mean, I'm not talking about giving me a blog that I then had to copy and paste. I'm talking about it was on my website, live, written, published in my voice with picture and everything, 12 of them, all the backlogs filled on the right dates, as if I never missed a beat. And it took about 40 seconds. And I was like, holy shit. This, it's one of those moments where you probably, there have been these inflection points throughout history. You probably remember the first time you, you, you experienced an iPhone or whatever, like glass smartphone that had the whole Internet and you're like, oh, this I'm never going back to my motor Motorola Razer flip phone or whatever, right? We're never going back. Um, um, maybe the first time you drove an electric car or something like that, or experienced full self driving. Um, but there are these inflection points throughout history where, you know, you have this feeling and it's like, oh, everything just changed. We just stepped into the future. That's the feeling I want everyone to have where you're not just chatting with it, then you have to do something. It is actually doing stuff for you.

Speaker B: Even the year was 1992. I was, I don't know how old you are, I don't want to know. Just keep that to yourself. Uh, but the year for me, the year was 1992 and I was uh, like wrapping up college and my cousin Steve called me and he's like, hey man, go, uh, to the math science building and set up an email account. Uh, I want to send you an email. I was like, what are you talking about, man? Like, just leave me a voicemail. Why would I walk all the way to the math science building, set up an email account so I can read a message from you when I can just hear your voice in my answering machine. That's so stupid it's never going to take off. So there is one inflection point that I missed. And needless, uh, to say, now the primary means of communication is email. And you know, the next big turning point was the rest of the Internet coming on board. And I think about that, like, to me that was the last big shift. But anyway, I don't want to get into like this broad, how awesome is AI sort of thing. Although your reaction when you saw what happened in 40 seconds with your blogs. Like, I w. You, uh, know how many times people in the past year have had that reaction to something AI has done for them, which is like, oh, shit. Like, this is unbelievable.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: In that particular experience though, how did you. This is getting a little into the weeds. But how did you ensure that it wasn't just creating AI slope? Because, I mean, that's a legitimate concern is that we're putting all this just like. And we can all read, like, we've all read those, uh, the stuff. And you read it and you know, it has the same metaphors and the same, uh, language that it uses. Like, how do you. How do you know those blog posts didn't have the same AI slop that everybody else seems to be putting out?

Speaker A: Yeah, we do. It wouldn't be fair to not explain the background because I have been using AI for years leading up to this moment. I've already trained it on my voice. It has the context of all my businesses. My blog post. This is the task that, um, I had given to my va, my human VA was to take the transcript of things I actually say, like, from. From my podcast.

Speaker B: Yep.

Speaker A: Run that through a custom GPT that is trained on my voice. Extensive, extensive knowledge of how I write. And she would run that through there and then get, this is. This is how Ethan would write the blog. And then she would give it her human once over, then I would give it my once over and then it would get published. So that process we had built up over time, so that was. That's what I would call like a level two automation. And I know, we'll talk about the levels a little bit later. Yeah, Like a custom GPT that's semi automated. Because there was lots of humans in the loop. So in experimenting with agentic, I took that same structure, those instructions from the custom GPT, all of that, and instead of giving it to a human, I just, I gave it to an AI agent and told it to do that. So it's still running it through my authentic voice. And in my voice I have all the no nos, like, yeah, no EM M dashes and unlock delve, explore. All the trigger words, all the overused AI, um, poetic, uh, devices and literary devices and things that we see all the time. All of those don'ts are in my thing because I don't talk like that. So it comes out sounding human. It sounds like me. That's what's most important. And then you remember last time I came to EO Boston, which was even a couple of years ago, I had, you All I, ah, trained the audience on how, on how to do it and had you all write things, content, had AI, had your AI write things for you, run it through an AI content checker and it came back 100 human generated for a lot of people in the audience.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: So that's, that's the power of it.

Speaker B: Yeah, it's, it's the prep work that goes into it and doing it. Right. Um, so you touched on six levels of AI autonomy. We're, we're going to most. What you said to me in our exchange before this that most AI users are at level one or two. So we're going to go through those in a minute. I want to touch on a few what I think are fairly timely AI related topics because again, I don't want this to be just another look how cool AI is or look how awful AI is sort of conversation. This really is meant to be a timestamp in the middle of 2026 to talk about key issues in AI right now. Um, one thing I noticed, which I think is fascinating, I wrote a blog. Sorry M. I wrote a post in LinkedIn about this and it got more interaction than any other post I've put up there. I think you might even commented on this as well, which is, uh, I saw a woman, I think a lot of us saw this. A, uh, commencement speech from a woman that mentioned AI and everybody booed. And uh, then she mentioned humans and everybody cheered. And um, of course the audience is right around 20 years old. And what I've noticed with my kids and other young people, there's incredible pushback from teens and young 20 somethings. Um, and I don't know what the question is. Have you seen that? Because it, I mean there's so many reasons why that could be. The most obvious is some people feel like because it's taking their jobs. Well, I don't think it's that simple.

Speaker A: What did you major in in college, Dave?

Speaker B: Economics.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: Now I'm doing economy things.

Speaker A: But whatever it is that you intended on doing as a career, what has that been replaced by AI, uh, to some capacity?

Speaker B: No, I'm trying to think like what the heck I do for a living. Um, no, nothing that I do personally has been replaced. It's only been enhanced, it's been amplified.

Speaker A: Okay, well if you. Well what I went to school for, um, graphic design, art, even web design. That can all be done from a prompt. Now.

Speaker B: Graphic design is brutal right now. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: So now I'm far enough removed from college to where I I'm not mad at the situation and I embrace it and I use AI to amplify what I do. Yeah, but think about someone who just got their degree and spent all this time learning graphic design or web designer coding. All of this has been, we can now anyone can do it with a prompt. So, yeah, there's, there's some, it's a, it's salt in the wound right now for these American college students. And I want to, I want to point that out. It is kind of a cultural thing. Very much a cultural thing.

Speaker B: Yeah, expand on that. Tell me more.

Speaker A: I saw that same commencement speech. Um, and then I saw they were. It, it became a trend. There were several other commencement speeches where whenever AI was mentioned, you got booze from the audience. And then I saw there was this montage on the news where not only are they booing at commencement speeches, but they're protesting, they're holding signs, uh, Claude is fraud. I mean, things like the anti AI protests on college campuses in America. I'm scrolling through Instagram and I saw this. And then I kept scrolling a little bit more and I saw a news clip from China that showed a 12 year old girl who, who, uh, had already vibe coded several different apps and she was making money, real money, because she put these apps into the marketplace. And she was at a school where they were teaching AI, teaching all these young Chinese kids how to monetize AI and their culture has embraced it. There are people lined up to install open Claw. Um, and then the news reporter got into a self driving taxi, went to the mall. You can buy robots in the mall to help you out around the house, uh, for like $15,000. You just buy it in the mall and walk out like the Apple Store. And that stark contrast of showing American college students and how we're anti AI and then the Chinese college students embracing it, it just really, really stuck with me. And, and I wonder. I get the emotional part of it. I get it. Um, I've had, I've, I've had a job. I've, I've had jobs displaced. It doesn't have to do with technology, but I've had the rug pulled out from under me. I know what that feels like. So I understand the pain. But at some point you have got to pivot and like lean into it. And what I say is, if you feel like you're being bullied by AI, then bully the bully. Go learn it. Learn how to make it work for you, how to make it make money.

Speaker B: Amen, brother. Yes, amen to that. Because that is exactly my sentiment. And I don't mean to sound like an old man complaining about the younger generation, but uh, let me complain about the younger generation for a second, which is like, I get the resistance and the concern anxiety. There's, there's fear about the impact on the environment. There's some, there are some legitimate issues with AI for sure. Slop is an issue in and of itself. It's like all this garbage out there, we're getting inundated with like junk it. Which is AI generated. And I see it's not all AI generated stuff is junk, but there is a lot of junk out there that is generated by AI because it's so easy. Uh, there's manipulative, uh, manipulative, uh, marketing out there. So yeah, there's a lot of stuff that AI is doing that is negative. But where I get frustrated is when people turn their backs to it and say, I'm going to pretend it's not there. I'm going to ignore it and hope that somebody changes it. I would much prefer they do what you're suggesting, which is dig in, dive into it and let's figure out how to use it responsibly. Let's figure out what regulation we want to put in place, if any. And let's figure out, um, let's be an example as how to, how to do it the right way.

Speaker A: Exactly.

Speaker B: I'm with you.

Speaker A: Like, you don't want to be like the Luddites. You remember the Luddites in the 18th century? They were a group of people who had an anti machinery movement, uh, the industrial revolution. And they would go and destroy how they do.

Speaker B: Did they win?

Speaker A: Yeah, I don't think they won.

Speaker B: I don't think so either.

Speaker A: They would go and break in and destroy the machines in the factories because their jobs were being replaced. They lost that battle. You're not, you're not going to win against AI people. I mean, it is here to stay, so you might as well embrace it. Because I look at it like this. What if you, what if you flip your thinking? What if it's not the enemy? What is it? What if it's a gift you've been given? Because that's how I see it. I wake up and I'm like, oh my God, I don't believe I have access to this. Look what it just did. Uh, these done moments I was just talking about. I have them every day and I'm like. And I walk by people on the street, I'm like, they have no idea that you can have this superpower that is available to everyone. That's why I'm so passionate about this.

Speaker B: Me too. And also I think that's uh, that's another element that a lot of people aren't talking about, which is the people resisting this, they're at an age. I don't mean to dismiss it, but every single 20 year old in history, maybe 19 or 18 year old in history, uh, pushes, uh, that's a strong statement. Of course, not every single one, but this is the age where they, they push back on what their parents are doing and what uh, society as a whole is embracing. Like it's their time to stand up and be like, I've got an opinion and I'm going to express it and it's different from yours and stand strong on a different opinion. Sometimes it's just being and, and having a voice. And I think there's a, I think you're right. It's very emotional, their response too. But anyway, I don't mean to cut it down.

Speaker A: Some do and I do. And I just want to add this part because we don't want to be generation bashing.

Speaker B: Yeah, too late. That was on me. That's all me, man.

Speaker A: But, but, but listen. Yeah, you are, generally speaking, you're correct. But listen, in my Household, my daughter's 16. She heard about that same thing with those college students who are anti AI and she was like, those kids are stupid. Like, she was like they're doomed. My daughter embraces AI M. Of course she's awesome. She's in the house with me. That, so that, that's part of it. But she uses it and by the way, she's a scholar. She does not, she doesn't use it to cheat. She uses it to amplify her learning. I mean she's at the top of her class and, but she sees the disparity. There are kids in her class, she was like this Guy was using ChatGPT right in front of the student, right in front of the teacher, copied and pasted uh, the output from ChatGPT and they'll, and they'll just turn it in, in high school. And I'm like without, without any type of filtering or any. She uses it to study. She, she, she, ah, I see her have it give her practice exams and things like that. So she uses it to do better at school, to amplify her learning. Um, but she thinks that these kids who reject it are absolute idiots.

Speaker B: So let's take this conversation a little bit further rather than just like you Said I, I hate it when I hear myself doing what I just did, which is generation bashing sort of thing. And it. Anyway, uh, it's not, to me it's not about the generation. It's about the dynamic of refusing to acknowledge change and embrace it. And I don't mind when people, in fact I encourage people to embrace something, to fight it or embrace it, to change it, but it's just walking away from it is not going to do anything. Talk about a couple of these topics though, like let's talk about the future of jobs. Um, do you believe that? So, so I think, I think the worst PR departments in the world right now for topic and open AI. Like absolutely, absolutely worst. Um, PR departments because you have their CEOs telling people that um, basically not only is the world probably going to be completely destroyed due to AI, like human race is gone, but they're all telling people every single job is going to be replaced. And I don't know why they're taking this position. I personally do not have that position. I think there's going to be a massive shift of jobs in the marketplace. I think a, ah, lot of people are going to be able to do way more, but I do not believe there's going to be a massive elimination of jobs. Do you disagree with that?

Speaker A: No, there, there will be, it's more of a, of a shift, um, that, that doom speak. I don't agree with two reasons. One, yes, some jobs will be replaced. I also remember like there were, there used to be humans who had to stand on an elevator and push the buttons for you.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: That job got replaced with the automatic elevators, but that doesn't mean that.

Speaker B: And also the big buttons that you could press yourself. Yep.

Speaker A: Right. So now. But are those, did those humans get kicked out on the street and did they starve to death? No, they just did something else. There used to be operators who had to do the physical punch things for the phones, but those jobs are gone, so they, you do something else. So it's more of a shift. But I also think that there will be plenty of work and here's why AI allows you to do so much more at scale that that will become the expectation. So right now, just going back to the earlier example, if I can publish 12 blog posts in 40 seconds, well, that's going to become the expectation. Whereas maybe last year my expectation was, oh, just publish one blog post a week for a human. Now, now I, I know the ceiling has, I mean the floor has risen because of AI. That's going to happen across the board. Right now that we're in the gap, period, where, uh, those of us who are leaning into AI, we have a bit of a head start because we can get so much more done than people who aren't using it. But it's going to become normalized to where, yeah, we're going to expect a certain level of output and now you're going to have tons of jobs to fill that need because every company is going to need to keep up with that output.

Speaker B: What do you think happens to the world of media? I mean, you just said you published 10 blog posts in 40 seconds. If a lot of people are doing this, which we are, or more social media posts and more videos and more content, more music, like what happens in this world of media where, you know, there's already an incredible amount of media, the amount of email we get alone is outrageous. But what happens when it just magnifies? What do you think's gonna change there?

Speaker A: It's gonna come down to taste. The tastemakers will win. So the, the quant. While the quantity of media may increase, you're gonna resonate with people who are telling stories who you can identify with. Um, let's look at, let's look at it this way. I mean, when we're of a certain age. When I was growing up, there were three channels, like 2, 5 and 11. Now I don't, there, I don't know how many channels are. Do you know that there are over 700 different streaming platforms?

Speaker B: I did not know that. But I do know when I visit my dad in a assisted living facility and I try to change the channel for him, there's like a thousand something numbers on the screen.

Speaker A: Yeah. On cable you now have a thousand channels, but there are 700 different platforms. So the quantity of options has increased. But people lock into the stories that they connect with. So that's where the power. You remember when I came and spoke to you guys, that's what I led with, is the storytelling. That's the main part. Each of us, we've lived certain experiences. We see the world a certain way. We're unique. And using AI to amplify that into magnify stories that you've authentically lived where you're not putting out generic slop that's just regurgitated from the Internet, but things you've actually lived. So now the best AI is indetectable. You can use AI for the mechanics of getting stuff out there, but it's actually you, it's your story. So it's, it's Dave Will, let's say you have a show and you have books and media and magazine articles and all this stuff about you that's actually your character, your, your real life and you've magnified it at scale using AI, but it's not slop. So if I'm connecting with you, Dave, it doesn't matter how many other people are out there, I'm going to follow you. So I think personal brand, if you want to use that language, that's the key.

Speaker B: I think you just nailed it. And I'm going to use a different word. I think it's about a relationship and that relationship takes a lot of different forms. Um, you know, respectfully, there's a million people out there right now that are saying, I know AI and I can help you, but I called you because we have a relationship. And you know, when I think about the people I follow on Instagram, even, even the people that I don't know personally, I feel a connection to them, I have a relationship with them, even if that relationship's in my own head. And so I, I think that that's really interesting. I think you're right that it is about that personal connection. And so now the question becomes, how do you form that personal connection? That's really rhetorical question that we can save for a marketer, maybe, um, developers. So you talked about developers and we're talking about jobs. My son, he's 23, just graduated university of Vermont, uh, he's a developer. And I remember when I told them to, you know, maybe you should consider, I have a software company. I'm like, maybe you should consider, you know, software developer. You know, six years ago I told him that. And um, so much listening to dad, but he's ah, uh, I was like, yeah, you're gonna make 100 grand coming out of school. And that was true six years ago. Now he comes outta school and he's not making a hundred grand. But I will tell you, what he is doing is, um, he, he is doing a different kind of coding. So what he's doing now is compiling. He's more of a conductor of pieces that he's putting together to tell a story. And then here's the thing that I think is really interesting about him as a developer. His job is to communicate that clearly to other people on his team and to clients. So now he's an interpreter almost between the technology, the coordination of the technology and the people that are going to use the technology. So to your point, the jobs are shifting. Uh, but I still Think there's jobs for developers. They're just doing different things. That's right.

Speaker A: Yeah. And having that skill set. Just like you said, AI amplifies what you went to school for, which you studied. Same thing for me is amplifying him. And there's going to be a need for that where you have people. Like when people learn how to vibe code and they create an application, they only get. They're going to hit a wall, and they're going to need a person who knows what they're doing to come and help them. Um, unless you learn how to communicate with AI. And this is a mindset shift that I notice a lot of people. I mean, you could. You could pretty much ask AI to troubleshoot you through anything. If you get stuck trying to publish an app or whatever, you can send AI a screenshot and say, hey, I'm stuck here. What next? And it'll tell you exactly what to do, walk you through the whole process. But a lot of people don't think that way, too. They want to go ask a human. So there will be opportunities for people like your son, who know what they're doing to come in and help save the day.

Speaker B: You know, it's. It's funny you say that. There's a. You're right. It takes a while to train yourself, and I think it takes longer to train old dogs. So, like, I, uh, think there's a lot of us out there where it's just a little bit. Takes, uh, a little more time to get us to do things. Um, my partner and my. My company created, um, an agent inside of Slack called Trace, um, that will basically answer any question about the platform, what's going on behind the scenes and the coding. So if a client's having a problem, we ask Trace. And it goes well beyond that. Like, I can ask, uh, I'm setting up a breakfast with some CEOs from the companies we work with in Washington, D.C. and I was just like, hey, Trace, can you tell me which of our clients are based in dc? I said, sure, here are the clients. I was like, cool. Can you tell me, like, who the CEOs are and what their email addresses are as well? And, like, in a heartbeat. She pulled this together for me. I say, she. It pulled it together for me. And I normally would have gone to my marketing person and been like, hey, can you go into Salesforce, run a report on all this, get this information? Then, like, the next day, I might have gotten the answer after an hour of work.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Um, but instead, I trained myself to actually use the tools at my fingertips. So a lot of this is just mindset training yourself.

Speaker A: That's right. And I want to pick up on something you just said, because I catch people doing that too. You corrected yourself. You called it a she and then you said it.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And the thing, I actually embrace calling them pronouns like he.

Speaker B: I call them gender.

Speaker A: Yeah, I like that. I like that he's. It personifies them. And the reason I think that that's important, that in that it helps with the mindset shift, is because if you look at it as a tech tool, then the moment it doesn't work, you're going to say, oh, this is crap. I'm not going to use it anymore. Versus if it's a person, you're going to take time. You're going to train it, you're going to nurture it, you're going to help it get better. You wouldn't fire that intern on day one the minute they make a mist. But I see so many people throw out AI and say it sucks because it made a mistake. So, yes, personify it, treat it like a person. I think that that is actually a winning mindset. I have a whole ton of agents that work together. Open clause, Hermes. I call them all by name and by by gender. Uh, I have Henley, who's a he. I have Athena, she. And people tease me. They're like. You talk about them like they're people. Like, yeah, I sure do. Because they get stuff done. I treat them like people. I have a chapter in my book where I talk about, um, train forever. Fire never. It's kind of a play on that whole higher, slow, fire, fast. With AI, you train them, you don't fire it. Yeah, you might switch platforms or you might jump over here and do this, but you don't ever fire it. You just keep retraining it. Because it has that memory that you just talked about. It has that access. You just gotta continue to update. Tell it to update its permanent instructions with your new instructions. And you keep doing that, and it gradually gets better and better and better. And it's gonna get to a point where it doesn't forget things. Humans, we forget things, we make mistakes. So, yes, definitely personify your AI.

Speaker B: I thank you for that because I've been. And this is timely too. For me. It's timely because for a long time it was all about, like, personifying it. And then recently I've been going down this path of, like, what really is a tool. And I've struggling with that decision. But I think Uh, I actually kind of appreciate you saying it's almost like giving me permission that it's okay to personify it. Nobody actually thinks it's a person, but it's okay to give it a label that personifies it. Um, a friend of mine came up with this really cool. His wife actually came up with this great idea. I have a boat. And uh, you know, it's a significant size boat. It's not, it's not a dinghy or little fishing rig. It's a little bit bigger than that. So it's a 42 foot boat. And it's very stressful sometimes like two engines if something goes or there's, there's a little bit of extra smoke or weird sound happening or God forbid, you know, water coming into the bilge or something like that. There's so much to know on this boat. And I've got a user manual that's literally 5 inches thick and it's a binder with information and I have all these invoices and receipts and in surveys that have been done on it. And you know where I'm going with this? Of course. So I'm naming this, this agent or this, this project in Claude. I'm going to name it Captain John after, after the uh, my friend that recommended this to me. So now anytime I have a question or if water's coming the bilge, I'm going to be able to ask Captain John, how do I troubleshoot this, what do I do? And it's going to give me an are much faster than me actually picking up the phone and calling for help.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: So um, yeah, I love the idea of personifying this. Now, um, I gotta build Captain John.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Hey, can I tell you about one other idea I've been working on?

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, go for it.

Speaker B: You were about to say something though.

Speaker A: I was saying. Or flipping through that 500 page manual. I mean that would take forever too. Instead you snap a picture, send it to your agent. How do I fix this? You get an answer immediately. So tying that to business, because I know business owners listen to this, your SOPs.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: That's an easy one. If you haven't done that yet, get your SOPs into an AI agent so your team can just talk to it and have a conversation instead of flipping through a manual or scrolling through a Google Doc or whatever.

Speaker B: I've never opened that, that manual to my book boat by the way. I've never opened it. I think I tried once and I was like, I don't even know where to start. Here. And I closed it. I think I just googled the answer. And it was much more difficult than an agent would be. So, Ethan, I want to build an AI Dave. And let me explain what that is. I want to take 90 days and answer 90 questions. Uh, each question will be. And I'm going to have AI help me generate the questions to best understand me and who I am. Um, questions like, what do I think about religion, Do I believe in God, what happens life, uh, after death. You know, that might be one category. Another category might be like, how do you find a job you're interested in? What's the relationship between money and work? Like, questions that ultimately every single one of them would be something you'd want to teach your kids. Uh, maybe it's just opinions about, uh, things going on in the world, political positions. I want to create this A.I. dave. I'm going to record a single question each day. It might be 20 seconds, it might be 20 minutes, but I want to record a video and put it into AI. Eventually I want to set it up so that potentially it could be an avatar of me. And at this point, after 90 days of data, and maybe longer if I keep going with it. Yeah, you could, in theory, have a conversation with me. I think Reid Hoffman did this. If I'm not mistaken, the LinkedIn guy, Reid Hoffman is LinkedIn, right?

Speaker A: Mhm.

Speaker B: Or am m. I thinking Netflix?

Speaker A: That's Reed Hastings. Yeah, I get the mistakes.

Speaker B: Reed Hastings, Reid Hoffman.

Speaker A: I just heard them on a podcast together and they were talking about how people get them mixed up. Yeah, I think we just.

Speaker B: Yeah, but one of them did that with where they created. And this was like two years ago, and they were really, they were early on the scene. But anyway, that's a project I want to work on some. I, uh, was started up some Saturday.

Speaker A: Oh yeah, that's a good one. And when you get that, actually teach that. Um, in part two of my workshop, which, by the way, I'm coming back to Boston to do part two. This. Uh.

Speaker B: All right. I didn't know that. That's great news.

Speaker A: Um, yeah, I'm looking forward to it. But, um, I actually have an agent that does that. So we. I'm big on context. That's one of the key things. We've been talking about that earlier. That's all the difference. So what you're building is a context vault, really a massive memory system, um, that describes Dave Will all. The only way AI knows who people are is through words. So if you think about a massive word document that had like millions and millions of words that describe you, how you see the world where you were born, your perspectives, your religions, all of these words which you ate for lunch last Thursday that would make up your character in the eyes of AI. That's really the only way it could know you. So that's what context is. And the more context you give it then the better it can serve you and do things for you. And um, and writing on your behalf, speaking on your behalf, those type of things. So it could serve double duty. When you build this context vault, not only can you have it as um, as a clone that you can use for legacy and passing on down onto your loved ones, but you can also use it to as an assistant. So all of my agents, and it's getting a little bit more technical, but all of my agents share a context vault about me. And it's a just a bunch of documents in a folder, but they're extensive. Like I have a story vault, for example, where every day I tell AI a different story. We forget so many stories that we live every day you work in your business, you have 10 stories. You have behind the scenes interactions with your team, you have client interactions, you get reviews on Google. All of these are like stories that you lose because you don't capture them. But you put them in a vault and AI will always remember them. And then when you have it doing things for you, it'll go and recall, oh, remember, remember last Tuesday when you got that five star review from John because you fix this boat or, you know, whatever. So now that gets resurfaced. You forgot about it, but AI didn't. And now that gets woven into your content and it can't be slopped because it's something you actually did.

Speaker B: So where are you putting those stories? Okay, so vault. What do you mean, where's the vault?

Speaker A: That sounds like so complicated. But it's just a folder on my computer. It's a, it's a folder which, with a bunch of markdown files, md, MD files.

Speaker B: Um, can you explain what a markdown file is?

Speaker A: Sure, if you. Everyone knows a Word document, right? There are different file formats. Word, PDF, um, Doc, all these different file formats. Dot MD is another one. And it's just a plain text English document. It's not code, but AI reads it and it's a set of instructions. I always compare it to, um, help people understand it. It's like that scene from the Matrix where Neo had the jack plugged into his head and he could learn the skills. They would just load it into his head.

Speaker B: Yeah, uh, yeah, I know kung fu. I remember that one.

Speaker A: Yeah. And he was learning at a light. Well, your AI can do that. You can give it skills by. By giving it a markdown file, a dot MD M file. And you literally can type it up yourself or you just ask AI, make this file for me, turn this into a skill. And now you can give it. It can be a super long document that explains any task, and AI will follow that skill and do it to a T. So all of these markdown files get stored. They just get stored into folders where you can point AI to it. That's all it is. So mine, I took it to another level to where it also has. I created. I said, I want you to create a story vault so that whenever you're writing content on my behalf, go look through the story vault. And then I have another one that's all about my brand voice. So it has tons and tons of instructions, examples of how I speak, keynote, uh, transcripts, workshop transcripts, podcast transcripts. So it has so many samples of my voice and instructions that it can't get it wrong. I mean, it's going to sound just like me. Um, in this vault grows and grows and grows. So it's the whole idea. So if I took that same vault, now it's multipurpose. I can go and create the clone like you're talking about, load those same documents into the brain of my clone. And you can do this with services like Delphi AI. If you want to do like the video avatar of yourself, you can digitize yourself, put those documents into the brain of your avatar, and clone your voice. And now it becomes like talking to you. And this technology is a little slow and clunky right now. Yes. But this is the worst it's going to be. So it's only going to get faster and the, uh, the latency is going to decrease. So that's where to me, that's the heartbeat of it. Like, that's. It's funny, I use the word heartbeat because that's what, like Open Claw and Hermes and stuff, they actually have a heartbeat md. So that's a file that tells your agent what to do on a regular basis. Like every 30 minutes, check my email inbox, draft replies to the most important ones, things like that.

Speaker B: So when you use the word vault, you're referring to a folder on your computer that holds a bunch of markdown files and MD file. And like you have a story vault in the story. Each MD file is a unique story. Or you have Multiple stories in one MD file.

Speaker A: Um, I keep them all in the same, uh, MD file. Just a bunch of files.

Speaker B: Okay, so one MD M file in one folder.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: Which you consider to be a vault. And then you just keep adding stories to that MD file. Yes. One last technical or detailed question. How do you get stories into that MD file?

Speaker A: Oh, I just talked to it. So I set up a, uh. So there are a bunch of different ways, depending on. I can use ChatGPT, because I've tied them all together, uh, using, uh, an MCP bridge, which is getting a bit technical. But you could just tell your AI agent, say, hey, create an MCP bridge so I can share this context vault with.

Speaker B: Which is like an AI integration.

Speaker A: Exactly.

Speaker B: So it's like an integration between different systems. Is AI just calls them MCPs. Okay, right.

Speaker A: So don't get hung up on that again. I'm not a coder. I just tell my AI to do stuff and it builds it. So, for example, in ChatGPT, I set up a task where every day it reminds me 9:00am hey, Ethan, tell me a story. Tell me, tell me something that happened. So it's keeping it sharp and that, uh, I'll just put it in voice mode and I say, I tell it the story of what just happened and say, add this to my vault. And then it goes and saves it in there.

Speaker B: That's great. All right, with the time that we have left, I would love for you to talk me through, uh, one component of your book, which again, um, uh, the book is done. Great name. Done. Uh, let AI do your work so you can live your life. Tell me about the six levels of autonomy. You said most of us are like level one and two. Yeah, talk me through that. Sure.

Speaker A: So level one is you're chatting with AI. You use ChatGPT. Use Claude. You ask it a question, you get an answer back. That's great. Uh, you still have to go do a lot of work. Maybe you asked it to write you a thank you email. Now you have to copy paste that email into your application or whatever, uh, level two is. I call them widgets. These are your in LLM M assistance, like your custom GPTs. Or in Gemini, we call them gems, or in Claude, your projects, where you have whatever repetitive task, you can build it inside of these applications and keep running it through that repetitive task. And it's almost like a super prompt where it runs the same thing everywhere every time. But you still have to do something with that output. Right. You still gotta copy and paste it, put it wherever it goes. But it does save you some time moving up that ladder. We have on level three, your automated workflows. So these are your trigger based sequences. So something happens. Let's say you get an email. Like the subject line has something about referral in it and that is the trigger that kicks off it. Adding the person to your CRM and then it adds them to an email drip campaign and then to an SMS campaign and then maybe it sends them a handwritten card in the mail. You could set up that whole sequence. Um, you could use AI. You could use stuff like zapier make.com n8n you know, it doesn't have to contain AI or it can contain AI.

Speaker B: So this, the third one is where you're starting to incorporate multiple systems and glue them together utilizing AI.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Is that considered an agent at that point?

Speaker A: Uh, technically no. And I'm glad you brought that up because a lot of people use that word agent very loosely.

Speaker B: Like me for example. Yeah, if I'm using AI, it's an agent, you know.

Speaker A: Yeah, some people would call that an agent. In fact, uh, I think zapier, they use that, that term agent when it's really, I would describe it as more of a workflow because it is dependent on that trigger first happening and then that sequence of events follows after that. Uh, now you're more hands off as a human because now once you build it, you theoretically don't have to touch it. But a lot of times those automations break. You have to go in and fix things. You know, authentications, API keys get stale, things like that. Um, but so going up the next level, level four is an agent. That's, that's what I call, um, an autonomous agent. That really, it does one specific task, but it does it on its own without needing any intervention. Unless you put that in the instructions. Unless you want there to be human inter intervention. But the AI can take that task from start to finish without needing a human. That's an AI agent to me. And then level five is where I call them your orchestrator agents, where you have AI agents whose job it is to manage other sub agents, um, kind of like an org chart. So um, that is where you have like it could be your Open Claw or your HERMES agent, but you talk to this, the boss agent and it knows which sub agent to delegate this task to. And it can manage multiple agents and spin off different tasks, meanwhile keeping itself free so you can continue to have conversations with your orchestrator agent.

Speaker B: So I, I was with you until level six. Give me A real life example of level six.

Speaker A: Oh, man. Okay, so if I. If I open up my Telegram app right now, which Telegram is another messaging app, a lot like WhatsApp. Ah. Or, you know, Discord. Um, that is the one I use to talk to my bots. So my orchestrator agent is Henley. So if I want something done, I go tell Henley. Henley has a team of other agents that he can delegate things to. If it's related to writing content, he'll delegate it to Hemingway, who's my content writer, and Hemingway will go get it done. Meanwhile, Henley is still free for me to talk to. Um, I talk about like this, and I use this. This metaphor in the book comes, um, from a story of my childhood when I was living. When I was 10 years old, my mom moved us to West Africa because she was living in the Peace Corps. It was a dream of hers.

Speaker B: Oh, my God. I didn't know that. Yeah, I feel like I've known you a little while, and I did not know you lived in West Africa. What part of West Africa?

Speaker A: We were in this country, Niger, and the capital is Niamey. Uh, we lived there for about two years. And one thing that I remember is when we would drive over the. The bridge and they were in the Nij, in the Niger river, there would be people washing their clothes by hand every morning in the river. All, uh. They'd be out there all morning washing garments by hand in the river and letting them dry out in the sun. And I thought to myself, I remember that young age being appreciative of, oh, man, we have washing machines at home, and, wow, we can just throw our clothes in there and go do something else while the machine washes the clothes for us. Meanwhile, they're spending hours out there doing laundry and bringing that to business context. How many times in our businesses do we metaphorically wash the clothes by hand, do this repetitive task, copy and paste something from a spreadsheet into your CRM when you could have a machine, a washing machine, that does that task for you. And now more than ever, if you. If you don't have the machine, you can build it yourself using A.I. uh, you can usually vibe code or build an agent with plain English, something very simple to help you do these repetitive tasks. So with that same analogy, if you have Washing the clothes by hand level one, you're chatting with a, uh, genius who's standing next to you as you're washing this garment by hand, and he's giving you good advice, but you're still doing all the work. Work Right. Level two. Oh, now you get some tools, you get a basket, you get a brush, you get some detergent. That will help you do your job faster. These are your custom GPTs, things like that. But you're still doing a lot of the manual work. Level 3 is your automated workflows. That's like your washing machine. You. But you still have to go gather your clothes, dump them in the machine, put in the detergent, press start.

Speaker B: This is such a good analogy. Keep going with it. Yeah.

Speaker A: All right, so that's your washing machine. Inputs, dirty input, in, you go through the machine. Clean input, clean output.

Speaker B: All right.

Speaker A: Uh, level four is your agent. That's like if you had a dedicated laundry person on staff. Now, you don't have to touch your laundry. Your laundry person goes and grabs dirty clothes out of the hamper, washes it for you when it's dry, folds it, puts it away. Okay. That's the dedicated agent that does one task.

Speaker B: Now level 5, last one is like, if you had a husband. That's. What. Is that what you were gonna say?

Speaker A: Uh, I was gonna say butler, but.

Speaker B: Okay. Yeah. All right. Is that. No, this is not a husband. All right, go on.

Speaker A: Okay, so you have your. Your butler, your husband, who you tell the butler what. What you want done. The butler manages the laundry person and the pool boy and the gardener and the. The housekeeper. You're. It manages.

Speaker B: They're saying the same thing here. Yeah, butler and husband. Right.

Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. So that. That's. That's how these agents work. And the beauty of it is you can build these with plain English. Now, level six is. It's on the horizon, but it's. It's also already here a little bit. Uh, that's proactive AI to where AI anticipates your needs and takes action on your behalf without you even having to ask for it.

Speaker B: And that's Mom. That's the mom right there. You know, like, that's the. That's the highest level of the intelligence pyramid. Uh, there, like, now you got mom taking care of everything. That's amazing. And, um, yes, you can use those if you want. If you also want to get sued. All right, um, something I want to. And we're going to wrap this up in just a second, but something I want to tell you because I'm very proud of this. Um, I think, uh, and this kind of leads nicely into my last question for you. Um, a lot of my peers are becoming. Learning, uh, everything they can about AI because they want to use AI and make their company better with It, I fall in that category. But more importantly for me, I want to create this culture of curiosity in my company. I want to hire people that are 100% invested in AI. I want AI to become, um, a big part of how everybody in my company does their jobs. And so for me it's more about I want everybody else. And this is kind of how I lead too. Like, I'm the dumbest person in my company. I'm. There's no job in my company I could do better than the people that are doing it themselves. And that's the absolute honest truth there. And so the same is true with AI. And it's really, really cool when you can create this culture of people in your company that are building agents and building all this autonomy and using Claude, uh, in our case, to do all kinds of awesome stuff that's amazing to see. And for example, just today I've been doing a lot of client interviews. You know, like, that's the human interaction I love. And I'm asking clients about their jobs and about, you know, their interaction with our platform and so on. And one of the people on my team created this agent using Claude that, where the agent just gives me everything I need to know before I go into the interview. And then I plug the, the granola link into the agent and um, and it updates Salesforce with any new information. It puts a note out to Slack so the CSM or client Success manager can see that I had a conversation with this person. And then it updates this, um, this, this uh, product wizard inside of uh, inside of Claude that is going to suggest new product enhancements based on the conversations I've been having with our, with our clients. Absolutely. All awesome. And I didn't do it. And that's what I love. Yeah. Question to you. And, and I'm happy I can get into like how you build a culture like that, but that's not really the point of this. Um, and, and by the way, I think most of the people listening to this know how to build a great culture. And it's the same tactics. You talk about it, you bring it to company meetings. You, you, you just constantly bring it to the forefront and you hire for it as well. That's how you do it.

Speaker A: It.

Speaker B: Um, so let's, let's assume the person listening to this feels behind because I suspect that's a pretty common sentiment. Number one, buy the book. Done. I mean I'm a huge fan of yours. And so I don't consider this like, uh, uh, I have no reason to Plug this. Other than I believe in you and I love the conversations we have, and I think the book done that probably is a very comprehensive version of this podcast. But let's assume somebody listening this feels behind. They feel as though they've done a few things. Maybe they're dabbling in Claude or OpenAI. What do you suggest they do next to incorporate AI deeper into their company?

Speaker A: Uh, well, first, give yourself grace, because you're not behind. Out of 8 billion people in this world, only about 1.5 billion have even touched AI. And out of those, only like 12% have even gotten to that, like, level two that I talked about. So this is a very small percentage of the world. This level five stuff, this the agent you just described, the things I'm describing, you're talking about less than 1% of the population is even messing with this. So you're not behind the fact that you're listening to this, that you're reading my book or attending workshops and trainings. You are actually way ahead.

Speaker B: But, yeah, well, I mean, I'm thinking like a competitive entrepreneur, but still, 12 of 1.8 is 216 million people that are ahead of you. So you got that. Anyway, not, not to be a contrarian here, but still feel behind. We're an entrepreneur, you know, you're always going to feel behind.

Speaker A: You're always going to feel behind. All right, if you. But what I would do is those six levels that I just described, like, take an honest assessment, like, where are you on that scale? And by the way, these aren't levels like, you never go back a level. Like, I mean, uh, yeah, I'm doing like level 5 and 6 stuff, but I chat with ChatGPT and Claude all the time on doing level 1 stuff every day. So you. It's a matter of, like, choosing the right tool for the job, but you need to have knowledge of how to use each level. So if you've never built a custom GPT, learn how to do that. Learn. I, I, uh, still I teach workshops. ChatGPT has been out three, three and a half years. There are a lot of people who still have no idea what I'm talking about when I say custom GPT or they've never built a project. So embrace that. Learn what it is, why it's powerful. If you're already at that level, then what's next? Learn how to build a workflow. If you're already building workflows, learn how to build an agent. Start with something simple, dead simple, so that you understand the mechanics, you know the first thing that I started with, the first agentic thing that I did, I think in Claude code or cowork was I got it to clean up my downloads folder on my computer. Uh, it's just, it's my junk drawer. Right. I just, I have, I had like, I don't know, thousands of files that just land in there. And, and I just wanted to see what it would do. So I was like, hey, organize this. It took a few minutes, I had to give it some permissions. And now everything's neatly organized into folders that make sense.

Speaker B: I told you anything that's safe to give, uh, like Claude or OpenAI access to your file directory.

Speaker A: Yeah, I've never had, had an issue. You give it a folder to work in and that's its own little sandbox.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: So don't, don't be scared. Just get, if you, if you really have concerns about it, go buy a separate computer, but get in there, play around with it so that you understand the mechanics of how it works.

Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So I want to add to all that, like everything you talked about is how the individual gets better at it. But I want to add to it what I said right before that, which is get your team doing it too. Like, uh, what's more powerful than you becoming an expert is your entire company becoming experts. And so I want to emphasize that piece of it. Like that worked for me getting my entire company. Now granted, I have a software company, so the people in my company are already inclined to embrace it, whereas that may not be the case at a law firm or at a services, another kind of services company.

Speaker A: Yeah, well, I'm glad you brought that up because I work with a lot of non tech, A lot of my clients are in non tech businesses and they bring me in to implement AI and to get their team engaged.

Speaker B: There we go. There we go. What's it, how can they get you, Ethan?

Speaker A: Uh, so here's the trick. Well, you can, you can get me ethanking.com, send me an email, whatever. You go in there, you find my contact information. But whether it's me or not, here's what, here's the trick. You gotta get your team members to see how it benefits them personally because the, what's going on in the back of their minds unless they, unless they are, you know, coders or working software is I don't want to train one, I don't want to learn another tech tool for, for work. Everybody hates doing that. And then two, the last thing I

Speaker B: want to do me, I love it.

Speaker A: Well, you're in software, non tech people. Um, but the other thing is I don't want to train my replacement. And I literally had, I, I had a client, I have a client who's an insurance company and they brought me in for a training and at the end of this, it was like a half day workshop. And at the end of it, this lady confessed to her boss. She was like, I did not want to come to this meeting, I did not want to come to this training because I was like, I do not want to train this robot to take my job. But she was like, now I feel empowered. I feel like I got a promotion because now I'm the robot manager. And so that's what your people are, Dave, they're, they're, they're robot managers. So when you have a team, let's say you, let's say you have a team of 10 people and each one of them has 10 robots that they manage well. Now you have a team of 100 people without you having to add anyone to your payroll. So getting your team to think like that, it's like, no, I'm not taking anything, uh, away from, from you, I'm empowering you. Everybody wants an assistant, everybody wants more hours in their day. So if you're empowering them and you're elevating them and you get to get them to flip it and see it that way, then they're engaged and you see how it can help them in their personal life. And then they become like AI friendly and AI enthusiasts. And that's what everybody needs, is a team of AI enthusiasts like you have.

Speaker B: I couldn't agree more. You know what, I normally don't like the timestamp episodes like this, um, but this one, the content in here is going to change dramatically. We kept it kind of high level, but in a year from now this is going to be outdated and it's like, you know, it's going to be like a decade in normal world. Um, and so to timestamp this one, something really kind of fun happening this week is SpaceX is IPOing this week upon recording this. And so there's a little time stamp which of course that's likely to create the first trillionaire in history, which is just blows my mind.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Anyway, there's a time stamp for us upon the recording of this. This won't go live for another few weeks, but, um, we're going to get this one out as quickly as possible because every week that goes by, the value of this erodes. That's true. That's true. Ethan King. Thank you, man.

Speaker A: Thank you.

Speaker B: You know, I always want to say Ethan Hawk whenever I for whatever reason and that just shows my age, the reality bites age going to the Ethan Hawke. Wasn't he the star of uh, you don't know, you don't know.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Training Day and yeah, was that, is he the star of Reality bites? Him and Winona, I think. Anyway, so if I ever call you Ethan Hawke, forgive me. Ethan King, you're awesome, man. Thank you so much for joining me today.

Speaker A: Always good to be here. Thanks, Dave.

Speaker B: Thanks for listening to EO360, a podcast brought to you by entrepreneurs Organization. If you haven't yet, go to your app, Apple or Android podcast app to subscribe, rate and review this podcast. Join me in two weeks for another EO360 episode. For more great content or to learn about entrepreneurs organization, visit eonetwork.org.