How to Stand Out From Your Competitors with Chantal Cornelius｜EP99

Speaker A: Foreign. And welcome to the Profit Playbook Podcast. In this show, we discuss entrepreneurship, digital marketing and how to grow a profitable online business with some of the best minds in the space. I'm your host, Tyler Narducci. I broke free of the 9 to 5 rat race back in 2015 by starting my own digital marketing agency and have since scaled it up to multiple seven figures. Today, I run a consulting firm, helping Marketing agencies and B2B business owners rapidly scale their online businesses through our 100% done for you leads and sales program. We do this by fully automating your lead generation, sales and client fulfillment. If you're interested in taking your agency or B2B business to the next level, then apply now at www.profitpeak.co. that's www.profitpeak co. There will be a clickable link in the podcast show notes below. Now let's dive into today's episode. All right, I'm, um, your host, Heather Ducci.

Speaker B: And welcome back to another episode of the Profit Playbook podcast. We talk about all things business growth. If you find any value in the show at all, please show us some love by dropping us a like. Or consider subscribing to the show on YouTube, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Today I have with me Chantal Cornelius. Since founding Apple tree Marketing in 2000, Chantal has spent the last two decades helping hundreds of service businesses grow and achieve their goals through making strong emotional connections with their clients. Chantal knows that the key to standing out from your competitors is to build strong, long lasting relationships with your clients.

Speaker A: Her mission is to help business owners

Speaker B: realize that the path of success doesn't involve churning out endless social content. And her work. Chantal introduces service based businesses to different standout strategies that they can use to make the best emotional connections with their clients and stand out from their competitors by incorporating more emotion and empathy into their work. So we're going to be talking a little bit about emotions and connecting with your clients on a deeper level. So I'm really excited for that. Chantal, thank you so much again for joining us, um, on the show today.

Speaker C: Thank you for having me. It's great to be here.

Speaker B: Absolutely. So I can see the tree behind you and the tree has been around now for 24 years. So tell us, uh, why, why are we called Apple Tree? Why, why did you decide on that?

Speaker C: Oh, I love, I love this one. I, yeah, I, I set up my business in 2000 and when I, I left the corporate world and actually set up as a freelance copywriter. So I was Writing content for, for brochures, press releases, websites. Social media didn't exist back then so we didn't have to have to worry about, about that. And um, I wanted a business name that was a bit fun and creative, but that didn't say anything about what I did that would have some longevity. And a friend of mine, quite a few friends of mine had set up their own businesses and one of them said to me, oh, you must pick something that begins with A because then you'll be at the beginning of all the alphabetical listings. Well, it doesn't really work like that anymore. But I was actually sitting in my garden all those years ago and I had a beautiful old apple tree in the garden and I just looked up at it and thought, oh, that might work. So I went to a graphic designer I'd been working with anyway, and she came up with this, this funky little design which is the, the green tree. And I said, it's got to have a blue apple. My favorite colors are blue and green and it's, it's got to stand out. I'm not having the classic red apple. So that's where that came from. The add on to that is that seven years later I bought a house that was called Apple Tree Cottage. And I know it's really cool.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker C: Friend of mine heard about it, she said, I know you're looking to move. I found this place, it's called Apple Tree Cottage. I said, that's my house. I'm having it. And I've been here ever since. I've been here for nearly 18 years. And most people think that I named the house after the business or the business after the house are completely unrelated. But uh, it's a very special place and, and I'm never leaving. And I have five apple trees here. So it goes on.

Speaker A: Wow.

Speaker B: You live in Apple Tree Cottage with five apple trees and a business named Apple Tree Marketing. I, I love those, uh, little universal synchronicities that we find throughout our lives that uh, that just kind of work and click. So I, I love to see that in my own life with you. Why did you decide to set up Apple Tree Marketing? What was the motivation, uh, behind.

Speaker C: Turns out that I'm not very good at working for other people.

Speaker B: I can relate to that.

Speaker C: No, to every other self employed person on the planet.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker C: I walked out of Jobs. I argued with bosses. I got sacked. Uh, they were all idiots. Uh, they weren't. But I'm not very good at taking direction. The final kick was the job I was in wasn't going anywhere. And my boss wasn't interested in marketing. And I just thought I could do more. I could. Rather than sitting here pretending to be helping this company, I could actually go out and help more people. And it's a bit of a cliche, but for me, making a difference has always been really, really important. And I thought if I go and set up on my own, I get to choose who I work with. I could work with lots of different small businesses. I could help all of them or lots of them. And so that's what I did. I jumped out of my not very exciting corporate job and set up on my own.

Speaker B: Yeah, you have a similar story to me and a lot of other marketing agency owners that I know out there that have this gut intuition, feeling, desire, pull, draw to. I feel like I could be doing more. I know that there's more out there for me. Uh, and they often that's coupled with a work environment that's either hostile or toxic or not going anywhere. The latter doesn't, isn't visibly there. I, uh, mean, at least that was the case for me and a lot of people that I talk to.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And I, I think a good takeaway from that is if you're listening and you felt that same pull and you've had that, that, that toxic boss and you're not liking the job environment that you're in and you've been ignoring that pull and that, that gut feeling, it's time to stop. It's time to stop.

Speaker C: Time. Time to listen. Listen. Listen to the gut feeling. Because, yeah, I'm big on intuition. And the times in my life when I haven't listened is when I've ended up in a bit of a pickle. Whereas if I listen, the other, the other really important element for me was, was flexibility. I, I have my own horse. And, um, when I was working for that company, I had to rush to get to the stables to be able to ride one day a week. We were allowed to leave early and it was still a frantic rush. And I got to thinking, I don't, I don't want this anymore. Riding is a bit of a passion for me. And so as soon as I set up on my own, I moved the horse to stables where I could look after him. And it just gave me the flexibility. And I'm still doing it where I live now. My office is at the bottom of the garden. House is over there. The horse is just over there. She. She's out in a field somewhere. And there are days when I think, right I've got a few hours, it's not raining. I'm gonna go riding. And it's just, I just love it. To have that freedom and the freedom. Yeah, really good.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker C: Really important.

Speaker B: Yeah. It, so it's, it's sad because I feel like there's so many people out there that, that have that feeling, have that, that uh, intuition. Your gut is screaming that this isn't right. Um, but they, they, they over brain it. Ah. Or they over, you know, either you can think with your head and your head is good in many cases, helping you sort, you know, options. But when you think with your gut and you think with your heart sometimes, I mean, at least, uh, in my own opinion, listening to your heart and listening to your gut is almost like way more effective than listening to your head in most cases. Because logically, when I left my job and did that, you know, I wanted, I, uh, gained enough clients to do that so that my head wasn't insanely screaming, but it was still screaming. You know what I mean? Like, this isn't safe. This isn't dangerous. You get benefits with this job. You know, what, what if your clients leave you? You know, you have all those things going on. Um, but the reality is in many cases the, the security of having even just a handful, five different clients paying you, uh, retainers is actually five times greater than one employer paying you one paycheck. Because the chances of all five of those clients firing you at the same time.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: Is kind of up there. I mean, you have to be really, really bad. Uh, you have to be really, really bad at what you do. But the chance of that one employer is just as much as one of those clients. So there's almost this false sense of security of staying in there because you're safe. But whereas when you start diversifying your income across multiple clients, I personally find that to be a safer bet. Really?

Speaker C: That's a brilliant way of looking at it. I'd never really thought about it, but you're right. It's more likely that if you're full time employed, there's a high probability that your boss will suddenly say, right, that's it, you're sacked. I was made redundant from a job that I loved and I'd only been there 11 months. Um, I didn't see it coming. And all of a sudden I'm like, okay, I'm out. What next? Whereas, yeah, you're right, it's pretty unlikely that all five clients are going to sack you on the same day. You must have to do something hideously wrong to do that.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker C: But yeah, it does, it does, it does spread the load. But I think there are a lot of people out there who don't make the move. And I think that's what you were saying about listening to your gut and your heart more than your head and think. That's one of the reasons I've been drawn to the research I've done around emotions and these strategies. Talk about. Because we make decisions subconsciously and emotionally 95% of the time.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker C: Kind of the gut and the heart. The head then jumps in and goes, oh, rational, no, we must do xyz. Or we had irrational decision going, I'm going to go and set up my own business. And then the head goes, yes, okay, you can do that as long as you do X, Y, Z. So that's an interesting way of looking at it.

Speaker B: I've seen a lot of things about, like, evolution and how your brain and our brains are just wired to keep us alive.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: Like they're constantly trying to keep us alive. And, you know, back in the day, that served us very, very well when we lived in caves and we were foraging for our food and there's tigers out there and you had to look out for, you know, you know, you didn't make it very long in life because if, you know, a bear comes along, that's it. Right. And so you have this constant state of fight or flight we still have in our, you know, brains today because we haven't got that far down the, uh, evolutionary path, but our lives are dramatically different and much more comfortable now. And you don't need that constant fight or flight all the time. So your brain in a, uh, in a toxic work situation is constantly in that fight or flight. It's constantly in that, stressed out, constantly in that. And that's why so many people go home and they're just completely exhausted. Like, they're just wiped out and they're drained. Because you're not enjoying what you do. You don't like it, you're not getting rewarded for it very often. I mean, uh, sometimes it's, you're getting paid really, really well. So that's the, the, the math. But oftentimes, uh, you're not even getting paid super, super well and you don't like what you do and your heart is telling you to do something else. And it's like, how many more universal signals do you need to say, enough is enough and I'm going to go find my apple cottage with my five apple trees and ride my horse when I want to. Because that's how life is meant to be lived.

Speaker C: Exactly. Listen, listen to, listen to the warning signs. I've, I've become so much better at, uh, taking note of the red flags. I've had times in the past when I've become quite ill because I've worked too hard and I don't listen to the signs. Whereas now I'm like, okay, yeah, that's right, that's telling me that. Or that's telling me don't work with that client or do work with this one, take a risk on that. So, yeah, so I, yeah, I, I, I kind of feel slightly sorry for anyone who is in an a, not very well paid job that they hate but, but they're too scared to leave. Like, no, get out. I mean, I was, I was lucky. I had, I had financial support from, from my now ex husband. When I wanted to set the business up, he was working full time and I said, I want to run my own business. He went, okay, um, and we, and we survived. And I know a lot of people don't have that financial security and yet there are grants, there are loans. There, there, there is, there is a way to do it. Yeah, definitely. Anyone who's listening, if you're thinking about setting up your own business, just do it. If been nagging you for long enough that, yeah, do it, just do it.

Speaker B: And I mean, and myself, like, I didn't have, I didn't have that financial support from someone else. I had to figure it out myself. And so I had to figure out what's the happy balance between my, my brain that's screaming this is too scary and too risky, and my heart that's saying, I hate this, I gotta go. You, there's so much more for you. And how I was able to do that without that financial support was I said, okay, start, start the business on the side. Don't leave the job. And for everyone listening, you don't also, you don't have to quit your job today and go start getting clients and hope that it works out. You can start getting a client, the next client, and start bringing them on one by one and have your revenue goals. My personal revenue goal back in 2015 when I started was I want to before I will bring this to my, my job. I want to make three times the amount. If I can bring in three times my paycheck in alternate clients, that was my marker in the sand for okay, now I can go bring this to my client or bring this to my boss. Right? And when I brought to my boss. It was with the intention of flipping my boss to my number for my next client. It wasn't to quit. It was to then to be like, okay. But I knew there was a huge risk there in them saying no and that being the end. And so if they said no and that being the end, I needed to have that marker in the CN with those security downwardly.

Speaker C: Yeah. Very clever. Yeah.

Speaker A: And I did that.

Speaker B: And I did that, and I brought

Speaker A: it to m. My boss.

Speaker B: It blew up in my face. It was awful. Uh, they. They were horrified that I would dare spend my time on anything else other than their business. And they gave me a full ultimatum. Your business or ours.

Speaker C: Wow.

Speaker B: And I know I was a wild, too. I thought it was a slam. I had a slam dunk offer. I'm like, you're going to. I offered them to pay me less. Uh, the only thing they had to sacrifice was me in the office.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And they would get all the same work, but just in a retainer to my agency instead of being the employee. Thought it was a slam dunk. But they had very, very old mindset. They needed to see a butt in a seat in order to believe that work was being done. This is pre Covid. This was, you know, and so, uh, it ended up being a no, and that was totally fine. And I left, never looked back, and continued growing. So you don't have to. You don't have to, uh, get lucky and have the financial support like Chantal did. You don't have to quit your job and risk it all and go on. There are paths where you can kind of build it up on the side. But the point is, if your gut is telling you and your heart is telling you, you need. You need to do it.

Speaker C: And you've had a plan. And I think that's really important, that if you, however you decide to go and set up a new business or take on a new venture or do anything different, have a plan. You know, I was running a workshop yesterday for a client, and we were talking about creating a marketing strategy and a plan. Don't just jump in and go, oh, I hope it'll work. Yeah, your Plan of. Of 3 times your. Your salary before doing anything else. Brilliant. Yeah. Really, really good idea. Yeah.

Speaker B: That was the compromise I made with my brain to be able to listen, to follow my heart, basically. Um, but. But. And it worked out the way. The way it worked out, and I'm really thankful for that. So, moving right along for the audience, what is a USP first? And why don't you think that they work?

Speaker C: Okay, A, ah, USP is a unique selling point or a unique selling proposition. It's the old fashioned way. If you said to somebody what makes you different, they, they will say, oh my. USP is the reason they don't work is predominantly because they're all about selling. And if you go to a networking event or you're introduced to a potential client, the person you're talking to isn't necessarily in the market to buy from you. And if you're talking about a unique selling point, you're trying to sell something to them and they may not want to buy right, then they m. Might have only just met you or anyone just heard about you. The other reason that they don't work is that everybody says the same thing while trying to be different. I noticed this mostly with coaches. I work with, uh, a lot of coaches and consultants and trainers and the coaches were all saying, oh, what makes me different is I help you get from where you are to where you want to be.

Speaker B: Great.

Speaker C: I know that's. I love coaches. I have fabulous coaches. I've been coached all through my business career and I wouldn't be without my coaches. But the number of times that I heard that, it started me thinking, okay, this, something is not right. And it's, it's, there's, there's no emotional connection there. So it's, yeah, it's all about selling. And there's nothing unique. So. And when, when you're, when, when there's just you in your business or even a smaller business, a lot of other people saying to me, oh, I'm, I'm what makes it unique. Yeah, you, it's difficult to promote a business on that as well. So that's what.

Speaker B: Especially if they haven't met you yet, uh, or fallen in love with you yet online in any way, shape or form, like, you're not a good selling point because they haven't, they're not trusting you yet. So that doesn't work.

Speaker C: Exactly.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I see that. I see that a lot with a lot of the clients that I work with as well. Um, when we work with marketing agencies and other B2B clients and we're, we're talking to them about their business and about their offers. One common thing that I see a mix up in the same category is, uh, what's your offer? And they'll tell us what their services are like. I do Facebook ads for $3,000 a month, uh, is what they'll tell us. And I'm like, That's not an offer. That's a service with a price tag. And anyone out, any other competitors out there also can do, you know, Facebook ads for whatever price tag as well. Uh, a service and a price tag is not an offer. What's the offer? What are you gonna. What's the results that you're gonna get, uh, in what amount of time or else what? Like, you gotta. There's. There's so much more to an offer, and I feel like there. People don't understand the difference between offers and services and, uh, and how a USP fits into that, um, all along. But, but I love the, the line of thinking there. Now we're definitely getting into the meat and potatoes here, uh, of this episode and what that is your standout strategies. So I'm, uh, I understand you have five standout strategies. So if usps are, uh, don't really work, standout strategies do. So talk to me about standout.

Speaker C: Okay. Having heard far too many coaches tell me the same thing about what made them m. Different, I started digging into this back in 2015 and looking at what else was it that made businesses stand out and how could we find a better way of doing it? And I started reading around and discovering that it's actually about emotional connections. Like I said earlier, we make 95% of our decisions emotionally and subconsciously. We don't even realize we're doing it half the time. So if we can tap in as suppliers, if we can tap into the emotions that our clients want to feel when they, when they work with a supplier, that's going to give us a much better connection. And the more digging I did, the more I was. I was able to identify five different strategies. And shall I, shall I. Shall I take you through them quickly?

Speaker B: Yeah, let's go. Let's go through them. I don't know if you want to go through one and then go deeper into one, or do you want to go through all five and then kind of backtrack and explain them?

Speaker C: I will. I'll go. I'll go through all five. But what, what I'll say to start with is, as you're listening to them, what usually happens is most businesses have one of the five. That is the strategy that will make them stand out. This is not about trying to use all five. This is about how to stand out and how to be unique. So there will be one of the five for most people, where they go, oh, yeah, that's me. Um, I've created a test on my website as well, which will help you identify even more accurately which is the right one when you know which is the right one to use. There's a set of language that comes with each of the five strategies and it's emotional language. So then we can use that language in our marketing and our promotions and it attracts the clients who we really want to work with. Make sense.

Speaker B: Um, I'm, I. Now I need to know. Now I need to know because now I'm like, oh God, what have I been using the wrong one or any of them at all?

Speaker C: Real time. Okay. The first one is called certainty. This is where clients want to feel. They want to feel a sense of safety, security. They want to feel, um, they want clarity in what they're doing. They want confidence from you as a supplier. So it's all about being a safe pair of hands. It's not for fun and sexy and exciting. It's just straight talking safety. So that's, that's certainty. The second one is called connection. And this is where clients will work with you because they want to feel a sense of belonging. They want to feel connected, not necessarily to you, but to other people. So your job will quite often be about connecting them to other people, bringing them, uh, giving them harmony with other suppliers, helping them to be part of something bigger than just, just them. It's about relationships. Definitely that one. The third one is called contribution. Now this is where clients will, when they work with you, they want to feel a sense of collaboration and duty, but also they're looking to give back some way. They want to pay it forwards as well. They may well be interested in philanthropy, developing a better purpose, being of service and sharing what they can do with, with other people. And they're looking to you as a supplier to help them do that. Number four is called growth. This is where clients are looking to grow themselves personally or their business, or both. Quite often it's both. And they're looking to feel more courageous. They want to feel empowered and energized and excited by the supplier that they're working with. They need somebody who's going to motivate them and be a cheerleader, but also to stretch them and encourage them to go further. And number five is called significance. And this one is where clients will work with you because they want to feel a sense of belonging, but also a sense of appreciation. They want to be. They want to feel seen and heard. They want to make a much bigger impact. They want to feel more respected in the work they do. And they're looking to you as a supplier to help Them. So those are the five. Did any of those jump out at you?

Speaker B: For me, definitely certainty, for sure. Um, and I think mostly because of the type of clients that I work with, because they're bombarded by so many other offers and they're bombarded with so many other people in a similar space or maybe trying to do a same, a similar thing. They don't know who to trust and who's going to, you know, who's going to be the most effective. So I think certainty plays a big one. When he talked about community, that one, that one rang big for like coaches, definitely coaches that, you know, would, would be signing up, uh, you know, clients in a, a more collaborative way. Um, but, uh, for me, I, I would say definitely more certainty. How can a person with. I mean, I guess these, these would be best categorized by the type of business that you have or the type of clients that you're working with or what, what would you say about that?

Speaker C: It's, it's actually about how the clients want to feel. Let me, let me give you an example because when I was first digging into this, I was, I'd grown my business to the point where I had, I had, I had a team here in the office and they were mostly young and super enthusiastic and really keen on this new thing called social media that was coming out. And I spent quite a lot of my time talking to our clients and talking to potential new clients saying, marketing's great, isn't it? We can really help you grow your business and we can do videos and blogs and social media and all this stuff for you. And I, ah, love marketing. So I was getting all excited about helping clients to grow. And then I realized that the clients were being quite resistant to that approach. And so I started asking them, m. What do you actually want from us? Why do you work with us? And the phrases they kept coming back with is, you are a safe pair of hands. At the time m. My team here, we were doing marketing for people. So now I just tell people what marketing to do. I mentor them and tell them what to do. But back then we were doing it. So they were saying, you're a safe pair of hands. You just get our marketing done and we get results. And we don't know how you get the results and we don't care because you just get it done. And, um, so what I was, what I've been doing is I was trying to use the growth strategy to promote my business. What my clients were saying is they wanted certainty. So I was listening to my Existing clients. Now, if you've already got existing clients, talk to them, find out why they work with you and how they want to feel. Uh, my clients now say, I want a sense of confidence and clarity when they work with me and I am still a safe pair of hats. They don't say, oh, I want to feel empowered and excited about marketing. Who would, other than us marketers? So if you've already got clients, talk to them about what they want. If you're just self starting out in business, you get to choose. You know, if I was starting again, I might say, actually, I'm going to go for growth. You know, the growth strategy. And then you attract those people in. Where it goes wrong is what I was doing. I was trying to promote my business on growth and my existing clients were going, we don't want growth. We want, we want certainty. A lot of my.

Speaker B: Can you explain a little bit the difference, though? Because, like, wouldn't the client want to be certain that you're going to help them grow?

Speaker C: Yes, but actually what was going on at the time is the majority of my clients had been in business for quite a long time. They were brilliant at what they do, what they did, and they had really strong reputations. What they were looking to me for was to maintain those reputations. Uh, and what we found is because they were all service businesses, coaches, consultants, trainers, speakers, they had these fabulous reputations. And so we were putting out marketing that enhanced that reputation, that said, this person is still here. They're still doing what they're doing. They're still brilliant at it. So they actually weren't looking for massive growth. Now, I used to. I had one client who was an HR consultant and she used to run. Well, we used to run workshops for her three or four times a year, and we promote them like crazy. We'd get a whole bunch of her clients and potential clients to come along. We'd video them, we'd produce videos and, um, blogs for her. People would sign up. People would call her, saying, I've heard about your workshop. I couldn't make it, but can you do my HR for me? So that was. I know, I loved it. It was. And she'd phone me all excited, oh, I've got another new client. And I think because they come from a referral or recommendation, so it's very different to a business that might want exponential growth. So that's, that's, uh. And there are businesses that want that, but that wasn't what I was providing.

Speaker B: So now how. In. In your intro, there was A line about without producing endless content. So how can you be effective with these standout strategies? Especially, um, you know, the, the. The certainty and the. And the. And the other ones that you were talking about. Without all of that social media content, how are you effectively getting that?

Speaker C: There are still businesses that need social media? Very definitely. In my business, the only social media I do is randomly occasional LinkedIn posts. I'm posting a couple of times a week at the moment because my new book's just come out and I'm having a launch party online. So I'm shouting about that. I have an ABC of marketing. A stands for ask for referrals, B is business networking, and C is content. And the A and the B, when you provide, when you run a service business. So when you're selling yourself, your time, your expertise and your experience, people will buy you, buy from you because somebody has recommended you or because they've met you at an event or they've heard you on a podcast. I get that quite a bit. Nobody is going to buy either of us from a tweet. Nobody's gonna have. Nobody's gonna trust us and go, yep, I'm gonna give you $3,000 a month just because I saw this one tweet. I think in some. I'm gonna stick my neck on the line here. I think there's a lot of desperation going on. A lot of people are saying, well, if I put out, uh, I heard somebody say recently, he tweets 150 times a day. Now that to me is utter desperation. He really is desperate.

Speaker B: That's tiring, exhausting.

Speaker C: And they must all be automated and they're just being churned out. And he's probably not even looking at all the responses. Whereas I had a bit of a glitch in my business a few months ago. So I got on the phone, I did the old fashioned thing of I wrote a list of my favorite clients and my favorite contacts and referrers. And I got on the phone and I called up every single one and said, who do you know who you can recommend me to? So I wasn't saying to them, do you want some more marketing? Do you need some more help? I said, who do you know? And the work has been flooding in because these are all my A grade clients, my wow clients who love me and love what I do. So they go, oh, yeah. Oh, let me refer you to xyz. So referrals and networking and speaking on stage or on podcasts, those. When you run a service business, that's what will get you the business. The content is then back up. So I put out, I send out an email newsletter once a month. I do these random LinkedIn posts. That's all, that's all I need to do. And yes, I know I'm lucky. I've been doing it for 24 years. And uh, for people who are newer in business, they might need more. But it's not about churning out endless posts. It's quality over quantity. Very definitely, yeah.

Speaker B: And it ties back to that real emotional connection that you were talking about before. You don't really get that good emotional connection from someone finding you on social media. I think, I think the, the big message here is social media does work. It is good and it can help your business. But social, uh, media is a great. Actually it kind of goes along with a lot of things that I tell my clients as well, which is like we'll, when we sign them up, we will run, uh, their, we will run their paid ads for them to help generate new, new prospects, get them in the pipeline, start nurturing them with emails. Um, and we'll also put out, uh, content, social media content on their pages. Um, and we explained to them that the, the organic content on the pages that we're creating isn't designed to go find someone brand new, convince them to purchase your services, and then they sign up because it's, it's, it's a huge reach to do that from just a, like a random social media post like you're talking about.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: But what it, where it does help is those connections that you've already made that are then seeing you again. And it's an additional piece of information from you reminder. Like we'll generate leads for them through ads and then, then they'll be like, okay, who is this guy? Let's go check out this guy. They go to the page and they're like, oh, okay, I see what they're about. I see.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: And the, and the, the content reinforces the connection that was previously built. Right. So if you're getting a referral and they refer you to, you know, Susie B Business, and Susie B. Says, oh, who's Chantal? Let me look her up. And she looks up Chantal and then she sees the content. Now Susie B Is, you know, is actively, you know, okay, and the walls are down a little bit more. She knows a little bit more about you. But, but that initial connection to Susie B wasn't just that organic social media post that was never going to end up on Susie B's feed anyway because Organic is pretty much dead, but it's good to have there because it gives them. You want to give people who are looking you up something to find. And if they, if they can't find anything, then you're shooting yourself in the foot, especially as a digital marketer, but

Speaker C: especially if, you know, if you're recommended to somebody, that somebody, Suzy B. Whoever, is going to go and look you up online and if they can't find anything useful.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker C: I'm always saying to my clients, yes, be on LinkedIn, post now and then, but also add articles. My newsletter goes up as a LinkedIn article as well because then people can see it there. I have a page on my website called Appearances and it's got podcast interviews on it. And I've had people who've been, they've heard about me, they go and look at that page. They go and listen. You'll be up there soon. You know, they go and listen to some of the podcasts. I've been on to get another. A better flavor of oh, can do. I like the sound of her. Can. Can she help? So, yeah, it's. The content is definitely, definitely back up.

Speaker B: The organic isn't going to go and find you new clients, but it's going to, it's going to give you authority with those clients that have found you some way in one of these and one of these standout, uh, strategies that are going to go, then look you up, uh, and they feel much better about moving forward with you and proceeding. So, um, I think that's, that's a big thing to pull out of that.

Speaker C: There's also a way that we can enhance the content that we're putting out by using the language that goes with the, the strategy. So can I do a quick plug?

Speaker B: Yeah, no, please tell us about that.

Speaker C: Um, on my website, which is appletree uk.com There's a page called Take the Test and it's, it's a free test. You go along, read the instructions, tick some boxes, and you'll then get an email that says, this is your strategy. This is the one to use to make your business stand out. You'll also get a list of language to use with that, uh, strategy. So, for example, for you, Tyler and me, certainty, if you start weaving language like assured, clarity, confidence, focus, peace of mind, relief, responsibility. I'm reading this off my website and I kind of know the words quite well. Weave those words into your marketing, into your content. It jumps out. The people who want that, we'll see it. I recently rewrote, uh, a LinkedIn profile for one of my clients, and her strategy is growth. And we wrote fabulous. We went for it, went for a walk and recorded. Recorded the conversation we had. And we've turned it into all sorts of fabulous material. But I've then gone through, and I've woven in the growth words, so I've added in words like challenged, courage, educated, empowered, energized. And those words will really resonate with potential clients of hers who are looking for that. That level of support. So that's kind of the magic of it, that when we start weaving the language in of how people want to feel, that's actually going back to what we talked about earlier. That's where the gut and the heart go, oh, I like this. Yeah, you don't know why. And the head. The head is then going, ah, uh, well, okay, yes, I'll be rational and say X, Y, Z. But, you know, we. We can reach people through the emotion, through the gut and the heart. And that's why they then go, oh, I want to work with her. And I'm not even sure why.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, human beings are emotional creatures. We're emotional buyers. Uh, and if you're going to market to emotional buyers, you should probably put some emotion in your marketing. Emotional marketing works for emotional buyers. Maybe that should be the name of the episode.

Speaker C: Like it? Yeah. Nice. Yeah. Because there are. There are people who will go, no, no, I'm. I'm keeping emotion out of this completely. Um, and that's. And that's fine. But anyone who wants to work with a supplier where there is an emotional connection. Yeah, this is. This is the way to do it, I think.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And I think anyone that says that they don't buy on emotion is probably lying to themselves on some level.

Speaker C: Yeah. They probably don't understand just how much. How many of our emotions are made, uh, how many of our decisions are made emotionally. It's like when you walk into a room and you see somebody for the first time and, you know, they say you've got however many seconds it is to make a first impression. It's because our emotions, the bit of the brain that makes those decisions, that's working already before the conscious bit goes, oh, uh, no, I'm not sure I like them. If you have a gut feeling about somebody and you think, oh, well, I'm not sure about that person. And then a bit later on, you think, oh, no, they're actually, uh, they're okay. And then they do the dirty on you. And Your gut goes, yeah, I told you so.

Speaker B: Yeah, it was.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker C: Impressions do actually count. So, uh, those decisions are made subconsciously.

Speaker B: Our emotional guidance system really is the. What guides our entire life. You know, it's what guides us in or out of that job that we were talking about earlier. Um, it's what guides us into partnering with different people in our business. It's what guides us. And another. Another thing that you should use your emotional guidance for is, you know, help sifting and sorting clients that you want to take on as well as the business owner.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: If you're getting bad vibes during the sales process.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: That's also another big emotional flag that you should use as the business owner, too, to, you know, say no to clients. Because I'll tell you right now, a, uh, a draining, emotionally or mentally draining client is never worth any amount of money that they're paying you.

Speaker C: Not worth it? No. And, um, when they, you know, if somebody comes to me and says, I need it done quickly, or I had one recently, you said, I just want you to sort out my LinkedIn profile, because that'll bring me work, won't it? And I'm like, uh, no, it'll help, but it. No, won't fix anything. So people for me who want something done really quickly or who quibble over the price or who. Yeah, uh, I might, because I've been doing this for long enough. Or people who say they want results really quickly, that's not the marketing and support that I do. So I. I will say that I'm sorry. I'm not. I'm, um, not the right person for you.

Speaker B: Yeah, there is somebody out there who

Speaker C: can help them, but it ain't me.

Speaker B: And then you protect your piece as a business owner, and, uh, that's another thing. You know, once you. Once you do start the business and you start getting clients, the biggest privilege in the world is being able to say no to a bad, fit client. And you. Most of us have to learn that lesson the hard way. Um, I know I did. Um, and I know many, many people out there have before, but, you know, it doesn't matter how much they. They want to pay you, you know, as long as your bills are paid and you're. You're good. Like, you really, really do need to get to that place where you can say no to clients despite that, the, the money that they want to bring. Because another thing that can happen that I've seen happen is you escape that 9 to 5 that you hated is toxic. Uh, a, uh, toxic work environment. Now you have your own business. And then you create an entirely new toxic situation for yourself. You create an entire cage around yourself. And now all of a sudden, not only are you not. You're. You're not working nine to five, you're working 24, seven. And you're also not enjoying it because you've now surrounded yourself with a bunch of clients that are not good fit for what you want to do that you let desperate clients. And I think that's probably one of the biggest red flags is what you hit on, um, is an incoming client. If they're desperate from day one, this has to work, or else this is. You should likely not bring that client on.

Speaker C: Ones who say things like, oh, I'll try you out for a month. No, you won't. No.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker C: Six months minimum with me. Yeah, I'm. Yeah, I've been doing this for 24 years and I still make that stupid mistake. I haven't done it for a while. But every now and then somebody comes along and says, oh, could you do this for me? And if I'm, if work's a bit quiet or I think the money is good, then I might, uh, I really have to listen to my gut. And it has to really scream at me, go, no, don't do it. Because too often I go, oh, yeah, it'll be fine. And then I think, okay, hang on. What happened last time I did this? So, yeah, it, it does get easier, doesn't it, as. As you go through business? But even now, all these years on, I still have to really listen to my gut and go, okay, all right, I won't do it.

Speaker B: Some. And some of them are easy to see. Some of them are easy to see. And others, uh, are like sneak attacks. Like, I recently had one, um, with my agency that they're like, I love it. Let's move forward. Like, it was all green lights and everything. And they were like, oh, but, but we need to add this to the contract. I need a guaranteed xxx outcome and this, this other outcome and buy this, throw that in the contract, and then we're good to go. And I'm more like, wait a minute, wait a minute. What? Um, and then. And then they kind of just revealed their face as, you know, you're. You're desperate. And what they do when you, when you sign up a client like that is they put all of that desperation and press, so they're holding all that tension and baggage, and now it's your problem that you better solve for them, otherwise it's going to create a huge headache for you and you'll literally feel that energy transfer.

Speaker C: Yeah, just. No, not worth it.

Speaker B: No, it's never, never worth it. Um, if you're going to create a business for yourself and you're going to grow a business for yourself, grow one that you enjoy. If it's your lifestyle, don't give yourself 10 new toxic bosses. Find clients that are, that are at the level that you want and that you can confidently do.

Speaker C: Those ones will then recommend you to the right sort of people. And I've had clients in the past where I've, Long time ago, and I said, yeah, okay, you can have a discount because you haven't got very much money. The problem with that is they then go and recommend me to other people who don't have any money or who want a discount, and you kind of end up in this downward, messy spiral. And I had, uh, years ago, I had a really lovely client who kept recommending me to coaches who had no money at all. And they were all completely mad. And, um, you know, I'd have conversations with them like, yeah, yeah, I really want to work with you. Oh, I haven't got any money. Like, uh, none at all. How. What can I have for free? In the end, I had to go to my client and say, look, please stop it. I can't help these people. I can give them a little bit of advice, but, yeah, because so you have to care.

Speaker B: You do have to be careful. You are coming out with another book soon. Uh, would you like to tell us a little bit more about the book and what it's about?

Speaker C: Well, it was actually published in October 2024. It is now out. It is around. It's on Amazon.

Speaker A: Even better.

Speaker C: It's even better. I know. It is called Standout Strategies. It's all about the five strategies. It goes into way more detail than we have time to talk through on a podcast. It's got lots of examples on. In it. It's got, um, it's got details on how. How you can work out which. Which is your strategy. You can do a DIY version or you can. You can take the test and then it shows you how to apply it to your marketing and your sales and your. Your delivery, your customer service. Because that. That bit's really important too. So, yeah, it is out. It is out in the world. Very.

Speaker B: Love it, love it, love it. You don't even have to wait for it. So go and find that. You said it was on Amazon.

Speaker C: Standout Strategies. Chantal Cornelius. It is there.

Speaker B: Perfect. Perfect. Uh, and then my last piece of, or my last, uh, question for you is something that I ask every guest at the end of our shows. But what would be your number one piece of advice for business, uh, owners who are looking to find new clients online?

Speaker C: Oh, good.

Speaker B: Gotta pick one. I know there's tons you could pick from, but you're top.

Speaker C: Oh, top one. I am. Um, I, I am, I'm still a really big fan of talking to people. So, so I, I wouldn't say to somebody, oh, just pick an industry and go and go and look for them. I would probably. Here's a thought. Okay. I would pick my top five a star. Wow. Clients. I'd go onto their LinkedIn profiles and I would.

Speaker B: Physical specific businesses or industries?

Speaker C: No, no, just, just favorite clients. People who I love working with, who I pick. Pick maybe five of them. I'd go and look at their LinkedIn profile and look at who they know who they're working with. And if I had to do it completely online, I would then probably ask them for a connect for an introduction to, I might say to client number one. Oh, you know this person, please, may I have an introduction? Um, but if I was doing it offline, I just pick up the phone. But yeah, I would, I would use LinkedIn and I would look for, I'd go to my favorite clients and um, actually I'd probably ask them m, who their favorite clients are because that way you're going to be, end up working, you're going to have introductions to really nice people. It's more labor intensive than some online strategies, but it's more focused and more targeted. And because it's about working with people who already know you and trust you and they're going to recommend you, it actually doesn't matter what industry you end up in.

Speaker B: I love it. I love it. This has been very much about human connection and, and utilizing the, you know, emotional connections that we already have and then setting up new emotional connections the right way with the right language from the start. Something that you really drilled in this, in this episode that a lot of my other guests don't is referrals. So that's kind of refreshing to hear because a lot, I feel like too many people forget about referrals and they just keep looking for that, that, that, you know, next client. But if you just ask your existing clients to bring you in something else and introduce you to some, uh, another fit like the connection that you have already, there's could be a ton of low hanging fruit there for you and low Hanging fruit, apple tree.

Speaker C: Uh, there we go. There it is.

Speaker B: Perfect. Perfect way to end. Chantal, how can our listeners get in touch with you?

Speaker C: They can. You can go to my website, which is AppleTree UK.com. you can also find me on LinkedIn. Uh, check the spelling of my name. The last time I looked, there were only two people in the world with this spelling. There's me in England and there's another lady in South Africa and we both look very different. So, yeah, find, find me on LinkedIn. Come and, come and say hello or go to my website and go and take the test and we'll have a look at which is, which is the right strategy for your business.

Speaker B: Chantal Cornelius of the uk. This has been an apple tree. Uh, marketing. This has been a phenomenal episode. So thank you so much for joining us on the show today. Uh, and maybe I'll have to have you back again sometime so we can go even deeper into these standout strategies because I feel like there's. We just barely scratched the surface there,

Speaker C: but let's do that. Love to. Yeah. Be great.

Speaker B: Love it. Thank you so much.

Speaker A: That's going to be it for today's episode. If you're ready to take your marketing agency or B2B business to the next level and have your leads, your sales and your client fulfillment all done 100% for you, then apply now at www.profitpeak.co. that's www.profitpeak co.

Speaker B: There will be a clickable link in

Speaker A: the podcast show notes below. See you on the next episode of the Profit Playbook Pod.