#323 - Justin Breen | How To UNLOCK Your True Potential

Speaker A: So visionary will see something, uh, before someone else. They're focused on purpose. They're not focused on transactional stuff. They're focused on connectivity. They're the world, the world thinkers. So that's a visionary 2. They live in full abundance. There's no scarcity. Full abundance. Full abundance, no scarcity, no excuses.

Speaker B: All right, welcome to the podcast, Justin. Thanks so much for being here, friend.

Speaker A: Yeah, this will be a super, um, super interesting interview. Uh, you know, you're from small town. Uh, and then people like us are usually aliens within our own family community and vertical. And so you're, you know, there might be one other person from your town that. But where you are in, you know, silicon slopes, there's a lot of, A lot of. Yeah, visionaries.

Speaker B: Yeah, we have a lot. Yeah, silicone slopes is a lot of fun. Uh, I've had a lot of these guys on the, on the show. And so it's interesting to. When you talk about like, visionaries and things like that, or when you talk about high performing individuals, uh, who find themselves, you know, in that position, hey, real quick, let's just kind of go off. I want to go right to the deep stuff really quick because I have a lot of fun doing this. But you know, in your time interviewing visionaries, in your time, you know, speaking with these individuals, what are some common traits or like threads that you see in, in these types of people?

Speaker A: Well, yeah, so you're a very high intuit and then you're curious. Um, so that's. Those are two good things. Um, and then just as background. So I'm either spending time with my family or talking to, connecting the world's top visionaries, um, and then have created two companies based on that purpose. Connecting visionaries to serve humanity. And then before starting Entrepreneur Journey, I was a journalist for 20 years, so talked to top athletes, uh, performers, actors, and then most of my days talking to folks with, uh, add, uh, adhd. Diagnosed or undiagnosed, they're all over the place. And then my brain simplifies into patterns. So, um, the question you ask, the commonalities of the traits, that's all my brain does is see the pattern in people and visionaries, uh, which self included. Okay. So, um, I mean, there's so many patterns, I will say, um, the two that are the m most obvious to me after just basically spending my entire life talking to people like that, including myself. Um, first one is there are only four things, only four things that separate visionaries, uh, from humans, small business owners, consultants. They're only Four things. Uh, and I'll go over them. So one, bankruptcy or potential bankruptcy. Two, depression. Three, highest level of anxiety you can imagine. Four, likely and or possible traumatic experience experiences as a child, young adult. So human. Small business owners, consultants, those are excuses, preventers, playing not to lose. And then for a visionary, okay, figure it out. Um, that's the motivation. So that's. Most people, um, cannot be, are not visionaries because they make excuses. A visionary. No, no excuse. No. Yeah, so that's one. Uh, almost everyone I talk to, uh, including myself is, uh, three of those four things. And then the really successful ones are usually, uh, all four. Um, no excuses. Okay. And then, um, uh, you know, again, I was a journalist for 20 years. You don't get into that for revenue or office space. I don't really care about any of that stuff. And now run very thankful to run two global companies that only partner with top visionaries or folks that folks that will, uh, become one of those people. And there are three attributes in their mindset. Only three. There are only three because I simplify it. Everything into patterns. So one is their visionary. So not business owner, not. Not consultant. Uh, and visionary has nothing to do with how many employees you have or any. That's, that's totally meaningless.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: So visionary will see something, uh, before someone else. They're focused on purpose. They're not focused on transactional stuff. They're focused on connectivity. They're the world, the world thinker. So that's a visionary. Two, they live in full abundance. There's no scarcity. Full abundance. Full abundance, full abundance, no scarcity, no excuses. And then three, this is where the fake visionaries, uh, what I like to call them, they get stopped. A true visionary will only look at things as investments, not costs. So if someone asks, what do you cost or charge? I will never talk to that person again. Because they are their own preventer with their own scarcity mindset. Because they think they're a visionary. They think they have abundance, but they look at things as cost, not investment. And a visionary would never look at things as a cost ever.

Speaker B: Oh, interesting. Okay, so I like the last three. Um, the first, the first four. That's, that's. Yeah, I mean, to be honest with you. Yeah, I've seen that. Yeah. I mean, myself included. Uh, right, that's, that's fun. That's crazy. Because, you know, my follow up question is always like, all right, so how do people cultivate that? And I think the last three are pretty easy to kind of understand. Right? Like step into the Abundance, mindset. View things as investments and then think long term. Think like, you know, very, very strategic. Uh, and so my follow up question is always like, well, how do you do that? But I don't know if I want to, I don't know if I want to talk to people about like, you

Speaker A: know, what do you mean?

Speaker B: Like, uh, you know what I'm, you know what I'm saying? So like, if, you know, if somebody

Speaker A: said like, oh, because I just asked the question. I never overthink anything. I just ask.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, good point. But like, uh, it's always funny because you're like, all right, how do people cultivate that? And you can't really cultivate depression or anxiety or trauma. Right? Like kind of just.

Speaker A: Absolutely. You've got. All right, if you're.

Speaker B: All right.

Speaker A: Well, that's what makes a visionary there. Um, I'm in a group called Strategic Coach. Very grateful to be in that. Dan Sullivan, co, uh, founder. Co founder. He, uh, was in his mid-30s, bankrupt and divorced on the same day. I mean, okay, Right now he runs arguably top entrepreneur group and one of our favorite, uh, PR partners. His grandfather was decapitated in front of him when he was uh, a child. He went to Hong Kong with him and his dad went to Hong Kong when he was a child with $10 in their pocket. They created two eight figure companies. And he hired, uh, PR firm, higher PR firm. He, uh, created an at home robot to uh, help people with Alzheimer's dementia. Um, Alzheimer's dementia. Because mom has Alzheimer's and dementia. So he created an at home robot. And so what you said was really interesting because, um, again, I have zero business background. I didn't know what an S corp was when I started first company in, in 2017. And then first, uh, couple years was talking to small business owners, uh, still some employees, some consultants, and they were us zero. One or two of those four things. Now as you go higher, they're all threes and fours. I've talked to three or four people in the last two years under less than three of those four things.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's good. That's a good one, man. Well, I think what. Okay, then the next question should be like, why those four things?

Speaker A: Tremendous. No one's ever asked that. And I haven't thought about why it's those four things other than. And this is, this is why I love doing these shows because I learn and I learn in real time. And you, someone asks you the question, then you think about the answer. Yeah, I'll answer it. Like this. I actually do have the answer, which is really interesting. So I was talking to one of Africa's top entrepreneurs, Dr. Akindele. No, wait. Akintoy Akandele. Okay. So he's lost millions, if not billions. Made millions, if not billions. I was telling him about the all four things. I think this does answer your question.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: The four things. And he. And he. And maybe now what you're saying, I actually fully agree. Uh, I don't know if I fully agree with him. So I was telling him about the four things.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And he said you had to go through all four. You had to. It was a requirement to transform from pride to purpose.

Speaker B: M. Okay.

Speaker A: And I don't necessarily agree with it because I'm three of those four and I'm full purpose.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I'm the only one knock on. What I haven't had to worry about is, uh, bankruptcy or potential bankruptcy.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Um, but now that you ask that, maybe that's the only way to shed the last bit of pride.

Speaker B: Well, you know, it's interesting because, you know, you're saying that and then I'm thinking about it. You know, I asked a question and I have like an inclination about it and uh, you know, I think that's just where grit comes from. So when, when you're forced against a wall and you have no other choice and you have to make it work or like figure it out. Yeah. You've. Then I think you do. Right. I think.

Speaker A: But most people don't. But yeah, M. Yeah, that's my point is they don't. Most people would choose to be a visionary if they could do it, but they, those four things are excuses. They don't do it. That's why they stay small business or consultant or go back and get a job. I mean, that's what it is.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And you know, but, uh, but there also is a lot of meaning that like I do stand up comedy quite a bit. And I think the best stand up comics always come from most damage.

Speaker A: They're more damaged than damage. They're the only group that I can think of that is as a whole more damage than entrepreneurs. The only one.

Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, for sure. And I think. And then the best ones just, they come from that. Right. Like they.

Speaker A: Your double damage, your entrepreneur and comedian. That's really.

Speaker B: I, uh. Well, I find that's how I cope. Right. Like I laughed. I find laughing about it. Well, because, well, it's a shield, like definitely. But it's also a way for me to like, make sense of it. Like if I can step back and like laugh a bit. Then you can.

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker B: If you can make sense of it, then you can solve it, right? Like, then you can.

Speaker A: That's a good point too. If you can make sense of the trauma, then you can. So, um, you can solve the trauma by creating something. Man, this is really interesting. So, okay, so again, all my brain does is turn everything into patterns. Um, so what a true entrepreneur, true visionary is they're the most damaged person with the best coping skills. The most damaged. The most damaged. But then they have the highest iq, most grit to your, you know, most, Most hustle, highest eq, most intuition, no excuses. Yeah.

Speaker B: Ah.

Speaker A: And then, uh, I'm sure you talk to a lot of people like this too, but I talked to one to two visionaries a week that have let entrepreneur life destroy their family life or prevented them from anything meaningful because they take all that damage and those coping stills to create all this stuff and then they just torch anything meaningful in the process. So.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, I mean that's, that's definitely somewhere you don't want to be, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, uh, you definitely got to get to the point where you can, because you've got to have some things, I think. And, and the visionaries and, and high end of high worth individuals that I meet, they find a way, you know, balance doesn't exist. They're fully present in whatever moment they're in. So whenever they're at work, they're fully present. Whenever they're with family, they're fully present. So there's no balance. There's only, um, presence. Right. And so presence, I think that's where, I think that's where a lot of people get kind of lost is, is like, uh, you know, it's like some of these individuals, right, who are like, they pour everything into their business and everything else kind of like gets lost. And um, and then inevitably we talk about balance. Right. And, and uh, I think I've interviewed enough people to come to the conclusion that balance isn't the word, that it's more presence. That is the wor. And uh, because you're never going to balance it, uh, like multitasking doesn't exist.

Speaker A: I don't know. I mean, I literally wrote a book about how to build collaborative global companies while putting your loved ones first. And my wife is transitioning out of pediatrics. She's the COO of second company. And um, we're about to be named one of top five masterminds on planet. So, um, but do you think It's.

Speaker B: Do you think it's balanced or do you think it's like, just like when you're with your wife, you're with your wife. When you're with your company, you're with your company and company. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And then I was going to say that too. Like that. And then the people that. There's one other argument which is there is no difference. And that's a fine argument to make, I think.

Speaker A: I mean our, our sons are 11 and 9. They're both maniac visionaries like I am. The 9 year old already wants to take over both of companies. So I think. And all right, I mean, see this again, this is what I like in real time. But I think to your point, the key is that being present, um, being present and. Oh, uh, this is really okay. So being present focused on my family, allowed the creation of a collaborative global company. I never thought my wife would be like, oh, hey, I'm tired of hanging out with humans or parents complaining about their children. I want to phase out of pediatrics and be CEO of your company. But I think by being present and being consistent in the way running both companies, that was attractive to her and that actually created a better life balance for her.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So this is, um. It's not that we agree to disagree. I think we're coming at this the. The same thing in different ways in collaborative.

Speaker B: Which, which is something, by the way. I, Yeah, I always, uh, find that is the case. And the more interviews I do, the more I learn. There's a funny story that I like to. This is when it kind of changed for me. But I was watching it a short video and it was like way back and like man, like 2016 or something like that. And it was the presidential election and I watched a short clip of this person saying, like, why I'm not left or right. And then he panned to like his bookshelf and I was like, uh. And so the more that I learn, the more that I read, the more that I interview, the more I realize, like. Yeah, just like what you're saying. Right. Like there's many roads essentially. And it does. So it doesn't really matter like the road necessarily, but.

Speaker A: But how you get there, it's 100%. Well, the, um. One of my good friends, his name is Scott Danner, pure, like all of my friends, he's a pure visionary. Um, and then I am not an ideator. Almost everyone I talk to is there an idea. Shiny object. Add, uh, is not a disorder. It's a sign of genius mislabeled by humans. But once or twice a month, someone like Scott will say something truly transformational, then I'll write it down. Then it becomes a. A way of life, and then a chapter in a book or something. But so what he said was, every meeting is an opportunity for mentorship. Every meeting. So I go into every meeting, uh, with the approach of it's an opportunity for me to be mentored by someone, and then for me, hopefully, to provide something that could be of value to someone else.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Well. And I mean, when you approach conversations like that, I think. I think something beautiful happens, uh, in my experience, when both parties, like, with these interviews, right? Like, if I approach the conversation knowing that I don't know everything, and then person's kind of in the same boat, and we're trying to work towards the truth, I think those conversations make something very special. Uh, I. I've turned down podcast guests, uh, before who, who just want to, like, impose thing. Well, and I'm like, well, you know, I've interviewed just as many, if not more people than. Than the next person. Right. And I've always found that, like, I think it's. I think it's something very humble about even the, like, some of the top people now. And I. By the way, I'm going to stop and pause right here. There's a dichotomy that I think that I think should be recognized, and that is, like, some of the biggest visionaries, they are humble. They. They do take advice. And then. And then you do have, like, these people, you know, in the same breath. They're like, some of the most insecure people.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: Like. Like everybody's kind of out to get them kind of thing. And I think it's a very interesting place to be and a very interesting conversation to navigate. One of my favorite Books is the 48 laws of power by Robert Green and Robert Green.

Speaker A: Mastery. Second favorite book. Third.

Speaker B: Yeah, Mastery. Yeah, Mastery is a good one. I like the 33 strategies of war, 48 laws of power. Like those books very much in my collection.

Speaker A: So this is what I mean. Like, yeah, um, we've never talked. I mean, we've talked online, but we've never met or talked before like this. But it's all, like, it doesn't surprise me at all. I'm guessing you've read Man's Search for Meaning. Um, if you haven't. Okay. Right. Um, the second favorite, my master used to be number two, but the second favorite book now is, uh, Outwitting the Devil. Napoleon Hill. Most people know Think and Grow Rich. To me, outwitting the devil's a thousand times better for a visionary.

Speaker B: Yeah, I like outwitting the devil. The. The Think and Grow Rich isn't one of my favorite ones, but.

Speaker A: Oh, so where you agree with that? Yeah, that's hilarious. I mean, but that. Yeah, that one's like the one that, um. Like a true visionary outwitting the devil. That is the. That's like the. Yeah, that's like the key. It's like unlocking all these doors of. Of visionary power that you wouldn't necessarily expect, but it really. It's like a guidebook for visionaries. And then, man, search for meaning. Again, for. This is for your audience. For those who have not read Viktor Frankl, Man, Search for Meaning. He survived the holocaust. His entire family was killed. He lost all his life's work, and he found meaning in that. Yeah, like there's anything to take from this show. I mean, please read that. I, you know, please read that.

Speaker B: Yeah, it's a good book.

Speaker A: Please.

Speaker B: That is.

Speaker A: That's the ultimate. And I, um, I think why. Why I'm saying that is like, so there are 34 Gallup, uh, Clifton Strength Finders. G, A, L L U P. Clifton Strength Finders. Um, okay, see, um, by the way, I'm very high in self assurance, so I don't have imposter syndrome. A lot of entrepreneurs are very low in. In self assurance, so they're. Yeah, that's why they have imposter syndrome.

Speaker B: Or people.

Speaker A: But anyway, um, I am, ah, dead. Dead last in empathy. Dead last. However, for visionaries who don't make excuses, I have endless empathy, like, beyond. Like, it's like I stop talking because, like, I get so, uh, immersed in. In their pain. Like, I feel it.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And then, man, uh, search for meaning is like the ultimate. That's the ultimate. No ex. That's the ultimate. No excuses. The ultimate of ultimate.

Speaker B: Yeah. Well, and I think it's, uh, interesting. I like those book. I mean, I like that book. I. I was introduced to that, uh, through, you know, my. My stoic philosophy. Um, and I always like to put a caveat on that. People who've listened to this before might have heard me say it, but I always tell people I heard about stoicism before. It was cool. My mother introduced us at a very young age to these ideas.

Speaker A: Yeah, this. This calmness from. You came from sun. Like, um, your iq. Have you ever done it?

Speaker B: No, I've. I don't know how to do like,

Speaker A: you don't have add or you do, do you?

Speaker B: I do have adhd. Yeah.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: Yeah. No, I. And by the way, I've always thought too, that, uh, adhd, one of the things that I, I discovered about adhd, um, and I've always wanted to talk to, uh, other people about this, but, um, it's like the special ADHD intuition, right? Yeah. You familiar? Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, man, that, that. And that's why I don't, like, when I was diagnosed. I was diagnosed as an adult with adhd. Um, and I have, like, I help with, like, mood stabilizers, um, and those kind of things. But. But as far as, like, when they were like, hey, let's try, like, stimulants, I was like, no way, because that'll turn off, like, my, My. My favorite thing, which is my ADHD intuition, which is like being. Going to a room or like, sit with a person and just be like, like, I know who you are now.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Thank you for, uh. Well, you're like a stoic add, but the, um. I just put it in the chat. But, uh, Dr. Doug Brackman, uh, he wrote the book Driven, um, which is like the definitive book on adhd. He's become a good, good friend of mine. Um, yeah. Uh, so there's a. Iamdriven.com. there's a five minute assessment. That's free. Um, yeah. And he's. So the typical human is a small gray circle. The typical driven is a giant. You're a. You're a. You're a giant red circle for sure. And then I sent him. Well, so I sent him mine. And he was genuinely confused in a good way. He's never seen it. Um, so, uh, my intuition. One of the things is intuition. My intuition, like yours is like, it's completely off the charts. Um, but, uh, uh, I'm actually less bored than an average human, uh, because I never leave my zone of genius, ever, which is, uh, spending time with my family and connecting visionaries to serve humanity. Most people like us are, like, bored all the time because they're like, shiny object, shiny object, shiny object, shiny object.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's right.

Speaker A: Right. And I'm not like that. I only have two shiny objects. Family and network.

Speaker B: Yeah, well, I think. I think, uh, what's. What helps curb the shiny object thing is like, what you said, just. Just staying in what you're good. Like, staying in your realm of genius. Right?

Speaker A: Like, and you learned that from a young age of calmness and peace?

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, I think so. Like, uh, I am. I'm Always a. I'm always a weight guy. Like, like, like, uh, patience, you know what I mean? Like, I think that's what. And by the way, I remember when I was learning about, uh, when I had. When I was, like, diagnosed. But I've. I've loved stoic philosophy. Like, I got it tattooed on my arm, right? Like, this is something that I really enjoy. Uh, and I remember being in an ADHD group and saying, like, stoicism has really helped me. Like, I really enjoy this philosophy. And there was one guy who, who pushed back pretty hard, and I didn't really understand where he was coming from, how he was like, stoic philosophies and like, adhd, they don't mix. And I'm like, I don't know. I was like. I was like, dude, they. I was like, they do, though. Like, they do. Well, um, it was an interesting conversation.

Speaker A: My uncle had me read, uh, Marcus Aurelius, the Prince, um, when I was younger, um.

Speaker B: Yeah, Meditations.

Speaker A: Meditations, yeah. And, um, you know, I was, uh, I was having this conversation earlier today, and, um, this will be kind of long winded, but there's a. There's a point at the end that dovetails and complements what you're talking about.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So people like us. Not always, but usually. Mary. Stabilizing humans. Not always, but like a teacher, my wife's pediatrician, or a nurse, or, you know, social worker. Okay. So I have found the equivalent of that stabilizing human in a mindset or a stoic or stoicism, ah, type way is to have, um, a, uh, gratitude. Grateful filled mindset. Um, it's like. It's like a stabilizer for people, I guess. So, like, the first thing I do every day is a full journal to my wife. What I'm grateful for, for her, the previous 24 hours without her very bad, very bad situation. Not good. Not good. Um, and then, uh, five days a week, I've already included this in that, but I do a grateful journal on LinkedIn. What I'm grateful for, though, the previous, uh, that. That day, it's like a commercial for other people. And, uh, when you're constantly grateful, it's hard to be ungrateful. But again, it's like a stabilizer. It's like a mindset stabilizer. Stoicism.

Speaker B: Yeah, I think so. I mean, I mean, gratitude's one of those big ones that people miss. Um, and, uh, it is very powerful. I think it just shifts your mind to focus on things that are happening to you and. Right. Or excuse me, if for you and not to you. Yeah, exactly. I think it shifts that focus. But that's a big shift. Like, that's a, that's a really important shift that not a lot of people make. Um, because it's really easy to be like, you know, focus on what you don't have. Um.

Speaker A: No, no, no, no. Yeah. So. Okay, thank you. I appreciate you saying that. So I strongly feel you're either born top visionary on planet or you're not. Um, I think most people choose this. But again, those four things. Excuses. If you are born like this, which I, I think, I mean, it's rare. I mean, visionaries are very rare. Usually aliens within family, community and vertical. But if you are born like this, um, you can work on that mindset every day. And a visionary will do what it takes to, to do that. They will. That's the point is they won't make the excuse. They'll do it.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: Well.

Speaker B: And you know what's interesting? This conversation kind of brought to light another angle of it, um, which is one of the things that I've really enjoyed. One of my favorite authors is Mark Manson. And he's only written like, he wrote two books and then ghost write it another one. But, um, one in one of the books, you know, the subtle art of not giving a. He said, it's not about the. The question isn't like, how bad do you want it? It's like, what are you willing to suffer to get it?

Speaker A: Or like the price.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I. And what's interesting is you brought up those four traits. Um, and so for somebody who has those four traits, uh, that's like, what do you. Like, that's not really a question anymore. It's kind of like, well, my life is like, you know what I mean? Like, what is this? What is this another way. You know what I mean?

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: It's like, let's just go for it because, like, it's not going to get any worse.

Speaker A: Or, or, or not. I, I still, I mean, I know most people don't go for. That's the point. They don't.

Speaker B: Right, right, right. And I think it's because they get caught up. They don't have the experience.

Speaker A: They don't, they don't have those. They don't have the. No, they don't have the IQ or eq. They don't.

Speaker B: Well, yeah, and I think it just gets like. Once you go through something traumatic and, and you resolve it and you come through it right. Then everything else is kind of like, all right, well, we can do this. Like I did that, right?

Speaker A: Um, that's the eq. Yeah, but if you don't have the EQ to understand even what's going through. Um, I was talking to my friend Lee Brower. He's a, he's a. Oh, man. Great visionary. And, um, I haven't done the research on this, but he was, he was talking about something called xq, which is experience quotient. And that's essentially like, if you have the IQ and the eq, the emotional quotient, then you can, then the, the experience quotient. The X quotient is like the, is like the next level. It's like you go through all this experience because of all this pain and all this trauma, and then you've just learned from it. You just, you experience how that feels and like, okay, whatever.

Speaker B: Yeah. It's an opportunity.

Speaker A: It's an opera. It's an opportunity. Well, uh, one of the chapters in Epic Life, uh, the latest book, Epic Life is Uncertainty, is an opportunity to collaborate. So the uncertainty, the. Oh, Covid chaos. All right, so you created a show to connect people. I created a second company that's about to be named one of top five masterminds on planet that only connects visionaries to serve humanity. But that's what you, that's what you do, is it's an opportunity to collaborate.

Speaker B: Yeah, well, of course. And then, and then I.

Speaker A: Not though. Most people don't say of course. That's my point. Of course. For people like us. Yes, obviously, duh. Uh, but that's not the grand. Most people don't say of course.

Speaker B: So. So you said something interesting. And I want to push back just a little bit. Just to explore it, though. Just to explore it. Okay. You got somebody who's born a visionary or they're not.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: Does it happen late? Can you discover it later in life that you are a visionary? Maybe you uncover some of these things and.

Speaker A: Well, okay, so first of all, that's not a pushback. That's a, that's a perfect follow up question. So, uh, I started first company. First company six days after turning 40. I'm 46 now.

Speaker B: So.

Speaker A: Six days after turning 40, after job salary as a journalist was cut in half. I couldn't find a job. And then I'm like, oh, I'll just, just incorporate. I don't know anything about business. Um, so. But I was always this person. Meaning, like, so when I was a journalist, I was an entrepreneur who happened to be a journalist. I just didn't know that until Becoming an entrepreneur. So again, people like us are usually aliens within our own family, community and verticals. The only people understand us are top entrepreneurs. So when I was journalist, uh, I was writing about and connecting cool people, changing the world. And then journalists who are journalists write about like taxes and politics and crime. I'm like, I don't even know what you're like. So they were looking at me like, what are you doing? And I'm like, what are you writing about? All this negative stuff where I didn't even understand it. So, so I think to your point, folks might not be aware they are this, but you're either this or you're not.

Speaker B: That's fair. I, I, I can appreciate that. And the reason, because I, I grew up in, in a town in the small Midwest, right? And uh, and there are some people I, I think what this turns into, uh, and I think is a dangerous way to turn into is like how you find happiness, right? So I know a lot of people who make like the average income in my hometown even today is 30,000, $30,000 a year. And I know some, uh, some of the happiest people, right? And so I don't, I don't know, uh, I think if you, wherever you find happiness, if you, if you're a visionary, you're going to find happiness there. If you're, if you're not, it's okay. Like, yeah, let's combine it.

Speaker A: Let's combine it. Let's buy. Okay. Because this is again first time we've ever talked in detail. So. Yeah, There are only two 10x things I care about. Only two. I don't care about revenue, employee account. That's transactional business owner stuff. I've never cared about. That funnel stuff's annoying. It annoys me. I don't care about any of that stuff. Okay, two things. This is simple logic. Simple logic. Okay. Logic with visionary maniac combined so 10x number one experiences in life with my family. If you have a good family life, you have a good life. If you know someone from your hometown or anyone who has had a good family life that has not had a good life, I would like to meet that person. I don't care if they're a visionary or not. If you know someone who's had a good family life that has not had a good life, that is, I haven't met, I mean, all I've done is talk to people. I've never met anyone like that.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Okay. Well, thank you. And then 210 Xing Network on a global level, when you increase your network on a global level. It creates endless opportunities for your network and yourself. And I found that all this business owner stuff that so many people are focused on and just winning the wrong game, and they're not happy because they're focused on things that actually don't make them happy. But I found all this business owner stuff takes care of itself with that focus on family and network.

Speaker B: Beautifully said. I, uh, don't think I need to add anything more to that, because I think you're right. I think. I think if you take care of the people around you, they'll take care of you. And we. A rising time.

Speaker A: People around you take care of the people around you, they'll take care of you. That's beautiful simplification.

Speaker B: Yeah, I. I genuinely believe that. Like, I think if you just do the right thing. Even so, there's a tenant in stoicism, the Latin phrase summon bonum, which is the highest good. So virtue is defined as doing the right thing for the right reason. Right? So it doesn't matter what happens, um, afterwards. There's no, you know, there's no ulterior motive. You do the right thing because it's the right reason. And. And that's essentially what karma is. You know, you. In Christianity, it's called the law of the fast or the law the harvest. And in, you know, to our Buddhist and Hindu friends, it's called karma, but it's essentially the same thing. But here's what's funny. You know, I was. I read a book on karma once, and they said something funny where they were like, karma doesn't need, like, doesn't need you to mess up to do, you know, to, like. Karma is not an evil thing, right? It's like, uh. I think the best way, the best definition for karma I've ever heard was from a UFC fighter, Dustin Poirier, after he won it, after he won a big fight, he said, karma's not a. She's a mirror. And. And I was like, that's it, dude. He said that, uh, that was it. And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So when you take care, the people around you are essentially mirrors, right? They're. They're the reflection of what you want to see in yourself.

Speaker A: If you're not a litmus test for people you serve, it's hypocrisy.

Speaker B: Well, yeah. And so, yeah, and that's it, right? Like, you don't, you know, if you can't see yourself in that and what you want to become and the people around you. If you can't see what, what you want to see, then it's a you problem, not a them problem.

Speaker A: It's amazing. We've never talked in detail before. It's like you're. How old are you?

Speaker B: 29.

Speaker A: Yeah, 29. There's. That sounds like. But you're, you're like, um, an ancient wisdom. Um, my nine year old is, uh, he's a lot like you.

Speaker B: Thank, uh, you.

Speaker A: You're welcome. Our, um. Do you have children yet?

Speaker B: Yeah, I have two.

Speaker A: You have two? How old?

Speaker B: Yeah, my daughter is seven. My son is five.

Speaker A: You had your kids young and is your wife a stabilizing human?

Speaker B: Yeah. Yep.

Speaker A: So what is her profession?

Speaker B: She's a stay at home mom.

Speaker A: What is she educated in?

Speaker B: Uh, she like dental hygiene?

Speaker A: Oh, perfect.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: Oh man, that's hilarious. That's the first time I've heard dental hygienist. Okay. But, yeah, so, okay, so like the greatest joy of this life by far, again, 10 Xing experience, life, family, is that the children get to see this world even exist, and then they can do what they want with it. So you, you got to see maybe not necessarily this world, but the philosophy that can lead to greatness in this world. You saw that at a young age. And then our nine year old, um, both of our sons are, you know, they're highly intelligent, very good children. They're. My wife's a pediatrician, so they like have her kindness and empathy and whatever that stuff is. And then they're maniacs like me. But the, um, the nine year old when he was eight, his name's Chase, um, we were talking about bending time and iq and then, uh, Chase provided the single best definition of what life actually is that I've ever heard. Um, ever. And then all I do is talk to brilliant people like you all did. So this is when he was 8? About six months ago. So he's, he considers life one long, great day. So there's no, um, November or Wednesday or 2023 or whatever. I don't know whatever that is. Um, so yesterday's before you're born, tomorrow's after you die. Um, and then he said, because he's a simplifier like you and me, for sure, you're definitely a simplifier. But yeah, um, uh, so he said there are only two ways, only two to have a great long day. Only two. One, create more living things. The fundamental purpose of any living thing is to create more living things. If there was an argument against that, there'd be no Life. But feel free to. Not you, but anyone who feel free to. So that can be a child, a foundation, a company planting a tree, flower. I don't know. Create life. 2. Do what you like to do and what you're good at and keep getting better at it. Like Earl Nightingale said, success is progressive realization of a worthy ideal. So keep getting better at that worthy ideal.

Speaker B: It's a great way to think about it. Then you don't. Then you don't get caught because, uh, yeah, we're just. We're just bouncing back all the things that have taught us our. Our mindset. But, yeah, you know, depression. Depression lives in the past and anxiety lives in the future. So if you just think about it.

Speaker A: Interesting.

Speaker B: Yeah. Change my view of how well it makes sense.

Speaker A: Depression, live. Oh, uh, that's really. I'm gonna talk to my kids about it. Well, maybe not depression. I won't use that word, but sure, that's fair. Lives in the past, but anxieties in the future.

Speaker B: Well, yeah, I mean, you think about it like. I mean, it certainly makes sense in my life. You know, I. I'm not a therapist or a psychologist or anything, but when I think about that phrase, when I heard that. I mean, I heard it from a therap when I, you know, thought about that, um, it definitely. My anxiety. And. And so I curb my anxiety, uh, by. Oh, who said that? Was it. Oh, was it like Mark Twain or. Who said that? He's just, you know, if you. If you, uh. Oh, worry just means you suffer twice. Worrying means you just suffer twice. You know what I mean? Or like that guy who said, I've suffered a lot of great. I've said I've suffered a great deal of things in my life, none of. None of which have come true, like, come to pass, right? Like, you just, like, get this in your head, like, I'm going to, you know, all these things, and. And then. And then you have to really train your brain through experience that. Like, no, no, no, this hasn't happened yet. It's not here yet. Like. And by the way, uh, another great stoic tenet that I live by is. Is, uh, the. The Latin phrase would be premeditated malorum, which is the premeditated. The, uh. The premeditation of evils. So I kind of. I approach life with a counterintuitive thought, uh, which is if the worst thing that. If I do this and the worst thing that happens, like an investment, right? If I do this investment and the worst thing happens, I. I lose it all. And I don't ever get it back. Like, will I be okay? If the answer is yes, then I'm. Then it's it. Then I'm in, right? Like, if I can't get to the yes answer yet, then I. Then I don't do it. Right? Because once you get to the point where, like, look, the worst thing that's going to happen, if I knock on this door and ask this person to buy. They're going to. They're going to tell me to F off. They're going to slam the door. They might call the cops. Like, all of these things, right? And, uh, if they do that, I'll be okay. Like, it might be a pain, but I'll be fine. So if that's the answer, then knock on the door, get it done. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then you're fine.

Speaker A: Well, there's two things, um, two. Two things from that too.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Um. Um. So this is my litmus test for what you just talked about. Or. Visionary. So my father was, um, he was 61. 61 when I was born. Uh, he was born in 1916. And, um, he was a World War II hero. Shot, uh, down multiple times in combat, many times without a parachute. And he would just get back into another plane.

Speaker B: So.

Speaker A: Okay, so that's what you either can do that or. Or you can't. Okay, so most people can't do that. They're not okay.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: And then two, A question I received all the time is, so what do you worry about with. What do you worry about with your company? I go, nothing. Nothing. And they're like, well, what do you worry about? I go, anything happening to my wife? Anyway, that's it. That's what I actually genuinely worry about. But the business stuff, uh, I mean, that stuff will take care of itself. But if anything happens to my wife, that's a significant problem.

Speaker B: Yeah, I agree. I think, uh. Yeah, I named my dog. I gave my daughter a very specific name to help me remember that My, uh. Her name's. Her name is Lily. Comes from Matthew, chapter. The end of Matthew, chapter six. So if you're familiar with the Bible and that specific chapter, that's when Jesus is teaching and he says, uh, consider the lilies of the field, how they toil not. Um, and I. And I. And he says. And I say unto you that even Solomon arrayed in all of his glory was not designed like one of these. And so how can you. So how can you. You know, how, ah. Can Solomon.

Speaker A: Or.

Speaker B: Excuse me. And I'm paraphrasing now but how can this flower that's cast into the oven tomorrow, right? It grows and then cast into the oven tomorrow. Um, like, how. How is that so beautiful? And then your father would forget you. And so the end of that. The end of the. The paragraph there is, uh, take ye, therefore, no thought for the morrow. For the morrow will take care of the things of itself. So she. Her name is a reminder for me to stay in the present, because that's essentially what that. What that.

Speaker A: Wow, we are so similar and different. Um, the oldest child, uh, Jake. He's named after my wife's grandfather, who is a very great strong man. And then, uh, his middle name is Mike, after my dad. And naming name is so important. My name is. And then, um, uh, Chase. Chase is, uh, the Hebrew word Hassan, which he is named after, is, uh. It means strong. Strong.

Speaker B: Yes. Yeah, I. No. And I come from a culture, so I'm Polynesian, Part Polynesian. Uh, what?

Speaker A: Polynesian?

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the Jones.

Speaker A: Are you lds?

Speaker B: Yeah, I am lds. Yep.

Speaker A: You are. Oh, God, the best entrepreneur. Religion. Let me see. I have the Book of Mormon here somewhere. Are you practicing LDS or.

Speaker B: Laughs no, no, no, no, no, I practice. I practice.

Speaker A: Love the lds. Where's my Book of Mormon?

Speaker B: Yeah, those, uh. Those, uh, missionaries, dude, they. Those doorknocks.

Speaker A: Where did you do your mission?

Speaker B: Uh, I served in St. George, Utah.

Speaker A: Wait a minute.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: What, you didn't go to some? You didn't go to some. You're the only person I've ever met who did a mission in the United States.

Speaker B: Oh, there's quite a few of them, but, uh. But it was foreign to me. I mean, I'm from Iowa, man, but the culture between here and the Midwest is completely different. Like, it was a. It was a shock for me. I'd never seen mountains.

Speaker A: Yeah, I was just out in Jackson Hole, uh, last year.

Speaker B: Yeah, I never seen mountains. And then I'd never met a. Like a community like that. And I serve mostly on college campuses, but.

Speaker A: Okay, let me. Uh, this is. So again, I know a, um, gajillion lds. I know a gajillion lamps. Lds. Uh, they're really interesting. Um, I know a.

Speaker B: What did you.

Speaker A: What did you call a lap cell. Yes. So he was a. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Former Mormon drug dealer. Um, so he was raised with the Mormon ideology. And then.

Speaker B: Yeah, okay. That's actually really.

Speaker A: Yeah. Lapse. Oh, I know, uh, in Utah. I know a lot of them. But, um, the, um. And then, um. Um, why. I was in, uh, Jackson Hole. I'm part of this, uh, uh, it's a foundation where we're repurposing, uh, we're basically saving the ecosystems in the United States. First piece of land was this, that we toured was a hundred thousand acres. A hundred thousand acres. That's one seventh the size of, um, of uh, um, Rhode Island. So it was. And we were the only people out there. And then, uh, most of the folks in the group are on the board. I'm on the board. Are lds. I am not lds, um, but I kind of am. So like, um, uh, I, uh, was raised Jewish, um, and then Jews, uh, and Mormons. Top two, top two entrepreneur religions because you're. You're pushed to the brink, near extermination, go off into the middle of nowhere. So you figure it out. And then, and then I was talking, I was talking to, um, I talked to a lot of LDS folks and he goes, oh, well, there's a, there's a fundamental difference between, um. Fundamental difference between Jews and Mormon. I'm like, oh, tell me. I want, I just want the answer. Right? Like, give me that. Give me the answer.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so he's like, now this is him saying it's not me. Okay. I'm just telling. It's like, okay. So I just want to make sure that. Okay. So he's like, well, the Jewish folks are focused on, um, law that, uh, you know, finance, um, you know, the entertainment business. Transactional, transactional stuff. And he's like, the Mormons, they're focused on, uh, relationships. Relationships. You know, Mormon mission. You knock on 5,000 doors to find five new Mormons.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Oh, thank you for telling me that. I'm a Mormon. And then I'm like. And then, and then I had another conversation with, um, with, um. He's half Jewish, um, and. But married to. But married to a Mormon. Okay. Married to him.

Speaker B: Or.

Speaker A: Okay, so. So just think about that for a minute. Okay, so. And then it's fascinating, right? So, um, so then we were talking about religion because it always goes back to religion. Always. Uh, the entrepreneurs, like I'm in all these entrepreneur groups, invest a lot of money in them. All these breakouts. We always talk about religion, uh, every time. It's really fascinating.

Speaker B: Yeah, very interesting.

Speaker A: Yeah. Religion's just like an entrepreneurial operational system. That's what it is. Okay, so. So, so then we were talking, and then the Mormons are like the best sellers, the fastest growing religion. Sell, sell. We want you. We want you. We want you. We want you. We want you. Great. Fine.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: The Jews, they don't want anybody to become a Jewish person. You know how hard you have to work, like you have to beg to. And then, um.

Speaker B: Because.

Speaker A: So the, The Mormons are the best sellers. The Jews are just a buyer. They don't join or not. And that's how I am. I'm like, I don't sell anything.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I mean, people pay a lot of money to be part of groups and stuff, but I'm not selling anything. I'm just a. The people.

Speaker B: So.

Speaker A: So I'm a Jewish Mormon Jew who almost married a Southern bapt, uh, woman where I was the only, uh, white, uh, person in the church. And then I've taken Catholic communion like five, four or five times. So it's like all these religions.

Speaker B: I enjoy exploring other religions. It's a very, it's very fun. And yeah, a lot of my. I mean, I have a lot of friends inside and outside of the LDS faith, and the entrepreneurs that I know outside of the LDS faith do have very strong, uh, faith that I, that I've.

Speaker A: I think it's important to have. Um, one of the chapters in Epic Life is, uh, is God winks. Uh, I just think things are meant to be. Um, I'm, I'm always. It's very rare, very rare that talk to people like us that they don't believe in some type of higher power.

Speaker B: Yeah, well, I think, uh. Yeah, I think there's something very special about it. I mean. Yeah. And I don't really. Yeah, I'm. I'm agnostic to the point where, like, I, I don't really, uh. I don't really care what anybody else does, you know, like what they believe or anything like that. As long as we can get it done, like, we get it done, you know.

Speaker A: Yeah. So you're like a hybrid of, um. You're a hybrid of genetics, culture, religion. Super interesting.

Speaker B: Well, we had it. We had that, you know, like, grew, uh. I grew up Mormon, um, obviously, and then, ah. My. Both of my parents were Mormon, but when we lived in Iowa, I was like the only Mormon in my high school.

Speaker A: Were they there because of a mission? Is that how they ended up in Iowa?

Speaker B: No. So, yeah, how we ended up. How a bunch of Polynesians ended up in, In Iowa. That's a long story.

Speaker A: I was gonna ask because your tattoo looked. Looked, uh, like moai or. Uh.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had. So I got that this was part of my, uh, you know, coming of age thing, but I, I enjoyed that. It was a very spiritual experience. No, my uh, my parents met at byu, so the joke I always tell, like, when I do stand up is like, my, uh, My. My dad's Russian. My mom's Hawaiian. And that's what happens when your parents made a byu. And then you get these, uh, this little thing.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Um, yeah.

Speaker A: So anyway, Hawaiian, Iowan all over.

Speaker B: Done.

Speaker A: I mean, wow.

Speaker B: Done it. I never know what. Yeah. Crazy stuff.

Speaker A: Yeah, because you're like an old soul in a young, uh, body. And then you have. I'm guessing you have a very childlike. Like, you're like a child, uh, with children. Like a little kid.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yep. I love kids. I love babies. They're my favorite thing.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I don't really like talking to, like, human adults. It gets really awkward. Like, I just hang out with my kids and their friends and play football with them, but with, like, people like you, I'm, like, the biggest extrovert on the planet.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, that's so. That's so true. Well, uh, Justin, this conversation went by way too fast. I loved every minute of it. Hey, before I let you go officially on the podcast, tell everybody where they can follow you, where they can get your stuff, all that good stuff.

Speaker A: I challenge your visionary Mormon brain here to, um. Because I think it's hilarious how, like, you have these deep, philosophical conversations, and at the end of shows, you're like, can we have your website?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I think there needs to be a better someone, someone like us to do this, where we cut. I, um, mean, it's just so ridiculous. I know. It has to be done. I get.

Speaker B: But no, I. I mean, I. This is your show. I gotta, like. I gotta let you sign up.

Speaker A: We just, like, talked about, uh. It's breviknetwork.org brevicnetwork.org oh, my God. So funny. All right.

Speaker B: I love it. Just that setup.