How to focus marketing on high-impact work

Speaker A: Foreign.

Speaker B: Boring, repetitive tasks and have the same impact on your team as burnout. It's a phenomenon, um, called bore out and it happens when team members don't see value in their work. In this episode of Conversations with Martech, we're talking to Christine Royston, CMO of Wright, about why marketing teams are at particular risk of bore out and what leaders can do to prevent it. Welcome to Conversations with Martech. This episode of Conversations with Martech is brought to you by Semrush. Meet your unfair advantage. A new SEMrush uniting search and AI discovery into one powerful marketing growth engine. Delivering richer data, more keywords, deeper AI ah, insights and prioritize next steps. With Semrush, you can turn total brand visibility into coordinated action. Get a 14 day free trial and a discount code. Visit martech.org SEMrush Coupon or scan the QR code.

Speaker C: Hi, I'm Christine Royston, CMO at Wrike. I've spent the past 20 plus years, uh, in B2B tech marketing. Uh, as the CMO here, uh, I lead all of our marketing and communications to really focus on driving company growth. Uh, so this includes brand demand, product. Uh, we are a global team with people all over the world. So we are constantly balancing that need for global brand consistency with the need to drive growth. Uh, and Wrike is an intelligent work management platform. Uh, it's the place where anybody can build, connect, automate and scale their workflows. Um, and so, you know, we've got customers all over the world, across many industries, many functions. Uh, and it's, it's been a great experience to kind of come in and work on a product that my team uses every day embedded into everything that we do.

Speaker A: All right, thanks for being here. So, uh, crazy times in marketing, right? You've got, um, even before A.I. uh, came along, we were dealing with more channels than we've ever had to deal with before. Um, just more requests, more ask for more and more and more and more data to back everything up. Uh, we've all heard of burnout. It was a big topic around the 2020 pandemic. Everybody's talking about burnout. Uh, we've all probably felt its effects or seen it in action to a certain extent. But you have the, uh, less familiar problem that impacts teams and marketing and beyond. What is bore out?

Speaker C: Well, uh, I will start by saying I cannot take credit for the term. Uh, so I came across it, uh, toward the end of last year, uh, there was a Yahoo Finance reporter that published an article and it really Made me stop and think about what am I observing in my own teams. Um, and I really wanted to surface it to other marketing leaders because um, I think it is uh, sometimes easy to get deep into the execution and not take that step back and think about how you address, um, address a trend that, that's impacting your entire team. Um, so bore out is not the same as burnout. Um, burnout, you know, it, it happens because you're overworked, you don't have that work life balance. We've uh, seen this for years. I'm hoping that teams are taking steps to, to reduce burnout and really address it. Um, bore out is really this slow erosion of motivation uh, that is caused by this ongoing low value, repetitive, busy work. Um, and marketers are particularly being impacted. Uh, they may have these low impact tasks like reporting, data entry or workflow, administration, um, and they don't have the time for that deep focus, uh, and thinking about how can they deliver more high impact work. Um, and those are typically the types of things that give people purpose and meaning and ultimately deliver better results for the company. Um, and I think it's, it is that concept of bore out is something to keep in mind when we're thinking about AI strategy. Uh, because I think AI can really change the game because it can help remove some of those repetitive processes so that marketers or anybody can really focus more on the creative, the revenue driving work. Um, so you don't want to remove that uh, because that's really what excites employees. Uh, it's also what leverages the best of, of humans. So you know, giving AI the ability to take over the tedious work, um, uh, is, is really what we're focused on. Um, and we don't want to let AI, you know, cause uh, even more burnout by handling the creative work.

Speaker A: Yeah, we've heard from kind of when people first started talking about AI, uh, obviously people get concerned about is it going to make me redundant? You know, the response from a lot of the vendors has been no, it's going to make you more creative. It's going to help you think more strategically because it's going to free up your time from the tedious tasks. Um, I think people say people hear that, um, what's your sense? Are people buying it?

Speaker C: You know, I think um, I think it depends on where you are in your AI evolution. I think if you, you know, haven't really dabbled in it, you know, you're not hands on in the tool, you don't really know the Capabilities, it's hard to kind of gauge, you know, okay, everybody's saying this is good for me, but I don't actually know if it is. And I'm reading all these articles that are saying that maybe it isn't. So I think people that are experimenting with the tool, tools, they're, they're rolling out AI, they're seeing the impact and they're seeing where it is taking, um, taking on the work that they didn't like doing that, you know, they felt like could, could have been, um, you know, outsourced. Um, so I really think you have to, you've got to be deep in the tool. Um, you know, certainly roles are going to change, jobs are going to change. Um, I think they're going to change for the better so that we can focus more on, on the creativity and the strategic side of things. Um, but I think until you're actually in it and actually testing, uh, you know, various AI tools, uh, you're just not going to be, kind of be a believer.

Speaker A: Yeah. I think before you do your next least favorite task, think about how AI can handle it. I know for me, going through transcripts of like the virtual Martech conference and looking through sound bites and summarizing conference sessions. Feed that transcript into AI.

Speaker C: Absolutely, yes.

Speaker A: And then you get to the fun part. Right, that's not the fun part. Going through transcripts for.

Speaker C: Exactly, yeah, exactly. I did this the other day. You know, I went to a conference, there was great content, and the whole time I was thinking, well, how am I going to translate this into changes that I should make or ideas for my team? And if I had had to, you know, think about converting those notes into an email, I can just use AI to do that and kind of also suss out because it knows, you know, my company, my pain points, my focus areas, my objectives, it can kind of translate that into. And here are the most important things that you should focus on first, Christine, or this is what you should bring out back to your leadership team.

Speaker A: Yeah. It seems like a lot of marketing teams today are caught, and AI, I think, is partly responsible for this. Um, between two opposing forces, there is efficiency and speed, which some marketing leaders, but certainly some business leaders are very focused on, because now you've got AI and it helps you go so fast.

Speaker C: Right, right.

Speaker A: And then there is authenticity and creativity that people worry about losing. In this world full of workflow automation. Is that accurate? Do you see it that way?

Speaker C: So I think we've always had this trade off, uh, how do you deliver more work Faster versus how do you deliver great work that's impactful? Um, and I think AI helps helps us ensure it's actually not a trade off, it's not an either or. Um, because if you think about AI's kind of immediate top level uh, value, it's driving efficiency and so it can help us deliver more work faster. But the big opportunity is actually how do you maximize the unique value that humans in your team have always been able to deliver that creative and strategic element, but maybe they haven't had time because they've been bogged down and in um, in more hands on repetitive tasks. Um, so I think when, when you're using AI to kind of remove some of those tedious tasks, reporting or formatting or manual campaign updates, teams are then able to, to deliver that unique value, um, of you know, strategizing new ideas, uh, being able to refine strategy. Um, so I think, I think is, is really something that helps us to balance that because there's always going to be, they ask for more faster. Um, but uh, we also want to make sure that we're delivering great work. Uh, and I think AI kind of enables both of those things.

Speaker A: I think what happens sometimes work and ideas, they're sort of like traffic. No matter how big you build the highway, more cars come to fill it in. Um, will we ever really regain the time and space that we need to get creative now that we've opened up the AI box?

Speaker C: I think so. Um, you know, I don't think that the opportunity is past. I um, think that AI is actually what gives you that time and space. Uh, but you've got to be intentional about how you're going to use it. Um, so if you think of AI as being able to scale output and creativity, uh, you can do that without increasing team sizes. Traditional constraint was always more campaigns, more output, you need more people. Um, but I think AI changes that ah, equation. Um, you can look at the team that you have, offload some of those administrative efforts, uh, and that same team can deliver more ambitious, higher impact work without burning out, ah, or boring out. Um, I think it's similar on the budget side too. When resources are constrained and teams can't necessarily afford to do everything. Um, but that pressure really refocuses and requires you to drive specific outcomes. It's not how can we do more work but it's how do we do more impactful work. Um, I do think that AI is going to help us to regain uh, that time and space and help us to make the time to prioritize um, I think one of the things that we have to be thoughtful of is, um, when you're using AI, uh, there's this opportunity to change what you do. It's not just using AI to do the same things faster, but it gives you this space to brainstorm and strategize and collaborate with your colleagues and say, what are the new things that we could try? Uh, because those new things are often what keep people engaged, uh, with the work and they want to try to try to come up with new strategies. Um, so I think that uh, being able to leverage AI, uh, is not only going to help you do the same things and focus on the creative aspect, but try new things that you may not have just had time to think about before. Um, and it's definitely something uh, that we've been focused on. Um, in our team we look at how do we, how do we standardize all of our repeatable workflows. Um, if you think about time needed, process needed to create a webinar, uh, we build that once we want to dictate what are all the steps, um, so we don't have to figure that out every time. And then that gives us the time to focus on, all right, what should this webinar be about? Do we think about a different spin on it? Do we think about, you know, showing customer examples, uh, of hands on versus going through slides? Um, so I really think that, um, that opportunity to try new things is one of the great benefits about AI that helps us, you know, balance that, uh, that need for, for efficiency and creativity.

Speaker A: What are the signs of bore out? And um, how should leaders who recognize it in their employees address it?

Speaker C: Uh, so I think one of, one of the key signs is when you look at high performers on your team and they are disengaged. Uh, did they previously talk up and speak up more in meetings? Um, were they constantly pitching you new ideas? Uh, I think that disengagement is something that is a signal. Um, um, and I think that, you know, taking a look at what's causing that, often it's when your work doesn't feel connected to impact, you might be so bogged down in administrative work, you can't see how your work is tying to the goals. Um, and so at wrike, one of the things we've done is, you know, we give people the autonomy to fix their own workflows. Uh, so, you know, this year, ah, I set a goal for my team that I want every person to build at least one AI agent that is specifically handling the Worst use of their time. Um, uh, now to the point of making sure you're enabling teams to also leverage AI. We, um, have created a role within the team that's a dedicated AI efficiency lead. Um, this person is an internal consultant who sits on, uh, my leadership team. He works with the team to identify where those friction points, uh, where can we use, um, automation and AI to eliminate some of those. Um, so I think that's, you know, being able to bring people in and help them find those areas that are causing the bore out. Um, I think giving them the ability to identify those is important. Um, you know, I think outside of AI, another key piece is making sure you're bringing your teams along with, with strategy, um, really sharing with them the why, you know, why is it that we have these targets? Why is it that, you know, the sales team is asking for certain things? I think when team members can see that bigger picture, no matter what level they're at, and they see how their work is driving the business goals, whatever those are, um, they feel more connected and more engaged.

Speaker A: Do you have any advice for talking to senior leaders, maybe those who aren't in marketing, about creating that space for creativity and authenticity that we talked about? Because the last thing they want to think about, it seems like, is idle minds or people who don't seem to be banging away at the keyboard. But if you've worked in marketing for any sort of time, you know that some of your best stuff comes from the moment you're not banging away.

Speaker C: Yes, yes. Uh, so, uh, I think the first thing you need to do is, is vocalize the importance of it. Um, making sure your team knows you want them to make this space, um, and you want them to figure out how to spend time on this. I, um, think AI is kind of the trend that should cause leaders to really vocalize this and want their teams to be more, more creative. Um, because part of, of figuring out how AI is going to benefit you and your team is spending time thinking about like, what is working in my workflows, where can I allocate my time other ways. So I do think you need to, um, almost give your teams permission that you want them, um, to be making space for, for creativity. Um, I think you also have to make sure that you as a leader, um, are either driving this or enabling your teams to drive this is to take a look at, you know, how is work organized? How is information organized? If you think about, you know, the time to drive creativity, poor organization is, it takes away from that. If you're always chasing down context. You're always chasing down, well, what is the process for this? Um, you're taking away that time for teams to be able to, to be creative. Um, so I do think that having that sort of structured data, structured workflow definition, um, it helps teams free uptime. It is also a, ah, requirement for AI. Uh, it's only going to be as effective as the data and the context that you are giving it. Um, and so if you do want to want it to help you, uh, deliver work so that you can focus on the creativity, uh, you've got to make sure you've got that context, uh, in place. Um, so I think, you know, it's, it is, it is something that I think as a leader, you've got to make sure that you, you are prioritizing not only for yourself, but for your teams.

Speaker A: Once again, if the tools are good and they're running with good data, then you're probably going to be in a good place.

Speaker C: Yes.

Speaker A: Yes. All right. Christine Royston, she's the CMO at wrike. Thanks for joining, uh, us on conversations with Martech. Sam.