215. Laura Lindsberg: The Art of Networking

Speaker A: Inspiration, success stories, expert advice, strategies, new ideas and amazing conversations. Everything you need to become a great speaker. This is Oscar Santolaia and welcome to Time to Shine. Hello and thank you for joining for this new episode. Today, it's all about networking and how that connects to communications and public speaking. For that, we have a very special guest, Laura Lindsberry. She is a marketing and networking professional who has published the book Orange in Finnish. It's called Verkus tu misen the Art of Networking, which was published in the spring 2024. Laura's work focuses on the importance of collaboration and connections between people and their impact on their career development and business success. In 2011, she founded the Finland Young Professionals Network to promote professional networking among young people within and between companies. Hello, Laura. Um, welcome.

Speaker B: Thank you. Great to be here.

Speaker A: Yeah, pleasure to be talking with you. So, let's get started and I would like to hear more about you and especially how you became a speaker.

Speaker B: Well, that is a very good question actually, because my original idea was not to become a speaker or an author. This was completely due to the fact that I love networking and I really, really want to talk about it to the audience. And this was the main reason why I became a speaker. Um, I actually work in a speaking agency, so I have been involved with many speakers during the years. But now, um, I might say that the last year has been my own speaking year and hopefully many years to come.

Speaker A: Of course, I'm sure many will come. Um, so tell us why networking came as, um, a strong interest early in your career. How would it happen?

Speaker B: Yeah, that's really interesting, uh, to me as well, since I would say that networking is not a new topic, like AI, for example. Uh, networking has been in the world as long as we have had people doing business or selling or collaborations with each other. But it has become more and more important, I, um, would say within, uh, the last few decades. And the main reason is that the world has changed. Usually maybe 20 years ago, it was common that you had a good CV and good, um, education. That would be enough. But what we read quite many times, for example, from LinkedIn, is that you have had those excellent career paths and everything, and still you end up getting fired or there is some other changes going on in your work life. It is nowadays very common that you need more than just these basic things. And here is where networking is going to help you to find your future jobs, to find what interests you, and all kinds of opportunities. And I think it's an interesting fact that depending on the studies uh but I would say 70 to 80% of jobs are filled through networking. And it's very understandable since recruiting new people is quite expensive, time consuming and well it takes quite a lot from the companies and also from the future employees that how will they find the perfect matches? And here is why networking is helping us nowadays more and more.

Speaker A: Mhm. Tell us uh, how and why you founded the Finland Young Professionals back in as it's written, 2011.

Speaker B: Yes, I was working back then uh, at IBM M and they already had this um, network Young IBMers which was meant for, well I couldn't name any age, uh, groups but mainly for young people at IBM M. Um, they wanted to support um, the sense of belonging, something to do with this, that you're coming from school, straight from school to work life, that you need to have more connections and you need to learn how to navigate in the business life. So they already have this young IBM ers network. I was asked to be the chairman of this network and um, after one year I thought that hey, could there be some other companies that could also have these young networks? And I did find six other companies and we had just a brief meeting that hey, would it be fun to do something together maybe? And we decided to have a big picnic at Akiva Koisto in Helsinki and 200 people showed up and we thought that wow, there must be something into this that people really want to.

Speaker A: Besides a sunny day. Very sunny day I guess.

Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. And it has been just growing ever since. Now at this point we have 33 companies or their networks who are involved and um, the network reaches I would say a little bit over 8,000 young professionals in Finland. And it's a very good group since they are excellent companies and highly skilled young professionals working in these companies. And what they are looking for is some um, professional and of course fun networking which is related to work life. Of course.

Speaker A: Excellent. Um, and now someone is listening to you and saying okay, yes, um, makes a lot of sense what Laura is saying and I need to do more networking or if I'm doing already, I want to do better. So what would be your top piece of advice for someone uh, who wants to do better networking more effective?

Speaker B: Well at first I would ask that what is your goal? What do you want? In a way we are very unique in every way I would say. And um, some people want to have a lot of connections. Some people only need maybe five people in their life. It varies quite a lot. So what is your goal? Do you want to just meet like minded people or do you want to learn something new or just maybe share experiences? So that's the first question to answer and to know. And then I would say that a very important thing is learning what works for you, what feels natural and what can you continue. Because if I just say to you, for example, that hey, just go to a networking event, um, just connect on LinkedIn with uh, 150 people and you're good to go. That's your networking strategy? You might say that. Ah, well, this doesn't work for me. I don't actually uh, like to meet randomly new people and 150 sounds quite tiring. And like what do I gain from this? So then it's important to know what is your goal and what is your best way to do it. Like I can be a little bit shy in the beginning when I meet a new person just to get to know them a bit. Like what do they, like what are you? What is like the chemistry between us. And after I sense the tone that hey, we have some kind of connection, then it's really, really easy for me to um, share things and everything. But I need to take my time and if I do it in my way then it will have so much more efficiency and so much more potential for the future and it feels natural. I've said many times that networking is sort of like work, lives, friendships.

Speaker A: Mhm.

Speaker B: That I would say that explains it quite well. And of course few practical tips are that be curious about people and help others. Don't always assume that networking is something that you will gain out of or that something that you will profit. But if you are just exactly friendly and trying to be connected to people, ask that how, how are you able to help them? And they probably will ask you the same after they find out that hey, you are a great person to work with. For example.

Speaker A: Yes, it's, yeah, I agree that having the why or the goal, uh, to start with, that it's very important because yeah, if someone, let's say your mentor tells you, uh, well, that number 150 watts exaggerated I think, but like marathonic goal. But anyway, if someone tells you, okay, you need to meet, maybe 20 is more realistic still. Um, maybe. Okay, why do I challenge myself? Why do I torture myself or expose myself? Whatever you want to, uh, the um, tell it. Yeah, but why, yeah, why, why do I do it? Why is the real benefit and it has to be a, a clear goal that somehow motivates you, you are convinced to do it. Yeah, so that's, that's very important. I uh, agree with that. And you also mentioned the uh, the way that works for you. Right? You say something like that, what is, what is your, your way. Yes. In for finding your way is somehow experimenting or m. Um, how you find your way of networking.

Speaker B: Yes. Well, I would of course maybe analyze people around me, for example, that who do you admire at workplace? Are there people you like, their style of uh, talking or meeting new people? I'm not saying that you need to copy those people, but just to get ideas that what works, what you enjoy, then it might be natural to do similar kind of things. And then maybe just it requires some testing and trying. That's true. You need to figure out that hey, is this natural for me? And for example, like I always um, hear this talk about like, oh, it's easy for you, you're so extroverted person that it must be easy for you to talk to many people. But we all have our good uh, and um, downsides if we want to put it like that, that for example, introverts can be really, really good at networking. They actively listen and they, they know their boundaries and they just need to keep in mind that when they need to recharge, they just have to remember to take the time and know their limits, for example. But they can be excellent in conversations and all. But it does require some experimenting as mentioned.

Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. As you mentioned you were working at IBM when the networking became like a big thing in your life. Uh, so now thinking of perspectives of companies, companies and organizations. Because normally when we talk about networking, we talk about the individuals, the professionals, the benefits for us, the people. But for the organizations, for companies, what is the, what is the benefit? Uh, and how, for instance, why a company like IBM was doing that and how companies today, uh, because things have changed, of course in three years. What are the benefits and how companies could do today?

Speaker B: I love this question because this is one of the main things why I'm so highly invested in this. As you mentioned, everything starts from single human beings. But the benefits are huge for companies as well. If I want to share it a bit, I would say that it has both external internal benefits for organizations, for example, it can definitely improve your competitiveness since as I mentioned already a lot of recruiting is done via networking. So for example, when you are hiring a new person to your organization, you are not hiring only that person, you are hiring their complete network. So there can be connections that can be excellent and sales point of view or being partners or gaining experience and all this. And for example from employer branding perspective, they can have a huge impact on how the company is seen, both good and bad. So this has to. Because people talk. That's always the case, of course. And then internally of course as well. Well, I mentioned already that for example, the sense of belonging, that was one of the main things, for example at IBM, that you are part of a culture, you are part of uh, something bigger than just your own work. And I don't mean this by that you should share everything, all your secrets at the workplace, but just something that, hey, we spend quite a lot of time at work or at our computers and it does create quite much if you're able to feel that, hey, I'm respected and I have people who care about me and so forth. And there's definitely collaboration between teams as well. I have been working in big companies many years. It's quite common that companies do have silos, um, and people can even do jobs that are quite similar to each other in different departments, for example. So combining all this talent and sharing all the best practices and everything, um, can actually make the company much, much more efficient and of course make them feel like, hey, I get help when I need, need one, that I'm not alone doing this, this role. So all in all, employee engagement is quite big. And I did ask this in my book from this um, as we say, FYP companies that how important it is that there is a young network in your company. And uh, I would say that over 60% answer that it is important or very important that there is some other function as well than just the job role. And it does not apply only to uh, young people of course, but others as well. But in, in my book I was of course studying these uh, young professionals since I, I have a, um, close connection with them. But there are so, so many benefits. And I would say that in Finland, for example, as my father, um, has said many times, and this is a common quote, that uh, Finland is not a country, it's a country club. So everyone knows each other. Well, not everyone, but you know, you always know someone, uh, who knows someone. So if you have this good experience from an organization and you um, can ask that what is it like to work in this company? It can definitely help or not help in the organist point of view. So I think uh, people are realizing more and more how um, beneficial all this is.

Speaker A: Yeah, indeed. If we move now into the more talking about communication skills and also public speaking. Moving also into public speaking. If you learn communication skills more than, let's say the average, you learn more not only into Presentations, but also how you interact with others, how you connect with other, how you understand other, how you listen to others. So if you are already uh, you gain more knowledge and skills on that, how that can help in building your network. Yeah, just tell us a bit that.

Speaker B: Yes, uh, I think um, one of your guests, uh, in this podcast has already been Andre Nol Shaker.

Speaker A: Oh yes, two times.

Speaker B: Yes. And we had this wonderful, wonderful event a week ago with Andre where we were combining communication skills, storytelling and networking. So there definitely is a strong correlation between these things. And how does the quote go from Maya? Uh, is it Angelou that people, the famous quote that people will remember how you made them feel. And um, this is definitely very important how you can do this via, uh, excellent communication skills and how you can apply them also in networking because networking is quite um, it can be a little bit of sensitive topic because if someone comes to you and say, hey, I want to meet you, can we have a chat? And you feel like, are they going to sell something to me or what do they want or whatever that is, it can be a little like pushing too much. But if you are able to express yourself, to communicate in a way that of course you're clear of your attentions, that hey, I see a business opportunity for example, but you're able to do it in a way that the other one feels very respected and um, they understand what you want and they are telling you how this will help both parties. It has a huge difference than just asking that, hey, I need you and help me sort of like harsh speech. So I see definitely a strong connection between these two.

Speaker A: Yeah, it's true. Um, while we are speaking, I'm thinking of situations. Um, my mind's switching from one situation, past situation and potential situation to another when meeting people. And yeah, it can be like, um, I'm looking for, let's say next, next employer. I can be, I'm um, looking. I'm trying to sell, not trying to sell someone. I'm looking for, let's say funding. So different situation. You, you want to meet people for, for different reasons and you are in the, in the two sides, sometimes there is one that is more active, not someone who, if it's not doing uh, it doesn't understand about connection, about ah, communication will maybe be too salesy, too pushy and the other person will kind of push back. So it's true. I mean for the two sides, if you want to be a bit more passive, more like, okay, let's talk, let's be less active, less active uh, trying to find people, but also open to talk with people or if you want to be on the side, which I have a goal of 150 people I want to talk with and I will go and approach and approach and approach. Yes, it's true. Depending. You need to understand how to connect with people. You mentioned storytelling is also useful how that short story, right? Because you can bore people if you talk like a too long story or too irrelevant. So that's also. Yeah, those are skills. I mean we have talked about storytelling a lot in this podcast, but often into the on the stage. But yeah, sharing a short story in a. When you meet the next person, it's very, very useful.

Speaker B: It is. And I always say that a lot of things are built on trust and authenticity creates trust that you are able to share. Again, not maybe your secrets, but something that feels that you can relate or feels vulnerable or whatever the feeling is with this, like stories and um, not only just based on facts. So you are able to build that trust. And we do quite many decisions based on our intuition and trust. And this is key also in networking. Even though we might not know yet that what do we want or where do we want this to go in the future. But just uh, you remember the feeling that hey, that was a good person. There's something like uh, I could maybe do something and it can come up maybe in two months or two years. You never know. But that's definitely a good way to start somehow to share some ideas or maybe share experiences or anything.

Speaker A: Mhm. Yeah, definitely. Now thinking um, of the ones who are on the stage, like, like a speaker is on the stage giving uh, presentation, a talk. How that, I think how that um, um how the, the fact of being on a stage can help you for, for networking. Have you had experiences like you, you went to a stage and that helped you for networking or vice versa? What experience do you have?

Speaker B: I think it has helped so many times because as we mentioned, um, people will tell that hey, we heard this excellent speaker for example. And hey, you could benefit also from uh, this speaker that book them to your next conference or whatever. So, so this has been a crucial thing for me at least. And I think that one of the best things uh, I have done is that I have been quite um, open about and quite human about the art of uh, networking and it has definitely helped me to receive uh, the feedback which has all taken me so much further both in my career and life in general. And I, I many, many times when I have done a speech, people come to Me after, um, after the presentations and they say that, hey, I learned this and this and I even learn so much from them and they give me a contact that, hey, you should talk to this and this person. Person.

Speaker A: Nice.

Speaker B: And this has been very helpful for me in Finland since networking, uh, as a skill is. Well, everyone knows it, but it's not as maybe common as for example in the US or other countries. For example, we did not have that many books, uh, about network in Finland when I wrote mine. So it has been very, very beneficial that I, uh, get introduced to other people when they find what my interest is, is and what I want to promote. So they might feel that, oh, that is your angle of networking. Well, that sounds great. You should definitely need this and this person. So it does open quite many doors.

Speaker A: Yeah, indeed. Indeed. Yeah. I also had several experiences which. Especially when you. When you give a talk and the, uh, audience is super, super quiet sometimes happens and you. You don't know that. Did anybody like what I said? And then, and then after that you. Yeah. People approach you. I mean that. That's one of the greatest things that can happen to speaker. You, you leave the stage and people approach you and yeah. They tell you they like what you said and. Yeah. And networking starting.

Speaker B: Yes, exactly. And you always notice that you get so many requests after a great speech on LinkedIn that they want to follow more like next. And uh, what else do you have to say? Because the time is always limited and they say that, hey, I want to follow your thoughts. And then they might, after six months they would say that, hey, could you come to our organization to talk about this topic so we could tailor a speech for us directly, for example.

Speaker A: M. Yes, yes, yes. And it's something. Actually I have, um, suggested people who are, yeah. Going up in their careers and the one special who have not, uh, given too many talks, going to events to speak. I recommend exactly doing that. Go to the stage, uh, become a speaker in some event, if you have not started before, that will help you a lot. And that's something I always encourage. It's.

Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.

Speaker A: Laura, uh, could you now share with, uh, us what is your favorite quotation?

Speaker B: My favorite quotation, I have to say the one that is of course in my book as well from Misha, that networking is not about collecting contacts. Networking is about planting relations. I m love this because this is so close to my, my idea of perfect networking that it's not, um, a sprint, it's a marathon, as we say. And it's not for the quick wins, but you do it sort of like give and take perspective that it goes both ways and you never know what is going to happen. Sometimes as in friendships, the other one needs you more and more. Then the tables are turned and um. But there's the mutual respect and trust and um, and understanding of each other. So. So it's definitely about planting relations.

Speaker A: Mhm. Like yeah, exactly. Like, like yeah, planting the seeds. Exactly. Yeah. This very first step. And yeah, the time will come when yeah, you get the benefit or on the other side the other person might be the one who gets the benefit. But uh, yeah, everybody wins. Anyway, could you now recommend us one book that has been particular inspiring, influential for you?

Speaker B: Oh, this is a tough question because there is not only one book, but I have mentioned at least um, one old classic which I would guess that someone else has already mentioned as well. Dale Carnegie's how to Win Friends and Influence People. It's, I think it's written in 1936 so almost 100 years ago. And it's, it's uh, quite um, strong topic that how to Win Friends. But uh, the idea is that they're still very, very valid. And then. Well that's maybe one of the main books that come to mind. But then there are definitely uh, a few books from the US that um. I uh, would say Karen Wicker taking uh, the Work out of Networking, sort of like a guide to introverts. Because I hear especially in Finland many times that I'm an introvert, I cannot network and I say that that's not true.

Speaker A: Nice excuse. No, no excuse.

Speaker B: Exactly. And then there's another. I don't know why they are so um, like controversial these uh, topics. But then there's another one from Devorah's Zach, which is networking for people who hate networking. So I don't know, but it can be. I think the key here is that it can be intimidating and it can be uh, that it feels like uh, it's not for me and it's too much. But if you think it as workplace friendships, then it becomes much more natural and not so tiring all the time.

Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. At least this, this last one quite um. Provocative name and a controversial name for one who hate networking. So yeah, yeah, I think definitely, uh, call the attention.

Speaker B: I know, yeah, true.

Speaker A: Could you now share with us an exercise, something practical that you would recommend us to do it regularly, A uh, routine to shine.

Speaker B: Well, I would say I would go back to this uh, networking and storytelling. I would say that collect stories that usually if you are preparing uh, for A presentation. This goes to myself as well. It might be difficult to remember that what has happened to me and is there anything interesting to share or what is my experience. So either it's in your notebook or it's in your head. But you have this like funny or like good stories that have happened which you can share because they make you so much more human and more relatable. So definitely collecting stories. And I would again mention that follow and listen to other people. Do not copycat them but just think that what do you like about them and is it something that you could maybe learn from to your own presentations or networking? So maybe these two concrete things.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah I think that definitely good. Actually I have usually have recommended um to. To make a list of stories but for. For the talks when you are building your talk. But it's true. Uh, another list of stories for. For bump or socializing for. For networking. Those might be different stories. Right. So it's. It's definitely a good. Definitely a good one. And. And also you mentioned uh. Yeah. Um, take some the good things of people you. You meet. So of course you, you maybe some colleagues, someone you interact, a friend, someone who you interact with regularly and you notice okay this, this person is good because it's uh, you notice that she's least. She's really listening and I should. I could. I could copy this or try this. Uh, so that um. All the language. The language um, or giving um small compliments or. Yeah. Some. Something good that you. You know, some people are doing something good and helping to connect with people. Those, those are things that one can. Yeah try to use them and see how it works. But yeah, as you say, it's a lot of experimentation.

Speaker B: Yes, exactly.

Speaker A: Excellent. Well it's been a pleasure talking with you Laura. So please let us know how people can um. If they want to learn more about you or find you. What are the best ways.

Speaker B: Yes, uh, I can be found from. Easily from LinkedIn of course. Course. And then also on Instagram both uh by my name, Laura Linsberry. So it's L I N D S B E R G And I also have a website in my own name so it's Laura linsberry.com. it is currently unfortunately only in Finnish but this is a good reminder for me to uh, have it in both languages, Finnish and English because I do 50% of my speeches also in English. So that would be a good thing for me as well to translate it.

Speaker A: Excellent. Again it was a pleasure talking with you Laura and all the best.

Speaker B: Thank you. It was a pleasure.

Speaker A: Thank you for joining us today. If you enjoyed this show, do me a favor, go to Apple Podcast or your favorite app and leave us a rate and review. This helps me so more people will find the show. And if you work in the tech industry, please Visit my website, rockthetechstage.com until next time.