#101: How to feel less trapped and show up better at work

Speaker A: Julia, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for making the time.

Speaker B: Thank you for the invitation.

Speaker A: Julia, you are, uh, I hope I'm saying this right, a communication strategist. You're a trainer, you're a change facilitator. You come with a blend of a few things. Strategic thinking, human centered communication, creativity. And you and I have connected some time ago and it was pretty clear to me that um, you bring a very interesting perspective on conversations like this. Specifically, you shared an article that you wrote in 2025 called Radical Connectedness. I found it quite eye opening. I was not familiar with the concept. So may I ask you to help me understand what do you mean by radical connectedness and why is it such, uh, an important concept?

Speaker B: Thank you so much. I'm so glad you found it. Radical Connectedness. Well, this is the concept I came up with myself while preparing for the keynote about uh, new work and transition, transformation, digitalization. And I thought, okay, usually we talk about digitalization as um, you know, the starting point for the new work. You know, the whole world is right now into AI on digitalization, like especially in Germany. And we all see, see this progress as um, the cause for the companies, for the organization to change and to have new culture. And I thought maybe it can be also vice versa, maybe we can also create special culture, special conditions where this progress can happen. And I thought, you know, coming from the system theory, there are some connections, there are some relationships and there are some independencies. And this is actually how we all going through this life, whether we are aware of that or not. You know, like when we go, for example to another country, we're traveling, we really see that, we really experience that. So radical connectedness, for me, something we can experience very, very deeply. When we are uh, like stepping out of our normal environment, we are going for another country, we are doing like new projects with other people or we are connected in some political issues, maybe, I don't know. And then you realize it's like the first time I'm doing this, first time I see these people, but somehow I feel connected. There's something we share something in common. So the idea is we have like three levels or three dimensions as I call it. First of all is personal dimensions. So me, my body, my wishes, my desires, but also my fears, my patterns. Me as a human being, like my own system, I'm bringing into the second system, the second dimension, which is group dimension or let's say team or organization or company. So usually also working with other people together. This is also how we interact together, the connections between us on this level. And then the third one is level of society or environment. You can also say where we have impact, like what we do, what we think, what we plan, how we interact has also the impact on the whole society, the whole mankind, or maybe let's say in five years or something, could be also cosmic dimension number four. You never know. So that's it.

Speaker A: And so if I understand it correctly, you say there's these three layers, these three dimensions, right? The personal group or social dimension and environmental dimension, maybe a fourth one, uh, with the cosmic dimension in the future. And you call it radical connectedness. Which means, well, whether you like it or not, these interdependencies are there, right. And maybe you don't know, you don't realize, but. But um, you are connected to these layers and it's not just you. Also the people that you interact with, that work, the people that are around you are connected to these layers in their own way. What do you think changes once you acknowledge that? Once you realize that?

Speaker B: Good question. Well, first of all, I will say you have better relationship with yourself, so you will be more kinder with yourself and probably will also start your days differently. So the moment you wake up and the moment you open the door and go into the world and you know, meet people, create work, have problems solving problems, go into the crisis, this all will carry you. So the moment you reconnect with yourself, you will immediately react and act differently with the world outside. Meaning when you are in the supermarket and someone is being annoying, for example, or being bit rude, you will probably not react automatically and being rude as well, or like being very harsh. But you will see this person in these three layers at the same time and you will say, okay, this person didn't find the right channel to let his or her anger go out, or maybe even sorrow, you know, you don't take it personally, don't you? Uh, stop taking things personal. This is the first thing. So it has nothing to do with me, you know, even if like my boss shouts, shouts or yelling, it has nothing to do with me in the first place. Even if I did maybe not the job they wanted me to do. Yeah. So this is kind of freedom for me, you know, this is the moment say, okay, I know we do have connection and we do have this independency, but I'm okay, you're okay. And if you go through the world with these glasses, when you say okay, I'm okay, you okay, we have the issue or this problem we have to solve together. Then you start to do it differently. So it's not about winning and losing. It's not about, I, uh, wanted to prove everyone I'm the best and they're like the worst, or I need to earn the most money so they will know how successful am I, because they couldn't do that. It's not about that anymore. It's about, about what could we create together which didn't exist before. And this is such an amazing feeling.

Speaker A: I do believe, and I'm not just saying this, I do believe it is a very underestimated, underrated idea. I am, um, a big believer of call, um, it human to human connection. Now I feel like these days these words are being thrown around and are losing their meaning in certain, I guess, environments. But I do believe in human to human connection. And I do believe that, uh, um, it makes a lot of sense to build connections when you don't need them, because that's where people meet you at the most, so to speak. Authentic version. And the reason why your idea of radical connectedness was so appealing to me, is so appealing to me, is that in a way, it helps you to set your ego aside. It helps you better understand not just the environment and not just yourself, but also the people that you speak to.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: How common is it to come back from work and think, oh, that person was so annoying. Or how, uh, common is it on a Friday or a Saturday or a Sunday to not be there, present, but think, uh, next Monday, next Tuesday. I need to have this conversation. It's going to suck so much energy out of me. And to understand that it's not about my own ego, to understand that everyone is somehow connected to a layer gives you a very different perspective. Now it also means that when we speak to other people. I know that you mentioned negotiation in your article, but it goes obviously beyond negotiation. It makes it not a zero sum game. Like you said, it's not me against them. It's more let me zoom out, let me forget about the short term and let me build something that is long lasting.

Speaker B: Correct.

Speaker A: And I do think that this is in a way, the skill of the future. Right. We talk about AI, we talk about being proficient with all the new technologies. Everyone these days is building an agent and is an expert at everything. But we forget that, uh, this idea of connectedness is probably something that will stay with us no matter what. No matter what. Technological change.

Speaker B: Absolutely.

Speaker A: Uh, do you think there is any layer? So we spoke about the personal, the social and the environmental layer that people tend to mostly ignore unwillingly, probably. Do you see? I guess my question is a specific hierarchy in these layers. Is there any layer that you should somehow pass me the term figure out first?

Speaker B: Well, obviously when we are talking about people who are in the age between 24 and maybe 60, most of our time we do spend in the working environments. Right? Right. So with our colleagues or even like with our spouse and friends, somehow we're very social, active. So this level, uh, is very present to us. So the collective level. Right. The group, the organization. And we really tend to forget either our personal dimension very often. Like especially when we talk about special groups of people, special conditions, special upbringing. I'm talking about myself right now, being a girl, you know. So this is where you learn very often not anymore happily, but things like put your desires away. It's about others being happy. You are the second. So this kind of things people do experience still in many countries, unfortunately. So this we tend to forget. And uh, also because we think we have to work much harder and much more. There's simply sometimes no time for that or we forget to, to create time for ourselves. This is the first one. And the second is of course the biggest one, the society. It's funny because it's actually a very old fashioned way to perceive yourself as a human being. Right. When we go back to the ancient Rome, whom I'm talking to, Matteo, you know, it's better than me. So this idea, I am a citizen in the first place, and then I'm a father, and then I'm a worker, then I'm a colleague, then I'm a human being, you know, like this maybe also too much at that time, but everything I do has an impact. My company, the product we are doing, the services we are offering, they do have impact on the whole society. Not only in my organization, not only with my partners, with my clients, but the whole big scale. And this is something I think is very crucial right now for us also in terms of uh, where we are right now as a society. I think we're kind of losing that from time to time. And if we will be aware more, more often about that, then I think we have great chances to survive as a mankind and be in a very good democratic society.

Speaker A: There is another idea that uh, again you introduced me to not too long ago that I would like to touch on. And it's the idea of um, third space. Now this is a true story. I had a chat with a friend the other day, just a few days ago, actually. We were saying that in most cases we would be able to somehow predict the average day of the average person or professional without even knowing them. Meaning you wake up, you go to work, you come back home, you sit on your couch, you go to sleep. Now it's a wild generalization and uh, it's not meant to be offensive in any way, but rather show that inevitably we spend most of our time between home and work. And there is this beautiful concept that you talked to me about which is the idea of the third space. Can you tell me what a third space is? And um, again, why is it so crucial to understand?

Speaker B: Sure. So there's a whole science behind it. I'm not the expert on that, but I really love the idea how we can escape this duality of going to work, going home, going to work, going home, you know, and how it used to be always important for all the cultures and all the, um, people before us, like centuries ago to have this so called third space. Space where you go, which has nothing to do with your work, which, which has nothing to do with your role as a spouse or father or a brother or a son. So a space where you can reconnect with yourself in the way you usually don't do in the professional environment or even at home. It can be also with your friends, but it can be also just you and random people around. Right? So, and that's whatever when you go to the gym or when you go for a jog, for example, or where you just like go to the library, or uh, when you just go for a walk on the sunny morning and you just stand somewhere and some random people will come together and you just observe swans, let's say, which I always do, um, in Groatsberg in Berlin. And then you start a conversation or maybe you just whatever it is that play ping pong together, stuff like that. Or maybe there is a concert you didn't know about, but it just happens that you just walked through this space and you see there's a concert and you just stay there and you start to sing together with other people, things like that, which really gives you power and energy to keep up with your daily business, with your daily heavy roles. Very often where you can just put all these responsibilities away and maybe even being kind of inner child in the way, you know, kind of lets the, let the energy flow and the things you like to do with random people and then come back again. And I know maybe you have experienced that as well, but sometimes we have these phases where you're just like, you know, project deadline and you're Just like working, working, working sleep. Working, working, working sleep. And then like latest, after the second week you will realize, okay, I need, I need, I need to change something, right? There's like physical need sometimes to leave the office or to go for a walk or uh, to leave the apartment, to go for a weekend, you know, to the seashore. We really need that. We like try to escape this feeling of being caught in this duality of work and home. So we really need this third, uh, one, even the fourth, the fifth, the sixth space, right.

Speaker A: It makes so much sense to me. It, I see it as a way to regain a little bit of agency over our lives, right? We get caught into all our duties and to do lists, which is perfectly normal. But um, there is a reason why time goes so fast. In a way, weeks go by, months go by and, and we wake up one day and look back and think like, oh my God, it's already, it's already May, it's already June. You know, um, we're heading towards the end of the conversation, but there is something I want to ask you maybe to tie all together and it's this, it's a very simple question. If someone is listening to this and is currently going through either a change personally or professionally, or maybe they're somehow stuck, bit in a, in a rut and they feel disconnected from themselves or from their team or from the direction that they're heading to, or they think they should be heading towards. Is there anything that uh, you feel you would want to tell them and scream through this podcast right now? Yes.

Speaker B: Stay active, stay curious. Reconnect with things you used to like to do in your childhood. Maybe there is a hobby you didn't continue to do when you grew up. Maybe there is a, uh, city or place you wanted to visit for a long time, but there was no chance to do it. Maybe there is one person you wanted to say hi or write a letter or just message or give a call and you thought, mhm, maybe I need to wait, Be active, do something about that and reconnect with things, which gives you good energy. You will usually feel it, you know, you will usually just say, okay, that's, I really like it. It's like in your body will also expand. You would just say, oh yeah, that was so cool. I like, I like to continue that. And once, once you are in this state, in this resourceful state, um, as we say, then you will have options, then you will see options and create the fourth, the fifth, the sixth option for yourself. And then it feels really freely, so you don't feel like you. You're stuck between two things. But when you create yourself three more options, you will say, okay, so it's up to me what to choose. And then this is radical connectedness. Coming back again to say, okay, what do I want? What do I need right now? What are my strengths? What do I want to achieve next three, four, five years? Tomorrow, first three hours. And if this is clear, then you just go.

Speaker A: And with this, Julia, thank you so much for making the time. Hopefully we can do this at some point again. And until then, take care.

Speaker B: Was lovely to be here. Thank you so much.