Breaking Barriers in Mental Health (Feat. Heather Stephens)

Speaker A: Hey there, listener. Corey Andrew Powell here. And I'm excited to share that Motivational Mondays is now sponsored by BetterHelp. Feeling stressed or anxious? Well, BetterHelp brings you online therapy that's convenient and affordable. NSLS members get 50% off your first month of BetterHelp when you sign up@betterhelp.com NSLS or click the link in the show notes. Start your journey to better mental health today. Hello, everyone. I am Corey Andrew Powell. And welcome back to the Motivational Mondays podcast presented by the National Society of Leadership and Success, the country's largest leadership honor society, now with over 2 million members, uh, nationwide, uh, soon to be worldwide, because we are going to do some great international initiatives. Um, but today we are talking about here in the US and we are diving into a topic that is incredibly important. It's mental health. Navigating life as a young adult or a college student, especially for those balancing non traditional paths, can come with some unique challenges and pressures and questions. And that's why I'm excited to welcome Heather Stevens to our show today. She's a clinical psychologist and a key member of the clinical team at BetterHelp, who we've partnered with here at the MSLS. And BetterHelp is one of the leading online therapy platforms connecting millions of people to mental health support in ways that's accessible, flexible, and personalized. Now, Heather's here to help us explore how young people can find the right support and what works for them and make therapy work in their lives. And so they're transforming the mental health space. And we're so happy to. Heather's here to join us today. Welcome to Motivational Mondays.

Speaker B: Hey. Hey, Corey. Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here.

Speaker A: Yes, thank you. I'm excited you're here too, because this is something that's very personal for me and I always share that. I benefited from going to therapy when I was like, 28 years old. And it changed my life for the better. It put me on a trajectory that was so much more positive because I understood things that I had not really processed before about my own life, my own self. So when it comes to young adults specifically, they often face similar anxieties, loneliness, burnout, um, all the things that any generation really would go through when they're young. But it seems more kind of more intense nowadays. So while they're trying to juggle school life and all their personal life in accordance to those things, what types of therapy or therapist characteristics should someone look for to help those people get through those challenges?

Speaker B: Absolutely. Well, Corey, one quick note. I am actually a licensed clinical social worker and so yes, I did just want to clarify for, for our listeners and so welcome. And I also, I have a few notes here because this is a very important topic. So I want to make sure that I hit some of the very, very crucial ones. But to your question, um, building a therapeutic alliance is so important. It's truly the cornerstone of what the therapeutic relationship will be. So specifically in your situation for your 28 year old self, Corey, you brought the items that you knew were most pressing to you. And while meeting with a thera is daunting, it's a stranger, right? And I'm bringing all of these crucial things about myself to you. Um, while that process is daunting, being able to have the courage to do that and connect with a professional and say I'm m experiencing burnout, I'm experiencing transitional stress. I just don't know what's happening in my life right now. I need someone to help me navigate these thoughts is the most crucial step in approaching therapy. M. Yeah, from, um, from there, cultivating that therapeutic alliance guides that process and it helps us get to the place that we truly want to go. Hm.

Speaker A: Now there is a clarify, a clarifying point to make there too. Whereas as you mentioned, I sort of. And I did, I went in kind of knowing things that I thought were bothering me. But what was beautiful about therapy was that there's so many things we don't know are bothering us. Because what really broke me through and got me to a better place was I was carrying around stuff that I didn't even know I was carrying around until a therapist had m me really started speak about what I was feeling. And a lot of it was unresolved trauma that we don't even know we have. And so I love that, you know, there's that part of it too that you know, you go there to also discover stuff that you don't know. Wouldn't you say that's a part of it?

Speaker B: Agreed, agreed. So one of the more important parts of, of that discovery is being seen, being heard and understanding that you're a valuable participant in your process. And so that's what allows us, uh, just being seen and heard to say, oh, you know what? I didn't even know I was thinking about that. That's the thing that I've been carrying around with me that I had no idea. I couldn't smell it, taste it, see it, but I felt it. And just in that therapeutic process, having the conversation about what you've been thinking about allows us to see those hidden things, the unknown, trau, even vicarious, um, trauma from something that you've witnessed. A lot of times we don't see that as being our direct thing to carry. But still, it's in our backpack and we have no idea that it's there.

Speaker A: Yes, I love that. The backpack. Dr. Adolf, um, Dr. Adolph Brown, who I love, he's also a great speaker and talks a lot about psychology and how it impacts us, our youth. And he talks about the, he has a backpack, uh, theory as well, about what we're carrying around in our backpack. So I love that you referenced that too. Now, when it comes to therapy in general, we hear a lot of people say, oh, it didn't work for me, I had the wrong therapist. Or, you know, I don't know if I had the right one. I didn't really feel like they understood me. So that leads me to my next question, which is when it comes to finding a therapist, the right therapist, you know, what's a crucial part of that journey for someone who's looking to get help for the first time?

Speaker B: Absolutely, that's a good, good question. Uh, Corey, I have to think about that one for a moment. And so in finding the right person, consider this. You know, when we're out there and we're getting to know people, if we're dating or, you know, we're, um, meeting new friends, even being new on our job, there's this anxiety around who am I and who are they and how are we going to connect. And so in therapy, very similar, we have that anxiety. Even us therapists have that anxiety. We want to make sure that we show up for the person. But the most important thing is, again, the courage to be able to push through, through the worry about, am I finding, going to find the right person and get in the action of finding the right therapist. Um, here at Better Help, we have the ability to match our clients with over 30,000 therapists from all over the country. And so you may meet with a therapist who might hit on two or three of the major things that you're looking for, but you know, there's something else missing. You have the opportunity to switch very simply and look, uh, for the person that has that match. So as long as we are going towards action and looking for our therapist will eventually land on the person that's going to hit on all. I always say with my clients, on all areas of our connection. Five points of them. So y' all see me doing that. That's what that is.

Speaker A: That's great because I know that when it comes to, like, the traditional avenues of going to see a therapist, maybe through health insurance, if you will.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: Um, very often, I know in my case, I was able to try them out. I was able to, you know, have a couple of visits. My insurance allowed me to have a couple visits with one. See if that works for you. And if not, then we will try another one. And then I had. I think I was able to do that, like, up to three people, which was pretty amazing and supportive. Um, in many ways, it's a similar thing with the app world because now there's a situation where you can sort of research and find out maybe if there's a right doctor for use. But. So I don't want to be presumptuous about how it all works. So please, if you can walk us through what that user experience is like, uh, on. On the BetterHelp app.

Speaker B: Absolutely. So very similar to when you go into your doctor's office, we. And you have a clipboard with, you know, a questionnaire that you're filling out with better help. We give you an intake questionnaire and you'll explain things about how you are now, how are you feeling now, what's important to you, what are your values? Um, what are the things that are important to you with your therapist, the person you want to connect with. And so we have, um, a very specific questionnaire that helps us understand everything that you are looking for. And then we work to match you with a therapist that meets, again, those needs that relate to the services you're looking for. Now, you mentioned that, um, your insurance company gave you, you know, a couple of visits and then said, you know, three total chances. You know, let's find your match. Well, we actually have you, you know, match with your therapist and then you can match from there for different issues, different needs, because sometimes, you know, we might go for a certain issue and then issue is resolved. But I want to meet with another person now that can help me with my professional coaching or to help me through this life transition. So are no, um, maximums for matching with us. However, most of our clients who are matched with the therapist remain with that therapist. Okay.

Speaker A: M. So they get, like, a connection with someone and they do stick with them because now it's familiar and they found their person, so to speak.

Speaker B: Absolutely, absolutely. And we are very proud of our. How we match our therapists with our clients to make sure, again, the client's needs are being met. And if we can do that in the first or the second round. Wonderful.

Speaker A: Mhm. Now I know because this is a bit of a new world for therapy in that regard. The whole the app based world. So sometimes people may worry that online therapy won't work or won't feel as personal as in person sessions. So what would you say to someone who is hesitant about the virtual world of therapy?

Speaker B: Corey, I'll have to confess that I was one of those people. I was very concerned. Um, especially when we all experience lockdown across the country together. How am I going to connect with my clients in the same way? Well, it became the new normal and a new, better version of personability. Because now my clients are in their home or in a place where they're comfortable. They have. It's one thing to have anxiety and then be able to talk about it in your living room versus to have anxiety, drive through traffic, or forget if it's rushed hour and all of the other things that can happen when you walk out of your door. So I have the. Truly, it's a privilege to connect with you where you are, where you're your most comfortable and build our therapeutic alliance from there. So there are lots of studies, a, uh, Berkeley study in specific, that talks about how online therapy and in person therapy have the same outcomes.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: Wow. But when I'm connecting with my clients anecdotally, I feel that their guard is down. They don't have all of the worries that they had with the trans. Um, by transporting themselves to a different location, it's me coming to meet with them in their living room and we get to have a different level of conversation because that top layer is gone.

Speaker A: Oh, wow. I love that. Like, and it's almost. Yeah, it sort of reverses the. I don't want to call it a power dynamic, but in a way, yeah. If they were intimidated by the process, you've allowed them now to feel like they have a little bit of that control or a lot of it, because they're in the space, right?

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: They're more likely than to open up and talk to you.

Speaker B: Absolutely. Corey, I completely agree. And I love that you mentioned power dynamic because the goal is that our clients always feel empowered. Therapy isn't about me. It's about you and me meeting you exactly where you are. And again in your home, meeting you where you are at your most comfortable. I don't have a power dynamic to wield there. I am just being the tool that you need me to be during this process.

Speaker A: No, that's great. And I have to laugh too, because it sort of reminds me when I think about online therapy. It reminds me of like where we were maybe 15 years ago with the idea of online dating. And people will be like, I ain't meet no man online. I mean what. I ain't desperate crazy people, you know, like this whole thing. And next thing you know, like I think maybe one year I went to two weddings of two of uh, friends who. How'd you guys meet? We met online.

Speaker B: Absolutely.

Speaker A: It's a very normal and in fact a preferred way today for people to connect romantically if they're looking for a partner or spouse. So I, I sort of make that comparison with the, the perspective of it versus what it has become.

Speaker B: Absolutely. Well, to your point, Corey, there's that element of uh, safety that's there. Right. So in the online dating world, you know, you're not physically with this person. So there while it's, you know, there's nothing that's 100% safe. Some of the elements of risk that we would be worried about in person are gone. And so similar to our clients who are doing virtual therapy, many of those risks are not there. So that's that layer that comes off I don't have to worry about, you know, um, is my, my um, shirt pressed and do I look the part while I'm walking into the office? Right. You know, I can come as I am and my client has the ability to see me as I am as well. It's a, it's a greater connection in my opinion.

Speaker A: Mhm. No, I agree. And also just to go back to one thing, when you mentioned about the physical aspect of getting to a therapist office, which could also contribute to a lot of the stress. So I love that. Really Another key point to that is people don't have a geographical barrier at all to getting help.

Speaker B: Absolutely right.

Speaker A: There's no obstacles there as far as a physical space necessary other than wherever they want to be and they can dial in and get it, get it going.

Speaker B: Absolutely. It does not matter if you are in California or Nebraska or Idaho. We have a therapist that will be there in your living room, office or wherever you choose to dial in to meet with you. Um, access to care is something that's very important, um, to us at Better Health. Our mission is to provide um, low cost affordable therapy to as many people as we can. And so being able to again, not have the geographical boundary or you think about, um, clients who may live in rural areas and they don't have community mental health clinics or behavioral health, uh, locations close to them, we can facilitate that need because we're going directly through the Internet into your living room.

Speaker A: And do you find that, I mean, the response has been overwhelmingly one way or the other, like, you know what? Yeah, a lot of young people are taking advantage. Or are you seeing a different demographic than you initially thought you might see respond? Or is it just really, do you see that in general this product is definitely delivering for all those demographics?

Speaker B: Absolutely. So the latter, yes. This platform is delivering for all of the demographics. But Corey, I'll tell you, you know, um, for our, our folks who are in the mid to early 20s, they are on the forefront of uh, all of the technological advances and new um, systems and ways of connecting. So I feel like with any platform we always see, see, um, uh, an increased use around certain age demographics just based off of where they are with technology. But I have been blessed to see, um, folks of all ages, backgrounds and demographics using our platform. And it's amazing to see again, technology not be the limitation either.

Speaker A: Yeah, that's great. I love that. Um, yeah, accessibility. That's really what everything today is about is trying to bring things, more things to people versus putting up barriers preventing them from actually having access. So, um, this is another one of those examples and from m, your clinical perspective as well, how important is cultural identity based matching? And I wonder if that's a thing. You know, for example, um, an LGBTQ person may want to feel more comfortable because they may think an LGBTQ doctor or sensitive doctor would understand them better. So how much do things like cultural, uh, components play into the practice?

Speaker B: Absolutely. So very much so. Um, understanding who you are and then who you'd like to see are very important in how you approach therapy. If Corey, myself is coming in and I'm looking for a person that looks like me because that's going to be the relatability or understands where I'm from regionally. And then, and I happen to be from the South, I'm from Louisiana. And so if I have a preference of a therapist who understands the Southern living in dynamics, and then you match me with someone who's from the east coast and I'm saying y' all and folk, and there's a disconnect. Right. I can't get through to the area that I need to talk about because we are still trying to build, um, common communication, language and understanding. So for that reason, um, gender identity, religious, um, or spiritual identities or affiliations, again, regional and any other socioeconomic related factors that may be important to you, we consider that in our matching algorithm to make sure that the person that you see is the person that you want to see.

Speaker A: Okay, yeah, I was going to ask you to clarify that. So basically those, those, um, very granular details of a person's personality that's part of your intake process for the person who's signing up. That's that level of granularity of who they are.

Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. So in that intake questionnaire, we ask questions about relationship, um, education, goals, spirituality. My goodness, I'm going to miss so many because there are so many good questions there. But it is truly, um, to assess all of those areas that would either be a benefit or a barrier to the therapeutic process. And so I truly look at not asking it to be a barrier. So all of these things are benefits in understanding. This is what I'm looking for. And here is the therapeutic approach even. And a therapist who has specialties in certain modalities. All of that goes into, um, the matching process as well.

Speaker A: Mm. I imagine too. And I'm not sure for how many people, but even in that process, when you are asked to talk about yourself, it's almost like journaling in a way. I bet you many people, when they're answering your questions are actually probably starting to discover things right in that moment because they're being sort of challenged to write down those emotions. And they may now, they may never have even purged them before until someone finally said, hey, what's going on with you in relationships? Or tell me about your whatever. So being able to purge a lot of what you might be holding is a first step, it seems.

Speaker B: Absolutely. And to your earlier point about, you know, going to therapy and realizing that was something you'd not thought about asking, the question activates, huh, what's my answer there? And we start kind of working through those answers and identifying things. Um, one of m. My favorite questions for clients who may not know where to start is what you've been thinking about today. Hm. You know, and a lot of times that will even surface. But if I ask you, Corey, what's your spiritual preference? Automatically you start thinking about, well, what's my answer to that? What's the basis for my answer to that? How do I conceptualize this for this person? And it's like kind of shaking the dust off the rug and looking at what's in the air, starting to make sense of it.

Speaker A: Yeah. What's great about that too is especially with this particular demographic where we have a large body of college age young people and also non traditional students as well, that is that time of uncertainty for so many People we have the younger generation who are just starting out. But our non traditional students had to re. Calibrate if you will, after Covid. Yeah, maybe they lost their job. Maybe whatever it was, they found themselves in uh, their 40s and 50s having to reinvent completely. And these are people who might need definitely to have a service like this. Like I'm trying to figure this out. Where do I. Everything I thought was up is down. Now help me out, help me figure this out. So absolutely, yeah, I think that's definitely

Speaker B: a big one with college kids. You know, everything up is down. I had to chuckle at that one, you know Corey, because we can all relate to that. But being a, ah, college age or being a college student, the irregularity of their life is, I mean I can't think of a time where my life was any more irregular, any more upside down, you know. But uh, a service like this one allows a uh, service like better help allows us to truly meet the client where they are with multiple modalities. So think about a college kid who's running between classes and their job and extra credit curriculars. Then you have the ability to meet with your therapist by phone, by chat, by video, all through your phone, your laptop or your computer. But the goal is that when you have, you know, um, I don't like to say hectic, I like to say adventurous. When you have a very adventurous lifestyle and you've got lots of things going on, the goal is that you still get to be in your life and then we become a support of you remaining in that life. And so that's why we have the different modalities to eliminate that access to care or eliminate the barriers to care through having greater access to care.

Speaker A: In some ways that actually answers my final question. But it's sort of kind of, there's more to be said about it, I think. So I would ask you, what final advice would you give to a young person who is listening and struggling and they don't know where to start when it comes to their mental health support?

Speaker B: That is a really, really good question.

Speaker A: I mean other than download the app, you know.

Speaker B: Right. Because it's a great place to start. Uh, but Corey, I'd say just knowing that you have goals or you have a place that you want to get to that you've not yet gotten to is a great place to start. If you feel that maybe this anxiety that um, I'm feeling is greater than what I can deal with by myself or I just feel out of sorts right now, you know, I had a client told me, I just wanted to talk to somebody about some of the things that are going on in my life. No trauma? Uh, no. No things that we would deem negative. I just want to talk with someone kind of about the things that I'm think those are all reasons to seek therapy. Whatever it is that you're thinking about, bring it to us. Let's talk about it. Let's figure out how that relates to where you want to go.

Speaker A: Wonderful. Very inspirational and very welcoming, which I love that everyone can find a place there to, uh, have, have an ear, listen to them when they have that need. So, Heather, before we let you go, I have two more questions actually for you. They are exclusive questions for our, for our NS NSLS audience and, and those who are listening out there who want to know more about what we do here@thesls.org visit us there and you can find out more about our leadership initiatives. Heather Stevens, one of the key members of the clinical team at Better Help. And we are so grateful you came here today. This is, uh, a wonderful conversation. So thanks for being here on Motivational Mondays.

Speaker B: Thank you so much, Corey. I enjoyed it. Thank you.

Speaker A: Thank you for listening to Motivational Mondays, presented by the National Society of Leadership and Success and available wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. I'm Corey Andrew Powell, and I'll see you again here next week.