325 | She Thought Motherhood Meant Giving Up Her Calling, with Jane Doerman

Speaker A: A warm welcome to Thriving in christ show on YouTube and podcast. I'm Dr. Ioana Popa and I'm so delighted to bring a renewal conversation with an extraordinary woman who's going to share courageously about her journey with Christ on her path, which many times took some twists and turns and nonetheless is bringing her to live the vision that she partnered with God. We're going to talk about the importance of making a decision in our faith and and how fasting can be used to really uncover and get closer to God along with the practice of silence and Today I had the joy of introducing Jane Doberman. She's a writer, speaker, podcaster and creative who is passionate about the power of stories to reveal the God, goodness and glory of God. She holds a degree in Media Communications and Business Management from Asbury University and began her career in broadcasting working for WLWT Channel4.5 and Cumulus Media Cincinnati. Today, Jane works in podcasting and serves as the podcast producer for Raising Godly Girls, a uh, podcast from American Heritage Girls. She also created and produced podcasts from organizations including Women in Marketplace, Polish Network and Forward. And Jane serves on her church's teaching team where she preaches quarterly and previously led Rise Women's Ministry, helping women connect the discipleship and community. She lives in Cincinnati with her husband and their three kids and loves Jesus, storytelling, volleyball, baking and will never turn down a slice of homemade sour cherry pie. And if you're a regular, I want to welcome you back. And if you're new, welcome to Thriving in Christ show for Christian Women, professionals and servant leaders. And this is for you. If you feel at times stressed, depleted on a busy treadmill with Sunday night blues inspired spite of loving what you do, if you sense blocks in reaching your highest potential for the kingdom as you carry significant responsibility and impact. If you wrestle to stay fully replenished and access the peace that surpasses all understanding and long to stay grounded, peaceful, joyful and expansive and present in your vocation and profession and life. No matter what the situation, if this is you welcome. You're not lacking discipline, you're not lacking faith. More often what's missing is sustainable and skill for renewal and grounding in Christ. See, many of the solutions available today act like band aids placed on top of already burdened foundations which are shaped for us by conditionings, chronic stress, past events, cultural conditionings without taking in consideration the needed alignment and wholeness in order to have a sustainable life in Christ. See, I burn out twice, not because of lack of knowledge as I'm in the mental health field or because of lack of faith. And in this show we take a different approach. Through the integration of science, psychology and Christian faith and spirituality. This show helps you to return to a place of inner renewal, to align body, mind, heart and soul to reduce inner fragmentation. Simplify your daily habits from inside out to build sustainable rhythm, access, clarity, peace, joy and ground and presence so that you can expand your capacity and keep leading and serving in Christ God. This is not about doing more. It's about learning how to return skillfully again and again to God within, where your strength is renewed like the eagles and your inner life is restored and your leadership flows from your soul. And as mentioned, I'm Dr. Ioanna Popa. I'm a co founder and CEO of Team for the Soul Institute. I'm a physician, psychiatrist, educator, spiritual care and executive coach, speaker and trainer. And you can find us on the web team for the soul.com and make sure you download Team for the Soul app with free resources for you to help you get closer to God using science, psychology, Christian faith and spiritual care. And you can also find ways to reach out to me there to set up a consultation. And we'll put the link down in the caption as well. All right, are you ready to go towards your highest potential From a grounded, renewed foundation with Christ at the helm, Then let's dive in. A. Ah, warm welcome, Jane, to Thriving in Christ podcast and YouTube show for Christian women professionals and servant leaders. We met must have been in June and I know we connected. I love your sense of humor. That was one thing that we definitely connected around. But just your life and your vocation and what you do, your dedication, it really touched me. So I'm so delighted that you're here. Welcome.

Speaker B: Oh, thanks so much. Ioana was so wonderful to be here. I'm so glad our paths crossed and um, I'm really looking forward to this conversation today.

Speaker A: Yes, thank you so much. And I would love to learn more about your vocation and journey in Christ and how these intermingled and. But let's start with what you're doing now and then we'll unfold the thread.

Speaker B: Okay, perfect. Well, currently I am vocation wise. I'm a podcast producer. I currently work for an organization called American Heritage Girls and it is a scouting, uh, organization, um, that is faith based. It is, you know, really wants to keep God at the center of everything we do. It's focused on girls from ages 5 to 18 and really just building women of integrity through this scouting program. But as part of the umbrella of American Heritage Girls. There's an offshoot, and it's like a parenting arm, if you will. And the parenting arm is the Raising Godly Girls podcast, which is what I'm a part of in the creation of. I work with four wonderful hosts that just are deep wells of knowledge. They, they. They would claim that, hey, we don't have all the answers for parents, but we're here to encourage and equip you to raise godly girls in a challenging cultural climate. Because being a parent myself of a girl and two boys, it is. It is challenging when they come home with all these heavy questions of what they're experiencing out in the world today. And ultimately, we want parents, our audience, really, to know is that they're not alone in it. And maybe we can put our heads together and encourage each other along the way. So it's really fun. I get to interact and book guests. I edit episodes. I help craft and cultivate these stories. And it's just really deeply at the heart of what I love doing is just connecting each other to each other's stories. So

Speaker A: is

Speaker B: what I'm doing right now.

Speaker A: Wow. So connecting people together through the stories. And I love what you said about growing girls with integrity. Right. If you're listening and you're a parent. Right. Isn't that, I mean, for boys as well? But that's something so important that we want our kids to grow with values and that sense of integrity, and you get to be part of that organizations and help with the podcast. Wow. Congratulations. That's exciting.

Speaker B: Thank you. It was definitely. I'll be honest, it wasn't on my radar when the opportunity came up. But, uh, God has been so good through this whole experience of not only building my own resume, but he's really immersed me in this community that I never thought I would be a part of. Like, from, like, my first week on the job, like, the 30th anniversary of the organization. It's been around for a long time, and I just, uh. While my boss was like, hey, we can't pay you to come to certain events, but this is a time where everybody, because we are a team of 60 plus people across the United States. Oh,

Speaker A: wow.

Speaker B: Headquarters are here in Cincinnati, Ohio. We have troops in all 50 states. We have, you know, and these women are so dedicated that are on the team. And so I just had this opportunity not only to be immersed by the whole remote team my first week on the job, but also going to the conference. I got the opportunity to be a part of a live podcast interview with one of the speakers. And even through that, seeing the girls that are involved, like the young girls, the, these are the people that were reaching, you know, and, and I even got a chance to do some like woman on the street interviews with them. And I would say, you know, what do you love most about ahg? That's the shorthand for American Heritage Girls. What have you learned? And just it really humbled me to see like this is who we're serving, you know, not just them, um, you know, I, I guess our audience is mostly through raising godly girls, the parent, but, but also seeing that trickle down to the girls and like how that relationship is being formed as well through our work. And I don't know, it was just a really cool, humbling experience and it continues to teach me to this day. So.

Speaker A: Wow, so beautiful. So just immerse in going to that conference right at the beginning and seeing it. Right. And that seems to me that just ignite that synchronicity of the mission. Right? Something shifted for you.

Speaker B: Yeah, it did. Because honestly Iwana, so prior to the work that I'm doing now, my background is in media communications, um, and broadcasting. So I caught hold of this dream back in 2006 when I interned at a radio station in Alaska. And I mean we were on air, we were behind the scenes doing prep know it was a multi formatted station that reached a specific group of people because this radio station not only was for entertainment, it was also a source of two way communication for a lot of the people in the villages nearby. And I spent a whole summer there. And I just remember near the end of my time there, I felt God say to me, this is the work we're going to do together, but we're going to do it together. You know, it's not just going to be all on you. So I left that. I graduate college, a couple years later I get a job in radio broadcasting here locally in Cincinnati. And this dream, I thought this is it, this is like I'm going for it. This is what God was talking about. Two years. It only took two years, Iwana, for this dream to kind of get stomped out. It became such a toxic work environment. There was expectations of me to be always, you know, accessible, like even outside of work hours. There was no balance, there was no margin, no boundaries. And if I did not align with that, I kind of was. I uh, was reprimanded quite a bit and I kind of walked into each day where I didn't know who or what I was going to be interacting with and it almost always like a pretty negative experience. And some things just kind of tore me down. And I would say God delivered me from that role. And a little while later my husband and I decided to start a family. So I thought, okay, work just didn't pan out. Maybe that's, maybe I got it wrong. Maybe I got the message wrong. Maybe it's parenting that I'm just going to throw all my eggs in that basket. So we had our first kid and it after six months, Ioana, six months, I got bored. I was so bored because I love my children, but all he does is cry and eat in dirty his diaper. And I would spend my, you know, moments of peace while he was napping watching television. And I just remember sitting there being like, this can't be it, like just it like, you know,

Speaker A: uh,

Speaker B: what's going on here? And so through that season, it was eight years I was full time stay at home. I really was wrestling with this lie that I truly thought I believed at the heart of it. I can't be a mom and have a career at the same time. And that was in that season. God brought someone into my life who was a coach who had me write that lie down and say it out loud. And she kind of walked me through like, is this true? And I was like, I know probably the right answer here is no, it's not true. And also I don't know if I believe that. And so like God had to do some working within me. And it was in the season where God opened a door to enter the workplace again. It wasn't a role in broadcasting, it was a role, uh, to connect with local churches for a women, a Faith at Work for women organization. Because I had a lot of connections with people in the church, faith

Speaker A: and work. And here was your dream. Faith and work and family.

Speaker B: Exactly. And family. And so that was a season. Like it was 20, 21. I had a one year old on my lap on a zoom call with a friend that I thought was just a zoom call. And little did we know Katherine Steiner was another person that I was being introduced to. And they both said, we want you to come work for us. Would you consider working for us? And I'm like, so that was like God opening the door, me gradually stepping in. Catherine became quite a mentor for me through the whole season because resumes had changed and I needed to update that and uh, I needed to learn how to be a part of a team where I was used to, I don't know, doing my own thing for Eight years,

Speaker A: uh,

Speaker B: and feeling safe enough to share new dreams that I. That I had for that organization, which led to podcasting. And then that. That podcast I hosted, I wrote, I edited all on my own, which led to a merger with this organization, with Polish Network. And so they were looking for a podcast host. And so I stepped into that role. And then that role, uh, I was their podcast host, and again wrote, edited, did all the things for the podcast. That was my job. And then we merged again with Forward. And while my role changed with that merger significantly, that was probably a season where I felt like God had something new on the horizon for me. And as they say, yada, yada, yada. I here at American Heritage Girls,

Speaker A: in

Speaker B: a season where it feels like a full circle season, where I am doing a lot of similar work that I was doing at the radio station, I worked right outside of college. That was a toxic. And I feel like God is in, like, this redemptive season of, like, remember when we used to do this and it was really hard, and now you're part of a team that's safe. And, like,

Speaker A: I'm

Speaker B: not the only one doing. Working on the podcast. I'm with a team of other women who are passionate about the content and what we put out there. I don't know, Ioanna. It's just been so interesting to see God work that out. God has really poignantly pointed out to me in these last five years of stepping back into the work that he planted that seed of a dream within me that I am limited, and I need to be comfortable with that because he's unlimited. He's an unlimited resource. Um, and he has showed up in ways, gosh, where I'm, like, praying, like, maybe I can't book a guest for this particular slot on our calendar. And I'm like, okay, I have sent out 12 invitations to various different gifts. Nobody's responded. Or the ones who have are like, sorry, we're not available. And I'm like, hey, God, literally, I do this a lot. I'm like, k, God. I have reached out to everybody I have known I could reach out to. Who do you want? Who? Obviously, I'm not getting the memo. Who do you want us to talk to for this particular topic? In, like, within 24 hours, somebody pops up or a, ah, name pops up,

Speaker A: and all of

Speaker B: a sudden it's like, he's like, yep, this is. This is who I wanted. Or somebody who felt so inaccessible becomes accessible. Or, like, it's

Speaker A: like,

Speaker B: I don't know. My bosses continually joke and say, I think Jane could get Jesus to be on our podcast because she's just not afraid to ask anybody.

Speaker A: And I go,

Speaker B: yeah, maybe.

Speaker A: That's amazing.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So beautiful.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah. Thank you for sharing that and that sense of God. I love what you said. God is there even in our limitations,

Speaker B: and

Speaker A: he will flex with us like snows. We are limited and imperfect. It's okay sometimes, as you're listening, it's okay sometimes to put something on the shelf, like, okay, it's impossible. Like, let's not try to put everything to go into one pipe because we're limited time into limited energy. So thank you for sharing that. I just love so much your. Your journey and how now you're doing, like, okay, God. Yeah. Living the dream that God planted in you.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. He's been so good, and he continues to show up as good even when I have those questions of, like,

Speaker A: are you

Speaker B: even in this, God? Because it's so easy for us to go there. Um,

Speaker A: yes,

Speaker B: as we navigate that journey, so.

Speaker A: Right. And did you always have a relationship with. With Christ all along? Was it smooth? Was it bumpy? What is it? For me, it was hiatus, hiatus, hiatus, hiatus, and then boom.

Speaker B: Oh, wow.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah,

Speaker B: yeah. Okay. Well, I like to say that the church and Jesus was always in the DNA of our family. Um, my. I grew up going to church. It was very much a part of our family calendar. I grew up in the Baptist tradition. Honestly, back then, when I was younger, I don't think I thought too much about it. I was just like, we go to church. We went to church Sundays. We went Sunday nights, sometimes Wednesday nights. There was always a youth program. My mom was always invested in the women's Bible studies and the women's ministry. That was always happening. So we were just always there. I accepted Jesus into my heart, became a follower of Jesus at the age of five. I would say, you know, I have a very distinct memory of sitting on my mom's lap and praying with her together, because I just. My mom said in her words, like, you got it. Like, I asked you questions because you were like, I want to. I want to be saved and I want to get baptized and things. And my mom was like, she's five. Does she really understand what she's asking?

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: You know, and so, uh. And so she asked questions. My dad asked questions. I met with the pastor at our church, you know, and he asked me questions. And while it was a very much a childlike faith, uh, from the beginning, God has grown me over the years, and I Would even say, I think ownership of that faith didn't happen until my college years. Now I went to Asbury University. Some people may hear that and be like, oh, Asbury is in the one that had the huge revival a couple years ago. Like, God entered Hughes Auditorium, um, and like, poured out his spirit upon the people who came there. And, like, it brought thousands of people to this small little town outside of Lexington, Kentucky to experience it. That being said, I went through a really hard season the first couple years of my college experience there because, uh, I was. My identity was wrapped up in other things that were not

Speaker A: Jesus. And

Speaker B: I think the biggest thing for me at that time in my life were relationships. Whether it was friendships, whether it was romantic relationships. Like,

Speaker A: I'm

Speaker B: like, I got. This is. This is the place to, like, meet people and figure out who I am. And I also had this moment because I thought, I'm going to a Christian college, right? So I'm going to be around people who think like me, who, you know, we have the same baseline, right? So of course we're going to all agree with each other. And then I take these Bible classes with other people from different traditions. They grew, they grew up in. And I looked at them like, are, ah, we reading the same thing? How did you. How did you land there? You know? And it was this beautiful experience where I got exposed to just different traditions of the faith, different ideas. And it really caused me to wrestle with, like, okay, what does it mean to really be a follower of Jesus? And how do I reckon where this person lands differently here with their faith and I land here? But we have Jesus in common. So that's really the greatest denominator of it all. And through that whole experience, I went through a season. This actually happened right before I went to Alaska. I had the season where, like, God just stripped away almost every relationship that I had. Like, whether it was like, friends that I used to hang out with kind of fell away or they started ghosting me. A guy I was dating definitely ghosted me. And it was just very disorienting. I was very angry. I thought, God, I'm doing all these things. I'm growing, I'm learning, I'm following you. What gives, right? And he brought me to this space, I don't know, Hughes Auditorium. That's where we would have chapel at Asbury. It was a very special place. And we had like a mini revival. Not to the extent of what happened a couple years ago, but it was. It really shook the students on that campus where we felt his Outpouring and that he was there. And, like, the worship service lasted longer than what it was supposed to. And I remember meeting Jesus there at the altar being like, okay, I surrendered all this to you. Like, what it means to follow you is to just let go and release and trust you. And I'm choosing to do that

Speaker A: today.

Speaker B: And so that was like a restoration moment, if you will, in my story with him. And like, from that point, I. When I come up against wilderness moments where I question God, are you here in this with me? I have that moment I look back to quite often to be like, I was with you in this restoration moment, and I'm with you now. So it's. It's been this lifelong journey with Jesus. Like, he's always been in the picture. I think I took ownership more of it when I was in college and was challenged by other people's beliefs and

Speaker A: even

Speaker B: into midlife adulthood and parenting. Now, I'm not going to say everything's been hunky dory. Like, we've faced. We have faced several challenges over the years where I've come back to that question, God, where are you? Are, ah, you even here with me in this?

Speaker A: And

Speaker B: he is.

Speaker A: He

Speaker B: shows up and he is good

Speaker A: m.

Speaker B: As I wrestle with my understanding of his character in those moments. So that's been my journey with Jesus so far. And still. Still going

Speaker A: well. Thank you so much for sharing that. That's such a beautiful witnessing. And if you're listening, there's. There's so much. So you might want to rewind this, but because there's so many elements to this. But from, uh, if I want to point out something which is so essential in our faith for you as a listener, our faith is not. And I encountered this a lot with the, uh, people that I coach. It's not a feeling, it's not a thought. And sometimes things around can. Can feel quite chaotic.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: Where are you, God? But what's interesting, what started you on that journey is, Jane, is the decision you made.

Speaker B: Yeah,

Speaker A: you made a decision, and that is grounding because once you make it, we make a decision

Speaker B: that

Speaker A: doesn't matter what happens. And many times people say, well, I don't feel God like you shared. I had experiences like that. God, where are you?

Speaker B: But

Speaker A: it's not a feeling, is not a sense of, oh, I'm, um. Sometimes where it feels a bit of a dry spell.

Speaker B: Yes,

Speaker A: God is. Is in the midst, and it starts with our decision. So psychologically this is important because it just brings that framework, that stability in Our inner sanctuary. And isn't that faith is a, uh, evidence of things not seen? What is it?

Speaker B: Evidence of things unseen and assurance of things hoped for

Speaker A: or things hoped for. Thank you so much.

Speaker B: So

Speaker A: that Bible verse, right, that. I Bet it's Romans 11:1. I have that on the wall because we sometimes need to walk on water. I can't imagine Peter. Right?

Speaker B: I can't either. I think about that story all the time.

Speaker A: Yes. And that's the message. Keep our eye on Jesus and start with that decision because that's at the foundation.

Speaker B: That's so good.

Speaker A: Thank you for sharing that. That um, so powerful. And I love how you bring it on all the time. And also psychologically this makes sense because you know, we have what's called state dependent memory. So when we are in a state and we can bring that particular positive state, more state, more positivity will come in. So that closeness with God, you're grounded in it, it's going to bring that grounding and also more memories of the ground, make it more vivid. This is

Speaker B: why

Speaker A: people, when they go through trauma, they have the flashbulb memories, the negative.

Speaker B: Interesting.

Speaker A: And then if they're into a negative memory, all of a sudden there's other negative memories and we spiral it down. But opposite is true and people don't always tap into that. And I'm so excited to see how fruitful has been, how much fruit has been brought into your life through this.

Speaker B: Mhm. Yeah, it's definitely a grounding value, my faith. Um, and it's funny because sometimes I can be flippant and be like, well, everybody has that right. And a lot of people are like, actually, you know, it's kind of like what comes easy to you may not come easy to someone else. And so I do see that as a gift. And

Speaker A: yes,

Speaker B: I don't know a grounding value that I have in my work to consider. What would someone need to hear in here to uh, receive that grounding as well?

Speaker A: And I love that you made the decision to choose Christ first and, and let go. So thank you for that gift.

Speaker B: Absolutely, absolutely. I'm happy to.

Speaker A: And through the ups and downs of life, which happens to all of us, what has brought you to stay grounded and kind of align body, mind, heart and soul? Right. Any, any uh, two or three practices that you use, that you find them super grounding, that the listener might be inspired?

Speaker B: Yeah, well, as far as like practices go, I am learning the practice of solitude. And just like community is important, I would say at the heart of the work That I do. It's building community and let's not be isolated and be in our silos. But how can we come together, encourage one another? But I also recognize, uh, and especially this is where it's challenging for me because I am an extrovert. I love people and I get energized by being around people. And I've also learned the beauty of solitude. And I would even say too paired with that fasting, which is a new practice. I wouldn't say I do it regularly, but it has been one I've been dabbling in a lot. So in this current season, um, I was, I'm in a small group with some women and we were navigating this practice of fasting together. And what was interesting was it was very uncomfortable, let's just put it that way, of uh, of just talking about it and being like, well, does God really meet us when we fast or do I need to fast? You know, we were coming up with excuses because it's just an uncomfortable practice. Right. Um, and

Speaker A: yeah, let's just say it, it is an uncomfortable.

Speaker B: It is, it is. And I, that was. I, I kept saying I need someone to give me a compelling argument as to why I should do this because I keep hearing this and this keeps coming up. And so I read a book that was recommended. I can't remember the title of it, but it was this little book. And I read through it, it was very compelling. You know, talking about how like true fasting is fasting from food and it's initiated by God. And, and we sometimes use things like food to cover up these like uncomfortable feelings. And if we just release that, you know, and don't like go all in, do a three week fast or something like all in, but start small. You know, all the things that I heard before. But what was really compelling is my friend who led the small group, she invited us. What if we did this together? We, you know, they talk about in the Bible and we talk about a lot like, you know, don't tell people you're fasting. And this is not something you boast about. But what if we did it together and like we're accountable to one another and we

Speaker A: uh,

Speaker B: use this fasting as maybe for this person it's 24 hours, but maybe for someone it's skipping lunch or breakfast, you know, like just like test it out and I'll tell you what I want. It was a transformative experience, especially paired with solitude because I do a lot of remote work. So I'm. While I'm A part of a team and I'm part of team meetings and that's great. I do spend a lot of time alone, especially when my kids are in school all day. And so Wednesdays was the day our group agreed to do and it was so interesting. Uh, for me personally I chose to do. It was pretty much a 24 hour fast. Like I stopped the, uh, after dinner the night before. I didn't eat until dinner the next day. And there is something about not eating all day, doing it in community, you know, because we had this text thread and we were honest on that text. We're like, I'm really hungry or this happened and I'm really aggravated and things are stirring up in me and it gave me moments and permission to pause and reflect as to like, oh, where's this negativity coming from? What's that stemming from? And I just felt like the Holy Spirit was just so sweet to me and that's that those moments where I felt like I had to do all these things on my to do list that day and then I felt invited to go take a walk with the Holy Spirit in the park. And I chose that. And it was just such a time of renewal and strength. Um, I am an achiever at heart and so I love checking things off my to do list. I love seeing my calendar full. Like there's no white space on it. I, I got things to do and we're, we're going for it. And I think one of the things Holy Spirit has been teaching me in this season as I'm in this new job and navigating this new work and building these new things with God. And also I do believe that there might be something else on the horizon, but I just don't see it yet. And that's kind of frustrating for me personally because I like to know where I'm going. But God's kind of in this season of do you trust me? And so fasting has been a part of that. And it just drew me closer to him in ways that I, I just couldn't explain it. It um, unlocked some things that just felt kind bound up together that I just felt like I couldn't crack and I was frustrated by it. And like this process of fasting helped me release that. But also solitude. Like I am a mom in the thick of it right now with kids ranging from ages 13 to 6 and they got needs and I got needs and are just. Our life is really loud. And so I find myself longing for finding those spaces in my day where I Can go up to my bedroom and just kind of sit on my bed and just kind of sit with God. And sometimes he talks to me. Sometimes it's just this peaceful moment of just like let me just soak in everything you're trying to teach me today. And I don't know, I think he's teaching me also that he just how he shows up in our everyday, ordinary lives. And it's beautiful. So,

Speaker A: um.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing. And I think there's something so beautiful about the way you. I love the journey. Right. Even a fast. And uh, what uncovered what can uncover for us. Right. The emotions, the habits, when are we reaching out for food. And the way you, you took with and almost like there's as you said, there's that opening. There's all of a sudden a new territory and allow for a different way of being.

Speaker B: And

Speaker A: so much appreciate the uh, finding that practice of solitude sprinkled throughout the day. I mean it doesn't have to be like an meditation.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: Just five minutes. I love it. Let's go in the bedroom or if you're super busy, might be in the bathroom, you know.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yes.

Speaker A: Close the door and you're done at work or at home.

Speaker B: Exactly. Um,

Speaker A: but I think that's just so encouraging. Right. And it's so nourishing. So thank you for the encouragement. If you're listening, I hope you can find more pockets of renewal this way throughout the day. And yeah, consider fasting is so interesting. And Jane, you and I, it's becoming apparent we can talk. I, uh, think we can talk for another hour and we'll uncover so many more things. But before we wrap up and I want to hear your Bible verse. Was there anything else that you wanted to share to make this complete?

Speaker B: I guess before we get to the Bible verse, my encouragement is if you're walking through a hard season or a season where there's just uncertainty, some would call it like a wilderness season, if you will keep showing up. He just keeps showing up because God is present and always at work. Even when he doesn't feel like he is. He is. And my encouragement would be just keep showing up and see what he has for you today. So that would be my final little nugget of wisdom, I guess.

Speaker A: Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. Keep showing up. No matter what happens, keep showing up. God has you. Thank you for that. Thank you.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. So, um.

Speaker A: Yeah. What's your Bible verse?

Speaker B: My Bible verse. This one I came across in high school and is one I've been I've clung to all my life. Um, it's found in second Timothy, chapter one, verse seven, where it says, for God has not given us a spirit of fear and timidity, but of power, love and self discipline. And that verse I sit with almost daily because I think I've had a lot of growth over the years. But back then I was pretty timid. I was pretty lacking in self esteem and questioning my abilities or whether God really had good things for me. And I think every time when I am faced with fear, I'm reminded time and time and again that God is near. And he did not give you a spirit of fear. He actually gave you a spirit that is powerful, that is of love and that is of a sound mind or self discipline. And I often come back to that

Speaker A: because

Speaker B: I think my default is to spiral and to question. And, uh, when I really get out of whack and feel like I'm lacking control, God's like, nope, that's not for you to control. It's for you to surrender and release and to trust in me. But this is what I have given you. So that is. That is the verse.

Speaker A: That's so beautiful. Do not have the spirit of fear, but of power, love and self control.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: So lovely. Beautiful. Well, thank you so much for sharing. Definitely. I want to have you back.

Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker A: And let's, uh, wrap up with a prayer.

Speaker B: Okay. Uh,

Speaker A: yeah. To just lift up your work, your listeners and. Yeah. Would you like to start?

Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. I would be honored. So, Heavenly Father, we just come before you right now with just open hands and open hearts. We are so grateful for who you are and for how much you love us that you don't leave us to be in the dark, but you brought light to our lives. Father, I thank you for Iwana and this podcast and just the work that you've anointed her to do, Father, that you would continue to work through her and inspire others to be renewed by your strength, Father. And to lean on you and depend on you. Father, I'm also grateful that you've chosen all of us, not just Iwana and I, but those who are listening today or watching today. You've chosen to partner with them in the work that they have to do, whether it's a paid job, whether it's a unpaid job. Um, you have work for all of us and you desire to partner with us. And I just ask that you would continue to refine us and that you would teach us what it means to truly surrender our lives to you. Father.

Speaker A: Thank You God, thank you for this time. Thank you for Jane. We lift her up and everything that she is doing in her family, in her workplace and podcasting and spreading your goodness, your love, your power and a sense of your presence in stillness, in action, whatever is happening. And we also lift up the listener. Uh, may you bless her abundantly. Lift her up and her family and her work and every. Everything she's dreaming for and is moving be. Help her to be constantly encouraged that you are there for her no matter what happens. It might be a difficult season or a very smooth, easygoing season. No matter what the season. May you keep her encouraged and continue as, uh, Jane said, partnering. Help us to be aware of that partnership, that co creation with you and come closer to you as you come closer to us always. You're right there for us. Thank you God for that. In Jesus name, amen.

Speaker B: Amen.

Speaker A: Thank you so much, Jane. I so appreciate connecting with you again and uh, thank you for sharing of your life and I so appreciate your. I would have not thought that you were shy early on as you shared and it's just that sense of co creation and partnering with God. Right. That's just right there present. So thank you for your wisdom. Thank you for your courage and authenticity and sharing those, um, beautiful moments with God and on your journey. So thank you.

Speaker B: Oh, uh, my pleasure. And thank you for hosting this conversation. It's been great.

Speaker A: Thank you. Thank you so much, Jane, for the breath of wisdom and for your courage and authenticity. I love so much the way you're showing up and keep on going with Christ of the helm and in your heart. And, and thank you. As a listener, I don't take your attention for granted. You're awesome. You are more precious than the rubies and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. And I wish you to have a wonderful rest of the week and month and year. And to reach out to Jane, we'll put the links in the show notes and to reach out to us, uh, remember teamforthesoul.com this is our website and make sure you download Team for the Soul app where you get free resources. And you can also reach out to me there. You'll find out more about our programs inside. And when you're ready to set up a one to one consultation with me to see if executive coaching or spiritual care, life coaching is what you need right now, feel free to set up an appointment. Also, if you are moving through a season of grief and you want to set up a grief consultation consultation, make sure you do that. And as mentioned at the beginning and in the episode, I'm in a season of moving through, bringing the curriculum that I've developed into organizations to help regenerate, to help activate our levers of inner freedom in Christ, using psychology, science, Christian faith and spiritual care. As many times when we are highly performing, the renewal might be missing, it might be gap in regeneration, and our reserves can be diminished. So I'm on a mission to support you and the people that you know and love in a way to stay grounded in Christ. And because of this, we're switching to the monthly episodes right now for this season. And we'll continue showing up on YouTube and podcast in this new rhythm. And if you have any questions, remember to reach out to us. There's a form on the website. And with that, thank you for all you do. God bless you, and we'll connect next time.