The AI Moonshot Strategy with Robin Ayoub - VistaTalks Ep 198

Speaker A: Foreign.

Speaker B: Hello and, um, welcome to Vista Talks. Interesting discussions with interesting people from all around the world. I'm your host for today, Simon Hodgkins. Delighted to be joined by my good friend Robin. Thank you so much. He's the founder and CEO of of N49 Networks, a fractional chief revenue officer, strategic advisor, a, uh, podcast host for sure. Uh, and he's focused, I know, a lot on AI localization, global growth strategies and everything else. Robin, welcome to the show.

Speaker A: Thank you for having me. Appreciate it. Simon, good to see you again.

Speaker B: It's my pleasure. Good to see you. Uh, let's jump straight into it. Many, um, companies, they're all investing heavily in AI, right? And from your experience, because I know you're sort of talking and advising many executive teams. Right. What are you seeing are some of the common obstacles, Robin, that companies are facing when they're trying to, how can I phrase it? Operationalize AI successfully?

Speaker A: Um, thank you for asking the question, by the way. It's a very important question to be discussing and to be asking. And it goes beyond is the technology has the ability or have the ability to do what we want the technology to do. It goes beyond that. The main obstacle that I see right now is, uh, Simon, is, um, many companies and many executives are looking at adding technology into an existing process, um, without taking the time and considering what the process is and considering the fact that the new technology is allowing us today to, um, maybe take an inside look of our process. Maybe we don't need the processes that we currently have. Maybe moving the pieces around would results in a better process. The biggest, uh, mistake that people are making today in deploying AI is overlaying technology over top of a broken process. And everybody can define what a broken process is. And, um, in everybody's environment has their own definition for this. But that's resulting big time in people feeling, oh, I tried AI. You've heard, you've heard the statement, I've tried AI didn't work, and we're moving on from there. That's very dangerous statement because AI is not here for a short term. It's not here for flash in the pan, as we say. Uh, it is here to stay. And if you've, you've, you approached it wrong at this, at the onset, then you've set the wrong expectation. You saw, you, you said to yourself, this technology doesn't work. We're going to ditch it, we're going to go fake, figure out what else works out there. Meanwhile, your competitors, the market, the industries that you work in doesn't necessarily need to be in Localization industry alone have bypassed you, have left you behind. You're now catching up into what your competitors are doing. The biggest and the, you know, the most obvious mistake and there's many of them, is overlaying technology over top of a broken process.

Speaker B: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I suppose it would be important for us also to touch on some of the changes um, because as you say, some companies may be applying um, AI over broken processes. That's certainly not going to help. Uh, and you know an awful lot about localization and AI obviously from your background, your career and the discussions that you're having on your own show. But I wanted to ask you about the fact that as AI continues to drive this change that we're all working through, uh, we've seen a lot of role changes, we've seen knowledge gaps for sure and unfortunately we have seen uh, job losses too in the localization industry and that that continues. Some of the, the world's biggest tech companies are making job losses, sorry, uh, letting people go from their jobs and those people are experiencing a loss of their job at this moment in time. As we're recording. Any advice or any thoughts on how people should best navigate this moment in time? Because it is a moment of change, isn'?

Speaker A: Absolutely. Uh, Simon, It's a huge moment of change. And um, we are a generation that is stuck in my opinion between the legacy uh, technology versus the AI technology. The legacy technology would say things like we'll wait for the next release, we'll wait for the next feature, we'll wait for next windows from Windows 10 to Windows 11 you waited 12 months. Uh, unfortunately for AI we don't have that luxury. Um, whatever we knew today is different than we're going to be knowing tomorrow. So the um, ever evolving, the self learning nature of the technology that we're currently dealing with takes away all that legacy thinking that we've had in the past. And we have to put our frame mind in a frame, in a frame in a way that we are dealing with a completely different types of technology today. I keep saying we have something that runs on Fridays at 9 o' clock in the morning. I have something called AI exchange. It's a global network of um, individuals that from different countries that we get together and we talk about AI and what's on everybody's mind, what is everybody's experiencing, uh, what did we do differently this week, what did we notice? And one of the things that we're always saying to everybody Is look, every conversation that we think we have, you know, put our thumb on it, we've already decided, already know something. It has an expiry date and it has a very short expiry date. Um, whatever we know today is different than what we know tomorrow. Now you asked a question. How do we, how do people get on board with this? And it's pretty simple. Get on board with it. If you are in a, you know, you've reached the age of saying, you know, um, I'm nearing retirement, I don't need this, it's too much headache. That's a decision individual would make and would say, well, maybe I don't want to deal with this. And then companies will find out that you probably don't need to deal with this. And your marching orders comes in later after that. People who are coming on board with this meaning I'm going to embrace, I'm going to learn, I'm going to take the time on my own time and learn it. And I've learned a lot through the conversation on the localization. Fireside Chat is one of the individual I've interviewed. Ah, she is the chief AI officer, uh, for a large credit card company in the U.S. um, the podcast is online. People can look it up and I asked the question, how are you incentivizing your team to get on board with technology? How are you telling your team? Because you can think, you can think about it and say, oh, I'm going to force them. It doesn't work. They have to come along. And so they put a various program, educational program, money incentive program. Because if the company, think about it, if a company is going to use AI, it's going to say 50%. What I'm just rounding up number to make an example. If you took 20% of that or 30% of that and you distribute it as an incentive to your staff, you definitely going to have a lot of champions jumping in. And m say, hey, I'm going to take part of this. What tend to happen in companies is the greed comes in and um, they say, okay, we're going to save 50%. We're going to save 50%. Some of the staff are going to be staying on board, some of the stuff is going to be going on, going off board and they're going to be going home. That's unfortunate and why it's unfortunate because many of these individuals could learn and it's not hard to learn the technology. This is what's the beautiful about it. The technology will teach us. Before we used to Go to take Microsoft classes. We used to take uh, CRM classes. This I can ask the technology teach me and it will teach you. It's not hard to learn but given the opportunity people would choose to learn versus losing their job. And I've seen this over and over again. The third point around why companies are letting go people. Some companies are letting go people obviously for legitimate reasons and you know those are legitimate reasons. But there are some companies out there that prematurely letting go people on the hope and prayer that is going to save them some cost down the road. And I've heard a few of them where these companies have made a commitment to the shareholders, to the board by this quarter we're going to save you. X It didn't materialize so guess what they do. They just fire a whole bunch of people to adjust the financials so it looks good. And we have a company here in Canada, it's called Rogers Communication. It's one of our largest telco in the telecom company in the, in the country. Few weeks ago they let, they announced they're letting go uh, 12,500 people. That's 50% of their staff. My neighbor runs one of their data center. He's out. And I said, I said what are they going to do? Who's going to run the data centers? Um, they don't know yet. They are figuring things out as they go along because the priority is keep the stock price up, keep your financials up and we'll figure the rest of it, the rest of it later. It's going to show up in revenue, it's going to show up in bad customer service, it's going to show up everywhere. Three things learn. Companies are prematurely sometimes laying off people. Third is people are. If the people are incentivized correctly they will take it on, they will take the challenge on and they will learn.

Speaker B: That's some great insights. Yeah and I think people will certainly want to learn uh face with the alternatives. Unfortunately we are seeing, I think you're right that people laying off um, you know, thousands of people, hundreds of people uh, on a hope that everything works out in the end. Um, some of the plans may, you know, you could sort of poke holes in them. And also we hear the term AI washing where people are sort of saying they're letting go people when it maybe they overhire in the past or maybe they need to restructure anyway so it is very interesting. One thing's for sure, the change is certainly not over and I think we're in for more change as we Go forward. And I wanted to ask you, I mentioned earlier as a sort of somebody that advises from a revenue, you know, Chief Revenue Officer perspective and somebody who operates in the sort of strategic advising space too. Robin, for any business leaders that are listening to our conversation, how do they, when you talk to those people about moving faster, about reducing risks, about creating more sustainable growth in the AI economy, uh, what about the other side of that coin? So, you know, not the job losses, but the companies that are trying to move forward. What's your advice for those people?

Speaker A: You need to focus on the growth part instead of cost efficient efficiency.

Speaker B: Yeah, right.

Speaker A: Yeah. So, um, you know, I did a podcast with a gentleman out of London and we just posted it a few days ago. And one of the lines that I really captured my attention in the, in the podcast, it was if you lead any organization from a growth position, you will create positive, you will create positivity in your organization. If you lead your organization from a cost efficiency perspective, you are going to lead into resentment. Company is going to read lead into the reason. And I'm just speaking in general, right? So there's an exception to every rule. There's an exception to every statement out there. Those are proven facts. Normally you hire a CFO as a board to do one thing, straighten out the company and sell it. You would hire a CRO to run your company for one reason. Grow the revenue, get me to the five year plan, double the revenue, whatever you want to do, because we have other things you want to do down the road, fine. But the bottom line is the leader of these organization normally come if they come from an accounting background or from m. An operational background. Normally what you have is cost cutting, process improvement and AI can help you in any of those. I mean, those are facts and they're out there. People can help. But if you want to drive your organization into a positive mode, and here's, here's the kicker that I'm hearing right now. In our organization there's two, there's two sides. There's one side that says I want to grow my company. But there is a more depressing side in our, in our industry which it says I don't want to grow my company, I just don't want to lose more revenue. And I don't know how many CEOs I've talked to, it says just help me stop the drain versus help me grow the company now to grow a certain organization today. And uh, it doesn't matter if you're trying to grow slate flat or try to cut Cost. Whatever category of those objectives you are in as a board, as an owner, or as a CEO of an organization, there are many tools, uh, today that would allow us to become, as an individual, become an army of one, and as a company would become a, uh, lot more throughput. It gives us an opportunity to do a lot more throughput. If you're doing a marketing outreach, if you're doing a customer outreach, if you're trying to reach prospects, closing deals, responding to RFPs, at our disposals today, there is a ton of opportunity to do more with less. Not less in terms of people, but less in terms of effort. And I get, I always give this example to my audience on my show is look to run a podcast for me. And you run your own podcast. You know how much effort it is to record, to schedule, to post, edit, to do all the facets that you need to do post recording. Uh, uh, it would take an arm and leg. It would take a lot of effort to do this used to take me like weeks to do one episode. Now it takes me one hour. Why? It's because I built programs around this. I've used tools around it. Did the quality go down? Absolutely not. I'm still in charge of it. It's, uh, you know, this is where people miss the fact that you are using the technology. You are in charge of technology. It's not replacing you. You control the technology. Nobody's going to go back one day and say, you made an error. Simon or Robin, we made an error in that post. Oh, sorry, AI did it. No, you're still responsible. You did not abandon your responsibility of whatever intellectual property you're creating out there because you, you subcontracted this or you used a tool. Whatever you, you did, this is still our responsibility now, going back to growing and growing positively today, most organizations out there, and you probably know that, uh, you had a, you know, tremendous amount of marketing effort for Vista Tech. So I tell you, the biggest problem everybody's facing is called top of the funnel problem. Everybody wants leads. Everybody's asking, where's the next leads coming from? Everybody's asking, where's the next meeting is coming from? And nobody has a, nobody has a magic wand solution to this. Nobody has like somebody says, you know, hi, Robin, or hi, Simon, and fix it all together for you. It's a multitude of tools. It's a multitude of processes that we need to diagnose and we need to sit down and figure out each one of them work independently of each other or they get together in a sequence. Perhaps I don't know, depends on the individual, on the individual company. But there are many tools right now that we can do. Top of the funnel, build up. One thing that we need to keep in mind is our customers are using AI to filter through that too. So when we do an outreach, our customers are doing that too. So you can imagine in a Star, uh, Trek kind of a movie is a bot against bot. And. But what we're trying to do as a, as a human who's trying to reach to another is inject a human in the process. You can't leave it all to an AI to go after a certain prospect because everybody's going to ignore you. Nobody wants to answer that. And if they do answer that, they're probably giving you the call shorter when they answer it. Um, they're answering with a great deal of skepticism. When they get to the conversation, they have a big question mark. Who am I talking to? Is it a real person or non real person? So, uh, there's a lot of tools out there that allows us to move away. And that's what frustrates me sometimes when I hear owners are saying, you know, just the industry, the technology, all negative out there. It's not negative. People are still creating content, Simon, we're creating content. You're creating content. Our customers are creating content at, uh, a faster, much faster rate due to AI than what we had before 10 years ago. So these contents needs to be vetted, needs to be translated, needs to be edited, needs to be done. Whatever. We need to repurpose that content to go to other languages. So there is still need for the industry. It was back then during the Babylonian days, and it will continue on for 10,000 years to go from here. The question is the language industry will never go away. There are a lot of, uh, uh, I want to say, um, you know, how do I say that? Nuances to every culture, uh, there are a lot of specificity that you cannot encapsulate into a mathematical formula and say, I'm going to put it into a technology of sort. To take for instance, just to give an example, you know, when you say in Saudi Arabia, two years ago was the year of the camel, and everything around that is around that culture, around how we value this, how we, this is now embedded into our culture as, as a society, AI will never know that, uh, unless somebody teaches it and it changes from year to year. Good luck. Um, so there are still needs out there for growth, there's still need out there for clever way of growing companies. Uh, it won't be the old traditional fashion, that's for sure.

Speaker B: Some great points there, Robin. Um, and it's funny, I was only talking to the CTO of uh, a technology company, software technology company. Recently There are about 300 people. They've been uh, across uh, Europe, they're moving into Africa now and uh, other places around the world. And one of the things they were saying is they haven't actually made any job losses or job courts. They're keeping their staff, they're actually hiring more staff and they've deployed 70 agentic agents in their company because they are empowering the people that they have. Right. So it kind of touches on what you were saying earlier. It's a growth mindset. They consider that if they have more humans plus the benefits of AI, they will outstrip their competition. So they're quite optimistic in that growth mindset. But I appreciate the points that you've raised and it's, it, it makes me want to ask you about the human expertise. We talk a lot about humans in the loop. I know in, in, in my world we talk a lot about the required importance for human expertise alongside these AI systems. What's your experience of that at, at the enterprise level, Robin? How do you see that?

Speaker A: Um, you're referring to um, let's say an engineer or project manager or translator or an architect, uh, those expertise in uh, in the world that we live in today. Yeah, we do talk a lot about creating value and we're trying to identify as professionals in every profession. The doctors are worried about it. Um, you know, medical, medical profession is very worried about it. The legal profession is very worried about it. That the technology is now, is allowing people to take ownership of, of whatever profession uh, that you want to address in this context. I do remember a few weeks ago one of my uh, relatives had a bit of an issue and she wanted to go to the doctor. So my, my wife went with her. My wife's sister and ended up going with her to the doctor. And she went to the doctor more equipped with information to answer uh, or to ask questions. Very in depth question to the doctor. The doctor almost told her to stop. Stop. You know, he got frustrated. He just don't want to deal with this anymore. So you, we have to be ready for this. Our customer is going to be asking very clever questions because they're now more educated, they've got access to information and the profession out there or the industry out there that they are banking on stupid customers. There's no more stupid customers. Every customer out there is educated is well, well aware. And they probably know about the topic before more than we do in some cases. So we got to be equipped with this and, uh, the value that we tried to create to define what is our key characteristic as an individual in the midst of all these technologies. What do I bring to the table? I bring to the table my 30 years of experience, 40 years of experience. You've seen many cases. You cannot take all that knowledge and encapsulate it. I don't know how somebody's going to be able to copy your brain or your memory and put it into all of it. That will be like, I don't know, thousands of terabytes of data. All the experiences that you've had all your life. This is what makes us, us as a human. AI has taken a snapshot of data that has been established over the past, I don't know how many years, but as a human who's like 30, 40 years old, 20 years old, you've got a lot of experiences. Not all of it has been captured into form of data. And that's the value that we bring in. We bring in our expertise, our knowledge, we, what we've done in the past that allows us to take advantage of those experiences and build on them into the future. A project manager may not need to perhaps manipulate files and copy files between folders. They can focus more on advising their customers, on working with their customers, on what is the best option here? What can we do better for your outcome? What is the outcome expected here from this, what we're trying to do for them as project managers? I find at one time I did a, uh, what do you call it? Uh, I sat beside a project manager and, uh, for one day, tried to see what they do. I was almost floored. Like, most of the work is manual, like moving files, typing emails, like very benign emails, like, you know, send me this file, you forgot to attach this thing. And, um, we need this reference material. And I'm thinking in my head, you know, as a technologist, by background thinking, like, 99% of that stuff can be automated. And the project manager now can focus on the relationship. And I'm using the project manager as an example, but could be anybody.

Speaker B: No, absolutely. And it's interesting when you put it in, in those terms, uh, in terms of all the experiences that we capture as humans. And there's something about that, that sort of gut feel that we have, that sort of intuition that we have when something is right or wrong or it needs to be restated. Uh, and also, of course, A lot of experience that people bring to the, uh, the A.I. discussion. Um, yes, A.I. is brilliant. I'm the first one to admit it. It's phenomenal tool. Uh, but when you combine it with the human expertise, it really does, uh, accelerate the, you know, here's what I

Speaker A: say to your audience, right? I, I would really be convinced the moment I see anthropic or chat GPT crying on my screen. If I see them crying on my screen, that means they engaged enough passion, human passion inside of, or emotion. I don't think this is happening anytime near future.

Speaker B: Very good, very good. Um, now for anybody who is watching us and not just listening to us, they will be able to see, um, the lovely localization Fireside Chat branding behind you. And I wanted to ask you about that because obviously you're the founder, you're the host of lfc and I know you have a lot of candid conversations with AI leaders and many industry experts on your show, but I want to ask you about sort of trends or concerns that you're actually hearing about from people, from executives on this, this future sort of landscape that we're describing here. What are you hearing as you, as you're doing the Fireside Chats?

Speaker A: I'm hearing two sides of a coin. The first side is we're worried about what is, what role does the human play in the future. And you hear from everybody. The, uh, the person who just created an app, uh, the person who's trying to change the world by creating some new technology, AI based technology, and the other people as well who are, um, you know, going through transition. We're all going through transition right now. I mean, we were not born into this. We were coming across it as a technology as we evolve in our career, in our professional life. So two sides. One is a group, ah, of executives or a group of decision makers. It's came on the podcast and we've done many of those conversations where they talk about the role of the human, you know, and we talk about it from a variety of perspective. I mean, I've had people talking about the cognitive power of the human brain and how. And in order for us to m. To mimic this into AI would be complete impossibility. You're talking about, you know, whatever the next quantum computing is going to look like to mimic a human brain. We're trying to at this point is to take a subset of the human activity, the human, the cognitive human activity. And we're not there yet. We still have contact rods, we still have hallucination, we still Have a bunch of things and in fact uh, I did a podcast on mapping out the human brain and trying to create an AI based on the human brain in ter. How do we remember things, how do we access data, how do we access. So if you want to extend that, you'll be three groups. One is trying to understand how the human brain function and trying to mimic, create technology that looks like the human brain or behave like a human brain. And that's a down the road kind of thing. And the third, the second one is a group of people that they come into the podcast and they say well what is the value of the human? What is the role of human? We're worried about that, uh, they're worried about it. We're worried about the fit the role. You know, are we going to be all out of a job? I've heard this many times. Are we all going to be in a, in a, you know, as, as, as technology continues to evolve, uh, would we all become, I don't know, vegetables, um, or do we do other things in life? And the third uh, group which they talk a lot about innovation and those are taken up to the next level. Like I've interviewed at a, uh, one of the US in the United States is like the top um, neurosurgeon, uh, he specialized in uh, spinal cord fusion. Now listen to this. They invented a microchip that goes into, after they do the surgery and he, the guy did hundred thousands of these things and they embed it into the human body at the, at the nerve ending uh, of the spinal cord fusion. And there's fiber cords that goes from that and attached to the nerve endings. Now this is an AI based microchip connected to your phone and you can dial in, dial out the amount of electricity you want to send to those nerve ends to reduce the amount of pain. So what's the end? What's the outcome? Almost 80% of the people that they put this technology in them, they had almost zero medication after that. So we can talk about it from the context of um, you know, is it going to speed up the translation? Is it going to replace, know the translator? But there are many aspects where human are benefiting from this technology right now.

Speaker B: Yeah, a great example and uh, I suppose look a follow up to that question is as you look ahead then personally, um, there must be some major shifts that you're expecting. You know, where does this intersection of everything from AI localization, revenue growth, you know, customer engagement, the kind of things we're talking about here today. How should an organization prepare maybe for not just what's here, but maybe what's coming down the line.

Speaker A: Robin, um, organization should take a look at this from their own perspective of where the market is, their own market. So there are some organizations I'm going to use like the localization industry. You've got 19,000 companies in our localization industries thereabout. I mean CSA probably will correct me say we're 18, 7, 50, whatever. I'm just going to round it up to 19,000 um, 19, 000 companies. Say uh, uh, we have in the, in the industry some uh, of those industry. Some of those companies are very focused on a small sliver if you will of a specific market. They only serve two companies that had a long term relationship and they know each other. The relationship is there. Uh, they don't have to worry too much because they seem to think that the relationship is strong and it's protected. Technology is not going to displace that. If you have validated this good for you, protect that zone for yourself. And in the back your mind you may want to continue thinking what if those two customers leave me? What do I do next? So you may want to think about that way. And there are a few companies out there that they fit that profile that I just talked about. The second one is you've got like the midsize companies. You know, I've got 2 million to 10 million or 20 million dollar uh, revenue. You know, I operate let's say in a certain segment. I only serve the medical or I only serve legal, I only serve engineering, whatever industry that you happen to be in. And for that they have developed a specific formula how to serve them. Either a high tight security and nobody else can do this right now. So everybody has figured out a way to either entrench themselves in the pro, in the market that they're serving and protected nicely. If you are in a flatland, I would call it that you're serving everybody your horizontal service. You're serving multiple uh, multiple industry sectors out there. And I'm just talking about the 8020 rule. So, so the um, 80% of the revenue comes from the top 20 companies in the industry. So those top uh, 20 companies uh, out there and you know, you know who they are, uh, they probably right now are looking at major shifts in the way they're going to be operating and either they are going to introduce new services, if they haven't done that already, they're introducing new services, maybe data training, maybe some AI related services, um, and, or um, maybe focus on what they're good at and retract and concentrate on that, uh, in, in the future. And I'm just speaking in market, market in general. And you know, for those of you who knows me, and I'm not sure how much, how well we know each other, so I pretty Much sold on 4 continent or all continents in around the world. And I can tell you without a doubt the market, it will be separated in two segments. One is, um, I mean, I like the artisan way of getting things done. I love the traditional classic way of doing translation. I want to get to know the translator, I want to, to shake their hands, I want to go visit them. You have those buyers and they will always be there and you are going to have those buyers where they say, you know, I want to have convenience, I want to have promptness of service and I want to have it cheap. I want to have a good quality. So two groups of buyers, uh, that will always exist and this is what we need to be ready for.

Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. Yeah. And I suppose I want to squeeze in one more question because I, I suppose that where that leads me to, uh, as you're talking there is the level of AI exposure in a company today is very, very different. Like we talk to companies of all shapes and sizes. I'm sure you do too. And some are very early in their AI journey. Um, you know, are there any sort of practical steps or any sort of recommendations or takeaways for people who are trying to move at this moment in time, Robin, from experimentation? Um, ah, somebody called them technical toys recently. You know, everybody's playing with the technical toys. That was Peter Rose, a CTO of a company called Tech Enable. He was talking about technical toys, which I liked. Um, but how do we help people move from experimentation to this? You know, you've got to build long term value and of course you need some competitive advantage in there too. So any, any sort of last thoughts on the practical steps here?

Speaker A: So last week, last Friday, I did a presentation for the AI Exchange and I called it the AI Moonshot. And what I meant by that, and you know, I did a few slides on this one. And what I meant by that is most, as you mentioned, most companies are trying to use, uh, technical or technology in a way that it's very timid. Uh, a few small steps. You know, I use AI to manage my email or to draft an email or I cut and paste and I'm so shocked. Oh my God. If anybody heard or saw or detected that I used AI, it's like oh my God, it's like the most embarrassing thing in the world. I just laugh at this because everybody's using it and not just using it in a way that are uh, shy about it. Everybody's proud of using it. You have to think about this because you cannot stop it. The genie is out of the bottle. Uh, you cannot put it back in the bottle. Technology is out. Everybody's using it. Your customers are using it, you are using it. You better get on board. We're going to become a dust of history. The second thing as I recommend it to people is look, if whatever you're looking at from a technology deployment right now, think about this. If it's not making you uncomfortable to a point where you're losing sleep at night, you're not doing anything and if you are doing right now things like oh, I'm using, we're using A.I. you know, we just uh, bought a subscription to chat, uh GPT for my staff that somebody said that to me. Uh, did you show them how to use it? Um, you know, they will figure this out. Well, I mean you got to use it in the context of what you're using. But, but the next point is what I, when I did the presentation, you gotta aim at the 10x whatever the 10x in your world is. So aim at the 10x from a deployment perspective and you have to move the needle at that rate. So whatever you're doing right now, you gotta multiply by 10 tomorrow in order for you to either A gain competitive advantage or B create some sort of a uh, uh, technology that allows you internally to say we're going to do better job for our customers because at the end of the day every, every business service customers, um, and that 10x is going to move the needle for people and that uncomfortable situation, you and your staff as a CEO or, or a chief Technology officer, you're going to put yourself in. That's very healthy by the way. It's not just stressful, it's part of the journey and nobody's um, going to get hurt in, in the process but we all going to be on board. It can't be a one man show or one here. We're all going to be on board with this and the 10x is realizable. There are many examples out there with companies says enough with this. We're not working on just managing email. We're just going to use this flat out on everything we do. And the results are astonishing.

Speaker B: Well that's, that's phenomenal food for thought. Robin, you know, get, uh, on board 10X. You know, people. People need to, uh, make it happen. Right? So I. I really like that you've, you know, you've offered some great food for thought, and it's a wonderful part to finish our discussion together here today on, um. I. Unfortunately, it brings us to the end of the show. Uh, today with Robin. I'm going to ask people, uh, to, you know, tune in again to another episode of Vista Talks. Uh, you know, we discuss interesting topics with very interesting people and to also go and check out everything Robin's doing on the localization Fireside channel chat and everything else he's involved in. Um, but look, join me back here for some more discussions and, uh, I hope to see you soon. But thank you, Robin, for being on the show. It's been a pleasure to talk to you. Talk to you again today. It's great to see you.

Speaker A: Thank you, Simon. Appreciate it. Thanks for hosting me.

Speaker B: Appreciate it, Sam.