Ep 167: A Path for Veterans

Speaker A: Everybody who's a manager at within 84, 99% of them have started entry level with us. So you create this culture from within and just promote those people from within.

Speaker B: Uh, welcome to Builder Nuggets, hosted by Dwayne Johns and Dave Young.

Speaker C: In each episode, our guests share powerful messages and inspiring stories that elevate all of us.

Speaker B: It's collaboration over competition. Our guests today work for 84 Lumber. One is director of talent acquisition, has been leading the central stores with over 15 years of experience in the field. The other is a former Marine who conducted operations across Africa and the Mediterranean before retiring and applying for his third job ever at 84 Lumber in 1998. He worked his way up through the ranks, holding numerous positions, and is now a national director of multifamily here today

Speaker C: to share why they focus on hiring veterans and why those veterans make the best employees. Uh, it's our pleasure to welcome Joe, Jenna and Jason Hinskin to today's show. Welcome, Joe and Jason.

Speaker A: Good to be here.

Speaker D: Thank you for having us.

Speaker B: So, guys, 84 Lumber has been a great contributor to the Builder Nuggets podcast and the community. We've had David Fisher on to discuss some creative approaches to recruiting great talent. Christy Powell and Judy Dunnell to discuss diversity. And now you guys so certainly appreciate your time. So where are. Maybe let's start with Joe there. Where. Where are you guys located today?

Speaker D: So I am at, uh, just outside of our headquarters in 84 Pennsylvania, so about 25 minutes outside of Pittsburgh.

Speaker B: Very cool. Jason, outside of being in an airport lounge, where do you regularly report from?

Speaker A: Um, usually from an airport lounge, as crazy as that might sound. Ah, I spent most of my life on a plane, but. But, um, I'm actually on my way to the Fisher House Foundation. It's a veterans organization, not for profit, that, um, essentially lets families of military, uh, folks stay near veterans, uh, hospital or near a military base while they're having surgery done. So we actually build those and donate a lot of time and material to that organization. So I'm in Chicago for their hundredth Fisher, uh, house there. There's a ceremony tomorrow. So it's pretty, pretty exciting being a veteran to go there and kind of be part of that.

Speaker B: I bet that sounds. That sounds pretty awesome. Thank you again for that. Thank you for your service. Why don't you guys maybe give us a little backstory on each of you know, how you got involved in the industry, uh, what led you, you know, to where you are today. Just give us a little setup.

Speaker A: I, uh, I got out of the military and uh, needed a job, needed a career, needed a place to kind of plant roots and kind of get things started. So I applied at a bunch of different jobs and what I found out real quick was, you know, I was in the infantry, in the Marine Corps. And uh, I guess blowing things up wasn't uh, a very good transferable job skill. So um, I had to fall back on my personality. So um, what I found out pretty quick is that I could sell things. So I started applying for sales jobs. And 84 Lumber offered a career path that basically said, um, you'll get out what you'll put in. So I said, well, so what you're telling me is all I gotta do is outwork the folks around me like my peers? They said, yeah. So, well, where do I sign up? And uh, I've been here ever since. That's it in a nutshell. Kind of a quick, uh.

Speaker C: And uh, what's your specialty now, your role? Uh, how do you add value to the 84 team?

Speaker A: I've got this title, but, you know, I just moved the title over to the side. I, I just bring people together. That's, that's what I tell everybody. That's my job is, you know, I just bring people together. Whether it be General contractors to 84, uh, whether it bring uh, entry level folks from military, uh, or college to a career, I just put people together full time. So sometimes it's sales, sometimes it's hiring. That's my role today. If I answer the question. I don't know if I answered the question or not.

Speaker B: Yeah, I think certainly, you know, connector. We, we talk about it many, many times on this show and uh, with the builders or models we work with all the time. You know, it's uh, we're in the people business. You know, it's all about relationships. It's not the sticks and the bricks and all that stuff. I mean, yeah, that's part of it, but uh, certainly it's the relationship stuff.

Speaker D: So.

Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, I think people do business with people they know like, and trust. And that's, that's my, that's my mantra. That's what I go to every time I have a meeting with customers or do a conference in different places. Yeah, you know me like me and trust me, it's kind of hard not to do business with me.

Speaker B: Cool. Joe, how about you?

Speaker D: So I've been in the uh, recruiting space for about 15 years now. Joined 84 about 5 1/2 years ago now. I started out as a recruiter and have been promoted twice. And five years that I've been here, I head up our, uh, talent acquisition teams for our central division stores, our components manufacturing, and then our headquarters back office support positions. Um, and just to Jason's point, I definitely think we're a people company. A lot of the skills that we have or expect from our individuals, we can teach them. If you come to work, work hard, you can really kind of put a, find a career here and be able to really grow and move up with the company.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, uh, either one of you can answer this question, but I'm familiar with 84. Like I said, we've had guests on. I've known Judy Dunnell for quite a while through NHB and a few other things. You know, there's certainly a culture there. It's uh, it's a little bit, uh, infectious. You know, people, people can tell you guys are certainly, uh, like a big family. What, what is it? I mean, what's the secret sauce over there?

Speaker A: I think from, you know, from Frank Cicero who runs the company, to your entry level manager trainee. We're all kind of, we all drink from the same, uh, same, same spigot. We'll say. So Frank, we started the company as a manager trainee as well. So the culture, everybody who's a manager at within 84, 99 of them have started entry level with us. So you create this culture from within and just promote those people from within. So it kind of creates uh, a uh, tight knit family. Um, like I could go from here and fly out to California to one of our new locations. I'm wearing blue, he's wearing blue. We don't, we don't even know each other, but we can have a conversation. So you just. We're a big family.

Speaker B: You know, Dave talks about a lot building the magnet. And I'm sure we'll get into more of that as we continue to talk here. But do you, outside of actively going out recruiting to find people, do you find that, that, that culture, the fact that the people that do work at 84, you know, enjoy where they are, that, that spills over to others, to where people are like, hey, I'm interested, I'd, I'd like to be a part of that group.

Speaker D: Yeah, I definitely agree with that. And I think typically when we find the individual with the uh, right skill set, that, that hard work and that determination, doing whatever it takes to get the job done, they typically stay for a very long time with the company. I mean you look at someone like Jason, success story, really Come in, kind of learn the company from the ground up, uh, and then obviously, uh, be able to grow moving forward. There is endless opportunities if you're going to work hard. The possibilities truly are endless here.

Speaker C: Joe, as a, as uh, somebody who's specialized in recruiting and has had tons of conversations with candidates, what is it that or how does an organization showcase their culture so that it can be a magnet? How do you guys get your stories out there so that people are uh, seeing them? Because culture is one of those things that a lot of people tell us, hey, you don't really understand it until you're in it. So a secret becomes, if you can portray, uh, it out in the universe, that um, you'll have a leg up on the competition. How do you get it out there?

Speaker D: Yeah, I think from our side. We do a, um, great job here at 84 partnering with our marketing team. They can really tell the success stories that we've had. I mean we've had individuals that have started in the manager training program and in two and a half years they're running their own store. So it really gives these individuals an opportunity to kind of, they're going to have the autonomy to run the stores they see fit. Obviously this falls under the 84 umbrella, but they do have a lot of opportunity to make their own decisions and really kind of be uh, a driving force with that, which a lot of companies, you can't promote that quickly to a position of leadership like that.

Speaker C: So having the, the internal growth opportunities and sharing those stories provides uh, the proof that your intended audiences need to, to make the call or to put you higher up the food chain. When they're looking at who they're going to go and invest there, you know, their, for sure their employment energy into, uh, because it really is a mutual investment. You know, how much you put in to thinking about that employee coming on board. And then there's the expectation as well that they're going to reinvest back. It only works if both parties are, are doing it, that with sort of the, the same level of intention. How do you tell who has it?

Speaker D: I think our recruiting team does a really good job on those initial calls. Really kind of being painting a clear picture of what the position is, how much hard work it's going to be and really kind of gauging if the individual is on board with that. You can typically tell pretty quickly when you tell these individuals, hey, they're going to be unloading trucks. I mean, there isn't a job at the store that they're that they might not end up uh, doing on a day to day basis. So really kind of painting that clear picture and making sure that this is something that they are ultimately going to be comfortable with. Because if you think about manager training, some of those are different kind of from company to company. It's more behind the desk. This is definitely not a behind the desk job. You were on your feet, you're talking to customers, you're building loads, you're hoping to unload trucks. You're doing everything in the store.

Speaker C: Jason? Yeah. Almost the same question. What are the traits or the hallmarks or the tells that you see that gives you the sense that somebody's got the it factor and that they're the, that they're a worthy candidate.

Speaker A: I think once we get them from uh, so the recruiters go through, do some pre screening. I think once I get candidates to kind of fit into the box what we're looking for, I always prefer to do a face to face interview. I think that's, you know, with technology we've kind of moved away from that a little bit. But if, if at all possible I can because I'm looking for, I'm looking to gauge personality. To Joe's point, you'll do a little bit everything, a lot of interaction with a lot of different types of people in a day. So gotta have a good personality and you gotta have work ethic, but you can't really tell what work ethic is until you really meet somebody and kind of go through the job. To Joe's point, you know, I compare it to a restaurant. I say, you know, you ever work in a restaurant and if the dishwasher calls in sick, the dishes are still getting done by somebody, whether it be the cook or the waitress or whoever. Um, it's very similar to that. So everybody on the team uh, contributes each day. So uh, I look for people that, that show up on time, that look the part. They look like they're showing up for, for, for an interview for a job, for or you know, not a job but for a career. You know, I'm looking for people that are career minded folks, not job hunters. Like if you want a career, let's talk. And that's what I do face to face to gauge personality, work ethic.

Speaker C: What, what types of questions work well for helping you to determine whether they're genuine in that, in that career versus job assessment. Uh, because people can, you know, get trained on how to maybe BS their way through a job interview. You guys have the experience to suss that out and really assess. Hey, are they legit? I love the dishwasher question because you're trying to find context and see how they respond to something they probably didn't expect they would be answering.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker C: What are some other questions that you guys like that think really help you to, uh, get the most out of the interview?

Speaker A: I like to go through just asking them, you know, their resume. I'll take a look at that and kind of go through their job history, ask some questions about what they did in different positions, and then I just kind of slide that off to the side, you know, that the resume is great, but I just. That just tells me what you did in the past. And then from there I just talk about what the candidate would like to do in the next five years. Like, where do you see yourself? Where do you want to be? Like, if and if that person can explain to me, um, their desire to grow and climb and build a career for himself or for his young family, uh, his or her young family, um, then that resonates with me and I say, okay, well this person has an idea of where they are today and where they want to be. And the resume kind of explains different experiences they've had. And some of those might translate into this job. So err. Into this career path. So that's how I do it.

Speaker C: Yeah. Not being, um, or interviewing somebody who doesn't know what they want or what success looks like for them is a little bit daunting because they could be relying on you to plan it out and map it out and you just don't know enough at that stage. Like the input from them is so important to give you that sense of where they could even go. Uh, and combine that with where they want to go and how you help them to get there.

Speaker A: This is where you're at today and where do you want to go? And if they don't have a path, then we talk about the ladder of opportunity within 84. And I said, well, here's a path for you.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker A: Um, get in, work hard, take your tests, pass your exams, do all your things. And then from there, what do you want to go? You want to do store operations, sales, install, you want to get into my line of work, selling big skyscrapers, things like that. You want to go to corporate office, you know what, from there. But if they can explain to me where they're at today, I can kind of help them on the path forward.

Speaker C: And sometimes, uh, and this is a good role that you play is sharing what the opportunities are. Sometimes it's okay for somebody who wants to join an operation. They don't know all the different paths that are available to them and that will, in the right cases, be exciting to them. Who wouldn't want to have options and understand what those could be? Uh, even if they were things that they hadn't understood themselves, you may be able to help them get there. It's. If they're void of any vision, uh, it's a little bit tougher because then you feel like you're gonna be pushing them instead of leading them.

Speaker A: Yeah, it's a fine line to walk between you know, pulling somebody or pushing them. It's, it's, you know, it's, it's a fine line. I do a little bit of both each day. Some sometimes I pull, sometimes I push.

Speaker B: All right, So I want to dive in. I mean, we know the challenges there are when it comes to recruiting, hiring, finding good talent, retaining good talent. You know, when we had originally reached out, uh, you guys were really focused on, hey, the fact of bringing in, you know, veterans is, uh, getting them on the team. So let's just dive into that. Tell us what, what took you down? I mean, I sort of know what took you down that path, especially you, Jason. But I mean, what, what was the real, uh, I would say maybe light bulb moment that was like, man, this is, this is something we really got to pursue.

Speaker D: I think the big thing from m our perspective is though, we've seen a lot of individuals that have come in from the military community and really thrive in our culture. A lot of the same aspects from the military are set up within 84. So they come in, they kind of already understand the culture a little bit. Um, we've notice for individuals that might not have military experience, it's a little bit of a culture shock with coming into 84. So with these individuals already having kind of that understanding, it just sets them up better for success with us.

Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. I think with, I'll go back to that personality and work ethic then. You know, I think a lot of military folks, you know, if I'm interviewing a 23 year old young man or woman, um, that's just out of the military, or a young 23 year old man or woman either just in college looking for a career path. Some of the military folks come kind of preloaded with those two things. So the ability to communicate effectively is extremely important in anything you do in life, especially when you're part of a sales company, which is 84. And that work ethic thing too, like I just know what I get out of military folks. I know that that's, that's there because you get up before I tell folks. When I was in the Marine Corps, you know, I've done more before 8 o' clock in the morning than most people have done all day. And 84 is not much different than that. Like you get there early before the sun rises and you watch the sun rise as you're putting a load on the truck and then you go in and bring out some material and then, you know. So I think that a lot of military folks, they bring that those two tangible things, personality and work ethic, they just, they just have it.

Speaker C: We do more before 8am than most people do all, uh, day. Would be a great advertising campaign, wouldn't it? Great slogan. Yeah,

Speaker A: I'm giving away some of my secrets here, you know, but that's part of. No, no, my process.

Speaker C: No, that's good. The flip side of that, I mean clearly, you know, people need to under. Understand the role expectations, communication, all that sort of thing. What aspects would you say, um, are different from what you've valued in the military or not? Weren't present in the military? Like how would you say, or how would you describe the differences? There are some fundamentals that you shared that were, that, that resemble things that work in the military. What are some of the differences?

Speaker A: Well, I'd say back in the, I started back in the 90s and I'd say that, you know, I kind of joke around a lot of people. I say that the main difference between 84 and the marine Corps is I no longer carry an M16. It's very, you uh, know, it's, there's, there's a rank structure. It's very. It. For me it just fit because I got out of one and got into another with, with rank structure, with culture, with, with you know, you have to shave every day all. It's very similar, very similar to the military. So for me it just fit. I don't know if I answered the question or went off on a different tangent there, but.

Speaker C: Well, to me that sounds like some more of the, the similarities or the things that you're seeing line up. And I was wondering like things that maybe people would typically associate with military in terms of lack of autonomy or creativity or some, some of the, maybe some that could be considered stereotypical. Right. Or that they haven't been exposed to that people in the military may be able to answer that a little bit better. And that's kind of why I've asked how Do. How do people get to put their own stamp on, on the experience that they have there within that military like or that similar structure? Because you know, people want to grow. We know that they want to be involved, uh, they like to have autonomy, they want to be able to master something. They want to have a shared purpose that they're all going towards. And sometimes people can feel like they're being pigeonholed. How do you guys break through that but still adhering to some of the value that you've brought from your military experience?

Speaker A: Yeah, I'll say just to finish my last point or kind of move on from that point. While it is, ah, um, a very structured organization, each individual is challenged to drive themselves for their own personal success. So there's a lot of one on one training that happens. There's a lot of one on one opportunities for each manager trainee and above to actually stand out amongst his peers, his or her peers. It's not, you're just lumped into, everybody's wearing camis. It's, you know, it's still separate. It's a cultural thing, but it's still an individual. It's a company that awards people on individual performance. So you do get recognized when you, when you succeed, when you do things better. Like it's um, we're a company that basically teaches extraordinary things to ordinary people and you just kind of grow from there. So it does provide a lot of individual opportunities for, for to not be pigeonholed into a specific position.

Speaker C: Yeah, that explains it. Thanks. M. Um, want to turn your nuggets into pure gold.

Speaker B: Connect with us and the builder Nuggets community on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn or BuilderNuggets.com. yeah, this is, I guess it'll be two questions. It's the same question I'm just going to be asked of different people. I mean one, for the small builders out there, remodelers, um, if they're looking to attract veterans and ultimately, you know, retain them, what do they need? What do they need to be thinking about? Because something like you said, I mean I could, I would imagine that a company that's maybe a bit chaotic and doesn't have structure may not be that appealing to a veteran. Right. So I mean, what. Yeah, just lay out some things that companies could do to attract, uh, and retain.

Speaker D: Yeah, I think one of the big things is to really make sure that you're getting your story out there. A lot of these individuals that are coming out of the military are wondering how are their skills going to be transferable to A civilian lifestyle. So really being able to kind of show that value, hey, here's what our company does, here's what we believe in, here's where you can kind of grow and move into. I think it's just, it's very important to kind of show that um, that value and how they can make a difference in your company.

Speaker A: Yeah. Transferable job skills. To your point, like, like I said earlier, like I, I was a mortarman in the Marine Corps, I blew things up. So what's transferable? What kind of military skills do I have that are transferable? It's not that, it's the other parts. It's the people skills, it's the interactions. It's, you know, you know, I would tell, you know, have, have that type of a conversation with folks about what job skills are transferable from what they did in the military to what they did or what you want them to do in your company. And I think to the structure point, I think military or non military folks, I think everybody craves a little bit of structure in their lives. You have to have a path. There's got to be opportunities for growth. So I think having a structure with a clear cut path for growth to make more money and have success, I think a lot of men and women would look for, uh, getting out of the military, coming to smaller model or general contract.

Speaker C: It's interesting too, Dwayne. You know, you talk about maybe they wouldn't necessarily want to come to a company that didn't have that structure in place, but if you were to flip that the opportunity is to come in and help a company install some of that structure or put some of that into their culture, that could be a real need. And the exact reason why somebody with this background, uh, that thrives in that could bring some of what they learned to the table. And, and if you combine that with, and you know, you guys can probably share a little more context around this. But what you see in terms of a leadership mindset coming from this because the best leaders can also be, can accept leadership. And when you spread the leadership around for different areas of expertise, you get a bit of a magic potion. Uh, there it strikes me that there's lots, there's opportunity to lead. When you come in and you learn first, I'd agree.

Speaker A: I think if you come in, you learn, you know, to speak of 84, to speak of a general contractor's company, um, come into the company, learn the processes and procedures and then eventually somewhere down the road that owner or someone with an organization is going to say, what can we do better here? You know, you've been in roles before, you've been in positions of leadership, you've been a platoon commander or whatever it might have been, or a squad leader. Um, what would you do differently? And those, those questions get asked of military folks within our company or within general contractors company. You know, I do these conferences. I go meet people in different markets and we do like this 15, 20 minute speed dating session. And a lot of the folks I meet with are former military people and they're looking to meet with companies to expand with. So it's, it's kind of like I said, I bring people together. That's, that's what we do primarily.

Speaker C: So it's such a better conversation when it's what could we do better versus what did you do wrong? Um, because it's usually that's when everybody clams up. But if you all look at it, what could we each have done? That's when you find those ownership moments and it brings the group together.

Speaker B: So to flip this question for veterans, what do veterans have to be thinking about if they want to break into the, the construction industry? What? Maybe, maybe, uh, either misconception or maybe what they don't know.

Speaker D: I think being willing to take risks kind of get outside of your comfort zone. There's a, a lot of companies desire the skill sets that you learned with your, your service, um, and your, what you learn is definitely going to be transferable. It might not be something that's written on a job description, but a lot of the stuff where you might be handling a pressure situation, obviously in the military, you probably handle those all the time. So you're going to thrive in a situation like that and you're going to deal with that, um, in your civilian lifestyle as well too. Um, I just think really being able to kind of think outside of that comfort zone, take risks and know that the skill sets that you have are going to be valued by employers.

Speaker C: So don't lead with, I'm looking to blow things up like Jason. Right. It's the transferable people skills. Unless you're going into the demolition side of things and you're, you know, you're dropping the tower at Sands in Las Vegas. Uh, you know, but that's a really good way to describe it, Joe. It's create, uh, a relatability around whether it's your communication skills, your leadership skills, your. That if it's a job that requires rigid adherence to protocol or safety, and you've been and you've had that, you know and you've had to be the steward of safety for your, for a team or in scenarios tell your stories and uh, just understand what stories to tell and then let the employer gravitate towards those are the things that we need and they'll be able to tell you. And then if there's a piece missing, like you know, maybe it is on more on the construction side or it could be in on the technology side, whatever, whatever it is, they can at least share with uh, the candidate what the path would be for them to get that. But get in the room first and tell your story. Learn how to tell the right stories and then just make yourself undeniable that way and the company will tell you how they would do it. Again, it turns into a collaboration.

Speaker A: Yeah. And I think for employers also with trying to veterans looking to get into the construction field also talk about the opportunities for income because I think in some instances uh, folks look at construction uh, as um, I'm going to work hard, long hours and I'm not going to get paid as much as I should. So some folks kind of shy away from that. But I always talk about your opportunity for income in the construction field. No matter if you're, you're doing wood like us or you're a plumber, electrician, mason, there's a lot of money and opportunity to be made out there in the construction field.

Speaker C: Yeah. There is a fear certainly, and it's existed for a long time that you're going to be treated like a commodity. It's just a, ah, work to the bone sort of thing. You're trading time for money. So if you don't act like a commodity, uh, and you ask questions about growth and opportunity, uh, you can find out if that exists in a company like Duane and I with the, with the companies we work with, people may come on board as a, as a carpenter or as a project manager, but we can work with them to share that there's a career path that could bring them to ownership, fractional ownership in a company, full ownership, multiple offices. We've seen people go from what you would say maybe is an entry level position to you know, really powerful leadership position and ownership roles. So it's up to the employer too to be able to have that path. Um, and not, not, not just be a cog in the wheel.

Speaker A: Yeah. If you think about it, you get out of the military, you get out of college, you know, and the way I look at a lot of those is you're kind of on the same path. Because if I Have to teach you what a 2x4 is and how to. How to do a takeoff on a garage. Like, everybody kind of starts at the same place. And so you start, you learn how to do the block and tackle. Basic block and tackle functions. In this industry, at least in our industry, you learn that. Just like with a gc, you learn his basic block and tackle functions. And then from there, the sky's the limit. So now you know how the cake is made. So now you can take a higher level of responsibility within our company and make more money. So I always talk about selling the dream and the path. Like, what's the path to make more money? How do I get there? How does. How does a, uh, uh, young, uh, man or woman get out of the military, come to a general contractor or material supply company like 84? And how do I make. How do I get. How do I make money here? Like, where do I start and how do I get there? So I bit of selling the dream too, you know.

Speaker B: Yeah, it's important. I mean, I think it's underestimated sometimes by business owners how important it is that people want to know what is that path? What's the opportunity ahead of them? So I think that's a really good point. All right, I'm going to ask both of you separately. We ask of all of our guests, and you can answer this any way you want. It could be either personally or professionally. But when you think about what's coming up over the next six months to a year, what excites you?

Speaker D: I would say from a professional standpoint, um, growth. I know we, uh, here at 84 are, uh, obviously still in growth mode. We are in 33 different states now. Um, we have plans that continue to grow over the years. So obviously to be able to successfully get these locations off the ground and running, we need to make sure that we have adequate staffing, good individuals, individuals that can promote, stay long term and be able to help drive business out there. So I, uh, know our teams have a lot of work here to making sure that we have the right individuals in that place. So, uh, that's definitely something that gets, uh, me up and is exciting moving forward.

Speaker C: And that's on the professional side. Our audience always loves to know a little bit extra about the guests personally. What's something you're personally excited about that's coming up in the next little while? And this can be anything.

Speaker D: Uh, my wife and I are planning a trip to, uh, Las Vegas in February. So that's something I'm looking forward to.

Speaker B: Is that for the builder show?

Speaker D: No, just leisure, Dwayne. Just leisure.

Speaker C: Just leisure.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker C: Dwayne's so romantic. You know, I was going to say,

Speaker B: uh, how did you pull that off?

Speaker C: You know, let's go to a builder show, baby.

Speaker B: Yeah, how did you pull that off?

Speaker A: Hey, I do it every year. I tie it together, I bring my parents out.

Speaker C: Yeah, that's a, that's a smart move too. So. So Jason, what's something that you're uh,

Speaker A: looking forward to, I'd say personally? So I've got um, next, next, uh, Saturday is my, my grandson's two year birthday. So I got a couple grandkids that have literally, I'd say in the past year and a half just kind of, kind of consumed a lot of my spare time and gladly glad that I love them to death, you know. So I'm excited to spend uh, uh, a Christmas coming up with them. Um, his birthday, his sister's birthday's coming up. So I'm just excited about family things, you know, family, you know, health, health of my, you know, my, my wife has some health issues. She's, she's doing a lot better with. So I'm happy to spend time with family more than anything on my time off. So whether that's, maybe that's a little boring. I'll probably be out the builder show in February. That'll be my Vegas trip. Um, so we'll travel out there. But I'd say you know, professionally, you know, I think um, you know, for what I do is I have uh, about 16 teams of multi family construction professionals located in different parts of the country. Country. And our sole focus of business is multi family. So while 84's primary core business is single family, you know I, I oversee the, the branch of multi family construction for our group. So what I'm really excited about is you know, interest rates have kind of come off a little bit which uh, is starting to feel a lot more interest in that, that apartment, um, industry side of things. Um, that's starting to pick back up again but went through a little bit of a slowdown, uh, but I see it picking up a bit more and uh, that's good for people who need housing the nation short million. I don't know how many millions of houses and places for people to live. So I'm kind of happy over the next six months uh, to maybe see the construction of apartments uh, start to pick up a bit more than what it's been recently.

Speaker C: So well it's grow, it's growth all around you guys, it's growth of the, the multi residential side of things. It's expensive expansion and growth. Joe, that you mentioned. And uh, watching your families grow, I mean, that's, it's exciting what we do this for, right? The future. Right. It's, you know, we're, we work on, um, how, how we can help our others create, um, better futures. And when, uh, you get people working on that together, whether it's through military or, you know, principles or cultural values, great things can happen and everybody levels up. So thanks a lot for sharing your time with us today.

Speaker B: Yeah, thank both of you guys. Yep. Appreciate your time. This is, this was good stuff. So for the listeners out there that want to learn a little bit more, connect with you guys, how can they find you?

Speaker D: Yeah, so anyone interested in a, uh, job opportunity can go to 84lumber.com careers. Uh, we have everything that we have posted and I'll 33 different states now out there. Um, but they can also, uh, feel free to connect with me on LinkedIn. I'm happy to talk more about the 84 story and kind of where opportunities, uh, that they can grow and really be successful with the company.

Speaker A: Very cool. Yeah, same for me. Same thing. Just connect LinkedIn or email or phone call and about anything, to be honest.

Speaker C: Whether it's, you know, that's what we like. That's what we like to hear. Yeah. Well, we'll put the contacts in the, in the, you know, in the show notes and the stuff that we put out so people can, uh, reach out and uh, yeah, we appreciate you sharing your nuggets with our audience.

Speaker B: Yeah, Jason and I will be at the builder show, so maybe we'll connect out there.

Speaker A: You'll see me. I'll be at the booth.

Speaker B: All right, guys, thanks again. Appreciate it. And, uh, that's a wrap.

Speaker A: Thanks, guys.

Speaker D: Thank you, guys.

Speaker B: Hey, thanks for listening.

Speaker C: Got a cool tip story or even a challenge that's been setting you back.

Speaker B: Your input is what makes our builder nuggets community thrive. Hit us up at Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn or BuilderNuggets.com.