Hospitality Operations: Why Great Concepts Fail After Opening | Ami Alexander

MIchele N DiMeo: Well, hello everyone. Welcome back for another episode of Dine and Dish. ⁓ ⁓ show is going to be so exciting because ⁓ we have so many different guests on that we talk the gamut of ⁓ my God, ⁓ POS systems, advertising, marketing, franchise. But today we're gonna talk my world, which I'm so excited, the restaurant biz and hospitality.

So ⁓ we have Amy Alexander on the line ⁓ ⁓ She is a managing partner with Barrel Age Hospitality. And I'm not going to tell too much secrets before we start the show because I'm to let her introduce herself. But what a cool background in hospitality and hotels and Michelin. And I'm so excited to kick off the show.

So Amy, welcome to my podcast. I'm so excited to have you here today. Ami Alexander: Thanks for having me, Michelle. I'm very excited to be here also.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yes. So we were just kind of chatting a little bit before we started about ⁓ swim week and Miami. There's so much going on in your world. So I actually have such good friends in Florida and they were at the event and parties and we've had friends walk in the show.

So I didn't make it this year, but I'm sure there's been craziness over there. Florida's so crazy anyway. Ami Alexander: Yeah, and ⁓ you know, they keep swim week is an amazing event. It brings people from all over and everybody seems to capitalize now.

You have hotel events and pre parties and after parties and guests are you know, chef chefs are coming in and doing tasting menus. But we actually had a lot of rain this weekend too. So ⁓ a lot of the runway shows were done in the rain, which was sort of interesting. MIchele N DiMeo: I Really?

Wow, has that ever happened before? I've never 'cause they did that huge ⁓ catwalk across that water element or installation, didn't they? Ami Alexander: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

It there was a quite a few runways that ended up happening in the middle of the rain, but rain or shine. The event goes on. Yeah, I think Yeah, it's more. MIchele N DiMeo: Wow.

Well, guess what? They're in swimsuits, so they're prepared for it. Right. So none of the designs are going to be ruined because they're meant to be wet.

So it all worked out. ⁓ Well, let's jump right into the show. ⁓ you have such an amazing background. So I'm gonna let you kick it off and just introduce yourself, talk about what you do, who you are, and then I'm gonna pick your brain on so many amazing questions.

Ami Alexander: Exactly. Amazing. I love that. Well, I'm I'm really thrilled to be here to talk about food and beverage today.

I am the founder of Barrel Age Management and we're essentially an operator and developer consultant partner. We we wear many hats, but we come in and we essentially help develop a food and beverage plan for whatever you know the hotel may be, master planning site. ⁓ you name it, and we've we've been a part of it. We've worked on ⁓ stadiums, we've worked on membership clubs, we've worked in airports, we've done you know super high-end luxury curated experiences on yachts and St.

Bart's, and then done food and beverage programming at hostels. So we've been sort of all over the place in terms of ⁓ what type of concepts we work on, but essentially ⁓ we're two people that started this company because we noticed that food and beverage is is a business that requires a lot of different talents. ⁓ and so my partner and I, we were both running food and beverage for two different companies. And I can share more about our history and background, but realize that, you know, truly to be the best in this category and and to go into a new market with a new concept, you have to be resourced, you have to have the right people to come in.

And whether that's from a culinary aspect or beverage or branding and narrative and marketing, like there's just so much that needs to come together to tell the story and to have a successful business. And so we started our own company so that we could do just that and resource the right way ⁓ every project that we touch. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. So you touched a little bit about what you did before you started your company and you've worked on huge brands.

I mean, all over the world. I mean, I know some of the and we'll talk about that as we get further into the show, but you know, talk a little bit about where it came like your ideas came from and where you started. And because I know we're going to talk about creating concepts, why they why some are successful, why some fail. So why don't we talk a little bit about your background, where you started, who you've worked with, some secrets maybe that you want to share.

And then we'll get into your company now and how you're scaling different concepts all over the world. Ami Alexander: Yes, I love that. You know, it ho luxury and lifestyle restaurants within the hotel space is fairly new. When we t when we look at the history of hotels, there was always sort of this formula for like you have the three meal period restaurant and maybe you have a coffee shop and maybe you have a pool bar and grill and you could kind of guess what was on the menu and all of those.

and you know, and this idea of having really curated food and beverage outlets in a hotel that that speaks to the local community and that gives you a local experience versus more of like that international continental offering is fairly new. ⁓ And so, you know, to back it all the way up, I started my career in the restaurant industry working for restaurant groups, ⁓ was with Hawke for for almost a decade and joined them when they only had two locations and scaled it to now it is one of the largest entertainment companies in the world.

But MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Ami Alexander: You know, we were opening the same concept everywhere. So Hakasan was a Michelin rated UK restaurant, Cantonese food. MIchele N DiMeo: I was just gonna say, not to cut you off.

I actually have very good friends in London. We're gonna be there in July. And the first thing she said is, ⁓ we have to go to Hakasan. I'm like, okay, it's funny you should say that because my guest today, we're gonna we're gonna talk about that restaurant group a bit.

Ami Alexander: I I I mean, it was like my pride and joy, Hakasan. And you know, it opened in two thousand with Alan Yao, who was just this incredible mastermind and really brought like fine dining Cantonese to to London and to America and to the world in in a lot of ways. It was approachable, had an incredible craft cocktail program. You know, the approach to pairing wine with Chinese food was not something that you really saw a lot of, and he developed MIchele N DiMeo: Mm-hmm.

Ami Alexander: a a path to you know have a wine list where all of the wines on the menu matched the food and would go well with the food. And so it was really a very new concept. And I I fell in love with it and was thrilled to launch it, you know, across the world and spent a lot of time in the Middle East and Europe and eventually brought the brand back to America. But In those days, you know, when you were replicating a concept, it you did have to adjust a little bit to local market, flavor profile, culture, but you really wanted to maintain the brand and the concept.

And so it was all about recipes and steps of service and you know, and the brand book and the training program and all of that. And and so that's really where I started. And and I always had a love for hotels. I worked in hotels briefly before before being ⁓ at Hakasan.

And I was approached by Andrew Zobler from Sidel Group in 2016. And he is the mastermind behind the Nomad Hotel, the Line Hotel, the Freehands, and really, you know, had a really refreshing outlook on lifestyle and wanted all of the hotels to be different. So instead of this idea of copy paste and a strong brand is one that is duplicated well, was more like a strong brand has a a strong sense of place. And therefore it's completely different based on where we open.

So the Line Hotel is a great example. We opened the line in in LA and it was in the middle of Koreatown. And we really wanted it to feel very LA and cool and laid back. And then the line in DC that was I'm sorry, yeah, the line in DC that was open was an Adams Morgan and an old church.

And so that needed a different sort of ⁓ MIchele N DiMeo: That was super cool. That one's super cool. Ami Alexander: Yeah, and so we, you know, we there was the first James Beard award-winning chef from the area was our partner there. And so every project just felt really different.

And I I was thrilled to join that team and get to work on some of those incredible hotels. And I think we approached everything like a blank canvas, right? What can we learn from the architecture, from the neighborhood? What's happening in market that's interesting?

So instead of this idea of creating something that was the same everywhere. It was this idea that you know your guests are traveling to a hotel, and within that hotel, they want to experience the destination. They shouldn't have to leave the property to have this like strong sense of place. And so that was an incredible learning opportunity and just a group of people doing brilliant things, in my opinion.

And I loved working for them. after that, I was at Montage Hotels. I ran food and beverage for them for nearly four years and We had the montage brand, but then also the Pendry brand. And so Montage, which is, you know, very luxury product, I would say modern luxury, more approachable, very rooted in sort of its California roots, but with this, you know, foundation of you know, the Forbes five standards and and everything that you would expect from a five-star hotel experience.

But then Pendry was sort of the the little sister concept that came out of that was bred out of montage roots and history and culture. But a little bit more approachable, a little bit more lifestyle in terms of how it was programmed, how it's positioned. ⁓ I think a little bit, you know, younger, in terms of like the traveler is gonna have more of an eye for design, an eye for local profile and and and flavor, you know, desire desirability around like what they're eating and drinking.

So MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah, well, it's funny because Pendry's very kind of modern artsy too. So, you know, they took that luxury standard, but they made it kind of cool and vibey and you know, because the Pendry and they find really cool buildings to put it in too, which is super cool. Like they took the police station in Baltimore and they reworked that whole piece and brought it into a piece of history for Baltimore, which is, I think, super cool. I mean, even when you do different projects in churches, restaurants and churches.

firehouses. It just adds such a cool piece of element and design into the whole mix of the brand. Ami Alexander: Absolutely. And whereas Montage, all of the food and beverage was developed in-house and managed in-house, Pendry wanted to step outside the box with that and really partner with the best in the business that could help bring layers of storytelling and experience.

And Baltimore was a great example, partnered with Andrew Carmelini out of New York, brought this incredible chop house experience down. And of course, you know, if you're going to open a hotel in the Northeast, it's great to have a chef that understands that market and MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Ami Alexander: that's it you know, that guests find interesting, not only that are staying at the hotel, but also in the area. It was really exciting for people living in in Baltimore to have this like incredible, iconic New York chef, you know, opening a flag there.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah, and what's really cool too, and you brought up a big point with the chef knowing the market, because Baltimore's known for crabs and seafood. And so they have to know how to kind of translate from a New York menu, because New York food and New York menus are very different than when you get into Baltimore, DC. I mean, me being a restaurateur, I mean, we learned that very quickly. We opened in Tennessee and we're like, whoa, that's a whole different market than Baltimore and whole different market than Virginia and DC.

So, you know, it's Kind of interesting we're having this show right now because we're getting ready to move our headquarters up to the New Jersey, New York area. And we just were at lease to do a project with Hilton in a hotel brand. So we're actually going to be opening a full service restaurant right in Jersey City, right on the water facing New York City. And we're going to do basically a full service Italian concept in the hotel.

So it's kind of interesting that we're talking now about. hospitality at restaurants in a hotel environment. You know, it's when we were designing this whole piece, we we said, okay, we're taking this restaurant space that's in a hotel, but now we're going to make it a restaurant space focus, not just a restaurant and hotel. You know, because now we want to bring people in from the community and we're going to bring, you know, we're going to do this wine bar and we're creating this whole vibe.

So I was so excited to do the show. I'm like, yay, I have Amy on, you know, this is what she does. So it's kind of cool to talk through this. It's perfect timing.

Ami Alexander: Yeah, I mean, well, congratulations. That sounds exciting. Jersey City is blowing up and and there's so many great restaurants happening at, you know, on that side of the bridge, which ⁓ which is exciting for everybody, I think. ⁓ you know, there's so many young people that live in New Jersey that love the food and beverage scene that's happening in Manhattan, but you know, want to have have it at home.

And so I love that I love that to hear that these projects are happening. It's always exciting for us. You know, I mentioned it before, but MIchele N DiMeo: Thanks. Thanks.

Yeah. Ami Alexander: In the past, hotels really would want to cater to their international guests. They'd want to have, you know, the sort of comfort foods that people might expect at home in their hotel. We considered that the luxury of hotel dining, right?

You want to have your omelet, you want to have your breakfast, you know, your your coffee, you want to have a great burger, a great pasta, things that are comforting to you when you're not home. That has shifted a little bit. And why people still want to feel comforted and want something they know, I think more people want to feel like There's some place that has a strong identity and vision and a draw for locals. And in a place like New Jersey, when you have so many different concepts, you know, in order to stand out for the local community, you have to have a point of view.

So what is the concept? What is the cuisine? You know, what is who is the chef and what is their vision? And I think the more you can double down on that and really commit to it versus making exceptions for the, you know, the convenience of every traveler, it's the it That's what people want.

And at the end of the day, one thing that has changed in the last 15 years with the sort of new wave lifestyle hotels, we know that interesting food and beverage drives ADR and drives occupancy because people will want to stay there. And so a lot of times you can build, you know, those shoulder periods where it may not be high seasonality, but you're drawing people in that want to stay there to experience the amenities of the hotel and the surrounding area. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah, so true.

You know, what we've seen and we've done other projects. I mean, we have a a restaurant here that we've had for 20 years that's part of the West End. ⁓ we've been we've watched restaurants come and go and we're still there. You know, we restaurants that were in the West End actually closed and we're still there.

So it's so true. The the whole footprint of dining in a hotel versus actually on the street in a hotel has changed so much. And the, you know, one of the things, you know, you stay at a hotel and what you what do you do? You Google, okay, where should I go in the area to eat.

So, you know, if you can bring that energy and bring that design and bring that concept to stay, to it gets people to stay in the hotel to say, ⁓ let's go have a drink in the bar, instead of let's go across the street to another concept that's on the water. And I'll tell you what, Jersey City is just blowing up. Like that whole exchange portion of, you know, being on the water and everybody coming over from New York City, it's just what's going on in Jersey is amazing. You know, between Weehawken and Hoboken and Ami Alexander: Mm-hmm.

MIchele N DiMeo: You know, it's just we're seeing such a huge increase of just traffic and building and high rises. I mean, it's just amazing what's going on over there. But that's a whole nother show. So you mentioned ⁓ some interesting pieces about luxury hospitality and five star standards with Forbes.

And I want to talk a little bit about that because systems that are built in luxury experiences are very different than just a restaurant that's built in a hotel or on the street. And Ami Alexander: Yes, it is. MIchele N DiMeo: I want to talk through that because you've you've worked with so many chefs, developers, concepts that are built just on operational excellence. So talk through how that luxury hospitality system is built versus just your standard service system, you know, because you're working, I'm sure, now with so many different types of concepts.

And the luxury side is so different in terms of culture and training and design. So let's jump into that a little bit and you know, then we can kind of talk about. Does the guest really see that difference? You know, and and how they feel?

Because dining obviously is all about the experience, right? Ami Alexander: Absolutely. Well, I would say that at the core of luxury brands is sort of your mission statement, right? And that is a big separator from let's say walking into just a a bodega and getting a sandwich versus visiting, you know, having a sandwich in a restaurant in a luxury setting is, you know, there's there's a culture, right?

So there's a culture of hospitality, there's a culture of brand. And Sort of your mission statement and your brand pillars don't just speak to how your guest should feel, it also speaks to how your employee should feel. What are what is important to them, right? A lot of times your brand and and for instance montage, the tagline is a life well-lived.

And it's about you know quality time together, building memories, ⁓ time well spent. Right. And so usually the people that are coming in and that want to work for you identify with that too. And and it resonates with them.

And so ⁓ I think there's a natural tendency to bring people in that ⁓ are are dedicated to hospitality. They're not just a waiter, they're somebody who enjoys care of people. ⁓ we're not here to take food orders. We always say we're here to know to really guide the guests and take care of them.

And and I've always loved restaurants in a in a hotel setting because you have the ability to, you know, this is somebody that's potentially staying with you for three, four, five days. ⁓ you have more interactions, you get to know your guests more. ⁓ there's more loyalty there. So you see return guests repeating, you know, families, you hear stories all the time.

I was here 20 years ago for our wedding. ⁓ there's just there's there's a real core sense of, I think, ⁓ commitment to the brand and the experience and the guest. And that to me is the biggest difference. I would say from a concept standpoint, ⁓ you know, there we spend more time now talking about concept and brand and narrative than we did before.

What does this restaurant mean? You know, if it's an Italian restaurant, is it, ⁓ is it like grand grandma's grandma's recipes from Italy? Like what, you know, do we do we have those? Do we have them written down?

How do we turn that into Like a paper napkin or a custom piece of artwork that you see when you walk in. ⁓ is it you want the experience to be 360 degrees now? We think more that way than we did before. It's not just about, you know, tasty food and and good drinks.

And it need you really want to feel transported. You want to understand the name of the restaurant and why, and who is the chef and where do they come from and where's the inspiration from? And so we've seen like incredible leaps in brand work and narrative. We bring on these companies now that, you know, can just really they do incredible illustrations and storytelling.

And now with, you know, the the power of social media and content and, you know, we bring it to life. So most people have an idea of what to expect before they even step foot in the in the restaurant or in the hotel. and I think that we, you know, I think that in the luxury setting, you connect more. You build sort of that emotional connection with your guest.

And that's To me, that's what luxury is. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. So we create concepts. I mean, obviously, you know, you have to match your concept to the brand that you're building in, obviously.

So, you know, you don't want to be too fancy for the audience that is staying in the hotel, or you don't want to be too casual for the audience staying in the hotel. So obviously the concept is so important how you market it, how you design it, how you create that story. Because you're absolutely right. It's all about a story.

It's all about storytelling and experience. But I want to jump into because what you do these days are so much about ⁓ making sure the concept is successful. And you know, we we create these amazing concepts, we build these amazing restaurants, but then sometimes they don't work. I mean, obviously this industry is so volatile.

We all we talk about at every show, 80 plus percent fail in the first two to three years. So Let's talk about, and my husband says it all the time. My he's my partner in life and partner in business, but he says all the time, you know, it's the honeymoon phase. Every restaurant that opens does amazing.

It's the honeymoon phase. But then so many things happen, whether it's the concept breaks down, the operations break down. So talk about what things you see most. I mean, this restaurant opens, and then what happens?

You know, why why does it fail? ⁓ is it a breakdown of systems? Is it a breakdown from the ownership? I mean, talk through that process for.

Ami Alexander: Yeah, I think culture is is also key to this answer. You know, what is the culture of the the team that's in place when you open? And are do people enjoy working there? Do they stay?

I think there's a direct correlation to ⁓ how often you have turnover to how successful your restaurant is. ⁓ for me, that's that's super key. You know, one one thing that happens sort of in Europe and in in MIchele N DiMeo: Mm-hmm. Ami Alexander: many other countries is you get these like really lovely 30 day, 60 day training periods where you get to bring people on so early and do you know a ton of training and everybody really gets to know the food and gets to know all the drinks and a ton of mock service.

And in America that feels a lot shorter. You're lucky if you have two weeks of the whole team on. So you have to build MIchele N DiMeo: ⁓ yeah, everybody rushes through it. They hire fast, they rush, rush, rush, rush, rush, they forget the training and then they're like, they open the door and they expect these people to deliver five star service, you know, and then they're like, ⁓ why aren't you doing it?

Well, you didn't invest in them, right? Ami Alexander: Yeah. Right. And hotels are an even more of a disadvantage because there's a sort of a longer development period, right?

So what we're seeing today is a lot of the hotels opening this year, last year, the year before, you know, were underwritten before COVID, before a lot of these changes that happened around the world where, you know, the cost of of of parts of furniture, of shipping, of of construction has gone through the roof. And so as they get closer to opening date, like things get tighter and tighter. And so, you know, the the last thing big expense to come on board is like your team. So sometimes you see, and it's unfortunate when it happens, but it's like, ⁓ we're only gonna have a week to train, or we only have two weeks to train.

So I think the important thing is, you know, you want to really treat that pre-opening period as gingerly as you can. Like you want to build the trust with your team. You want everyone to enjoy working together, to to have time for like team bonding and You really want the team to understand the menu, understand the drinks. I just went to a restaurant opening ⁓ this past week actually in Miami, and it was a much anticipated restaurant opening, highly visible redesign of an iconic Miami hotel.

And the restaurant missed and it just did. It the AC was having issues, the drinks took too long, ⁓ the food was served cold. The order was wrong. And it was just, it was so disappointing.

And we were, you know, rooting for them, like super excited to be there. But it was just, it was clear that, you know, they were rushed into opening their doors. And, you know, the honeymoon phase is important because you get a lot of people that will come and visit you once to try it out. They've heard about you, they've you'll never get PR like you get when you open right if you do it right.

⁓ and so you know, you get one time to make a first impression and it's really important that you're ready. I would say, assuming you make it past that and you work out the kinks and you know, and your restaurant is open, you have to stay relevant, right? So lifestyle, fine, you know, restaurants, it's a competitive space, especially in places like Miami, New York, Jersey City. There's always gonna be a new kid on the block that people are are excited about.

So it goes back to service standards and how we treat our guests and building loyalty. If I go to a restaurant, it's my third time there, it makes a huge difference if somebody remembers my name or remembers my water preference or remembers that I liked a table. ⁓ it makes a huge difference. And I think we overlook that sometimes.

⁓ one thing that I always encourage my teams to do in restaurants is take guest notes, any guest note. You know, if any if for every table that sits down, if if the server can write one thing and hand it to the hostess to put Notes, had this, like, enjoyed that, you know, ⁓ it's their anniversary, but it wasn't in their, but they mentioned it, but it wasn't in their reservation notes. Let's make sure we get it in the notes for next time. Or maybe a manager can pick up the phone the next day and call and say, Hey, I noticed you joined us for our anniversary.

Like, thank you so much for coming in. Little touches that feel personalized are making a huge, huge difference. We tend to go back to restaurants where we feel feel seen more than the best restaurants in the city. Because there's familiarity and you know that you're gonna enjoy yourself and you automatically feel at ease that you've picked a place where you're comfortable.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah, I 1000% agree. new restaurants need to make it or break it from the beginning. I mean, being in the restaurant business for my God, I've been working now with my husband for almost 20 years and we've opened so many full service restaurants and that I'm such a stickler for the floor and the service and expectations. And It starts when they walk in the door.

And I couldn't agree with you more. And, you know, I make notes, I put it in the reservation platform, whether it's Resi or Open Table. And I mean, I've had so many people come in and do engagements and propose and we would go over like put the ring on a beignet. And I mean, we just we've done so much cool stuff over the top.

And that's why we've been successful. I mean, our latest concept that we had here in Annapolis, ⁓ It was all about the vibe and the experience. And I mean, I'm there. I'm at the door.

I'm on the floor. I'm making sure that the service is being met. I mean, it's it's so important. I mean, people, you're you're 100% right.

They bring them in, they, they hire fast, they train, they throw them on the floor, and then the guest feels it, you know, and then they leave, just like you said, it's such a miss. And then they leave. And I mean, it it's sad. I mean, I hate that.

I mean, I go to restaurants and I'm like, ⁓ Some of these things I cringe because I'm sitting there. I'm like, they could have just done this and it would have made the experience a thousand times better, you know? And it's also starts with leadership. I mean, it's not just even the ownership, it's the owner taking it down to whoever's leading that team, whether it's the GM or the the executive chef in the back.

I mean, they have to set that expectation. I say it all the time. As an owner, I don't touch the guest. I have 14 restaurants.

I'm not in every restaurant every day. But I need to make sure that I communicate down to my team and my team communicates down to the front line, like you said, whether it's a server or bartender, to make sure that they're being accountable. They're communicating the same message. They know the menu and they're trained.

So I'm I love that you said that because so many restaurants just don't get that. They just hire anybody and they come to the table and it's like, ⁓ my God. You know, it's they're not just there to take an order. They're there to create an experience.

Ami Alexander: And you have to s you have to stick to your standards of service. So if you say that every server needs to know the menu before they can take a food order, then you certainly shouldn't be putting them on the floor plan on day three because you're short staffed. Sometimes you have to limit your books for the night. You have to give them that space to learn and grow their confidence.

And you know, training and development is so important at every stage of someone's career. If you're a a busser in a restaurant, MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Ami Alexander: There should be a path for you to become a server, right? We shouldn't just be waiting for you to raise your hand.

Like, are there trainings? Are there opportunities to come in and shadow a server? Do you have ongoing, you know, beverage and food trainings that they can partake in if they want to? What is the test to go from busser to server?

Is there a physical test that they can take and pass and show you they know the food, they know the service standards? So I think creating a culture of growth and development and encouraging that is also a huge part of just having an ecosystem within your business where you're developing your own talent. Because we all, you know, there used to be a day where you'd post a server position and you'd have a hundred resumes. Those days are gone.

So now, you know, we really do hire based on character and attitude and willingness to learn more than experience and even in the luxury setting whereas before you would require you know minimum of five or ten years experience at sort of every role. So I I think that's important too and and empowering your team, you know, if something goes wrong on the table, make a change, you know, comp the dish, send something out. Like you have the power to to to make it right. And that is important for people because they know, you know what, ⁓ things go wrong, dishes take too long, things happen.

And having the ability to sort of turn it around and take care of the guest is also a quality of hospitality that you want your team to have. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. You know, every show I do, two things come up and I'm gonna say the two things. It's COVID and AI.

Ever that's what everybody's talking about. And you actually mentioned COVID with when you were talking about just the hotel industry in general and hospitality, because things just got they just everything was delayed. W whether it was, you know, supplies, kitchen equipment, I mean everything. So what are you seeing ⁓ in your industry?

I mean, obviously you focus a lot with concepts in the luxury brands. What are you seeing since COVID in terms of changing in staffing, hiring, build outs, concept development? ⁓ what changes have you seen the last few years? Ami Alexander: ⁓ my gosh, everything has changed.

I mean, it's a different landscape. I think the the biggest, the biggest glaring thing I deal with every day because I work so much on development and with owners and in sort of the planning phase and the building phase is the costs have skyrocketed. So, you know, if you wrote a number down for how much you thought that was gonna cost or cost five before COVID, it's not that number anymore. And so we go in and you know, it's part of what I do and MIchele N DiMeo: Mm-hmm.

Yes. Three times. Yeah. Ami Alexander: And I I you mentioned this that you and your husband are partners.

My husband and I are also partners in our in our business. So part of what we do is we go in and we have to, you know, make a budget that makes sense. And that's our our due diligence phase with with different owners and developers is like, you know, we don't want to get to the end of that project and have to cut back on staffing and have to cut back on the things that matter, right? The plateware, the uniforms, like the music, programming, the tools.

So let we gotta get in there early and make it right. But you know, the mentality with with MIchele N DiMeo: Grand opening. Ami Alexander: Hiring and training has changed too. You know, now that remote work is plentiful, a lot of people have turned to that.

We don't see as many applicants for positions as we had before. But I'll say that, ⁓ you know, if you're a brand that has ⁓ legs and that people understand and that has a good reputation, it's not so difficult to hire. So it's really important. I think I work closely with you know people in culture and HR departments to make sure that.

we are you know great employers and that we're we we have the tools for people to be successful. ⁓ in some you know instances we've opened restaurants where it's a four-day workday. So we we really want to come in and understand the market and what people are looking for and ⁓ and and hire to that but I would say generally you know we we see less applicants, we see less experience. There has to be just more focus on training, on developing, hiring the right people and You know, and then I think consumer sentiment has changed too.

You know, where we used to have really big peak seasonality in certain markets, especially mountain towns and beach towns, ⁓ or even in cities, you know, your Thursday, Friday, Saturday were your peak days, all of that has shifted. ⁓ seasonality is sort of not a thing anymore in beach towns and and and and the mountains, and at least not as much because so many people have moved there, right? And live there now full time. And then, you know, I think in the in the cities, there's a real clear correlation to the culture of how many office days do you have versus how many do you not?

You know, I have two two restaurants in New York City, one of sitting in Midtown where all of the surrounding offices are on a four-day work week. So they're busy, you know, six out of the seven days of the week. And then another one where they are on a two-day work week. And so they're really struggling midweek because they are surrounded by offices.

or note what that are basically empty. So I think that the the move to remote work has done a lot in our industry. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. You know, the good thing is a lot more companies are actually going back to office work where that's nice to see because for so long everything was zoom, zoom, zoom.

And it's like, you know, people want to get back. I mean, especially restaurants. I mean, I don't think restaurants are ever going to go away because people love the experience. They love the camaraderie.

They love the excitement. They love seeing the vibe and the different food. And I mine I have friends all the time that say they don't even care about the food. They're just going for the atmosphere and the experience.

But Talking about experience and driven hospitality, I want to talk about so many things now are focused on these like private clubs, like lifestyle hospitality, membership clubs. I mean, I have a really good friend who ⁓ lives in Florida, ⁓ goes back and forth between New York and Florida, and she keeps saying, let's do a members only type of focused club in the city. And I'm like, ⁓ you know, let's see where that goes. But what are you seeing in terms of like membership clubs and lifestyle hospitality and yacht clubs?

And I mean, it's kind of making a comeback. Ami Alexander: It's it is absolutely what everybody is developing now and ⁓ a huge focus. I do even hotel brands are wanting to have floors that are membership only. ⁓ so you know, and I I I think I read an article recently, I can't remember where it was, but there was some some key indicator saying that, you know, in the next 10 years or 15 years from now, most people will be a part of five or six or seven memberships.

So whether that's a health club membership, a social club membership, an office membership, a gym membership, though there'll be some, you know, multiple levels. It's not just about one. It'll be having multiple. I myself am a member of multiple, you know, different I have a a place where I'm a member that I can work.

I have a place where I can go to the beach. I have, you know, and so and wellness is obviously the biggest growing market segment. So you're having all of these wellness centers pop up that may also offer office spaces or fitness, but primarily you know, exist for wellness and and longevity and you know, there's there's a lot of intersects now of that with medical and being able to run scans and diagnostics and blood work and have somebody from a medical field, you know, review your your biomarkers.

So it's it's an interesting world. I think ⁓ you know, if you're gonna come in and you're just going to be a membership club that's a restaurant or essentially, you know, evening programming, you have to be really you, you know, you have to be thoughtful about what that looks like. It's I've seen some mem some membership clubs open that have multiple restaurants and it's really hard to fill them every night. ⁓ and so, you know, you it I think striking a nice balance of public versus private ⁓ is sort of the answer, but it depends on market.

And a lot of markets are are really don't have any yet. So in some ways it's kind of the Wild West for them to figure out What is the actual demand? What will the actual usage be like? What can I charge for membership?

And you're seeing a lot of different companies figure that out now. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. There's actually a really cool one in Philadelphia. ⁓ my daughter actually got married there, but what a cool lifestyle brand.

I mean, it was like a boutique hotel. It had like 10 rooms. It had an amazing gym. I mean, really cool lifestyle center where they could work out.

It had a club, but then it also had a floor where you could work and do your Zoom and your office space. And then it had its own bar and restaurant. It was the coolest space. I'm like, God, I need to do one of these in Maryland.

But You know, the only problem with it is I s I think it's still so new. And then how do you it it it targets a certain clientele too? It's not general public, you know, and then like you said, you know, what how do you do pricing in terms of what that membership looks like? And are you driving more the workout wellness clientele or are you driving more the the business office that just wants to work out at lunch?

I mean, it's kind of such a a cool industry and it it's just evolving and You know, and then how do you create loyalty to that hospitality brand? You know, so you're going from being just the restaurateur to now being this club. And then do you allow if you're not busy, do you allow the public to come in? I mean, it's kind of you gotta kind of figure out that whole piece.

Ami Alexander: Yeah, there's a ton of work that needs to be done, ⁓ market study work in advance of opening a club. You really have to understand what you're doing in advance. It's incredibly difficult to start selling memberships and then three months in go actually we're going to open a floor to the public. That's a you know recipe for disaster.

So you really have to kind of come in with a plan and understand your market. And I've worked with different groups from Europe that are trying to open membership clubs here in America for the first time. And so they're very smart to bring on a consultant or someone to help them identify what can we charge? What is the likelihood, like how many memberships do we need, you know, to open.

And so there's a lot of different benchmarks that we look At when we do a membership club. But I think you know, you asked about COVID, and and my answer was really more about operating and opening and developing. But the other huge shift that happened during COVID is this sort of blurring of business versus leisure travel. And you know, more and more people don't identify as just a business traveler or just a leisure traveler.

And so, and I think we a lot of a lot of people that work remotely and myself included. Our days are not so simple. You know, it's not that we've got this nine to five work day, and then from five to seven is my time, right? We sometimes we take, you know, do things during the day that we need to do for ourselves and then we work at night.

And maybe I'm doing a business trip where I'm taking meetings, but I'm also meeting friends for dinner, or I'm staying an extra day to work by the pool. ⁓ so there's there's just a little bit more blurred lines, I think, between business and leisure and I and A great membership club that offers this sort of office space, co-working levels. ⁓ those are successful because people value, you know, a great place to work. If you're on the road and you can pop in somewhere and you know you have great Wi-Fi and it's a it's a place where you can invite somebody and take over a meeting room for a couple of hours, you can ⁓ you know, host lunch or or an early dinner.

These are all really great benefits and amenities that people who are traveling that are also working remotely want to have. MIchele N DiMeo: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I know we're gonna run out of time. So I want to talk really quickly about just scaling these concepts.

So you've talked about opening brands in Europe and other countries or other countries coming here. And that's such a huge ⁓ undertaking because you have to learn the culture, you have to learn the country, you have to learn their standards, their food. There's so many different pieces. That goes into that.

And that's something that you've done very well and you pride yourself on it from your background to what you do now. So talk a little bit about how do you do that expansion without losing your identity, losing your vision? Cause like you said with Hakassan, I mean, that's a whole nother concept that they brought here, but they didn't want to lose who they were, but they had to kind of tweak it to be American. So how do you go about doing that and keeping the culture of the true company and the and the true brand as you scale?

And and you grow. Ami Alexander: Well, it's about knowing your brand. What is essential to the brand? What is core?

What is non-negotiable? It has to exist. Right. And with Nomad, it was all about, you know, design and certain elements of the food and the beverage program and this, you know, the library space where people could could work that was so there were certain elements of like you have to have this type of space.

You have to have this, you know, element of design. ⁓ for most luxury brands, there's also non-negotiables in terms of destination and like physical footprint of the of the property that's needed. ⁓ I would say, you know, and and then you have to know what's non-negotiable. What is, you know, is it 10% of the menu that can change?

Is it 50% of the menu that can change? You really have to have guidelines so that When a guest is traveling from place to place, there's certain things that they can expect that they love about the brand. So they're not like, wait, I loved this, I loved this hotel in London, but I'm really not getting it in New York. It doesn't make sense.

So what is it that you feel the guest like from the brand resonates with and wants to have? And then what is sort of the, you know, the formula for what can evolve and change and represent the sense of place? And a great example is like a beverage program. A company may say, All right, we want ⁓ Our classic cocktails to be the same everywhere.

If you're gonna have a Negroni, a martini, a margarita, like it should be the same because it's classic. And then we'll have a seasonal cocktail menu, and that should really be more about sense of place and where we are and local local ingredients, local trends, what are people drinking in the area? ⁓ so I think, you know, I think it that's it is like really understanding your brand, understanding what MIchele N DiMeo: Friends. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Ami Alexander: ⁓ a guest who is coming to experience your brand, what are they expecting and what do they, what should they see, feel, taste, touch, hear? And as long as you're hitting that, you can kind of play with with, you know, sort of the other elements. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah.

⁓ let's just touch a little bit on the future of hospitality because I mean, with AI and technology and we talked about membership clubs and ⁓ what do you what do you see coming in the next five years? ⁓ you know, what should restaurateurs, hospitality operations, what should they prepare to get ready for whatever that next is? What do you what do you see coming this way? Ami Alexander: It's a great question.

we get asked about AI all the time. And while I think AI is certainly going to have, you know, a big role in branding and some of the creative aspects of what we do, certainly ⁓ things like market studies and analysis and competit, you know, looking at our competitors and price sets, like there's already so much being developed in that stage where There's really no reason to open something that's amiss. Like we have so much information now about the market and where people dine and average check and sort of all of the assumptions side, I think is is going to become a lot easier and more streamlined.

And we're harnessing a lot of that AI ourselves and finding that we're getting answers quicker. So projects become shorter in terms of lead time. ⁓ I still think that we're gonna maintain, you know, we're gonna be a human business for a long time where people feel they want to connect with. not only those that they go out with or travel with or dine with, but also, you know, the bartender, the server, the met, like they still want human interaction.

So yeah. Yeah. I don't think it's going anywhere. ⁓ wellness and health are here to stay.

I think we're gonna see a lot more ⁓ technology around what people are eating. MIchele N DiMeo: They still want cheers. They still want that neighborhood gathering place for the bartender to go, How are you? What's new?

Ami Alexander: and ⁓ macros and you know diet benchmarkers it's it's easy to look at a menu and think that you're eating something healthy but you're really not so I think people want that level of ⁓ exposure they want that level of transparency you know you there's certain restaurants now where you can track the farm that your animal came from and you know when was the animal born and you know and how long ago until like it was MIchele N DiMeo: Would you wanna do that though?

Would you wanna know where the animal was that you're eating? I I don't want to think that much into like, ⁓ my God, it has a face, it lived here, this is the family. I mean, that's a I don't know, that's a little much. Ami Alexander: I did not Well, you know, I I think a lot of people might want to know ⁓ if their fruit was picked two months ago, you know, or you know, things like that.

And I or, you know, the that the form that the food is coming from is organic or not. I think, you know, you can have a salad dressing that's a thousand calories. So I I think there Yeah. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah.

That I want to know. As you get older, it gets harder and harder to lose weight. So yes, the calorie level for short, we want to know. Ami Alexander: People wanna know.

They wanna know what they're eating, they wanna know what they're drinking. They you know, there's there's a ton a huge shift in the alcohol industry and and non-alcoholic drinks and drinks that actually now have ad adaptogenic effects and and and longevity, you know, pro ⁓ things that sort of help with longevity and functionality and brain health and help you go to sleep and so. MIchele N DiMeo: ⁓ yeah. Ami Alexander: We've developed menus at hotels that are all about, you know, if you're gonna eat late night, like these are things that are actually things that promote health, ⁓ healthy sleep.

MIchele N DiMeo: ⁓ yeah. I've already thought about that. It's funny that you said that because that's one of the things I thought about for our late night menu because I can't eat after eight o'clock. Like I'm getting to the point now where I'm like, it keeps me up, or you know, you don't sleep.

And I I literally thought about that. One of the things I wrote down is we should have a menu at night that doesn't affect people that can't eat late, that you know, really don't want to drink so much. Like maybe you have more lavender drinks or, you know, different things that help you sleep and and calm you before you go to bed, especially if you're in a hotel. The last thing you want to do is go eat at eleven o'clock.

You land from, you know, busy flight at the the airport. You check into the hotel, you're starving, and then you eat something and you go and you have to leave in the morning early and you just ate and it keeps you up all night. It's the worst. Ami Alexander: Right.

And and and so we're, you know, we're rolling out sleep programs at hotels, we're rolling out mini bars that are all focused on that, you know, AM or ⁓ sort of menus, what you should start your day with, what should end your day with, ⁓ partnering with electrolyte companies and ⁓ metabolic health, you know, companies that have things in the room that you can you can use. So I think more and more travelers now this shift has gone away from We want to indulge and cheat when we're on a trip to we want to maintain our health standards that we have at home.

And but also there's a sense of adventure and a sense of discovering something new. So having, you know, walking into your hotel room and seeing a face mask, for instance, in the mini fridge is is something that I think a lot of our guests are, you know, more inclined to grab than a beer or or a glass of wine. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Yeah, I agree.

And and you're absolutely right. This whole move towards zero proof. I mean, the whole bar landscape has changed so much. ⁓ and that's a whole nother show.

Cause I mean, I you know, I talk to sales reps and managers in the liquor world, you know, from the distribution side, and they're blaming it on cannabis and edibles and gummies and like, you know, it's like there's such a shift of people don't want to go out and feel horrible anymore and then wake up. You're absolutely right. You know, they get up and they take a cycle class or they go and they do berries or one of these workouts and they don't want to go to bed with a hangover and drink and then wake up early and feel like crap and go to work.

So it's just such a different landscape and you know, it it is definitely, I think, geared and focused on wellness and and lifestyle. So such important parts. And I think when you're creating concepts and you're Coming up with menus, I mean, that has to be a part of your conversation and and a part of your thought process now, which is so different from 15 years ago, you know, before I gotta tell you a funny story already here. I'm gonna digress.

I do this every show. You know, we we are in the Italian industry and you know, besides full service, we have fast casual. And when menu labeling was the hot thing where you had to put the ingredients and you had to put the menu calories and caloric intake, and you know, we're going through the whole process and One of these dishes I think had like three thousand calories, you know, because it had bacon, it had cream and and she put that on the screen and I looked at her and I go, ⁓ my god, it has three thousand calories because I came from weight loss, you know.

So I'm looking at these calories and I was like, Holy cow. And like I looked at my husband, I'm like, You need to rework this entire menu. Like what? We can't put that on our menu.

People are gonna look at that and say, My God, that's a heart attack waiting to happen, you know? So it's like it so many things have evolved in the last fifteen years, but I I agree. I think that whole wellness and lifestyle push and peptides and all this stuff is just pushing people to to think smarter and dine smarter. Ami Alexander: Yeah, and and look with you know it's estimated that one in fourth ⁓ Americans is on a GLP and that seriously reduces appetite and you know, so how do people want to engage with with us if they're not sitting and having that second drink, third drink?

So what can we do? And that's why we see, you know, all ⁓ better programming with music and games and you see like Mahjong night taking over everywhere. And so, you know, it's like we still people still want to be out and they want to be social and they want to ⁓ engage with their community and their friends, but we're spending less time eating and drinking. So the thoughtfulness around that I think is really relevant and a conversation we're having with all of our clients.

MIchele N DiMeo: All right, so before we end the show, I always do my lightning round questions so the audience and listeners can get to know a little bit about what you like in your field. So I'm gonna throw some questions out and see what you say. So I need to know what you like better. Do you do Michelin tasting menus or hidden neighborhood spots?

Ami Alexander: Mmm. Tasting menus. MIchele N DiMeo: Really? Then finding that little like even if you go to Europe and you're like walking the streets and you want to find that little local neighborhood spot.

I see I like to eat with the locals. Ami Alexander: locals too and I I love a good community neighborhood hang like ⁓ sure on my day to day but ⁓ you know an a it's a great experience is always something I look forward to. I plan months in ahead. I just I love it.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Wow. Okay. It's funny.

If you ask my husband, he'll say, I always take him to these fancy restaurants. We'll go to like Chicago and you know H2O was a big one at one point. And I was like, ⁓ my God, we gotta get in. I gotta take him.

I used to do these fancy dinners for him. And then we would go through like ten levels of food and wine pairings and all this stuff. And they come out with the little fancy foam and all this stuff. And he would leave and he'd be like, We're going to get a burger.

I'm like, okay, I you can't even enjoy this with you because he leaves and he's like, I'm starved. Ami Alexander: Yeah. MIchele N DiMeo: you know, typical. So we sp because of him, we stay away from a lot of the Michelins, even though I love them.

But he always leaves hungry. He always says the portion sizes are too small. Ami Alexander: Yeah, I yeah. Well Michelin Michelin's changed so much, you know.

I mean I was at I was at a community restaurant last night in a strip mall and you know it's a had a has a Michelin star, but it's very casual and very good. And so Michelin has also changed. It's not so fussy. There's there's great restaurants recognize now.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. I gotta I have to tell you a funny story about Michelin. So ⁓ Pineapple and Pearl is one of my favorite restaurants. I don't know if you've been in there in DC, but it's so good.

And I don't want to give away the secret, but I I wanted to do my birthday celebration there. So we did it last year and we've been there a few times and ⁓ they always send you home. With this secret little box, and nobody knows what it is. And, you know, the first time we went, we had this great dinner, and of course we leave.

And my husband's like, ⁓ my God, I'm starving. I want a burger. We get back to the room and we have these beautiful black boxes. They're all folded and they're gilded with gold and beautiful.

So we thought, ⁓ it's pastries or dessert. And we get back and he's like, God, I'm starving. And everything's closed. So he opens the box and inside it wrapped was a gourmet burger.

And he was like, Yes. Somebody understands that the men want a burger when you leave a Michelin star. It was the greatest. He still talks about it.

You know, that, well, they sent me home with a burger. It was such a cool concept. But, you know, we got to enjoy all the amazing tastings and all the fancy pieces of the menu that they put together. And then we went home and we had the best gourmet burger we've ever eaten.

I mean, the burger was amazing. Well, just a fun touch. Ami Alexander: Yeah. I love that.

I and I think there's a lot of restaurants that have that that same sort of, you know, ethos of like, okay, we've gone through the tasting menu. Is there anything you want to have again? Or, you know, we don't need to leave we don't or the last dish is like a you know, r risotto and it's like the sense that, okay, we've done what we want to do, but you should still make sure that you leave hungry not hungry. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah.

Yeah. ⁓ biggest guest misconception about luxury and hospitality. Ami Alexander: that it's expensive. You know, luxury, luxury is just like we talked about Michelin's changing and luxury is approachability.

Luxury is feeling comfortable, feeling seen is feeling like you always have a seat at the table. feeling like there's, you know, that the you there's you look at the menu and you're excited. You're not overwhelmed. You're not nervous.

You're not panicking about price points. I think luxury today is about, you know, getting what you want. MIchele N DiMeo: ⁓ okay. Yeah.

And one word for hospitality in twenty thirty. Ami Alexander: In what? You could have MIchele N DiMeo: In twenty thirty, in the next ten year ten years, one word for hospitality. Ami Alexander: Say transformative.

MIchele N DiMeo: Mm, I like that. It's always transforming. Ami Alexander: Yeah, it's always transformative, but I think I think the experience of hospitality is to to make you, you know, feel better than you felt before you had the experience, leave happier, leave more aligned with who you are. ⁓ and so I I think that's where we're going is to to be a little bit more personalized and and yeah.

MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah. Well, believe it or not, we're running out of time. This happens every show. ⁓ this conversation was amazing.

And I'm sure everybody listening is just probably wanting more. So you're gonna have to come back and we'll have to talk more about the rest of my million questions we never got to. But for everybody listening, you know where to find us. ⁓ always at restaurantdeva.

com. DMs are open. You can find us on LinkedIn. And Amy, for anybody listening that wants to find you or find out more about your company and what you do, or might be interested in engaging your services, where can they find you?

Ami Alexander: You can find us online. Our website is barrelaged management.com and our social handle is Barrel Aged MGMT, Barrel Aged Management on social. MIchele N DiMeo: Awesome.

And that's Instagram as well as Facebook. Okay, good. And what's one thing that you want to leave us with today if you had to close the show in terms of engaging and ensuring long term success and hospitality and building your concept or in a restaurant? ⁓ what would you want the listeners to take away from the show today?

Ami Alexander: Correct. Say if you're in the business of building or leading a team in the restaurant industry or in the hotel industry, do it authentically. You know, lead with authenticity and build a culture where people can be out there authentically themselves too, because that is where we see people thrive and our guests connect. MIchele N DiMeo: Yeah, I agree a hundred percent.

I mean, you have to be authentic to yourself. You have to love what you do. You have to lead with passion and excitement and experience. And, you know, like we talked about, the concept always gets the attention.

Just like you said in Miami, everybody was rooting for this new restaurant and they just kind of missed the mark. And execution is is so important and it builds legacy and success and long term you know, just engagement with your community and your guests. But Thank you so much for for being on the show. This was amazing.

And I might have to call you. We might have to talk about my new concept and how we're opening it. Yes. ⁓ thank you so much.

And we'll talk to you soon. And and everybody listening, that was another amazing episode of Dine and Dish. And we'll be back next week with another episode. Thank you.

Thanks, Amy. Okay. Ami Alexander: So excited I want to hear all about it. Thank you so much for having me.

This was great. Thank you.