Tricia Mulder on Collaboration and Strengthening Michigan’s Nonprofits

Speaker A: Foreign. Hi, everybody. Welcome back to Brand in the Making by Think Tank. I have Trisha Mulder here, who started owns, is the founder of River City Grant Writing. And we're going to be talking about how she kind of found herself here and also just the different nuances of nonprofits and grant writing and how River City Grant Writing is making Michigan a home for everybody.

Speaker B: Thank you for having me. Yeah, appreciate it.

Speaker A: Absolutely. So, uh, really the purpose of this podcast, we like to call it Brand in the Making, um, because we just love to hear the backstory of where founders, business owners came from and how they kind of got to where they are, but also just like, what's going on in the business right now. So if you want to give a little bit of, like, an intro to start, Tricia, then we can get rolling with some of the questions.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Just tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do.

Speaker B: All right. So, um, my name's Tricia Mulder, and I'm, um, a Michigander through and through. Even though I was born in Tennessee, we can ignore that little, small detail. I grew up in West Michigan, moved to Grand Rapids to go to college, and really grand raps Grand Rapids. I love it. Um, never left the area. Um, now live just south of town, um, in Middleville. But grand, um, Rapids is. It's home. It's home. Um, I have a huge passion for the community. Um, I have found, well, especially with the sector that I'm in is a very collaborative community and that's who I am in my heart.

Speaker A: That's cool.

Speaker B: Right?

Speaker A: Um, so we were talking a little bit before the podcast started, just about River City Grant writing and how you kind of found your way there. But if you want to give our listeners just a little bit of a recap on how you found yourself here just at River City.

Speaker B: All right, well, uh, graduated from grand valley in the 90s. Go Lakers.

Speaker A: Nice.

Speaker B: Got into the finance sector, did mortgages for a lot of years. And even when I was doing mortgages, I was volunteering and doing homeownership classes at, uh, Inner City Christian Federation, which is ICCF now.

Speaker A: Sure, yeah.

Speaker B: And just always found myself trying to find the, the, the charitable angle for any job that I was in. And I did that for a lot of years. And then I, I was married, I had a child, and then I decided to be a stay home mom for a few years, but then I went through a divorce.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And, well, can't be a stay at home mom and be divorced, unfortunately.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: So. But it was also 2008. And for the listeners who remember, it was probably the worst time.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: Since the 70s to do mortgages and do finance. So I trudged along with some jobs that I'll put on my resume, but I'd rather not.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: But they paid the bills.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: While I was getting my master's degree and I got my MBA in 2009 and was really lucky later that year, um, well, 2010, few months later, um, got an opportunity to go into, um, work kind of in the non profit world, but technically for profit. With the Job Corps program. Yeah, um, it's federally funded. Um, but it's, you know, I work for the contractor and I work there through 2018. Really got a chance to learn the operation side of um, running, running things versus kind of, you know, used my education, used some of my background, but really learned a lot of new skills about what it takes to run, run the behind the scenes, the systems, the processes and all of those things. In 2017, I had a friend pass away that was very close to at work. I had just remarried and we had a long conversation, my husband and I, and I just couldn't go back. M. Uh, it happened at work. Unfortunately. I was involved in the medical.

Speaker A: Whoa, okay.

Speaker B: The medical issue.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: And it. I just couldn't walk the halls anymore.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And my husband, full of grace and love, just said, you're smart, you'll figure it out. Mhm. And I laid on a couch for a couple of months, watched a whole lot of ncis. I'm ashamed to admit I watched every episode of every season. That's crazy. Really enjoyed being. I was a new stepmom to two more kids.

Speaker A: Uh, so.

Speaker B: So I had three kids that I was able to really plug in and I was able to be a really present parent in their life. And after about two months of that and kind of came out of the fog, ran into a person I used to work with at Job Corps. Um, and she said, hey, let's have lunch. Let me show you where I'm working. And it was more of a job interview. She bamboozled me. Uh, and she's like, well, we need an operations person here. I'm like, can't do it. I'm sorry. Yeah, I can't. I can't go back into the same field that I was doing. So I just said, blurred it. I kind of blurted it out. I said, so what's the one thing you can't do? M. Because I was looking for my next thing.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And she said, grants. M. I never have time and we need them. M. And I said, oh. She's like, well, you wrote a few here and there. And I said, yeah, I wrote some requests here and there. Yeah. Like, you're smart, you'll. You're smart, you'll figure it out. Kind of like my husband did. And I said, okay. I said, give me a couple of months.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And so I took a six week course online that met with a professor and I learned the ins and outs. And I went to YouTube University.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And I.

Speaker A: It's a gift. YouTube University.

Speaker B: And not sponsored, but LegalZoom.com.

Speaker A: okay. Yeah. Okay.

Speaker B: Spent a few bucks and got made myself an llc. And I. I just did it.

Speaker A: That's amazing.

Speaker B: And she was my first client, so.

Speaker A: Nice. Yeah, that's such a good story. I love it. Um, so we talked previously, um, and you shared a little bit about how, uh, this idea that Michigan can be a home for everyone.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: And that fuels a lot of the decisions that you make surrounding what nonprofits you work with.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: Could you speak into that a little bit? Like how does that kind of, uh, how, how do you use that filter as you're making those decisions?

Speaker B: Just like I advise my clients to always focus on their mission, our mission is we are on a mission to make Michigan a home for everyone. And when it comes to talking with new clients, when it comes to speaking engagements or sitting on panels, I always go back to the mission. And does this client truly want everyone to be at home in Michigan? Is the panel reaching an audience that is trying to make Michigan a home for everyone?

Speaker A: Sure.

Speaker B: Yeah. And so it just, it drives the decisions. And if I ever have an inclination, um, or any type of a hesitance about a potential new client, I take it to the team.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: And I just say, hey, here. Here's where we are. Here's a conversation I have. How do you feel about it? And we vote. And it has been, you know, usually if I'm on the fence for a potential new client, they're not fitting our mission as well as we want them to be. And the decision is. Yeah, you're. You're right. But I, I never want to say no. I hate saying no. But yeah, we have to stay true to what we're trying to build.

Speaker A: Yeah. And you only have so much capacity.

Speaker B: We do. Mhm. We do. And we're constantly pushing our capacity. We're in a very fortunate situation.

Speaker A: Yeah. That's awesome. Um, so also another conversation that we talked about previously was how nonprofits are often built on passion, but they lack Sometimes some organization and structure, but because of some of your background in offering that structure to businesses, you're able to kind of like fill the gaps sometimes. Can you tell us about what that looks like for you and your business?

Speaker B: We can fill gaps, yes, absolutely. Um, but we cannot build an organization from the ground up. Mhm. We can suggest improvements and things like that. So often, you know, the typical new small nonprofit is built. It's, it's founded by a person who has a life experience, whether it has been they're a veteran or they experienced homelessness or they were a victim of domestic abuse and they're a survivor or something. Usually, unfortunately, a traumatic event.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: And they say, I want to help people the way that I was helped to survive my situation or endure my situation. But they often hesitate to look around to see what other organizations already exist in their community that are serving. Mhm. That population or that demographic. And so they may say, I have a passion for serving people with this experience, XYZ experience. But I have no business background, I have no experience in working for or running an organization that serves this population. I only know from my personal experience. And they fail to recognize that even though domestic abuse survivors, for example, all fall under umbrella, their experiences are very unique to them. And it takes training, it takes education, it takes experience, and working with different populations that are experiencing the same situation to truly be able to build a full, robust organization around it. That's setting aside the complete structure of setting up an organization. The compliance, the accounting, the data analysis, the processes, the standard operating procedures. That's completely setting aside that, all of that.

Speaker A: Yeah. I feel like there's two sides of this conversation. There's the structural side that you're talking about, where a nonprofit has business elements that they have to be aware of as they're building. And there's also, you mentioned, um, that there are nonprofits who are doing a lot of good work right now. And so, uh, sometimes you might find somebody who wants to start a nonprofit based on a lived experience they've had. And then maybe they don't do the research prior to trying to start their nonprofit and someone's already doing that work. Do you find that a lot?

Speaker B: I do, yeah. Honestly, just yesterday I had a conversation. I got a phone call from a lady who found me through Google and she said, Well, I own 10 homes. Um, they're 10 three bedroom homes and I want to start, um, a transitional housing program. And I said, wonderful. I said, what kind of experience do you have in transitional housing and working with the Unhoused? And she said, none. I said, are you a social worker? No.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: I said, have you researched any of the licenses and all of the program requirements that you need in order to qualify for HUD grants or MSHTA grants, which is the Michigan State Housing Development Authority? No. Well, it sounds like I need to hire you to do all that. I said, no, you need to do that yourself. Sure, I can help advise you, I can send you links, I can do these things, but it's up to you to roll your sleeves up and do the hard work. Mhm. So after talking to her for half an hour, I just said, you know what I really think you should do because you have your heart. I mean, she didn't even realize that there's minimum standards. The houses have to be up to code to even just rent.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And it sounded like that the houses needed a lot of work to even be rentable.

Speaker A: Mhm.

Speaker B: And so I just said, why don't you contact a place in your city that's already doing work with the unhoused, who's already doing transitional housing and offer to rent to them at a discount?

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So they can expand their offerings because they have the social workers, they have the funding to serve. Because I explained, you know, homelessness, like so many other things, it's like peeling an onion. Um, you can put a roof over a person's house, but if you, you know, a roof over a person's head. But if you don't deal with the mental health issues, the physical health issues, the, ah, possible addiction issues, all of the other things that cause a person to become unhoused, all you're doing is putting a roof over their head, which is an important thing.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: But it doesn't solve the long term issue. Yeah.

Speaker A: Uh, it's putting a band aid on something that needs a lot more attention.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So I mean, and it just. And that's what I often find. And she'd already filed her 501C3 paperwork.

Speaker A: Wow. Okay.

Speaker B: And. But she wasn't aware of a lot of the compliance things that she needed to do. And a quick online compliance check in that phone call that I had found out she wasn't compliant in about five different areas either.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: And she was in jeopardy of probably having her IRS status revoked. Whoa. Because she didn't seek the advice and the counsel of, of the people that she didn't take the time to do the research first. Of what it takes to truly run a nonprofit. And I like to remind people it's a nonprofit business.

Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Um, I'm looking back at my questions. We've jumped around a little bit. Let's see. Yeah, this, this question goes back a little bit to kind of what we were talking around it a little bit with some of these things, but the unnecessary competition in the nonprofit space. Yep. Um, because there might be someone like what we're talking about who is trying to start a non profit to help somebody, but is not qualified. But what happens if a, um, an individual is qualified to start something in the nonprofit space? Would you recommend that they do that or that they team up with somebody who is already doing that work?

Speaker B: Uh, how about yes to both of those?

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: I guess the easiest way to say is it depends. Um, communities don't need copycats when it comes to nonprofits. So if you are, let's assume the person is highly qualified. They've been a social worker or they've been in an industry for a long time, and they're highly qualified, they have lived experience, and they have the passion to start this non. Then what I recommend is talk to the similar organizations in your area. So I can use an example of a client that I've had for a few years now.

Speaker A: Sure.

Speaker B: She worked for a local mental health provider, working as a clinician, uh, a mental health clinician for domestic abuse survivors.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: They served the whole community. But what she, and what she found is being bilingual, um, being Latino, being an immigrant, her personal experiences in those areas. She found that most people that serve domestic abuse survivors in Grand Rapids, um, maybe had one bilingual person, but not necessarily the cultural competency to be able to truly understand all of the differences. And it's not just it, you know, from one country or another. It's truly understanding the Latino experience from South America versus Central America versus, um, the Caribbean Islands versus. I mean, the cultures are so different. And there was this huge gap in lack of understanding in West Michigan for that. So, uh, she met with similar providers and they said, we'd love to provide these services, but we don't have capacity, but we will work with you to fill that need. It was an identifiable need. It was a need that other providers said was there. Yeah. And what she built was a huge collaborative network that took her from an organization that started pre pandemic to now that's over a million dollars a year.

Speaker A: Dang.

Speaker B: And serves hundreds of people every year and has changed the lives of countless families and is breaking the cycle of abuse all over West Michigan and is truly having profound impact. And she's amazing. And she still collaborates. So she had the expertise. She took the time to find out where the. That she suspected there was a need, but she took the time to actually verify it was there. Mhm. And then she got the support of the existing players in the field to get out there and help them.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Because that's really, ultimately what she's done, is she's helped meet that need. So they're now referring people to her. She's referring people to them. And it's a cohesive network of collaboration, uh, not copycats.

Speaker A: Yeah. It sounds like collaboration is a big value in the nonprofit and the grant writing spaces.

Speaker B: It absolutely is. And I'm not talking. Oh, I'm going to have them come to an event and have a table. Uh-huh. I'm talking real collaboration where people are sharing resources, they're sharing information, they're coming to the table together and saying, how can we better serve this community? How can we fill a gap? Who can fill that gap the best and how can we support that person?

Speaker A: Do you have any other examples of a collaborative, um, moment that you've gotten to experience in your experience or based on your time in grant writing?

Speaker B: Yeah. And again, it's, it's another. And that's why I love West Michigan. Um, Detroit's getting there.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: It's definitely getting there.

Speaker A: Do you, do you work much with nonprofits on the east side of the.

Speaker B: Yes, we have clients all over.

Speaker A: Okay, that's awesome.

Speaker B: Yeah. And so, um, a really good example, I would say again, in West Michigan would be a client of mine who serves African, um, refugee m. Community, um, the dysphoria, um, from Africa and their unique experience. Um, because one of the things I've learned in working with her is that there's two things that African refugees deal with when they, when they come to the United States. First of all, they're immigrants, they're refugees, they're experiencing a new environment. Mhm. But they're also learning for the first time that they're black and what that means to be black in America. In America?

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: Yeah. It's completely new to them because they're going from the majority for the most part, in how they look at least. Maybe not ethnicity wise or, or religion wise, but at least how they look. They're going from being the majority to now a minority. Mhm. And so there, it's kind of a double whammy for people who are immigrating from the, um, continent of Africa. So what she's really done a great job of is helping other African American serving organizations in West Michigan. Understand, uh, that it's not that they don't understand the black. It's not that they don't want to participate in the black experience in America, is that they're learning what it is. And so she's helped, in addition to serving the need, the unique needs of her population, she's helping bridge and educate American people. You know, native here, lived here for years and years. Um, on what that, what it means to be an African immigrant and what it means to be learning what black means in America in addition to an immigrant in America.

Speaker A: Okay. That's really cool. It is, yeah. It's amazing that, um, she's able to fill that gap for people because she serve in that way.

Speaker B: She's lived it herself.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: She's learned. And I, I sat in on a panel that she was a part of and it just, it, it blew me away. I m, I, I learned from just her speaking to her, her story. Yeah, it's very eye opening.

Speaker A: That's cool. I bet you get to experience a lot of really impactful stories.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: In your line of work.

Speaker B: I do. Um, and that is ultimately what drives our mission. Mhm. Because when I can help a person who has a really good idea and the nuts and bolts down, but just needs some refinement or needs some advice or some sometimes reeling them back in a little bit for controlled growth so they're sustainable.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Um, and you just, you know that ultimately, how many kids got after school programming instead of getting themselves into trouble because of the work we've done? How many immigrants and refugees have been able to receive health navigation services because of the work we're done? Um, we've done. It's just, it's, it's, it's a good feeling, but it's also not, it's never enough. We, we're always. My team. I'm really, really thankful for my team who, you know, they, they are very driven to consistently push forward and always seek new opportunities for our clients. Um, kind of the way that I have it set up is they kind of own certain clients. Uh, in a way.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: They, they take pride in working a lot with the particular clients. We cross train, of course, and do all the things you're supposed to do.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: But certain, certain staff just mesh better with certain clients.

Speaker A: Just the relationships.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker A: That's sweet.

Speaker B: And you know, I have one staff member. She, she's a band kid, she's a choir kid.

Speaker A: Okay.

Speaker B: She loves our arts. Arts clients.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: She loves them because it's her passion. Yes. She's, she's really pushing on those really hard. And I know when you're writing and you enjoy a subject you're going to better, you're going to prioritize a deadline.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: I have another staff member who has a background in public health M and she was a non profit leader in that area. And I have another, I have another staff member who just really loves sports and youth activities and I was really passionate about driving after school programs and so that's where he, he leads is that it's, he's seen the impact in his life and his kids life so that those are the clients that he gravitates towards.

Speaker A: That's sweet.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: That's really cool. So if there is a nonprofit leader that is listening to this right now, when is the right time for them to reach out to you? If they're feeling like they might need a little bit of help, whether that's seeking some of that, um, counsel on like how to structure their business better or for grant purposes. Who are the people that you're looking to connect with?

Speaker B: Um, well the first thing that a person's going to learn and most people reach out to me when they first. Oh, I've written a few grants. Our organizations are you know, around 150 to 250,000. This is the typical time I get a phone call. I've written a few grants. We've been around for a few years. I just don't have time anymore. Yeah, uh, we've got a few pro. We have had a program running for a couple of years. We're doing pretty good. Okay. And so what I will explain to them is uh. Sounds good, sounds like you're doing well in the area. But are you grant ready? Are you truly grant ready?

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Do you have the program standard operating procedures? Do you have a way to measure program effectiveness and impact and a lot in about half the time I go, yeah, we've got all of these, we do likert scales, we do all of these surveys, blah blah blah blah. Mhm. Awesome. Let's take a look at that. Let's take a look at your accounting procedures. Let's look at the back part of the house. Because mission will fuel the fire of the nonprofit, but the systems and structures of the business side of it will maintain the fire. Uh, it's the fuel that keeps things going and it's really important to if the person's ready to find out if they're truly grant ready, then that's when it's time to work with me. Um. Because I'm not going to just take the phone call. There's a grant. It's due in two weeks. Will you write it for me? Nope.

Speaker A: Sure.

Speaker B: No.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: That's. I'm not, I. We're. That's not how we work.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: We first and foremost. First and foremost make sure you have the structures in place.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And a willingness to make adjustments. Um. Because unfortunately sometimes the ego needs to be checked a little bit. Sure. And if. If you've always done something a certain way, maybe you need to be ready to tweak things a little bit and refine things and then you're ready.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Then we'll go out, we'll seek the funding. When I can confidently tell a funder that I maybe know personally because I've been fortunate to build some relationships. Uh, when I. When I email someone, I know I've got a new client. I'd love to introduce you. They know they're ready. Sure.

Speaker A: That makes sense.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Yes. It seems like you hold a pretty high bar for the people that you work with for your clients. And because of that, the funders are able to trust that whatever money they're able to contribute, it's going to be used well.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: Within the non profit.

Speaker B: Yes. So that's the goal is having to check the ego. Some funder syndrome, founder syndrome. Sometimes what I hear about. Yeah. And just being willing to open up and trust us, which is really scary for someone. Yeah. Um. To trust someone that they've just met with all the inner workings of their organization.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: But what comes with that is 90% of the time it just needs a few tweaks to move forward.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: And, you know, a couple of suggestions here and there. And, you know, a compliance check and making sure you have all the documents and all of the things that need to be done. And I'll be honest that, you know, so when the big opportunity like the great state grant or a federal grant, that's just perfect or we know you're ready for it and we're not scrambling in the two, three or four weeks between the times the proposal is first issue to the time the application is due, if you get ready, we can stay ready. Right. We don't have to scramble and then things are done. Well. M. And ultimately what that does is it benefits the people they serve because you're running efficiently, you're running in an impactful way. M. And those donor dollars go a lot further. Um, and you can serve more people.

Speaker A: Yeah. That's awesome. Well, Tricia, it's been awesome having you on Brand in the Making. Is there anything else that you want to make sure we say while we're here? M.

Speaker B: I love working with nonprofit leaders that lead with passion, but it's really important to remember that there's a lot of other really good nonprofits in our community and to first take a look and survey the landscape and see if maybe you can volunteer. M. At a collaborator and understand how they work and identify the real gap in services and just work with each other. Don't work against each other. Mhm. There's a finite number of resources out there to fund nonprofits, so figure out a way to add to the collaboration of, of the, of the community versus being one more competitor.

Speaker A: M. Yeah, that's good. M. Well, Tricia, thank you so much for making time to be on Brand in the Making today. It's been great having you here.

Speaker B: Thank you for having me.

Speaker A: Yes. Um, everybody, thank you so much for joining. This has been an episode of Brand in the Making.