Talking Hospitality podcast · 2026-03-19 · 13 min
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
44 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
Jonathan Napier brings 20 years of hospitality experience across bars, clubs, restaurants, and hotels to his role as HR Director at Jumeirah Cotton Tower in Knightsbridge. He explains that HR - increasingly called 'People' - functions as a guiding hand to protect, develop, and support staff while ensuring organizational promises are met. HR in Hospitality, the non-profit organization he volunteers for, runs 15-16 annual events including employment law updates, mock tribunals with the Law Society, networking sessions, and an annual awards ceremony in September. The organization conducts salary and benefit surveys and positions itself as an advocate for HR teams across the sector. Napier addresses the common fear that AI will replace HR functions by clarifying that true AI requires quantum computing and empathy - neither of which machines currently possess. Instead, machine learning will augment administrative tasks, freeing HR professionals to focus on people-centered work. He emphasizes that professionals who learn to use these tools effectively will outpace those who resist them. For aspiring HR professionals in hospitality, Napier recommends gaining operational experience first - as a chef, bartender, manager - to understand the lived experience of the staff you'll serve, making HR guidance more impactful and grounded in reality rather than pure theory.
HR functions as a guiding hand to protect, develop, listen to, and support staff while ensuring organizational promises are kept. It has evolved from payroll and admin (Personnel) to a comprehensive people function covering recruitment, development, career building, and employee welfare across any business.
HR in Hospitality is a 30-year-old non-profit advocacy group running 15-16 annual events including employment law updates, mock tribunals with the Law Society, salary and benefit surveys, networking sessions, and an annual awards ceremony in September to recognize talent and innovation.
True AI replacement is unlikely because it requires quantum computing and empathy - neither of which machines possess. Machine learning will augment administrative tasks, freeing HR professionals to focus on people-centered work, but professionals who learn to use AI effectively will outperform those who resist it.
Unlike most industries that require degrees for senior roles, hospitality rewards people-focused professionals without formal academic credentials. The key is being a good person, having strong people skills, and putting employee needs at the heart of your work.
Jonathan recommends gaining operational experience first - working as a chef, bartender, or manager - so you understand the real challenges of staff and can speak their language, making HR guidance more impactful than theoretical knowledge alone.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode covers fundamental HR definitions and some directional advice about career paths and AI, but lacks novel claims or surprising frameworks. Most points - HR as support function, importance of operational experience, AI augmentation rather than replacement - are standard industry takes. There are modest insights about hospitality's non-credentialed pathway to leadership, but substantial filler and repetition (the AI discussion, the social media tangent about Tesco and Facebook, networking anecdotes) dilutes density.
We are jack of all trades, master of none in many ways. But I think in dealing with people, we're there to capture anything people need.
Hospitality is the only place you can truly achieve without the academic traditional routes.
The thinking is conventional and well-trodden: HR is misunderstood, AI will augment not replace, get operational experience before moving to HR, and hospitality offers accessible career growth. The AI discussion rehashes familiar distinctions (machine learning vs. true AI) without fresh framing. No contrarian arguments, first-principles reasoning, or counterintuitive claims challenge the listener's existing understanding.
It will absolutely augment the things we do. It will make admin faster, better, harder, faster, better, stronger.
I would say do something else first. So I'm more effective, I believe in my role because I was an operator.
Jonathan Napier is an HR director at a luxury hotel with 20 years of hospitality experience and volunteer leadership in a 30-year-old HR advocacy group. He is a legitimate practitioner, not a consultant or theorist, which adds credibility. However, he is not running a major HR transformation, hasn't scaled a company, and his domain expertise, while solid, is narrow (hospitality HR). He is relevant and operational but not at the highest caliber of guest a B2B operator would expect.
I'm Jonathan Napier. I'm currently HR director at Jumeirah Cotton Tower, based in Knightsbridge. I've been in hospitality for the last 20 years
HR in hospitality is voluntary. We are a non for profit advocacy group that champion HR in hospitalities.
The episode is sparse on concrete data, metrics, or named examples. Jonathan mentions the HR and Hospitality group runs 15-16 events per year and has a 30-year history, but no salary surveys are detailed, no specific case studies are presented, no metrics on HR outcomes, and no hard numbers on turnover, engagement, or business impact. The mock tribunal and awards ceremony are mentioned by name but not substantiated with outcomes or examples.
HR and hospitality has been around for 30 years. It's actually our birthday next year. We run around 15, 16 events every year
We have a mock tribunal every year with the Law Society
The host asks open questions and does attempt some follow-ups (e.g., on AI, on career advice), but questions are often soft and lack depth. The host rarely challenges Jonathan or pushes back; instead, they validate and move on. The AI discussion devolves into a tangent about Tesco loyalty cards and Facebook privacy rather than drilling into HR-specific implications. Few sharp, clarifying questions or productive disagreements emerge; the conversation feels more like a supportive chat than an interrogation designed to extract novel operator insights.
What's your thoughts on that?
So Jonathan, anybody who may be in hospitality already and is thinking of looking to work in HR or is right at the beginning and wants to work in hr, what advice would you give them?
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
This bonus episode of Talking Hospitality , recorded live at Confex 2026, explores one of the most misunderstood roles in the industry: human resources. Timothy R Andrews speaks with Jonathan Napier , HR Director at the Jumeirah Carlton Tower and a volunteer advocate for HR in Hospitality , a non-profit network dedicated to championing people professionals across the sector. Jonathan shares what HR actually does inside hospitality businesses - and why the function is far more than hiring, payroll or policies. At its heart, HR is about supporting people, developing talent and ensuring teams have the guidance and structure they need to succeed. The conversation also explores the work of HR in Hospitality, a volunteer-led organisation that has spent three decades bringing HR professionals together through events, education and networking. Jonathan explains why advocacy for HR as a career matters, why operational experience is invaluable for future HR leaders, and how hospitality offers career progression without the traditional academic route. The episode also tackles one of the most talked-about topics in business today: AI.
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
The voices, you know, Timothy, Tracy and Joe on the show, from front of house to chefs on the line, every voice can shape the future. Each time, Every voice can. Welcome to another edition of Talking Hospitality and yes, we have another bonus episode for you. We are again here live at Confex 2026, courtesy of MMG Events.
HR in Hospitality. What is it and who are the people behind it? Jonathan, welcome to the show. Great to be here.
So, Jonathan, before we get into HR in hospitality, I think it's probably quite fruit and that we tell our listeners who you are. Okay. Hi, I'm Jonathan Napier. I'm currently HR director at Jumeirah Cotton Tower, based in Knightsbridge.
I've been in hospitality for the last 20 years and across every facet of it, bars, clubs, nightclubs, restaurants, you name it, I've done it. Now, hotels. My time at HR and hospitality is voluntary. We are a non for profit advocacy group that champion HR in hospitalities.
So hr, actually, because we all hear about HR and what is H. What if someone's listening? Go. We know what HR sort of is, but we don't.
What is. What would you. How would you describe hr? Okay, so I mean, the cynical side of me would say it's a space for anything else.
People don't really know what to deal with. We are jack of all trades, master of none in many ways. But I think in dealing with people, we're there to capture anything people need. So it can be a bit of a mixed bag, but first and foremost, we're there to look after people and make sure that they are protected, looked after, developed, listened to, spoken to.
It's really the guiding hand. I always say to people. We're not there to tell anyone what to do. Uh, we're there to offer guidance, we're there to offer support.
We're there to make sure that everything happens in the way that it should, in the way that it was promised. Yeah, I. Before I became part of your HR team for a little while, I always thought human resources, quite a vague term, but actually it's exactly what it is. Yeah.
It's the human bit and it is the resources that we then provide people and the support that we give. So anyone who goes, what is human resources? That's how I see it. Yeah, it's gone through a big evolution.
Right. It used to be called personnel. That was very much when it was just payroll and stationary. HR then took over and started to take on a more complex role.
Now it's more commonly referred to as people. Yeah. Not to be Unimaginative or fail to think of a new. An acronym.
But it deals with everything that involves people. Yes. And unless really the payroll and stationary elements. It's more about how you find people, what you do with them, how you develop them, how you can extract their skills to build a career anywhere.
And that's the best fit for me is that this is whilst I represent people in hospitality sector, people are everywhere. So you can do this job across any industry, in any business, and that makes it really exciting. Jonathan, you've talked about HR and hospitality. We've even had a bag in front of your face hiding you, saying, HR in Hospitality.
What is HR in hospitality? Then? If somebody walks past it, they see that, what is it? Okay, so HR and hospitality has been around for 30 years.
It's actually our birthday next year. We run around 15, 16 events every year, some in person, some online. The aim, as I said, is to champion HR in hospitality, to help advocate for those teams that are so important, with a strategic focus, longevity focus, a profitability and productivity focus, and really change the perception that a lot of people still unfortunately hold that HR are there to fire people and put on posters. Our events range from educational, such as employment law, updates from legal partners.
We run a mock tribunal every year with the Law Society, which is just phenomenal. It's one of those unfortunate things that you only get experience in if you're in it, and that isn't a great first experience for anyone. So the mock tribunals are always one of our more popular events, but we also have fun. We have fun and we network.
This is an industry full of people who support each other. So we do a quiz. We have an awards ceremony every September which recognizes the amazing talent, the amazing people, the amazing innovation that happens within our industry. This year it will be in September, I think September 12th.
So date for your diary. Tickets go on sale soon. There will be links in the show notes below. But we also do important work like salary and benefit survey.
Lots of people offer these kind of things, but it really is an incredible piece of work and I think the fact that we're all volunteers, the fact that we give our time, means we're a group of people that really care and want this industry to improve and be recognized for what it does. So come and join us, get involved, find out. It's amazingly reasonably priced when you look at its competitors. We have special prices for sole operators and individuals, not just the corporate businesses.
Yes, but you should definitely come along to our events. Some of them are open to everyone, so come and see us here at no Vacancy. Come and check it out. If you're not, check us out online.
So we know that HR is quite stressful, can be a lot of hours, but a new off quite high up in the HR sphere. What made you think, actually, I want to get involved in HR and hospitality and use up some of my spare time to support this. So two things. The first is a personal challenge.
Despite people might see looking at this or listen to, I find this kind of thing really hard. I don't find networking with people I don't know very easy at all. I tend to be the person who goes to a room, gravitates towards the person I know and clings to them for dear life. This is obviously very nice because we know each other, but I decided to try and push myself to get out there more.
And there were some really incredible people. There are some very incredible people already in HR and hospitality. Shout out to Stephen Williams and he really encouraged me and took me under his wing and said, you should come and come to the event, see what we do. And that was the first step.
You combine that then with the genuine passion, the genuine personal value or mission. I have to advocate for HR as a career. I think many people will be familiar with the old adage of it's a, you know, a stepping stone. It's things that students do while they're waiting for a real job.
It's something people fall into. It's not a very intentional career for people. You don't hear, my kids don't say, I want to be a hotel manager or I want to be a. I want to be a gm.
People talk about wanting to be an astronaut or a lawyer or a doctor or these kind of things. So really it's set about hr and hospitality is there to demonstrate this is an amazing career. Hospitality is the only place you can truly achieve without the academic traditional routes. Don't get me wrong, there'll be individual examples across the board, right?
But generally speaking, most places that want a senior management will still require a degree level, master's level, some kind of education or academic achievement in order to get in through the door. Hospitality just wants you to be a good person. It wants you to be great with people. It wants you to put people's needs at the heart of what you do.
And if you do that, you can succeed. And I'm living proof to your point. I'm a director in an industry where I didn't go to university and I'm so proud of that. And I want other People to have that opportunity, too.
So at its core, that's what I believe in. That's what HR and hospitality do. And coupled with the opportunity to try and face my fears, to meet people, to talk to people, it's the perfect place. Perfect.
I've got two questions for you. Two questions. The first one is obviously not talk about AI coming in. Okay.
And I think it was only two months ago I heard one of the apps saying they'll actually, even on my show, even a previous episode, we had something coming in saying their app will replace HR function, the HR admin function. What's your thoughts on that? I've got many throw loads at you,. The ones that you, my mother can.
Hear, you can keep the ones you want, I guess. Controversial. So, first of all, there's no such thing as AI. Okay.
What you've got is machine learning. For AI to exist, you need two things. True AI, you need quantum computing, which means, in layman's terms, that you can have simultaneous decision making happen at the same time. So if you're talking binary code, it's 0 and 1 together.
It doesn't just have to be one or the other. And at the moment, those things only exist few and far between. Okay. But coupled with that computing ability, you also need empathy, and that is really something that a machine isn't capable of.
So when I'm faced with that question of, oh, will AI replace hr? It will absolutely augment the things we do. It will make admin faster, better, harder, faster, better, stronger. And it will enable us to spend more time with people.
So when people say to me, oh, AI is going to take your job, I say, no, it's not. People who can use AI are going to take my job. And that's really what I'd ask everyone to take away from that little snippet, if you want one, is lean into this. Whether it's about concerns with your children or younger people using the Internet, or whether it's will AI replace your job?
You're not going to solve that problem by shutting it out and ignoring it or banning it. So, right. You need to embrace it, you need to learn about it, you need to become an expert in it, and you will find the bits of it that make your life, your job, your role, much easier and you'll become more effective as a result. I think if you already, if you're resistant to it, it's too late.
Yeah, the genie's out the bottle. And for people that are worried about privacy and all this, if you're on Facebook, Or Instagram. That's already gone. If you're on WhatsApp, it's already gone.
So let's not worry about. And even if, like me, you think you're, you're not on any social media. Got a club card. Yeah.
They know Tesco know everything about him. And Tesco know everything about him. And that's why, for a small fee, Jonathan, I don't need to release the news. Okay.
But that's a really good point. I think is about embracing AI AI and we've got to stop having these fear conversations around it. Jobs will change, some jobs will go. But then we've also had thousands of jobs that didn't exist 50 years ago.
Yeah. And there are still plenty of people working. So I agree with you on that. So Jonathan, anybody who may be in hospitality already and is thinking of looking to work in HR or is right at the beginning and wants to work in hr, what advice would you give them?
I would say do something else first. So I'm more effective, I believe in my role because I was an operator. So if you've got lived experience in, in the thick of it operationally, being a chef, being a bartender, being a bar back, being a manager, the things that we want people to do, there's a reason for them. We can give you the reason, but we have to translate it to your language.
You have to translate it to your world. Why is it important for you? What difference is that going to make when I'm trying to get this customer to do X? So I would say that I think if you start off in hr, there's no problem with that.
A lot of great HR practitioners, they've only ever done that. But personally I just think you should try as many different things as you can, as many different companies as you can. Get a breadth of experience, get a depth of experience and that will make you more impactful and effective. Yeah, I agree.
You to be able to speak to the people that you're serving, you really do need to know what their issues are. Yeah. And you can only do that if you've got experience doing it. Otherwise it's theory.
You can't know everybody's experience. But to be able to speak the same language is central to do that job. So I totally agree with you. Thank you very much, Jonathan.
It's really have a really best of luck with the rest of your day. Anybody that's interested in HR and hospitality, we will have show notes and links. So please do check out the podcast. It will be underneath there.
And Jonathan, if they want to get hold of you directly. What's the best way to do that? I am on LinkedIn. No other social media, but yeah, you can find me on LinkedIn.
HR and hospitality are also on there. Or you can check the website and. The links again will be in the show notes. Big thank you to our sponsors, Graphic Kitchen and HJ UK Hospital Sanity Jobs UK for supporting the podcast and of course again to MMG events for making this happen today.
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