S2 Ep18: Behind Passport 2 Employment: A conversation with our L&D Coach, Lina & Candidate, Jamila

Speaker A: Hello, I'm Holly from Only a Pavement Away, the charity that supports people looking to rebuild their lives through employment opportunities in hospitality. Welcome back to our podcast series. Today we are shining a spotlight on learning and development, and I'm joined by our, uh, L and D coach, Lena, and also a candidate of ours, Jameela. So, guys, welcome, and let's get straight into it. Leena, to kick us off, um, can you start by introducing yourself and also just telling us a little bit about your role at Only A Pavement Away.

Speaker B: Of course. Hi, everyone. My name is Lina. I'm, um, a, uh, positive psychologist, and I am the learning and development coach at Only A Pavement Away. So what I do is, the focus of my role is working with the inner work of our candidates. So that inner work that has to happen maybe before they are ready to get into employment. So as you all know, our charity supports, uh, people facing different life circumstances. It can be, uh, homelessness, it can be mental health challenges, it can be, um, prison history. So they might need some support before they get into employment. So what it looks like is we focus on two main interview preparation and confidence. Um, and we do this via two routes, like we like to call it in our one to ones. So in our interview, uh, route, what we do is. Or what I do is I work, uh, in an individual setting with our candidates. And we work in terms of how to communicate their experience, how to share their stories, and how to really feel, uh, motivated and that they deserve to be in that room with them. And then there is the confidence route to that is where maybe there are candidates that they have so much experience, so many skills, but they might maybe freeze when they are in the interview room, or maybe they don't necessarily feel that they are good enough for the opportunities that they have. So what we do in those, um, spaces with these candidates is that we take a little bit more time and, uh, we go through emotional regulation. We talk about maybe that inner critic voice that's so many of us have, and we, uh, kind of learn how to see those thoughts. Kind of like clouds, I like to say to my candidates, and learn how to not engage with those and engage with the ones that are more useful and more productive, uh, to get the opportunity that you deserve. So that's what I do in our one to ones, basically, um, that's, uh, the 50% of my time, or I say a little bit more. And then there are other opportunities like training, work experience and passport to employment that we are going to be talking about that a little bit more Ah, later in the podcast, Brill and I

Speaker A: feel like you've kind of touched upon this question already. Um, but for anybody who's not listening, um, who might not know what the term means, um, what does L and D actually mean in this context? Um, what are you trying to do that perhaps a more standard employability service might not?

Speaker B: Yeah. So, uh, what we have seen is that in um, learning and development services, we focus a lot in training and skills. And um, we, we obviously do that as well in only a pavement way. However, we find out that sometimes the skills are not necessarily the barrier. Um, so many of our candidates come with so much experience and so many skills, but sometimes they just don't know how to share that or they feel that is not enough. Right. So what we're building here in L and D, um, is maybe like a step backwards and making sure that people have that psychological readiness so that people feel um, safe enough, grounded enough and self aware enough. So when they get into that room, um, something that I love to say to our candidates is I, um, want you that when you get into that room, you know that you deserve to be there. Uh, so many times when it comes to interview preparation, people think that is, let me memorize these answers because this is what they want to hear. And what I keep saying to them is, I don't want you to memorize anything. I want you to own your story, recognize what you're good at and share that. And that's what I really want them to do. Um, don't matter what you don't have. Focus on everything that you already have. And that's what I think that is what we're doing here that is a little bit different, uh, than maybe other services.

Speaker A: And I think um, there'll be a running theme of this throughout this particular episode. But you come from a positive psychology background. How does that shape the way that you work with our candidates?

Speaker B: Yeah, so for everyone that is listening and they don't know what positive psychology is, it's an uh, evidence based uh, approach in psychology. And what it propose is instead of only focusing on the diagnosed or in the mental health illness or it needs to be fixed, what we focus on is in what is already there. So we really focus on the strengths of the individual and we try to kind of like build from that instead of, okay, what is missing. So when it comes to the um, approach in psychology and what you can find in the research is more things like resilience and optimism and compassion, even uh, M positive emotions or more pleasant emotions Like I like to say, uh, like gratitude and creativity and joy. And, um, in this specific scenario, the way that I'm shaping it, uh, our L and D service is based on the strengths. So there is a moment when I didn't say this, but in our one to Ones, we follow a workbook, and there is a module in that workbook where we focus only on strengths. So before I even start talking with my candidates about their work experience, I showed them a list of 24 strengths. And I asked them, in what situations have you showed this? It's not even about, do you even have this? Because I know that they do. It's more about. Tell me about a situation in your life. This can be in a personal setting. It can be in a professional, with your community, with your family, that you should have shown this. Because what I'm trying to show them is that it's already there. So that's why, um, my background in positive psychology really shapes everything that I do in our one to Ones, in our materials, and then in Passport to Employment as well. Bro.

Speaker A: And I think, um, you talked about the one to ones and how that's been influenced by positive psychology. And I think, um, the routes that you've set up, particularly for this year, we start with the one to Ones and then Passport to Employment is seen as that next step when, you know, they're kind of ready to kind of almost get into employment, but they just need a little bit more of a push. Um, and it's such a key part of what we do in L and D. So for listeners that perhaps haven't come across this before, what is it first and foremost and also, why does it exist?

Speaker B: Yes. So Passport to Employment was already here before I arrived, so I cannot credit that to myself. Um, but it's a beautiful opportunity that candidates have to, uh, experience hospitality, to feel it and to really, um, kind of see if this is something that they want to do, but in a very experiential way. So Passport Employment is a week program, a group week program, uh, where one of our employers, um, that we partner with, they host these programs. So it can be in a hotel or in a restaurant. And we create different experiences throughout the week where they can, uh, learn and they can make mistakes and they can try different things, and they can also prepare and connect with, um, other people that are already in hospitality or that they also want to be in hospitality. Um, so what do I do? Um, what do we do? Um, the first day we get to know everyone and we kind of create that, ah, Sense of connection, sense of, uh, I would like to say belonging. And um, we have an introduction of hospitality and we have our host and they introduce themselves, introduce the venue that we are in, because sometimes it's uh, a really impressive place. So we have been in really interesting hotels or really nice restaurants, Underground London, which is really, really amaz. And we have a venue tour. And then during that first day we have also some master classes. So this can be, uh, workshops where our candidates have the opportunity to try things. And again, I keep highlighting making mistakes and learning without the pressure of, oh, if I make a mistake, am I going to be out? Right? No, just go and try and see if this is something that you enjoy. So we have done, uh, mocktail classes, we have done luxury dining, we have done, um, housekeeping arrangements, uh, and all of that. Then, um, in the second day, what we do is we create workshops around hospitality skills. So this can be teamwork, this can be assertive communication, this can be problem solving. And then we also have on the third day, uh, work experience day. So this day is really important and I think is the one that creates maybe more impact. At least that's what I think. Um, and during this day they just go and they either shadow someone from the department or they start working, uh, as well. They have a proper, like, shift. So, uh, again, this can be, if we're working a hotel, this can be in housekeeping, this can be in the breakfast shift. This can be, um, as a security guard, um, and so on. And then on the fourth day we do interview kind of preparation and we invite some of the people from, uh, again, the venue, the place that we are, uh, for them to have that kind of mock interview experience. And also for the people from, uh, the hotel or the restaurant that we're working with, um, to get to know our candidates a little bit more. So this is kind of like that moment where they can share those life experiences, they can share those skills. And uh, they have that opportunity to just know how a hospitality interview looks like in a setting of a hospitality venue. Um, and at the end we just celebrate with a graduation ceremony. It's a very simple part, uh, at least for myself, impactful, where we give, uh, them some, um, certificate and we share some words. If the candidates want to share some words, they can do that as well. And then we just celebrate because the way that we see it, passport to employment is that moment where they might have already gone through one to one. So they, they already did that inner work that I was talking about. Then they get into that passport to employment moment where they see, and they can see themselves working there. And now they're ready, they're ready to go, they're ready to ah, get that employment and hopefully even in their own um, venue that we have just hosted the program. So it is there because it really helps them to just see themselves in hospitality and try things without the fear of maybe if I make a mistake, am I going to be out.

Speaker A: Thank you for the very in depth explanation. Uh, and I feel like that you've actually answered my next question, but if there's anything that you want to add to it. Of course, um, what I was going to ask next was just if you could walk us through what the week actually looks like, which I feel like you've done. And also what does a candidate experience from day one through to the end?

Speaker B: For that second question that you just uh, asked there, I will say, obviously I will let our um, guest, uh, to tell us how her experience was. But from my end when I am um, facilitating this week, I can definitely see them from day one feeling a little bit hesitant, feeling a little bit fearful, uh, which is completely normal. I also feel a little bit anxious at the beginning because I don't know how is it going to go, uh, the energy of the room. But from the day one, the first moment where everyone is a little bit more quiet, to maybe day two or day three when they just had the work experience that you start seeing a, each personality with their uniqueness and again sorry for being a, ah, um, repeated record but their strengths of each person, um, it kind of gives me that meaning of why I do what we do and why only a pavement away is here. So yeah, that's for me at least that experience that I can see is that flourishing of the candidate.

Speaker A: Brilliant. Um, um. And is there a particular moment in that week that you find to be the most powerful as the facilitator, you know, something that perhaps doesn't get old. Um, you know, no matter how many cohorts, um, that you've done.

Speaker B: Well, I have so many um, moments that I will remember. But I guess thinking back is that morning after the work experience because the afternoon before everyone is super stressed. They ask me about their uniform, they ask me about their schedule, they ask me about what do I have to do. They ask all of this and then the morning after, or if it was only half day, the moment after lunch and they start telling me everything that they do. And I can see that in their eyes, how excited. Because it's not only about what they do, but it's, I think, at least for what they have told me is how they saw that it was possible for them. And they were actually, oh, actually, this was not that hard. I enjoy this, and I can see myself doing this. Uh, sometimes maybe they got into, um, a specific placement that they were not too sure about, and then they're like, oh, I can actually try this again. And I really enjoy this. So I think that for me is the most important part. Obviously there are so many during the week, but seeing that in their eyes and in their excitement, um, it's just a really nice thing to see.

Speaker A: It's a lovely answer. Um, and what does success look like to you at the end of the cohort?

Speaker B: Look, obviously I think numbers are important, of course, and we are trying to make sure that, uh, we then provide some type of placement, some of job opportunity after this program. Uh, but I have to be honest, I think for me, it's that moment where I can see them, that transformation that happened only in a week. And is the connection that they do with the other people around the group that for me is the success. Because obviously I have seen them in a one to one setting where, uh, we have built rapport, we have built maybe that connection between them and myself. But then when they are in the program, when they are trying new things and they are maybe, uh, putting their hand up and participating, or even the graduation, when they are like, can I say something in front of new people? That for me is success because that means that, uh, we did a really good job and that the candidate really put themselves out there and they did, uh, their best and they're feeling comfortable within themselves. And that, for me, is what, um, matters. Then the numbers, I will leave that to my colleagues.

Speaker A: To me, yeah, that's your job. I mean, all of these are, uh, good skills for the hospitality industry. This is all things that we're really trying to push for. And we actually have a lovely candidate who's volunteered their time today who's taken part in Passport to Employment, and she's here ready to sort of share her experiences. So, Lina, would you like to do the introduction?

Speaker B: Of course. It's such an honor to have you here. So, everyone, this is Yamila. Uh, she was in our first cohort of Passport to Employment of the Year, so. Yeah.

Speaker A: Well, Jamila, thank you. Um, and welcome to the podcast. It's really lovely to have you here. Could you start maybe just telling us just a little bit about yourself?

Speaker C: I'm Jamila. I'm living Here around three years I started looking for a job everywhere. Uh, but that's hard to find job because different place, different community, different language. That's something it's very hard to face here. But I try, I can try all the time. Working, uh, as a barista, as a hospitality, it's something is new for me, to be honest. Totally new because my experience was um, in different things. When I started working as a barista at the beginning I thought oh, it's something hard for me to work like a barista and hosting people. But that was wonderful. Something I enjoyed to do. I like to serve people to make them happy, to give him like a coffee or. Everything about hospitality was amazing, to be honest.

Speaker A: Thank you for sharing. And I think um, you know, you are right, you know, kind of it's a new country, it's a new language, it's a completely new area for you. But the fact that you know, you're throwing yourself into it and you're enjoying it I think screams um, absolute testament for you and your resilience. What made you decide that you actually wanted to join the passport to employment course?

Speaker C: Uh, this program was amazing because I uh, think the designer for what we need to be part of this work or uh, uh, how can I say it? Just like marketing ourselves, if that right word. Just tell me. Marketing ourselves for others or for company, for cafes or any places I want to work there. That's program just uh, what the training need. They give us like uh, a passport at the end of this week. We have all skills we need, all confidence we need in interviews or even at the work in the same time. That something was amazing. I think if that, if you make it that again, I will happy to be part of that because a lot of information, ah, different, um, they give me a lot different of skills that uh, helped me a lot.

Speaker A: Fantastic. And was there a moment during the week that particularly stayed with you? Um, something that you perhaps felt was like a little bit of a turning point?

Speaker C: A lot of things, to be honest. A lot of moments because all the time we have uh, uh, good moments and sometimes funny moments. Uh, but to be honest, the best time in the program was when we played role play, role play. That was uh, to be honest, that's something I was very interesting. Why? Because like that practice for us, um, for every trainee in the program to know exactly how can. What he need to do or what he need to develop and something what some um, interviews, when they make with us interviews, that was amazing. Why? Because they give us a feedback that exactly what I need, because I make, like hundreds of interviews, but I didn't get any feedback. I don't know. Because we get a feedback. I know. I know exactly what I need all the time. If I have interview, I just read that before I go, because. Okay, Jamila, focus in this. Jamila, please speak slowly. Jamila, make like that.

Speaker A: Brilliant. And I think, um, the two examples that you provided, I think, um, and, you know, correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that the common theme between them is that you're able to sort of take almost the theory element of it and then put it into practice. So, you know, the role playing, you know, actually sort of seeing how you would be, you know, as you're kind of developing those hospitality skills, but then also the interview practice as well, being able to sort of slow down, put it into, uh, practice, you know, see what kind of feedback comes from both. Um, would you say that was. That's a fair summary?

Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Um, that was really, really helped me m. A lot.

Speaker A: And you did your work experience at the Brasserie Sedal, um, one of London's most iconic restaurants. What was that like there, working as a barista?

Speaker C: Uh, the idea to work like a part of the program, that was amazing. And this was a, uh, good opportunity to work like a, um, fancy restaurant. A fancy restaurant. I saw every steps they work in, how they serve the people, how they focus in, every steps to give them the best cup of coffee for people. Every details. Every details was amazing. I was really happy to have this experience. It's amazing.

Speaker A: It is amazing in there. It's very beautiful. Um, what would you say to someone that perhaps is hesitating a little bit about joining the program or joining a program like this?

Speaker C: Oh, no, don't miss this opportunity. It will be regret, to be honest. This is the best opportunity to, if you find it, just catch it. Hundreds of people, they will wish to have this opportunity.

Speaker A: Brilliant. Um, well, yeah. Jamila, thank you so much for sharing.

Speaker C: Thank you.

Speaker A: Before we get into our quick fire round, Leena, can you share one part of the program, um, that's made you really proud of Jameela?

Speaker B: Wow. So many, so many. Just the fact that she's here with us today, um, and hearing all of her, uh, experience and her learnings and how much she enjoy it really gives me a lot of, like, pride. But I guess back from them during the week, she was the joy. She was so giggly, so bubbly, um, trying to always find kind of like that comfort, also making me feel Comfort as well as a facilitator, which is something that I really, really appreciate. Um, and at the end in the graduation, that moment was she stand up and she was the one that actually shared some words and said how she felt and her experience in front of all the people. And that for ah, a moment where I was like, I know that Jamila is going to find a great experience here, but also in her future, um, she has so many nice strengths and skills and I'm sure that her current employer and her future employers are going to be uh, so lucky to have her. So, yeah, so many different moments during the week.

Speaker A: It's not bad feedback, is it? Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker C: Thank you Alina so much. She is, she's a good trainer and a good person to be honest. She helped us with a lot of things and healing some things she didn't know about it. She just amazing person. Lina, thank you.

Speaker B: Thank you Jamila.

Speaker A: Okay, lovely. Positive note to end questions on. Thank you both. Um, and now we're going to kind of move into the last segment, which is the quick fire question round. So if you're ready, let's go for it. Okay, um, we'll go leaner than Jamina.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker A: Um, Leena, what's your favorite food?

Speaker B: Right, so I am from Colombia and in Colombia, in the coast we have basically fried fish. Uh, this is like, it's called mojara frita. And uh, it is a fried fish but it is a massive fish in your plate with coconut rice and then the most delicious plantain. Uh, but it's not sweet plantain, it's something that we call patacones. So these are like again, fried, sorry is a lot of fried food. So fried patacones, that is like more like a salty plantain and it's crunchy. And um, yeah, I think that that's my favorite food. So I cannot find it here in

Speaker A: London, but hopefully maybe somewhere in Elephant

Speaker B: and Kaswar we'll find it.

Speaker A: Oh, there's got to be somewhere. Absolutely. And Jamila, same question for you. What's your favourite food?

Speaker C: Uh, I'm um, from Yemen, Arabic country. I uh, prefer a food like it's called uh, fahsa, fahsa or fahsa. It's a traditional dish with the meat. It must be very hot. I like spicy food.

Speaker A: Oh really? Yeah, Something spicier the better.

Speaker C: Yeah, that's something very necessary for me.

Speaker A: Interesting. I wish I was a bit like that, but I'm absolute rubbish with spice. Same. Um, so next question. If you could have dinner with any figure, past or present, who would it be and why?

Speaker B: To keep it with the theme of today's uh, episode, I will say Martin Seligman. So he is the founder of Positive Psychology. So um, I already had the honor to kind of see him on a conference and ask him a question. But I would love to have a meal with him and ask him so many questions, but also maybe challenge some things. Positive Psychology was um, founded in the 2000s. So I just want to see what has evolved and how we can keep uh, applying in a better way.

Speaker A: Just an opportunity to completely nerd out.

Speaker B: Um, absolutely.

Speaker A: And then Jamila, who would you pick?

Speaker C: Hard question, but I think uh, maybe uh, King Charles.

Speaker B: Oh.

Speaker C: Because before I came here I was just reading about him a lot and I like his, his personality as all his ideas, uh, his thinking. He have amazing, um, amazing uh, ideas about um, accept other people. Accept different background from some things like that. I wish I can have a dinner with you.

Speaker A: Never know, you might be listening to the podcast. Keep an eye on your emails I hope. Um, and then final question is just um, could you describe passport to employment in one word?

Speaker B: That one is a hard question. Um, there's so many different words, but I guess I will go with belonging.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker A: That's a nice one.

Speaker C: Hopefully.

Speaker A: And Jamila.

Speaker C: Oh, one word.

Speaker A: One word. I know it's tough isn't enough.

Speaker C: Yeah, uh, wonderful maybe.

Speaker A: Wonderful.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker A: So you've got belonging and wonderful.

Speaker B: So I'm doing something right here.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I can keep my. Well, brilliant. Well, thank you both um, for joining me today. Um, and a big thank you as well to our sponsors at ah, Stonegate Group. We wouldn't be able to do this without your support. Keep your eyes and ears peeled for the next one and until then, see you soon.

Speaker B: Bye.