139. Most Client Briefs Miss the Real Problem w/ Emma Beckmann

Speaker A: Most briefs don't reveal the real problem they need to solve. Instead, they share what clients think they want, not what's truly driving their business. Now respond to that on the surface and you may win the pitch, but you'll likely miss a big opportunity. Welcome to the B2B Sales Trends Podcast, my lovely people, where we give you a sneak peek into the strategies of the world's best CROs and go to market leaders. We explore the systems, the playbooks they use so you don't have to figure it out the hard way. If you're looking to boost win rates, enhance deal quality and learn from the best in B2B selling, you are in the right place. Today we'll discuss how to transform client conversations, shifting from merely responding to briefs, what's coming in to really and truly uncovering the real business challenges behind them. Joining me today is Emma Beckman. Emma is the group Chief Growth Officer at Landor. She's reshaping currently the way opportunities are created and won and I can't wait to have that conversation. Emma, welcome to the show.

Speaker B: Thank you very much for having me.

Speaker A: Why is it risky for sales teams to take client briefs at face value, in your opinion? Let's start dive right into it.

Speaker B: Well, I think that there's a number of different risks. I think you know, first and foremost there is a missed opportunity for true impact. Um, I think briefs often articulate symptoms, um, that is our brand is not applied consistent, consistently, globally, um, rather than articulating the root causes, um, that is our uh, branding is not culturally relevant in all markets for example. So I think taking them at face value really means um, delivering a tactical solution that might not address the client's core business challenge. And I think that leads to limited M impact and superficial results. Secondly, I think a big factor here or big risk is the risk of commoditization and price pressure. Um, when you only deliver what's asked, you become a supplier fulfilling um, an order and obviously it makes price comparison or comparison on price price alone much easier and devalues strategic expertise, other risks, um, erosion of trust and that sense of um, partnership which particularly in a um, professional services industry, um, and a business like ours is really important. If the delivered solution doesn't truly move the needle, um, and have impact that can be connected back to a business outcome, the clients sooner or later will eventually feel um, let down. Even if you've technically fulfilled um, the brief. And I think there the risk is that long term, um, trusted advisor relationships ah, are undermined and that's ultimately what we're striving for.

Speaker A: It's interesting, uh, the topic, uh, I've heard people say that if you don't influence briefs in advance and you merely, as you've alluded to, uh, react to them, uh, then you actually only participating in a benchmarking exercise. Um, do you agree with that?

Speaker B: Yes. And I think, um, you know, it's also. It's also an art skill or an art form to actually spot, um, some of those RFPs that are actually just a benchmarking exercise and there's no prize behind it. Um, and I think, um, typically those benchmarking exercises happen, or you run the risk of it becoming a benchmarking exercise when you really don't have the opportunity to engage in dialogue. If a client or a prospective buyer just wants you to tick the boxes, complete the forms, and submit your pricing, that's a benchmarking exercise, whether intended or not.

Speaker A: So it's really a case of how do we share the unique value that we can bring to the table? And in a way that's sort of coupled with some of the research that's out there right now that says that buyers are, um, much more informed these days about your solutions that you can provide. They know a lot about the text and specs of things. And so if we merely respond to what they're asking for, we're sort of asking for that commoditization that you have, uh, referred to, right?

Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

Speaker A: Can you share the kind of conversations that your teams are currently having, uh, where you see that gap between a request that comes from a client and the actual needs, uh, that they may have?

Speaker B: I think one gap is often the tactical fix versus the strategic, um, transformation. What I mean by that is, um, clients often approach us saying, we need a new logo or, um, we need to review our, uh, brand architecture, for example. We try to shift those conversations quite quickly into actually, what is the business challenge that you're wanting to solve with this? You know, what is your growth strategy? Is your brand architecture, you know, or your current portfolio structure, you know, stopping you from being able to, you know, grow into this geography or that kind of like, uh, product adjacency? So quite often the brief will read like it needs a tactical fix, but actually there is potentially a much bigger, um, need behind that. I think, um, the other gap that we often try to tease out in a conversation is between, um, in its symptoms and root causes. And I touched on that, um, a little bit before. A client might say, um, our sales declining, we need more share of wallet, etc. Or we're not selling enough product in store. Um, in that example, in the case of cpg, our um response would be to explore is it a brand perception problem? Is it a relevance issue for the audience? Is it a differentiation or a standout problem? On shelf. The actual need might be a brand restage, um, or it could be portfolio optimization or a more expansive um, brand world, um, that enables a brand to be memorable not just on shelf, on a pack, but also in the you know, the social and digital context that brands live in today. But I think, you know, probably you know, the biggest gap is often uncovered when, or the most common gap is often uncovered when um, in the absence of the articulation of why. I think clients know what they want when they write these briefs but sometimes struggle to define why it's important. Just to make it a little bit more concrete perhaps to give an example there. A request for a brand refresh often uncovers a need for um, a full brand reinvention, um due to market shifts or because of M and a, um activity or new competitive pressures from um, from, from different uh, competitors which requires a much deeper strategic engagement before getting to a brand refresh.

Speaker A: Yeah, so it's clearly highlighting the uh, need behind uh, the want, uh, the why behind the uh. Ask now. It's really challenging sometimes for client facing people to make that shift. Right. Because a lot of the times, you know, relationship gets in the way so much. Uh, you know, we want to have a good relationship with our prospects, our clients and, and, and basically for us to dig deeper into the why and how the uh, the impact it can have and so forth. That's pushing back a little bit on what the client is asking for. Uh, is do you see that as a challenge for, for client facing people?

Speaker B: Typically, I think it's important to acknowledge the challenges that a client sees. The brief that they've written, you know, and you know, start by demonstrating, you know, that we've heard and understood um, you know, their initial request, you know, we, we hear you're looking for this. We understand that. I think that builds rapport, it shows respect. Um, but then you know, techniques to introduce um, an informed, empathetic um, perspective, you know, based on experience, learnings from other categories. I mean I find that many. And it's, it's one of the luxuries that we have working in um, an environment like we work in, particularly on an agency side. You work across so many different categories.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: And sectors. You know, many clients in these situations, um, in A Particularly if they have been with companies or brands for a long time. You know, doing a complete rebrand or a big brand transformation program is a once or twice in a career, um project, uh or um opportunity. We work on 3, 4, 5 as individuals at any one time in multiple sectors over multiple years. So I find you know, reframing some of those experiences and you know, using them to demonstrate how you know, other clients have you know, navigated uh, or how we've helped clients to navigate through similar challenges and help to reframe that way is a much better um way than I mean obviously we would never do that but um, a much better way than saying yeah, this is not what you need. Brief is, is wrong because you know, very often it is, you know, through that conversation, through that um, through that interrogation that will get to um, and the client will get to um, you know, the heart of the challenge.

Speaker A: And I think this, the way you've described this, uh, I uh, think it's important to do it in this way because it builds trust, it builds confidence that yes you are helping me with something that I'm not doing day to day, but clearly you are and you bring in your expertise to it. So you are in a way de Risking that project for me, um, by going deeper into this. And this gives me confidence that builds that trust that I need um, uh, uh, for that. I think, I think when done well that reframing exercise is really important for people to do. I agree, fully agree.

Speaker B: And if I could just add to that. You're also framing it as um, a shared success as well. I think you're not positioning it as um, the brief is not quite right or the problem is not clearly defined. It's positioned as let's ensure that we achieve the best possible business outcome together. And um, I think that's one of um, the biggest roles that we play M. Particularly in these early conversations in agency. Um, selection. M. Chemistry is so important. You know, clients in today's world are looking for partners who are going to um, you know, make them not just successful with the tasks that they've been given but also make them look good in a very pressurized environment, um, which is you know, challenged on so many fronts and that they have to represent to the C suite.

Speaker A: Yeah. And this idea of how do we co. Innovate that solution together? Uh, uh, that already creates that level of partnership that both sides are actually looking for, not just one sided uh. For sure.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker A: How so great. You've now had the skill to reframe this right? Reframe this around, uh, the impact that you can help them drive. Reframe, uh this on, on. On you being an expert. Expert in what you do, the expertise you can bring to the table. Therefore you build trust, therefore you build confidence in. In you and your solution. That's good. How does the reframing, or shall I say, how does reframing the problem in a way influences the way now uh, you structure your response to these briefs.

Speaker B: Traditionally people would start with um, you know, talking about themselves and um, you know, this is all of the expertise that we have and that you know, the client and um, uh, you know, would. Would often be second. I think the way we reframe that is, you know, really avoid talking about ourselves as. As much as possible and really, you know, start the response with you know, what's at the heart or the strategic problem, what really the opportunity is. Um, that's at the heart of the brief. So I think articulating in as concise a way as possible um, uh, understanding of the real business challenge, um, or the real opportunity perhaps rather than challenge um, that we have uncovered through the reframing, I think that is the important basis that then allows you to. To secondly then go into, you know, and this is how we would help you to solve um, you know, this challenge. Talk about approach, recommended approach, um, and deliverables and timelines and budgets then become almost kind of like a distant, kind of like end to. To the document. And when we do it really well, when the um, strategic opportunity has been, you know, framed really early on with a strong point of view underpinned through deep understanding of the client, but also um, the sector or you know, out of um category, um, similar. Similar challenge challenges. And that leads through and flows through into the recommended um approach more often, often than not, in my experience, we rarely even get into then talking about you know, deliverables. Yes, they're important and at some point of course you will have a conversation about deliverables, but it's not the focus of the conversation and I think that is um, and that's important but also connecting deliverables directly to outcomes. So to avoid deliverables feeling like a, you know, a line item and therefore there's a cost attached um to that. Um, but each deliverable explicitly linked to how it contributes to solving the problem or the challenge. So um, you know, I think that makes its inclusion or justifies its inclusion inclusion uh, which also when you then do come into, you know, cost negotiations, etc. It's very difficult Then for a client to say yeah, but could we just remove that to cut this budget? Because it logically all builds on each other in each step, each. Each um, part of the deliverable responds to a question that needs to be solved. I think um, another thing that is important is strategic road mapping as opposed to timelines and um, linear timelines that just look like things that happen um, one after another. But also. So um, bringing that, you know, at this stage in the process we will have answered collectively this question. At this stage in the process we would have collectively answered this question so that you know, the critical milestones are represented um, in the time timeline. And I think all of that um, you know, helps to really um, build a consistent or build a red thread through the entire response which if you've got the strategic reframing right is very difficult to argue with when you get to um, the end. Uh. I think the final. The other point that I think I would make is emphasizing value over uh, um, cost uh, as well. I mean where we can. And it's not always possible, um pricing is presented within the context of the potential um return on investment and the strategic transformation that's being delivered as opposed to a line item, um cost that can be m. Question or removed. It's not always possible. When we do have to present costs as line items then demonstrating added value in other ways with a 0 um against it to highlight that. And we will be doing quarterly inspiration sessions with your teams and things like that helps to um, Helps to um, justify value rather than just have a cost discussion. That was probably a very long answer to that question. But I think it is a bit of a sequence. And if you get the sequence flow right, um, the client might still not like you or not like, you know, the chemistry might not be right. The answer might be wrong.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Um, they might be looking for something different. But I think it makes it a much, a much more connected story which is difficult to unpick.

Speaker A: I agree with you. It's. It's a sequence of events and uh, it's that flow. And you know one of the things that we always hear is that. That uh. That client facing people tend to be they, they sometimes know what to do intellectually. They know what to do and how to behave then in that situation. But when it comes to doing that actually in front of the client, it creates quite a bit of tension and that has them shy away uh, and sort of fall back into their comfort zone. So how do you help teams really deal with that tension between these different Elements that you have just shared, uh, between for example challenging, uh a uh, brief and to simply delivering what's requested. Now that's pushing back in a way and that's, that's adding to how you phrased it. Uh, the client may not like you, but that creates that sort of tension. How do you help your teams to deal with that? Because that can't be difficult. Uh, that can't be easy. Excuse me.

Speaker B: No, it's not easy. And I'm not sure, I'm not sure there is a, you know, one cookie cutter way of doing it. I think. Um, depends a lot on, on personalities as well. You know, within the team. Um, you know, we don't win pitches as individuals, we win pitches as teams. But you know, my role, um, as a growth lead and the role of my teams who are, you know, supporting leading um, the these types of pitches, um, is to help through frameworks, through um, tools that we have, um, to almost coach teams. Um, through this. I mean we tend to build teams that have um, a mixture of different skill sets. So training and frameworks, um is of course important, I think, um, leadership and leadership. Sponsoring and coaching, um, is important. Senior leadership really need to actively champion that. And that is something that is big at Landor. I mean we have a, I hate to call it process because it's not a process, but you've got to kind of put it down as a process, um, on a page. We do have a, A process, straight framework, um, that we champion all the way from the CEO down across um, the business. And I think that is really, really important. And again this whole reframing of briefs is not just important in pitch processes but also when you're then working with a client in um, ongoing relationships because it's that um, mindset. So there is a lot of mentoring and coaching that we do around that. We also, I think another way is also demonstrating through doing. We have a lot of internal sharing forums, um, you know, globally but also locally where we highlight um, particularly successful um, cases or pitches. We also highlight and talk about and discuss the ones that haven't gone so well and why they didn't go um, so well and use those as learning, um, opportunities. I think, um, you know, also a culture, um, what's also important is a culture where people feel that they can, you know, escalate or ask for help if they can see something going off track or they're not being, you know, that, that they're not sure that they're doing the right thing or there is tension, you Know with, with the client, um is important that people come and ask for the right help. And I think where possible in whichever small or not so small way that you can do. I think aligning um, incentives and recognition with the strategic impact that people are having versus the tactical um you know tactical um working through projects, briefs at speed. So um, recognizing behavior, whether it's through internal wards or we have a system of the heroes of the month where you know internally in our studio meetings people across all levels of the business are recognized and those are good moments and opportunities. So there's a, there's a lot of um, different things in place. But I think ultimately um, leading through example um is certainly something that um, you know I found in my role but also you know my role as a leader within the business is to practice what I preach and in it and demonstrate um, the behavior model, the behavior that we want people to be able to um, demonstrate and uh, execute in these types of processes.

Speaker A: Uh, it sounds like you have uh, implemented a really um, strong leadership uh and coaching culture within your organization which is something that a lot of companies always are striving for and sometimes find it actually very challenging to do that. What's, what's a couple of actions? So let's say a leader is listening to this. What are a couple of action points that a leader who wants to implement a similar strong leadership and coaching culture that you have implemented. Ah, especially in relation to how do we handle these briefs effectively, how do we go beyond uh, the uh, the initial uh sort of surface and how do we really dig down into the impact that we can have for, for these prospects for these clients. Uh and then the connection of how do we now coach the sales uh or client facing people to that. So let's say I'm a leader listening to this and I'm thinking I need to have that same culture. I need to have the same culture of coaching. I need to have the same uh, same culture of, of client facing people's behavior. Let's say um, what is the one thing that I should immediately start doing tomorrow? What's the one thing I should stop immediately uh tomorrow and what's the one thing uh I should keep doing if I want to implement that culture?

Speaker B: I'm just trying to think which order to go on this in terms of the start. Stop keeping. Let's start with start M. Because I mentioned that and I think it builds on the point that I said before. I think it is actively modeling the behavior that um, uh that you want to see publicly um but also um, with your teams, but also with clients in those um scenarios and you know, respectfully challenging or questioning um uh, client client brief. So I think behavior for me um is modeling the right behavior is. Is. Is. Is really important and I know a lot of that, some of that will be linked to individual leadership style as well which obviously comes into this. But modeling behavior I think for me you know show, don't just tell is um. Probably my, my biggest takeout, my biggest word of advice. Um, in terms of keep I would say you know celebrating celebrating strategic wins. Celebrating. Celebrating those moments where you know everything has you know come together in the way that you, you you want it to. Explicitly highlighting um, in those moments and how it happened and sharing those stories um, of when a team has successfully reframed a brief and what the outcome was and the outcome doesn't always need to be. We won. We often demonstrate great behavior and the outcome was we lost for many uh, potentially other reasons. I think we can learn equally from, from the wins and the losses and there are many different things that come um into that. But I think um in it sharing, sharing those, sharing those stories in different forums, um and having the forums to be able to do that. Um as a global business we have global forums, we have local studio forums, we have regional forums, multiple forums where things can be shared and repeated would be um. The one thing that I would probably um uh say you know people should certainly keep doing if they're already doing that. Um and the stop. Stop. I think you know agency life is quite in a fast paced um. There is a demand for high performance and I think there's a danger of um, you know, rewarding and recognizing busy work. People who are extremely busy working late night on the pitches, fast turnaround, um on uh, more tactical kind of like briefs rather than you know, taking a moment to pause. Um, the slightly slower, more strategic work which um you know, perhaps happens over you know a period of 2, 3 months and can be a marathon to um, reframe a brief rather than you know, a quick pitch win that came in and was turned around in a week. You know both should be celebrated. But I think in. In the um in the context of this type of mindset, um change that we are trying to achieve, I think consciously ensuring that those slightly longer more strategic um processes are equally celebrated. Not just the fast and furious.

Speaker A: Right. So you've got to ah, start actively model good behavior in front of uh, uh your teams and in front of your clients. And that will hopefully start with the Journey of creating a culture. Uh, you have to uh, keep celebrating, keep celebrating the winner. Love that point. And uh, uh, stop rewarding busy work and really start rewarding outcomes. Um, that's great. Three tips. Um, Emma, the last question in every podcast. This has been an amazing insight for our listeners, so thank you for doing that. Uh, the last question on every single podcast I've asked now for many, many episodes is what in your opinion are, uh, the top three skills of behaviors that truly effective client facing people need to possess and really do well today? What are those top three skills that client facing people uh, need to do and execute really well today, in your opinion?

Speaker B: Quick fire or with explanation.

Speaker A: Now you can explain. That's good.

Speaker B: Strategic acumen, business insight. I think they need to be able to not just know their product or their discipline or their um, their, their work. They deeply need to understand the client and the client's business, industry, strategic object objectives. Um, in the context of our world, I think number two, I would say, uh, in today's world, radical empathy. An insightful curiosity I think is critical. Not just listen or listen, um, not just to respond, but to truly understand the client's unspoken needs, fears, aspirations. Um, there could be a bit of everything in there. It's the asking, the probing, thoughtful, um, questions that really undercover, undercover the um, underlying issues. And last number three, value articulation and storytelling. I think those two often go hand in hand. They translate complex solutions into clear, compelling narratives and that vividly demonstrates, I think, tangible, tangible business impact and value rather than just presenting features or um, talking about the benefits of your approach versus someone else's, um, approach. I think if you can combine value articulation through the lens of storytelling, you can really paint a picture, um, of transformation and real outcome and impact.

Speaker A: Strategic acumen, insights, curiosity and listening. To understand versus to respond as well as value articulation through storytelling. Emma, wonderful insights. Uh, thank you so much for taking the time. Uh, I know our listeners are uh, very much appreciating uh, your insights and thought leadership on that topic. Emma, uh, thank you for taking the time.

Speaker B: Thank you very much for having me. It's been a pleasure, my lovely people.

Speaker A: Many teens believe that winning is all about responding and responding better. Really. Better decks, better ideas, better execution and so forth. But if you're solving the wrong problem, the wrong issue, none of that really matters. The real edge lies in how you interpret debrief, challenge it. As uh, Emma said, reframe the conversation for better impact and outcomes. The teams that consistently win aren't the ones who respond best. They are the ones who define what gets solved in the first place, and I think that's really, really important. For more insightful conversations like this, my lovely people, subscribe to our YouTube channel or tune in wherever you listen to your podcast. Don't forget to download our 26 sales trends for 2026 if you haven't already. The link will be in the description below. Until the next time, take care of yourself, your loved ones, and of course your B2B customers all.

Speaker B: Bye bye.

Speaker A: If you'd like to put yourself or someone you know forward to be a guest on our show, there is a quick form in the show, notes to complete. It only takes a minute and it helps us to find voices and opinions that shape the future of B2B selling. Thank you. We appreciate it.