Bold Leadership and Data with PowerSchool (Part II of PowerSchool Series)

Speaker A: M.

Speaker B: As I think about that theme of Bold leadership, sometimes bold leadership is just being willing to have the conversation. And AI is definitely a topic we need to have a conversation about.

Speaker C: Hello and welcome to episode 38 of Education Excellence. I'm Michael Levin Epstein, the creator, producer and host of this podcast. For those of you who might be new to the podcast, Education Excellence is a safe, nonpartisan national forum for discussing complicated, cutting edge issues in education. We provide real life examples of actions you can take to achieve creative solutions to problems you face every, every day. In our last episode, we started our fabulous four part series with our terrific collaborator and underwriter that is Transforming Education. Of course, I'm talking about Power School. Power School recently released a landmark study, its 2024 Education Focus report, which features insights from more than 1600 school district leaders, teachers, parents and students. In that episode, you heard from Ryan Imbriali and Chris Cirillo about student driven personalized learning. In this episode, we have two more terrific PowerSchool representatives who will be discussing Bold leadership and data. So let's meet them right now. First up is Richard Hughes. Richard is an Education Innovation Advisor at Power School, where he has also held the roles of Learning and Innovation Advisor and Senior Education Consultant. Prior to Power School, Richard was a former school superintendent for more than 10 years, an educator for more than two decades. In his role as an educator and parent, Richard believes all students must have equal access to opportunities to learn meaningful skills and to explore their individual interests and abilities. Welcome to Education Excellence, Richard.

Speaker B: Thank you.

Speaker C: Also joining us today is Tracy McCown. Tracy is Director of Solution Engineering, Data analytics and AI at PowerSchool. With two decades of experience in education technology and progressive solution uh, engineering, specializing in solving education's most pressing challenges and opportunities through targeted education technology Solutions. Tracie uh has expertise in designing and implementing solutions that meet business needs, enhance product offerings, and align technology with strategic objectives. Welcome to Education Excellence, Tracie.

Speaker A: Thank you.

Speaker C: Yeah, we're happy to have both of you here. And I kind of like to begin the discussion today, which of course is about bold leadership and data. Um, and that's a key component of the Power School Education Focus Report which we just, uh, mentioned. So, Richard, can you kick us off by, uh, elaborating on this portion of the UH report and maybe, uh, name a few of the key takeaways from this particular section.

Speaker B: Certainly, um, as we think about education and the challenges that we currently face, the only way to overcome those challenges is through bold leadership. And when we talk about bold leadership, as evidenced in the report, we're not just talking about making decisions and just going on our own path. We're talking about how do we build collaborative teams, how do we build teams that have sole focus on improving results for our students, improving learning in the classrooms, improving, um, the interaction with our community and increasing opportunities. So as you look at the report itself, um, that bold leadership piece is definitely a key component. And it really has to circle around how do we get people working together and how do we get them moving forward? Um, our society is definitely challenged. I think we've seen a lot of that upheaval in the, in the current and recent past. I mean, the pandemic was a perfect example of, um, unforeseen issues coming to the forefront, but it also gave us opportunities to move forward. And this report kind of wraps up, like, how do we look at analytics and data and, and combine that with leadership to move education forward.

Speaker C: Yeah. And so let's follow up a little bit on that. And you mentioned, um, the pandemic and how that changed things. And so I'd like to get your thoughts, especially with your, uh, background and experience, on why right now is there seems to be a growing need for bold leadership. Why more than ever.

Speaker B: I mean, we can go way back, um, when our current model of education was created with the Industrial Revolution, um, but right now we had this massive upheaval occur. It was already kind of festering as it was with a lot of political discourse, um, with. There's a seemingly lack of trust in institutions. And one of the main institutions that, that our society holds dear is education. So we've seen this increase in mistrust occurring. So to counter that, to really change the paradigm that we're currently experiencing, not just from the unforeseen issues with the pandemic where we had to basically drop everything and figure out new ways to educate students remotely in a hybrid world. But how do we move forward and increase that transparency so that those in our communities understand what we're trying to do and become partners within that? Um, that's where the bull leadership being able to bring people together. Um, state goals have measurements that are very key to those goals. And then we hold, we hold those measurements and those, those, uh, goals at the center of every decision that we make. Um, it requires us going outside the box that we've been in for 100 plus years. We've got to do things differently. And now we have the technology and data analytics to really do things we couldn't do before.

Speaker C: Yeah. Uh, and maybe could you give us an example of the kinds of goal setting that you might be seeing now with goal leaders that might not have existed before or not to the degree they exist now.

Speaker B: I mean, they may have been before, but one of the major topics we're seeing nationally is the science of reading. It's a, it's a very hot topic, making sure all students can read by the end of second or third grade and how we go about that process. So it's, it's really causing this change, this change in paradigm from. All right, we got to get our kids to love to read and to really teach them how to read. Well, some, some students aren't going to love to read. I have one of them in my household. They don't love to read, but they still need to know how to do so so they can learn as they, as they move forward. So those kind of ideas of really focusing on the goal of, uh, we want 100% of our children to read at grade level, well, that's a mark, that's a metric that we're going to hold to and we're going to do everything in our power to make sure that the learning that's going on in the classroom, the data that is provided is, um, showing where our students are in real time so that we can adjust and move forward to focus on that goal. It is bold leadership to say 100% of students are going to read on or above grade level. Because, I mean, you and I know, and many of our listeners have dealt, uh, with education, know that. Well, sometimes maybe these kids don't get it or those kids don't get it. Maybe not every kid. Well, bold leadership says every kid deserves, uh, the opportunity and every kid deserves a personalized learning path to reach, reach their goals.

Speaker C: Yeah, thank you for that. And you, you mentioned data. And I want to turn to Tracy now because obviously her, her job focuses a lot on data. And kind of ask you, Tracy, that from your perspective, um, why is there now more of an increased focus on data, uh, today and looking ahead to the future? And what can you tell me about, uh, product data driven insights that lead to successful solutions?

Speaker A: Yeah, thank you for that question. I think data's been top of mind in education for a long time, but it's really evolving. To your point, it's getting a lot more sophisticated and we're generating more data than ever before. So we just have these massive amounts of data. But the challenge can be turning that data into information that's really an asset. And uh, so I think as technologies are evolving and Getting more sophisticated. They're enabling us to tap into this data in new and unique ways so we can really leverage this data to build trust, to build transparency, and most of all, to personalize learning. So the more that we can figure out exactly where a student is and what they need and data helps us do that, the more we can really serve each student as an individual and, uh, really help each student grow in their academic journey. And I think, you know, as we're adding on tools like abilities to centralize data and secure data and connect data more and more, we then can do innovative things like add on artificial intelligence or AI, which was also a big theme in the Education Focus Report. And all of these tools really just serve us to help us better help students, help families and help communities.

Speaker C: Yes, thanks for that. So, so let's, let's follow up on that. So, you know, our listeners include many people who are principals and teachers and school district leaders. And, uh, if you could give them some example of data could lead them to the, to better solutions and better goals and better understanding of what issues are, that would be helpful, I think.

Speaker A: Yeah, I'd be happy to. So I'm going to start with whole child analytics. So oftentimes we have data that's siloed, so we have information about our students, about our classrooms, about our schools, but it's sitting in a bunch of different places. So if we can centralize this information into one place and get this whole child picture, we can very, very quickly do the analysis of where our students are at. And as soon as we know and we know based on fact and data, then we can very quickly start to respond to what we learned. So, uh, I'll go along the lines of what Richard talked about with reading. The first thing we have to do is know where they're at. We have to know where students are at, and we use data to do that. But just knowing where they are in reading isn't enough. We have to know other things. Back to that whole child analytics. So chronically absent is also a big thing, attendance or students even coming to school. So let's say we have a group of students that are struggling in reading. We can't really serve them in reading until we know that they're even in our classrooms. So maybe using whole child analytics and data, the first thing we learn is we have a group of students that aren't coming to school. So let's start by solving that problem. Uh, once we get them to school and get them into our classrooms, then we can really start focusing on how do we grow them in reading. And then we might have other data that tells us they feel disengaged, they don't feel connected. Because we also know that that human side is really important to learning too. So if we have that whole child analytics through data, we can really view each child more holistically and really help each student grow based on where they're at and where they need to go. And then we could use data to monitor. So the first thing we do is we learn and we do something. But now we have to use data to know if it's working. And if it's working great, we're going to keep doing it. But if it's not working, we need to stop and adjust. And uh, then we need to try something else and use data again to see if that's working. And we do this at the student level. We talk about this whole child analytics, but that all rolls up, uh, to, to a more macro level. So what about the classroom? How are we serving each classroom or the grade level or groups of students or the school level? And then we roll that data up even further to the district level. And at every level throughout our system, it's informing the goals that we're setting and the tactics and the strategies that we're using to really achieve those goals. And until we really centralize our data and get that whole child in whole system view, we just don't have enough information to make really informed decisions. And that's where technology really guides us through this process.

Speaker C: Yeah. And uh, when we come back from the break, I want to talk a little bit about, uh, the new technology, especially AI. But for now, uh, we're going to take a quick break, hear a word from our sponsor. Don't go anywhere because we'll be right back. Horace. Goal. In Today's rapidly changing K12 landscape, it's important to be making careful decisions about technology investment. And increasingly it's important to be innovative in those investments, from addressing chronic absenteeism to promoting positive behavior and supporting an effective multi tiered system of support and a framework for support. PowerSchool is heavily, uh, into student success. And its student Success cloud gives you the tools that you need to meet students where they are and also to streamline data and insights and to improve attendance and behavior outcomes. You can, uh, learn more about Power school by visiting powerschool.com that's powerschool.com. And we're back and we're Talking to Tracy McCown and Richard Hughes from Power School. And I want to Kind of pick, uh, up where we left off before the break. And Tracy and Richard feel like, uh, Richard, if you feel like chiming in on this, that would be great as well. So I wanted to talk to you about the importance of AI going forward, both in terms of bold leadership and in terms of data. Um, you know, I, I think they're, you know, uh, a couple of years ago, I think there were great fears about AI in the education community, as there were in every industry. And I think some of those fears have been lessened, uh, in the last year or so. But I think it still is an issue when it comes to parents and some administrators and maybe some students as well. And so how do you, how do you deal with. What's your opinion of where AI is going and how do you deal with concerns that some have about the, uh, possible dangers with AI and education? And, uh, either one of you can begin.

Speaker A: Sarah, I can start here. Oh, go ahead. I think I'm going to focus on a technological perspective here. And the first thing that we have to do when we implement these new tools such as AI, which I think can be very powerful tools in education, is we have to put student safety and security first. And so by bringing all of this data together and all these systems together, we have to do it in a very safe and responsible way. And that's where a lot of our, you know, not only technology comes in, but our human centered focus, making sure that at the end of the day, everything that we do, it serves the students, it serves the education system, and we do so responsibly and safely and securely. And innovative technologies can really help us do that, to make sure that as we do proceed into the world of AI and all the great things that it can do for us, that we have taken all the right steps to make sure that we do it right.

Speaker B: Yeah, I think Tracy's absolutely correct. Um, as I think about that theme of bold leadership, sometimes bold leadership is just being willing to have the conversation. And AI is definitely a topic we need to have a conversation about. There are schools across this, uh, country who are doing unbelievable things with adopting AI. Um, whether it's our power Buddy solution or others that are out there, it really is about how do you give every child, how do you give every teacher and educator the tools to do their job better? How can they save time and energy from doing those kind of monotonous tasks that we sometimes have to do, um, and use AI to do so? Um, we all have our own biases that we look at. You Know, we look at a student and like, wow, the student doesn't. They're act out because they just don't want to be in school. When in reality it could be a whole different scenario going on behind the scenes that we're not aware of. But the AI component with the data lets us dive into this holistic data that Tracy, uh, was talking about, that all those analytics and that whole child view to help us figure out maybe what really is going on or what the blockers are, the barriers are for that child to learn. Um, in education, um, we tend to stay within our own group. So if I'm an elementary teacher, I tend to just focus on the students in my classroom, um, at the middle school level, because middle schoolers are a little bit crazy. I have a couple myself and I was a former middle school principal. I know the chaos that occurs at the middle school level. We tend to team a little bit, but then we focus on content and at the high school level we just focus on content. Well, AI can really help us bridge those pieces across content across grade levels by looking at the data and really using it to look at the whole child and look at the whole, whole of everything we're doing within a school district. Um, during the pandemic, we bought a lot of stuff. We bought apps and, and tons and tons of stuff. We've got to figure out what is worthwhile to keep and what's worthwhile that's going to make a difference in the classroom. And I think AI is one of those components that when used in the right way, is going to make a huge difference in learning.

Speaker C: So let's follow up on that, guys. And so I think you have so many uses for AI in education, both from an administrative level and also in terms of, uh, going ahead and letting students use AI to work on specific projects. And I'm wondering if you guys have had any experience just on the student level, getting feedback from students on how they're using AI, how comfortable they are with AI. The reason I bring this up is if you look at, um, the use of computers at an early age by students, use of cell phones at a very early age by students, you know, it is amazing how it's getting younger and younger where students are perfectly capable of doing computer skills when they're, you know, very, very young, um, four and five years old, even younger from the use of cell phones. And I'm just wondering if you've got any experience at all with the use of students using AI assisted technology.

Speaker B: We've definitely, I've definitely seen it. Whether it's in my own household or in classrooms around the nation. As I, as I visit places and talk to school leaders, um, seeing students, if the purpose of AI is to simply give them the answer, well, that's, that's not where we want to go. We, we want them to be able to create prompts and dive deeper into ideas. Um, the pandemic has shown us that, uh, we have a large gap that has increased in learning, that tutoring, targeted tutoring, makes a huge difference in helping close those gaps. Well, AI can help that. If I'm a teacher teaching 25 kids in a classroom and I have students of all these varying different abilities and we're on a particular topic, maybe we're just learning, maybe we're just, uh, I'll go to the elementary classroom. We're learning, um, equality as it relates, relates in math. And some students are knocking it out right away. Others are having, are not quite getting it. Well, I can use the AI and the student can use the AI to really focus on the learning of where they're struggling versus just constantly getting more information. Well, let's get the information that they need to close that gap so they can move on and move ahead and catch up or move beyond where they should be at grade level.

Speaker A: Yeah, that's exactly right. It's a tool to help students and staff be more efficient and effective in their work. And that's what it is. And I'll, I'll give a personal experience. I have a college age son now, and I watched him spend most of his junior year and senior year of high school at home during the pandemic. So he missed out on these really critical learning years. And his teachers were absolutely amazing and they were doing everything they could to support students, but they were all working remotely. I think about the AI tools that we have today, even compared to a few years ago, how much that could have helped him. It could have helped him, him, you know, just kind of that personalized digital tutor that could have guided him a little bit more as he was taking these really rigorous AP classes and not having the benefit of being in the same room with his peers and his teachers, that maybe he could have reached for these tools and just gotten a little more help. Um, and again, his teachers were amazing and everybody was just, you know, responding to this environment the best they could. But that's where I see AI tools really supplementing the great work that educators are already doing and just adding another layer of personalization and just making the education experience a Little more personalized and robust.

Speaker C: I think that's a great answer, Tracy. Um, so we have time for just one more question, but it's an important one. You know, as, as we have these episodes and um, as I went to ISTE and, and, and got to meet you guys, I mean, if you ask, um, principals and school district personnel and administrators, what are some of the biggest issues facing them today? I. Every one of them would say AI, but also every one of them would say social media. And um, I'd like to just get your thoughts and it's a really open ended question. Like, like how, you know, you know, how do you view, and how does power, uh, school view the issue of social media, which is so ever present in our high schools and lower grades even today? Um, you must be asked about it from time to time. And so I just wanted to get any thoughts that you guys had of, about, about the importance and influence of it and just any thoughts you had.

Speaker A: Sure, yeah. I, I mean, social media, AI, it's all here to stay, right? So I don't think the question is if, I don't think it's, if our students have access or if it's going to be a part of our education journey. So then what we have to really figure out is how do we do it safely, responsible, responsibly and securely. And it has to be top of mind at the end of the day. Keeping our students state safe while really kind of growing them, you know, into responsible adults that can be successful in the world, I think is really important. And we do get asked about that stuff. And we're really on the forefront of making sure that we build tools such as AI and integrating with social media and other tools that is done with the student experience, top of mind. And making sure that as we focus on that student experience, that we apply safety measures and that we work very closely in partnership with our districts and education systems to making sure that we are helping them and guiding them and supporting them in any way we can. And that includes technology, of course. But I'm also a big believer in that technology and the human experience have to work together. So you could put the best technology out there that you ever dreamed up. And if you don't operationalize it on the human level and make sure that it supports human needs and human growth, then that technology isn't going to work. I think at PowerSchool, we're not just here to deliver technology, although we do that, and we want to be the best at it, but we're also here to really deliver human solutions.

Speaker C: Thank you, Richard. You get the last word.

Speaker B: I mean, I love that perspective. Absolutely. Um, as somebody who's was a principal when MySpace was first out and they had to deal with bullying issues on social media, um, it has definitely gotten harder to do. Um, I think the social media components also created has increased the amount of mistrust we see in our institutions, especially uh, you know, government and education for sure. So when we think about leadership wise, how can we be more transparent and using social media to really give people those glimpses inside the classroom? You know, our community members, our parents, our, uh, government officials, the only thing they know about what happens in our classroom is what they experienced when they were in school. So we can use social media in positive ways to truly show what's happening with our, in our classrooms from a curriculum, instruction, assessment perspective that we can really share those stories. Either we share the stories that we have or others are going to make those stories for themselves and share them that perspective. We want to share the perspective of, yes, we have challenges in education, we always have, but we have things that are happening faster than ever before. Uh, educators are adapting and adopting to those challenges and um, at a pace that is dizzying to say the least. And using those social media pieces to truly share our stories is just going to help in the long run where we can bring everybody together to make a difference.

Speaker C: That's a terrific way to end it, Richard. And before signing off, I'd like to thank you, Richard, and you Tracy, for being such terrific guests on Education Excellence. I'd also like to thank our assistant producer, Sam Hofmeister. We urge you to subscribe to Education Excellence so you don't miss any episodes. It's the only way to make sure you don't miss them. And we don't want you to miss these episodes because we have series like this with Power School where it's a four part series and you want to get all four parts. Remember, this podcast is free. You can hear us on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. We welcome and we value your feedback, ideas and questions about the podcast. Podcast, you can email me at michael.levenepsteinmail.com or just ping me on LinkedIn if you'd like to be a guest, marketing partner or sponsor. We want to hear from you. We'd appreciate it if you'd give us a five star rating on Apple Podcasts and tell your friends and colleagues about us. It really does make a difference. Thank you for tuning in. To Education Excellence today, and we'll see you next time. Time on Education Excellence.