Building Experiences and Writing Stories with Carla Flanders and Lauren Koetje

Speaker A: Well, welcome, Carla. Happy to have you on Brand of the Making today. Um, I am your host, Lauren with Think Tank. Carla, will you tell us a little bit about yourself before we get going?

Speaker B: Sure, sure. I'm, um, Carla Flanders, and I'm a West Michigan native. My business is CMF marketing and events, and I'm really happy to be here.

Speaker A: Thank you so much for joining. Um, before we get rolling into the business questions, just tell us a little bit about how your summer's been going.

Speaker B: Fast, just like everybody else is. Um, we took a big trip in the beginning of the summer, which took up a lot of, uh, the summer, which I loved every second of it. But, um, then came back and it's just been a race and now it's the middle of almost end of July. And just, um, want to savor every last minute of summer as much as I can. Um, so, you know, just trying to get everything in and um, my. I have kids and they're going off to college. So that's another factor that plays into college.

Speaker A: Going off to college, like for the first time or returning to college.

Speaker B: Returning to college. Yep. One's going to be a senior and one's going to be a sophomore at Western Michigan University. That's good.

Speaker A: Yeah, it's nice too. I also took a family vacation earlier in the summer, and for me it was like my big thing is at the beginning of the summer and then the rest of the summer I'm just like, relaxing.

Speaker B: So. Yeah, that's nice. Yeah. We have a pool too, so I'm very thankful for that and, um, just wish I could get in it more. You know, work gets in the way from time to time, but, you know, absolutely.

Speaker A: No, I can totally see that. Um, so you are working as, ah, an experienced designer, event planner, working as a marketer. Tell me about how you kind of found yourself into that role.

Speaker B: Yeah. So, um, the interesting thing is I've always kind of had this path. I just didn't realize that that's where I would end up, if that makes sense or not.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Um, so I, I've worked in West Michigan for pretty much my entire career. And, um, I've worked between Grand Rapids, Holland and the Muskegon area. And, um, I love all the communities and I've loved all the work that I've done honestly. And um, so through all of those opportunities, it kind of led me to what I do now, which is CMF marketing and events. And, um, if you want to kind of hear the history of that, I guess is maybe what the Question is, you're asking? Yeah. Um, I'll kind of. I'll tell you about that. So in, um, 2010, um, I was trying to start a new career and I lived on the Lakeshore. I had moved from Grand Rapids to the Lakeshore. And I had commuted initially for quite some time. And I decided I just, I didn't want to commute anymore. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but at that time I had younger kids and I wanted to be closer to home. So I couldn't really find anything, um, that fit my area of expertise. Um, so I decided, well, hey, I'm getting all these, like, side jobs for marketing and events. I should just create my own company. And I come from a long line of entrepreneurs, from my grandmother to my father to me. And so I created what I call CMF Marketing 1.0. Yeah. And then from there, um, I did that for about five years. And through that I did a lot of work for the Muskegon Lakeshore Chamber of Commerce. And, um, at one point they are like, we want to hire you in because you're doing so much work for us. And I said, well, okay, the time seems right for me to do that. So in 2015, I, um, got hired in at the Muskegon Chamber and I worked there for five years. And then 2020 happened, you know, and a lot of things changed in 2020, and I found myself looking for another job. And so that's when CMF marketing 2.0 started. So altogether, I have had CMF marketing for 10 years. And, um, I hope to retire doing this as well.

Speaker A: That's awesome. How did that feel as you were kind of making that transition? Did it feel like it was the right move or were you like it did?

Speaker B: You know, ironically, I always feel like there's a certain season for different things in your life. Right. So when I was looking for the job in 2010 and I just couldn't find anything. Couldn't find anything, um, it was the right time for me to start that business. Right. And then in 2015, when the chamber I was doing, so they were like a majority of my client. And, you know, there was other perks about being a full time employee and, and doing things there. Um, I thought, well, the timing is just right for that to work. And then obviously in 2020, um, you know, there were so many jobs that were lost and so many things happened and people weren't hiring, especially in my area, that, um, the timing was right again. And, and I just keep kind of going back to this Kind of independent contracting slash experience coordinator slash marketer. And um, it's. It's my calling. And, and that's what I really like to do. So I, I'm uh, again hopeful that I can stay doing this until I can't anymore. But then again, I always say never say never. Right. So if another opportunity arises in five years and it's, It's a really good opportunity that I just can't refuse, then who knows?

Speaker A: Yeah. Uh, no, that's great. Um, and in listening to your story, it sounds like you've, you've stuck around West Michigan area quite a bit. Um, and I know that you've done different events for like the Chamber, the Muskegon Chamber. Right. Um, so what, what are some of the events that, that included? And also why. Why West Michigan for you?

Speaker B: So starting with the events, um, some of the larger scale events that I have worked on that people will probably recognize. Um, include the Tulip Time Festival, which ironically, this picture behind me is assigned, um, autographed jicle, uh, print from Tulip Time from back in the day. So I worked at Tulip Time for about um, what I call seven, uh, seasons, uh, almost eight years. Um, and that was wonderful. And that was in Holland. And then I also did a large scale event here in Muskegon called the Lakeshore Art Festival. It was a weekend event and 50, at the peak of it, before COVID 50 to 60,000 people came to that event over the, the weekend, which was amazing. And um, I've done smaller events, uh, like a Harvest fest event that I'm working on, um, with the Muskegon rotary. That's about two to 300 people. I've done work in Grand Rapids with the um, Art Prize and different organizations that were participating in ArtPrize. Um, so I've worked with them. And so it's just kind of been that trifecta, um, of the West Michigan area. And you asked why West Michigan? Um, you know, growing up in Grand Rapids, I, um. Growing up, I don't know if this is just a growing up thing or if it's a personal thing, but I did want to explore, I did want to get out there. And when I first graduated from college, I interviewed for jobs in Chicago and looked at jobs in New York. And I'm like, I'm going big city, I'm going to do this, you know, and, and I found myself here in the community and um, really enjoying the work I was doing and loving, you know, that I was close to my family. And for me that was really really important. My, um, my parents, my mom's parents lived in New York, so we didn't get to see him that much. And my dad's family were immigrants, um, from Italy. And so they were all in the West Michigan area. And just family was really, really important to me. And here I am still in West Michigan. Um, not, you know, I'm on the Lakeshore now, which I would absolutely love. And people are always like, would you ever move back to Grand Rapids? I'm like, I can get there in 35 minutes. I'm really happy where I am.

Speaker A: That's so nice. The Lakeshore is so beautiful. Yeah. So family is a big factor for you in being in the West Michigan area? Yeah.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: And you said you considered the big city life, but is there. What do you think about the. I think of when I think of a place like New York, I think of like the hustle culture that is there. Do you feel like that kind of culture resonates with you a little bit, or do you like the more like, smaller town type of feel?

Speaker B: Different answers for different times in my life. So, you know, just out of college, it was the hustle, the, um, experience, the culture, the opportunities there, the things to do in the community, um, have always been important. And so, you know, and when I was in my 20s, I was like, I want to get out there. I want to go to the restaurants, I want to go to the clubs, I want to go to museums, I want to do all these things. And those were really good opportunities in the bigger cities to do that. Um, and so that was kind of what my thought process was at that time. And honestly, another part of me just wanted to get out. I just wanted to have my own experiences. I wanted to see what else was out there in the world for me. And I did apply, um, an interview for quite a few positions in Chicago. And um, either they didn't work out or they weren't a good fit, or the pay was just not gonna work for, for me to live there. So I, I decided not to do that. Um, and then, but you know, as I got a little bit older and I got married and I had kids then my, um, requirements or desire for the place that I live really changed. Right now I'm looking at what is the community like? Is it safe, is it good school district, Is it, um, you know, a great environment where my kids can go out and play in the yard and I don't have to worry about it? So that, that kind of changed. And ironically, um, that's when we moved out to the Lakeshore when my son was about five or six months old. And um, the cost of living was also a factor. I mean we, we found a house in, in this community that was exactly a house. It's a developer, a west Michigan developer. I won't give away any secrets, but same exact house. Same exact house. It was about $80,000 less here in on the Lakeshore. So I was like, uh, no brainer, we're gonna move here.

Speaker A: So that's amazing.

Speaker B: And, and as I was in college also my parents had moved to the lakeshore too. And so now I have a five month old baby. We're thinking about daycare who can watch the child. And um, it just worked out that we ended up moving near they were where they were and they could help out with childcare.

Speaker A: That's nice. That's really cool. So kind of thinking about the, like being in a big city, you kind of are in the context of having to like work hard and grind, but in the context of owning a small business, you kind of have that no matter what. Um, so I'm curious, as you're wearing all these different hats of being an event coordinator and strategizing for marketing, how do you kind of balance all of that and keep the visionary with the execution kind of like balanced?

Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great question. And I was thinking maybe I should say a little bit more about what I do in general with, with CMF marketing and then I can talk about that balance. Um, so CMF marketing and events, um, focuses on what the title says, right? I do marketing and I do events and it's about 50, 50. So in the marketing realm, what I kind of spend specialize in in the West Michigan market is um, strategic planning for market for marketing, um, project management. I can kind of put myself into your organization if you have a certain project that needs to be done or uh, you have um, press releases, uh, that you need to get out and you want to um, work with the media. That's another area of expertise. So I can kind of manage a certain project or I can act as your internal marketing person or external marketing person. So on the external end of things, if you need your traditional marketing, you need a logo, you need a website, you need social media assistance, you need things like that. I can help put a plan together and then either implement it or give you the guidelines on how to. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then on um, the event side of things, um, that kind of goes a couple different ways. Again, if you are a company that has an internal event, uh, maybe a gala coming up or a large um, convention or something like that. I can kind of work on just that project. Um, and, or what some, what's been happening a lot lately is that a lot of fundraisers or community events have been contracting me to do their work because I have that expertise in doing the large scale events and working with the city and working with the different businesses within the community to make sure they know what's going on, make sure that they are involved in the decision making for things where it uh, might impact them. And so, um, so that's what I do. Kind of on the event side from small, smallish to me is, I mean I could do, you know, 20, 30 people to 20 to 30,000 people. Depends on what the project is.

Speaker A: Okay, that's cool.

Speaker B: Yeah. So that's what CMF marketing does. Now I feel like there was another question in there. Did I answer?

Speaker A: That's really helpful context. Um, to continue to orient to like who you are to who CMF marketing is. Um, the original question to bring it back to that is how do you balance within your workload, the visionary versus like the execution type of work?

Speaker B: Right. Yeah. So I think in almost every project there's both. Right. So we meet with the client, we put together the visionary portion of it. We say, what is your vision? What is your desire? How do you want to proceed? What are your goals? Right? So we have that vision and then once we do our due diligence, our research and um, try to implement that vision and that plan, that's when we get down to it, right? That's when we start the action, that's when we make things happen. And that's the implementation portion of it. So I feel like in almost any new, any new project really, you have to be able to balance both. Um, and then sometimes if you have repeat events or repeat projects, you already know what the vision is. You already know that it's there and now you need to implement it. And as an independent contractor or a sole proprietor, my model is I contract out as needed. So depending what the project is, I pull in my partners to make that happen. So um, you know, there's some things that I handle personally and then there's other things I work with my, um, contractors were to do that. And the other thing that's. I think the benefit of that is that keeps my overhead low, right. So um, I don't have to pay, um, you know, salaries to people or, or you know, health insurance and things like that. I just Bring them in, um, as a contract employee and then they get paid and we get, we make a, ah, really beautiful project or event or marketing piece for our clients.

Speaker A: Yes, that makes sense. That's cool. Um, if it's okay with you, I want to shift a little bit into more personal and hear about like what you like to do to kind of stay grounded in your like day to day.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: Um, and then I want to move on to talk about the book that you just launched.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's great. Yeah. Um, and as part of that I do want to add one other quick thing. So, um, as far as the business model goes, um, you know, generally I have people that come to me, they contract me. You know, it's a transaction, it's that personal experience. That's what I can provide. Um, I think that's what sets me apart is the um, very hands on, personal, I would almost say boutique type, um, service but without the boutique type prices. Um, and so I'm shifting my business model, um, which also a little bit. And this also plays into how it keeps me grounded. Um, I've had a project in my mind for quite some time and I wanted to implement it for a while and I finally decided this year I'm going to make it happen. And um, it's going to happen this November 14, 15, 16 and it's called Girlfriend's Getaway. And it's going to be happening in the Muskegon area. And uh, it's, it's just what you would imagine it to be, an amazing weekend with your girlfriends having a great time. And so some highlights of it include a, an amazing swag bag full of goodies. We're gonna have a private reception at the newly renovated Muskegon Museum of Arts. There's going to be a whole day of shopping at the Michigan Makers Market. We will have wreath making workshops. We're going to have private tours of the Hackley Hume and historic homes in Muskegon that are going to be fully decorated for the holidays. And uh, you know, mimosa brunches, all that good stuff. I encourage anyone.

Speaker A: You said that's November?

Speaker B: Yes, that's November 14, 15, 16. And information can be found@girlfriendsgetaway.org so check that out. So that kind of plays into, I mean on a personal realm. Um, you know what, what keeps me balanced is um, doing things. I enjoy doing things that I like to put my time and energy into. Um, and I'm not saying that means I, you know, you can't love everything you do sometimes you have to do stuff that you don't love, but you just get it done. Right. Um, so. So that's, you know, kind of how I operate on things. So from. From my business model, you know, I'm, um, 80%, uh, people contract me, and 20%. I'm trying to create my own revenue source and do something fun and exciting for the community that people will.

Speaker A: That's so good. So doing things that you enjoy is one of the things that you do to, like, kind of keep yourself grounded. Are there any, like, um. I'll use the word rhythms, like, in your weekly routine that are like, I have to do this every single week in order to, like, be successful?

Speaker B: Yeah, it ebbs and flows. I mean, there's rhythms to a certain degree depending on what the project is that I'm working on. Um, and, um, just following up with clients and things like that. But on the social media end of things, I manage a lot of Facebook pages. So, um. Excuse me. I. You know, that's a. Definitely a rhythm every week, which sometimes can be good and sometimes can be daunting or draining. But, um, kind of more on a personal level, I do, um. There are things that I. I mean, I love to walk. We live, again, really close to some amazing parks here and. And the lake. I'm literally five minutes from Lake Michigan. So, um, walk there often. And I have my trusty companion who is sleeping right down there, um, whose name is Griffin, which, hopefully later in this, um, interview when we talk about the other project. I will, I will, I will going to point something out to you about Griffin. But, um, you know, we love to be outdoors. I love to, um, travel. Um, we. Muskegon is amazing place. Honestly, people, if you haven't been to Muskegon in the last 10 years, you gotta come check it out. Between the arts and culture that's here, between, um, the natural environment and between everything that we have going on, it's. It's a great place to really live, work and play. So.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Awesome.

Speaker A: Um, you mentioned, um, with traveling. I'm curious, on the note of traveling, is there any place that you've gone that has inspired you, like, creatively more than others?

Speaker B: Oh, man. Kind of. There's been, um. I love to travel. Let me just throw that out there. Okay. But again, it's been kind of the last. We had a huge trip planned in 2020 that got kiboshed. And so, um, these last two years, we're trying to make up for lost time. So, um, this past year we went to Italy and The year before we went to Scotland, um, when we were in Scotland, um, it was for, it was for my husband's work. But, um, it was also some travel in there. We went to this event that was so amazing and so inspiring and probably really expensive. And I just thought, you know, like, unlimited budget. I would love to do something like this in West Michigan. I mean, it was very eclectic. It was, it was thematic. It had all these extras and the decor was just dynamite. And it's like, you know, lots of people. It's funny, like, the way my mind works. Like, I get excited about events and production, right? Where like my husband loves to watch sports and he gets excited about sports and all the players and then this. And I'm, and I'm thinking about this sporting event. I wonder how they, where they set the cameras up. How long did it take to get all this ready? How long? You know, I mean, like, I'm thinking of the production quality of it. So, so yeah, so traveling back to traveling, that, that was an amazing event to just experience. And then, um, in Italy, we went to some really, really cool sites and, and, and the hospitality there and the culture and how they treat their guests and is another important factor. I think when you're thinking about putting together events or even client work, you know, you really need to, um, just show other people respect and courtesy and follow through and do what you say you're gonna do. And um, so those are some of my takeaways from my travels recently.

Speaker A: What was the event that you went to?

Speaker B: It was a.

Speaker A: Sorry, uh, did you say what kind of event it was?

Speaker B: No, I didn't, I didn't. It was an Alice in Wonderland themed event. I am telling you, this was mind blowing. They had. I won't go into all the details, but they had like tables, long tables that were probably 30, 40, 50ft long that had um, all this decor on it that was Alice in Wonderland themed. And then they had like people on stilts. They had um, characters walking around in different attire that were Alice in Wonderland theme. They had music related to it. They had like their food. Some of the food items were like in the shape of what you would think was in the middle of Alice in Wonderland. And I mean it was just phenomenal drinks related to it. Like, that's amazing. And it was held in a huge atrium at uh, a world renowned, um, Scottish museum. So like the, the dome of the atrium was um, just like added to the.

Speaker A: I went to Ireland last year, so I'd imagine there's, there's similarities you know, in like architecture.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: Landscape and everything. So. Yeah, those buildings. Yeah, those buildings in themselves are just like so beautiful and breathtaking. So to have that experience there. Very cool.

Speaker B: For sure. Yeah. And, and we, we were just watching a movie the other day and I knew I was gonna forget what the name of the movie was, but they were in Italy. So I, I looked it up and um, they were having an event on this show in Italy and I was like, God, that looks really familiar. And um, it was at the. We had just been there at the same m. Um square in Venice. And um, or maybe it was a St. Peter. It was, it was in this huge cathedral and I. And it was an event that had like strobe lights and live music and people dancing on things and all this stuff. And I was like, we were just there. Like, how cool would that be if we would have been there during the event?

Speaker A: That's so cool.

Speaker B: Mhm.

Speaker A: Okay, we do. We have to like start tapering off at some point. But I want to bring it back to this book. You just wrote a book, you just released it. Tell us about the title and the inspiration and all of that.

Speaker B: Yes, yes. So the book is called on the day you graduate. And here it is, um, it is a short story and it is about a child that, you know, grows up, goes through all those different experiences that you would have growing up. Um, you know, learning to ride a bike, hopefully going away to school and um, you know, just being by yourself for the first time and um, maybe getting your driver's license and goes through those different series. And then at the end of it, it all culminates in a graduation. And um, it's, it's was inspired by my own children, obviously, but it, um, what I really, really like about it, and I'm really proud about it and I'm not going to go through the whole book, but it's, it's, it's gender neutral. Um, so it could be for, for any child. And there's also a place in it at the end where the student or child could write their own memories of school or what they're excited about for school. And then the last few pages are open for other people to write things in. So whether you wanted the family members to write, uh, hopes and dreams, aspirations for your child, or what some people are doing is they're getting it for younger kids. And then each year at the end of the school year, they're giving it to the teacher and then the teacher gets to write a little. You know, Susie was So amazing at school this year. Keep up the great work. You know, and so, um, it's just a fun book, um, for ages 0 to 18 and beyond. And, um, that's. That's what it is. It's. It's just a great book. And I mentioned earlier about Mr. Griffin that's hanging out behind me, and he helped to inspire some of the artwork within the book, because this is Griffin in the book.

Speaker A: Um, will you. Will you say a bit more on how your kids kind of inspired this project for you?

Speaker B: Yeah. Um, throughout my. My, um, first son's life, I just remember, like, all these different. I mean, through both of my son's life. But, you know, your first one is it's your first time you're going through this, so you're having these experiences, like when he first came to be and be in our house, right. I just remember thinking, like, I am never going to be able to leave this kid alone. Like, how am I ever going to be away from this child? Like, he is going to have to be by me all the time. Right? And then you get to that phase where you're like, okay, well, he can get. He can be in the crib. He can be in the crib by himself. He's going to be okay, you know, and so each phase of life, I remember thinking about all this. And then at the. When he finally graduated, I just had this revelation of all these phases and all these things that he has been through and what I've been through as a parent to watch them grow up. And so I wrote it all down. I wrote this little poem. It's kind of more of a poem, and, um, gave it to him as a keepsake for when he graduated. And then when my second son graduated, I thought, you know what? I'm going to give him the same thing, and I'm going to put it out at his graduation and have people sign it. Have people sign it around the home. And then I thought, you know what? Uh, this might be a thing. Like, I can maybe make a book out of this. And other people could also share this experience and recognize, you know, what their child has accomplished by graduating on one end of the spectrum. On the other end of the spectrum, this could be a book as a child's growing up, to read with their parents, to, um, look forward to those different experiences of growth. And then at the end of it, it would be a gift for them to keep. A keepsake gift.

Speaker A: That's really sweet. That's so sweet. I love that you, like, had the Poem out at your son's. Did you say, I'm picturing, like, an open house? I don't know if you said open house.

Speaker B: Yes, yes, yes. I'm sorry. I probably said graduation.

Speaker A: I meant open house, because that's such a. Like, I remember that being such an impactful moment for me, too, like, seeing so many people who have influenced and impacted my life come through on that day. So.

Speaker B: Mm. Yeah. Yeah. And a lot of times at graduations these days, people do put out books or have little cards where they ask people to write down, like, little words of wisdom or a note to the student and for their future, or they'll put it in the cards that they give them. And so that's why, um, some of the graduations that I was attended this year, I gave them the book, and they opened it and put it out so that people could sign it on

Speaker A: location without giving too much away from the book. You can answer from the perspective of the book or take a different route if you want. But for somebody who is looking to make a next step in their life and so with the inspiration of the book in mind of someone graduating and, like, going to the next big thing and maybe having some fears behind that, uh. Is there some, like, advice that you would offer to somebody like that?

Speaker B: Yes, I would say try it. Whatever you do try it, don't be afraid to try it. You'll never know unless you do. And there's. There's things that you're gonna fail at, and there's things that you're gonna succeed at. And, um, you know, I. In the back of my mind, I always thought, I want to write a book, you know, But I was like, uh, you know, this excuse and that excuse, and I don't know if I can do it. And then finally I just got to the point. I was like, if I'm gonna do it, this is the time for me to do it. I need to try it, right? So I tried it, and we did it. And now I need to sell a whole bunch of books so you can find them on Amazon.com or on the day you graduate dot com. Um, that's my little plug. Um, but, yeah, I. And. And that's the thing. I even tell my kids, like, you won't know. You won't know if you can do it or not if you don't try it. So just set your mind to it. Put a good plan in place, and. And if you don't succeed, then, you know, they always, you know, you don't succeed. Try again. But part of not succeeding or. Or having hiccups along the way help build that, um, strength and stamina to. To do it better the next time or to succeed the next time or whatever the case may be. So my biggest advice is try it. Don't. Don't be afraid to try it.

Speaker A: What was your process like of writing and launching this book? Was there different iterations of the book along the way?

Speaker B: There was. I worked with an editor and a publisher, so, you know, they went through and edited. We made some tweaks. Um, honestly, my. Because it is a very short story, it's not super in depth. You know, when I say I write a book, I always want to. I always have to preface. It's not a novel. It's just. It's more of a children's book. But, um. But, uh, m. My biggest thing was the artwork. Like, I really wanted to find the right illustrator, um, to make it feel whimsical, um, connective, gender neutral, and, um, something that people could identify with no matter what. And so. So that, to me, was an interesting process, and, um, I really enjoyed that.

Speaker A: That's cool. And now it's out there and. Yeah, very exciting. Um, I think that is all of the questions that I have for you today. Maybe one final question for me. But before I ask that question, I'm curious if there's anything else that you want to make sure we say today.

Speaker B: Well, I guess, um, you know, if people wanted to learn more about my organization, my company, um, you can find more out at CMF M. And that's Cat Mary Frank or Carla Maniachi Flanders, CMF. Um, because people are like, CMS. CM what? No. CMF M. Carla Mariachi Flanders marketing.org.org. um, you can find more information out there about. About that. And same thing with the girlfriends weekend. Um, you can find more out about that online. And, um, the book, you know, it's a great gift. It's a great gift idea. 0 to 18, I encourage you to support local businesses and local entrepreneurs and local authors.

Speaker A: Can people also find you on LinkedIn or.

Speaker B: Okay, yes. Yep, you can find me on LinkedIn under my name, CM. Um, well, Carla M. Um, M. Flanders. Sorry, Carla M. Flanders. And then, um, also my company is on LinkedIn as well.

Speaker A: Cool. So my last question for you is, what is the next big project for CMF marketing events?

Speaker B: Well, I kind of already talked about that. That's. That girlfriend's getaway event that. That, um, yeah, that I'm really excited for. So that's. That's the next big one. I have a few others, uh, you know, that are coming up this fall as well. And, um. Yeah, but the Girlfriends getaway is a big one. But another fun one that everybody's invited to that I'd like to just throw out there is the Muskegon Rotary Harvest Fest. And it's, it's open to anybody. But the really cool thing about this is it's being held at the Culinary Institute of Michigan, which is right downtown in Muskegon. It's part, it's part of Baker College. And, um, it is October 23rd, I think it's that Thursday. It's either the 23rd or 24th, whatever that Thursday is. And, um, it's a fundraiser, uh, for local, um, activities that Rotary does and for the college students. So what's really amazing about it is it the culinary students create all the food. So, um, it's all the food you can eat that's all around the venue and, you know, little bite sized pieces all over the place. There's a cash bar, there's a 5050 raffle, there's silent auction items, there's live music, all the fun things. So, um, more information that@muskegonrotary.org awesome.

Speaker A: Well, thank you so much for joining us today, Carla, on Brand of the Making. It was really great to have you.

Speaker B: Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

Speaker A: Awesome.

Speaker B: Sam.