#325 - Jeff Crane | How To Develop A Winning Mindset

Speaker A: I believe that every small business owner has an ego. They don't go. Even Jordan Peterson has an ego. You have to have an ego. So you have to understand that when somebody comes up to you, and we've talked about this at least when people are sitting here in these chairs, like, why do people sit here? It's part of the ego. People get in businesses all the time because of ego. Because somebody told them that they were great. Their mother, their father, their bishop, their teacher, their brother, their uncle, their brother in law.

Speaker B: Yeah. Ah.

Speaker A: And they're like. And they believed them.

Speaker B: I learned that lesson from this podcast, which is you're not paid for how hard you work or what. You know, you're paid for your value, the value that you bring to society and the value of your skills. All right, Jeff Crane. We've probably been talking an hour before this.

Speaker A: At least. We should have been recording this whole time. It was awesome, dude.

Speaker B: Yeah, I love that. Um, but let's, uh. You were just talking to me about, um, starting a business. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Starting a business.

Speaker A: But I want to just say. Can I just say one thing? It's getting near Christmas. It might date this podcast or whatever, and I feel like this is a Christmas gift. I want to be on this podcast for months.

Speaker B: You're great, man. And then the other day you're on

Speaker A: Facebook, like, who'd like to be on a podcast? I'm like, bro, I've got to go in.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: Thanks for the invite, dude.

Speaker B: I love you being here, man.

Speaker A: Thank you. I've had such a great conversation with you. And we know a lot of same people.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And you know a lot more people than. I'm like, I don't even know half the people you know. You know a lot of people.

Speaker B: We just connect, man. We just get together. And, uh, Utah's really tight knit, so you just get a different side of the. The Valley, man, every time you. Every time you go out to one of these events or whatever. But you know that.

Speaker A: Uh, I do.

Speaker B: Yeah. You know that. But tell me. So you were breaking this down.

Speaker A: I was.

Speaker B: And then. And then I was like, nah, this is what we gotta record.

Speaker A: Okay. So I started off with my hand here with. In business, there's five phases of business, right? Idea development, startup growth, exit. And most people start with the idea. Yeah, I start with the exit. And so what I was talking about was, I, uh, call it the Pulp Fiction kind of theory. In Pulp Fiction, you had John Travolta and Samuel Jackson, and they're. They're in the diner and they're. Yeah, they're the OGs. And then across, you had the guy and the gal that were the real. They were the gangsters are trying to rob the place. Remember that?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So they stood up and like, everybody come here.

Speaker B: Right? Yeah.

Speaker A: And those guys, they didn't. They didn't. They didn't flinch. They didn't do a thing. They just kind of sat there and I think one of them handed the wallet to him or whatever the case is. And. But the theory was. The theory is that because I'm from la, is that you always put your back to the wall and you watch the door. Yeah, Right.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Uh, you know what the entrance is and you know what the exit is, Right. If you're original gangster, if you're really og, put your back to the wall and you look at the door and so many small business people, uh, excuse me, they put their back to the door and not back to the wall.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: So what we were talking about is some ideas for podcast and my book company and some of these other things that we're doing. And anything I do and choose to do is I always look at the, like, um, what is it, Stephen Covey End in mind.

Speaker B: Yeah. Right.

Speaker A: And go, if I do this thing, where am I going to end up? In so many businesses I've never started, because I went through that process in my mind, and when I got to the end of that business, I'm like, oh, uh, man, there's no exit to this thing.

Speaker B: Yeah. Ah, right.

Speaker A: So everything I do has to have an exit. I have to be able to drop the keys off to somebody and they get to drive that business away or I don't do that business.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's, uh. I mean, every time I get on these podcasts and. And people drop gems like that, it. We were talking about this before, but it's almost like anticlimactic.

Speaker A: Right?

Speaker B: You're like, that. Was it like that? Yeah. Obviously you would start with the end in mind. Right. But so many people, I think it's the allure and the excitement of a business. You're like, I just got to get going. Right. Like, this is cool. You don't take a minute to be like, all right, how's this going to end? If it gets to the point, where

Speaker A: does the excitement come from, bro? Where do you think the excitement of starting a business comes from?

Speaker B: I was talking about this was, uh, someone the other day. It's that human nature in us. Like, it's just that creativity like, we've gotta create something. And I was talking about that on one of the interviews. Like, even when you got some of these guys who just sit around and play video games all day, they're fulfilling that purpose in some fashion of like progressing and moving and like something new. Like, even though it's a video game and you probably shouldn't sit down and play video games all day, um, you're still kind of. That's why it's so addicting, is because you're still fulfilling that creativity bug in. You know what I mean?

Speaker A: Ah.

Speaker B: And so it can be the death of you or it can be very helpful, depending on what you're doing.

Speaker A: It's really funny. Um, it's funny you should say the death of you because I believe that every small business owner has an ego. They don't go. Even Jordan Peterson has an ego. You have to have an ego. And so what happens is, so roll with me on this. You go to a barbecue and let's say you're the brother in law. So you're a successful real estate agent. Uh, and then your other. So your brother in law, so you're, you're married to this guy's wife and your brother in law, her brother is making like ribs and he's doing really, he's like amazing at these ribs. We've heard it time and again.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And you walk up to the guy, he's a brown and the guy's a plumber.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: He does pretty well for himself. But you're like, bro, dude, you gotta do ribs. Like, these are amazing.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Why don't you go do these things? Here's the trick. You have the ego. You are giving him these really great ideas and you're getting him all pumped up and stuff. Like you get to go home and your Mercedes Benz and he's gonna go back in the house, he's go, sweetheart, I'm start making.

Speaker B: They're trying to figure out how to

Speaker A: make ribs and he's gonna fail because it's a plumber. It's a trick. It's a full on trick, man.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Now every once in a while, the rip guy makes it. He does. But if you go to the grocery store right now, I have a buddy who has a hot sauce or a barbecue sauce. Look at how many barbecue sauces are on the shelf.

Speaker B: Oh, there's a million.

Speaker A: And there's another million that never made that shelf.

Speaker B: It was because it's so hard to get in.

Speaker A: It's so hard to get in that business. So you have to understand that when somebody comes up to you, and we've talked about this at least when people are sitting here in these chairs, like, why do people sit here? It's part of the ego. M. When somebody comes up to you and they come up to me and go, dude, you're the greatest. Kind of. Just look at him. Like, uh-huh.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Yeah, Okay, I hear you. Yeah. Why are you stroking me? Right?

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, totally, totally.

Speaker A: So it's ego driven. People get in businesses all the time because of ego. Because somebody told them that they were great. Their mother, their father, their bishop, their teacher, their brother, their uncle, their brother in law.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And they're like. And they believed them.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Right. But if they were smart, the guy's like, look, bro, I know you're driving a Mercedes Benz, but in five years I'll own you. Because I'm a plumber.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And plumbers make way more money than tech executives if they do it right.

Speaker B: That's true. All day. Yeah.

Speaker A: Electricians, plumbers, mechanics. Dude, I got a guy around the corner, owns a multimillion dollar house and he, uh, fixes car. Like, you get. You get your car damaged. He paints it up and gets it

Speaker B: all ready to go into body shop. Yeah.

Speaker A: He crushes it.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You know what I mean?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: But everybody wants to do a podcast. Everybody wants to make a movie. Everybody wants to be a movie star. Everybody wants to be on TikTok.

Speaker B: Yeah. Right. So anyway, well, and what's funny is, like, uh, I learned that lesson from this podcast, which is you're not paid for how hard you work or what. You know, you're paid for the value that you bring to society, uh, and the value of your skills. Right. So, like, that's why not everybody can go run, uh, SpaceX like Elon Musk. Because, I mean, like, because you're like, well, he's a billionaire. And it's like, yeah, but could a plumber go run SpaceX, the boring company, Tesla and Neuralink at the same time? Probably not.

Speaker A: And could and must. Probably could. But could Musk fix his toilet? Well, he could, but he makes a billion dollars an hour, so he's going to call a plumber.

Speaker B: Right, Right. And vice versa with the plumber. Like, it's like the plumber. There's nothing wrong with being a plumber. Like, why would you want to go own Tesla when you can be a master plumber and. And make 200 grand a year or 150 grand a year whenever you're making. Right.

Speaker A: Precisely.

Speaker B: And you know, it's it's those goals. But, yeah, I. People just get. They do. They get caught up. And that's why, I don't know, this book's been played out. But I read it before it was cool, uh, before it got all over on TikTok. But that's why, uh, I love the 48 laws of power by Robert Greene. I think it's like, everybody kind of overhypes that book a little bit. Like, it's really. I've heard some people go, like, it's really dangerous or whatever. And I'm just like, no. If you break it down. One of the things that I think saved my career came from that book, and that was the higher up you go in the hierarchy of a company, the more insecure people are.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So the more careful that you have to be sure. It's because of the ego.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Right. Like, I remember totally failing with this CEO one time, and then I read that book and I was like, holy shit. That's exactly what happened. It's like, almost exactly what happened.

Speaker A: Like, well, there's something you just talked about that most people don't have, and that's being self aware, too. Like, you actually step back and go, oh, crap. So I've got a riddle to tell you you've never heard probably before. You ready for this? And we're going to work through this little riddle. It's pretty cool. And I think I invented it. You know how sometimes you read things and you're like, this is mine. Yeah, I think I invented it. Maybe I read it.

Speaker B: Okay. All right.

Speaker A: So there's a river, and it's too wide for you to broad jump. You're at the edge of the river.

Speaker B: Okay. It's too hard for you to jump

Speaker A: over, and you have to get to the other side.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: You can't touch the water. There's no trees. You can't swim. There's no rocks. You have to jump over the river. If you land in the water, you die. How do you get across the river? I don't know. It's a tough one.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Most people will sit there for hours if I make them to figure out, and they will. Like, honestly, you can tell a character of a person because they're like, well, can I fly? Can like, I zap my fingers? Like, they try to trick it.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: But so here's a, uh, little hint. What's counterintuitive? Because you have to go forward. What's counterintuitive? Going forward.

Speaker B: Backwards.

Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, you back up. You back up. And then what do you do next? You run.

Speaker B: Run. Yeah.

Speaker A: Most people will stay at the edge of that river for their entire life trying to trick themselves to get to the other side. But what you have to do, because you did this.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Is you backed up. And when you back up, Alan Watts talks about this.

Speaker B: Oh, I love.

Speaker A: You can either look at the star or you can look at the galaxy. You can't look at both. So when you look at the galaxy, you get perspective. You back up, you get two things.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You get perspective because now you know how far you have to back up, and then you gain momentum. You have to back up to go forward.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You have to back. And most marriages fail, and most businesses fail, and most friendships fail because they're not willing to back up a little bit. Now, I've told this riddle for so many years, and I had it half right, and one day I'm like, oh, my gosh, I'm telling this riddle wrong. The river is the jerk off boss. The river is traffic. The river is your ego. To think that you're only going to have one river in your life is the stupidest thing on the planet.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So once you get to the other side, what do you do? You don't stop. You keep going.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And the only. And we do this all the time. And this came up when I was talking about how people get jobs. You go to. Used to go to college, get your resume, you do your internship, you show up, you're like, you show up on time, and then all of a sudden you get the job. And then what happens? You start sloughing? No, dude, you got to keep that momentum.

Speaker B: Yeah, what's that? Uh, there's two quotes that I like to live by that I actually teach my kids. Uh, and they have to memorize them. But the first one is that old Haitian proverb that beyond the mountain is another mountain. And then the other one is, uh, from the Buddha, which is, before enlightenment, chop would carry water. After enlightenment, chop would carry water.

Speaker A: Precisely.

Speaker B: Yeah. Like, what'd you think was gonna happen? Uh, and I think, um, there's a lot of religious implications with that that I like to go into, but I think the implication there with business is, is, dude, like, you know, everybody wants to be the boss, you know, sipping Mai Tai in Tahiti. Right. But, like.

Speaker A: And what they don't realize is the boss is on their fourth marriage, that they were there 20 hours a day, and what they had to give up

Speaker B: and that Mai Tai is in between your 20 calls, that he's got a

Speaker A: field back and he's an alcoholic because he's drinking the Mai Tai. I m mean, you really want that guy's life, dude.

Speaker B: And that's what, you know what's so funny is like, that was one of the premises of this podcast, was that, you know, so many people will look up to. We can name drop anybody. Gary Vee, Elon Musk, uh, Warren Buffett, any of these guys. And they're like, this is unfair that they have this or whatever. And I'm just like, yeah, but have you just go one month, go find a job that will make you fly out where you're gone on Monday and you're home on Friday night every week. And that's just a taste of how much you don't want to do that. I had an outside sales job like, that we'd leave on Sunday night, we get back on Thursday night. And I lasted two months at that job. Yeah, it was terrible. I'm like, I could not imagine doing this as a living or as a business owner or whatever. Right. And then the fallacy that, oh, well, you just weren't doing business right if you did that, I go, um, then why are so many people. You're telling me that 90% of the people got it wrong?

Speaker A: I'm so glad you just said what you said. The person who said, well, you're not doing the business right. Well, who the freak are you to tell me about, let me see your bank account. Really? How many businesses do you have? We listen to people sometime in their criticism.

Speaker B: Yeah, right. Yeah.

Speaker A: It's like, why aren't you doing that? Well, let me look at your life. Take the freaking like beam out of your eye before you worry about the sliver in my eye.

Speaker B: Well, and not only that, but like, um, I just, I kind of, that's my counter is like. So you're telling me like 95% of people do it wrong. Mhm. Even if they're successful and you're the only guy who's doing it right. Like, you're crazy, dude. That's like me, you know, that's like a buddy of mine, he's had, you know, he's had 10 ex girlfriends. It's not the girl, dog.

Speaker A: It's so true.

Speaker B: It's not the gender, bro.

Speaker A: It is so, uh, true. You hit home, dude. Like the beginning of this year in January, I made an intention to have like a close relationship with a woman versus just dating. Because if this is the depth of where I wanted to go, I would go this far.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: And I only lived in this space, and I only looked for people in that space. And now I have this lovely gal that I love just dearly. And I've gotten that point because I've opened up my space to have that kind of opportunity.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: The other thing, too, is. And we've talked about this. So I migrated here from Southern California in 93, and I had a business before I went on my mission, and now I'm in my 25th business. And it's funny, I've lost sleep, I've looked back. I'm like, why didn't I do it this way? And why did I do it? Well, at the time, that's all I knew. And so you just learn as you go.

Speaker B: Yeah, you have to.

Speaker A: And at the end of the day, dude, when I close my eyes, I'm going to be so grateful that I went through my 50 businesses. And like I told you before, I had an online dating site, and now there's human being. I was literally in a meeting the other day with one of my clients, and I was meeting his, um, office staff, and I just happened to throw out the name of this online dating site. And the guy that is paying me to consult, he goes, dude, my sister was on your site and got married, and I have now nieces and nephews because of you.

Speaker B: That's crazy.

Speaker A: Isn't that crazy?

Speaker B: Yeah, it is wild to me.

Speaker A: And I sold that business off, and now I have people walking the earth. So you do business, you're going to affect people's life. It's not just about making money, man. And you do these interviews with these people, I guarantee you, you're such a great, great guy, bro, that when people leave here, they're like, I'm a changed person. Like, you change people's lives and they change your life. You've told me, we've sat here for an hour how impacted you were, right?

Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, I think when I. When I do these, it's always just about, um, just putting it out there. Like, uh, I think the best definition I ever heard about karma was from you, like the ufc. I think we talked about this. But the best definition of karma heard was from Dustin Poirier when he beat Conor McGregor, or when the second time Conor McGregor broke his leg or whatever. Remember that? And Dustin Poirier got the mic and he said, karma's not a bitch, she's a mirror.

Speaker A: Yeah, dude, right?

Speaker B: That was it. Uh, that's the only definition of karma that you need.

Speaker A: How come I've never heard that? That is Amazing. That's amazing.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's it. That's the definition. I mean, I've even read books where you can. By, like, uh, you know, Buddhist and Hindu and, um, you know, and that's. And that, like, karma doesn't need to be malicious to get back at you. Like, she doesn't need, uh, to play any ulterior motive game or any, like, uh, mischievous game. Like, because it's not, you know, it's you. And so. And one of my favorite quotes is like, um, in. So in Hinduism and Buddhism, it's the law of, uh. It's karma. In Christianity, it's the law of the harvest. And, uh, if you're Mormon in the Book of Mormon, it's the law of resurrection, which is you come back coin, uh, for coin. Like, if, you know, everything is Sorry, not resurrection, it's the law of restoration. Yeah, if you come back, it's a, uh. If you were bad, you come back like that. You know what I mean? And so it's like everything's restored back to exactly how it was.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And that's it, dude. Yeah, that's it. So that's why I do things and

Speaker A: you have to study these things. You really do. And I'm so glad you've brought it up multiple times about Buddhism. And, um, I love that, but I love Buddhism. I love it too.

Speaker B: I love Buddhism.

Speaker A: I went through some therapy. I had some situational depression in the day, and. And I went through ketamine therapy and, you know, guided careful in a clinic. And, uh, when I came out of it, I was so super clear that I remember I was in the Provo Canyon, and I had this company called Guides. And so I had been studying up on Sherpas. So m. I'd already known a little bit about Sherpas. And I don't know if you know this, but they follow the oldest, you know, preaching of Buddhism. Like the OG Like. Right. And, um. And I remember I recorded in my phone a book. It's called the Three Sherpas. And I actually wrote it. I haven't published it because they're an ethnic group. And I'm not quite sure if that's appropriate to call it that. But it's about these three Sherpas. And they're called Wisdom, Strength and Love. And the names are Tibetan names. So they're literally the names are Wisdom, Strength and Love and how they react on the mountain and act and how you would if you were Love and Strength and Wisdom and stuff like that. And I really grew up to appreciate the teachings, not the religion, because it's not a religion of Buddhism, which is.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's what I love about it is. Yeah.

Speaker A: Like, they asked the Dalai Lama, like, why don't you proselytize us? Because we don't want everybody to be Buddhist. Like, just go do your freaking thing. It's so Buddhist to say, yeah.

Speaker B: And you can be. Well, and you can just be a.

Speaker A: You can be anything.

Speaker B: You can call yourself whatever you want to use.

Speaker A: That's right.

Speaker B: And, oh, man, I told this story once, but, uh, I love Buddhism because, uh, I read that book. What's that? Uh, the Hero with a Thousand Faces, Joseph Campbell. It's probably one of the best books out there, but it just shows how these myths and how to tell a story, uh, and why we love certain stories and why they resonate with us so much. Um, because when you look back at Buddhism and there's what, Siddhartha Kadma. He's living in this life that is lavish and he loves it. And the better way to put that is he's comfortable. And then one day, he realizes that there's something else that needs to be done. This isn't it. There has to be more than this. This doesn't feel right. And so he goes out to this tree, and he goes underneath this tree, and for the first time in his life, he decides to pray. And then he becomes enlightened. He gets it. Right. I asked my Mormon friends. I'm m. Like, what story does this sound like to you?

Speaker A: Yeah, right, right.

Speaker B: Story of Joseph Smith.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: You're like, holy shit, dude. And then this is the story of life, though, that when you become enlightened, like, Buddha's life actually went downhill. Joseph Smith's life went downhill.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: This story, also very similar to Muhammad's in our brothers and sisters in Islam. And it's the story that just like. That's the life story. That's the human condition, is you. It's the story. It's also the story of Adam and Eve. Like, you know what I mean?

Speaker A: One of the things that, ah, Jordan Peterson talks about is one of the hardest concepts in philosophy is consciousness.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: So what's happening? And maybe this is what's happening, because I don't know what I'm talking about. Let's just pretend I don't know what I'm talking about is that once a person gets enlightened, they now have a conscious motive, and that's when they start living, and that's when crap starts to fall apart.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: So in the case of Adam and Eve, they were unconscious.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: They had the apple. So the fruit. The fruit, the knowledge. And now they're conscious of things. And that's when crap went to freaking look at their kids. Right? Cain and Abel.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Look, who knows? They probably had some marital fights and this and that. Like, they had to, uh, like, work for their food, you know, Everything became hard. But isn't that beautiful? Like, we would not be here without these struggles, without pressure. There's no life.

Speaker B: And to your point there, I love it. Because one thing, you know, we were talking about book, but one thing that's always going to go in my book is when I interview business owners. And you can tell me if this resonates with you, but when I interview business owners, they go through some of the most crazy, hard shit. And that's one of the reasons why people will say, like, real entrepreneurship is very lonely, because even though you've got this group around you, nobody knows what you're going through. And then you ask them, all right, well, uh, what would you do differently? And they said, nothing. And then you get the answer, like, why not? Because there was no other way to get to where I am than that path. Like, there couldn't have been. And you're just like, all right, well, shit, I guess it's true.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Yeah. And so that's why I, uh. I don't know, dude. I love this conversation because it's bringing up so many things. But one of the things that I tell people, like, do you don't have to pray for hardships, because the hardships will come.

Speaker A: They're there, bro. They're waiting. Yeah, they're so waiting.

Speaker B: Yeah. That's why one of my favorite verses is, sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: You'll have enough tomorrow to do it.

Speaker A: Here's the good news.

Speaker B: You know what I'm saying?

Speaker A: So that's good.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: But here's what's even better. So I'm dating this wonderful gal. She's absolutely amazing. I love her to death. And I've never loved any person or woman, uh, like I've ever left her. And it's funny, because she said something a couple months ago. She goes, you know, Jeff, this may not have worked out a couple years ago, because what we've come to realize is the things that we've gone through with other people not having to do it. We're not having to do it with each other anymore. We've already gone through those things, and now we've come Some people, what they do is they'll go in a relationship like this or sometimes they'll go in a relationship like that.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: For the longest time, for the last couple years, because we've kind of untwined how we got together. We've been going like this and now we're here m. And we're now going in the right direction. But we've had some of the same challenges. Right. And some of the same problems, and now we don't have to go through them together. So there's something to be said about the seasons of life.

Speaker B: Yeah, right. Yeah. And business, too. And like, all those failed things. I interviewed a really awesome entrepreneur, Eric Espinosa. He was the. He's currently the CEO of Coconut Va right now. And, uh, I remember we were on a podcast together and he said, you'll never know. I was asking him about, how do you know about million dollar ideas? Because that's what he was going for. And he was like, yeah, you won't ever know your million dollar idea if you didn't fail at the $1 idea or your $100 idea, or if you didn't have some success at your little thousand dollar idea, the, you know, that only your friends and family buy. He's like, you'd never know. You just. And so, yeah, it's kind of like, oh, shit, dude. Yeah. Uh, you kind of have to know. And it's more than the cliche, like, more. You have to know more than just the bad to know the good. You also have to understand, like, the mediocre to kind of. All right, I think I'm on the right track, but I don't know if that. You know what I'm saying?

Speaker A: Like, isn't that beautiful?

Speaker B: Yeah, it is. I think it is.

Speaker A: Uh, Alan Watts, uh. Or is it Jordan Peterson?

Speaker B: They're out.

Speaker A: No, no, no, it's Alan Watts who said this. He said they're very close. Yeah, they're in their philosophy. But it was Alan Watts who said this. He goes, if you woke up every morning knowing that you were going to win the game, would you play the game? If you knew you were going to wake up every morning knowing you were going to win the game, would you ever play the game?

Speaker B: I don't know. That's.

Speaker A: I wouldn't. It'd be boring.

Speaker B: Yeah,

Speaker A: I played a four and a half hour Monopoly game with my girlfriend and my bro, my sons. And if I knew walking into that game I was going to win the game, I'm like, I'm not playing this game. Yeah, it's the challenge.

Speaker B: Yeah. Or at least it wouldn't be fun if I did. Right.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And that's the thing.

Speaker A: Most people are entrepreneurs, most of them are neurodivergent, and most do it for fun. If you look at the number one reason they do a thing is that's entertaining. If it's not fun, I'm not doing it, man.

Speaker B: Right. And you know what else is funny about people being that neurodivision and starting businesses? Uh, I'm adhd and a lot of my best ideas happened by accident. And actually a lot of businesses, really successful start just an accident might not be the right word, but definitely, like, serendipitous. Like, it wasn't supposed to happen this way. I didn't envision it like this, but it fell in my lap and then it clicked and I was like, yeah, that's it. And that's super cool, too.

Speaker A: We spoke for like an hour before we even got on this podcast. And I was. I'm so. And I still am, um, so really enjoying this conversation. So I have a question for you.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: Have you heard of the Reticular Activation System?

Speaker B: No.

Speaker A: So at the base of your neck, there's a thing called the reticular, and you use it all the time. So if you bought a Honda Accord today, what would you see tomorrow?

Speaker B: Bunch of Honda Accords.

Speaker A: Right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So the Reticular Activation System is really. When you talk about something, and this is the secret, careful what you say. Careful who you're around. Right. Jim Rohn, you are the five people you hang with. Careful what you think. Because you're going to attract. It's a funny word. People use it, overuse it, but you're going to attract that thing. And so if you're thinking about things, you're going to attract those things. If you buy the Honda Accord, you're going to get the Honda Accord. What you're doing and what you're saying, and I'm just translating, you said it perfectly. But, uh, when you said by accident, it was never by accident.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: You had done something to be in that spot at that moment for the retake. Like something to make aware, to notice and to.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And every good business person is a hacker. Not computer hacker, but the definition of a hacker is seeing an opportunity and exploiting it. Now you have a choice to exploit it the right way or the wrong way.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: You could have a brand that somebody takes shortcuts, or you have a brand that goes the extra mile.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Right. Because what happens is you have action, you have results, and then you have brand. You take the action. And if that action is you're cutting corners, you're going to have some sort of result that shows that. And then your brand is a cutting corner kind of person. But if you're the person who, like, long, um, suffering helps other people. We were talking about Dave Kent. We love Dave Kent. He's always helping people and veterans and stuff like that. But if you have somebody who's always giving and giving and giving. As soon as I said Dave Kent, I said five names and I said Dave Kent, you're like, bro, I love Dave Kent.

Speaker B: Yeah, dude. M. I met him at an event. Yeah. One of Sean Finnegan's events.

Speaker A: Yeah, Sean's amazing too. But they're givers and that's their brand. And so you live in that honesty. And so the thing that we come about, like, you know, I'm now part of a, uh, co owner in, um, Restart Utah, and I went to the event in January and I'm like, what in the. I didn't even know about the event till the day before. Business partner of mine was like, hey, man.

Speaker B: Oh, yeah, Last year. Yay.

Speaker A: It was in January.

Speaker B: Yeah, in January.

Speaker A: It was over at the Sandeep thing with all the cars and whatnot. So I walk in there, I'm like, who even freaking owns this thing and what is going on? And I've never seen this, like, it's like a, uh, it's like speed dating for businesses and.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: One thing led to the next, and I met Martin Miranda, who's my business partner now, and I'm like, oh, I love Martin. Isn't Martin great?

Speaker B: Martin's great.

Speaker A: He's, um. His dad was a missionary, like, in three different countries. And he's a very spiritual guy. Martin is.

Speaker B: I love Martin.

Speaker A: Yeah, Martin's a great, great guy.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Anyway, I had known him for months and months, and he just let it slip that he owned Restart Utah. I almost smacked him over the phone. Like, why didn't you tell me that? And I had seen an opportunity in that. I'm like, dude, I want to be a part of it because I know I can help with it. So guys like you and I and gals, right, whatever, dogs, cats, whatever you identify as, uh, if you're really good and you've been through the wringer, whether it's from a childhood or business or sports or whatever it is, and you've had an experience, you have a different set of eyes and you can see opportunities that other people don't see. There was hundreds of people who went through that event who probably didn't see what I saw. One of the number one things I saw was who's the face of this fricking thing? Who's shaking the hands of the people who bought these booths and did the sponsorships? Well, now I've solved that problem because I'm now one of the faces. I know I'm going to know every single person who walks into that place, and when they leave, they're going to be ready for the next restart because they're going to get treated so very well.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so I'm sure you do the exact same thing. Like, you look at an opportunity and go, dude, I know exactly how to monetize this thing. Like you do with. Dude, it's a genius what you do, monetizing this podcast. And it's not. It's not normal.

Speaker B: No, it's. No. Well, because you have to take a, uh. And it's just kind of like restart. Right. You have to take these things that everybody does, and then you've just. You've got to reinvent it. And, uh, then people. I think people like the allure of the difference. Right. Um. And yeah, that was one of my favorite quotes in sales was where there's no difference, there's no preference. And so very good.

Speaker A: Yeah, you have some really good quotes, man.

Speaker B: Just one liners. Yeah.

Speaker A: Dude, that's awesome. You're one of those guys.

Speaker B: I do, Yeah. I mean, that's. Well, adhd. That's how I have to live. Everything gets blown. Bump it up into whatever. But yeah, it's true, though. It's like, this is very different. I like this because it just. It stimulates it a little bit different. You know what I'm saying? So. So it works, man. But yeah. What? So to break down restart. I've heard about this. Has it been going on very long?

Speaker A: It'll be on its fourth year.

Speaker B: Fourth year?

Speaker A: Yeah, In March.

Speaker B: Okay. You said like small business, speed dating.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: That's.

Speaker A: Isn't that interesting?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So essentially, think about it this way. You have a booth and there's two people in the booth. You stay in your booth, and then your compadre goes to the next booth. And then somebody comes from another booth, another vendor, and they sit in front of you for three minutes, and that's your opportunity to pitch whatever you're pitching. Now, the interesting part is you only have three minutes. And most VCs, or like, I've done a handful of investment, uh, pitch competitions and there's a trick to that three minutes. That's your elevator pitch. Like if you were in an elevator and you were with, like, Tony Robbins or Bill Gates or something, like, what would you say? M. And so you have this in spades. And one of the things is why I've wanted to be on this podcast is because people like to do business. They like. You're a very likable person. Right.

Speaker B: Yeah. Right.

Speaker A: And so one of the first things you're going to want to do if you're in this, uh, event is make sure they like you.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: There's politicians up there who really suck as politicians, but they smile all the time. And the ones who have all the facts and they do the right job and they kind of frown, people don't vote for them, even though they're the ones they probably should vote for.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: So it's the likability.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You know what I mean?

Speaker B: It's that charisma. Well, yeah. That suave. Yeah.

Speaker A: And where does likability come from? It usually comes from not talking about myself, but talking about, you know. So Dalton's like, bro, dude, it's really good to meet you. What are you doing here? Oh, I have a booth over here and blah, blah, blah.

Speaker B: Really?

Speaker A: Oh, that's interesting. This is what I do. And I think we could help you or I know somebody who can help you. By the time you're done and you leave, you're like, dude, that guy didn't say one thing about himself and he was trying to hook me up. Yeah, I'm gonna go back and help that guy, Jeff Crane. Uh, now, if you have 150 vendors, we have 100 to 150 vendors that do this over a two day period of time. You get to know people, a very deep level, and you're also. And here's the best part about this event. I think most people don't understand this event like I do. You're volunteering to play by the game and the rules. When you go to a normal event and you buy a booth, which is one of the biggest freaking scams on the planet, be careful when you buy booths, guys. If you go to any other event, and I'm not. And I'm not disparaging any events. In Utah, we have billions.

Speaker B: But boosts are.

Speaker A: They're hard.

Speaker B: They're hard.

Speaker A: They are.

Speaker B: That's the, that's the thing is like, that is. The thing is just they're. They're difficult to monitor.

Speaker A: Do you know why that is? Here's why that is. So you get a booth, like, look, bro, I'm going to hook you up. Let's say it's another event somewhere else. I'm gonna hook you up with the booth and you're gonna be in the vendor's area, but we're gonna have talks going on in the other room and panels and they're gonna have bathroom breaks, they're gonna have coffee breaks and they're gonna get lunch and they're gonna come out in this eight hour period for a total of an hour.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's tough, dude.

Speaker A: Right? Ah, the people are hammered. Listening to everybody in the first place. You're out there transacting, that's a transaction. You're trying to get them. And so there's like this force field, this 10 foot barrier where people don't want to make eye contact.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: They're going right by the booth. They're kind of like, I do this all the time. I, I don't make eye contact. Because if you get eye contact, they got you. You look at the title and go, if I can't understand what the title, what it is by the title of that business, I'm not doing business with them.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: It's a billboard, right? It's four words. That's the max you should have on any kind of billboard. You're, uh, cruising by at 75 miles an hour. It better say one call. That's all it better say. I hear you, Ken Garf. Right? It better be something like that. Or my old business, hot saints.com, they'll wreck their car when they're like, what was that? And so our event has really great opportunities, um, to grow. But I just use that as an example. I'm just talking about Restart Utah, but I'm in my 25th business. You know. I told you I was doing movies at, um, the end of last year, for the last three years.

Speaker B: Yeah. What a cool.

Speaker A: And people are like, so did you go to school for that, Mike? No. How'd you do it? I'm like, well, I did it how I got through high school.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I used to give the juniors dates and they would do my homework. So I found a videographer. I found people with events. It's called NFT the movie.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And they would do these big old events and I was the only game in town. I wasn't making NFTs. I was telling stories about it. I was literally, we, as a team were the only company and it was called NFT the Movie. So people understood what we did when we walked in, we were mobbed by people because they wanted to be interviewed. And I was dumbfounded that there was no other media company like ours doing what they did.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And we captured the market because we weren't competing with them. We were doing. What you were doing is giving them a platform to talk about themselves.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: It was such a wonderful experience.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Oh, my gosh, dude, that would be really fun. So it was kind of like a documentary of just, like, how. Tell me the premise of the movie.

Speaker A: Well, we have two documentaries.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Um, and what's funny is because we've talked about your podcast on what wins are. Because some people think a win is a whole bunch of money in the account. Um, I know very few people who have submitted a movie to Sundance Film Festival. We started our film in 2021 in May and submitted a film in September. We didn't get accepted, but the fact that we were able to submit a film to Sundance, I'm stoked.

Speaker B: Yeah. Sundance is.

Speaker A: Do you know how many applications they have? 7,500 features, 4,500 shorts, and they only pick 200.

Speaker B: Wow.

Speaker A: No offense to Sundance, but every freaking film festival is an absolute scam. Because I did the math. If you take the 12,000, uh, 500 or 13, 14,000 companies that didn't get in and multiply it by just a minimum of five people, and there's way more than five people in the production team. There was over 30,000 people before Christmas that were affected that were hoping that they would get their film into that studio, that they paid for their application fee to get in there, and that's their only way of doing business. I could care less. Honestly, I could freaking care less if we ever got in.

Speaker B: Which is like, Damn. That's why NFTs should have been bigger than they were, but because you could have changed the whole world with the right kind of play. NFTs with those small media companies. You know what I'm saying? Like, damn it. I get sad a little bit.

Speaker A: You know, I'm hoping it comes back. Yeah, we did two documentaries. One that public hasn't seen and one that, uh, a, uh, handful. As a matter of fact, this time last year, we did a red carpet, and it was called, uh, Magic City Ape dao. Now, a DAO is what's called a decentralized, autonomous organization. And this documentary, this short documentary of 22 minutes was about people who had owned bored apes. So this was a dao of people who owned bored apes. Are you ready for this? So when we filmed it, we were interviewing people who were janitors that bought a $500 bored ape, and it was worth 450 grand. And I had asked him multiple times in the movie, dude, don't you want to sell it? Like, no. By the time I showed the red carpet, those bored apes were worth like 50, 60, $70,000 because the market had dropped.

Speaker B: Yeah, market.

Speaker A: So for me, the whole excitement, uh, of doing this movie was really just sitting down with somebody, literally looking them in the eye, and they're like, yeah, man, I'm going to change the world, and I'm going to change my world, and I'm going to do it with this and that. And I'm like, barely believes this.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's, like, waxed.

Speaker A: Well, no idea. Because one of the hardest, one of the worst things a person can do is to lay their life on the line to say that they're right about something. Right?

Speaker B: Hey, yes.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: Like, I know. I'll, ah, put my. My. That's what the Crusades were for. And that's where everything else was. I will die for this. And you're like, sure.

Speaker B: And I'm lds. I'm active lds. But that's the time when I. When some people think that, you know, some people think I'm going through a faith crisis or whatever is because I'm like, yeah, dog, I've just seen too much to live in a black and white world. Like, it's not. I remember getting in a, you know, not an argument, but we got in a discussion with one of my former mission companions, and he was. We were talking about whatever it was, and I was just like, dude, I've just seen too much this. It's not as black and white as you think. It can't be. Like, if we believe in the same God and he does the same things that we both teach, it cannot be that black and white. And so, yes, I get really nervous when people talk black and white. This is the only thing. And I'm like, oh, fuck. You know what I mean? Like, dang it. Uh, I don't think so.

Speaker A: You're gonna appreciate this.

Speaker B: So

Speaker A: I was not on les. Uh, baptized when I was a kid, converted, whatever. Went on my mission to Brazil. The name of the mission was Camp Penis. My mom's like, what camp are they sending you to? I love that. It's my favorite Jo.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's hilarious.

Speaker A: And I did my thing and served my time and got divorced and. And then I. And then I kind of went away from the church and kind of hurt a Little bit. And then. But now I go to church, I go with my girlfriend, which is awesome.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: I don't take sacrament, but I like to go. I'll even bear my testimony about Christ, because I have a testimony of Christ, right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And I'll even go to my ex wife's ward and sit next to my son so I can be with my son and next to him is my ex wife and next to her is her husband.

Speaker B: Sure.

Speaker A: Because I just want to be with my son and I want to be in a really neat environment. But before, I used to have a problem, and here's where the problem was. And I actually spoke about this at Thanksgiving with a friend of mine. And the problem was I was living that life where I wore my suit and I did the things that I needed to do. But because I was doing that and I was watching myself and I was being so careful with myself that I was also watching what other people were doing. And I didn't mean it, but I was, in my mind, I was prejudging or I was preconditioning other people. I'm like, wait a second, why aren't they wearing a tie? And why aren't they wearing a suit? And why is their hair messed up and why are they wearing jeans? I'm that guy now. Yeah, I used to have really long hair, like probably like 12 months ago. And I got up at my ex wife's ward with no tie and I'm like, I'm that guy that you see in the ward that I used to, quote, unquote, um, in my mind, judge. And I don't do that anymore. So I can walk into any place, any church anymore, as long as I'm with people that I like and love. And I could probably get something out of it, you know, my time is limited, so I have to be careful where I go.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: But when it comes to the faith of like. I'm so glad you brought this up, bro. When it comes to, especially in our

Speaker B: culture,

Speaker A: you have to follow rules. Like, that's part of life, that's how you're happy, is following rules. Like, we had time to do this podcast and I have to show up on time, right?

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: And so I get the benefits.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: But what you said is totally true. Like this black and white thing, it's a little tricky.

Speaker B: Well, for me, uh, it comes down to this. And, uh, dude, I'm throwing out a bunch of quotes, so why stop now? But one of the other things that my kids have to memorize and That I kind of teach them and raise them by is strict with ourselves, tolerant of others. And that's the idea of not black and white. Yes. I have rules that I follow, but I know why I follow them, and I've been through. So I'll give you alcohol, for example. Religious reasons for not drinking alcohol is probably number 99 on my list. Why I don't drink alcohol. Like, number one is genetics.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: It's. You know what I mean?

Speaker A: Sure.

Speaker B: Like, period.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So when people go like, oh, you don't drink alcohol because you're Mormon. No, actually, I had watched my mom have grandma seizures on a table because she hadn't had alcohol in six hours.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Like, that's how bad it was. Right. And so. And so. And my dad was born fetal alcohol syndrome.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: You know what I'm saying?

Speaker A: Sure.

Speaker B: And I don't mean to say that other than, like, just be careful. Of course you can drink alcohol. And I'll go to the bar with my buddies, and we'll go watch UFC at a bar named sue, and they all drink, and I'll have, like, my water or whatever I have. Uh, so it's just strict with yourself, tolerant of others. And that's why I don't go black and white.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Because I'm just like, man. Yeah. I just. It's not.

Speaker A: Anyway, judge lest ye be judged. We were talking about the Buddhist thing kind of thing. It's the karma, right?

Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. And it's also, you know, there's a few other places where it's like, um, you know. You know, the same as a person who looks in their mirror and looks at themselves and then leaves and forgets what they look like and then goes around their day and judges people. Yeah, dude, you forgot what you look like in the mirror. Yeah. You forgot all this acne that you. Or whatever.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Like, you're bald.

Speaker A: Yeah, no.

Speaker B: You know.

Speaker A: But you know what she's doing?

Speaker B: Empathy.

Speaker A: Yeah. And it takes time.

Speaker B: It does.

Speaker A: And it takes time. How old are you, man?

Speaker B: Uh, 29.

Speaker A: You're 30? I'm 54, bro. I'm gonna tell you something. I'm, like, half a hundred years old. And when I was like, you know, 20, I acted a certain way, right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And I was 30. It's in the scriptures.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I acted a certain way, and I was 40. And now I'm in my 50s. And when I get to my 60s and 70s, I'll keep looking back, I'm like, what a moron. But I have to go through this process to get to that end. And as long as I'm around people who love me and understand me and know, hey, that's just Crane. Like, by the way, you just call me Crane. Dude, nobody calls me Jeff. All my best friends call me Crane.

Speaker B: All right?

Speaker A: And, um, I love it. Like, some, um. My girlfriend calls me the Jeff Crane. You know what I mean? Like, you are the Jeff Crane.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's cool.

Speaker A: And I've stepped over myself so many times and I've tripped so many times that it's almost like a joke. It's like I'll say things. My buddy Chris Dayton, we talked about him. I said something the other day goes, you're the only one who could get away with that. And it's a wonderful life that we can have our own identities of the things that we've done right, the things that we've done wrong. Um, but we're still here trying. We talked about Brandi Vegas. She's just a wonderful influence in our community. And she helps people who have stopped trying and to a certain degree. And she helps them to not ultimately stop trying forever and ever. You know what I mean? The self harm thing. And she comes to my mind because she's the epitome of somebody who sees the worth in somebody. And it's like, look, man, your life is worth something. Let me help you.

Speaker B: Yeah. And one of those life changing moments with me, just because you brought up Brandi Vega. But one big, uh, empathy developing moment for me was. Have you ever read the book Never? Uh, split the Difference?

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Okay. So in the book, Chris Voss talks

Speaker A: about his movie Come out. Yeah, he has a movie that came out in January. Ah. It was during Sundance.

Speaker B: Oh, wow.

Speaker A: Yeah. Randy Garn invited us up there and he had his promo, had dinner with Chris, and he's an amazing guy.

Speaker B: Dude. Funny, uh, story about Chris. His family's from Mount Pleasant, Iowa.

Speaker A: Oh, okay.

Speaker B: I'm from Keokuk, Iowa. Mount Pleasant's in our district, played Mount Pleasant and Voss Petroleum. That's what his parents did. They owned, like, a gas company. Yeah. So anyway, but in Chris Voss's book, he was talking about how he wanted to become a negotiator. And one of the things that somebody else had done or that he was told to do was go volunteer at the crisis text line or, excuse me, the national suicide prevention line. And he would learn how to take somebody from hot to cold. And so I had a super big ego. I was like 23 or something like that. And I was like, shit, I'll do that, and I'll just be a badass negotiator like Chris Voss. And, boy, uh, wow, dude. What he doesn't write in that book, if he did it, is how the reason he can be so empathetic and so cool is because he's seen how crazy people. Like, I don't want to say crazy in a derogatory way, but how intense these conversations can actually get. Like. And how they can go from just 0 to 100 miles an hour in the first text message. And, like, you don't get to know names. You don't get to know where. Like, most of the time, they won't tell you where they are, and you're just like, holy crap, dude. Like, what this could be. And the beautiful thing about not knowing the name on the. I mean, sometimes we know that, but we'd only know the first name, right? So, like, if they gave us a name, it was probably only a first name. Um, but most of the time, like, in my experience, I didn't get a name. Um, even though I would ask, I would be like, what's your name? And they'd be like, look, I just want to. Whatever.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Uh, because there's that anonymity. And it was like, dude, this could be anybody. Yeah, this could be coming from anybody. And we knew the demographics were mostly, like, LGBTQ in this community. Right. Or, like, some. Some other minority community. Um, but, like, the words could have come from my daughter's mouth. And I was like, shit, maybe we should change our mind about how we treat people. You know what I mean? Like, these just could be coming. Like, that could have easily. Those words were not special to that specific person. Does that make sense?

Speaker A: It sure does.

Speaker B: You know, like, um, yeah. Which is that. That. Yeah. So I. That was one time my ego got knocked down a little bit because it was like, holy crap, dude.

Speaker A: If somebody asked me what I think of you, I would say he's a good father.

Speaker B: Oh.

Speaker A: You mentioned a couple times, like, what you instill in your kids.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And, uh, so Chris Boss's movie, um, his son was in it, and his.

Speaker B: Brandon. Yeah.

Speaker A: Amazing. His son's absolutely amazing.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so, you know, from Voss to Voss, you know, he helped his son and stuff like that. And it sounds like you're doing that with your kids.

Speaker B: Yeah. Right.

Speaker A: You're helping them with these things that you have them read books or quotes or what do you do with your kids? How if there were dads and moms here listening, what are a couple things you do with your Kids.

Speaker B: Well, I think the most important lesson that I could ever teach them is, uh, empathy. That's like, if you just sum it up into one word. I feel like you just have to try to get your kids to understand that, like, when they meet another. That's why I put my son in wrestling and my daughter in jiu jitsu is because that stuff prevents bullying.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Like, it prevents them from being bullies, and it also prevents them from getting bullied.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Or. But I love that. Uh, it just teaches empathy because if you go into a wrestling room or jujitsu, uh, gym, you step on the mat, you are liable to get your ass kicked every day. And there's something really sacred about that. And then you get to walk in a minute in their shoes, and you could be like, man, I remember, like, I was that kid who, if my daughter can, um. Or my son can go, man, I just got beat up yesterday. I know exactly how that kid feels. That's all you need. That's how the world starts to change.

Speaker A: That's beautiful.

Speaker B: You know what I mean?

Speaker A: I do.

Speaker B: And so, like, yeah, I do it with this kind of stuff, but it doesn't have to be that, like, put them in music, put them in something where they can just take a humongous loss.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And they. And then there's nothing that the parent can do about it.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Like, that's the other thing.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Uh, everybody wants to teach their kids empathy. Nobody wants to sit back on the sideline and not do anything to help their kid learn.

Speaker A: Exactly.

Speaker B: There's a big lesson, you know, like, I'm watching my son wrestle, and, like, and I can teach him and I can yell at him, and I could even go stop the match and, like, help him whatever way. Uh, you know what I mean? Because I'm a coach. But you can't. You gotta let him get beat up, you gotta let him get pinned. You gotta let him get hit in the face a couple times even though the kid's cheating or whatever. You know what I mean? You just have to let it happen. Even though it's one of the most horrible things you can feel as a parent. Uh, you've probably experienced that, right?

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker B: There's nothing I can do. Like, can you take this away from me? Nope. Sure can't. Like, you have to learn this.

Speaker A: And isn't it ironic no matter where you are? And some people. And I understand. I have some really great friends who are atheists, so they don't believe in God, but that's the story of God. God's like, look, Christ, go down there, son. Go do your thing.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You go through a lot of pain, I'm not gonna fix it for you.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, right, yeah. Ah. And by the way, when you ask for my help, I'm not going to be there.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker B: Because you have to.

Speaker A: You have to do it. Let me tell you something that's interesting. Um, I learned this from a friend of mine who lives in Israel. And, um, what had happened was he was dating his wife, and his wife's like, listen, man, um, when we get married and we have kids, we're going back to the homeland. He's like, all right, right on. So about five, six months ago, we were chit chatting, and I just so happened to tell him that I like to do morning study, and I like to study a word. I think it's really important how we use our words.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And I look for the derivatives. He's like, I did that just the other day. He goes, do you know what the word perfect means? I'm like, no, what does it mean? Uh, you laugh. Do you know what I'm about to say?

Speaker B: Well, I know what the word means, but go, yeah.

Speaker A: The Western philosophy or the things that we use the word perfect as to be spotless or to be without sin or whatever. And actually the word derives from, um, it means to complete. The word perfect is. Is like you've completed something, and then when you look back at Christ's story or any other thing like that, it's like the reason he was perfect is because he completed his father's mission. It's not because he was without failures. Like when he played baseball, quote unquote, he wasn't hitting grand slam home runs. We know he learned line upon line, right. And he had to grow. But it's so many times, and it's unfortunate, especially with the youth. And it does happens with adults where people feel like they have to be perfect, they look at somebody else. Like my dad always says, um, concentrate on the mountain, not the climber. Right.

Speaker B: Yeah. For real.

Speaker A: And all of a sudden we look at other people on social media or the way that they won't drive their cars. You know, as a matter of fact, we know this now. If we're looking at a, you know, a BMW or a Mercedes, we're like, what's the payment? And did they have a house? And, like, just because they have a nice car.

Speaker B: Yeah, look, I had this conversation the other day. I was like, uh, I know people. I know people who can actually afford Lamborghinis and actually paid cash for them and actually have them. And I've never seen them post a picture of it on Facebook.

Speaker A: Right. Ever. Precisely.

Speaker B: I don't like. I don't have a Lambo.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And I'll probably never buy one because I don't like. But even if I had the money. Yeah.

Speaker A: Uh, you.

Speaker B: I just know. I know who's got real money and can afford a Lambo and who can't.

Speaker A: Yep.

Speaker B: And we all can now.

Speaker A: And that's their path.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: That's the path that they take.

Speaker A: Right. The rich man's path.

Speaker B: But I like that. I like the, uh. I. Because I learned that, too. And I learned. So. Yeah. Complete. And then the other definition of like in the Hebrew context would be maturity is perfection as well. So, like, um, you know, there's. So you can be perfect in this life.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: You can complete things and you can grow in maturity.

Speaker A: I perfectly make my bed every day, and.

Speaker B: And I'm growing every. Like, there's a spiritual maturity. Like, uh. And, uh. Like I'm getting. You know what I mean? And, uh, that's. I think. Yeah. I remember telling that to a friend, too. And he was like, I didn't know that was the definition. That would have saved me so much heartache. Right. I was like, why? Why didn't you ask? Or like, I don't know.

Speaker A: Well, in the old adage is it's a misnomer. Practice makes perfect. But that's not right. It's perfect. Practice makes perfect.

Speaker B: Right? Yeah.

Speaker A: You practice something, doing it the wrong way, you're still going to get the wrong results.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You know, before we started this podcast, we were talking about books, and, you know, uh, one of my businesses, um, we take these podcasts and we turn them into books. And what's funny is that when I first thought of this business idea, because I'm in the AI world, I thought, oh, I'll just teach people how to do AI books. And it took me a couple months until I started doing my own book that I realized I'm like, dude, this is so hard. Like, I can't teach both people how to do this. And then I saw all the restrictions. And as I was doing business with Debbie Hart and Sean Finnegan, whom we were talking about before it dawned on me, um, and this will go back to our, um, perception, because perception of perfect is not really what it was, but my perception was I wanted to teach a whole bunch of people how to do it a certain way. And as I was doing this process of taking their podcasts and turning them into a book. I stepped back and I, and we've talked about this. I'm like, what am I really doing? What am I really doing? Not what I want to do, but, um, what am I really doing? What I'm really doing is I'm taking ready made content and turning them into a book. So I went to my business partners and said, hey, let's change our site. We do now. Ready made content turning into a book. That's all we do. And at first it was almost a letdown because my original idea was like, oh man, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that. But I had to take a step back and I had to take a look at what I was really doing versus what I was hoping I would do. And I think so many times in life, people, they have this sense, we're using the word perfection. They have this sense like, well, I'm working out and I'm keeping myself fit and I'm going to church and I'm doing my thing. How come I'm not married?

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: And they're not really looking at the things that they're really doing. It's like, well, are you opening the door for people? Are you really nice with other people? I was at an event last night, the RFK event, and I'll make sure that you're at this next one, but the, um, Robert F. Kennedy event, and a good friend of ours, uh, my girlfriends and I was, um. It's really beautiful. He was standing right next to us and it was about 12 midnight. He sent us both a message, a DM, and he goes, I just want to let you guys know that, um, I was watching you and I loved how you were like hugging each other and loving each other and respecting each other. And I can tell you guys are like, like, wow, you have a bond.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: Everybody's watching, dude. Right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: It's those little things that you're doing. So the perfection really comes in. Like this completion or this maturity. It comes in. And um, what are you doing when people aren't watching you?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Integrity in your business and your life or whatever it is.

Speaker B: And, and that word, by the way, is like. So I train salespeople and I look at business owners and like, okay, because the path to a, uh, successful business isn't always like linear and it's definitely not the same as everybody's path. Right. Like, if Elon Musk gave me exactly what he did to be at SpaceX, that's probably not going to work for me. You know what I'm saying? But there is one thing. So I never like. Success leaves clues, and here's the blueprint. And I've never really bought into that. Except there is one thing. The one thing I found about success, the one clue I found about success after all these interviews, it just boils down to one word, and that's authenticity.

Speaker A: You're right.

Speaker B: It's just you. The reason you're talking about Chris Tate, and he's like, you're the only person who could say that, because it's you. Because when you said it, I knew that it was you and it was genuinely you. Uh, so I'll let it slide because, uh, he's being authentic.

Speaker A: Exactly.

Speaker B: You know, I knew a guy like that, too. He'd tell people, hey, can I have a discount on this card? Be like, what the are you talking about? Absolutely not. Uh, no. And he would say it just like that. But by the time he would say. They would ask that and say it, they would laugh with it. Yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And they would still buy the car without a discount because they knew it was him. Uh, he wasn't being. He wasn't saying what his manager said. He wasn't saying what some book, you know, he was being him.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And that. And that's why when. When there was a new guy and he saw that, he was like, oh, should I do that? I was like, absolutely not. I was like, no, please don't ever do that.

Speaker A: It won't work with you.

Speaker B: And he goes, why not? And I go, because it's not who you are. That's not you. You're the guy who does it differently. You can close that. You can close that same deal, just not the way that he closed it. Right.

Speaker A: It's so true.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I have a buddy. We, uh, were business partners in Puerto Rico, and he's such a great guy. Same as James. And he's from Great Britain.

Speaker B: Oh, yeah.

Speaker A: And people from Great Britain can tell you to piss off in such a charming manner.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so he used to use this vernacular called, I'm going to slap you. So what he would do is he would warn you that he was going to insult you. Like, an Italian would be like, no offense, but I'm gonna tell you, you're ugly.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so he'd be like, crane, I'm gonna slap you a little bit. And I knew that he was just about to cut me down and give me some criticism.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So we went on a trip to Puerto Rico, and we bumped into this crypto billionaire who's now a friend of ours. And he had opened up a conversation and he was talking about a family member and this and that. And I wanted to give my opinion. I had barely just met the guy. I'm like, hey, Brock, I'm gonna slap you a little bit. And he looked at me. It didn't translate. Not in my English, it didn't. He looked at me like, what is going on here? I'm like, I just want to give you some advice.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And I never used that vernacular again because it worked for James, because he had this great English accent. He was very charming.

Speaker B: Yeah. And it was him.

Speaker A: And, yeah, the way he was doing, but the way I did it, I'm from East la. He's like, is this guy gonna be this level? And we became great friends because he understood that, uh, my nature. But it's just that exact same example.

Speaker B: It's like, authenticity. Like, everybody's going to. They. I mean, it's that old book. If I could rewrite a book in one word, it'd be, why do people buy from you? And the one word is authenticity. It's just like, they know it's you. And people aren't going to buy from you for the same reason, which is great, that they won't buy from you. Like, you don't want. I've never been a fan of, like, close. You'll close 100%. I don't want to close 100%, dude, because I don't want. There's some people who are wonderful human beings that we just don't vibe, and that's totally fine, dude. Like, they're gonna live their life. I'm gonna live my life. There's nothing. There's nothing wrong with his journey or what he's doing. There's nothing wrong with me. But, like, we're never gonna do business together, and that's cool, man.

Speaker A: I'm so glad you brought up sales. I think every single person. If I were President United States, there's a couple things that I would do. I'm like, look, man, you're either gonna. You need to serve in the. The armed forces for a year. You can go on a humanitarian mission for a year, or you can spend six months in jail, like, whatever. Like, I have a different way of looking at things. Um, but the. The subject that we just brought up, like, I would. I would mandate people, um, get a sales job maybe door to door, right. If I were President United States. Because every sales job I've ever had, I failed. Miserably at the very first utterance, even if I practice it for two weeks, I put my foot in my mouth. And it's not about making the sale. It's about overcoming yourself and learning how to get past that and to grow. And man, what an experience to be able to be shut down, to go back, lick your wounds and go, okay, how am I going to do this? A little bit better.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And then go back and do it and be like, I did it.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: It's better than the sale.

Speaker B: Oh, totally.

Speaker A: Right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: In the relationship, like, you're talking about authenticity. I can tell, bro. It's literally in your blood. But, like, whenever I would do sales, I did. During my divorce, I called my good friend and old business partner, Todd Peterson, and I said, hey, bro, I need to leave town and I want to do some door to door sales.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: He goes, you can go to Texas or Alaska. Where would you go in the summer?

Speaker B: Alaska.

Speaker A: Alaska. So I went to Alaska. And, uh, I was one of the top, uh, business alarm business, uh, sales guys. And that's a conversation for another time. But doing door to door sales really teaches you. Right. How. How to be humble, how to be authentic.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: But every relationship I ever, every person I sold, I had a relationship with, they would invite me over for, like, king crab. They would want me to come over and watch the game because I would not do that job unless I was. I really cared about them and their family.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And they made me a part of their family.

Speaker B: And then. Because they can feel.

Speaker A: They did.

Speaker B: They did feel it.

Speaker A: Totally.

Speaker B: And you don't have to. You know, there's a really, a lot of special things that come with adhd, but it doesn't matter what. It doesn't matter who you are. Like, anybody can smell bs.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: I mean, there are some cunning people, and we can definitely talk about the outsiders later, but for the most part, people can do that. But, um, old Jeff Crane.

Speaker A: Yes, sir. That's right, buddy. You're my friend now. Crane all the way.

Speaker B: I appreciate you coming. Thank you. A lot of time together, man.

Speaker A: It was awesome.

Speaker B: I love it. But before I let you go, I'm gonna do everything, what I do with everybody. Where can everybody follow you, find you all that good stuff?

Speaker A: Yeah, it's a good question. Um, I'm not really much of a social media guy and people keep telling me to do it. You would think I would with all my tech companies. Right. Um, but I'm on Facebook, you know, Jeff Crane. And that's usually for friends and family and Some business associates, and I am on LinkedIn.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: So they can look me up on Jeff Crane. Just look at my face and you'll see me there. Um, cool. But I want to say one last thing before I go. And, you know, we talked about this for about an hour before we got on this podcast, and you're creating, um, uh, a provenance. In the NFT world, they call it a provenance, and some people call it a pedigree, or it's your history. And every time you do an interview with somebody, like, you're kind of spreading your butt or fly wings.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: You've done dozens, right? Like, well over 100 interviews.

Speaker B: I've done over 300.

Speaker A: 300 interviews. Right. Like, I just keeping. Keep doing it, man.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I just encourage you to keep doing what you're doing and to get to the heart of the people and whatnot, because the people on the other side of this camera that's watching this right now, they're going to resonate with something that you've brought out with somebody. I've never had this exact same conversation with somebody like I've had with you.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And I know a lot of the times you're doing this for. For us, and you're giving us the light, but, bro, you do a great job, and you're doing a great job service for a community. Some people are trashmen. Right. Some people are nurses, and you're doing podcasts and you're helping the community. So I just wanted to thank you.

Speaker B: Yeah, dude, I appreciate you. Thank you so much, man. I appreciate it.

Speaker A: Appreciate you, man. Thanks, dude.