Fun times with Fun Guy: How to create your own category with Phoebe McPherson & George Moulton

Speaker A: Welcome to the Uncommon Brands podcast. I'm your host, Parker Nash. If you want to know the product and marketing strategies the next wave of up and coming consumer brands are using to achieve uncommon success, you're in the right place. In each episode, we interview founders of fast growing consumer brands that are breaking out by not being afraid to be different. So if you're a DTC founder, entrepreneur, or leader that, uh, thinks differently and you're trying to build an uncommon brand, this podcast is for you. Okay, onto the show. Okay. Today, excited to have something a little bit different. We have two guests on the show today, and we have Phoebe McPherson and George Moulton on the show and they are the co founders of Function and Fun Guy. They're athletes, healing experts, adventurers, entrepreneurs amongst much more. And I could try and explain exactly their backgrounds, their ventures there, and brands they're building, but I'm pretty sure all I would do is do it a complete disservice. So I'm going to kick it to them, let them introduce themselves and tell us all about what they're working and building on here. So, Phoebe, George, welcome to the show.

Speaker B: Thank you so much.

Speaker A: So why don't we start here first, George, give us a little bit of your background and then we'll go to Phoebe, you give us your background, and then we'll talk about the brands you guys are building.

Speaker C: My background's mostly in just basically business entrepreneurship. I came from a family of just entrepreneurs. I was like, in my bloodline. Like, I knew from such a young age that I really never wanted to work for anybody. I was always going to work for myself and design my own schedule based off of my lifestyle of always. I grew up, like, growing up snowboarding at such a young age and competing. And that's why I moved from the east coast to, uh, California when I turned 18 was to pursue snowboarding. So I wanted to kind of figure out a way that could fit around that lifestyle so I could travel wherever I wanted and just kind of continue snowboarding. But yeah, over those years I had some really bad injuries that kind of like, it changed the trajectory of what I wanted to do with snowboarding. So I stopped competing, kind of transitioned snowboarding for fun. Alongside that, I was always in the cannabis industry, which kind of gave me just deep knowledge of, like, how the cannabis industry operates and just working in that way to help that structure, like what I wanted to do for the rest of my life. As I kind of like got, uh, bored with the cannabis industry, I knew I wanted to, like, venture off and to do other things. This was when I was currently living in or when I was living in Tahoe. And when I decided it was just, it was time to switch up. I always had a passion for food and cooking. So the first real business that I came up with that I wanted to do was Italian, uh, dessert company. So I ended up moving to San Diego to kind of pursue and start my first business. Something very simple that I could learn. Like it was very little overhead. Something that I can learn how to like properly run a business. So that ended up being. It was a, uh, cannoli company. So we were filling cannolis with lotto. It was super random, but it was something fun at the time. And did that for a few years. Ended up getting bored because I learned how to do that and I was like, what's next? We end up selling that and went on a surf trip for a month to kind of clear my head and think about what I wanted to do next. And from there went to starting this adventure tour company in San Diego, which was like connecting younger age travelers with locals in San Diego that were willing to show these people what locals did in San Diego. Because, uh, I just saw this little gap in San Diego where there was all. There was like super touristy, like trolley tours and family stuff. There was nothing for like all these young kids that were coming to visit their friends that were in college in San Diego who didn't have time to show them what to do. So we like designed this cool custom, like surfer looking bus that was byob and we would just allow people to just come on the bus and we would take them on full day coastal adventures to San Diego and just show them what it was like to actually live in San Diego. Yeah. So while I was doing that, did that for another two years and then just like it wasn't. I was so used to making like fast money, which, with cannabis. And it just wasn't. Something was just off. And I was starting to realize how much more momentum and energy I was gonna have to put in this and how much longer it was gonna take. So at that time I ended up. My backup plan was to just move. I moved. Ended up moving from San Diego to LA to focus on some more work with cannabis. Cause I had a lot of clients up here. And then, um, from there it was right before COVID hit and I was always very health focused through my whole years of snowboarding. And I just noticed my body just starting to like not recover as fast or where I just like energy levels were down. I was really trying to figure out what I needed to put, like, add to my life to kind of just like, prepare for myself getting older. And that was like, right around before COVID when I discovered functional mushrooms as I was like, playing around with psychedelics, because I just really love psychedelics. And I had some amazing experiences that, uh, changed my life. I just saw how powerful they were, even though they weren't legal yet. I just started putting, like, using that in my routine as I kind of took a step away from alcohol and found myself using psychedelic mushrooms to go out and hang out with friends and socialize once I realized how to properly dose with them. And m it was just like that fine line of, like, understanding how to take the cert the right around medicine to, like, go out and socialize. So, yeah, at that time, so it was like playing around with psychedelics. And then I found functional mushrooms. So, like, that's when mushrooms just kind of took over my whole life, which now unfold into these. All these mushroom things that we're doing.

Speaker A: All right, we're going to put a pin on that for a second. We're going to go to Phoebe, you give us your quick little background, and then we'll kind of come back to the mushroom world here and talk about the brands you guys are building.

Speaker B: All good. So my name's Phoebe, and it's such an honor to work with George every single day. As you guys can hear, he's an absolute visionary and is in everything under the sun. My background is more in the plant medicine space, so I come from plant medicine. I'm an herbalist and an educator. I've been in plant medicine for years, and I've learned everything from cultivating mushrooms and plants to holding space and ceremony, how to create formulas, how to pair different plants and mushrooms together. My big spiritual awakening, for lack of a better word, came from having an experience with psychedelic mushrooms and kanna together. An incredible plant that we'll talk about. And it completely opened me up where I looked around the life that I was living, and I realized nothing would be the same. And within two months after that experience, I'd quit my corporate job and I had started apprenticing with someone full time to learn the entire space. And so I worked and created and co founded another mushroom and plant company before. And now I'm here today with George, doing everything. And it's such an honor to be able to share mushrooms and plants with people and help them connect and a way where they feel just as connected to the world as I do.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, it was super interesting too, because, I mean, there's this whole area that you guys are in is you're certainly on the forefront of a movement and a wave.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker A: And it's been so many ups and downs, I'm sure with all this kind of stuff. And we're starting to see some things that were totally, uh, kind of third rail, couldn't touch it. Now states are starting to change their perspective on these things.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker A: So it's such an interesting. But it's obviously right now too. It's like the messy middle of figuring all this stuff and all this space out. So it's pretty wild.

Speaker C: Right?

Speaker A: I'm sure of it for you all. But let's. So let's go now to the two brands that you guys have and are working on. Uh, we're going to talk more about one specifically, but why don't you guys tell us a little bit about the brands you guys are building.

Speaker B: Yeah. So we have fungi and then function. So function is daily wellness. So tinctures that you need to feel good from sun up to sun down. All of our tinctures feel, really taste, really amazing. They taste sweet like honey, but there's no sugar or fake sugar and they're all filled with plants and mushrooms. And then our other company, fungi, we want to help people feel good, feel better, but at the end of the day, just make you feel. So we have mood enhancing chocolates and fruit shoes that are going to make you feel a certain kind of way. They replicate an actual microdose, but it's totally legal. And then we've just launched tinctures as well to help support people's experiences no matter where life takes them.

Speaker C: Cool.

Speaker A: So fungi is the one that's really starting to take off here. And then for those listening, it's function. F U n G T I O N fun fung. Right. So the fungi. And so let's maybe a little quick base education here. So a lot of the products you have is for fungi. They're chocolates. You, you also launch some tinctures within there. But what's the active ingredient is Kanna? Is that right? Is that what's in the chocolates here? And then can you just give us a quick little education on what Kanna is, what that does for you, what that's all about?

Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So Kanna is a succulent from South Africa and is classified as an empathogen. And pathogenic substances of plants are a class of succulents, psychoactive, not psychedelic substance that opens up Your heart. They increase feelings of love and joy and empathy. Other pathogens include MDMA and mda, but of course, those are both synthesized and they include amphetamines. Um, and they're not legal, But Kanna is 100% legal. You can cultivate it in South Africa. But in addition to that, Kanna is going to help you feel like a, uh, kind of like a microdose of mdma. That's where it gets nicknamed Nature's mdma. But it also regulates your amygdala, the part of your brain responsible for your fight or flight center. It reduces stress, it reduces pain. It helps you feel more connected to yourself and others around you. And you just feel really good on it. And there's no comedown, unlike MDMA and mda. So you feel really amazing the next day. And it's super safe to take daily four years. And in addition to that, in South Africa, it's been used for thousands of years for anxiety and depression.

Speaker A: To this day, I'm wondering if you guys have different experiences with it or how it makes you feel. But for those that haven't tried it, what's the sensation? What's the feeling you get? Yeah. User Office.

Speaker B: Happy, connected, euphoric. If you're someone that struggles with social anxiety, it's melting away. If you're someone that's typically pretty quiet or more reserved. I always get this feeling where people would tell me, I don't know why I'm telling you this, but you just have a belief. Let's share and come off. When you take it in more, like, energetic situations, like going hiking, going to yoga, going on a run, or like, going to festivals, you just feel so good in your body and you just want to move. Yeah, that's the feeling. And who wouldn't want that?

Speaker C: I like to say when I use it for snowboarding or surfing and or going to do yoga, like, it helps me drop into flow state much easier, where I'm just like, the zone. In the zone. Just, like, focused, and it just helps you get there.

Speaker A: I don't know how to explain it, but, yeah, I mean, you have to experience the in the zone feeling to. I don't know how to explain it either, but, like, we've all, at some point in our lives, I hope all of us have had that experience where you're like, man, I'm just locked in on whatever it is I'm doing or experiencing. But, uh, yeah, it's kind of hard to explain that exactly, I guess. But, yeah, okay, all right, so then you guys Launched Funguy in February. Is that what you said? Is that right? Okay. And it's really starting to take off. So why don't we talk a little bit about that process of, uh, what have you guys done to get this thing to really start taking off? And I'm also curious a little bit about within the space you're in, do you have to do a lot of education to get people to understand this product, or is it. No, we're focusing more on. We know there's people out there that know this, know what Kana is, know this stuff is. And whereas our goal is just to find those people and serve them the perfect product for them, or, you know, maybe talk through that. But let's start first with kind of launching this thing. And what have you guys done to really get the ball rolling on this?

Speaker C: Yeah, I would definitely say it is a lot of education, because the space that we're in and the way we went about it is, hey, people get confused thinking it's psychedelics. Whole point. Like, the strategic buildup of this was like, Fungi originally started as, like, an awareness page of, like, a psychedelic inspired brand. Kind of like preparing for the future. Everyone knows, or is, like, kind of aware that psychedelics are becoming more popular. They're on the works of becoming decriminalized and legalized. So Fungi was meant to be this brand that is future or forward thinking. Like, this is eventually going to be a psychedelic brand. But even though we can't legally sell psychedelics right now, we're just going to keep promoting, like, building this brand online as an awareness page and letting people kind of go off their own imagination of like, oh, what is this going to be? And that's how I really started building just, like, really cool branding. And it's like the catchy name makes you just think about psychedelics. But in that time, we knew we couldn't legally launch it yet. So that's where, when Phoebe introduced me to Kanna, we started realizing that this could be our loophole, because Kanna also allows you to have similar feelings of microdosing. Microdosing. And it's fully legal. So we're like, that was our loophole to kind of put this into a product stacked with some other ingredients so we can now launch this brand and some products and keep promoting it and building it ahead of psychedelic legalization with the intent that when psychedelics do become legal, we do plan on going that route.

Speaker A: And you've already built a community, the customers, the base to then serve them whenever it does happen. Which seems like we're moving in that direction. The big question mark is just when.

Speaker C: Right?

Speaker B: Uh, exactly. And I think one of the beautiful things is that we do education really well. Like, we really do education well. We don't do like a huge amount of education, but what we do is it helps people understand exactly what we're creating. It helps people understand exactly what they're going to feel and we relate to them. I think a, uh, problem that a lot of brands that are in the education space get wrong is that they try to express, expect customers to meet them where they are instead of meeting customers. Exactly. They want to be. Not many people want to like download a free guide. They don't want to like go to like a one on one, like a webinar learning like a masterclass.

Speaker A: No co effort, low friction.

Speaker B: Exactly. So we meet them where they are, we make really easy consumable videos. Talking about like, yeah, you can take this to festivals, you're going to feel really good. And then we give them a product that's actually reliable and tastes really amazing and is easy to carry around and it's a pretty easy formula once you catch it. But then I think one of the great things that we did is when we launched Fungi, we launched the same week as we started a really big integrated marketing campaign with one of the biggest psychedelic magazines on the planet called doubleblind. And so they did a lot of education to their reader base as well who are already interested in psychedelics. So having kind of like this double whammy approach was really amazing to not only build credibility and respect for our brand, but also spread that education much wider than we ever could on our own.

Speaker C: Um, yeah.

Speaker A: Talk about finding the right place to show up and get in front of the right audience.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker B: And I think the one thing I'll add is you said like, are, ah, you just going to people who already know like what Kanna is? And by launching with Double Blind, we reach people who already did know what Kanna is, but we also reach this wider audience because they reach anyone who's interested in psychedelics. So it was kind of like both, like, okay, cool, we've all got the people that love it and now they're always going to teach people who don't know it and then when they see the Fungi name, it's already recognizable and they're going to start trusting us.

Speaker C: Right?

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: You're building that from the halo effect of there's like people, early adopters really know exactly what this is. But then there's a uh, as it grows and builds, there's people that have slightly less knowledge and they're in the area, in the space, and you're serving those people. So brilliant doing that. And then. Yeah. So you. I mean, I thought was really interesting. You're talking about education and totally agree with you. Nobody has the attention span or really cares to, like, download stuff or spend all this time doing this stuff unless you're just, like, so into it that you're willing to dedicate hours to these things. But which. Shoot, many of us are. But maybe you can give us a little bit of advice, because I think this is things that I speak with a lot of brands that they struggle with is how do you actually do this? How do you actually educate and inform people in a, uh, entertaining way? And that's quick and not too much information for them. I mean, I also think too, a lot of things I see oftentimes and, uh, I work with a lot of brands on this is. I think one of the biggest things we have is the curse of knowledge, which is. Have you guys heard that term? Which is essentially, it's. We forget that not everybody knows as much as we do about our products, our businesses, our brands. And so we just speak to them at a level that is way over their head.

Speaker C: And then we forget.

Speaker A: We're like, no, no, we've been in this world for years or however long it is, and we got to back it up to a very simple form and level and then start building up from there to speak to them. But anyways, long way of asking and going back to this, though, is do you have an approach that you can share with us of how you educate? And is this mainly through social media? M. How are you guys doing it? And what's that look like?

Speaker B: So one of the things that we were really lucky with is that I got invited on a lot of podcasts, a lot of podcasts that wanted me to tell the kind of the same story again and again. And those repetitions gave us a ton of sound bites to then use to educate people. And because I was kind of telling the same story 14 different ways, I got so many different ways to explain, like, what Kanna is, what mood enhancing is like, all of these things. And then we were able to test it on our audience by putting it into ads. And so I would say, like, anything where you can tell a story, tell it again and again and again. And in prep for those podcasts, which was in prep for education, I would reach out to friends or people that I didn't talk to a really long time and say, hey, can I explain this to you and see where they were met, like what felt good to them, what didn't. Like I said, a lot of my background is in education. Like I do a lot of consulting for other people, helping them understand plants and mushrooms, trying to really hit them on a baseline. And what you said is completely right. You have to really almost treat people like they're at a fifth grade level. Right. And not from like a condescending way, but just help people understand and get them to a baseline so then we can all rise together. And until they start to do that, uh, like customers would just feel like you don't care about them.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: So, uh, we were really lucky with that. And then we have an entire page on our website that kind of deep dives onto this plant Kana. And we're working on pages for all of the plants and mushrooms. And I think what's really beautiful about that is you can then allow people to go and explore more on your own website if they want it, but if not, like, you just let it be. You know, give them the basics, give them the tidbits, and then you can breadcrumb the rest of the way.

Speaker A: Yeah, I'm just going to hit that again because it is so important what you're saying there, especially in if you have a product or a brand or service you're building that is on the cutting edge, on the forefront. For sure you are a PhD level knowledge of what you're building and doing. And for sure your customers do not, for the most part are not going to know and understand that stuff. So what you said there about speaking to them at a fifth grade level is 100% on. And I would also say this too, which is when I was at ah, Nike, we had a senior leader at our group and he always had a saying stuck in my mind. But his saying was repetition is reputation. And that's the same too, is like say the same thing. Say the same damn thing over and

Speaker C: over and over again.

Speaker A: And that's the way you get it drilled into people's heads.

Speaker B: Exactly, exactly. And I think, you know, that's why I think advertising for small businesses like Meta and even like Instagram and even like newsletters can be so amazing. Like just drill the same message everywhere. I'm getting into people's heads and then they're like, okay, cool. When I'm talking about fungi, uh, they're talking about like kanna and illegal microdose and mood enhancing. Like they need something to grab onto and know that it's going to be the same time and time again.

Speaker A: And you're also what you're doing, which is brilliant as well, is you've tested it, the messaging to see what you actually get from reactions of people before you actually put money behind it and waste money in an ad is like you're getting the nods and, oh, I understand that. Again, the reaction from people of telling them through podcasts, through interactions and stuff like that, which is another really smart thing to do, which again is a lot of brands will go, well, we'll just test it through ads. You're like, yeah, you're going to spend a lot of money. You could do that. You're going to spend a lot of money doing that, but you can do that. Or there's a simpler way to do that too.

Speaker B: Exactly. And I think Gary Vaynerchuk, I mean, he's like brilliant marketer and he talks about this a lot too. You take your content that's performing well organically, your emails that are performing well organically, and that's what you turn into an ad. Right? Like, it's basic, like, use like the organic audience and go from there. I have a small following, but like a following enough where I can test a lot on like my own audience, just like in stories and Instagram and see what's resonating with people. And then on top of that, like, we also had a second. We have another brand called Function, which started long before fungi did. And we have products with kanna in it and we had products with mushrooms in it. So we were able to already start testing out the audience and see what was resonating with people. And we did this like giant tour where we partnered with Daybreaker and we went to like 14 different cities over the course of a year. And we're talking to thousands of people trying to basically pitch them the free samples of our products that we were giving out. And by doing that, we were again then able to say, okay, what's actually resonating with people? And we learned really quickly, wow, you say mushrooms, even if it's like a functional mushroom and people think they're going to get high, like, you have to help them feel safe. The number of people that didn't want to try, like our super legal. You don't even feel it like mood boosting tank shoes because they're like, oh, I have to drive later. Was essential, astounding to us. It just example of like, oh, wow, like, really have to bring this down another notch.

Speaker C: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah, no. Good. Okay. So before I want to just move on to the little thing here, what we talked about briefly before we started hitting recording here, and you were talking, Phoebe, about positioning. And I want to come back to this because it was spot on and something that I think is really important for other founders, other brands to hear. But why don't you give us your little, uh, your take on positioning, brand position as it relates to Fun Guy and how that's helped you guys with again in the handful of months, started to break out here and build a lot of momentum.

Speaker B: Yeah. So what I was saying is that you have to be different. You have to do something controversial. You have to start a conversation. If you are doing what everyone else is doing, no one cares. You really have to be different. And so what we did on our website when we launched, we still have it, is we call our products Euphoric Social lubricants. Social lubricant is a polarizing term to say out loud. Even before we launched, we kind of went back and forth on it and I was like, no, we have to do it. You need to give some people something to talk about. And people absolutely talk about it, which is amazing. People are like, a lubricant lube. Like, what, how am I going to use this? Like, exactly. Who doesn't want to be lubricated when they go out into a social setting? And so we've kind of like doubled down on that again and again. And thankfully people really love it. Yeah. Anything you want to add on that?

Speaker C: No, I thought it was. Yeah. Went back and forth for a while there. It's really hard like that. And it's like, even the other one where we were like, we're getting really advantageous. Promote like selling it as nature's mdma. Because like, comma, plan, uh, is kind of known as nature's MD is the same class as mdma. It happens to be fully legal. So it's like, why not ride off that? Because you're. You say mdma, you're going to. People are going to be like, what? How are you doing?

Speaker B: Ah, yeah.

Speaker C: And then they get interest and they come in, they're like, so. Yeah. I mean, it had a way to kind of like get. Capture people's. By using stuff like that.

Speaker A: We're all so distracted. We have so many things hitting us at the day. Like the number one goal of marketing first is to capture attention. Right. At least to get. To just stop them in the tracks for a second to go, what was that? And then to pull their Attention so that you can inform them and educate them. You can't do that unless. And get them the product that can help them. Unless you can actually stop them in the tracks and get them to go, wait a minute, what is this?

Speaker B: So, and I remember I was told this. My background's in journalism. I m used to be a journalist. Like I was breaking news reporter. Like I love storytelling. Yeah, yeah, it makes a lot of sense now. But I remember one of my editors and he was like this 80 year old guy, like living in Boston, like super intense attitude. And I was like writing all these stories and I was really nervous because I had this amazing story. But it was like really polarizing. Like I knew I was going to piss a lot of people off and it was a real story. I wasn't fabricating anything. And he goes, phoebe, I'm going to tell you something. And I was like, okay, what? He goes, if you were for everyone, you are for no one. And I was like, oh my God, that is so true. It's like when you try to please everyone, you are absolutely for no one. And what are you actually doing? Like, you're not really telling stories, you're not pushing the label, you're not pushing anything forward. Like the most amazing things in the world are always controversial and you can't be scared of that because when you're not for someone, you're absolutely for someone else. And we have to create products in the CPG space that aren't going to be for everyone. Right. That's how we have healthy competition and that I think that's what we really are believing in here.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker A: And so many brands get. Because it's easy to. There's that it's so hard to fight this. We all have to fight it of the pie so much bigger. But if I say, if I have a message that's more democratic or like a little bit more tamed down, I'll reach more people. Except for no you won't. Like it's counterintuitive because you won't be seen. You're just going to be stuck in the sea of masses. You're going to look and sound like everybody else. And yeah, I mean there's so many things you're saying and I'm like, oh, this is the stuff I say all the time too, right? Yeah, this is exactly it. Which is, yeah, don't like one, don't be better. If you're playing the better game, you're. The game's already over because that means someone else already owns the Category owns. Owns it in people's mind. So don't be better be different. So create. And that can be through your product, through your marketing, through that, your branding. But whatever it is, like, you have to be different. And yeah, 100% the friend, everyone friend to know. And that's how I say it. But your journalist guy there had a good saying as well too there.

Speaker B: So it was so good. It completely changed my perspective. And then I remember the article came out and, like, people loved it. It was so intense. And there were people who were, like, really upset about it, but it got something like 10 more clicks than anything else.

Speaker A: I mean, I feel like when I'm doing this stuff and I don't know, you guys feel this too, but, like, I feel like I know I have something there. If I had a gut feeling in my stomach before I hit send on an email or something, I'm like, I don't know, how's this gonna go? Like, if I have that feeling, I'm like, I think this is gonna be good. Otherwise, it's just like, uh, there's not everything you can do can be controversial or get your butterflies going, but if you're doing that, like a decent amount, that's a good sign. And if you're not, like, you should check that.

Speaker C: Right?

Speaker A: Like. Cause what are you doing to actually stand out?

Speaker B: Exactly. Exactly. I think that's definitely how we feel. One of, like, our strategies, at least while we were just testing out our products, is we were making everything by hand and then going to festivals all over the country and l. Handing out samples, being like, hey, this is like nature's mdma. Are you taking MDMA tonight? Take this instead. Tell us how you feel. And just like, really, really being out there with it. And it was super cool because it captured people's attention. They were like, what are you giving me? And then two people were actually feeling it, and then three people were coming back for more. And then by doing that and, like, actually talking to human beings again and again and again, you start to understand what's going to resonate and not. And I think one of the big issues that I see within marketing for brands is we get so, so focused and bogged down on data. And it's like, at the end of the day, we are human beings. We're not machines, we're not data. Like, I don't care. You've got to get out there and talk to your customers. You have to talk to the human.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, it's Phoebe. We're on the same wavelength. Here I do a lot of customer interviews for stuff, but I always find that, like. Like, some people would be like, well, why are you doing customer interviews? I'm like, because I've had so many times where interviewing customers, they will tell me, I will find out new ways of. Ways to find these people. So new channels. They will tell you. They will say things to you that can be word for word, an exact script you can use in an ad in the, uh, email and social media, what to put on your website. They will give you new ideas for how to reach them. They will give you ideas of the concerns they had, of why they did. Why they almost didn't buy that you need to address. Because if they're having these concerns and it's not being addressed, other customers having the problem too, and you're losing customers because of that too. So, yeah, talking to people is the first thing I always find is like, the first thing to do in the first place to start on this kind of stuff.

Speaker B: I think it's the reason I love events so much. I'll share one story. So I was at an event four days ago, and I was just, like, handing out some samples for, like, this fun, like, yoga sculpt event. And the. I'm handing out the sample and the guy goes, fungi? And I was like, yeah. And I was like, it's like, kanna. Like, I can explain what Kanna is. He's like, no, I know. I bought, like, $200 worth of product. And I was like, wait, what? And this would have never happened in an email or a DM or anything. And he just launches into the story. Have I told you this yet? Where he goes, I was in a car accident. Like, and I have had terrible PTSD and, like, terrible stress. And, like, I used to drink all the time, and I can't do that. And a, uh, friend just, like, introduced me to your gummies, and I ate one of them and I felt it. And I've been taking them every single day, and it's completely changed my life. And, like, thank you so much for what you're creating. And he's, like, going into the story, and I'm, like, on the verge of tears. And I'm also like, oh, my God. Like, this is why we're doing what we're doing. Like, thank you so much for sharing this. He's like, yeah, I love your product. I was like, well, have you left a review? Like, do you follow? He's like, no, no, I just buy it. And I'm like, this is what I'm talking about, like, the real customers. They don't actually care. They're not going to review, they're not going to do anything. Just going to keep buying it again and again. And it's like, it's such a beautiful reminder of, like, we are human beings.

Speaker A: Yeah, George, I must make you feel pretty good here and stuff like that

Speaker C: when I get that same way, too. It's like, I have so many products that I love and I use every day. It's like, I can't test that. It's like, I don't go on and write reviews because it's just like, I don't think about it. It's like, yeah, I love this. I take it. But it's like sometimes it's like you don't really, like, I don't like going on my computer and letting writing a review unless, like, someone, like, prompts me or is like, hey, can you really do this for me? It's like, if someone asked me to do it, like, I will. But it's not like an initial thing where, like, I feel like people are more inclined to go write a review if they had a bad experience.

Speaker B: Yes.

Speaker A: Okay, so I want anybody listening to this right now. We're going to stop for a second, press pause on the podcast. We're going to go to a brand that you love and you buy from routinely but haven't left a review. Let's take a second, go, leave a review and then come back to this. Okay, we're going to pause for a sec. Okay, we're back. I've actually since going off on my own and building my own business doing this kind of stuff, I've actually been not great at it, but I'm way more. Put a way more concerted effort knowing, uh, how hard it is to build a brand that, like, man, the least I can do if I'm buying product from you on a routine basis. I'm starting to leave reviews more and more just because, like, I know how hard it is and I know how helpful it is too, for these brands. Like, even just one little review can be a big deal.

Speaker B: Really can.

Speaker C: It really can move forward here with

Speaker A: a couple of different things. And we're going to move into the lighting round here in a sec. But going back to the idea of, you know, being different, you have a unique product, you have a unique brand you've been building. But I'd like to know about maybe an uncommon marketing strategy you guys use that has had great success. I mean, most people go, oh, we go to ads, we go to this blah, blah, blah, blah, maybe. But something that's a little bit different you've done that has had surprising results for y'.

Speaker B: All.

Speaker C: I feel like uncommon was just like, building this psychedelic, like, psychedelic inspired brand first before launching it. Uh, where it's like, people saw that brand name and recognized it because they're instantly relating it to psychedelics. So it's like building that brand name first and that recognition. Yeah, for really launching it. Then I, like, that was. The tactic was to, like, create this known and trusted brand that when we were ready to actually launch with something a little different, people were like, oh, I know that. And it worked. Like, people, they saw that and they were interested and they want to know, yeah, good.

Speaker B: And this is not as sexy, but it still worked. So on function, we have tinctures and, uh, like, they were selling okay, but not, like, astronomically. And I had this thought of, like, let's just launch the tinctures under fungi branding. Like, people love fungi. Let's just try it. So we labeled them, we put them under fungi branding, we gave them sexy names. The mushroom elixir became perform, and the Kana Elixir became mellow. And we just literally put them on the website without another thought, did not change a single word of any other branding, Just copy and paste it from the website and they started selling. Day one with no promotion whatsoever. And I think a big thing and, like, I think it's called the sunken cost fallacies. You think you've invested so much and, like, you have to keep doing it. Like, no, like, if it's not working, it's not working and switch gears and, like, it wasn't really working the way we wanted it to. And so we just just switched it and put it on the fungi website and people started eating it up. Like, sometimes it is just the branding, sometimes it is just the timing, the positioning. And the more you can just surrender to that and stop pushing when it's not working, I think the better everyone's business will be.

Speaker A: Awesome. That's great. All right, last question here before lightning round that, you know, a lot of times we're talking about what to do, what you should do, what's good, what works, that kind of stuff. But oftentimes I actually find that knowing what not to do is actually some of the best stuff that we can learn and avoid as we're building our brand. So maybe what is something you guys would not do again, as it relates to either your product, your marketing, or just building your business that you're like, we did that. We would definitely not do that again.

Speaker B: Okay. I actually have one. So there are some stores where you can like, basically pay to play and be a part of it. If you don't have a ton of cash, don't do it. Like, absolutely don't do it. There's been times we're like, oh, okay, it'll get us visibility. But, like, you are competing so much for brands that have a way bigger name for you. Unless you have a ton of cash, don't do it. Focus on small things that actually have an roi. Like, we definitely wouldn't do that again. We also, we launched not thinking that we would do very well and we sold out and we weren't ready to go back into production and we were sold out for like two and a half months. And then we pre sold thousands of units, which was insane, in like two months. And then when everything finally came in, we started running out of packaging. So be prepared. Be really, really prepared and expect that you're going to do really well instead of expecting that you're not going to do that well, because that definitely threw us off. And then also, don't ship chocolate in the summer without ice.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And that was a really fun learning lesson. We had a two weeks where suddenly we had like 700 pre orders that we had to go out over the course of four days and suddenly was like the hottest weekend on record and we had no ice and we had no idea what to do. And it was such a beautiful learning lesson and like startup life to a T, you know, we're like literally running around the office handpacking orders till like 2 o' clock in the morning. Like, oh, my God, how are you going to make this happen? But we made it through and people love their chocolate even if it was melted. Someone sent me a video of them opening it being like, whatever, it's a trip and like literally lick m. Great. As long as you're happy, I'm happy.

Speaker A: Hey, that's how you have a good product when there's a mistake with the product and still people. People still love it. Right. So maybe that's an offshoot product. That'll be. The next line is not chocolate bars. It's chocolate syrup is coming up next.

Speaker B: Honestly, I've actually wanted to do that. I've made like psychedelic ice cream before and then I've made content. You actually make Connor infused, like stuffed dates. And then I melt kind of chocolate and pour it on top. It was really fun.

Speaker A: Love it. All right, lightning round, you guys. Ready for this Is, this is action packed, high pressure situation here.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: All right. One fun fact about mushrooms many people don't know.

Speaker B: I think a really fun fact about mushrooms is that until literally two years ago, they had zero environmental protections. So people could go into a forest and they would say like, oh hey, there's endangered plants or animals here so you can't tear it down. If they were endangered or rare mushrooms, it didn't matter. They had no environmental protections. And that's only changed recently thanks to Fungi foundation and Juliana who's doing incredible work in Chile.

Speaker C: So I was going to say fun fact is, ah, that mushrooms are more closely related to humans and animals than plants. People don't know.

Speaker B: That's a really fun fact here.

Speaker A: That's a little bit mind blowing. Yes. Okay. Wow. Okay, that's cool. All right, let's see. Maybe a memorable experience you had while enjoying one of your fun guy chocolates.

Speaker B: So many economies chocolates. Yeah.

Speaker C: Snowboarding. Honestly the first time when we, I really started see it like noticing Phoebe's formula with Econo as we were, I was snowboarding preseason and just had like, I think it was like first run as we were going up on the chairlift after the first 1/2 one going back up and then I was just like, I was just doing my normal thing like warm up runs and stuff. And then I just like, I like to like weave in our uh, trails and like boost off the side hits. And then I just noticed I was like, I just launched and like as soon as I caught air and I was up in the air and felt it and landed. I just like felt like I just like I knew like my next five moves before. Usually I'm like, I'm thinking of what I'm gonna do as I'm going up and I was just like zoned in and everything was just flowing like I was in a video game. I was just like landing and stomping everything like I just wasn't thinking of it.

Speaker A: M. That's awesome.

Speaker C: Oh, what is this? I felt like I just had like.

Speaker A: How about you? Memorable moment.

Speaker B: I love that story. I think my favorite recent memory is I just hiked the Camino de Santiago, which is an ancient pilgrimage in the north of San Spain. I hit 200 miles by myself. Yeah, it was really amazing. And I brought a lot of Hana chocolates and fruit trees with me. One of my favorites was we had a 22 mile day and it was pouring down rain the entire time and I was walking with like three friends that I made 22 miles in the pouring down rain. Not fun. And we all took Khan of chocolate. And like 45 minutes in, we, uh, are giggling, like almost peeing ourselves. Giggling even though we're drenched in rain. We're in the middle of nowhere. We can't 55ft in front of us. And it was just the best day ever. Like, we bonded so deeply and they're now friends for life.

Speaker A: That's awesome.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: All right, last one here and we'll get you guys out of here. One piece of advice for other founders listening to this.

Speaker C: Be careful about who you hire for work. Whether it's hiring friends or just having or better discernment about hiring for help.

Speaker B: That's a really good.

Speaker C: Yeah, sometimes you can just have bad seeds that hold you down.

Speaker A: Have you found qualities that you guys are looking for within hiring people?

Speaker B: Passion.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker B: Got to be really passionate and really reliable. Yeah, I think those are two of the biggest things. And like a, uh, good head on your shoulders. Like, you don't have to have a massive background, but like, you got to have common sense and like, be a critical thinker. If you can do that and you can problem solve, you'll be successful in this world. Right. So I think those are really big things. And just being really passionate. I'm very passionate and so people can't match that. I'm like, okay, what's going on? Like, where is the fire?

Speaker A: I think you're saying it too, but I'll add this to what you're saying there about the reliable also. I'll also add proactive, uh, like, especially you guys being founders, you don't have to be hovering over people, telling them what to do all the time. Like, that's. You guys already have enough stuff going on. I've seen it with other founders, other businesses where they're just like, they got employees. You're like, I'm basically doing this job for him now, her or whatever. And like, it's dry back nuts, right?

Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker C: Like, it's huge.

Speaker B: I think my one piece of advice is you have to be like, and excuse this language, but you have to be erotically obsessed with your business and your product. If you're not, what are you doing? Like, truly, truly. Like, you need to be the one that's talking about it so much that everyone's annoyed. Like, I know anytime I come to a party, people know I'm bringing Kana. And people like, oh my God, Kana girl is here and she's going to talk about like, uh, that's the job but you're going to start a business, be erotically obsessed with what you do and never, never let it fade.

Speaker A: Don't let until you're Coca Cola and ubiquitous. You got to be talking about it all the time.

Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. I think it's so interesting. Like, people get shy and it's like, no, be obsessed. Like, it's your business, it's your baby.

Speaker A: So, yeah, they can help people. If you can help people, you're doing them m a disservice by not letting them know about it.

Speaker C: Yeah. Love it.

Speaker A: All right, so guys, tell us where can we find more about your brands?

Speaker B: So fungi.com f u n g u y and then at fungi is our Instagram account. You can find our Twitter, it's at hey, Fungi as well. And then, George, your Instagram, if people want to find you a personal or

Speaker C: are we getting business?

Speaker B: I mean, we already did the business. I'll get my personal.

Speaker C: Yeah, uh, my personal. Instagram's G underscore M M O u L T N. Um, we'll put it

Speaker B: in the show notes.

Speaker C: Yeah, that's usually where if you answer. I'm not huge on social media. I try and just be present in my everyday life. I just only really go on when I need to.

Speaker A: Maybe one time you'll share a little snowboarding adventure with us.

Speaker C: Oh, no. At least that's the only time snowboarded. I don't want to go on and post my like because I love making like local video reels of it when I'm in my element and doing my thing. So it's like the only time I really gone is when I make a fun video and post it and then I'm out.

Speaker A: Love it, Phoebe.

Speaker B: And then it's at underscore Phoebe, underscore McPherson. And we'll put it in the show notes. But if you go to my Instagram, I have a bunch of pin content all about Connor, all about mushrooms. You can find tons of educational content there. And then I also have a text only number if people have questions about mushrooms, psychedelics or Connor or. So you can always text me and I can guide you either to find one of our products or another company that might be a better fit for you.

Speaker A: Awesome. Well, appreciate you guys coming on the show. This has been awesome.

Speaker B: Thank you so much. We love the conversation.

Speaker A: Thanks for listening to the Uncommon Brands podcast. I hope you enjoyed today's episode, gained new insights, and are inspired to take one idea you heard from the episode and implement it into your business. Don't forget to subscribe to the show and leave us a review you and join us next time as we uncover how the next wave of up and coming consumer brands are building an uncommon brand.