Joanna Zhang, Connecting Strategy with Soul for a Thriving Business - Innova.buzz 690

Speaker A: Foreign.

Speaker B: Welcome to the innovabuzz podcast, where our job is to help you build visibility, professional credibility and connection with your ideal client by putting the human at the center of innovative marketing so you can build and strengthen an engaging, enduring relationship with your ideal clients. I'm Jurgen Strauss from Inova Biz and I'm honoured that you're here with me. If you haven't yet joined our wonderful Flywheel Nation community, go to flywheelnation.com and join in the podcast conversations. Do subscribe to the show and also leave a review because it helps others find us. Let's get into today's masterclass on this innovabuzz podcast. Hi, I'm your host, Jurgen Strauss from innovabiz and I'm really excited to welcome to the innovabuzz podcast today from Sydney in Australia, Joanna Zhang, who helps leaders build businesses with a solid foundation by creating a unique operational framework that truly connects strategy with soul. Welcome to the Innova Buzz podcast, Joanna. I'm really pleased to have a conversation with you today.

Speaker A: It's great to spend this time together. Thanks a lot.

Speaker B: Now, before we dive in just for our listeners, especially if you're new to the Innova Buzz podcast, on every episode I like to have a candid and practical conversation with a remarkable guest. Just like Joanna, I like to explore how they create impact and in the world, how they build human connection with their work. And whilst we unpack knowledge, attitudes and values, I'm always keen to see how they can translate interaction for my listeners. So think of this as a seat at the table with you, me and Joanna, all learning together. And as always, at the end we'll have our, uh, buzz round, which are the same three questions that I ask of every guest. We will get some snappy, insightful answers, hopefully inspiring that action that I mentioned.

Speaker A: Let's do it now.

Speaker B: Joanna. Yeah, I'm really looking forward to our conversation today. I know, um, we're both very passionate about human connection and also that you're uh, um, very much into building thoughtful systems that enhance human connection but also make things much easier for business owners and, um, having the business run more smoothly. So perhaps you can start by sharing with us what drives that mission for you and what is the ultimate impact that you aim to make in the world.

Speaker A: Well, thanks for asking. Um, I actually my mission and passion was started from solving my own problem because when I start business I was a financial planner, which is a professional, starting on my own as a self employed, but when I started I actually had a lot of challenges. To work in my business because I'm not really good at marketing or it. So I really need someone to help and there's a lot of other things I'm not really self sufficient enough. So um, I need to work with someone else to help myself. However, you know I don't have a budget to hire a group of five to ten, uh, full time part time staff to you know, work together. So I figured a way even though there was a lot of challenges but because I was really dedicated to make it work. So I figured a way to really structure XR team. Everyone is specialized in their genius, uh, their specialty and I can customize uh, suitable for my budget and to scale up the business. And then I thought many business may need this kind of help as well. Then I started to share this as a resource for other mind the business owners and that's the motivation behind this whole movement is because I overcome on my own challenge and I started to share this solution with the world. Um, but going forward I think because of this journey, um, I found a solution. But there was some breakthrough during this journey through my soul awakening, soul ascension process. And now it's my mission and passion to really share these divine messages and to really share with the world to see how we can really break through and be aligned with our soul to make impact for this world. And the main point is to really give something back to this world.

Speaker B: Yeah, uh, that's really interesting. There's probably two or three um, points there that I recognize as from what you described as some big transition moments. And I wonder if you could perhaps describe those in a little more detail for us. So for me the three that kind of stood out from what you mentioned was the transition moment where you recognized, yes, I've got all this work to do, but there's a whole lot of things that I'm not good at or I don't want to be spending my time on. I can spend my time on more valuable things that are more aligned with my expertise. So uh, that um, that recognition and then starting that team that are the experts in those particular areas that to me was the first transition, then the second transition recognizing hey, this works really well for me. I'm sure other business owners must have the same issue that I had and maybe I can help them because now I've built systems and I've built a team and I can share that with them. And then the third one is the recognition where you transformed your leadership role, if I understood that correctly, where you had what you described as the Soul awakening. So maybe you could walk us through each one of those three in turn.

Speaker A: So beautiful. The first transition, as you mentioned, that, um, I figured out, uh, a way how to really start to delegate. Actually that's the first step. Um, because at a time I had a business coach and we did exercise called incompetence, competence and genius. Um, and through that exercise, interestingly, incompetence is something that I'm not good at and I don't like to do it. Such as IT and marketing. Right. And I know straight away I spent hours on it and I still can't make it right. So I better let someone else handle it and they do much better job than me. The interesting part was actually when I do in, my competence part is something I'm good at and I think I can do it well. But I don't love the daily financial planning actually lays in that layer. So that starts to make me start to think, oh, is this a career I wanted to do the rest of my life? I don't think so because there's something missing over there. And then I started to see that, oh, I need to rebrand my business. So that was a trigger point for me to think, oh, probably business wise, financial planning is not my destiny. Right. And of course I want to dive deeper of excellence and genius that actually dive to today as myself. But, uh, the transition to start with that was that exercise helped me to really figure out which part to delegate on and which part I really truly love to do. So that's the first transition. Any questions on that?

Speaker B: No, no, that's pretty clear. I love the, the exercise of, um, having that, that analysis, um, of what are the skills that you love doing, what are you good at? And, and I guess there's an element in there of what brings you some sort of reward. Um, and for business, obviously there's the financial element to that.

Speaker A: Yeah, for sure. Because, uh, since then I started to bring some color back. I was doing financial planning. There was a psychic. I just spoke to the side chick of the firm and she said, Joanna, your life is gray color, you know, which means there's no color. I'm actually very bubbly. You can see my character. You know, I love the smile, laugh and make fun and then, you know, be, be lively. But at that time my whole life is like very dull and boring. Um, no alignment. So that made me start to think I need to do something different. Yeah, I, and I decided to follow my heart to rebrand it. So that was the first transition. Uh, shall we move on to the next one.

Speaker B: Excellent. Yes. Talk to us about the second one where you recognize, hey, this could be a business for me and something that helps a lot of other businesses.

Speaker A: Yeah. So when I actually figured out a solution for myself to really start to work with the team members to work on different areas, um, I realized there's something that I could use this solution to help others. And that was a transition for me to transform m from a professional truly into a business owner. Because to run the business there's a lot of different mindset differences. Professional is more like I use my knowledge just to provide that particular service to the client. Right. But now I need to really design a um, product and to wrap up everything together and the pricing and the channels and really deliver the value and uh, the whole package and to, to deliver to the clients. So there was a whole shift from any professional into a business mode. I think in that I've learned a lot, I've learned a lot of strategies. Um, but I still have some challenges of to be honest, sales, uh, is not my weakness because doing financial planning is doing sales too. Um, but the difficulty was like generating the business constantly from front end to generate leads. Uh, it's a great challenge for me. And then later on I found out because I worked so hard to really at work front end, you know, to make something fancy or you know, branding and outreaching, whatever it is. I was trying so hard I couldn't really break through. It's not because I don't know how to sell or how to get. It was because actually I didn't have a good right intention. Now I realize, especially after my soul awakening about three or four years ago, I used to do business on a transactional mode. To be honest with you, at the very beginning I was dollar person. I look at everyone as a dollar sign and when I communicate with them I think about the deals. So that was the main challenge and blockage for me when I'm doing business wise. I didn't realize then but after my soul awakening I actually spoke to my spiritual mentor. I said I was trying so hard why things doesn't go through as I wanted. And she actually helped me to delve into a spiritual realm to see the biggest blockage over there. I was trying so hard because I didn't believe my true value. That's why I'm doing a lot of externally to validate myself. Right. So doing a lot of fancy shining branch projects, uh, to make myself feel like I'm doing something. However, when I actually go back to myself to really care about myself, I changed my operation. I start to really look at every single client as a solve. Looking at their problems and challenges to really understand how my solution can really help them out. So I changed my approach. Since then I, whenever I discuss, like have a conversation with someone, I don't look at them as a client or whatever it is. I'm just looking at them as a sol and truly care about what exactly challenge they having and just wholeheartedly give my solution to give my ideas. Uh, and surprisingly fixed just that magic happens. 1 I totally land all the expectations. Magic does happen. Then I realized the true intention is so important when we coming from love and care, things will just naturally, magically unfold. So that's my second transition.

Speaker B: Okay, so that's the second one before the soul, soul awakening. Because I think there's something that you said there that I think is so important and a lot of people miss and that's the idea of serving your clients real needs to really connect with them at a human level and understand what is it that they need and where does that intersect with your expertise or your service or your product. And the other bit that I really like because I think a lot of people miss this part is then giving something without any expectation of a return. And that's where. Because if, if we have that expectation of a return, let's say, um, well, the classic one is, okay, download my email lead magnet, right? Um, and here's a series of emails that will follow up from that that give you some further information or help you understand whatever I'm, I've put in the lead magnet better. And if, if the clients or the, the potential clients, the people that have subscribed to my uh, list are reading those and they're getting the sense that he's expecting me to buy the product or he's expecting me to become a client. He's not just giving me this information because he wants to help. There's uh, an expectation attached to it. Then immediately the, the protection barriers go up, right? Whereas if it's like, wow, this, this person is so generous, he's helped me, he's got no expectation at all about um, what I do. Um, and I've had this experience as, as a client a couple of times where I've almost to the point where I've been surprised. I thought while they're giving away so much stuff and yet they haven't asked for any sale or there's nothing that I sense of expectation. But the paradox as you said, is that that Makes you even want more to buy something from that personal company. Uh, I think you've muted your microphone.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So that's so true. I think uh, that's really truly come intention because I used to do business from desire and fear. Um, either fear I'm not good enough so I need to really prove myself or desire like I need to earn money or you know, like that. But I totally switch now to the love and support and um, what I really care about others. You know. Um, I believe wealth is energy too. And it's like when we working from starting from giving love and provide solution with creativity and the universe will of the. The wealth is flowing towards its energy. And I don't really go with a lot of attraction. Um, especially after I spoke to my um, spiritual mentor. I mean attraction, this world is more like this way, right? Attraction is this way. However, I stopped using law of attraction anymore. I just feel like I'm just be myself and give what I have this vibration. And intention needs intention at divine timing. If someone needs my help, I'll be there. So uh, just naturally and let everything else divine will work it out. A magic click. And I'm myself, no stress and wholeheartedly very happy because I'm doing the things I love to do. Help others to solve the problem, help my team and members to grow day in, day out. And his energy, it just start to flow. Love needs to flow. It's a flow. So yes, totally. After I change intention, everything else started to unfold. Yeah. Transform.

Speaker B: Yeah. All right, well, so that was the second transformation. I mean that, that uh, sounded a lot bigger than what I'd, um, what I'd actually anticipated from what you mentioned earlier. Um, but that's fantastic. Now the third transformation, I thought that was all wrapped up together there. But obviously there's another level of transformation. So talk us through that.

Speaker A: So, uh, the third transformation is since I started business, started to work with people together, um, that was my personal growth. And to be honest, at the very beginning when I worked with others, I was totally entitled leader. I'm the founder, I'm the director. You got to listen to me, right? I don't want to give you instructions. I had a lot of expectation at the time as well. I was totally controlling freak, very Kiki. And there was a team member actually at the very beginning she worked with me. And later on she actually left for some personal reason. And then two years ago she actually came back and said she was surprised. He said, joanna, you have changed so much. And the very beginning you Made me cry. See?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: And um, I can see each personal growth after I work with the people, right. As a team member because I uh, grow myself as well and the team grows as too. So as totally like a title leader in a stage. I was in a very frustration and then tired and then um, nervous mode, you know, always because I need certainty, I need things to be under control. I need things to go certain way. So I'm very strict. A lot of masculine energy over there is to fully controlling the situation. And gradually actually I realized that everyone has all their own different perspectives. When I actually give some more stages or maybe m some space for them to perform, they often surprise me. And I realize I need to really consider other perspectives better and then to really care for them and then give them more support. I started to become a serving leader. From title leader to serving leader. I really truly care what I can do to help you. And then since then our team members started to be more working well together and the dynamic getting better. And then everyone started to perform better, right? To have a lot more potential to explore. But at the same token, another issue has risen because one actually wholeheartedly giggling this. A lot of some people do step my boundary. I believe these people show in my life to show my certain lessons. Right. Um, so I start to get frustrated. Some people, you know, probably can't really keep their words and get work done on time even though they are fantastic at what they do. All different sort of issues. And then that was like after my soul awakening, I started to transition into the third stage of my leadership which is a spiritual. Spiritual leader. Spiritual leader is like a balancing act to balance about compassion and the boundary. And because I want to practice spiritually of self love. I find out I used to be people crazy because I don't like the conflict. So I actually give away a lot of my own boundaries. But since I practiced self, um, love, I started to respect my own feelings, my own willingness. So I have a stronger boundary now. So once I practice that also besides lack of more control, right. And then I found the dynamic of the team has changed because I started to be stronger in the core in a certain area in the business to be strengthened in certain areas for certain certain uh, guidelines to be followed. The purpose for that is really to help another person to grow. Imagine that if some people constantly crossing our boundary and we don't do anything about it. There's one saying said we don't always get what we want, but we always get what we tolerate for. So I've learned That from my experience that I started to set a boundary, you know, to really have a um, strength in the guideline for the team members to follow. And surprisingly there was one team member, uh, used to really copy deadlines, you know, beats the different hour submission, all those sort of things. According to our uh, new boundary set of rules, she actually truly she can become a, you know, create a new set of the habits and then getting better and better in what she does. So we all wholeheartedly happy for her. So now I totally understand the balancing. How important is that? It's surely to help others to grow, uh, help myself too at the same token. Yeah, so that's my third position.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a lot there that's really interesting. It's the um, transition from the, the um, what did you call it? The title leader to the servant leader. So the. Yeah, so I guess the title leader is the controlling leader from, from what I understood your description. And then the servant leader is more uh, like I am the leader but I'm here to serve you as a team member and you have your roles. But then the balancing that with the boundaries, I think that's really good. And the example you gave is probably somebody who wasn't necessarily testing boundaries or who wasn't necessarily playing up, but they just didn't know what are the boundaries. And once, once the boundaries were clear though. Yeah, yeah, we're fine.

Speaker A: That's right. That's right. And then it's their own choice too. There are team members. We can't really have the same value, not on the same path. We be apart, that's totally fine. But because at the end of the day it's same as um, the universe. I know we call it God or source, whoever you call it. When they created us on this world, they wanted to be happy, to grow. Right. And have you heard of karma? It's such a rule. There's a universe place that with good behaviors and when we have good karmas, but with certain bad intentions, bad karmas, I think it's the same thing as that. Crucially I, I thought differently. I thought oh, if it bad karma is a punishment, we use the word punishment. Sounds very harsh. Then I realized when I personally experienced some consequences of my own actions, I actually do learn from it and to grow. Of course at the end of the day it's still our own decision. Whether we want to choose fear or desire or we choose love, it's our own decision. But once we make the decision, learn from it, we essentially can grow out of it.

Speaker B: M. Yeah. I think the interesting thing for me is that. And I reflect on this quite a lot when I, um, look at doing journals, for example, and say, well, what was I grateful for today? When I journal something and sometimes I. I, um, actually struggle, um, because I did. There are a whole bunch of things I'm grateful for, but I take them for granted. Like the fact that I woke up this morning and the fact that I'm still breathing is. Is something to be grateful for. Because the alternative is not really pretty. Uh, but the summit, like the karma. The idea of karma is, um. I mean, often you say, well, I hope karma catches up with that person. If somebody's done something nasty to you and you kind of. You're tempted to do something nasty back. But that again, goes against my grain. But I do often have the thought, well, there is karma, and I hope karma catches up with that person. So that maybe is the revenge part. But I think what you said is important. It's like what you put out into the world, you often get back, right?

Speaker A: For sure. For sure. And what are you talking about? I used to feel like, um, actually I found out this part when I went to Egypt. That's interesting fact. I used to, uh. Because I'm wholeheartedly caring for others, right? And if someone actually do something really harmful for me, I used to have resentment in myself. And then this time when I went to Egypt, that emotion actually stirred me up a lot. I remembered past life, I had some similar experience that actually accumulated some resentment. And of course everyone probably have a different foundation. But my foundation was I wasn't really graduate, uh, gratitude enough for who I am. Um, uh, when Source created me, I didn't see my own value, right? So I didn't recognize or embrace my own value. Though I thought there's certain things unfair. And also I was actually having expectations when I treat others this way. I had expectation, but just treat me the same way. So all these things actually accumulate from my past life, even until now, this life. I have any resentment, uh, layer in my emotion. But this time in Egypt, I totally figured out the foundation of it. Because I didn't recognize my own value. I started to really healing from that, to really truly accept who I am. Um, not just this lifetime of goodness or strengths, weakness, whatever it is, as a soul, I truly, deeply started to accept who I am. When Source created me, I understand it could be for a reason. And where I'm starting, what I'm experiencing is all part of the journey for me to gain the strength to really become that leader I am supposed to be. Um, so when we talk about a karma just now, if whenever someone actually do something to us, we actually wish that person has a karma. I, uh, would say that there is a little bit resentment there. But the thing is that one resentment feeling. My spiritual mentor asked me, what does it do for you if you have resentment feeling? What's the benefit to have that? Think about it. It's no benefit, to be honest. What do you think myself is Baggage, isn't it?

Speaker B: It's baggage, isn't it?

Speaker A: Exactly. And a lot of time I heard this sentence so many times until now. I realize that if we don't forgive others, a lot of times we can't let ourselves release. Right. So forgiveness doesn't mean that we allow that person to do the same thing again. Again, forgiveness means that we respect that person's free will to do whatever they do. But we learn from experience to protect ourselves. And we will trust the universe will pass the certain karma or lesson to them for help them to grow. That's about it. So I actually totally let go the resilient feeling after this Egyptian trip which is so wonderful, you know. And it's such relief. It needs to be. There's some feeling dragging me down, but it's no longer there. You. So. So after that. So surprisingly the resentment feeling for my ex husband or someone hurt my feelings before it's gone. If, if they coming back. I was just wholeheartedly wish them well and then the universe will give them a lesson, whatever it is. But I feel so relieved. Yeah. So thank you for um, pointing out. I didn't realize that I'm gonna talk about it but. Because we actually. It's going to flow. Right? We just read that.

Speaker B: Exactly. Yeah. So you mentioned Egypt there a couple of times. And I think just for uh, clarification for our listener, you did tell me before we started recording that you've just returned from a workshop in Egypt that you've done. And I guess the question I have because of a lot of the things we've been talking about, you've obviously done lots of work on yourself, on your own growth, on your own learnings, on understanding your strengths and weaknesses, on understanding where. Yeah. Who you are as a leader and what you needed to become as a leader to improve and grow. And also some lessons like the one you've just shared about carrying resentment forward when. When you feel as though somebody might have done something to hurt you. Um, what's the. Yeah. What. What do you see as the importance of doing that work on yourself in a general sense, because there's many ways, obviously, to do this. Um, and what do you say to people who. Because I think that a lot of. There's a lot of scary stuff that can come up when you do that kind of work. I'm sure you'll agree with that. You've probably had, um, many sessions where maybe there were tears involved and sleepless nights in. In advance. Um, what do you say to people who are holding back from doing that kind of work?

Speaker A: It's a really good question because, um, when I do my soul awakening, uh, the first session, my spiritual mentor said on that day, they're gonna be a group of people sitting beside it. Listen to it. It's like a judgment day, you know, because this opening is like, when we die, we go through the judgments, and there's a group of people there. At, uh, the first second, I thought, oh, well, would that be everybody know my secret? I just said, in God's eye, there's no secret. And everybody. The main thing is that everybody there who are already soul awakened, they are soul warriors. So they are there to actually learn together and to support you. Then I understand intention is different. First of all, the environment and the guidance is very important. So if anyone is actually afraid of this kind of thing, of course, everybody, uh, will have a concern. Make sure you. You choose a environment. And the guidance is truly, wholeheartedly from love. Right. Because I've come across so many spiritual mentor or coaches, whatever. I don't mean to judge or something, but I could see the intention, a lot of them coming from, uh, making money, to be honest. But this spiritual mental one actually get connect. I could feel the descent is like, truly from love. So a. Build a trust from there. And then the environment. I trust the environment too. So if anyone is holding yourself back, first, we'll choose a very safe environment, um, for. For them to really, truly support you. The second thing is that I realized that if I don't drop my mask, be my true self, I won't be able to be awakened to really truly learn who I am. So that's the second thing that really need to decide. I need to be facing up with people to really share my real stories. Of course they respect my, um, you know, privacy, everything. If I don't want to share, that's okay. But it's my courage to really. It got. We got to have the courage to really step out of our comfort zone, to drop our mask, feel safe, to shake all the vulnerabilities. So that could be the second step. The third step is really, uh, it's our own decision. If we truly want to grow, we got to really um, face who we truly are, learn about everything. From every experience. There is a lesson behind it. Before my soul awakening, I, to be honest with you, I have a certain pattern, repeat again and begin again. And I didn't learn from it and get harder and harder and harder, including business, including relationship, including my financial situation. Everything is getting so much mess. But after soul awakening, it's like in the sky, there's, and there's light coming through. You know, I started to be aware a lot of things around me. You know, everything happens. I started to reflect, to see what exactly there for me to learn. Oh, and I grew out of it. And one lesson I learned will apply to all the steps of my life. For example, um, lack of control. I learned from my relationship. I used to be codependent a lot, but because of that I learned how to start to focus on myself, self love and to lack of control. My whole dynamic, my team has changed. Yeah. So it helped ah, my leadership, it helped my relationship with my kids, with my parents, with my friends. So that one life lesson will reflect everything. So yeah, I know your question is like a lot of people think, what do I, what does this thing do? For me, some stuff wishy, wishy. And well, for me the spiritual awakening and soul ascension is not about doing certain ceremony, doing something to connect, whatever. It's not just that because our guidance there wholeheartedly want us to learn something. That's the main thing. What have we learned from this experience? And uh, we can really make changes to grow out of it. That's the main purpose of that.

Speaker B: M. Yeah, I think there's a couple of things there that are ah, really important to emphasize. And the first one is finding something that resonates with you. Whether that's the spiritual journey you've undergone or whether that's a uh, personal coaching journey, which may be focused a little bit more on self reflection, which to me is spiritual anyway. But maybe it's a different focus. And the key thing that you mentioned though is somebody that uh, both the process and the people resonate with you, but it's also a very safe space so that you can go in there and say, okay, I'm taking the mask off. I'm going to share everything there is to share within certain limitations. Obviously there's probably not everything that we want to share out in the open with strangers. Uh, but the more uh, that you feel safe to be able to share things that really are getting under your skin, that, that you're carrying along, that are getting in the way, um, will help to build that understanding. And, and other people have different insights. Right. That can, you can learn from totally.

Speaker A: Right. Because I used to care about a lot other how they see. And then I realized uh, about the judgment. Whenever we have a judgment on anyone else, it's actually a reflection of ourselves. In some part we haven't accept ourselves. So I started to loosen that part out if I share something and I learned something from it because first of all when I share I started to really facing my emotions truly hardly. And uh, facing myself. And I'm trying to find a lesson to really learn from it. So for me, uh, is that we who for sure, if someone else has a different feeling and a different against doing things, uh, using different purpose or different ways to harm whatever, they will have their own consequences anyway. So I start to learn that what's the focus whether it's on myself or on others. And that actually helped my self confidence enormously. Yeah, I look confident before, but I, I didn't. I wasn't really confident, but now I'm truly wholeheartedly feel like I'm in my call. Yeah, I don't really mind how the other people think because that's their lesson, it's not mine. Yeah.

Speaker B: Acting in congruence with your true values.

Speaker A: Yes, that's right.

Speaker B: All right. Now I'm um, just realizing that we haven't touched on AI yet and must be a record for me since, since we first started. But I know, um, because one of the things. Well, your business is all about a fractional VA service. Right. And I know there's, we touched on it at the beginning that there are a lot of systems that you've built around that. What um, I'm interested in is, and I know you've mentioned this to me in previous conversations we've had that uh, over reliance on AI is a bad thing. Even though AI itself is really helpful in many situations. So talk to us a little bit about how you incorporate AI into your business, into the systems and processes you have, and also how you avoid that over reliance so that you're still getting that human connection and that sense of I'm living my sole purpose, I'm in alignment with my core values and I'm being a uh, truly servant leader.

Speaker A: Right, sure, sure. Um, I love AI to be honest. Um, I feel like the amazing tools and they must manifest by the universe as well. However, same as everything Else is double sided sword depends. Our intention depends on how we use it. So we actually leveraging AI for a lot of areas in our own business to boost efficiencies like uh, creating contents or uh, some outreaching process and some AI bots generate some automation process process within our business. And then because we find out uh, even not just for ourselves. When I had a conversation with other solopreneurs or some business using AI, uh, we often come across some challenges too. Like for example um, if solopreneurs fully rely on AI, a lot of them actually feel very overwhelmed because they actually handle everything by themselves. They're very self sufficient. But there are certain gaps. They still need a lot of human uh, decisions or experience really help to mind the process. So if a solopreneur purely working on themselves with AI without any human involved, the general system can be overwhelmed. And for the team they actually for same as us as well. Like if we work with AI it boosts a lot of efficiency productivities. There's still a lot of gaps in between. Right. We need a human touch uh, or experience creativity here and there. So I'm wholeheartedly very big on working together with AI as a team. It's not like one buyer fully run AI or fully around human because everything exists for a reason. And with AI's join we can really boost the efficiency of our team members as human to focus more on the GPS zone. Right. Go in the hard flow. So I think that if we can figure out a way to really let the human that AI working well together will be really good balancing act. It's like the other, everything is balanced.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: Yeah. So that's how I think. How do you feel?

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah I, I agree with you. There's um, there's so much that can be done with AI these days and I'm discovering things every day. But um, I'm always conscious of what is it that we're trading off. Uh, like if I um, I've started doing my whole research about purchases through AI now. So I used to say well what are the options? I do a Google search of something. So let's say I recently bought a little pocket camera. So okay, I want a pocket camera. Here's all the different things. So I'd build a spreadsheet and say here's all the criteria that I have and then I'd do a Google search and try to find something that matched the criteria. And of course that was a stepwise uh, process. So I'd find something that matched some criteria and I'd say, okay, I'll list that one and then I found another one and then I'll list that. And then maybe two or three hours later I'd have five options and then I put them in the spreadsheet and then I'd look and I'd say, okay, option one, I have to compromise this. Option two, I have to compromise this. Option three, I have to compromise that. And then I'd sort of start to make a decision based on a table that I'd constructed. Now I go to an AI and I say, I'm um, looking to buy a pocket camera. This is why I want it. This is what it needs to do. This is what it must have. This will be nice to have as well. This is non negotiable. What are my options? And then it'll actually come back and it'll say, well, here's three I've identified based on what you've told me. This is the number one ranked. I would rank this number one and it'll list and say, here's how it ranks against the criteria you've given me and here's what the trade offs are. So in summary, if trade off number one is not important to you, um, but these three criteria are really important to you, then this would be the preferred one. If on the other hand, trade off number one is ah, non negotiable for you and you can compromise on category, uh, three, then this other one would be, um, the preferred option. So then I've got, I've already got what AI would decide. Yeah. Then I can take those things and have a closer look at them. I mean I might still decide differently, but I've done about three hours work in, in five minutes.

Speaker A: Beautiful. Wow, that's amazing.

Speaker B: And uh, yeah, so, but what I, what I think is, okay, am I losing my ability to do the research myself? And how important is that, that I have that? So I think, um, for example, if I ask it to give me an analysis of a theme, um, and to critically analyze some articles, I uh, often think, am I compromising my ability to think critically through that? So I think again, there's a bit of a balance there. Right. Because in some instances I think I'm enhancing abilities. In another instances because I'm delegating something to the AI, I'm losing, I'm not practicing that particular skill.

Speaker A: Yeah, amazing. I mean, I think there's always something, I feel like AI ah, there's something AI can't really replace, uh, something with our soul as a creation part. I Know they can design, design or editing, whatever is a creation. But is there something within us they just can't replace? For sure, like wisdom, like true, wholeheartedly our own part of our soul. I'll uh, give you example, like uh, you know, when we dropped some reach out or like a content creation. The AI knows me so well now. Like there's a podcast show, I asked to generate a summary. They can just do it beautifully. And I look at those words, wow, it's amazing. Never write like that, you know. But it does. Its purpose is really connect uh, with the podcast host really well. But at the same token, will I replace my confidence to really speak with someone? No, not at all. Because when I speak with someone is like my creation piece of art. Every single conversation is different. Then, you know, like when we talk about today, uh, say something similar as the other podcast. However, the flow, the modem, the you know, the way you say the uh, expression every time is different. For me it's a discretion itself. You know, it's energy, it's a connection, it's a bond. That's something that AI can't really replace. So I truly believe that if we actually can combine the AI and the human together, so we can truly really boost the efficiency as well as building the bond. Also keep the creation going and learn lessons from each other. I think that's very important because human are mirrors to each other's. They are the ones who trigger our emotions. Right? AI they're married. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Speaker B: All right, well I think, I think it's a good point now to move on to the buzz round where we do talk about AI quite a lot, but in the context of human connection. So, um, there's three questions as I mentioned at the beginning, and just some short snappy answers will be great. Um, so the first one is around innovation. What's the most innovative way you've seen AI use to strengthen human relationships?

Speaker A: I think AI can because the uh, the research and the database collecting feature of AI, they can really um, get a foundation of the essence of this person ads. So by building the connections is about understand each other and see each other. Right. So AI can really help to take the essence out and to really create something to create a report, um, very quickly. So from innovation point of view, I think their ability of creating um, uh, deeper connection has a really good foundation because used we used to not have to do a lot of research like you saying, you know, we do a lot of research, understand, um, but it takes a lot of time. They just shorten the time but they still give us the access to really build a foundation to create that big bond.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I've seen, I've done this myself and I've seen um, coaches actually do this quite a lot, record their coaching sessions with staff. So I've, I've recorded conversations I've had and then take the transcript of that conversation, put it through an AI and ask the AI, for example, what, what kind of language does this person use? What what does it say about their um, values, about their um, needs. And, and like you say, you can get lots of insights there that can then help you to actually connect with that person at that level.

Speaker A: Yeah, so true, so true. Beautiful.

Speaker B: All right, now based on your own experience, what's the best thing you've done with AI Again in a way that enhances human connection?

Speaker A: I think I'm using it for certain areas that I'm not really good at or either. Uh, our team member feels like we can use that to boost efficiencies such as certain areas of uh, content creation, certain part of the, like a uh, repetitive outreach, LinkedIn outreach and some part of, on CRM of generating certain sequence, uh, or some often asked questions by using AI bots. So there's different areas, uh, a lot of them actually with this repetitive part repetitive. Um, so our team member can really relieve from those areas, can do some higher end of the higher value of tasks, um, you know, combining the experience. So those are the areas I'm going to try so far.

Speaker B: Excellent. Yeah. And, and that's where I think some of those areas you've mentioned are where AI shines. And as long as you um, have some fact checking in place then um, it's probably doing an excellent job there.

Speaker A: Yeah. Question.

Speaker B: The final, final question of the buzz round is the number one. I guess it's almost a two part question. It's the number one thing we can do to differentiate ourselves in the age of AI. But it's also related to what I mentioned earlier, which is what are some of the skills or what's a critical skill we should be looking to build, develop or um, strengthen in this age of AI.

Speaker A: All right, so you mean the skills in age of AI, right. I think for that prompt is really important. It's similar as when we delegate task to a team member. As a human I found that the most um, more clear with the instructions, more detailed with the uh, direction we want, the better the outcome. So actually is a practicing act of really give a clear direction for exactly what we want. Uh, especially if we actually same as working with a human, if we give a lot of emotion, like I don't like it, I'm frustrated. Doesn't really help. Of course we can express. But I think token tell the other party, either AI or human, what exactly we want. That's very important. Uh, use a state way to describe, drive it, give it direction so we can help another party to really go towards the way we want. I think that's very important. It doesn't matter what with AI or human. Yeah, delegation, communication skills is very important.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. I found that, um, going to an AI often, um, particularly in the early days, I would get something back that, no, that's not what I wanted. And I would look at what I asked and I think, yeah, okay, I didn't, I wasn't really clear. And it's actually forcing me to be much clearer about what I'm asking. And I think that's a really good skill to develop and be conscious of because if we ask another person a question as vague as I've just done with the AI, I probably will get nonsense back compared to what I, what I actually want. So yeah, and, and what you, you've just prompted me on something. I wonder, wonder whether I should build an AI that I can actually test my questions. So if I'm going to ask somebody something, and here's the, here's actually the kind of response I want, how should I ask this question better?

Speaker A: That's interesting. Yeah, yeah, I think, uh, uh, at the end of the day, I believe AI are here to help us to grow, um, in different aspects. Right. So I hope that can really give us a opportunity to focus on our Gen Z really more and more time out, but at the same time keeping our creativity and connection between the human and, and again then balancing act I think depends on everyone how to treat it, look at it and then to find a way to really balance both parties.

Speaker B: Yeah, excellent. Really good message. All right, well, thanks Joanna. This has been a fabulous conversation. I've really enjoyed it. Now where can people find out more about you, about your business and maybe even reach out and say thanks for what you've shared today.

Speaker A: I think the best way is just find me on, um, LinkedIn, just put my name, Joanna Zhang. If there are multiple Joanna Zhang, you just put operations beside it. The right V will show up. Let's connect and then collaborate.

Speaker B: Excellent. All right. And we'll have links in the show notes where people can click straight through. So make it easy. So wrapping things up today, what's A specific action you'd like our, uh, listeners to take from our conversation and something that will make this worthwhile for the listener. It's been really worthwhile for me. So let's make it worthwhile for the listener.

Speaker A: I think I really wanted to go to somewhere probably not really into the business or AI Ah. Or whatever it is, but it's relying, uh, relate to a single person on a human level, um, to reset our own feelings, um, as a part of self love, um, shatter every single emotion. I used to be very positive. I had not really like a sadness or down time and those sort of things. But then later on I found, um, every single emotion has a reason behind it. If we really, truly, wholeheartedly face every single emotion, accept it, embrace it and find a lesson behind, we will find the great treasure behind it. I used to hide or escape from it and try to be. Look at, uh, very happy. But actually there's a lot of things buried underneath I couldn't really resolve. Right. So I hardly hope everyone started to really face our own emotion. Find a reason behind it, find a lesson behind it and surely heal from it and grow out of it.

Speaker B: Yeah. Really, um, inspiring message. And I think there's a lot of work that can go into that. But, um, yeah, acknowledging the emotion rather than just. I mean, there's a tendency, isn't there? Of. We say, oh, hi Joanna, how are you? And we say, oh, I'm. I'm good, thank you. Um, whereas it may well be that you're angry, um, sad, um, reflective, wistful, a whole range of emotions. You may be. You may even be ecstatic because something wonderful has happened, like your Egypt trip. So, so yeah, acknowledging that range of emotions I think is probably a first step. Right. And then.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Cherishing each one, as you said.

Speaker A: Yeah. Because once we really respect that. A lot of time I used to be numb, you know, like I. I didn't. Because I didn't face my emotions. Actually my emotions, like numb. I couldn't even feel what makes me happy. So that was a really, uh, tragic situation, I would say, because I would try a lot of things wholeheartedly and I don't have feeling of fulfillment because I didn't really do the things, truly make myself happy because I was numb. So if I truly started, I started to really tear my emotions. It's painful. Trust me, it's painful. Painful has a good reason behind it. Pain is inevitable in our life, like my spiritual mentor mentioned. But suffered is our choice. Let us feel the pain, learn from it. We don't have to start from it. We can detach, let go, and grow out of it, and, you know, go to the next step. That's how we actually grow as a soul.

Speaker B: Excellent. Well, that's a great message to finish up on. So thanks so much for sharing your insights and your wisdom so generously with us today. Joanna, I've really enjoyed our conversation. We've covered a lot of different themes and, um, I'm sure there's a lot there for our listener to take away today. Thanks again and all the best for the future. And please do stay in touch.

Speaker A: Thank you so much, everyone. Thanks a lot, Ugandan. Thank you. Bye.

Speaker B: Thanks for listening. We'd love you to leave a review on this episode. It will help us to make the podcast better for you. Simply go to lovethepodcast.com and pick your preferred platform. Remember to visit Innovabiz Co Flyworld and secure your membership to the exclusive Flywheel Nation community where you'll enjoy direct access to our incredible podcast guests, uh, engaging, meaningful conversations and participate in connection events designed to elevate your business journey. Don't miss out. Join Flywheel Nation today. Tune in again to the next episodes of the innovabuzz podcast, where we've got yet more fantastic guests lined up. Until next time, I'm Jurgen Strauss from innovabiz. Remember, be awesome and keep innovating.