Talking Energy Show · 2026-10-30 · 12 min
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
22 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
Shawn Wilson, host of Exploring Energy on KECO 96.5 in Elk City, Oklahoma, describes a transformative moment in the energy industry driven by technological innovation and policy support. The episode covers several emerging trends reshaping energy production: downhole nuclear reactors being deployed in geothermal applications one mile deep, modular refineries, and data center development in Oklahoma leveraging behind-the-meter natural gas. Wilson explains how closed-loop water recycling systems address environmental concerns about data center water consumption - contrary to activist claims, modern facilities use less water annually than a backyard swimming pool. Oklahoma's state legislature has mandated closed-loop systems and prohibited evaporative cooling, even allowing produced water reuse. The Cherokee play in western Oklahoma is experiencing significant development with 10-15 active rigs drilling for deep natural gas. Wilson credits figures like Aubrey McLendon for recognizing natural gas as a bridge fuel and supporting green fuels refineries - fifty planned across the next decade to process domestic light sweet crude rather than imported heavy oil. Wilson's journey into radio began unexpectedly at a haunted house event and led to his full-time opportunity hosting an energy education show on locally-owned Paragon Communications, helping connect job seekers with patch opportunities.
Hosted by Matthew Hill. The show scores 53.5/100 on substance across its analysed episodes. See the full show profile.
Downhole nuclear reactors are sent one mile deep into boreholes (starting at 48 inches wide) to generate electricity through geothermal-nuclear hybrid systems. If a meltdown occurs, it remains contained downhole and does not affect the atmosphere, making the technology safe and enabling geothermal development anywhere, not just at traditional geothermal sites.
Modern data centers using closed-loop recycling systems use less water annually than it takes to fill a backyard swimming pool, contrary to activist claims that they threaten municipal water supplies and force residents to conserve water for basic hygiene.
Behind-the-meter natural gas refers to on-site natural gas generation for data center power, leveraging Oklahoma's abundant gas reserves. This allows data centers to generate their own electricity rather than relying solely on grid power, reducing costs and grid strain.
The Cherokee play is an oil and gas formation in western Oklahoma north of Elk City containing deep natural gas reserves, currently experiencing major development with 10-15 active drilling rigs exploring the substantial gas deposits.
Existing U.S. refineries are configured to process heavy imported crude from Canada, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia, but America produces light sweet crude domestically. Fifty new green fuels refineries being built will process domestic oil, eliminating the need for imports and enhancing energy independence.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode contains a handful of interesting energy topics (downhole nuclear reactors, modular refineries, closed-loop data center cooling) but none are developed beyond a sentence or two. The vast majority of the runtime is mutual admiration, personal anecdotes, and boosterism with no substantive analysis.
they send down this nuclear reactor one mile deep. And what the is if it were to melt down, it wouldn't
most of these data centers, even the big ones, use less amount of water than it takes to fill up a backyard swimming pool in a year
The episode recycles well-worn talking points (natural gas as bridge fuel, energy independence) without any first-principles analysis or contrarian framing. The nuclear-geothermal convergence idea is genuinely interesting but is dropped immediately after being mentioned.
he knew that natural gas was the bridge fuel to the future
anybody, anywhere you look now can become a site
Shawn Wilson is a local Oklahoma radio personality who did entry-level oilfield work before pivoting to sports radio and then an energy show. He is a community booster and media figure, not a senior operator or practitioner who has executed at scale in the energy industry.
I sold pipe dows and fittings. I did some rouse to batting, I did some um, some wire lining in the oil and gas industry
I was the only person in the whole station that had any oil field experience
There are a few concrete data points scattered through the episode - the McClendon check anecdote with specific dollar figures, the 50-refinery target, the swimming-pool water comparison - but they are unverified, unsourced, and surrounded by vague assertions and handwaving.
he handed me a check for $250,000 for the elk City Sports Arena...it's a 22.5 million
50 refineries in the next decade
Speaker A is an unabashed fanboy who validates every claim the guest makes without a single probing follow-up or pushback. The conversation is a mutual appreciation session, not an interview, and no claim goes challenged regardless of how vague or speculative it is.
That's all fake news. Yeah, it is fake news.
And deservedly so.
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
Shawn Wilson is another reason I love these interviews. We caught up with a microphone between us at the recent OERB Oil & Natural Gas Expo. Naturally, I suggested I might make a better cohost than Butch. Gratitude and a little friendly trouble can share the same conversation. If you haven’t spent a morning with Exploring Energy, I hope you will. Broadcasting from Elk City on KECO 96.5 FM, the show brings energy news, industry perspectives, laughter and learning to the airwaves. Shawn wants it to feel like two people talking across a picket fence. I love that. There’s something wonderfully Oklahoma about making a big subject feel like a conversation with your neighbor. We talked about natural gas, emerging technology, refining ideas and Oklahoma’s opportunities. Those conversations deserve thoughtful questions, and the people doing the work deserve to be heard. My favorite story was how Shawn found radio. He was helping his young daughter talk into a microphone at a community event when someone heard him and offered him an opportunity. From helping his daughter find her voice to helping his neighbors understand energy, there’s a lot of heart in that story.
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
Speaker A: All right. I want to hear, I want to hear introduction like you guys do to who. Who does that introduction in the mornings.
Speaker B: Okay. It was so
Speaker A: good, like exploring energy. KCO 96.5. Yeah,
Speaker B: it was solid. It was a guy named Sam who did all of the sports animal, um, you know, intros and that. And then he got sick and we can't
Speaker A: probably same.
Speaker B: Yes, I know. And we can't, um, we can't get him to do anymore. He's not doing any more voice work. But he had that
Speaker A: real deep,
Speaker B: rich voice.
Speaker A: I would not have started podcast without Sean. I figured if he could do it and do it better than me, I could at least aspire to do what you guys do. But it's, it's, man, the fact that when I tell people and they don't know about it, I'm like, oh my God, you're missing out on the best show. My favorite.
Speaker B: Well, I appreciate you saying. I
Speaker A: don't know how you all do it every day, day after.
Speaker B: Well, you know, I, I try to bring a little entertainment value.
Speaker A: That's just
Speaker B: who I am. But I also want it to be like, hey, a couple guys like me and you just talking over a picket fence and, you know, how do you feel about it? You know, how do I feel about. There's so
Speaker A: much going on. I've never been more excited about the energy industry since I got into it than right now.
Speaker B: And deservedly so. A lot of it is because every day we're becoming more and more energy independent. Uh, I just talked to a guy today here at the expo and he was uh, building modular refineries. One of the big. Yes.
Speaker A: Dropping. Dropping nuclear bombs down in the hole.
Speaker B: Now that. That is a little different story. Yeah. That they're generating electricity with downhole nuclear reactors,
Speaker A: geothermal, nuclear and drilling all coming together
Speaker B: and, and they start out with like a 48 inch hole and then they send down this nuclear reactor one mile deep. And what the is if it were to melt down, it wouldn't.
Speaker A: It's not going to bother you,
Speaker B: the atmosphere, you know.
Speaker A: So what I like about it most is that, uh, the guys that are chasing all the land all over the country,
Speaker B: right,
Speaker A: Looking for where can we find more geothermal, you know, sites, you know, now it's like, wait a minute. Anybody, anywhere you look now can become a site. Yeah. As fast as we can make these react. If this all works out, we're set the behind. So where you're at Elk City.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: What a great place to think about areas for data Centers?
Speaker B: Oh, absolutely.
Speaker A: The gas.
Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, the natural gas. Behind the meter.
Speaker A: Behind the meter
Speaker B: that, uh, you know, that they have, uh, passed here in Oklahoma. The other thing that my state legislative buddies that are on the show talk about, and that is water usage. Because right now the anti data center people are using fear factor, like, oh my God, you're gonna, your electricity rates are gonna go off. That's
Speaker A: all fake news.
Speaker B: Yeah, it is fake news. And you're not going to be able to have enough water. Your town won't even have enough water to, to brush your teeth. I mean, it's just ridiculous. But now they have closed loop systems, which means they recycle that water several times and it doesn't come into contact with anything chemical, so it can be released. And then they said that most of these data centers, even the big ones, use less amount of water than it takes to fill up a backyard swimming pool in a year, you know, but they're using that. I
Speaker A: didn't know it was, it was that efficient.
Speaker B: Yes, it is. That's
Speaker A: way ahead of even what I mean.
Speaker B: And Oklahoma, the state legislators have had a great forethought to say, hey, let's get ahead of this thing, you know, let's make it to where they can't do any, they can't have evaporative systems, which means basically they cool. That water goes to, to mist and it's, it's done. Closed loop systems, recycling, even using produced water for cooling. So it's pretty exciting when you think about, like you said, the state of the energy industry right now and in Oklahoma, you know, and I had a lady tell me about a year ago that the Cherokee play out north of Elk City out in western Oklahoma was going to become really big. I'm like, it
Speaker A: is and it is
Speaker B: huge. Now, uh, you can drive up there and you can see 10 or 15 rigs, you know, and it's
Speaker A: smart. People know that there's a lot of gas, deep gas out there, a lot of it. Let's go get it. Now. When Aubrey, so far ahead of his time, isn't it
Speaker B: crazy? Aubrey McLendon, I remember one time he handed me a check for $250,000 for the elk City Sports Arena. And whenever we got to the arena to show him what we were building, he's like, uh, this isn't a $2.5 million project. I'm like, no, it's a 22.5 million. I was the president of the board of education. And he was like, my guys, I got the wrong information. I thought I was giving a tenth. I'm like, well, we can take more. But no, he was, he was way ahead of it. You know, he, he knew that natural gas was the bridge fuel to the future. That's why ch heavily invested into natural gas, even up in the Northeast.
Speaker A: If you're. I have him on one, but I need to get him out to you. But, uh, the, the green fuels refineries.
Speaker B: Yes,
Speaker A: he's, he's here. I
Speaker B: was gonna say I'll
Speaker A: come over.
Speaker B: Sent him an email. He was. Who I was talking about
Speaker A: 50 refineries in the next decade.
Speaker B: Yes.
Speaker A: And he broke ground on it here in Duncan.
Speaker B: Yes. And that is so amazing because what we're having trouble right now is having refineries that are set up to do the light sweet crude that the United States produces. All of our refineries have been importing oil from Canada, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia, the heavy oil. Now if we can start getting refineries here that can do our own oil, we'll become even more energy independent. I'm still, I'm stoked. I
Speaker A: know. I am too. I get so excited again. Look right here. It's not that hard to find exploring energy. There's no reason not to tune in, sponsor this show and listen every single day. Call in. You guys actually have the ability to call in? Yes. I'm not that smart. No one's ever been able to do that.
Speaker B: They call into my show and, and we put them on and then we, we stream to our Facebook pages. We stream to, uh, our, uh, podcast outlooks, and we've even got our own YouTube channel now. Talk about stepping up.
Speaker A: I, I thought, Yeah, I, I, I think that's where I first found you. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But maybe just driving through Elk City. I don't know. Don't you think, though? I mean, there's a shot that I, and better at it than your normal partner.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. You know. Yeah. I'll tell you. And in fact, Butch divorced me and now he's trying to come back, so I want to m. Shut up. Yeah, he's gonna come back two, three days a week.
Speaker A: Come on, man. Yeah. He's gotta be kidding me.
Speaker B: You know, I had, I added a lovely assistant that comes in and does the mop up segment. Yeah. Uh, and, uh, uh, tj, she comes in and does the weather and those kind of things. So. But you know,
Speaker A: you know what you need? Just a rotation of guests.
Speaker B: Oh, that's what I, that's what I need to do now. I could Just sit back and probably
Speaker A: come out like. No, no, not, no, not, not guest hosts.
Speaker B: Right? Okay. Co
Speaker A: host. Co
Speaker B: hosts. Yeah,
Speaker A: I'll come m out once, you know, a quarter. But we'll just get you like a rotation of better than me people. Better than Butch.
Speaker B: You know, you talk about a guy, make you feel better about yourself? No, I'm just teasing. I love Butch. And Butch has got so much,
Speaker A: a lot going on.
Speaker B: Oh yeah, and the boots on the, you know, and he, he is just that working knowledge. I mean, I sold pipe dows and fittings. I did some rouse to batting, I did some um, some wire lining in the oil and gas industry. Uh, but you know, Butch has been in a long time and, and you cannot, you can't substitute the knowledge, the first hand knowledge that he has. And so I'll be glad to get him back two, three days of the week. But you know, I just want everybody to tune in because we try to make it educational.
Speaker A: It is education, you
Speaker B: know, not that I'm smarter than anybody, but I have a lot of good sources that are smart. And the thing about it is education, uh, is the key in energy and anything really. But the more people have less time to research, if they can let me do the research and then they tune in and then they're able to, you know, get the highlights. That's exactly what I'm trying to get.
Speaker A: I, uh, I'm, I'm a, you know, I'm a huge fan. Anyway, make sure you tune in. It's the exploring energy show. KE C O 96.5. Oak City, Oklahoma, the heart of our nation.
Speaker B: 100,000 watts of crystal clear. The DJ. A very quick story how I got into radio.
Speaker A: Okay, I want that.
Speaker B: My little girl was about, oh, three and a half, four years old. And we go to this JC's haunted house in Elk City. Back when you could go and really do a haunted house and you didn't have to worry about fire codes and those kind of things. But anyway, they were doing a little radio remote and the guy saw her dancing and he comes up, he goes, you think that little girl will talk to me? I said, sure, yeah. And so he puts the microphone up and she gets kind of like, what? And I said, elizabeth, it's really easy. Say something like, here we are in beautiful Downtown Elk City. 12th and Wolfley. JC's Haunted House. Come on down. It's all happening here. The guy was like, dude, you want a job? I'm like, dude, I got a job because you like sports. I said, I love It. He said, I'm looking for a sports broadcast. Are you interested? I'm sure you know, it would be at night. So I give him a card and sure enough, man, the guy calls me and he gives me a chance to be on the radio. And, uh, I said, what do you think? And he says, you say ah, a lot. And I said, well, that's what I want to cuss.
Speaker A: And
Speaker B: he said,
Speaker A: you knock out.
Speaker B: He said, how did your mama raise you? Were you raised right? And I said, yes, sir. Yes, sir. He goes, don't say what you think. Say what you think is right. And from that point forward, I never had. I kept a picture of my mom, but, you know, just say what you think is
Speaker A: right. Picture of your mom
Speaker B: who don't. Right. You sell you. Anyway, uh, but that's how I got into radio. And then I went full time. And after, when we decided to start doing an energy show, I was the only person in the whole station that had any oil field experience.
Speaker A: Here's what I about that station that anybody involved in that station. Thank you. You know, it takes a lot. It's not like our world ever goes, oh, we need an energy show.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: That's somebody. I mean, that's somebody who really cares about Oklahoma. If you have a station and you say, I'll dedicate a chunk of time to something so critical to our nation and believes in you guys and has continued to do that,
Speaker B: you know,
Speaker A: it gets me in the feels that they said, you know, so. Paragon Communications. Thank you. That's important.
Speaker B: Blake Brewer and his wife Amber own Paragon Communications. And he's a local guy.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: And it's locally owned. It's not a clear channel. It's not a big corporately owned radio. And he can make those kind of decisions. In fact, we met on Wednesday and that next Monday morning we started the show. I mean, that was that quick. And so anyway, I appreciate him and his ability to give the public what they needed. And we can help people find jobs in the patch. We can help people get educated to find jobs in the patch or find hands if they have a, you know, a need for them. But it's really. It's really an opportunity for me. And, uh, I have. I'm grateful for the opportunity to have a show to where I can still get on the air, uh, and talk to people. After I gave up my ball game stuff, this. This gives me that opportunity to stay in touch with the community and provide a service, which is basically energy education.
Speaker A: Yeah, I'm in the fields
Speaker B: Thanks. I
Speaker A: got that fanboy out here, so thank you. You all take care. God bless. Please tune in to Exploring Energy.
Speaker B: Thanks for having me, man. Bye. Appreciate it.
Speaker A: Thank you so much, Sam.
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