Ep 222: College Funding Secrets and Strategy: Tax Hacks, Scholarships & Hidden Discounts

Have you ever had a money or career question you really wanted to ask, but didn't know who to go to, or just felt uncomfortable even bringing it up. You're not alone. Talking about money can feel intimidating, even scary, and that's exactly what I'm trying to change. That's why I created a free virtual coffee chat, a casual, no pressure, twenty minute conversation where you can bring one thing you're wrestling with and we'll talk it through.

No judgment, no jargon, no sales pitch, just clarity, ease, and a real answer from someone who gets it. If you've got something on your mind, don't sit in the confusion. Book a spot at limitreelife dot com and let sip and sort it out. Hey there, and welcome to Money in You.

I'm Michelle Perkins, your host. My search for more fulfilling work led me to career in business coaching, where I stumbled upon a game changing discovery. Money issues often start with our mindset and habits. You see, our relationship with money is the key to overcoming those frustrating financial obstacles.

As an entrepreneur, coach, and problem solver, I'm passionate about helping you create a great relationship with money, because turns out that's the foundation for a limit free life. Each week on Money and You, I speak with amazing guests about all things money, mindset, practical tips, and everything in between. We're here to give you new insights, education, and empowerment. So money can be one of your favorite relationships.

So join us for some lively conversations and let's transform your financial life together. Hello, Hello, and welcome to the Money and You Show. I'm Michelle Perkins, your host, and we have a great show for you today. This show is going to be super interesting.

It's a topic I've wanted to have discussed on the show for a long time, haven't found just the right person until now. And I'm really excited to talk to you about finances around college. So if you have a child of any age, you're probably going to be interested in this. And you know, for.

Some of us, like myself, I have a child who's an atypical person going back to college. He's twenty eight. He decided to start over, do something new. He's going back to school, and so a lot of what people with how high school juniors and seniors want to know about I now want to know about again.

So, without further ado, I'm going to bring in Brian Eister. We're going to go all over the place talking big picture about college planning and everything related to funding your children's college experience. So Brian Eister is a CCFS ELA and lic and the visionary founder of the grad Process, a groundbreaking system created to help families navigate the challenge of paying for their children's college education without sacrificing their retirement goals. Over his twenty six year career, Brian has developed a profound understanding of the financial needs of families.

His personal experience with college planning for his own kids have shaped his approach to wealth management, risk mitigation, resource allocation, and college funding strategies. As a highly sought after speaker, Brian shares his knowledge on creative funding for college cash flow design, income planning, risk management, and tax advantage strategies. Clients trust and respect Brian for his commitment delivering exceptional service. His grad Process is a testament to his dedication helping families upgrade their financial stability and growth without compromising their future.

Brian lives in Metro Detroit with his wife, two kids, tree cars, and enough guitar and softball equipment to last three generations. I love that you and welcome Brian. Thank you for having Michelle. I'm looking forward to our conversation today.

Yes, me too. So okay, Wow, there's a lot to talk about, and we know we have a limited amount of time, so I'm thrilled to have this conversation with you. Seriously, it is a big deal to parents, and you know, I talk a lot about people's relationship with money on this show and with just like with many things financial that seem overwhelming, and a lot of parents have just avoided this whole topic. I mean, I'll figure it out later and then suddenly later you're you know is high school.

So you know, there are so many things to talk about. I'd love just your insight into first a little bit about how you got interested in this, and second, what are the situations you find people in when they come to you? Excellent question. So a little bit about me.

I am fifty years old. I have been in this business twenty eight years. I'm going to have to update that resume that was sent over to you. You know, a little bit gray or in the beard, and so I graduated from Michigan State in nineteen ninety eight, Bachelors of Finance, way way back back when Nick Saban was a coach there and look at what he did there, got into the personal finance, spear, financial advising, financial planning, whatever you want to call it.

I have held a variety of licenses within that realm. And what happened Michelle was around twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen. Again, I'm fifty, so many of my clients are about five years older than me. So when I was starting out, they were mid twenties.

So when I'm thinking about becoming engaged, they're already married with child and or children. You get the idea. So the late twenty teens, I am getting calls from my clients that, hey, Susie, Bobby, you know, we're they're in school, they're studying for SATs, they're doing college apps, and there was a wide variety of Hannick, what are we going to do? And so we would get together and we would talk about what we had already done in the past, how it's positioning them to take advantage of various circumstances.

And all they wanted to know really was are we going to be okay? Because it's a huge cash flow concern. Many times also I would add an issue, but it's really a cash flow concern issue along the way because everybody's as their incomes rise, their expenses rise, and they do. Many of my clients have reserves and liquid, but not many could handle thirty grand a year twenty five hundred a month to pay for school.

So nonetheless, I was with a very dear friend of mine. We were after a ballgame, just kind of talking, and somehow the topic of college came up, and I started getting really granular and specific and like, well, what about this and this and this and this just stuff that I've acquired through the years of knowledge. And he basically said, whoa be? Does anyone know about this?

And I'm like not really. He's like, there you go. He's like, you got to bring this to market. And so what happened is, let me condense the story.

It took me forever in a day because I'm a planner, a reader, a researcher, a ready aim aim aim aim aim, then I'm going to fire. So it took me about seven years to get this thing off the ground. Because if I don't know something to the level where I can at a moment's notice, talk about it in depth in an articulate fashion and a convincing fashion. I won't take it to market, and so it took me about seven years, and that's why I acquired the CCFS college designation.

There's another one I acquired, which was almost like a master's class that I took, where the final exam was a dissertation, an oral answer, not a multiple choice. That has spurned into having frustrations talking with tax professionals. I'm just going to keep that general because a non tax professional gets a little defensive when I'm bringing tax strategies, Like we talked about it on our pre call. Tax scholarships love that for a business owner.

All day long, you can pay for school on the government's dime. But like right now, we're two days off from tax filing day. Tax professionals CPA's EA's tax attorneys jds with llms, they make their money by volume and by preparing returns and just basically not all, not all, because the ones I study from are doing this proactive. And so I'm going back to school to become an enrolled agent.

I'm studying for that because well, again there's a market. Michelle and no one's doing it, and I'm already doing this, so I might as well get paid for it. And I have been accepted into a very prestigious business school here locally called Wash College, where I haven't pulled the trigger yet, but I was accepted into their Masters of Science for taxation. Wow, because that is how strongly I believe in it, and how it's not being talked about anywhere.

Michelle, we could start there. It really whatever's top of mind for you. I'm an open book. So that's what happened from twenty nineteen is is learning, building up my con evidence, talking with my existing clients that already knew like you know, new me, liked me, trusted me.

I could have some grace if I screwed some things up or I wasn't correct. I have two girls. I have a twenty one year old. She should be a senior, but she's a junior right now.

We had to take a year off for a reset, which at some point I want to talk about because you can't always script everything. Oh my god, yes, yes, you told me a little bit about yours. I think I shared, I don't remember. And then I have a high school senior and so I'm living it.

So when I talk about these strategies, I've vetted them, I've tested them. I've talked to attorneys, I've talked to CPAs, enrolled agents, tax professionals, and I'm doing it myself and I know it works. So as an example, my youngest, when we talk about tax scholarships and how to position yourself to look attractive to a school in the university or the Brian, I'm not going to fill out the forms. You know, I make too much money.

I make a quartermill I make three hundred thousand, kay, ken, I get you. My daughter is going to a prestigious private school, Hope College on the West side of Michigan. Okay, about three thousand to thirty five hundred. It just it checks all the boxes for what we need.

If you look at the retail sticker price, it's sixty eight thousand dollars. I got it down to eleven thousand dollars a year. So I don't want your audience to think that I'm being cocky or cavalier. But you know what, I'm pretty darned confident in what it is that I talk about and suggests because I'm doing it myself and I took it from sixty eight thousand to eleven thousand Michigan State, which it was her first choice, but I talked her out of it, even though it's my alma mater.

That's twenty eight grand and based on our finances, they were going to give me twenty five hundred bucks. And then they said, we'll give you free tuition because of her grades. But you got to pay for your real You got to pay for room and board. Well, the room and board now you have to stay there for two years.

When I was there, you only had to stay there for one year. And I have it saved on my Instagram post. Board of trustees from Michigan State University approved the other day a five percent room and board hike. It's the same building that's been there since I was in school.

What are you doing? Why is it so much more expensive? And so colleges catch on, they will dangle the tuition, but then they'll get you on the real estate. So you don't know what you don't know.

I love to get into the weeds the details. I read everything and then basically I look at what pieces can I apply in our world to get the best result, and it works and so kind of long winded. We went around, But I love working with families that are just they're anxious, they're scared, they're concerned. Even sometimes Yeah that's fine.

I got you know, I got more enough money to cover it. Okay, Well, have you ever done a calculation as to if you're writing checks to the university with your own money, how much that's going to cost you in retirement time? Yeah? Okay, that you brought up so many things.

That sorry, sorry, it's good, it's. Good, good, good. I love everything you brought up because I know from being a mom and when I first when my son was born. I'm gonna tell a little about what I did so you can comment on it.

I'm not looking for compliments. I'm looking for ooh, you should have done this or whatever, because because I know I didn't do it that well, but. I did start. It was a concern.

It was also I love what you said about these things don't happen as we think they're going to happen. It was also a give in my mind that two kids that both would go to college. It was. Not a conversation, it was just a belief that I had based on my family and everything else.

It was just what was going to happen. So I sat down with my financial planner and he kind of mapped out, like how much we'd have to put away. At the time, that was kind of a joke. It was like, there's no way we can do that.

So I did something. I did what I could do. It was probably half of what he suggested. The way things transpired, it worked out just fine.

And a daughter it didn't go at all. And a son who you know, gave me an extra like I don't know, they eight nine years safe because he waited. He actually went and I used some of the money for that, but I didn't use the whole pot, and then it had a chance to continue growing through a pretty good, you know, economy for another bunch of years. So now he can go back and there's probably the same amount of money.

Of course, we might be losing some of it now, but we'll see. I have to go back and re look at that. But there's a lot of things about that. For example, I started with just a regular accounts, a Vanguard account because I didn't know what I was doing.

Then I did a five twenty nine. I want to talk to you a little about you know, the variety of ways that one could say for their kid's future. What do you think of the five twenty nine's, who are they for? What's the tax advantage?

There? Excellent question, lots there. My mind is racing. I'm thinking like, Wow, if you were sitting out in right field with me, I probably will talk your ear off for about five innings.

Okay, let's start with the five twenty nine. It's extremely popular and some things that I'm going to say may ruffle people's feathers, and that's okay. I'm not saying not to have one. I own two.

Okay, there's a phrase in our I got trained by some people that gave me a phrase. Do not confuse the objective with the method. Subjective is to go to school. Most of my folks that I work with want to absorb most of that costs so they're not saddling their children with debt wherever it comes from.

Method is a five twenty nine. So let's peel that back further. Now. I want to say again two things.

Number one, I have two five twenty nines for my kids. Okay, so I'm going to bash it, and then I'm going to share with you how I use it, okay, because how I use it is discovery by reading through iris tax code, how it works. I'm in the state of Michigan. How it works in the other states, and we'll get to that.

I want, if I forget about it, bring up state reciprocity and how that works, because that's extremely important for your audience to know. Okay. The first thing that comes to mind with five point twenty nine is and depending on if I knew someone well enough, we're friends, we've talked a couple of times, I would get a little bit I would get a little bit bold, and I'll say, have you ever been onto the Saint Louis FED site. I ask a lot of questions.

I'm not gonna I mean, I know what the answers are, but I want my clients to I want to help teach them to critically think through this concept in this challenge of college funding and planning and paying for Have you seen the Saint Louis FED study? No, okay, let me tell you what it is. Go check it out Saint Louis fed dot com. The US savings rate is at three point eight percent.

We're not saving enough as a nation. You can everyone can come to their own conclusions as to why that is. But the bottom line is we aren't saving enough. Why then are you going to create a strategy?

You're going to use a method, a product to put money in that you can't touch unless if it's for school, and then if you use it for yourself for some other reason. Because we're only saving three point eight percent, you're going to get penalized. You're going to lose the tax deductions. It gets added back into your income.

And like you said, I would argue to people close friends like that coach of mind, that's a buddy. I'm like, dude, why are you in the stock market at when your kid is getting ready to go to school. My child has been where I have my money. It has not been vulnerable to the stock market in three or four years.

College is a planned expense. If they go to school, we know they're going to enter their fall semester, their first year at seventeen or eighteen. Why are you trying to eke out those last few gains of the market. Why because your advisor said so, you're in it for the long haul.

Some of my mentors that taught one of the designation classes, I have article after article this repeats itself. This happened in two thousand and eight, and it happened in two thousand and it happened in twenty twenty. Why are you suggesting here you are where you should be enjoying. My daughter's going to school in the fall.

Why would I want to say we may have to hold off a semester because you know, daddy picked the wrong fund. I know you're laughing, and I say a lot young and cheek, but I have close friends, college roommates where they're saying that, and I'm like, why did you put yourself in that position in the first place? And then I get and and so A five twenty nine, if you're using money in there, it's going to grow. Yes, it's tax deferred, but there's plenty of other places that you can get money tax deferred too.

Okay, And let's hold off getting into the specifics because again the disclaimer, this is a general conversation. I don't know anything about their world. But there's plenty of other places where you can get the same results. And a five point twenty nine is a tax wrapper, that's all.

It is a tax rapper like a four toh one. K. I'm not saying not to have those. But all it says is you could put money in and in the state of Michigan, I can get up to ten thousand dollars a year of a State of Michigan tax deduction.

Then if you pull it out and it's deemed a qualified expense, you don't have a taxable event. Everyone's like, well, I'm going to max it out, or I'm going to Grandma and Grandpa are gonna position money, or they're going to gift money to me, and I'm going to put it in there, so forth and so on because i want the tax deduction. Okay, let me ask you a question with your financial advisor. Let's just say you're in Michigan and what state are you one.

I'm in California. All right, let's pull this real quick. Got my hirt? Okay, so in California.

In order for it to be deemed a qualified expense, meaning whatever the amount is in there that you use for college, if it's used for undergrad so the four year bachelor's great, You're not going to be penalized. If it's used for grad school, fantastic. You may have heard of. If there's a balance left over, you can use it for student loans.

You can up to ten thousand dollars per beneficiary. So if I had like fifty grand in one of my daughter's accounts and they're both graduated, that's leftover. I can pay use ten grand for her student loans, ten grand for my youngest student loans. If I was in California and it's deemed a qualified expense.

No Texas. But guess what. I live in Michigan, our state, our legislation, our congress that we elected, doesn't allow it. I can only use five to twenty nine money for undergrad and grad everything else that you read about in the newspaper.

Well, if you got money leftover, you can convert it to a roth. You can use it for student loans. You can use it for O K through twelve for private schools. Yeah in Ohio, not in Michigan, Michelle, that's just one.

I could keep you here for another three hours with the caveats, the asterisks, the O got you like, it's just a tax wrapper in Michigan. Let me use Michigan as example. Someone says, I'm going to put in ten thousand dollars because I want the State of Michigan deduction on my tax return for twenty twenty five. Cool.

But if you also withdraw in the same year six thousand, you don't get a ten thousand dollars credit, you get four Who told did any of your advisors tell you that? Yeah? No, I mean because they haven't been yes. And this is where I'll just get passionate.

I'll back up because they aren't trained. They have I gotten designations financial advisors. My world, Michelle, I'm going to bag on. They care about two things.

How many clients that they can get in assets under management, and if it's in a pre tax environment, guess what they're gonna get paid on the gross you got one hundred grand in there. They're going to get assets fees under management for all of that. And then when it's time for real world conversations, I don't know, Oh, well, you're in it for the long haul or sorry the market's down. They it's always an excuse.

That's crap. It's unacceptable. And so that's why I created what I did, because I'm in it as well, you know, And you don't have to take that traditional advice. Find a professional that is nuanced and specific and knows it inside and out and can converse.

So where I use five twenty nine is Michelle, and here's where it's beneficial. So as much as I've bagged down it, I want the audience to realize, here's how I use it personally. I contributed the acts. Okay last year, Okay, I was a little late to the party with one, but there were some other distractions and things going on, and so I contributed for my oldest last year, the ten thousand.

So when I ultimately file my taxes, which is not going to be until October, which I want to get to that as well. For the business owners, very beneficial in this whole tax planning. Should you should not be filing on April fifteenth, It should be in October. Okay, thing we're extending, and I'm now I'm super curious.

We are doing it for other reasons. So I can't wait to hear what you're saying. Fantastic, fantastic. Last year, I actually was a little bit later.

You do have October fifteenth. Yes, I had to pay a penalty, but guess what, I knew exactly where my daughter was going, and I was able to back in all the calculations. Very big reason why my daughter's going for eleven thousand dollars because I was able to I was able to position our entire financi antial affairs that benefited my daughter and my family to the max possible. If if I filed last year April fifteenth, she didn't even send out applications until August or September.

Yeah, yeah, is your financial Is your regular financial advisor talking to you about this? Hell? No, no, Well that's interesting because this show is airing tonight, which is the thirteenth, So people listening, if you still have time to extend, correct, I mean. You have time to extend.

And again, I let's put the asterisk. I'm not an enrolled agent or a CPA. It's an extension to file, not an extension to pay. So talk with whoever your tax pros and professionals are and you figure out that specific because I don't want it coming back on me saying Brianson not to pay.

But it's also kind of a joke to talk to them because I've already gotten emails yes the week, don't talk to us. And if it airs, if it airs, here's a couple of last minute things that I am okay with throwing in a general a general sense. If you have a college age person that's close and you have a few extra dollars, you can go online and set up a five twenty nine right now. I use the State of Michigan direct with the state.

I don't I gave up my equities licenses, and I'm not going to pay someone to put it in a cash account where it's not going to go up or down in value. You can put money in there, but you need to keep impeccable records because if you put ten grand in right now and you take out five, let's say in the fall, you need to come up with the receipts that that five was from a previous time. Otherwise you're not going to get the full ten interesting thousand dollars. Deduction health savings accounts for the business owners that have high deductible plans, you still have until April fifteenth to fund last year.

Okay, HSA gives you a So those are examples of tax scholarships. I know there's also and again check with your CPA or your financial advisor. Is it. I don't know if it's a SAP or a simple or a solo.

For one K. One of those, you have until April fifteenth. Again, audience, just just check. There are some things that you can do at the last minute.

But yeah, yeah, they're reminding me of one, so thank you. Yeah, Brian. Okay, ideally in the future, since we're two days away from tax filing, although I know that my accounts send an email today again saying it's tax week, we probably won't be available to talk to you. But they did put a little paragraph in there about it if you want to, and they typically extend for you, but maybe for those people who didn't want to, there was a paragraph in there saying here's how you can extend.

So it's easy though to find out how to do. When we're this is getting certified mail today. So for your audience, again, my my personal CPA right now and I are a little bit here like that, and it has to do is it has to do with some other things. Nonetheless, it is for your personal ten forty It is the extension.

I think it's called the forty eight sixty eighth. Yeah, the forty eight sixty eight is the form that you file. You can go in the IRIS website and you can check each state. Each state has its own rules, so like in Michigan.

If the federal one is accepted, they accept it, but I don't trust Michigan, so I printed those out. I'm going to file it too. And then there's a form I think it's called it's seven thousand and two, seven thousand and three, seven thousand and eight. That's for LLC's Texas and Escort like the eleven twenty essays.

So it's all there. And if here's why I advocate it, your tax work very well may be done. There may be situations where there's nothing else to do. Yeah, here's the thing.

Let me use my world. So last year, if I filed in April fifteenth, it gets uploaded okay, into the IRIS portal. And then when my daughter in the fall is completing apps and choosing which schools to send the to complete the FASTPHA, the SASPA will go to the IRIS site pull that tax return. Okay, everything's fine.

I cannot tell you how many things I learned from this time a year ago to the fall. Just I acquired knowledge. Yeah, and if I file an amended return, which you're allowed to do, so many families think, oh well, it's going to go up into the IRIS portal and the irs is going to let all of these schools know, and the schools now can give me a better offer because I lowered my taxes. It's not how it works.

The original one that you file goes up into the system. If you file an amended return, you have to personally contact every single university in their department and go there first. So why not get all of your ducks in a row first? So families that have juniors finishing up their year right now.

If you are a business owner, just file the return. You've done your estimated quarterlyes. You're not going to be You're not going to be in trouble, and it gives time for you to talk with your own professionals of making sure that your ducks in a row. Here's another thing.

I am actively. This has been going on since December one of last year. My oldest is at a let's just call it a Metro Detroit in the City of Detroit University. We have been battling their financial aid department since December one.

Oh, I am, I have presented my case and it is one thing after another. And where we're at right now is they said to me, because I went down there and I met him face to face. Everything that you're saying is one hundred percent accurate and correct and legit. But Brian, we go off of the tax transcripts, not your tax return, because a tax return can be forged.

You can go into a PDF editor and I can make it look anyway that I want it to. Oh, I could show you right now off screen. I could take one hundred grand, Like if I'm trying to get a loan for real estate or a business, I could turn one hundred grand in come into a million. I'm not advocating fraud people, I'm just saying that PDF editing software with a tax return is very easy to manipulate.

The tax transcripts on the IRIS website come straight from a Vanguard Ford Motor company, your employer, So what they have on file and what you're showing on the tax return. If there's discrepancy, they're going off the tax return. I have a known error on my tax transcript. I've showed it to them.

A number got flipped. Brian, you're correct, we believe you. But because you don't have an EA or a CPA or a JD after your name, your opinion doesn't matter because all it is is an opinion. Holy correct.

So that's why I'm getting that is the reason why I'm getting those tax designation after my name, because I get it. Yeah. Yeah, it's frustrating, and so you just just file the return, take your time, see what's going on. Talk with someone that knows.

Okay, what's the school? Does that university? Is it a fast as a CSS. That's a completely different.

How you strategically position your financial affairs depends on which one you're using, et cetera, et cetera. Yes, you can always. So you're saying file or extend. If I said file, I misspoke.

I'm saying extend. Okay, that's what I thought. If you can, if you can extend, certainly. Yeah, okay, I love that advice.

It's it's it's simple to do, and there's no problem with it. People are like, ooh, I never extend. Well I said that for a long time until I did. Now I always concerned.

So but okay, you brought up state reciprocity. What is that? Okay, So up until twenty and seventeen. In twenty seventeen, right around I think maybe between Christmas and New Year's it was Trump's first term, and he passed the I think the acronym was TCJA Tax Cuts and Jobs Acts, or maybe I got the C in the J reverse.

But a tax Act in twenty seventeen was passed. Up to that point, if you had a five twenty nine, it could be used if it was deemed qualified a qualified expense. And the IRS has a website it's IRS Publication ninetin seventy that talks about all the college education expenses. This is where I gleaned it from.

If it was used for undergrad or grad, it's considered a qualified expense. You're not faced with taxes. Well, every tax act someone starts putting in a little bit more and a little bit more to make it attractive, make it more broad. Look at how cool it is.

I'm going to argue it was probably lobbied by the investment business to do more and more so they get more assets under management. Now again we could go down the rabbit trail conspiracy theory. But so then what they did is they said, if you had here's my notes here, at some point you had the Secure Act, then you had the Secure two point zero, then you had the one big beautiful bill. So there was four pieces of legislation, and each time they expanded the use of five twenty nine money.

If you're paying for private school here in the metro Detroit area there's a lot of rich counties and a lot of private schools, you could use it for K through twelve private. If you have money left over in a five twenty nine, you can use it up to ten thousand dollars per beneficiary for repaying your student loans. Okay, okay, I want to use your example there in a second. If there, you check all the boxes and it's very nuanced, you could have excess money and you can move it into a roth Ira.

Let's go back to the student loans. Everyone gets afraid of student loans. There's public student loans and there's private student loans. Okay, And there's a lot of hullabaloo right now.

And depending on where you lie politically, you're going to take a position. It doesn't matter to me because I'm about reading the info and how do my clients take advantage of it. I asked this to CPA's JD's intelligent people that in both of the designations that I hold, and I pose this question and here's what it is. Let's use your state in California because you can use five point twenty nine to pay student loans off.

Okay, everyone thinks, well, I got to have a five twenty nine before my kid goes to school. No, I said, so what if I went back to school, which I am, and the last semester whenever that is, let's just say I bankrolled it or my company reimburses me. Okay, I'm just I'm not having to pay for it. But I got to come to the table with fifteen thousand dollars the last semester, Okay, and I take out fifteen thousand, I said, is there any rules that say that the five twenty nine has to be established for a period of time before it can be used to pay off student loans?

They're like, no, how many people now are paying off their student loans with post tax dollars. You go to work, you slave for forty hours a week, and you get a net paycheck. Now you're paying your student loan. If I contribute to a five twenty nine my last year, that's a pre tax contribution, maybe a state deduction, And I'm paying off my student loans with pre tax dollars.

Interesting all day, every day, twice on Sunday, Michelle. It's the nuance, it's the detail that will give families the difference between I can help you significantly pay for your school or you're on your own. But because my industry is only worried about assets under management, they don't take the time to educate the public. Sorry, I'm getting a little hot.

Yeah no, I love this, and really it's about It's just about strategy, and people don't really have those skills to design a strategy that fits your situation. That's where I think you come in an amazing way. Yes, everything is strategy. I see it all.

I have families that are five figures, okay, doing well. I have families. You know, let's just say I have I have one family around fifty thousand combined, and I have families at five hundred thousand. It doesn't matter what your income is.

Is just a different set of situations and problems. So the conversations I'm going to have with someone that isn't making five hundred thousand might be more needs based aid. Okay, what do we do there someone that's at five hundred thousand. Yes, you still need to fill out the federal forms and the reasons for it is a lot of merit aid is tied to the submission of the forums, the FASTPA or the CSS.

I don't know why, don't know. Yeah, I want to go back to that for a second, because something you said. Okay, so you talked about and I've heard from other people's children who are like, oh, we got into these ten schools and this one offered us, you know, twenty thousand offen this one offer, and you know, one of them offered them a complete ride. And so I was talking to my son about this, and it's like, I don't know what this stuff is, Like what what are these giant you know, discount savings excuse me that people are getting and how are they getting it?

Are they applying for grants or scholarships? Are like? What the heck is happening that they got into. All these schools and all the schools.

Seem to be fighting over them with you know, competing for the tuition, with the tuition? What is going on? What is that? How do we take advantage of it?

Excellent question? Let me. And I'm gonna have to We're we're talking, we're running out of time, and I hate it because it's such a great conversation in my life. It's fantastic.

So this is very relevant. Right now, we just hit the submit and yes button to Hope officially over the weekend. We one of the things that your audience needs to know. Number one, colleges just ignore the sticker price so you might see seventy.

It doesn't mean the average discount for a private school is fifty six percent. I will show you my numbers all day every day. My daughter going to Hope College is a hell of a lot cheaper than her going to Michigan State. Not even close, not even close.

Okay, what is it? What's going on? I'm dying to know. And because private, well, private schools also have private endowments, money competition.

Okay, you have public schools, and there's an air of arrogance like, well, you should just be happy that we were accepting you. And they get state money and so they can pick and choose regardless, they have both. I'm just using the example. So with families, offers are coming in, there's no One of the things that I would like to see is the industry is college is to come with a standard form template.

Okay, taxes, it's a ten forty Okay, it's standard, but this university, in that university, in that university, send you, Michelle, three offers and you can't make heads or tails out of it. This is where you need a qualified professional to be able to discern and say, oh, well, we're going to give you it's your debt. Cost is only going to be ten thousand dollars. No, it's actually fifteen thousand, five hundred because student loans.

Yes, it's not my money, but it's also not your money and the student is ultimately going to have to pay it back. So don't gaslight me and say it's only ten thousand when it's really fifteen thousand, five hundred. Okay, Then every universe, most universities, you can negotiate. So many people are unaware of that, Michelle.

Right now, the busiest time right now is you can negotiate with schools and the dead line is May first. So really, as as offers started coming in February, with my daughter as well as my clients, we look at the schools, the universities and perhaps maybe you should last minute send in some other applications to Some universities are in the same competing pool. Is the one that you want to go to because what if that one gives them more money and you can pit them against each other and then it becomes fun.

I'm a huge sports fanatic. You're literally becoming a sports agent for your client and you're trying to negotiate the best offer. And I love to I love the chat. I love to talk, as you can see, I also love that.

I also love to argue. And but I'm I'm battling for my clients and and some will. Some are willing to play ball, and others are like, we don't care to take it or leave it. Fine, but at least we tried.

You know, who are you trying with? Are you literally calling the school and saying, hey, can we talk? No, there's there's, there's there's So what you do is the most recent one. This isn't out of state clients of mine.

They are somewhere in Oklahoma. But the three main ones were University Oklahoma, Arkansas, and was it Missouri I'm drawing a blank. Anyway. That last one was the third one, and basically it was coming back between Oklahoma and Arkansas.

Oklahoma has a bigger retail price, but they're stingy where Arkansas. I'm sorry, I'm getting it reversed. And so what we did is is there was acceptance liders by both and they also gave offers. So it's not illegal to say, you know, to Oklahoma, well this is what Arkansas gave us.

Do you want to play ball? Do you want to talk? And it's going to be a yes or no. And then conversely you will also see what Arkansas what Oklahoma gave and you go back to Arkansas.

And so now it's like a free agency in sports, and you got the student who is the athlete, and you got two teams that are interested, and you keep bidding it up. Who's going to be better? Wow? And yes, yes, And again there's letters, and then you send it to the financial aid department and there's professional judgment.

I negotiated with UH personally myself with my oldest at the Urban Metro Detroit school. And again, you're not doing anything illegal. You're not fabricating anything, you're not making anything up. You're just presenting and saying can you We had we had some very very unique, singular one time medical expenses in the year's twenty twenty four and as a result, would you consider that because this year they look at the prior prior okay for FASPA and the CSS and documented and I hear the tax returns.

Here's our tax transcripts. Here is from one point one twenty twenty four to twelve thirty one, every single medical expense that we occurred from signal in a huge one hundred and fifty page spreadsheet because they're gonna want it, okay, and so so what I would say is as is, if you want to if you want to get that granular and that detailed, there's ways to do it, or you can just say in like like with my youngest, we got to the point where it was like, okay, this this is close enough.

We're not going to inch it out. We're just going to then focus on tax scholarships instead. And scholarships and grants those are things you need to actually apply for or do they come to you, you. Know, little both.

A lot of schools I see grants are offered originally. And it's also important that whoever your audience is working with and listening to, there's there's probably a half dozen different college planning software platforms, but most of them, Michelle are going to have that feature where you put in the student's data the university and then they will say, based upon GPA and their standardized scores, whether it be SAT or ACT, what they can qualify for. And then you can determine are you getting a fair offer or are you getting lowballed?

And and so you know, grants, merit based aid, work study, you know, depending on where you fall financially. The student loans, some of it could be subsidized, where means the government's paying the interest. Okay, okay, So if someone is paying if the government is going to pay the interest on my student loans, Michelle, that's free money. Why am I going to go liquidate and put money into a five to twenty nine.

I didn't realize there was such a thing as I'm paying your interest. This is the thing we don't know very much. And I just want to say to the audience that while hiring somebody like you to help with this process seems like ooh, you know, an expense, it's not. It's an investment.

It's an investment because this is a very long term situation we're looking at, and that bit of a you know, outflow to hire a mentor or somebody who's really knowledgeable in this area to help you has the potential to save you far more over the course of four eight however many years you're talking about. So you know, there are a lot of times when people, you know, they're worried about the college expense, so they're like, I'm not going to add to that by getting some help. And you know'm I'm not doing this in a weird, like pitchy way.

I'm just saying, for anything, I hired a medicare coach to help me choose my Medicare plan because I was in a in the middle of just a really crazy time in my life. I didn't have time to research and look into all of this. I spent one. Thousand dollars on that.

It was so worth it peace of mind knowing I got the right thing without any of my time, and it's been you know, these are good things to spend your money on, because just in the you know, short less than an hour that we've been talking, you can see how complicated it really is and how many strategic avenues there are for people to take that we would never know. I would never know. I'm going to call you because I know I in my mind this was my plan. My son did two years of community college that we just you know, that was nothing.

And then so maybe two years more, maybe three, I don't know, coming up five point twenty nine looks good enough to probably you know, fund two years and I was just gonna dole it out here, you go, kid, Now, let's pay for this. Let's pay And I'm realizing now, I'm sure, I'm sure changing myself on the way I'm thinking about this, Like, there's better ways to do this. I do have a business. I have there's all kinds of things that could probably a person like you can probably help me with.

And I'm gonna be yeah, you know, and again I know, so there's kind of enclosing there is. There's two major schools of thought with families. And I want folks to know that it's okay to admit that you may not know it all, and it's okay if you haven't done anything. See that's another thing that that's like, that's the elephant in the room and they're embarrassed.

Yeah, And it's a keeping up with the Joneses. And the most gratifying situ that I've worked on with families are the ones that feel like it's hopeless and it's really not. It's hopeless. You feel like it's hopeless because you don't have two nickels to rub together, so therefore you are not attractive to the asset manager.

But if your entire world an income is not tied to managing someone else's money, which mine is not. I gave up my equities licenses in on two occasions, that's it. If you have me back, that's a whole nother story. But let's sit down and there, Yeah, there is an investment, but you and families also have a right.

I mean, my oldest high level baseball and softball player, I spent a ton of money, okay, compared to if I was just trying to get by and play on an entry level travel team. It wasn't going to work. So you directly get and and whoever whoever your audience is listening to, they need to know what they're getting. And there should be a quantifiable ROI return on investment for what you're getting, whatever that may be, and whatever the arrangement is.

And with business owners, there's one hundred and fifty three tech scholarships out there, which ones work for you? Wow? Interesting? Well, this has been so good and I really feel like you know, if you're listening to it and your kids are little, you know, Wow, you've got all kinds of time to really map this out.

Again. I won't go exactly as you thought it would, but that's okay too, because then you can map out how you'll pivot. So and then for kids, for people with older kids. What made me sad when you said, you know, if you haven't done anything.

What makes me sad are the families who are saying, sorry, kid, you just aren't going to be able to go to college, like we don't have the money. And you know, I'd love for you to come back and maybe talk about too, what what how people can make that happen even if parents have done nothing and really frankly can't do any more than they you know, yeah, yeah. And and and there there's there's always, there's always an option, and just most people just they don't know where to start.

They don't know where to begin. They're embarrassed and don't be, don't be. Yeah yeah. One of the biggest problems with money in general, on any topic is just shame around what we don't know and what we haven't done.

And if we can just cut through that and just you know, go be uncomfortable for a little while, figuring it out and talking to people and revealing the truth. It's like we're so like hiding ourselves all the time and pretending with them with money, which is why we stay anxious and don't you know, kind of get where we need to go. So anyway, that's a whole other philosophical discussion. But Brian, thank you so much for being here.

Please tell people how they can get a hold of you. You're clearly a wealth of knowledge and we didn't touch on so many things that we could have. I know people are out there going, well, I have this question and it didn't get answered. So how can they get in touch with you?

Excellent? I would recommend that they go to my website www. Dot Essential Strategies dot net. Let me spell it out real quick.

E S S E N T I A L S T R A T E G I E S. Take your time and poke around. There's no pressure on that website. There's plenty of opportunities and boxes that you can click.

You can if one is ready to book a call, we'll have a Synergy call. It's about fifteen minutes and it's all we're going to talk about is do we like each other? Because I am I'm extremely selective and picky. You could better.

There could be situations where people benefit from my help, but we're just not going to get along from a personality standpoint. I'll introduce you to someone else. There is a resource tab where they can click them around. They can learn a little bit about fast FA student aid.

It'll take you a link to my CCFS profile. I got to get my other one up there, but you can casual. There's a white paper that you can download, and so very very easy going where they can kind of check out and get a chance to know me. I do have a LinkedIn profile, and I also have a Facebook business page.

A few others but they aren't up and running yet, but those are Those are the main three sources. Website, LinkedIn and Facebook. Okay, And I'll put the website in the show notes. And yeah, I love that.

I think you know one thing I do know other people in this space. The thing that I think you bring to the table that a lot of people don't is the tax strategy aspect of it. So you know, there might be some knowledge, but I think you go deep and I think you also are creative in how you think about you know, different ways to work this for tax advantages as well. There are some great tax advantages that none of us know how to.

Manage. So this is really good. Okay, well, I hate to do it, but I'm going to close the show and thank you so very much for being here. I'll reach out to you because I would actually like to have you back.

We really didn't even talk about FAFSA or the other one that I didn't know about that my son was filling out one day. I'm like, what is that? And he told me Emily, Oh, I don't know what that is. It was the CC what is it?

Oh? The CSS profile that is I'm drawing a blank on what the acronym's for. But it is typically used with private schools. It is much more invasive than the and some of the public ivys, like as an example here, Local University of Michigan extremely popular.

Everyone knows it. That's a public university, but they require the FASTPA, the CSS, and they have their own private form that you fill out as well. Wow. A little side note, I was born there, so my dad was an orthodonic school there, so I was born in.

A fantastic fantastic school. It's it's fulous, absolutely fantastic. Yeah. Okay, well clearly I don't really want to let you go here, but thank you Brian, and thank you audience.

I really hope you found the show helpful, got some wheels turning for you. There. There is a lot you can do in this area for planning purposes, and you know, I think Brian can be a great help and I think people should get help in this area. It's not easy to navigate, even like you said, just with your financial planner.

There's a lot more to it than that. So yeah, thank you for watching the Money and New show. If you like the show, if you have friends who could use this show, please share it with them and like and review. That's always great for us so we can bring great guests like Brian onto the show.

And you can find us on the Limit Free Life YouTube channel, all the podcast platforms, and yeah, thanks so much for listening. We'll see you next week.