Blake Modersitzki: Pelion VC, Venture Returns, AI, War Stories, Top Deals & Scale

[00:00:00 -> 00:00:02] Blake Modruzitzki, he is the managing partner [00:00:02 -> 00:00:03] of Pelleon Venture Partners. [00:00:04 -> 00:00:05] I call him on the phone and I said, [00:00:05 -> 00:00:08] hey, I'm calling so you can say I told you so. [00:00:09 -> 00:00:10] And he starts laughing on the other end [00:00:10 -> 00:00:14] and he said, Blake, you are the only people [00:00:14 -> 00:00:15] who just told me no straight up. [00:00:15 -> 00:00:18] And so then roll forward, Domo rolls around.

[00:00:18 -> 00:00:20] I get a phone call from Josh and he says, [00:00:20 -> 00:00:22] look, I'm not inviting any VCs into this round. [00:00:22 -> 00:00:24] Do you guys wanna invest? [00:00:24 -> 00:00:26] We were one of the original investors in Domo. [00:00:26 -> 00:00:53] All right, welcome back to the Startup Ignition Podcast.

[00:00:53 -> 00:00:55] Thank you so much for watching every episode. [00:00:55 -> 00:00:58] This is episode 49. [00:00:58 -> 00:00:59] So we've done 49. [00:00:59 -> 00:01:00] Hi, Blake.

[00:01:01 -> 00:01:01] Wow. [00:01:01 -> 00:01:02] Introducing Blake. [00:01:02 -> 00:01:03] Blake's here, he's gonna be on camera. [00:01:04 -> 00:01:06] 49, so we've done 49 episodes of this [00:01:06 -> 00:01:07] and we have an awesome guest today.

[00:01:07 -> 00:01:08] I'm Tyler, this is John. [00:01:09 -> 00:01:10] Yeah, I'm excited for today. [00:01:10 -> 00:01:11] I know, I'm very excited. [00:01:11 -> 00:01:13] Blake Modruzitzki, [00:01:13 -> 00:01:15] and I probably just hammered that last name wrong.

[00:01:16 -> 00:01:17] Modruzitzki, okay? [00:01:17 -> 00:01:18] Is that how you say it? [00:01:18 -> 00:01:19] That's how you say it. [00:01:19 -> 00:01:19] That sounds good.

[00:01:19 -> 00:01:20] I'm saying it right. [00:01:20 -> 00:01:23] But Blake is probably one of our favorite people [00:01:23 -> 00:01:25] in the ecosystem of Utah. [00:01:26 -> 00:01:27] We love this guy. [00:01:27 -> 00:01:30] He's so amazing, kind-hearted, hardworking, [00:01:30 -> 00:01:33] and has built an amazing asset [00:01:33 -> 00:01:36] to what Utah has to offer to venture.

[00:01:36 -> 00:01:37] One of the startups. [00:01:37 -> 00:01:38] One of the first people, [00:01:38 -> 00:01:40] when I came to Utah in 2002, [00:01:40 -> 00:01:42] one of the first people in the venture ecosystem [00:01:42 -> 00:01:45] that I didn't already know that I met knew, [00:01:45 -> 00:01:47] and we became fast friends in- [00:01:47 -> 00:01:48] 2002. [00:01:48 -> 00:01:48] 2002. [00:01:49 -> 00:01:51] We're coming up on a quarter century here, guys.

[00:01:51 -> 00:01:52] Not to date you. [00:01:53 -> 00:01:53] Yeah. [00:01:53 -> 00:01:55] But yes, Blake Modruzitzki, [00:01:55 -> 00:01:58] he is the managing partner of Pelion Venture Partners, [00:01:58 -> 00:02:00] and you have been in that position [00:02:00 -> 00:02:02] for how many years now? [00:02:02 -> 00:02:04] Yeah, I joined the firm in 2002.

[00:02:04 -> 00:02:06] Oh, you joined in 2002. [00:02:06 -> 00:02:07] Yeah, yeah. [00:02:07 -> 00:02:10] And then our founder, Jim Dreyfus, [00:02:10 -> 00:02:11] retired in 2012. [00:02:11 -> 00:02:13] Jim Dreyfus was kind of a legend [00:02:13 -> 00:02:15] in the venture history of Utah, right?

[00:02:15 -> 00:02:18] Yeah, our firm was founded in 1986 by Jim, [00:02:19 -> 00:02:21] and a guy named Wayne Brown and Dick Shanneman. [00:02:22 -> 00:02:24] Yeah, Wayne Brown Institute name, [00:02:24 -> 00:02:25] which is- [00:02:25 -> 00:02:25] Yeah, yeah. [00:02:25 -> 00:02:27] What was the name of the firm back then? [00:02:27 -> 00:02:28] Utah Ventures.

[00:02:28 -> 00:02:29] Yeah, Utah Ventures. [00:02:29 -> 00:02:31] It was Utah Ventures, then UV Partners, [00:02:32 -> 00:02:33] and then Pelion. [00:02:33 -> 00:02:34] Was Utah Ventures the first name? [00:02:34 -> 00:02:36] Utah Ventures was the first name.

[00:02:36 -> 00:02:36] I knew it as UV. [00:02:36 -> 00:02:36] I knew it as UV. [00:02:36 -> 00:02:37] Why did you ever move off of that? [00:02:37 -> 00:02:38] I knew it was UV.

[00:02:38 -> 00:02:40] You could have put a stake in the ground with that name. [00:02:40 -> 00:02:42] UV Partners, though, is what I always knew. [00:02:42 -> 00:02:44] Yeah, so Jim shortened it to UV Partners, [00:02:44 -> 00:02:47] and for a window in time, [00:02:47 -> 00:02:52] people thought we did electricity, stuff like that. [00:02:52 -> 00:02:54] Then they thought we were the economic development arm [00:02:54 -> 00:02:55] of the state of Utah.

[00:02:56 -> 00:02:57] Like this whole branding thing, [00:02:57 -> 00:02:58] and so we're like, all right, [00:02:58 -> 00:03:00] we just got to figure this thing out. [00:03:00 -> 00:03:01] Yeah, it's so funny. [00:03:01 -> 00:03:03] It was too early in the days of venture in Utah. [00:03:03 -> 00:03:04] Yeah.

[00:03:04 -> 00:03:05] And we're going to go back to his history. [00:03:06 -> 00:03:07] I won't spill it, but before that, [00:03:07 -> 00:03:08] what he did was very fascinating. [00:03:09 -> 00:03:11] Let's go from high school on forward is what we'd like to do. [00:03:11 -> 00:03:11] Yeah, yeah.

[00:03:11 -> 00:03:14] No, so before we do anything, I got a bio for you. [00:03:14 -> 00:03:15] So I'm going to read a bio, [00:03:15 -> 00:03:17] and you correct it if it's wrong, okay? [00:03:17 -> 00:03:20] So Blake is the managing partner at Peleon Venture Partners, [00:03:21 -> 00:03:23] one of Utah's most respected venture capital firms. [00:03:23 -> 00:03:26] He has spent his career in software across sales, [00:03:26 -> 00:03:28] marketing, M&A, and venture investing.

[00:03:28 -> 00:03:31] Before Peleon, you were the managing director [00:03:31 -> 00:03:33] of Novell Ventures, is that correct? [00:03:33 -> 00:03:33] That's correct. [00:03:33 -> 00:03:36] And vice president of corporate development at Novell. [00:03:36 -> 00:03:38] Earlier in his career, [00:03:38 -> 00:03:40] he held global sales and marketing roles at WordPerfect.

[00:03:41 -> 00:03:43] Wow, Blake, you have gone all the way [00:03:43 -> 00:03:45] through Utah's tech ecosystem, [00:03:45 -> 00:03:47] and you earned your bachelor's degree [00:03:47 -> 00:03:49] from BYU in economics. [00:03:49 -> 00:03:49] Yep. [00:03:49 -> 00:03:52] And Blake has also been associated with investments [00:03:52 -> 00:03:54] in huge names here in Utah. [00:03:54 -> 00:03:56] If you're familiar with the Utah ecosystem, [00:03:56 -> 00:03:59] we're talking like Fusion.

io, Domo, [00:04:00 -> 00:04:02] Metacloud, Strider, Red Hat, Riverbed, [00:04:03 -> 00:04:07] like the tech ecosystem foundational pieces. [00:04:07 -> 00:04:08] Blake's been a part of it, [00:04:08 -> 00:04:10] and not like anything has changed, [00:04:10 -> 00:04:12] but the historical track record [00:04:12 -> 00:04:14] of what Blake's been a part of is phenomenal. [00:04:14 -> 00:04:16] And so, welcome, Blake. [00:04:16 -> 00:04:18] Thank you for coming to the podcast.

[00:04:18 -> 00:04:19] Thank you for coming. [00:04:19 -> 00:04:22] This started because John attended [00:04:22 -> 00:04:24] Blake's amazing birthday party. [00:04:24 -> 00:04:25] We share the same birthday. [00:04:25 -> 00:04:26] Yeah, you guys have the same birthday.

[00:04:26 -> 00:04:28] And so, we've always had fun with that. [00:04:28 -> 00:04:30] And then this year, his wife and daughters [00:04:30 -> 00:04:31] threw him a surprise party, [00:04:31 -> 00:04:33] and somehow they kept it from it. [00:04:33 -> 00:04:34] It was just a great party. [00:04:34 -> 00:04:35] Yeah, that's awesome.

[00:04:35 -> 00:04:37] And my dad literally texted me at your party [00:04:37 -> 00:04:37] and was like, [00:04:38 -> 00:04:39] why have we not had Blake on the podcast? [00:04:39 -> 00:04:40] I'm like, I have no idea. [00:04:40 -> 00:04:42] We need to get Blake on the podcast. [00:04:42 -> 00:04:42] Let's get him here.

[00:04:42 -> 00:04:43] So, we're here. [00:04:43 -> 00:04:44] We're finally here. [00:04:44 -> 00:04:44] Okay. [00:04:45 -> 00:04:46] So, Blake, I don't know if you've ever watched [00:04:46 -> 00:04:47] one of our episodes.

[00:04:47 -> 00:04:48] No fault to you if you haven't. [00:04:48 -> 00:04:49] You're a busy dude. [00:04:49 -> 00:04:51] But we always start the podcast off [00:04:51 -> 00:04:52] with something fun. [00:04:52 -> 00:04:54] I like to throw something at our guests.

[00:04:54 -> 00:04:55] We call it the icebreaker. [00:04:56 -> 00:04:57] And so, I have an icebreaker for you today. [00:04:57 -> 00:04:59] We're doing it for like three, five minutes, [00:04:59 -> 00:05:00] and then we'll get into the podcast. [00:05:00 -> 00:05:01] Is that okay?

[00:05:01 -> 00:05:01] That'll work. [00:05:01 -> 00:05:02] Okay. [00:05:02 -> 00:05:02] So, here we go. [00:05:03 -> 00:05:04] Today's icebreaker is a fun one [00:05:04 -> 00:05:06] because I feel like typically [00:05:06 -> 00:05:08] when we have a venture guest, [00:05:08 -> 00:05:08] it's like, [00:05:08 -> 00:05:09] oh, would you invest in this?

[00:05:09 -> 00:05:10] Here's a scenario. [00:05:10 -> 00:05:12] I want to tweak that just a little bit [00:05:12 -> 00:05:13] because I have John here. [00:05:13 -> 00:05:15] I want John to play in the game too. [00:05:15 -> 00:05:16] And we have you here.

[00:05:16 -> 00:05:17] And I want to kind of, [00:05:17 -> 00:05:18] because you're both investors, [00:05:19 -> 00:05:20] you're both in venture, [00:05:20 -> 00:05:22] I think it's going to get a cool perspective [00:05:22 -> 00:05:23] of the difference, [00:05:23 -> 00:05:24] the way you guys look at deals. [00:05:25 -> 00:05:26] So, this is called [00:05:26 -> 00:05:28] what has to be true. [00:05:28 -> 00:05:29] So, I don't want you to just say, [00:05:29 -> 00:05:31] would you invest in it or not?

[00:05:31 -> 00:05:33] What has to be true [00:05:33 -> 00:05:35] in this made up scenario [00:05:35 -> 00:05:37] for you to invest in it? [00:05:37 -> 00:05:38] I think it'll be really insightful [00:05:38 -> 00:05:39] for everybody, okay? [00:05:39 -> 00:05:39] Go for it. [00:05:39 -> 00:05:39] Okay.

[00:05:39 -> 00:05:40] So, scenario one. [00:05:40 -> 00:05:41] You ready, Blake? [00:05:41 -> 00:05:41] Yep. [00:05:41 -> 00:05:42] And dad, you ready?

[00:05:43 -> 00:05:43] Okay. [00:05:43 -> 00:05:45] So, this is scenario one. [00:05:45 -> 00:05:47] Two technical founders, okay? [00:05:47 -> 00:05:48] They're very sharp founders.

[00:05:49 -> 00:05:51] Big AI vision right now, okay? [00:05:51 -> 00:05:53] They have a strong prototype, [00:05:54 -> 00:05:55] a few designs and partners [00:05:55 -> 00:05:56] going along with it, [00:05:57 -> 00:05:58] no revenues. [00:05:58 -> 00:06:00] What has to be true [00:06:00 -> 00:06:02] for you to invest in that scenario? [00:06:04 -> 00:06:04] Yeah.

[00:06:04 -> 00:06:04] You know what? [00:06:06 -> 00:06:07] The founders have to be true. [00:06:07 -> 00:06:08] And what I mean by that is, [00:06:08 -> 00:06:11] if you think about great companies, [00:06:11 -> 00:06:12] oftentimes, [00:06:13 -> 00:06:15] you can look behind the curtain [00:06:15 -> 00:06:16] and those founders, [00:06:16 -> 00:06:17] they're crazy, [00:06:17 -> 00:06:18] they're amazing, [00:06:18 -> 00:06:19] they're nuts, [00:06:19 -> 00:06:20] they're unbelievable, [00:06:20 -> 00:06:22] like every adjective on the planet.

[00:06:23 -> 00:06:24] And we can go down a list [00:06:24 -> 00:06:24] of the Utah guys [00:06:24 -> 00:06:25] and talk about them. [00:06:25 -> 00:06:26] Yeah. [00:06:26 -> 00:06:27] But the nuts, [00:06:27 -> 00:06:29] but then what's so interesting [00:06:29 -> 00:06:31] is the plus one. [00:06:31 -> 00:06:33] You got to understand the plus one.

[00:06:33 -> 00:06:34] Is the plus one [00:06:34 -> 00:06:36] on the journey with them [00:06:36 -> 00:06:37] to build an amazing company? [00:06:38 -> 00:06:38] And if they are, [00:06:39 -> 00:06:39] that could be [00:06:39 -> 00:06:41] a fascinating combination. [00:06:41 -> 00:06:42] So plus one meaning [00:06:42 -> 00:06:43] like their spouse [00:06:43 -> 00:06:43] or their partner? [00:06:43 -> 00:06:44] Spouse, partner, [00:06:45 -> 00:06:46] boyfriend, girlfriend, [00:06:46 -> 00:06:46] whatever, [00:06:46 -> 00:06:48] whoever is in the trenches [00:06:48 -> 00:06:49] with them.

[00:06:49 -> 00:06:50] On the daily, yeah. [00:06:50 -> 00:06:51] Even if they're not part [00:06:51 -> 00:06:51] of the company, [00:06:51 -> 00:06:53] they have to be all in. [00:06:53 -> 00:06:54] Because you know what? [00:06:54 -> 00:06:56] If my wife was not all in [00:06:56 -> 00:06:57] on Pelion in the beginning, [00:06:57 -> 00:06:59] I'm not sure I'd be sitting here.

[00:06:59 -> 00:07:01] So I'm always looking for [00:07:01 -> 00:07:02] what the plus one [00:07:02 -> 00:07:03] and how they think [00:07:03 -> 00:07:04] about the journey. [00:07:04 -> 00:07:05] Yeah. [00:07:05 -> 00:07:07] So no revenues? [00:07:07 -> 00:07:08] Are you investing?

[00:07:08 -> 00:07:10] So you want to hear [00:07:10 -> 00:07:10] what it would have [00:07:10 -> 00:07:11] to be true for me? [00:07:11 -> 00:07:12] Yeah. [00:07:12 -> 00:07:12] So first of all, [00:07:12 -> 00:07:14] I want to echo what he says. [00:07:14 -> 00:07:15] Founder market fit.

[00:07:15 -> 00:07:16] You and I talk about [00:07:16 -> 00:07:16] all the time. [00:07:16 -> 00:07:16] Yeah. [00:07:16 -> 00:07:17] We like to see that [00:07:17 -> 00:07:19] the founder has some fit [00:07:19 -> 00:07:20] to the market they're pursuing. [00:07:20 -> 00:07:21] But you know, [00:07:21 -> 00:07:23] you'll be finding this interesting.

[00:07:23 -> 00:07:24] Tyra and I routinely, [00:07:24 -> 00:07:25] when we're looking [00:07:25 -> 00:07:26] at potential investments, [00:07:27 -> 00:07:27] go to dinner [00:07:27 -> 00:07:28] with all the founders [00:07:28 -> 00:07:29] and their spouses. [00:07:29 -> 00:07:31] And we bring our spouses [00:07:31 -> 00:07:32] and there's been [00:07:32 -> 00:07:34] not a few deals [00:07:34 -> 00:07:35] where our spouses [00:07:35 -> 00:07:35] after says, [00:07:35 -> 00:07:35] nope, [00:07:36 -> 00:07:37] that's not an investment [00:07:37 -> 00:07:38] and we don't invest.

[00:07:38 -> 00:07:38] Well, [00:07:38 -> 00:07:39] one of them, [00:07:39 -> 00:07:40] we actually went to dinner [00:07:40 -> 00:07:43] and it was a recruiting dinner [00:07:43 -> 00:07:44] almost because we were [00:07:44 -> 00:07:45] replacing a CTO, [00:07:45 -> 00:07:46] a CTO there, [00:07:46 -> 00:07:47] a technical co-founder. [00:07:48 -> 00:07:49] And I think, [00:07:49 -> 00:07:50] yeah, [00:07:50 -> 00:07:50] my mom, [00:07:50 -> 00:07:52] your wife was like, [00:07:52 -> 00:07:53] that's a no-go.

[00:07:53 -> 00:07:54] They are not going to be there [00:07:54 -> 00:07:55] for the long haul. [00:07:55 -> 00:07:55] I asked the wife, [00:07:56 -> 00:07:56] I said, [00:07:56 -> 00:07:57] whatever her name was, [00:07:57 -> 00:07:58] let's say her name was Julie. [00:07:58 -> 00:07:58] I said, [00:07:58 -> 00:07:58] Julie, [00:07:59 -> 00:07:59] so you weren't ready [00:07:59 -> 00:08:00] for this ride [00:08:00 -> 00:08:01] on this journey, [00:08:01 -> 00:08:02] this entrepreneurial ride [00:08:02 -> 00:08:03] and the ups and downs [00:08:03 -> 00:08:04] it's going to bring [00:08:04 -> 00:08:05] and the fun it's going to be.

[00:08:05 -> 00:08:05] And she goes, [00:08:06 -> 00:08:07] and her answer literally [00:08:07 -> 00:08:08] back at this dinner was, [00:08:08 -> 00:08:10] I'm not even sure [00:08:10 -> 00:08:10] why I'm here. [00:08:11 -> 00:08:12] I told him I didn't want him [00:08:12 -> 00:08:12] to do a startup. [00:08:14 -> 00:08:15] There you go. [00:08:15 -> 00:08:17] Like that is so spot on.

[00:08:17 -> 00:08:18] What's interesting is [00:08:18 -> 00:08:20] we try to do exactly [00:08:20 -> 00:08:21] what you guys do. [00:08:22 -> 00:08:22] Yeah. [00:08:22 -> 00:08:23] Take Sandy, [00:08:23 -> 00:08:24] take my wife, [00:08:24 -> 00:08:24] we go, [00:08:24 -> 00:08:25] we have dinner [00:08:25 -> 00:08:27] and it's fascinating [00:08:27 -> 00:08:29] to have that conversation [00:08:29 -> 00:08:30] and watch that. [00:08:30 -> 00:08:31] Oh, [00:08:31 -> 00:08:33] and you learn so much.

[00:08:33 -> 00:08:34] And then when you see [00:08:34 -> 00:08:35] the spouse completely [00:08:35 -> 00:08:36] dominate the conversation [00:08:36 -> 00:08:38] and the founder [00:08:38 -> 00:08:39] is just sitting there quiet, [00:08:40 -> 00:08:41] you better make sure [00:08:41 -> 00:08:42] that spouse is on board. [00:08:42 -> 00:08:42] Yeah, [00:08:42 -> 00:08:43] totally. [00:08:43 -> 00:08:44] Yeah, [00:08:44 -> 00:08:44] totally. [00:08:44 -> 00:08:44] That's, [00:08:45 -> 00:08:46] here's another thing.

[00:08:46 -> 00:08:47] So that has to be true. [00:08:47 -> 00:08:47] Yes. [00:08:47 -> 00:08:49] Another thing is [00:08:49 -> 00:08:50] there has to be a true wedge, [00:08:50 -> 00:08:51] even though they might [00:08:51 -> 00:08:52] have this grand vision. [00:08:52 -> 00:08:53] I want to know [00:08:53 -> 00:08:54] in the next six months [00:08:54 -> 00:08:55] how they're going to get [00:08:55 -> 00:08:56] their early revenue.

[00:08:56 -> 00:08:57] What is, [00:08:57 -> 00:08:58] how are they going to wedge [00:08:58 -> 00:08:59] themselves in the market? [00:08:59 -> 00:09:00] Even if that's not [00:09:00 -> 00:09:02] the big grandiose vision [00:09:02 -> 00:09:03] that'll eventually be [00:09:03 -> 00:09:04] the biggest revenue center. [00:09:04 -> 00:09:05] I want to know [00:09:05 -> 00:09:06] who are they going to [00:09:06 -> 00:09:07] get revenue from? [00:09:07 -> 00:09:07] What's their plan?

[00:09:08 -> 00:09:08] How, [00:09:08 -> 00:09:09] what is it that's going [00:09:09 -> 00:09:10] to get them wedged [00:09:10 -> 00:09:10] into the market? [00:09:11 -> 00:09:11] Because if they can't [00:09:11 -> 00:09:12] find a wedge, [00:09:12 -> 00:09:13] a startup doesn't, [00:09:13 -> 00:09:13] they, [00:09:13 -> 00:09:15] they might run into just [00:09:15 -> 00:09:15] an, [00:09:15 -> 00:09:16] they can't wedge [00:09:16 -> 00:09:17] their way in. [00:09:17 -> 00:09:18] I need to know [00:09:18 -> 00:09:18] how they're going [00:09:18 -> 00:09:19] to wedge their way in.

[00:09:19 -> 00:09:20] We're going to assume [00:09:20 -> 00:09:21] it's a massive market [00:09:21 -> 00:09:22] because you said it's AI. [00:09:23 -> 00:09:24] But to build on that, [00:09:24 -> 00:09:25] we look for [00:09:25 -> 00:09:26] what is the moat? [00:09:27 -> 00:09:27] Yeah. [00:09:28 -> 00:09:29] What's the defensibility?

[00:09:29 -> 00:09:30] Because, [00:09:30 -> 00:09:30] you know, [00:09:30 -> 00:09:31] especially with AI. [00:09:32 -> 00:09:32] How important is it [00:09:32 -> 00:09:33] with AI? [00:09:33 -> 00:09:34] You can look at it, [00:09:34 -> 00:09:35] the rate at which [00:09:35 -> 00:09:36] companies go from [00:09:36 -> 00:09:37] zero to [00:09:37 -> 00:09:38] a hundred million dollars [00:09:38 -> 00:09:40] is so fast. [00:09:40 -> 00:09:41] What's the moat?

[00:09:41 -> 00:09:41] So, [00:09:42 -> 00:09:42] okay, [00:09:42 -> 00:09:43] let's piggyback off [00:09:43 -> 00:09:44] of that for a second here. [00:09:45 -> 00:09:45] So, [00:09:45 -> 00:09:47] if this has no revenues [00:09:47 -> 00:09:48] and this is like [00:09:48 -> 00:09:49] a strong prototype, [00:09:50 -> 00:09:51] big AI vision, [00:09:51 -> 00:09:52] like what are you [00:09:52 -> 00:09:53] looking for [00:09:53 -> 00:09:54] for that moat? [00:09:54 -> 00:09:55] They have no traction.

[00:09:55 -> 00:09:56] They don't have customers. [00:09:56 -> 00:09:56] They don't have revenue. [00:09:57 -> 00:09:57] Like what, [00:09:57 -> 00:09:58] what would it take [00:09:58 -> 00:09:59] for you to invest [00:09:59 -> 00:10:00] in that exact scenario? [00:10:00 -> 00:10:00] Yeah.

[00:10:01 -> 00:10:01] So, [00:10:02 -> 00:10:02] look, [00:10:02 -> 00:10:03] I think AI [00:10:03 -> 00:10:04] is disrupting software. [00:10:04 -> 00:10:05] Yeah. [00:10:05 -> 00:10:05] So, [00:10:05 -> 00:10:06] like what, [00:10:06 -> 00:10:07] what does it look like [00:10:07 -> 00:10:08] at this point in time? [00:10:08 -> 00:10:09] And what is the uniqueness?

[00:10:09 -> 00:10:10] And that could be [00:10:10 -> 00:10:11] founder knowledge. [00:10:12 -> 00:10:12] It could be [00:10:12 -> 00:10:14] early prototype, [00:10:14 -> 00:10:14] you know, [00:10:15 -> 00:10:16] customer traction, [00:10:16 -> 00:10:17] comments, [00:10:18 -> 00:10:18] contracts. [00:10:19 -> 00:10:19] Yeah, [00:10:19 -> 00:10:19] like, [00:10:19 -> 00:10:20] like all of that [00:10:20 -> 00:10:21] sort of stuff [00:10:21 -> 00:10:22] You have to see [00:10:22 -> 00:10:23] proof of the demand.

[00:10:23 -> 00:10:23] Yeah. [00:10:23 -> 00:10:24] You know, [00:10:24 -> 00:10:24] look, [00:10:24 -> 00:10:25] we invest, [00:10:25 -> 00:10:26] you guys, [00:10:26 -> 00:10:27] us, [00:10:27 -> 00:10:28] at such an early stage, [00:10:28 -> 00:10:29] the biggest risk [00:10:29 -> 00:10:30] we're taking [00:10:30 -> 00:10:31] is product market fit. [00:10:31 -> 00:10:31] Yeah. [00:10:32 -> 00:10:33] And so, [00:10:33 -> 00:10:34] how can you de-risk [00:10:34 -> 00:10:35] product market fit?

[00:10:35 -> 00:10:36] And you start looking [00:10:36 -> 00:10:37] at all of these [00:10:37 -> 00:10:37] sorts of things. [00:10:37 -> 00:10:38] We still have [00:10:38 -> 00:10:39] the product market fit [00:10:39 -> 00:10:40] that sits out here [00:10:40 -> 00:10:40] because, [00:10:41 -> 00:10:41] you know what, [00:10:42 -> 00:10:42] push in, [00:10:43 -> 00:10:43] Anthropic [00:10:43 -> 00:10:45] makes an announcement [00:10:45 -> 00:10:45] that they're going [00:10:45 -> 00:10:46] to do that feature.

[00:10:46 -> 00:10:47] So, [00:10:47 -> 00:10:48] you got to sift [00:10:48 -> 00:10:49] through all of that [00:10:51 -> 00:10:51] May of 2023, [00:10:52 -> 00:10:52] which is the month [00:10:52 -> 00:10:53] I kind of peg [00:10:53 -> 00:10:55] when AI went mainstream [00:10:55 -> 00:10:56] and all the deals [00:10:56 -> 00:10:57] we've seen [00:10:57 -> 00:10:58] countless times [00:10:58 -> 00:10:59] where entrepreneurs [00:10:59 -> 00:11:00] have pitched us [00:11:00 -> 00:11:01] and one month later [00:11:01 -> 00:11:03] their entire business model [00:11:03 -> 00:11:04] is completely [00:11:04 -> 00:11:05] upended [00:11:05 -> 00:11:06] by an announcement [00:11:06 -> 00:11:07] from one of the big [00:11:07 -> 00:11:08] LLMs or whatever.

[00:11:08 -> 00:11:09] It's crazy. [00:11:09 -> 00:11:09] I mean, [00:11:09 -> 00:11:10] that we, [00:11:10 -> 00:11:11] everybody says [00:11:11 -> 00:11:11] AI, [00:11:11 -> 00:11:11] AI, [00:11:11 -> 00:11:13] AI this, [00:11:13 -> 00:11:13] AI that, [00:11:13 -> 00:11:14] but literally [00:11:14 -> 00:11:15] you have to be [00:11:15 -> 00:11:15] very careful [00:11:15 -> 00:11:16] as a venture investor [00:11:16 -> 00:11:17] because the [00:11:17 -> 00:11:18] disintermediation [00:11:18 -> 00:11:20] is so rapid [00:11:20 -> 00:11:21] these days, [00:11:21 -> 00:11:21] isn't it?

[00:11:22 -> 00:11:22] It's, [00:11:22 -> 00:11:22] it's, [00:11:23 -> 00:11:24] you know, [00:11:24 -> 00:11:25] are you a little bit [00:11:25 -> 00:11:26] scared of the disruption [00:11:26 -> 00:11:27] or is there like [00:11:27 -> 00:11:28] no percentage [00:11:28 -> 00:11:30] of anxiety over it? [00:11:31 -> 00:11:33] I have a ton [00:11:33 -> 00:11:33] of fear, [00:11:33 -> 00:11:34] a ton of anxiety [00:11:34 -> 00:11:35] and a ton [00:11:35 -> 00:11:36] of excitement.

[00:11:36 -> 00:11:37] The reason I say [00:11:37 -> 00:11:38] that is [00:11:38 -> 00:11:39] your dad and I [00:11:39 -> 00:11:40] have lived through [00:11:40 -> 00:11:41] multiple cycles. [00:11:42 -> 00:11:43] The biggest [00:11:43 -> 00:11:44] companies [00:11:44 -> 00:11:45] I've invested [00:11:45 -> 00:11:45] into [00:11:45 -> 00:11:46] came on the heels [00:11:46 -> 00:11:46] of the internet [00:11:46 -> 00:11:47] bubble bursting [00:11:47 -> 00:11:48] the financial [00:11:48 -> 00:11:49] crisis meltdown [00:11:49 -> 00:11:51] cloud computing [00:11:51 -> 00:11:51] coming online [00:11:51 -> 00:11:53] mobile computing.

[00:11:53 -> 00:11:54] I think [00:11:54 -> 00:11:56] especially now, [00:11:56 -> 00:11:57] now is the time [00:11:57 -> 00:11:58] to be an entrepreneur [00:11:58 -> 00:11:59] to build an amazing [00:11:59 -> 00:12:00] company. [00:12:00 -> 00:12:01] The chaos, [00:12:02 -> 00:12:02] the carnage, [00:12:03 -> 00:12:04] it's coming, [00:12:04 -> 00:12:04] it's here, [00:12:05 -> 00:12:05] but man, [00:12:06 -> 00:12:06] there's going to be [00:12:06 -> 00:12:07] some amazing companies [00:12:07 -> 00:12:08] that are going to [00:12:08 -> 00:12:10] come out of this.

[00:12:10 -> 00:12:11] After the bubble [00:12:11 -> 00:12:11] bursts [00:12:11 -> 00:12:12] and we're in the trough [00:12:12 -> 00:12:13] is the best time [00:12:13 -> 00:12:13] to invest [00:12:13 -> 00:12:14] and the best time [00:12:14 -> 00:12:14] to be an entrepreneur. [00:12:15 -> 00:12:15] No doubt about it. [00:12:15 -> 00:12:16] One of my, [00:12:16 -> 00:12:16] one of my [00:12:16 -> 00:12:18] greatest companies [00:12:18 -> 00:12:18] that I've ever [00:12:18 -> 00:12:19] invested into [00:12:19 -> 00:12:20] came on the heels [00:12:20 -> 00:12:21] of the internet [00:12:21 -> 00:12:22] bubble burst, [00:12:22 -> 00:12:22] Red Hat.

[00:12:23 -> 00:12:24] Like, [00:12:24 -> 00:12:24] I put money [00:12:24 -> 00:12:25] into Red Hat [00:12:25 -> 00:12:26] right in that [00:12:26 -> 00:12:26] kind of, [00:12:27 -> 00:12:28] the world is [00:12:28 -> 00:12:29] growing, [00:12:30 -> 00:12:30] melting down, [00:12:30 -> 00:12:31] all that kind [00:12:31 -> 00:12:31] of stuff. [00:12:32 -> 00:12:33] Roll forward, [00:12:33 -> 00:12:34] it comes out [00:12:34 -> 00:12:34] the other end, [00:12:35 -> 00:12:35] I invest in [00:12:35 -> 00:12:36] Riverbed.

[00:12:37 -> 00:12:38] Cloud computing [00:12:38 -> 00:12:39] becomes all [00:12:39 -> 00:12:40] mainstream. [00:12:40 -> 00:12:41] Like, [00:12:41 -> 00:12:41] think about it. [00:12:41 -> 00:12:42] Do you remember [00:12:42 -> 00:12:42] the day when [00:12:42 -> 00:12:43] people said, [00:12:43 -> 00:12:44] especially the banks, [00:12:44 -> 00:12:45] I'm never [00:12:45 -> 00:12:46] putting my data [00:12:46 -> 00:12:46] into the cloud. [00:12:47 -> 00:12:47] Oh yeah.

[00:12:47 -> 00:12:48] Remember Salesforce? [00:12:49 -> 00:12:49] Yeah. [00:12:49 -> 00:12:49] Everybody said, [00:12:49 -> 00:12:50] that's stupid. [00:12:50 -> 00:12:50] Why would I [00:12:50 -> 00:12:51] put my idea [00:12:51 -> 00:12:52] on the planet?

[00:12:52 -> 00:12:53] Biggest SaaS [00:12:53 -> 00:12:53] company in the world. [00:12:54 -> 00:12:54] That's when we [00:12:54 -> 00:12:55] invested into [00:12:55 -> 00:12:55] Cloudflare. [00:12:56 -> 00:12:56] Yeah. [00:12:56 -> 00:12:57] You know, [00:12:57 -> 00:12:57] there's a company [00:12:57 -> 00:12:58] that has a $70 [00:12:58 -> 00:12:59] billion market cap [00:12:59 -> 00:13:00] today.

[00:13:00 -> 00:13:01] We want to hear [00:13:01 -> 00:13:01] all about that [00:13:01 -> 00:13:02] experience a little [00:13:02 -> 00:13:02] bit later as we [00:13:02 -> 00:13:03] go through [00:13:03 -> 00:13:03] your history [00:13:03 -> 00:13:03] on that. [00:13:03 -> 00:13:04] Okay. [00:13:04 -> 00:13:04] Keep going. [00:13:04 -> 00:13:04] Keep going.

[00:13:04 -> 00:13:05] Guys, [00:13:05 -> 00:13:05] we've done [00:13:05 -> 00:13:06] one scenario. [00:13:09 -> 00:13:09] Here we go. [00:13:09 -> 00:13:10] I'm only going [00:13:10 -> 00:13:10] to do one more [00:13:10 -> 00:13:11] if that's as long [00:13:11 -> 00:13:11] as they're going [00:13:11 -> 00:13:12] to take, [00:13:12 -> 00:13:12] but here we go. [00:13:14 -> 00:13:16] So here's the [00:13:16 -> 00:13:17] other end [00:13:17 -> 00:13:17] of the spectrum.

[00:13:18 -> 00:13:19] SaaS company [00:13:19 -> 00:13:21] doing $400,000 [00:13:21 -> 00:13:22] a month. [00:13:22 -> 00:13:23] Okay. [00:13:23 -> 00:13:24] Customers are [00:13:24 -> 00:13:25] super happy. [00:13:26 -> 00:13:27] Strong retention.

[00:13:27 -> 00:13:28] Steady, [00:13:28 -> 00:13:29] but not explosive [00:13:29 -> 00:13:30] growth right now. [00:13:30 -> 00:13:31] It's been a little [00:13:31 -> 00:13:32] bit laggy. [00:13:32 -> 00:13:33] Okay. [00:13:33 -> 00:13:34] They're getting [00:13:34 -> 00:13:35] to profitability.

[00:13:35 -> 00:13:36] They've raised [00:13:36 -> 00:13:37] some money before [00:13:37 -> 00:13:38] to get to this point. [00:13:38 -> 00:13:38] Okay. [00:13:39 -> 00:13:40] They want [00:13:40 -> 00:13:41] a super high [00:13:41 -> 00:13:42] valuation. [00:13:42 -> 00:13:43] What has to [00:13:43 -> 00:13:44] be true [00:13:44 -> 00:13:45] for you [00:13:45 -> 00:13:45] to put [00:13:45 -> 00:13:46] dollars [00:13:46 -> 00:13:46] into that [00:13:46 -> 00:13:47] company?

[00:13:49 -> 00:13:50] I probably [00:13:50 -> 00:13:50] wouldn't. [00:13:50 -> 00:13:51] You wouldn't? [00:13:51 -> 00:13:51] No. [00:13:51 -> 00:13:52] And the reason [00:13:52 -> 00:13:52] I say that, [00:13:52 -> 00:13:53] look, [00:13:53 -> 00:13:54] I think the [00:13:54 -> 00:13:55] SaaS apocalypse [00:13:55 -> 00:13:56] that people [00:13:56 -> 00:13:56] talk about [00:13:56 -> 00:13:57] is probably [00:13:57 -> 00:13:58] overblown [00:13:58 -> 00:13:58] today.

[00:13:58 -> 00:13:59] Yeah, [00:13:59 -> 00:13:59] yeah, [00:13:59 -> 00:13:59] yeah. [00:13:59 -> 00:14:00] So what I'd [00:14:00 -> 00:14:00] say is, [00:14:01 -> 00:14:02] what is [00:14:02 -> 00:14:03] their AI? [00:14:03 -> 00:14:03] How are [00:14:03 -> 00:14:04] they embracing [00:14:04 -> 00:14:04] AI? [00:14:04 -> 00:14:05] It has to [00:14:05 -> 00:14:05] have AI.

[00:14:06 -> 00:14:06] It has to [00:14:06 -> 00:14:07] have AI. [00:14:07 -> 00:14:07] And, [00:14:07 -> 00:14:08] you know, [00:14:08 -> 00:14:09] look, [00:14:09 -> 00:14:10] Canopy, [00:14:10 -> 00:14:10] one of our [00:14:10 -> 00:14:11] companies, [00:14:11 -> 00:14:12] Davis Bell, [00:14:12 -> 00:14:13] an amazing [00:14:13 -> 00:14:13] entrepreneur, [00:14:14 -> 00:14:14] it's a SaaS [00:14:14 -> 00:14:15] company, [00:14:15 -> 00:14:16] but what he, [00:14:16 -> 00:14:17] how he is [00:14:17 -> 00:14:18] embracing AI [00:14:18 -> 00:14:18] inside of that [00:14:18 -> 00:14:19] company.

[00:14:19 -> 00:14:20] So I use that [00:14:20 -> 00:14:21] as an example. [00:14:21 -> 00:14:21] It could be an [00:14:21 -> 00:14:22] amazing business, [00:14:22 -> 00:14:23] but how are they [00:14:23 -> 00:14:24] embracing AI? [00:14:24 -> 00:14:25] How are they [00:14:25 -> 00:14:26] utilizing it [00:14:26 -> 00:14:26] internally? [00:14:26 -> 00:14:27] How is it part [00:14:27 -> 00:14:28] of their product?

[00:14:28 -> 00:14:29] Because if they [00:14:29 -> 00:14:30] don't, [00:14:31 -> 00:14:31] they'll be dead. [00:14:32 -> 00:14:32] They'll be dead. [00:14:32 -> 00:14:33] So I, [00:14:33 -> 00:14:34] I maybe want to [00:14:34 -> 00:14:35] push back a little [00:14:35 -> 00:14:35] bit, Blake, [00:14:35 -> 00:14:35] on you. [00:14:35 -> 00:14:36] I'm pushing back [00:14:36 -> 00:14:36] the managing [00:14:36 -> 00:14:37] partner opinion [00:14:37 -> 00:14:37] on a little [00:14:37 -> 00:14:38] bit here.

[00:14:38 -> 00:14:39] But, [00:14:39 -> 00:14:41] I feel like [00:14:41 -> 00:14:41] almost every [00:14:41 -> 00:14:42] SaaS company [00:14:42 -> 00:14:43] is utilizing [00:14:43 -> 00:14:44] AI at this [00:14:44 -> 00:14:44] point. [00:14:45 -> 00:14:45] So I think [00:14:45 -> 00:14:45] to assume [00:14:45 -> 00:14:46] that they [00:14:46 -> 00:14:47] wouldn't be, [00:14:47 -> 00:14:48] would almost [00:14:48 -> 00:14:49] be an assumption. [00:14:49 -> 00:14:50] Whether they're [00:14:50 -> 00:14:50] using it to [00:14:50 -> 00:14:51] be more [00:14:51 -> 00:14:51] efficient [00:14:51 -> 00:14:52] internally, [00:14:52 -> 00:14:52] or if they're [00:14:52 -> 00:14:53] embedding it [00:14:53 -> 00:14:53] in their [00:14:53 -> 00:14:54] products and [00:14:54 -> 00:14:54] features.

[00:14:54 -> 00:14:55] Those are [00:14:55 -> 00:14:55] two different [00:14:55 -> 00:14:56] issues. [00:14:56 -> 00:14:56] Maybe this [00:14:56 -> 00:14:57] company, [00:14:57 -> 00:14:57] because they [00:14:57 -> 00:14:57] are a little [00:14:57 -> 00:14:58] bit more [00:14:58 -> 00:14:58] mature, [00:14:58 -> 00:14:59] so they [00:14:59 -> 00:14:59] probably are [00:14:59 -> 00:15:00] rooted in [00:15:00 -> 00:15:00] their ways. [00:15:01 -> 00:15:01] Maybe they [00:15:01 -> 00:15:01] haven't [00:15:01 -> 00:15:02] evolved yet, [00:15:02 -> 00:15:03] but assuming [00:15:03 -> 00:15:04] that they [00:15:04 -> 00:15:05] are utilizing [00:15:05 -> 00:15:06] AI in some [00:15:06 -> 00:15:06] way, [00:15:06 -> 00:15:06] shape, [00:15:06 -> 00:15:07] or form, [00:15:07 -> 00:15:07] because they're [00:15:07 -> 00:15:08] obviously a [00:15:08 -> 00:15:08] mature company, [00:15:08 -> 00:15:09] they have [00:15:09 -> 00:15:10] the employees [00:15:10 -> 00:15:10] and the [00:15:10 -> 00:15:11] at least [00:15:11 -> 00:15:12] futuristic [00:15:12 -> 00:15:12] outlook to [00:15:12 -> 00:15:13] say, [00:15:13 -> 00:15:13] okay, [00:15:13 -> 00:15:13] we need to [00:15:13 -> 00:15:14] be embracing [00:15:14 -> 00:15:14] AI, [00:15:14 -> 00:15:15] right?

[00:15:15 -> 00:15:15] They're [00:15:15 -> 00:15:15] obviously [00:15:15 -> 00:15:16] doing [00:15:16 -> 00:15:16] something [00:15:16 -> 00:15:16] right. [00:15:17 -> 00:15:17] But, [00:15:17 -> 00:15:17] okay, [00:15:17 -> 00:15:19] so AI [00:15:19 -> 00:15:19] would have [00:15:19 -> 00:15:19] to be [00:15:19 -> 00:15:20] true to [00:15:20 -> 00:15:20] exist. [00:15:20 -> 00:15:21] But why [00:15:21 -> 00:15:21] did you [00:15:21 -> 00:15:21] say you [00:15:21 -> 00:15:22] wouldn't [00:15:22 -> 00:15:22] invest?

[00:15:23 -> 00:15:23] Well, [00:15:23 -> 00:15:24] because [00:15:24 -> 00:15:25] when you [00:15:25 -> 00:15:26] look at [00:15:26 -> 00:15:27] the explosive [00:15:27 -> 00:15:28] growth that's [00:15:28 -> 00:15:28] happening [00:15:28 -> 00:15:29] across all [00:15:29 -> 00:15:30] startup [00:15:30 -> 00:15:30] ecosystem, [00:15:31 -> 00:15:32] if the [00:15:32 -> 00:15:32] company has [00:15:32 -> 00:15:33] not figured [00:15:33 -> 00:15:34] out how [00:15:34 -> 00:15:34] to hit the [00:15:34 -> 00:15:35] acceleration [00:15:35 -> 00:15:36] point, [00:15:36 -> 00:15:39] then are [00:15:39 -> 00:15:39] they going [00:15:39 -> 00:15:39] to be a [00:15:39 -> 00:15:40] lifestyle [00:15:40 -> 00:15:40] company?

[00:15:41 -> 00:15:41] Are they [00:15:41 -> 00:15:42] going to be [00:15:42 -> 00:15:42] a venture [00:15:42 -> 00:15:43] return company? [00:15:44 -> 00:15:44] Those are the [00:15:44 -> 00:15:45] questions that we [00:15:45 -> 00:15:46] would look to [00:15:46 -> 00:15:46] answer. [00:15:46 -> 00:15:47] By the way, [00:15:47 -> 00:15:48] there's a lot [00:15:48 -> 00:15:48] of amazing [00:15:48 -> 00:15:49] businesses out [00:15:49 -> 00:15:51] there that are [00:15:51 -> 00:15:52] growing at [00:15:52 -> 00:15:54] 25% that are [00:15:54 -> 00:15:55] amazing businesses, [00:15:55 -> 00:15:56] but you [00:15:56 -> 00:15:57] can't generate [00:15:57 -> 00:15:58] venture returns [00:15:58 -> 00:15:59] off that [00:15:59 -> 00:16:00] type of [00:16:00 -> 00:16:00] company.

[00:16:00 -> 00:16:00] So, [00:16:00 -> 00:16:01] what we [00:16:01 -> 00:16:01] would do [00:16:01 -> 00:16:02] is we [00:16:02 -> 00:16:02] cheer them [00:16:02 -> 00:16:02] on, [00:16:03 -> 00:16:03] they could [00:16:03 -> 00:16:04] use us [00:16:04 -> 00:16:04] as a [00:16:04 -> 00:16:04] resource, [00:16:05 -> 00:16:05] but we [00:16:05 -> 00:16:06] probably [00:16:06 -> 00:16:06] wouldn't [00:16:06 -> 00:16:06] make an [00:16:06 -> 00:16:07] investment. [00:16:08 -> 00:16:08] Yeah, [00:16:08 -> 00:16:09] and I [00:16:09 -> 00:16:10] would focus [00:16:10 -> 00:16:10] on customers.

[00:16:10 -> 00:16:10] I know [00:16:10 -> 00:16:11] this is [00:16:11 -> 00:16:11] obviously [00:16:11 -> 00:16:12] way beyond [00:16:12 -> 00:16:13] where we [00:16:13 -> 00:16:13] would invest [00:16:13 -> 00:16:14] as a [00:16:14 -> 00:16:15] pre-seed [00:16:15 -> 00:16:15] venture [00:16:15 -> 00:16:15] fund. [00:16:15 -> 00:16:16] And in [00:16:16 -> 00:16:17] disclosure, [00:16:17 -> 00:16:18] I am an [00:16:18 -> 00:16:18] LP of [00:16:18 -> 00:16:19] some [00:16:19 -> 00:16:19] Pelleon [00:16:19 -> 00:16:19] funds.

[00:16:19 -> 00:16:20] If I [00:16:20 -> 00:16:20] were an [00:16:20 -> 00:16:21] investment [00:16:21 -> 00:16:21] committee [00:16:21 -> 00:16:22] member of [00:16:22 -> 00:16:22] a later [00:16:22 -> 00:16:23] stage fund [00:16:23 -> 00:16:23] or whatever, [00:16:24 -> 00:16:24] I would be [00:16:24 -> 00:16:24] looking at [00:16:24 -> 00:16:25] those [00:16:25 -> 00:16:25] customers, [00:16:25 -> 00:16:26] looking at [00:16:26 -> 00:16:26] their churn [00:16:26 -> 00:16:27] rates, [00:16:27 -> 00:16:27] seeing why [00:16:27 -> 00:16:28] they're not [00:16:28 -> 00:16:28] getting more [00:16:28 -> 00:16:29] explosive growth [00:16:29 -> 00:16:30] and what's [00:16:30 -> 00:16:30] going on and [00:16:30 -> 00:16:31] seeing if [00:16:31 -> 00:16:32] they need to [00:16:32 -> 00:16:32] upgrade their [00:16:32 -> 00:16:34] personnel in [00:16:34 -> 00:16:34] sales, [00:16:34 -> 00:16:34] right?

[00:16:35 -> 00:16:35] There's a [00:16:35 -> 00:16:36] way maybe [00:16:36 -> 00:16:36] to get [00:16:36 -> 00:16:36] them to [00:16:36 -> 00:16:36] that, [00:16:37 -> 00:16:37] but I [00:16:37 -> 00:16:37] would not [00:16:37 -> 00:16:38] invest [00:16:38 -> 00:16:38] until they [00:16:38 -> 00:16:39] fixed it. [00:16:39 -> 00:16:40] It's really [00:16:40 -> 00:16:40] the lagging [00:16:40 -> 00:16:41] growth that [00:16:41 -> 00:16:42] is catching [00:16:42 -> 00:16:42] both of [00:16:42 -> 00:16:42] you.

[00:16:42 -> 00:16:43] Why have [00:16:43 -> 00:16:44] you slowed [00:16:44 -> 00:16:44] down? [00:16:44 -> 00:16:44] Why are you [00:16:44 -> 00:16:45] not getting [00:16:45 -> 00:16:46] traction over [00:16:46 -> 00:16:46] the last [00:16:46 -> 00:16:46] six months? [00:16:46 -> 00:16:47] It's [00:16:47 -> 00:16:47] venture [00:16:47 -> 00:16:47] returns. [00:16:48 -> 00:16:50] This is so [00:16:50 -> 00:16:50] good for [00:16:50 -> 00:16:50] our viewers [00:16:50 -> 00:16:51] and listeners [00:16:51 -> 00:16:51] to hear.

[00:16:51 -> 00:16:52] You may have [00:16:52 -> 00:16:52] a great [00:16:52 -> 00:16:53] business, [00:16:53 -> 00:16:53] a great [00:16:53 -> 00:16:53] idea, [00:16:53 -> 00:16:54] whatever, [00:16:54 -> 00:16:54] and we [00:16:54 -> 00:16:55] want to [00:16:55 -> 00:16:56] cheerlead you [00:16:56 -> 00:16:56] for sure [00:16:56 -> 00:16:58] as fellow [00:16:58 -> 00:16:59] participants in [00:16:59 -> 00:17:00] the ecosystem, [00:17:00 -> 00:17:01] but we need [00:17:01 -> 00:17:01] venture returns.

[00:17:02 -> 00:17:02] You need a [00:17:02 -> 00:17:03] certain return. [00:17:03 -> 00:17:03] We're a [00:17:03 -> 00:17:04] pre-seed fund. [00:17:04 -> 00:17:05] You do some [00:17:05 -> 00:17:06] pre-seed investing, [00:17:06 -> 00:17:06] some seed [00:17:06 -> 00:17:07] investing, [00:17:07 -> 00:17:07] but you're [00:17:07 -> 00:17:08] generally all [00:17:08 -> 00:17:09] the way through [00:17:09 -> 00:17:09] series A, [00:17:10 -> 00:17:10] B, [00:17:10 -> 00:17:10] and C, [00:17:10 -> 00:17:10] right?

[00:17:11 -> 00:17:11] And you [00:17:11 -> 00:17:12] have a lot [00:17:12 -> 00:17:12] of capital [00:17:12 -> 00:17:13] reserves and [00:17:13 -> 00:17:13] all that, [00:17:13 -> 00:17:14] but for us [00:17:14 -> 00:17:14] that are [00:17:14 -> 00:17:17] distinctly [00:17:17 -> 00:17:17] pre-seed, [00:17:18 -> 00:17:19] we have to [00:17:19 -> 00:17:19] have that [00:17:19 -> 00:17:20] venture return [00:17:20 -> 00:17:20] capacity. [00:17:20 -> 00:17:21] We believe [00:17:21 -> 00:17:22] this can [00:17:22 -> 00:17:22] get us [00:17:22 -> 00:17:23] 20 to [00:17:23 -> 00:17:24] 60x because [00:17:24 -> 00:17:24] that's what [00:17:24 -> 00:17:25] we go for [00:17:25 -> 00:17:25] to take [00:17:25 -> 00:17:26] these risks.

[00:17:26 -> 00:17:26] And we've [00:17:26 -> 00:17:27] had that [00:17:27 -> 00:17:27] history. [00:17:27 -> 00:17:28] We've had [00:17:28 -> 00:17:28] a lot of [00:17:28 -> 00:17:29] those type [00:17:29 -> 00:17:29] of returns. [00:17:29 -> 00:17:30] If we don't [00:17:30 -> 00:17:30] have a [00:17:30 -> 00:17:30] company where [00:17:30 -> 00:17:31] we think [00:17:31 -> 00:17:31] our first [00:17:31 -> 00:17:32] half a [00:17:32 -> 00:17:32] million [00:17:32 -> 00:17:32] dollars [00:17:32 -> 00:17:33] can get [00:17:33 -> 00:17:34] us at [00:17:34 -> 00:17:35] least a [00:17:35 -> 00:17:36] 20x, [00:17:36 -> 00:17:36] if we don't [00:17:36 -> 00:17:37] believe that, [00:17:37 -> 00:17:37] we're not [00:17:37 -> 00:17:37] going to [00:17:37 -> 00:17:37] invest.

[00:17:37 -> 00:17:38] You have [00:17:38 -> 00:17:39] to show [00:17:39 -> 00:17:39] that. [00:17:39 -> 00:17:39] As a [00:17:39 -> 00:17:39] founder [00:17:39 -> 00:17:40] pitching [00:17:40 -> 00:17:40] and trying [00:17:40 -> 00:17:41] to say, [00:17:41 -> 00:17:41] oh, [00:17:41 -> 00:17:41] why are [00:17:41 -> 00:17:42] these VCs [00:17:42 -> 00:17:42] not investing [00:17:42 -> 00:17:43] or giving [00:17:43 -> 00:17:44] me a second [00:17:44 -> 00:17:44] meeting or [00:17:44 -> 00:17:45] looking at [00:17:45 -> 00:17:45] my deal?

[00:17:45 -> 00:17:46] You have [00:17:46 -> 00:17:46] to show [00:17:46 -> 00:17:47] that it [00:17:47 -> 00:17:47] is a [00:17:47 -> 00:17:48] returning [00:17:48 -> 00:17:49] idea. [00:17:49 -> 00:17:50] 100%. [00:17:50 -> 00:17:50] We have [00:17:50 -> 00:17:51] to have [00:17:51 -> 00:17:52] a portfolio [00:17:52 -> 00:17:52] of 20 [00:17:52 -> 00:17:53] companies. [00:17:53 -> 00:17:53] We have [00:17:53 -> 00:17:53] to have [00:17:53 -> 00:17:54] four or [00:17:54 -> 00:17:54] more that [00:17:54 -> 00:17:55] hit 20x [00:17:55 -> 00:17:56] because we're [00:17:56 -> 00:17:56] going to [00:17:56 -> 00:17:56] have a lot [00:17:56 -> 00:17:57] of losses [00:17:57 -> 00:17:57] in pre-seed.

[00:17:58 -> 00:17:58] It's not easy. [00:17:58 -> 00:17:58] It's not [00:17:58 -> 00:17:59] like greedy [00:17:59 -> 00:18:00] VCs here, [00:18:00 -> 00:18:01] but it's [00:18:01 -> 00:18:01] really just [00:18:01 -> 00:18:01] true. [00:18:02 -> 00:18:02] The money [00:18:02 -> 00:18:04] revolves around [00:18:04 -> 00:18:04] the world. [00:18:04 -> 00:18:05] The world [00:18:05 -> 00:18:05] revolves around [00:18:05 -> 00:18:06] money.

[00:18:06 -> 00:18:07] The investors, [00:18:07 -> 00:18:07] the LPs, [00:18:07 -> 00:18:08] are actually [00:18:08 -> 00:18:08] investing to [00:18:08 -> 00:18:09] get that [00:18:09 -> 00:18:09] kind of [00:18:09 -> 00:18:09] return. [00:18:09 -> 00:18:10] We have [00:18:10 -> 00:18:10] a [00:18:10 -> 00:18:10] fiduciary [00:18:10 -> 00:18:11] responsibility [00:18:11 -> 00:18:11] to get [00:18:11 -> 00:18:12] those [00:18:12 -> 00:18:12] returns. [00:18:12 -> 00:18:13] This is [00:18:13 -> 00:18:13] the way [00:18:13 -> 00:18:14] I explain [00:18:14 -> 00:18:14] it.

[00:18:15 -> 00:18:16] It's [00:18:16 -> 00:18:16] public [00:18:16 -> 00:18:17] knowledge. [00:18:17 -> 00:18:18] We have [00:18:18 -> 00:18:19] the pension [00:18:19 -> 00:18:19] fund of [00:18:19 -> 00:18:19] the state [00:18:19 -> 00:18:20] of Utah [00:18:20 -> 00:18:20] as an [00:18:20 -> 00:18:21] investor [00:18:21 -> 00:18:21] in our [00:18:21 -> 00:18:21] fund. [00:18:22 -> 00:18:23] Think [00:18:23 -> 00:18:23] police [00:18:23 -> 00:18:24] officers, [00:18:24 -> 00:18:24] firemen, [00:18:25 -> 00:18:25] school [00:18:25 -> 00:18:26] teachers.

[00:18:27 -> 00:18:27] Your [00:18:27 -> 00:18:28] kid's [00:18:28 -> 00:18:28] third [00:18:28 -> 00:18:29] grade [00:18:29 -> 00:18:30] teacher, [00:18:30 -> 00:18:31] their [00:18:31 -> 00:18:31] pension [00:18:31 -> 00:18:31] is [00:18:31 -> 00:18:32] invested [00:18:32 -> 00:18:32] in us. [00:18:33 -> 00:18:33] Our [00:18:33 -> 00:18:33] fiduciary [00:18:33 -> 00:18:34] is to [00:18:34 -> 00:18:34] ensure [00:18:34 -> 00:18:35] that [00:18:35 -> 00:18:35] that [00:18:35 -> 00:18:35] school [00:18:35 -> 00:18:36] teacher [00:18:36 -> 00:18:37] maximizes [00:18:37 -> 00:18:38] returns.

[00:18:38 -> 00:18:39] I always [00:18:39 -> 00:18:39] look at [00:18:39 -> 00:18:39] it and [00:18:39 -> 00:18:40] say, [00:18:40 -> 00:18:40] I love [00:18:40 -> 00:18:40] the [00:18:40 -> 00:18:41] entrepreneurs. [00:18:41 -> 00:18:41] They're [00:18:41 -> 00:18:42] going to [00:18:42 -> 00:18:42] put it [00:18:42 -> 00:18:42] their [00:18:42 -> 00:18:42] foot [00:18:42 -> 00:18:43] down [00:18:43 -> 00:18:43] and [00:18:43 -> 00:18:43] we're [00:18:43 -> 00:18:43] going to [00:18:43 -> 00:18:43] build [00:18:43 -> 00:18:44] something [00:18:44 -> 00:18:44] amazing.

[00:18:44 -> 00:18:45] But guess [00:18:45 -> 00:18:45] what? [00:18:45 -> 00:18:46] I have [00:18:46 -> 00:18:46] this [00:18:46 -> 00:18:46] over [00:18:46 -> 00:18:47] here [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] that [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] I [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] have [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] to [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] be [00:18:47 -> 00:18:47] thoughtful [00:18:47 -> 00:18:48] for. [00:18:48 -> 00:18:48] If I [00:18:48 -> 00:18:49] can't [00:18:49 -> 00:18:49] generate [00:18:49 -> 00:18:49] the [00:18:49 -> 00:18:50] sort [00:18:50 -> 00:18:50] of [00:18:50 -> 00:18:50] returns [00:18:50 -> 00:18:51] that [00:18:51 -> 00:18:51] takes [00:18:51 -> 00:18:51] care [00:18:51 -> 00:18:51] of [00:18:51 -> 00:18:52] your [00:18:52 -> 00:18:52] third [00:18:52 -> 00:18:53] grade [00:18:53 -> 00:18:53] teacher, [00:18:54 -> 00:18:54] then I'm [00:18:54 -> 00:18:55] probably [00:18:55 -> 00:18:55] going to [00:18:55 -> 00:18:55] pass.

[00:18:56 -> 00:18:56] Exactly. [00:18:56 -> 00:18:57] To bring [00:18:57 -> 00:18:58] that to [00:18:58 -> 00:18:59] fruition so [00:18:59 -> 00:18:59] everybody [00:18:59 -> 00:18:59] understands [00:18:59 -> 00:19:00] is that [00:19:00 -> 00:19:01] let's [00:19:01 -> 00:19:01] say [00:19:01 -> 00:19:01] you [00:19:01 -> 00:19:03] look in [00:19:03 -> 00:19:03] a [00:19:03 -> 00:19:03] company [00:19:03 -> 00:19:04] and [00:19:04 -> 00:19:05] the [00:19:05 -> 00:19:05] entrepreneur [00:19:05 -> 00:19:05] say [00:19:05 -> 00:19:06] it'll [00:19:06 -> 00:19:06] be a [00:19:06 -> 00:19:07] no-brainer.

[00:19:07 -> 00:19:07] You're [00:19:07 -> 00:19:07] going to [00:19:07 -> 00:19:08] double your [00:19:12 -> 00:19:13] multiple [00:19:13 -> 00:19:13] than [00:19:13 -> 00:19:13] that [00:19:13 -> 00:19:14] because [00:19:14 -> 00:19:14] you're [00:19:14 -> 00:19:14] going to [00:19:14 -> 00:19:14] have [00:19:14 -> 00:19:14] a lot [00:19:14 -> 00:19:15] of [00:19:15 -> 00:19:15] losses. [00:19:15 -> 00:19:15] There [00:19:15 -> 00:19:15] are [00:19:15 -> 00:19:15] going to [00:19:15 -> 00:19:15] be [00:19:15 -> 00:19:16] some [00:19:16 -> 00:19:16] complete [00:19:16 -> 00:19:17] write-offs [00:19:17 -> 00:19:17] in your [00:19:17 -> 00:19:18] portfolio.

[00:19:18 -> 00:19:19] And so [00:19:19 -> 00:19:20] what happens [00:19:20 -> 00:19:21] is the [00:19:21 -> 00:19:21] winners [00:19:21 -> 00:19:21] have to [00:19:21 -> 00:19:22] get you [00:19:22 -> 00:19:22] to [00:19:22 -> 00:19:22] 10x [00:19:22 -> 00:19:23] not [00:19:23 -> 00:19:23] to [00:19:23 -> 00:19:23] 2x [00:19:23 -> 00:19:24] 3x [00:19:24 -> 00:19:24] 4x [00:19:24 -> 00:19:25] or you [00:19:25 -> 00:19:25] don't [00:19:25 -> 00:19:25] get [00:19:25 -> 00:19:26] what [00:19:26 -> 00:19:26] you [00:19:26 -> 00:19:26] said [00:19:26 -> 00:19:26] to [00:19:26 -> 00:19:26] venture [00:19:26 -> 00:19:27] return [00:19:27 -> 00:19:27] because [00:19:27 -> 00:19:28] venture [00:19:28 -> 00:19:28] is [00:19:28 -> 00:19:28] risking [00:19:28 -> 00:19:28] money.

[00:19:29 -> 00:19:29] The [00:19:42 -> 00:19:42] need [00:19:42 -> 00:19:42] to [00:19:42 -> 00:19:42] know [00:19:42 -> 00:19:44] just [00:19:44 -> 00:19:44] doubling [00:19:44 -> 00:19:44] your [00:19:44 -> 00:19:45] money [00:19:45 -> 00:19:45] is [00:19:45 -> 00:19:45] not [00:19:45 -> 00:19:45] good [00:19:45 -> 00:19:45] enough. [00:19:46 -> 00:19:46] No. [00:19:46 -> 00:19:48] If you've [00:19:48 -> 00:19:49] encouraged [00:19:49 -> 00:19:49] your [00:19:49 -> 00:19:49] listeners [00:19:49 -> 00:19:50] to read [00:19:50 -> 00:19:50] that [00:19:50 -> 00:19:50] book [00:19:50 -> 00:19:50] The [00:19:50 -> 00:19:51] Power [00:19:51 -> 00:19:51] Law [00:19:51 -> 00:19:52] that's [00:19:52 -> 00:19:53] a [00:19:53 -> 00:19:54] required [00:19:54 -> 00:19:54] reading [00:19:54 -> 00:19:54] for [00:19:54 -> 00:19:55] all [00:19:55 -> 00:19:55] of [00:19:55 -> 00:19:55] the [00:19:55 -> 00:19:56] new [00:19:56 -> 00:19:56] incoming [00:19:56 -> 00:19:57] interns [00:19:57 -> 00:19:58] and [00:19:58 -> 00:19:59] new [00:19:59 -> 00:19:59] people [00:19:59 -> 00:19:59] that [00:19:59 -> 00:19:59] join [00:19:59 -> 00:20:00] Pelion [00:20:00 -> 00:20:00] because [00:20:00 -> 00:20:01] it [00:20:01 -> 00:20:01] is [00:20:01 -> 00:20:02] what [00:20:02 -> 00:20:02] this [00:20:02 -> 00:20:02] world [00:20:02 -> 00:20:03] is.

[00:20:03 -> 00:20:03] The [00:20:03 -> 00:20:03] world [00:20:03 -> 00:20:03] that [00:20:03 -> 00:20:03] we [00:20:03 -> 00:20:04] live [00:20:04 -> 00:20:04] in. [00:20:04 -> 00:20:04] By [00:20:04 -> 00:20:05] the [00:20:05 -> 00:20:05] way [00:20:05 -> 00:20:05] there's [00:20:05 -> 00:20:06] a [00:20:06 -> 00:20:08] LinkedIn [00:20:08 -> 00:20:09] post [00:20:09 -> 00:20:09] by one [00:20:09 -> 00:20:09] of the [00:20:09 -> 00:20:09] partners [00:20:09 -> 00:20:09] at [00:20:09 -> 00:20:10] Sequoia [00:20:10 -> 00:20:10] that [00:20:10 -> 00:20:11] just [00:20:11 -> 00:20:11] talked [00:20:11 -> 00:20:11] about [00:20:11 -> 00:20:12] loss [00:20:12 -> 00:20:12] ratio [00:20:12 -> 00:20:13] in [00:20:13 -> 00:20:13] venture [00:20:13 -> 00:20:14] like [00:20:14 -> 00:20:14] early [00:20:14 -> 00:20:14] stage [00:20:14 -> 00:20:15] venture [00:20:15 -> 00:20:15] 50% [00:20:15 -> 00:20:16] of [00:20:16 -> 00:20:16] our [00:20:16 -> 00:20:16] companies [00:20:16 -> 00:20:17] don't [00:20:17 -> 00:20:17] make [00:20:17 -> 00:20:17] it.

[00:20:18 -> 00:20:18] You [00:20:18 -> 00:20:19] have [00:20:19 -> 00:20:19] to [00:20:19 -> 00:20:19] think [00:20:19 -> 00:20:19] about [00:20:19 -> 00:20:21] you [00:20:21 -> 00:20:22] don't [00:20:22 -> 00:20:22] generate [00:20:22 -> 00:20:23] great [00:20:23 -> 00:20:23] returns [00:20:23 -> 00:20:23] for [00:20:23 -> 00:20:23] your [00:20:23 -> 00:20:24] investors [00:20:24 -> 00:20:24] you [00:20:24 -> 00:20:25] got [00:20:25 -> 00:20:25] to [00:20:25 -> 00:20:25] have [00:20:25 -> 00:20:25] this [00:20:25 -> 00:20:25] whole [00:20:25 -> 00:20:26] power [00:20:26 -> 00:20:26] law [00:20:26 -> 00:20:26] you [00:20:26 -> 00:20:26] got [00:20:26 -> 00:20:26] to [00:20:26 -> 00:20:26] have [00:20:26 -> 00:20:27] those [00:20:27 -> 00:20:27] companies [00:20:27 -> 00:20:27] doing [00:20:27 -> 00:20:28] 20x [00:20:28 -> 00:20:28] you [00:20:28 -> 00:20:29] know [00:20:29 -> 00:20:29] I [00:20:29 -> 00:20:29] mean [00:20:29 -> 00:20:30] one [00:20:30 -> 00:20:30] of [00:20:30 -> 00:20:30] our [00:20:30 -> 00:20:30] companies [00:20:30 -> 00:20:31] our [00:20:31 -> 00:20:31] first [00:20:31 -> 00:20:32] $800,000 [00:20:32 -> 00:20:33] that we [00:20:33 -> 00:20:33] invested [00:20:33 -> 00:20:34] in [00:20:34 -> 00:20:34] that [00:20:34 -> 00:20:34] company [00:20:34 -> 00:20:35] turned [00:20:35 -> 00:20:35] into [00:20:42 -> 00:20:42] venture [00:20:42 -> 00:20:43] funds [00:20:43 -> 00:20:43] are [00:20:43 -> 00:20:43] searching [00:20:43 -> 00:20:44] for [00:20:44 -> 00:20:44] and [00:20:44 -> 00:20:44] looking [00:20:44 -> 00:20:44] for [00:20:44 -> 00:20:44] and [00:20:44 -> 00:20:45] that's [00:20:45 -> 00:20:45] what [00:20:45 -> 00:20:45] they've [00:20:45 -> 00:20:45] committed [00:20:45 -> 00:20:45] to [00:20:45 -> 00:20:46] their [00:20:46 -> 00:20:46] limited [00:20:46 -> 00:20:46] partners [00:20:46 -> 00:20:47] to [00:20:47 -> 00:20:47] do [00:20:47 -> 00:20:47] and [00:20:47 -> 00:20:47] like [00:20:47 -> 00:20:48] you [00:20:48 -> 00:20:48] were [00:20:48 -> 00:20:48] saying [00:20:48 -> 00:20:48] the [00:20:48 -> 00:20:49] firemen [00:20:49 -> 00:20:49] and [00:20:49 -> 00:20:49] the [00:20:49 -> 00:20:49] pension [00:20:49 -> 00:20:49] fund [00:20:49 -> 00:20:50] those [00:20:50 -> 00:20:50] are [00:20:50 -> 00:20:50] limited [00:20:50 -> 00:20:51] partners [00:20:51 -> 00:20:51] and [00:20:51 -> 00:20:52] that [00:20:52 -> 00:20:52] is [00:20:52 -> 00:20:53] our [00:21:12 -> 00:21:13] So [00:21:13 -> 00:21:14] let's [00:21:14 -> 00:21:14] go [00:21:14 -> 00:21:15] back [00:21:15 -> 00:21:15] Blake [00:21:15 -> 00:21:15] like [00:21:15 -> 00:21:16] I [00:21:16 -> 00:21:16] want [00:21:16 -> 00:21:17] the [00:21:17 -> 00:21:17] viewers [00:21:17 -> 00:21:17] and [00:21:17 -> 00:21:18] listeners [00:21:18 -> 00:21:18] to [00:21:18 -> 00:21:18] really [00:21:18 -> 00:21:19] understand [00:21:19 -> 00:21:19] how [00:21:19 -> 00:21:19] you've [00:21:19 -> 00:21:20] gotten [00:21:20 -> 00:21:20] to [00:21:20 -> 00:21:20] where [00:21:20 -> 00:21:20] you've [00:21:20 -> 00:21:21] gotten [00:21:21 -> 00:21:21] today [00:21:21 -> 00:21:21] because [00:21:21 -> 00:21:22] I [00:21:22 -> 00:21:22] don't [00:21:22 -> 00:21:22] know [00:21:22 -> 00:21:22] the [00:21:22 -> 00:21:22] latest [00:21:22 -> 00:21:23] numbers [00:21:23 -> 00:21:23] your [00:21:23 -> 00:21:24] your [00:21:24 -> 00:21:24] fund [00:21:24 -> 00:21:25] eight [00:21:25 -> 00:21:25] was [00:21:25 -> 00:21:25] how [00:21:25 -> 00:21:26] big [00:21:26 -> 00:21:26] that's [00:21:26 -> 00:21:26] your [00:21:26 -> 00:21:26] latest [00:21:26 -> 00:21:27] fund [00:21:27 -> 00:21:28] $500 [00:21:28 -> 00:21:28] million [00:21:28 -> 00:21:29] $500 [00:21:29 -> 00:21:29] million [00:21:29 -> 00:21:29] fund [00:21:29 -> 00:21:30] total [00:21:30 -> 00:21:30] AUM [00:21:30 -> 00:21:30] has [00:21:30 -> 00:21:30] got [00:21:30 -> 00:21:30] to [00:21:30 -> 00:21:30] be [00:21:30 -> 00:21:31] around [00:21:31 -> 00:21:32] 2 [00:21:32 -> 00:21:32] billion [00:21:32 -> 00:21:33] approaching [00:21:33 -> 00:21:34] three [00:21:34 -> 00:21:34] or [00:21:34 -> 00:21:35] approaching [00:21:35 -> 00:21:35] three [00:21:35 -> 00:21:35] that's [00:21:35 -> 00:21:35] just [00:21:35 -> 00:21:36] a [00:21:36 -> 00:21:36] billion [00:21:36 -> 00:21:36] dollars [00:21:36 -> 00:21:36] off [00:21:36 -> 00:21:38] so [00:21:38 -> 00:21:38] excuse [00:21:38 -> 00:21:38] me [00:21:38 -> 00:21:39] but [00:21:39 -> 00:21:39] that's [00:21:39 -> 00:21:40] insane [00:21:40 -> 00:21:40] so [00:21:40 -> 00:21:40] tell [00:21:40 -> 00:21:40] us [00:21:40 -> 00:21:41] okay [00:21:41 -> 00:21:41] where [00:21:41 -> 00:21:42] does [00:21:42 -> 00:21:42] Blake's [00:21:42 -> 00:21:42] story [00:21:42 -> 00:21:43] start [00:21:43 -> 00:21:43] take [00:21:43 -> 00:21:43] us [00:21:43 -> 00:21:43] back [00:21:43 -> 00:21:43] as far [00:21:43 -> 00:21:44] as [00:21:44 -> 00:21:44] you [00:21:44 -> 00:21:47] don't [00:21:47 -> 00:21:47] know [00:21:47 -> 00:21:47] the [00:21:47 -> 00:21:48] AUM [00:21:48 -> 00:21:48] is [00:21:48 -> 00:21:48] total [00:21:48 -> 00:21:49] assets [00:21:49 -> 00:21:49] under [00:21:49 -> 00:21:49] management [00:21:49 -> 00:21:50] by [00:21:50 -> 00:21:50] Pelion's [00:21:50 -> 00:21:51] firm [00:21:51 -> 00:21:51] okay [00:21:51 -> 00:21:52] I'm [00:21:52 -> 00:21:52] the [00:21:52 -> 00:21:52] acronym [00:21:52 -> 00:21:52] police [00:21:52 -> 00:21:53] he [00:21:53 -> 00:21:54] is [00:21:54 -> 00:21:54] he [00:21:54 -> 00:21:54] is [00:21:54 -> 00:21:55] and [00:21:55 -> 00:21:55] it's [00:21:55 -> 00:21:55] great [00:21:55 -> 00:21:55] because [00:21:55 -> 00:21:56] we [00:21:56 -> 00:21:56] want [00:21:56 -> 00:21:56] anybody [00:21:56 -> 00:21:56] and [00:21:56 -> 00:21:56] everybody [00:21:56 -> 00:21:57] to [00:21:57 -> 00:21:57] listen [00:21:57 -> 00:21:57] to [00:21:57 -> 00:21:57] these [00:21:57 -> 00:21:57] podcasts [00:21:57 -> 00:21:58] so [00:21:58 -> 00:21:58] thank [00:21:58 -> 00:21:58] you [00:21:58 -> 00:21:58] for [00:21:58 -> 00:21:58] watching [00:21:58 -> 00:22:00] so [00:22:00 -> 00:22:01] where [00:22:01 -> 00:22:01] do [00:22:01 -> 00:22:01] you [00:22:01 -> 00:22:01] begin [00:22:01 -> 00:22:02] do [00:22:02 -> 00:22:02] you [00:22:02 -> 00:22:02] want [00:22:02 -> 00:22:02] to [00:22:02 -> 00:22:02] go [00:22:02 -> 00:22:02] back [00:22:02 -> 00:22:03] to [00:22:03 -> 00:22:03] high [00:22:03 -> 00:22:03] school [00:22:03 -> 00:22:04] college [00:22:04 -> 00:22:04] first [00:22:04 -> 00:22:05] job [00:22:05 -> 00:22:05] where [00:22:05 -> 00:22:05] do [00:22:05 -> 00:22:05] you [00:22:26 -> 00:22:27] that's [00:22:27 -> 00:22:27] that's [00:22:27 -> 00:22:27] a little [00:22:27 -> 00:22:27] town [00:22:27 -> 00:22:28] called [00:22:28 -> 00:22:28] Bancroft [00:22:28 -> 00:22:29] and [00:22:29 -> 00:22:29] by [00:22:29 -> 00:22:29] the [00:22:29 -> 00:22:29] way [00:22:29 -> 00:22:29] I've [00:22:29 -> 00:22:29] never [00:22:29 -> 00:22:30] even [00:22:30 -> 00:22:30] heard [00:22:30 -> 00:22:30] of [00:22:30 -> 00:22:30] that [00:22:30 -> 00:22:30] it [00:22:30 -> 00:22:30] was [00:22:30 -> 00:22:31] amazing [00:22:31 -> 00:22:32] yeah [00:22:32 -> 00:22:32] I [00:22:32 -> 00:22:32] grew [00:22:32 -> 00:22:33] up [00:22:33 -> 00:22:33] moving [00:22:33 -> 00:22:34] pipe [00:22:34 -> 00:22:34] picking [00:22:34 -> 00:22:35] rock [00:22:35 -> 00:22:35] chasing [00:22:35 -> 00:22:36] cows [00:22:36 -> 00:22:36] driving [00:22:36 -> 00:22:37] tractors [00:22:37 -> 00:22:37] the [00:22:37 -> 00:22:37] whole [00:22:37 -> 00:22:38] gamut [00:22:38 -> 00:22:40] came [00:22:40 -> 00:22:41] down [00:22:41 -> 00:22:41] to [00:22:41 -> 00:22:41] BYU [00:22:41 -> 00:22:43] got [00:22:43 -> 00:22:43] into [00:22:43 -> 00:22:43] school [00:22:43 -> 00:22:43] met [00:22:43 -> 00:22:44] my [00:22:44 -> 00:22:44] wife [00:22:44 -> 00:22:44] down [00:22:44 -> 00:22:45] here [00:22:45 -> 00:22:45] and [00:22:45 -> 00:22:46] she [00:22:46 -> 00:22:46] had [00:22:46 -> 00:22:46] just [00:22:46 -> 00:22:46] gotten [00:22:46 -> 00:22:47] a [00:22:47 -> 00:22:47] job [00:22:47 -> 00:22:47] with [00:22:47 -> 00:22:47] this [00:22:47 -> 00:22:48] startup [00:22:48 -> 00:22:48] called [00:22:48 -> 00:22:48] Word [00:22:48 -> 00:22:49] Perfect [00:22:49 -> 00:22:49] in [00:22:49 -> 00:22:50] the [00:22:50 -> 00:22:50] late [00:22:50 -> 00:22:50] 80s [00:22:50 -> 00:22:51] for [00:22:51 -> 00:22:51] those [00:22:51 -> 00:22:51] of [00:22:51 -> 00:22:51] you [00:22:51 -> 00:22:51] don't [00:22:51 -> 00:22:52] know [00:22:52 -> 00:22:52] Word [00:22:57 -> 00:22:57] 80s [00:22:57 -> 00:22:57] and [00:22:57 -> 00:22:58] 90s [00:22:58 -> 00:22:59] yeah [00:22:59 -> 00:23:00] that [00:23:00 -> 00:23:00] controlled [00:23:00 -> 00:23:00] probably [00:23:00 -> 00:23:01] 70 80 [00:23:01 -> 00:23:01] percent [00:23:01 -> 00:23:02] of the [00:23:02 -> 00:23:02] market [00:23:02 -> 00:23:02] right [00:23:02 -> 00:23:03] it [00:23:03 -> 00:23:03] was [00:23:03 -> 00:23:03] amazing [00:23:03 -> 00:23:04] and [00:23:04 -> 00:23:04] and [00:23:04 -> 00:23:04] I [00:23:04 -> 00:23:05] like [00:23:05 -> 00:23:05] I [00:23:05 -> 00:23:05] ended [00:23:05 -> 00:23:05] up [00:23:05 -> 00:23:06] going [00:23:06 -> 00:23:06] to [00:23:06 -> 00:23:06] work [00:23:06 -> 00:23:06] for [00:23:06 -> 00:23:06] them [00:23:06 -> 00:23:07] as [00:23:07 -> 00:23:07] a [00:23:07 -> 00:23:07] security [00:23:07 -> 00:23:08] guard [00:23:08 -> 00:23:09] while [00:23:09 -> 00:23:09] I [00:23:09 -> 00:23:09] was [00:23:09 -> 00:23:09] going [00:23:09 -> 00:23:09] to [00:23:09 -> 00:23:10] school [00:23:10 -> 00:23:10] so [00:23:10 -> 00:23:10] as [00:23:10 -> 00:23:10] a [00:23:10 -> 00:23:11] security [00:23:11 -> 00:23:11] guard [00:23:11 -> 00:23:12] that [00:23:12 -> 00:23:13] led [00:23:13 -> 00:23:13] to [00:23:13 -> 00:23:14] a [00:23:14 -> 00:23:14] summer [00:23:14 -> 00:23:15] internship [00:23:15 -> 00:23:15] in [00:23:15 -> 00:23:16] Halifax [00:23:16 -> 00:23:16] Nova [00:23:16 -> 00:23:17] Scotia [00:23:17 -> 00:23:17] in [00:23:17 -> 00:23:17] their [00:23:17 -> 00:23:17] sales [00:23:17 -> 00:23:18] organization [00:23:18 -> 00:23:19] I [00:23:19 -> 00:23:19] graduate [00:23:19 -> 00:23:20] I [00:23:20 -> 00:23:20] moved [00:23:20 -> 00:23:20] to [00:23:20 -> 00:23:21] New [00:23:21 -> 00:23:21] York [00:23:21 -> 00:23:21] City [00:23:21 -> 00:23:21] in [00:23:21 -> 00:23:21] their [00:23:21 -> 00:23:22] sales [00:23:22 -> 00:23:22] organization [00:23:22 -> 00:23:23] then [00:23:23 -> 00:23:23] they [00:23:23 -> 00:23:23] moved [00:23:23 -> 00:23:24] me [00:23:24 -> 00:23:24] to [00:23:24 -> 00:23:24] Seattle [00:23:24 -> 00:23:25] lived [00:23:25 -> 00:23:25] in [00:23:25 -> 00:23:25] Bellevue [00:23:25 -> 00:23:26] John's [00:23:26 -> 00:23:27] hometown [00:23:27 -> 00:23:27] what [00:23:27 -> 00:23:27] years [00:23:27 -> 00:23:27] was [00:23:27 -> 00:23:28] that [00:23:28 -> 00:23:28] this [00:23:28 -> 00:23:28] was [00:23:28 -> 00:23:28] the [00:23:28 -> 00:23:29] early [00:23:29 -> 00:23:29] 90s [00:23:29 -> 00:23:30] yeah [00:23:30 -> 00:23:30] I [00:23:30 -> 00:23:30] mean [00:23:30 -> 00:23:30] you [00:23:30 -> 00:23:30] were [00:23:30 -> 00:23:31] right [00:23:53 -> 00:23:54] Pascal [00:23:54 -> 00:23:55] and [00:23:55 -> 00:23:55] some [00:23:55 -> 00:23:55] of [00:23:55 -> 00:23:55] the [00:23:55 -> 00:23:55] programming [00:23:55 -> 00:23:56] languages [00:23:56 -> 00:23:56] because [00:23:56 -> 00:23:56] of [00:23:56 -> 00:23:56] my [00:23:56 -> 00:23:57] chemistry [00:23:57 -> 00:23:57] degree [00:23:57 -> 00:23:57] in [00:23:57 -> 00:23:57] pre-med [00:23:57 -> 00:23:58] education [00:23:58 -> 00:23:58] but [00:23:58 -> 00:23:59] I [00:23:59 -> 00:23:59] didn't [00:23:59 -> 00:23:59] think [00:23:59 -> 00:23:59] it [00:23:59 -> 00:23:59] was [00:23:59 -> 00:24:00] for [00:24:00 -> 00:24:00] me [00:24:00 -> 00:24:00] and [00:24:00 -> 00:24:00] I [00:24:00 -> 00:24:00] didn't [00:24:00 -> 00:24:00] do [00:24:00 -> 00:24:01] and [00:24:01 -> 00:24:01] I [00:24:01 -> 00:24:01] look [00:24:01 -> 00:24:01] back [00:24:01 -> 00:24:01] and go [00:24:01 -> 00:24:02] what would [00:24:02 -> 00:24:02] happen [00:24:02 -> 00:24:02] if I [00:24:02 -> 00:24:02] would [00:24:02 -> 00:24:02] have [00:24:02 -> 00:24:03] joined [00:24:03 -> 00:24:03] then [00:24:03 -> 00:24:03] it [00:24:03 -> 00:24:03] was [00:24:03 -> 00:24:03] probably [00:24:03 -> 00:24:04] called [00:24:04 -> 00:24:05] SSI [00:24:05 -> 00:24:05] yes [00:24:05 -> 00:24:05] satellite [00:24:05 -> 00:24:06] software [00:24:06 -> 00:24:07] SSI [00:24:07 -> 00:24:07] but I [00:24:07 -> 00:24:07] think [00:24:07 -> 00:24:07] they [00:24:23 -> 00:24:24] by the [00:24:24 -> 00:24:24] way [00:24:24 -> 00:24:24] I [00:24:24 -> 00:24:24] was [00:24:24 -> 00:24:25] a [00:24:25 -> 00:24:26] dedicated [00:24:26 -> 00:24:26] word [00:24:26 -> 00:24:26] perfect [00:24:26 -> 00:24:27] user [00:24:27 -> 00:24:27] all [00:24:27 -> 00:24:27] the [00:24:27 -> 00:24:27] way [00:24:27 -> 00:24:27] to [00:24:27 -> 00:24:27] the [00:24:27 -> 00:24:28] very [00:24:28 -> 00:24:28] end [00:24:28 -> 00:24:28] until [00:24:28 -> 00:24:29] I [00:24:29 -> 00:24:29] got [00:24:29 -> 00:24:29] forced [00:24:29 -> 00:24:29] by [00:24:29 -> 00:24:30] my [00:24:30 -> 00:24:30] own [00:24:30 -> 00:24:30] company [00:24:30 -> 00:24:30] to [00:24:30 -> 00:24:30] go [00:24:30 -> 00:24:30] to [00:24:30 -> 00:24:31] word [00:24:31 -> 00:24:31] yeah [00:24:31 -> 00:24:32] so [00:24:32 -> 00:24:32] word [00:24:32 -> 00:24:33] perfect [00:24:33 -> 00:24:33] was [00:24:33 -> 00:24:33] better [00:24:33 -> 00:24:33] than [00:24:33 -> 00:24:34] word [00:24:34 -> 00:24:34] it [00:24:34 -> 00:24:34] was [00:24:34 -> 00:24:35] so [00:24:35 -> 00:24:35] much [00:24:35 -> 00:24:35] better [00:24:35 -> 00:24:36] and [00:24:36 -> 00:24:36] then [00:24:36 -> 00:24:38] living [00:24:38 -> 00:24:38] in [00:24:38 -> 00:24:38] Seattle [00:24:38 -> 00:24:39] end up [00:24:39 -> 00:24:40] coming [00:24:40 -> 00:24:40] back [00:24:40 -> 00:24:40] to [00:24:40 -> 00:24:40] Utah [00:24:40 -> 00:24:42] working [00:24:42 -> 00:24:42] in [00:24:42 -> 00:24:42] product [00:24:42 -> 00:24:43] management [00:24:43 -> 00:24:43] just [00:24:43 -> 00:24:43] having [00:24:43 -> 00:24:43] the [00:24:43 -> 00:24:44] time [00:24:44 -> 00:24:44] of [00:24:44 -> 00:24:44] my [00:24:44 -> 00:24:44] life [00:24:44 -> 00:24:45] then [00:24:45 -> 00:24:45] Novell [00:24:45 -> 00:24:46] shows [00:24:46 -> 00:24:46] up [00:24:46 -> 00:24:47] and [00:24:47 -> 00:24:47] Novell [00:24:47 -> 00:24:47] buys [00:24:47 -> 00:24:48] word [00:24:48 -> 00:24:48] perfect [00:24:48 -> 00:24:49] and [00:24:49 -> 00:24:49] for [00:24:49 -> 00:24:50] 1.

8 [00:24:50 -> 00:24:51] billion [00:24:51 -> 00:24:51] dollars [00:24:51 -> 00:24:51] literally [00:24:51 -> 00:24:52] one of [00:24:52 -> 00:24:52] the [00:24:52 -> 00:24:52] largest [00:24:52 -> 00:24:53] acquisitions [00:24:53 -> 00:24:54] of that [00:24:54 -> 00:24:54] era [00:24:54 -> 00:24:55] and [00:24:55 -> 00:24:55] so [00:24:55 -> 00:24:55] I [00:24:55 -> 00:24:55] go [00:24:55 -> 00:24:55] to [00:24:55 -> 00:24:56] work [00:24:56 -> 00:24:56] for [00:24:56 -> 00:24:56] Utah [00:24:56 -> 00:24:57] legendary [00:24:57 -> 00:24:58] tech [00:24:58 -> 00:24:58] companies [00:24:58 -> 00:24:58] tech [00:24:58 -> 00:24:59] companies [00:24:59 -> 00:24:59] Ray [00:24:59 -> 00:24:59] Norda [00:24:59 -> 00:25:00] and [00:25:00 -> 00:25:00] Alan [00:25:00 -> 00:25:00] Ashton [00:25:00 -> 00:25:01] got [00:25:01 -> 00:25:01] together [00:25:01 -> 00:25:01] and [00:25:01 -> 00:25:02] they [00:25:02 -> 00:25:02] created [00:25:02 -> 00:25:03] that [00:25:03 -> 00:25:03] so [00:25:03 -> 00:25:03] I [00:25:03 -> 00:25:04] worked [00:25:04 -> 00:25:04] I [00:25:04 -> 00:25:04] worked [00:25:04 -> 00:25:04] in [00:25:04 -> 00:25:05] Novell [00:25:05 -> 00:25:05] and [00:25:05 -> 00:25:05] I [00:25:05 -> 00:25:05] had [00:25:05 -> 00:25:06] a [00:25:06 -> 00:25:06] series [00:25:06 -> 00:25:06] of [00:25:06 -> 00:25:06] jobs [00:25:06 -> 00:25:07] product [00:25:07 -> 00:25:07] management [00:25:07 -> 00:25:07] and [00:25:07 -> 00:25:07] then [00:25:07 -> 00:25:08] I [00:25:08 -> 00:25:08] moved [00:25:08 -> 00:25:08] into [00:25:08 -> 00:25:08] corporate [00:25:08 -> 00:25:09] development [00:25:09 -> 00:25:10] and [00:25:10 -> 00:25:10] I [00:25:10 -> 00:25:11] always [00:25:11 -> 00:25:11] wanted [00:25:11 -> 00:25:11] to [00:25:11 -> 00:25:11] get [00:25:11 -> 00:25:11] into [00:25:11 -> 00:25:12] corporate [00:25:12 -> 00:25:12] development [00:25:12 -> 00:25:12] doing [00:25:12 -> 00:25:13] M&A [00:25:13 -> 00:25:13] work [00:25:13 -> 00:25:14] and [00:25:14 -> 00:25:14] I [00:25:14 -> 00:25:15] was [00:25:15 -> 00:25:15] doing [00:25:15 -> 00:25:15] that [00:25:15 -> 00:25:16] and [00:25:16 -> 00:25:16] in [00:25:16 -> 00:25:18] 1996 [00:25:18 -> 00:25:19] a [00:25:19 -> 00:25:19] guy [00:25:19 -> 00:25:19] named [00:25:19 -> 00:25:19] Eric [00:25:19 -> 00:25:20] Schmidt [00:25:20 -> 00:25:20] joins [00:25:20 -> 00:25:21] Novell [00:25:21 -> 00:25:21] as [00:25:21 -> 00:25:21] our [00:25:21 -> 00:25:22] CEO [00:25:22 -> 00:25:23] for [00:25:23 -> 00:25:23] your [00:25:23 -> 00:25:23] listeners [00:25:23 -> 00:25:24] Eric [00:25:24 -> 00:25:25] Schmidt [00:25:25 -> 00:25:25] then [00:25:25 -> 00:25:25] left [00:25:25 -> 00:25:26] Novell [00:25:26 -> 00:25:26] to [00:25:26 -> 00:25:26] become [00:25:26 -> 00:25:26] CEO [00:25:26 -> 00:25:26] of [00:25:26 -> 00:25:27] Google [00:25:27 -> 00:25:27] that's [00:25:27 -> 00:25:27] the [00:25:27 -> 00:25:28] fame [00:25:28 -> 00:25:28] of [00:25:28 -> 00:25:28] Eric [00:25:28 -> 00:25:28] Schmidt [00:25:28 -> 00:25:29] he [00:25:35 -> 00:25:36] and [00:25:36 -> 00:25:36] he [00:25:36 -> 00:25:37] sits [00:25:37 -> 00:25:37] me [00:25:37 -> 00:25:37] down [00:25:37 -> 00:25:37] and [00:25:37 -> 00:25:37] he [00:25:37 -> 00:25:38] goes [00:25:38 -> 00:25:38] hey [00:25:38 -> 00:25:39] I [00:25:39 -> 00:25:40] got [00:25:40 -> 00:25:40] this [00:25:40 -> 00:25:40] $300 [00:25:40 -> 00:25:41] million [00:25:41 -> 00:25:42] venture [00:25:42 -> 00:25:42] fund [00:25:42 -> 00:25:43] that [00:25:43 -> 00:25:43] Novell's [00:25:43 -> 00:25:43] board of [00:25:43 -> 00:25:44] directors [00:25:44 -> 00:25:44] has [00:25:44 -> 00:25:44] approved [00:25:44 -> 00:25:45] we're [00:25:45 -> 00:25:45] going [00:25:45 -> 00:25:45] to [00:25:45 -> 00:25:45] put [00:25:45 -> 00:25:46] $200 [00:25:46 -> 00:25:46] million [00:25:46 -> 00:25:46] into [00:25:46 -> 00:25:47] funds [00:25:47 -> 00:25:47] as [00:25:47 -> 00:25:47] an [00:25:47 -> 00:25:48] LP [00:25:48 -> 00:25:48] and [00:25:48 -> 00:25:48] we're [00:25:48 -> 00:25:48] going [00:25:48 -> 00:25:48] to [00:25:48 -> 00:25:48] invest [00:25:48 -> 00:25:49] $100 [00:25:49 -> 00:25:49] million [00:25:49 -> 00:25:49] into [00:25:49 -> 00:25:50] companies [00:25:50 -> 00:25:50] directly [00:25:50 -> 00:25:51] do [00:25:51 -> 00:25:51] you [00:25:51 -> 00:25:51] want [00:25:51 -> 00:25:51] to [00:25:51 -> 00:25:52] run [00:25:52 -> 00:25:52] it [00:25:52 -> 00:25:53] I [00:25:53 -> 00:25:54] remember [00:25:54 -> 00:25:54] thinking [00:25:54 -> 00:25:54] myself [00:25:54 -> 00:25:55] what [00:25:55 -> 00:25:55] is [00:25:55 -> 00:25:55] a [00:25:55 -> 00:25:55] venture [00:25:55 -> 00:25:56] capital [00:25:56 -> 00:25:58] I [00:25:58 -> 00:25:58] had [00:25:58 -> 00:25:58] no [00:25:58 -> 00:25:59] idea [00:25:59 -> 00:25:59] what [00:25:59 -> 00:25:59] I [00:25:59 -> 00:25:59] was [00:25:59 -> 00:25:59] doing [00:25:59 -> 00:26:00] in [00:26:00 -> 00:26:00] fact [00:26:00 -> 00:26:01] I [00:26:01 -> 00:26:01] had [00:26:01 -> 00:26:01] somebody [00:26:01 -> 00:26:01] asked [00:26:01 -> 00:26:02] me [00:26:02 -> 00:26:02] one [00:26:02 -> 00:26:02] day [00:26:02 -> 00:26:02] hey [00:26:02 -> 00:26:03] name [00:26:03 -> 00:26:03] the [00:26:03 -> 00:26:04] top [00:26:04 -> 00:26:04] 10 [00:26:04 -> 00:26:04] venture [00:26:04 -> 00:26:05] capital [00:26:05 -> 00:26:05] in [00:26:05 -> 00:26:05] the [00:26:05 -> 00:26:05] industry [00:26:05 -> 00:26:06] and [00:26:06 -> 00:26:06] I'm [00:26:06 -> 00:26:06] thinking [00:26:06 -> 00:26:06] myself [00:26:06 -> 00:26:07] I [00:26:07 -> 00:26:07] can't [00:26:07 -> 00:26:07] name [00:26:07 -> 00:26:08] 10 [00:26:08 -> 00:26:08] venture [00:26:08 -> 00:26:09] capital [00:26:09 -> 00:26:09] firms [00:26:09 -> 00:26:09] off [00:26:09 -> 00:26:09] the [00:26:09 -> 00:26:10] top [00:26:10 -> 00:26:10] of [00:26:10 -> 00:26:10] my [00:26:10 -> 00:26:10] head [00:26:10 -> 00:26:10] that [00:26:10 -> 00:26:11] was [00:26:11 -> 00:26:12] my [00:26:12 -> 00:26:12] journey [00:26:12 -> 00:26:13] and [00:26:13 -> 00:26:13] so [00:26:13 -> 00:26:13] I [00:26:13 -> 00:26:13] ran [00:26:13 -> 00:26:14] that [00:26:14 -> 00:26:14] from [00:26:14 -> 00:26:14] 96 [00:26:14 -> 00:26:15] to [00:26:15 -> 00:26:15] 2002 [00:26:15 -> 00:26:17] had [00:26:17 -> 00:26:17] an [00:26:17 -> 00:26:18] amazing [00:26:18 -> 00:26:18] ride [00:26:18 -> 00:26:19] we [00:26:19 -> 00:26:20] were [00:26:20 -> 00:26:21] LPs [00:26:21 -> 00:26:21] and [00:26:21 -> 00:26:21] firms [00:26:21 -> 00:26:22] like [00:26:22 -> 00:26:22] Kleiner [00:26:22 -> 00:26:23] Perkins [00:26:23 -> 00:26:24] Excel [00:26:24 -> 00:26:25] NEA [00:26:26 -> 00:26:26] and [00:26:26 -> 00:26:26] we [00:26:26 -> 00:26:26] helped [00:26:26 -> 00:26:27] Lightspeed [00:26:27 -> 00:26:27] spin [00:26:27 -> 00:26:27] out [00:26:27 -> 00:26:28] of [00:26:28 -> 00:26:28] Weisbeck [00:26:28 -> 00:26:28] and [00:26:28 -> 00:26:29] Greer [00:26:29 -> 00:26:29] like [00:26:29 -> 00:26:29] we [00:26:29 -> 00:26:29] it [00:26:29 -> 00:26:30] was [00:26:30 -> 00:26:30] an [00:26:30 -> 00:26:30] amazing [00:26:30 -> 00:26:31] ride [00:26:31 -> 00:26:31] we [00:26:31 -> 00:26:32] invested [00:26:32 -> 00:26:32] into [00:26:32 -> 00:26:32] companies [00:26:32 -> 00:26:33] like [00:26:33 -> 00:26:33] Red Hat [00:26:33 -> 00:26:34] and [00:26:34 -> 00:26:34] and [00:26:34 -> 00:26:34] commerce [00:26:34 -> 00:26:35] and [00:26:35 -> 00:26:35] just [00:26:35 -> 00:26:35] it [00:26:35 -> 00:26:36] was [00:26:36 -> 00:26:36] by [00:26:36 -> 00:26:36] the [00:26:36 -> 00:26:36] way [00:26:36 -> 00:26:37] my [00:26:37 -> 00:26:37] one [00:26:37 -> 00:26:38] of [00:26:38 -> 00:26:38] my [00:26:38 -> 00:26:38] first [00:26:38 -> 00:26:38] investments [00:26:38 -> 00:26:39] we [00:26:39 -> 00:26:39] put [00:26:39 -> 00:26:39] a [00:26:39 -> 00:26:39] million [00:26:39 -> 00:26:40] dollars [00:26:40 -> 00:26:40] into [00:26:40 -> 00:26:41] Red Hat [00:26:41 -> 00:26:42] alongside [00:26:42 -> 00:26:42] Benchmark [00:26:42 -> 00:26:43] and [00:26:43 -> 00:26:43] Greylock [00:26:43 -> 00:26:44] 18 [00:26:44 -> 00:26:44] months [00:26:44 -> 00:26:45] later [00:26:45 -> 00:26:45] we [00:26:56 -> 00:26:57] 2001 [00:26:57 -> 00:26:58] I'll [00:26:58 -> 00:26:58] never [00:26:58 -> 00:26:59] forget [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] I [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] get [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] a [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] phone [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] call [00:26:59 -> 00:26:59] so [00:26:59 -> 00:27:00] I'm [00:27:00 -> 00:27:00] in [00:27:00 -> 00:27:00] my [00:27:00 -> 00:27:00] office [00:27:00 -> 00:27:01] in [00:27:01 -> 00:27:01] San [00:27:01 -> 00:27:01] Jose [00:27:01 -> 00:27:02] and [00:27:02 -> 00:27:02] at [00:27:02 -> 00:27:02] the [00:27:02 -> 00:27:02] time [00:27:02 -> 00:27:03] from [00:27:03 -> 00:27:03] 96 [00:27:03 -> 00:27:03] to [00:27:03 -> 00:27:03] probably [00:27:03 -> 00:27:04] 2002 [00:27:04 -> 00:27:05] we [00:27:05 -> 00:27:06] lived [00:27:06 -> 00:27:06] in [00:27:06 -> 00:27:06] Utah [00:27:06 -> 00:27:06] but [00:27:06 -> 00:27:07] I [00:27:07 -> 00:27:07] commuted [00:27:07 -> 00:27:08] to [00:27:08 -> 00:27:08] San [00:27:08 -> 00:27:08] Jose [00:27:08 -> 00:27:09] so [00:27:09 -> 00:27:09] I'm [00:27:09 -> 00:27:09] sitting [00:27:09 -> 00:27:09] in [00:27:09 -> 00:27:09] my [00:27:09 -> 00:27:10] office [00:27:10 -> 00:27:10] in [00:27:10 -> 00:27:10] San [00:27:10 -> 00:27:10] Jose [00:27:10 -> 00:27:10] I [00:27:10 -> 00:27:11] get [00:27:11 -> 00:27:11] a [00:27:11 -> 00:27:11] call [00:27:11 -> 00:27:11] from [00:27:11 -> 00:27:12] Eric's [00:27:12 -> 00:27:12] assistant [00:27:12 -> 00:27:13] her name [00:27:13 -> 00:27:13] Pam [00:27:13 -> 00:27:13] Shore [00:27:13 -> 00:27:14] she [00:27:14 -> 00:27:14] goes [00:27:14 -> 00:27:14] hey [00:27:14 -> 00:27:15] Eric [00:27:15 -> 00:27:15] wants [00:27:15 -> 00:27:15] to [00:27:15 -> 00:27:15] talk [00:27:15 -> 00:27:15] to [00:27:15 -> 00:27:15] you [00:27:15 -> 00:27:16] and [00:27:16 -> 00:27:17] usually [00:27:17 -> 00:27:17] what [00:27:17 -> 00:27:17] that [00:27:17 -> 00:27:17] meant [00:27:17 -> 00:27:17] is [00:27:17 -> 00:27:18] he's [00:27:18 -> 00:27:18] either [00:27:18 -> 00:27:18] committed [00:27:18 -> 00:27:19] to [00:27:19 -> 00:27:19] an [00:27:19 -> 00:27:19] investment [00:27:19 -> 00:27:20] that [00:27:20 -> 00:27:20] I [00:27:20 -> 00:27:20] have [00:27:20 -> 00:27:20] to [00:27:20 -> 00:27:21] figure [00:27:21 -> 00:27:21] out [00:27:21 -> 00:27:22] he [00:27:22 -> 00:27:22] wants [00:27:22 -> 00:27:22] to [00:27:22 -> 00:27:22] go [00:27:22 -> 00:27:22] buy [00:27:22 -> 00:27:23] something [00:27:23 -> 00:27:23] or [00:27:23 -> 00:27:23] he [00:27:23 -> 00:27:24] wants [00:27:24 -> 00:27:24] to [00:27:24 -> 00:27:24] go [00:27:24 -> 00:27:24] visit [00:27:24 -> 00:27:24] some [00:27:24 -> 00:27:24] VC [00:27:24 -> 00:27:25] firms [00:27:25 -> 00:27:26] and [00:27:26 -> 00:27:26] I'm [00:27:26 -> 00:27:26] his [00:27:26 -> 00:27:26] driver [00:27:26 -> 00:27:27] and [00:27:27 -> 00:27:27] so [00:27:27 -> 00:27:28] I [00:27:28 -> 00:27:28] go [00:27:28 -> 00:27:28] down [00:27:48 -> 00:27:48] 2001 [00:27:48 -> 00:27:49] Google [00:27:49 -> 00:27:49] was [00:27:49 -> 00:27:49] a [00:27:49 -> 00:27:50] crappy [00:27:50 -> 00:27:50] search [00:27:50 -> 00:27:51] engine [00:27:51 -> 00:27:51] company [00:27:51 -> 00:27:51] it [00:27:51 -> 00:27:51] was [00:27:51 -> 00:27:51] like [00:27:51 -> 00:27:52] the [00:27:52 -> 00:27:52] 15th [00:27:52 -> 00:27:53] best [00:27:53 -> 00:27:53] search [00:27:53 -> 00:27:53] engine [00:27:53 -> 00:27:53] company [00:27:53 -> 00:27:54] out [00:27:54 -> 00:27:54] there [00:27:54 -> 00:27:54] and [00:27:54 -> 00:27:54] I'm [00:27:54 -> 00:27:54] thinking [00:27:54 -> 00:27:54] to [00:27:54 -> 00:27:55] myself [00:27:55 -> 00:27:55] what [00:27:55 -> 00:27:56] are [00:27:56 -> 00:27:56] you [00:27:56 -> 00:27:56] doing [00:27:56 -> 00:27:58] like [00:27:58 -> 00:27:58] literally [00:27:58 -> 00:27:59] Eric's [00:27:59 -> 00:27:59] one [00:27:59 -> 00:27:59] of [00:27:59 -> 00:27:59] the [00:27:59 -> 00:27:59] smartest [00:27:59 -> 00:27:59] guys [00:27:59 -> 00:28:00] on [00:28:00 -> 00:28:00] the [00:28:00 -> 00:28:00] planet [00:28:00 -> 00:28:01] and [00:28:01 -> 00:28:01] I'm [00:28:01 -> 00:28:01] like [00:28:01 -> 00:28:02] okay [00:28:02 -> 00:28:02] and [00:28:02 -> 00:28:02] so [00:28:02 -> 00:28:02] that [00:28:02 -> 00:28:02] kind [00:28:02 -> 00:28:02] of [00:28:02 -> 00:28:03] led [00:28:03 -> 00:28:03] my [00:28:03 -> 00:28:03] journey [00:28:03 -> 00:28:04] to [00:28:04 -> 00:28:04] do [00:28:04 -> 00:28:04] I [00:28:04 -> 00:28:05] stay [00:28:05 -> 00:28:05] at [00:28:05 -> 00:28:05] Novell [00:28:05 -> 00:28:06] continue [00:28:06 -> 00:28:06] to [00:28:06 -> 00:28:07] like [00:28:07 -> 00:28:07] maybe [00:28:07 -> 00:28:08] move [00:28:08 -> 00:28:08] back [00:28:08 -> 00:28:09] into [00:28:09 -> 00:28:09] products [00:28:09 -> 00:28:09] because [00:28:09 -> 00:28:10] they [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] were [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] going [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] to [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] do [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] away [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] with [00:28:10 -> 00:28:10] their [00:28:10 -> 00:28:11] venture [00:28:11 -> 00:28:11] fund [00:28:11 -> 00:28:11] they [00:28:11 -> 00:28:11] had [00:28:11 -> 00:28:12] some [00:28:12 -> 00:28:12] other [00:28:12 -> 00:28:12] focuses [00:28:12 -> 00:28:13] and [00:28:13 -> 00:28:13] I [00:28:13 -> 00:28:13] had [00:28:13 -> 00:28:14] a [00:28:14 -> 00:28:14] great [00:28:14 -> 00:28:14] mentor [00:28:14 -> 00:28:15] by the [00:28:15 -> 00:28:15] name [00:28:15 -> 00:28:15] of [00:28:15 -> 00:28:15] Jim [00:28:15 -> 00:28:16] Schwartz [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] who [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] was [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] the [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] founder [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] of [00:28:16 -> 00:28:16] Excel [00:28:16 -> 00:28:17] Partners [00:28:17 -> 00:28:17] that [00:28:17 -> 00:28:18] was [00:28:40 -> 00:28:41] right [00:28:41 -> 00:28:41] after [00:28:41 -> 00:28:41] that [00:28:41 -> 00:28:41] and [00:28:41 -> 00:28:41] then [00:28:41 -> 00:28:42] shortly [00:28:42 -> 00:28:42] met [00:28:42 -> 00:28:43] you [00:28:43 -> 00:28:43] the [00:28:43 -> 00:28:43] first [00:28:43 -> 00:28:43] time [00:28:43 -> 00:28:43] and [00:28:43 -> 00:28:43] then [00:28:43 -> 00:28:44] invited [00:28:44 -> 00:28:44] you [00:28:44 -> 00:28:44] to [00:28:44 -> 00:28:44] help [00:28:44 -> 00:28:44] me [00:28:44 -> 00:28:45] with [00:28:45 -> 00:28:45] something [00:28:45 -> 00:28:45] at [00:28:45 -> 00:28:45] BYU [00:28:45 -> 00:28:46] because [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] that's [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] where [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] I [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] came [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] down [00:28:46 -> 00:28:46] to [00:28:46 -> 00:28:47] be [00:28:47 -> 00:28:47] is [00:28:47 -> 00:28:47] it [00:28:47 -> 00:28:47] yeah [00:28:47 -> 00:28:47] and [00:28:47 -> 00:28:48] that's [00:28:48 -> 00:28:48] how [00:28:48 -> 00:28:48] we [00:28:48 -> 00:28:48] first [00:29:12 -> 00:29:12] and [00:29:12 -> 00:29:12] that [00:29:12 -> 00:29:12] was [00:29:12 -> 00:29:12] just [00:29:12 -> 00:29:13] like [00:29:13 -> 00:29:13] too [00:29:13 -> 00:29:14] many [00:29:14 -> 00:29:14] too [00:29:14 -> 00:29:14] much [00:29:14 -> 00:29:15] going [00:29:15 -> 00:29:15] on [00:29:15 -> 00:29:15] and [00:29:15 -> 00:29:16] so [00:29:16 -> 00:29:16] Jim [00:29:16 -> 00:29:16] hired [00:29:16 -> 00:29:16] me [00:29:16 -> 00:29:16] as [00:29:16 -> 00:29:16] a [00:29:16 -> 00:29:17] partner [00:29:17 -> 00:29:18] and [00:29:18 -> 00:29:19] like [00:29:19 -> 00:29:19] it [00:29:19 -> 00:29:19] was [00:29:19 -> 00:29:20] my [00:29:20 -> 00:29:20] first [00:29:20 -> 00:29:20] dose [00:29:20 -> 00:29:20] of [00:29:20 -> 00:29:21] kind [00:29:21 -> 00:29:21] of [00:29:21 -> 00:29:21] jumping [00:29:21 -> 00:29:21] into [00:29:21 -> 00:29:22] the [00:29:22 -> 00:29:23] deep [00:29:23 -> 00:29:23] end [00:29:23 -> 00:29:23] of [00:29:23 -> 00:29:23] the [00:29:23 -> 00:29:23] pool [00:29:23 -> 00:29:24] with [00:29:24 -> 00:29:24] Jim [00:29:24 -> 00:29:24] and [00:29:24 -> 00:29:25] he [00:29:25 -> 00:29:25] just [00:29:25 -> 00:29:26] said [00:29:26 -> 00:29:26] let's [00:29:26 -> 00:29:26] do [00:29:26 -> 00:29:26] this [00:29:26 -> 00:29:27] together [00:29:27 -> 00:29:27] we [00:29:27 -> 00:29:27] brought [00:29:27 -> 00:29:27] on [00:29:27 -> 00:29:27] a [00:29:27 -> 00:29:28] guy [00:29:28 -> 00:29:28] named [00:29:28 -> 00:29:28] Carl [00:29:28 -> 00:29:29] Ledbetter [00:29:29 -> 00:29:29] who [00:29:29 -> 00:29:29] was [00:29:29 -> 00:29:30] actually [00:29:30 -> 00:29:31] I [00:29:31 -> 00:29:31] worked [00:29:42 -> 00:29:42] basically [00:29:42 -> 00:29:42] yeah [00:29:42 -> 00:29:42] yeah [00:29:42 -> 00:29:43] his [00:29:43 -> 00:29:43] IQ [00:29:43 -> 00:29:43] was [00:29:43 -> 00:29:43] like [00:29:43 -> 00:29:44] a [00:29:44 -> 00:29:44] thousand [00:29:44 -> 00:29:45] yeah [00:29:45 -> 00:29:46] and [00:29:46 -> 00:29:46] so [00:29:46 -> 00:29:46] my [00:29:46 -> 00:29:46] role [00:29:46 -> 00:29:47] was [00:29:47 -> 00:29:47] to [00:29:47 -> 00:29:47] like [00:29:47 -> 00:29:48] Jim's [00:29:48 -> 00:29:48] like [00:29:48 -> 00:29:48] look [00:29:48 -> 00:29:49] just [00:29:49 -> 00:29:49] just [00:29:49 -> 00:29:50] help [00:29:50 -> 00:29:50] me [00:29:50 -> 00:29:50] run [00:29:50 -> 00:29:50] this [00:29:50 -> 00:29:51] firm [00:29:51 -> 00:29:51] and [00:29:51 -> 00:29:51] that [00:29:51 -> 00:29:51] was [00:29:51 -> 00:29:51] really [00:29:51 -> 00:29:52] my [00:29:52 -> 00:29:52] first [00:29:52 -> 00:29:52] role [00:29:52 -> 00:29:53] and [00:29:53 -> 00:29:53] then [00:29:53 -> 00:29:53] that [00:29:53 -> 00:29:54] just [00:29:54 -> 00:29:54] kind [00:29:54 -> 00:29:54] of [00:29:54 -> 00:29:54] evolved [00:29:54 -> 00:29:55] and [00:29:55 -> 00:29:55] I [00:29:55 -> 00:29:56] ended [00:29:56 -> 00:29:56] up [00:29:56 -> 00:29:56] taking [00:29:56 -> 00:29:56] on [00:29:56 -> 00:29:56] more [00:29:56 -> 00:29:56] and [00:29:56 -> 00:29:57] more [00:29:57 -> 00:29:57] responsibility [00:29:57 -> 00:29:59] kind [00:29:59 -> 00:29:59] of running [00:29:59 -> 00:30:00] the day-to-days [00:30:00 -> 00:30:00] of the [00:30:00 -> 00:30:00] firm [00:30:00 -> 00:30:01] Jim [00:30:01 -> 00:30:02] was [00:30:02 -> 00:30:02] amazing [00:30:02 -> 00:30:02] Carl [00:30:02 -> 00:30:02] was [00:30:02 -> 00:30:03] amazing [00:30:03 -> 00:30:03] had [00:30:03 -> 00:30:03] all [00:30:03 -> 00:30:04] these [00:30:04 -> 00:30:04] great [00:30:04 -> 00:30:04] mentors [00:30:04 -> 00:30:05] and [00:30:05 -> 00:30:05] Jim [00:30:05 -> 00:30:06] retired [00:30:06 -> 00:30:06] in [00:30:06 -> 00:30:06] 2012 [00:30:06 -> 00:30:07] Carl [00:30:07 -> 00:30:07] retired [00:30:07 -> 00:30:07] in [00:30:07 -> 00:30:08] 2018 [00:30:08 -> 00:30:10] we [00:30:10 -> 00:30:10] kept [00:30:10 -> 00:30:10] adding [00:30:10 -> 00:30:10] people [00:30:10 -> 00:30:11] to [00:30:11 -> 00:30:11] the [00:30:11 -> 00:30:11] team [00:30:11 -> 00:30:11] and [00:30:11 -> 00:30:11] today [00:30:11 -> 00:30:12] we're [00:30:12 -> 00:30:12] about [00:30:12 -> 00:30:12] 30 [00:30:12 -> 00:30:12] people [00:30:12 -> 00:30:13] when [00:30:13 -> 00:30:13] I [00:30:13 -> 00:30:13] joined [00:30:13 -> 00:30:13] there [00:30:13 -> 00:30:13] were [00:30:13 -> 00:30:16] three [00:30:16 -> 00:30:17] partners [00:30:17 -> 00:30:17] and [00:30:17 -> 00:30:17] an [00:30:17 -> 00:30:18] associate [00:30:18 -> 00:30:18] a [00:30:18 -> 00:30:18] CFO [00:30:18 -> 00:30:20] office [00:30:20 -> 00:30:20] manager [00:30:20 -> 00:30:21] that [00:30:21 -> 00:30:21] first [00:30:21 -> 00:30:21] fund [00:30:21 -> 00:30:22] was [00:30:22 -> 00:30:22] how [00:30:22 -> 00:30:22] big [00:30:22 -> 00:30:22] then [00:30:22 -> 00:30:23] of [00:30:23 -> 00:30:24] Utah [00:30:24 -> 00:30:24] Ventures [00:30:24 -> 00:30:25] so [00:30:25 -> 00:30:25] the [00:30:38 -> 00:30:38] is [00:30:38 -> 00:30:39] $500 [00:30:39 -> 00:30:39] million [00:30:39 -> 00:30:40] wow [00:30:40 -> 00:30:41] okay [00:30:41 -> 00:30:41] what [00:30:41 -> 00:30:41] I'm [00:30:41 -> 00:30:42] getting [00:30:42 -> 00:30:42] from [00:30:42 -> 00:30:42] this [00:30:42 -> 00:30:43] historical [00:30:43 -> 00:30:43] background [00:30:43 -> 00:30:45] is that [00:30:45 -> 00:30:45] you've [00:30:45 -> 00:30:45] seen [00:30:45 -> 00:30:45] just [00:30:45 -> 00:30:46] generations [00:30:46 -> 00:30:47] of [00:30:47 -> 00:30:47] startup [00:30:47 -> 00:30:48] building [00:30:48 -> 00:30:49] venture [00:30:49 -> 00:30:49] ecosystem [00:30:49 -> 00:30:50] building [00:30:50 -> 00:30:50] different [00:30:50 -> 00:30:51] cycles [00:30:51 -> 00:30:51] different [00:30:51 -> 00:30:52] technologies [00:30:52 -> 00:30:53] different [00:30:53 -> 00:30:53] hype [00:30:53 -> 00:30:54] waves [00:30:54 -> 00:30:55] different [00:30:55 -> 00:30:55] cyclical [00:30:55 -> 00:30:56] market [00:30:56 -> 00:30:57] environments [00:30:57 -> 00:30:57] right [00:30:57 -> 00:30:58] what [00:30:58 -> 00:30:59] changes [00:30:59 -> 00:31:00] and what [00:31:00 -> 00:31:00] is [00:31:00 -> 00:31:01] different [00:31:01 -> 00:31:01] what [00:31:01 -> 00:31:01] like [00:31:01 -> 00:31:01] what [00:31:01 -> 00:31:02] is [00:31:02 -> 00:31:02] always [00:31:02 -> 00:31:02] the [00:31:02 -> 00:31:03] same [00:31:03 -> 00:31:03] like [00:31:08 -> 00:31:09] career [00:31:09 -> 00:31:09] or [00:31:09 -> 00:31:09] venture [00:31:09 -> 00:31:10] what [00:31:10 -> 00:31:10] what's [00:31:10 -> 00:31:11] foundational [00:31:11 -> 00:31:12] you know [00:31:12 -> 00:31:12] I [00:31:12 -> 00:31:13] would [00:31:13 -> 00:31:13] say [00:31:13 -> 00:31:14] foundational [00:31:14 -> 00:31:15] are [00:31:15 -> 00:31:17] we [00:31:17 -> 00:31:18] talked [00:31:18 -> 00:31:18] about [00:31:18 -> 00:31:18] this [00:31:18 -> 00:31:18] a [00:31:18 -> 00:31:19] minute [00:31:19 -> 00:31:19] ago [00:31:19 -> 00:31:20] unbelievable [00:31:20 -> 00:31:21] entrepreneurs [00:31:21 -> 00:31:22] yeah [00:31:22 -> 00:31:23] you know [00:31:23 -> 00:31:23] if [00:31:23 -> 00:31:24] if I [00:31:24 -> 00:31:24] take [00:31:24 -> 00:31:24] anything [00:31:24 -> 00:31:25] away [00:31:25 -> 00:31:25] from [00:31:25 -> 00:31:25] it [00:31:25 -> 00:31:25] like [00:31:25 -> 00:31:26] like [00:31:26 -> 00:31:26] entrepreneurs [00:31:26 -> 00:31:27] are the [00:31:27 -> 00:31:28] lifeblood [00:31:28 -> 00:31:28] and I [00:31:28 -> 00:31:28] think [00:31:28 -> 00:31:28] Utah [00:31:28 -> 00:31:29] is [00:31:29 -> 00:31:29] one [00:31:29 -> 00:31:29] of [00:31:29 -> 00:31:30] the [00:31:30 -> 00:31:31] the [00:31:31 -> 00:31:31] most [00:31:31 -> 00:31:32] robust [00:31:32 -> 00:31:33] ecosystems [00:31:33 -> 00:31:33] when I [00:31:33 -> 00:31:34] first got [00:31:34 -> 00:31:34] into the [00:31:34 -> 00:31:34] business [00:31:34 -> 00:31:35] about [00:31:35 -> 00:31:36] 10% [00:31:36 -> 00:31:36] of what [00:31:36 -> 00:31:36] we did [00:31:36 -> 00:31:37] was in [00:31:37 -> 00:31:37] Utah [00:31:37 -> 00:31:38] today [00:31:38 -> 00:31:39] over [00:31:39 -> 00:31:40] 50% [00:31:40 -> 00:31:40] of our [00:31:40 -> 00:31:40] money [00:31:40 -> 00:31:40] is [00:31:40 -> 00:31:41] deployed [00:31:41 -> 00:31:41] in [00:31:41 -> 00:31:41] Utah [00:31:41 -> 00:31:42] wow [00:31:42 -> 00:31:42] you're [00:31:42 -> 00:31:42] more [00:31:42 -> 00:31:43] Utah [00:31:43 -> 00:31:43] yeah [00:31:43 -> 00:31:44] more [00:31:44 -> 00:31:44] Utah [00:31:44 -> 00:31:44] like [00:31:44 -> 00:31:44] it [00:31:44 -> 00:31:45] used [00:31:45 -> 00:31:45] to [00:31:45 -> 00:31:45] be [00:31:45 -> 00:31:45] maybe [00:31:45 -> 00:31:46] 50 [00:31:46 -> 00:31:47] 60% [00:31:47 -> 00:31:47] Silicon [00:31:47 -> 00:31:47] Valley [00:31:47 -> 00:31:48] 10% [00:31:48 -> 00:31:48] Utah [00:31:48 -> 00:31:49] this [00:31:49 -> 00:31:49] is [00:31:49 -> 00:31:49] you know [00:31:49 -> 00:31:50] 2002 [00:31:50 -> 00:31:51] roll [00:31:51 -> 00:31:52] forward [00:31:52 -> 00:31:52] to [00:31:52 -> 00:31:52] today [00:31:52 -> 00:31:53] over [00:31:53 -> 00:31:53] 50% [00:31:53 -> 00:31:53] is [00:31:53 -> 00:31:54] here [00:31:54 -> 00:31:54] we [00:31:54 -> 00:31:54] still [00:31:54 -> 00:31:54] do [00:31:54 -> 00:31:55] 30% [00:31:55 -> 00:31:56] in [00:31:56 -> 00:31:56] Silicon [00:31:56 -> 00:31:56] Valley [00:31:56 -> 00:31:56] and [00:31:56 -> 00:31:56] then [00:31:56 -> 00:31:57] the [00:31:57 -> 00:31:57] other [00:31:57 -> 00:31:57] 20% [00:31:57 -> 00:31:58] so [00:31:58 -> 00:31:58] I [00:31:58 -> 00:31:58] think [00:31:58 -> 00:31:58] what's [00:31:58 -> 00:31:59] foundational [00:31:59 -> 00:31:59] are [00:31:59 -> 00:32:00] great [00:32:00 -> 00:32:01] entrepreneurs [00:32:01 -> 00:32:01] great [00:32:01 -> 00:32:02] ideas [00:32:02 -> 00:32:03] building [00:32:03 -> 00:32:03] something [00:32:03 -> 00:32:04] amazing [00:32:04 -> 00:32:05] disruption [00:32:05 -> 00:32:06] it's [00:32:06 -> 00:32:06] it's [00:32:06 -> 00:32:06] always [00:32:06 -> 00:32:07] cyclical [00:32:07 -> 00:32:08] you know [00:32:08 -> 00:32:09] I invested [00:32:09 -> 00:32:09] in a [00:32:09 -> 00:32:09] company [00:32:09 -> 00:32:10] called [00:32:10 -> 00:32:10] Riverbed [00:32:10 -> 00:32:11] what [00:32:11 -> 00:32:11] they [00:32:11 -> 00:32:12] invented [00:32:12 -> 00:32:13] disrupted [00:32:13 -> 00:32:14] Cisco [00:32:14 -> 00:32:15] now [00:32:15 -> 00:32:16] Cisco [00:32:16 -> 00:32:16] didn't [00:32:16 -> 00:32:16] go away [00:32:16 -> 00:32:17] obviously [00:32:17 -> 00:32:17] and they're [00:32:17 -> 00:32:17] an amazing [00:32:17 -> 00:32:18] company [00:32:18 -> 00:32:18] but what [00:32:18 -> 00:32:19] they [00:32:19 -> 00:32:19] built [00:32:19 -> 00:32:20] was [00:32:20 -> 00:32:20] bandwidth [00:32:20 -> 00:32:21] optimization [00:32:21 -> 00:32:21] today [00:32:21 -> 00:32:21] today [00:32:21 -> 00:32:21] that's [00:32:21 -> 00:32:22] a [00:32:22 -> 00:32:22] commodity [00:32:22 -> 00:32:22] but [00:32:22 -> 00:32:23] back [00:32:23 -> 00:32:23] then [00:32:23 -> 00:32:24] they [00:32:24 -> 00:32:25] changed [00:32:25 -> 00:32:25] the [00:32:25 -> 00:32:25] rules [00:32:25 -> 00:32:26] so [00:32:26 -> 00:32:26] what's [00:32:26 -> 00:32:26] been [00:32:26 -> 00:32:27] consistent [00:32:27 -> 00:32:27] is [00:32:27 -> 00:32:28] always [00:32:28 -> 00:32:28] the [00:32:28 -> 00:32:28] changing [00:32:28 -> 00:32:29] of [00:32:29 -> 00:32:29] the [00:32:29 -> 00:32:29] rules [00:32:29 -> 00:32:29] with [00:32:29 -> 00:32:29] these [00:32:29 -> 00:32:30] new [00:32:30 -> 00:32:30] technologies [00:32:30 -> 00:32:30] the [00:32:30 -> 00:32:31] disruption [00:32:31 -> 00:32:31] of [00:32:31 -> 00:32:31] everything [00:32:31 -> 00:32:32] so [00:32:32 -> 00:32:32] you [00:32:50 -> 00:32:51] lifeblood [00:32:51 -> 00:32:51] like [00:32:51 -> 00:32:51] that [00:32:51 -> 00:32:52] that's [00:32:52 -> 00:32:52] such [00:32:52 -> 00:32:52] a [00:32:52 -> 00:32:53] key [00:32:53 -> 00:32:53] component [00:32:53 -> 00:32:54] I [00:32:54 -> 00:32:54] mean [00:32:54 -> 00:32:54] you [00:32:54 -> 00:32:54] have [00:32:54 -> 00:32:54] to [00:32:54 -> 00:32:54] have [00:32:54 -> 00:32:55] a [00:32:55 -> 00:32:55] big [00:32:55 -> 00:32:55] idea [00:32:55 -> 00:32:56] a [00:32:56 -> 00:32:56] big [00:32:56 -> 00:32:56] market [00:32:56 -> 00:32:57] you [00:32:57 -> 00:32:57] have [00:32:57 -> 00:32:57] to [00:32:57 -> 00:32:57] have [00:32:57 -> 00:32:58] disruptive [00:32:58 -> 00:32:59] technology [00:32:59 -> 00:32:59] but [00:32:59 -> 00:32:59] if [00:32:59 -> 00:32:59] you [00:32:59 -> 00:33:00] don't [00:33:00 -> 00:33:00] have [00:33:00 -> 00:33:00] the [00:33:00 -> 00:33:00] people [00:33:00 -> 00:33:01] that [00:33:01 -> 00:33:01] can [00:33:01 -> 00:33:01] execute [00:33:01 -> 00:33:02] against [00:33:02 -> 00:33:02] that [00:33:02 -> 00:33:03] they're [00:33:03 -> 00:33:03] just [00:33:03 -> 00:33:03] going to [00:33:03 -> 00:33:03] be a [00:33:03 -> 00:33:03] big [00:33:03 -> 00:33:04] adventure [00:33:04 -> 00:33:05] right [00:33:05 -> 00:33:06] you'd [00:33:06 -> 00:33:06] rather [00:33:06 -> 00:33:06] invest [00:33:06 -> 00:33:07] in [00:33:07 -> 00:33:07] a team [00:33:07 -> 00:33:07] with [00:33:07 -> 00:33:07] a [00:33:07 -> 00:33:08] B [00:33:08 -> 00:33:08] idea [00:33:08 -> 00:33:09] than [00:33:09 -> 00:33:09] a [00:33:09 -> 00:33:09] B [00:33:09 -> 00:33:11] team [00:33:11 -> 00:33:11] with [00:33:11 -> 00:33:11] an [00:33:11 -> 00:33:11] A [00:33:11 -> 00:33:11] idea [00:33:11 -> 00:33:12] right [00:33:12 -> 00:33:12] because [00:33:12 -> 00:33:12] that [00:33:12 -> 00:33:13] A team [00:33:13 -> 00:33:13] will [00:33:13 -> 00:33:13] make [00:33:13 -> 00:33:13] that [00:33:13 -> 00:33:14] B [00:33:14 -> 00:33:14] idea [00:33:14 -> 00:33:14] and [00:33:14 -> 00:33:14] A [00:33:14 -> 00:33:15] idea [00:33:15 -> 00:33:15] through [00:33:15 -> 00:33:16] good [00:33:16 -> 00:33:16] lean [00:33:16 -> 00:33:17] startup [00:33:17 -> 00:33:17] and [00:33:17 -> 00:33:17] pivoting [00:33:17 -> 00:33:18] and [00:33:18 -> 00:33:18] product [00:33:18 -> 00:33:18] market [00:33:18 -> 00:33:18] fit [00:33:18 -> 00:33:19] pursuit [00:33:19 -> 00:33:19] yeah [00:33:19 -> 00:33:20] exactly [00:33:20 -> 00:33:20] so [00:33:20 -> 00:33:21] okay [00:33:21 -> 00:33:21] when did [00:33:21 -> 00:33:21] you [00:33:21 -> 00:33:21] two [00:33:21 -> 00:33:22] meet [00:33:22 -> 00:33:22] tell me [00:33:22 -> 00:33:22] tell me [00:33:22 -> 00:33:22] more [00:33:22 -> 00:33:23] about [00:33:23 -> 00:33:23] your [00:33:23 -> 00:33:23] two [00:33:23 -> 00:33:24] I [00:33:24 -> 00:33:25] got [00:33:25 -> 00:33:25] I [00:33:25 -> 00:33:25] came [00:33:25 -> 00:33:25] down [00:33:25 -> 00:33:26] and [00:33:26 -> 00:33:27] think [00:33:27 -> 00:33:27] people [00:33:27 -> 00:33:28] know [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] my [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] story [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] that [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] listen [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] to [00:33:28 -> 00:33:28] the [00:33:28 -> 00:33:29] podcast [00:33:29 -> 00:33:29] but [00:33:29 -> 00:33:29] anyway [00:33:29 -> 00:33:29] I [00:33:29 -> 00:33:30] came [00:33:30 -> 00:33:30] down [00:33:30 -> 00:33:30] from [00:33:30 -> 00:33:30] Seattle [00:33:30 -> 00:33:31] after [00:33:31 -> 00:33:31] quote [00:33:31 -> 00:33:31] unquote [00:33:31 -> 00:33:32] retiring [00:33:32 -> 00:33:32] and [00:33:32 -> 00:33:32] BYU [00:33:32 -> 00:33:33] offered [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] me [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] to [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] be [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] a [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] professor [00:33:33 -> 00:33:33] of [00:33:33 -> 00:33:34] entrepreneurship [00:33:34 -> 00:33:34] and [00:33:34 -> 00:33:35] technology [00:33:35 -> 00:33:35] and [00:33:35 -> 00:33:36] then [00:33:36 -> 00:33:36] they [00:33:36 -> 00:33:36] also [00:33:36 -> 00:33:36] asked [00:33:36 -> 00:33:37] me [00:33:37 -> 00:33:37] to [00:33:37 -> 00:33:37] head [00:33:37 -> 00:33:37] up [00:33:37 -> 00:33:37] the [00:33:37 -> 00:33:38] Utah [00:33:38 -> 00:33:38] County [00:33:38 -> 00:33:39] alumni [00:33:39 -> 00:33:40] chapter [00:33:40 -> 00:33:41] which [00:33:41 -> 00:33:41] for [00:33:41 -> 00:33:41] the [00:33:41 -> 00:33:42] alumni [00:33:42 -> 00:33:42] association [00:33:42 -> 00:33:43] which [00:33:43 -> 00:33:43] is [00:33:43 -> 00:33:43] interesting [00:33:43 -> 00:33:44] and [00:33:44 -> 00:33:44] then [00:33:44 -> 00:33:44] I [00:33:44 -> 00:33:45] quickly [00:33:45 -> 00:33:46] I [00:33:46 -> 00:33:46] had [00:33:46 -> 00:33:46] just [00:33:46 -> 00:33:47] met [00:33:47 -> 00:33:47] Blake [00:33:47 -> 00:33:47] a [00:33:47 -> 00:33:48] little [00:33:48 -> 00:33:48] bit [00:33:48 -> 00:33:48] but [00:33:48 -> 00:33:49] I [00:33:49 -> 00:33:49] said [00:33:49 -> 00:33:49] Blake [00:33:49 -> 00:33:49] would [00:33:49 -> 00:33:49] you [00:33:49 -> 00:33:49] like [00:33:49 -> 00:33:50] to [00:33:50 -> 00:33:50] serve [00:33:50 -> 00:33:50] on [00:33:50 -> 00:33:50] that [00:33:50 -> 00:33:50] with [00:33:50 -> 00:33:50] me [00:33:50 -> 00:33:51] and [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] he [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] came [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] to [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] meet [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] at [00:33:51 -> 00:33:51] my [00:33:51 -> 00:33:52] house [00:33:52 -> 00:33:52] with [00:33:52 -> 00:33:52] about [00:33:52 -> 00:33:53] three [00:33:53 -> 00:33:53] or [00:33:53 -> 00:33:53] four [00:33:53 -> 00:33:53] other [00:33:53 -> 00:33:53] people [00:33:53 -> 00:33:53] and [00:33:53 -> 00:33:54] we [00:33:54 -> 00:33:54] formed [00:33:54 -> 00:33:54] because [00:33:54 -> 00:33:55] the [00:33:55 -> 00:33:55] chapter [00:33:55 -> 00:33:55] wasn't [00:33:55 -> 00:33:55] very [00:33:55 -> 00:33:56] active [00:33:56 -> 00:33:56] of [00:33:56 -> 00:33:56] all [00:33:56 -> 00:33:56] the [00:33:56 -> 00:33:56] places [00:33:56 -> 00:33:56] in [00:33:56 -> 00:33:57] the [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] world [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] it [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] was [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] kind [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] of [00:33:57 -> 00:33:57] funny [00:33:57 -> 00:33:58] Utah [00:33:58 -> 00:33:58] County [00:33:58 -> 00:33:58] where [00:33:58 -> 00:33:59] BYU [00:33:59 -> 00:33:59] was [00:33:59 -> 00:33:59] located [00:33:59 -> 00:34:00] was [00:34:00 -> 00:34:00] kind [00:34:00 -> 00:34:00] of [00:34:00 -> 00:34:00] inactive [00:34:00 -> 00:34:00] and [00:34:00 -> 00:34:01] they [00:34:01 -> 00:34:01] wanted [00:34:01 -> 00:34:01] to [00:34:01 -> 00:34:01] reactivate [00:34:01 -> 00:34:02] and [00:34:02 -> 00:34:02] so [00:34:02 -> 00:34:02] we [00:34:02 -> 00:34:03] got [00:34:03 -> 00:34:03] onto [00:34:03 -> 00:34:03] my [00:34:03 -> 00:34:03] committee [00:34:03 -> 00:34:04] and [00:34:04 -> 00:34:04] we [00:34:04 -> 00:34:04] started [00:34:04 -> 00:34:06] reviving [00:34:06 -> 00:34:06] the [00:34:06 -> 00:34:06] Utah [00:34:06 -> 00:34:06] county [00:34:06 -> 00:34:07] chapter [00:34:07 -> 00:34:07] so [00:34:07 -> 00:34:07] you [00:34:07 -> 00:34:07] served [00:34:07 -> 00:34:07] on [00:34:07 -> 00:34:08] a [00:34:08 -> 00:34:08] Utah [00:34:08 -> 00:34:09] county [00:34:09 -> 00:34:09] BYU [00:34:09 -> 00:34:10] alumni [00:34:10 -> 00:34:10] chapter [00:34:10 -> 00:34:10] yeah [00:34:10 -> 00:34:11] and [00:34:11 -> 00:34:12] I'd [00:34:12 -> 00:34:12] met [00:34:12 -> 00:34:12] I'd [00:34:12 -> 00:34:13] met [00:34:23 -> 00:34:23] business [00:34:23 -> 00:34:23] center [00:34:23 -> 00:34:24] as [00:34:24 -> 00:34:24] well [00:34:24 -> 00:34:24] as [00:34:24 -> 00:34:24] entrepreneurship [00:34:24 -> 00:34:25] center [00:34:25 -> 00:34:25] so [00:34:25 -> 00:34:26] that's [00:34:26 -> 00:34:26] right [00:34:26 -> 00:34:26] in there [00:34:26 -> 00:34:27] with [00:34:27 -> 00:34:27] all [00:34:27 -> 00:34:27] the [00:34:27 -> 00:34:27] stuff [00:34:27 -> 00:34:27] going [00:34:27 -> 00:34:27] on [00:34:27 -> 00:34:28] and [00:34:28 -> 00:34:29] like [00:34:29 -> 00:34:29] you [00:34:29 -> 00:34:30] canopy [00:34:30 -> 00:34:30] the [00:34:30 -> 00:34:31] venture [00:34:31 -> 00:34:31] firm [00:34:31 -> 00:34:31] right [00:34:31 -> 00:34:32] you [00:34:32 -> 00:34:32] knew [00:34:32 -> 00:34:32] about [00:34:32 -> 00:34:33] them [00:34:33 -> 00:34:33] and [00:34:33 -> 00:34:33] all [00:34:33 -> 00:34:33] those [00:34:33 -> 00:34:33] people [00:34:33 -> 00:34:34] coming [00:34:34 -> 00:34:34] from [00:34:34 -> 00:34:34] Novell [00:34:34 -> 00:34:34] and [00:34:34 -> 00:34:35] all [00:34:35 -> 00:34:35] that [00:34:35 -> 00:34:35] Ray [00:34:35 -> 00:34:35] Norda's [00:34:35 -> 00:34:36] family [00:34:36 -> 00:34:36] so [00:34:36 -> 00:34:37] Owen [00:34:37 -> 00:34:38] Charrington [00:34:38 -> 00:34:39] that's [00:34:39 -> 00:34:39] who [00:34:39 -> 00:34:39] I [00:34:39 -> 00:34:40] literally [00:34:40 -> 00:34:41] number [00:34:41 -> 00:34:41] one [00:34:41 -> 00:34:41] came [00:34:41 -> 00:34:42] down [00:34:42 -> 00:34:42] to [00:34:42 -> 00:34:42] help [00:34:42 -> 00:34:42] and [00:34:42 -> 00:34:43] then [00:34:43 -> 00:34:43] it's [00:34:43 -> 00:34:43] kind [00:34:43 -> 00:34:43] of [00:34:43 -> 00:34:43] funny [00:34:43 -> 00:34:44] a [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] month [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] or [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] two [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] after [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] I [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] got [00:34:44 -> 00:34:44] here [00:34:44 -> 00:34:45] he [00:34:45 -> 00:34:45] got [00:34:53 -> 00:34:53] that [00:34:53 -> 00:34:53] world [00:34:53 -> 00:34:54] of [00:34:54 -> 00:34:54] the [00:34:54 -> 00:34:54] Novell [00:34:54 -> 00:34:55] people [00:34:55 -> 00:34:55] doing [00:34:55 -> 00:34:55] venture [00:34:55 -> 00:34:56] and [00:34:56 -> 00:34:57] that's [00:34:57 -> 00:34:57] why [00:34:57 -> 00:34:57] you [00:34:57 -> 00:34:58] stood [00:34:58 -> 00:34:58] out [00:34:58 -> 00:34:59] and [00:34:59 -> 00:34:59] you [00:34:59 -> 00:34:59] always [00:34:59 -> 00:34:59] wanted [00:34:59 -> 00:35:00] to [00:35:00 -> 00:35:00] help [00:35:00 -> 00:35:00] BYU [00:35:00 -> 00:35:00] yeah [00:35:00 -> 00:35:01] I [00:35:01 -> 00:35:01] wanted [00:35:01 -> 00:35:01] to [00:35:01 -> 00:35:01] help [00:35:01 -> 00:35:02] I [00:35:02 -> 00:35:03] just [00:35:03 -> 00:35:03] left [00:35:03 -> 00:35:04] Novell [00:35:04 -> 00:35:05] but [00:35:05 -> 00:35:06] Ray [00:35:06 -> 00:35:06] Norda [00:35:06 -> 00:35:06] still [00:35:06 -> 00:35:07] owned [00:35:07 -> 00:35:07] a big [00:35:07 -> 00:35:07] chunk [00:35:07 -> 00:35:08] of [00:35:08 -> 00:35:08] Novell [00:35:08 -> 00:35:08] even [00:35:08 -> 00:35:09] though [00:35:09 -> 00:35:09] he [00:35:09 -> 00:35:09] retired [00:35:09 -> 00:35:10] and [00:35:10 -> 00:35:10] so [00:35:10 -> 00:35:10] we [00:35:10 -> 00:35:11] interacted [00:35:11 -> 00:35:11] with [00:35:11 -> 00:35:12] Canopy [00:35:12 -> 00:35:12] which [00:35:12 -> 00:35:12] was [00:35:12 -> 00:35:12] Ray's [00:35:12 -> 00:35:13] family [00:35:13 -> 00:35:13] office [00:35:13 -> 00:35:14] slash [00:35:14 -> 00:35:14] venture [00:35:14 -> 00:35:14] fund [00:35:14 -> 00:35:15] we [00:35:15 -> 00:35:16] co-invested [00:35:16 -> 00:35:16] with [00:35:16 -> 00:35:16] them [00:35:16 -> 00:35:16] we [00:35:16 -> 00:35:17] worked [00:35:17 -> 00:35:17] with [00:35:17 -> 00:35:17] them [00:35:17 -> 00:35:18] because [00:35:18 -> 00:35:18] Ray [00:35:18 -> 00:35:19] was an [00:35:19 -> 00:35:19] important [00:35:19 -> 00:35:20] part [00:35:20 -> 00:35:20] of [00:35:20 -> 00:35:20] the [00:35:20 -> 00:35:21] Novell [00:35:21 -> 00:35:21] story [00:35:21 -> 00:35:21] and [00:35:21 -> 00:35:22] so [00:35:22 -> 00:35:22] Eric [00:35:22 -> 00:35:22] wanted [00:35:22 -> 00:35:23] to [00:35:23 -> 00:35:23] make [00:35:23 -> 00:35:23] sure [00:35:23 -> 00:35:24] that [00:35:24 -> 00:35:24] we [00:35:24 -> 00:35:24] were [00:35:24 -> 00:35:25] interacting [00:35:25 -> 00:35:26] it's [00:35:26 -> 00:35:26] possible [00:35:26 -> 00:35:26] Owen [00:35:26 -> 00:35:27] kind [00:35:27 -> 00:35:27] of [00:35:27 -> 00:35:27] got [00:35:27 -> 00:35:27] me [00:35:27 -> 00:35:27] to [00:35:27 -> 00:35:28] meet [00:35:28 -> 00:35:28] you [00:35:28 -> 00:35:28] a [00:35:28 -> 00:35:28] little [00:35:28 -> 00:35:28] bit [00:35:28 -> 00:35:29] because [00:35:29 -> 00:35:29] he [00:35:29 -> 00:35:29] got [00:35:29 -> 00:35:29] me [00:35:49 -> 00:35:49] there [00:35:49 -> 00:35:49] was [00:35:49 -> 00:35:50] Kyle [00:35:50 -> 00:35:50] Powell [00:35:50 -> 00:35:51] Drew [00:35:51 -> 00:35:52] Majors [00:35:52 -> 00:35:52] and [00:35:52 -> 00:35:53] there [00:35:53 -> 00:35:53] was [00:35:53 -> 00:35:53] one [00:35:53 -> 00:35:54] more [00:35:54 -> 00:35:54] but [00:35:54 -> 00:35:54] I [00:35:54 -> 00:35:54] can't [00:35:54 -> 00:35:54] remember [00:35:54 -> 00:35:55] such [00:35:55 -> 00:35:55] a [00:35:55 -> 00:35:56] fascinating [00:35:56 -> 00:35:56] story [00:35:56 -> 00:35:57] but [00:35:57 -> 00:35:59] one [00:35:59 -> 00:36:00] thing [00:36:00 -> 00:36:00] about [00:36:00 -> 00:36:00] Blake [00:36:00 -> 00:36:00] and [00:36:00 -> 00:36:00] I'll [00:36:00 -> 00:36:01] just [00:36:01 -> 00:36:01] say [00:36:01 -> 00:36:01] this [00:36:01 -> 00:36:01] over [00:36:01 -> 00:36:01] all [00:36:01 -> 00:36:01] the [00:36:01 -> 00:36:02] years [00:36:02 -> 00:36:02] and [00:36:02 -> 00:36:02] the [00:36:02 -> 00:36:03] tremendous [00:36:03 -> 00:36:03] success [00:36:03 -> 00:36:03] Blake [00:36:03 -> 00:36:03] has [00:36:03 -> 00:36:04] gone [00:36:04 -> 00:36:04] through [00:36:04 -> 00:36:05] and [00:36:05 -> 00:36:05] what [00:36:05 -> 00:36:05] he's [00:36:05 -> 00:36:06] done [00:36:06 -> 00:36:06] he's [00:36:06 -> 00:36:07] also [00:36:07 -> 00:36:07] I'm [00:36:07 -> 00:36:08] not [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] trying [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] to [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] make [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] your [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] head [00:36:08 -> 00:36:08] big [00:36:08 -> 00:36:09] or [00:36:09 -> 00:36:09] flatter [00:36:09 -> 00:36:09] you [00:36:09 -> 00:36:10] unnecessarily [00:36:10 -> 00:36:10] but [00:36:10 -> 00:36:10] just [00:36:10 -> 00:36:11] really [00:36:11 -> 00:36:12] down [00:36:12 -> 00:36:12] to [00:36:12 -> 00:36:12] earth [00:36:12 -> 00:36:12] nice [00:36:12 -> 00:36:13] person [00:36:13 -> 00:36:13] that [00:36:13 -> 00:36:13] you [00:36:13 -> 00:36:14] know [00:36:14 -> 00:36:15] that [00:36:15 -> 00:36:15] you [00:36:15 -> 00:36:16] want [00:36:16 -> 00:36:16] to [00:36:16 -> 00:36:16] be [00:36:16 -> 00:36:16] friends [00:36:16 -> 00:36:16] with [00:36:16 -> 00:36:16] you [00:36:16 -> 00:36:17] could [00:36:17 -> 00:36:17] travel [00:36:17 -> 00:36:17] with [00:36:17 -> 00:36:17] and [00:36:17 -> 00:36:17] we [00:36:17 -> 00:36:17] have [00:36:17 -> 00:36:18] we [00:36:18 -> 00:36:18] traveled [00:36:18 -> 00:36:19] and [00:36:19 -> 00:36:19] it's [00:36:19 -> 00:36:19] just [00:36:19 -> 00:36:20] it's [00:36:20 -> 00:36:20] really [00:36:20 -> 00:36:21] pleasant [00:36:21 -> 00:36:21] that's [00:36:21 -> 00:36:21] what [00:36:21 -> 00:36:21] I [00:36:21 -> 00:36:21] say [00:36:21 -> 00:36:22] is [00:36:22 -> 00:36:22] a [00:36:22 -> 00:36:22] pleasant [00:36:22 -> 00:36:22] person [00:36:22 -> 00:36:23] I [00:36:45 -> 00:36:46] are [00:36:46 -> 00:36:47] the [00:36:47 -> 00:36:47] greats [00:36:47 -> 00:36:48] still [00:36:48 -> 00:36:48] coming [00:36:48 -> 00:36:49] like [00:36:49 -> 00:36:49] they [00:36:49 -> 00:36:49] were [00:36:49 -> 00:36:50] coming [00:36:50 -> 00:36:51] back [00:36:51 -> 00:36:51] 15 [00:36:51 -> 00:36:51] 20 [00:36:51 -> 00:36:52] years [00:36:52 -> 00:36:52] ago [00:36:52 -> 00:36:52] are [00:36:52 -> 00:36:53] founders [00:36:53 -> 00:36:53] different [00:36:53 -> 00:36:54] today [00:36:54 -> 00:36:54] than [00:36:54 -> 00:36:54] they [00:36:54 -> 00:36:55] were [00:36:55 -> 00:36:55] back [00:36:55 -> 00:36:55] 20 [00:36:55 -> 00:36:56] years [00:36:56 -> 00:36:56] ago [00:36:56 -> 00:36:57] like [00:36:57 -> 00:36:57] I [00:36:57 -> 00:36:57] just [00:36:57 -> 00:36:58] feel [00:36:58 -> 00:36:58] like [00:36:58 -> 00:36:59] at [00:36:59 -> 00:36:59] least [00:36:59 -> 00:36:59] me [00:36:59 -> 00:36:59] being [00:36:59 -> 00:36:59] a [00:36:59 -> 00:37:00] little [00:37:00 -> 00:37:00] bit [00:37:00 -> 00:37:00] of [00:37:00 -> 00:37:00] a [00:37:00 -> 00:37:00] younger [00:37:00 -> 00:37:01] generation [00:37:01 -> 00:37:01] than [00:37:01 -> 00:37:01] you [00:37:01 -> 00:37:01] two [00:37:01 -> 00:37:02] it's [00:37:02 -> 00:37:02] like [00:37:02 -> 00:37:03] I [00:37:03 -> 00:37:03] respect [00:37:03 -> 00:37:04] these [00:37:04 -> 00:37:04] names [00:37:04 -> 00:37:04] so [00:37:04 -> 00:37:05] much [00:37:05 -> 00:37:05] and [00:37:05 -> 00:37:05] it's [00:37:05 -> 00:37:05] like [00:37:05 -> 00:37:05] man [00:37:05 -> 00:37:05] are [00:37:05 -> 00:37:06] we [00:37:06 -> 00:37:06] going [00:37:06 -> 00:37:06] to [00:37:06 -> 00:37:06] have [00:37:06 -> 00:37:07] more [00:37:07 -> 00:37:07] word [00:37:07 -> 00:37:08] perfect [00:37:08 -> 00:37:09] novelle [00:37:09 -> 00:37:09] guys [00:37:09 -> 00:37:10] come [00:37:10 -> 00:37:10] down [00:37:10 -> 00:37:10] the [00:37:10 -> 00:37:10] pipe [00:37:10 -> 00:37:10] here [00:37:10 -> 00:37:11] like [00:37:11 -> 00:37:11] they [00:37:11 -> 00:37:12] used [00:37:12 -> 00:37:12] to [00:37:12 -> 00:37:12] come [00:37:12 -> 00:37:12] down [00:37:12 -> 00:37:13] it's [00:37:13 -> 00:37:13] like [00:37:13 -> 00:37:13] so [00:37:13 -> 00:37:13] disruptive [00:37:13 -> 00:37:14] inventing [00:37:14 -> 00:37:15] computer [00:37:15 -> 00:37:15] technology [00:37:15 -> 00:37:16] networking [00:37:16 -> 00:37:17] and [00:37:17 -> 00:37:17] cloud [00:37:17 -> 00:37:18] computing [00:37:18 -> 00:37:18] and [00:37:18 -> 00:37:18] like [00:37:18 -> 00:37:19] is [00:37:19 -> 00:37:19] that [00:37:19 -> 00:37:20] opportunity [00:37:20 -> 00:37:20] and [00:37:20 -> 00:37:20] those [00:37:20 -> 00:37:21] founders [00:37:21 -> 00:37:21] still [00:37:21 -> 00:37:21] around [00:37:21 -> 00:37:22] today [00:37:22 -> 00:37:22] like [00:37:22 -> 00:37:22] what [00:37:22 -> 00:37:22] do [00:37:22 -> 00:37:22] you [00:37:22 -> 00:37:23] guys [00:37:23 -> 00:37:23] see [00:37:23 -> 00:37:23] I'm [00:37:23 -> 00:37:23] going [00:37:23 -> 00:37:24] to say [00:37:24 -> 00:37:24] one [00:37:24 -> 00:37:24] thing [00:37:24 -> 00:37:24] just [00:37:24 -> 00:37:24] because [00:37:24 -> 00:37:24] I've [00:37:24 -> 00:37:25] studied [00:37:25 -> 00:37:25] it [00:37:25 -> 00:37:25] and [00:37:25 -> 00:37:25] had [00:37:25 -> 00:37:25] to [00:37:25 -> 00:37:26] teach [00:37:26 -> 00:37:26] about [00:37:26 -> 00:37:26] a [00:37:26 -> 00:37:26] little [00:37:26 -> 00:37:26] bit [00:37:26 -> 00:37:26] and [00:37:26 -> 00:37:27] I [00:37:27 -> 00:37:28] would [00:37:28 -> 00:37:28] say [00:37:28 -> 00:37:28] Blake [00:37:28 -> 00:37:28] lived [00:37:28 -> 00:37:28] it [00:37:28 -> 00:37:29] more [00:37:29 -> 00:37:29] but [00:37:29 -> 00:37:30] there [00:37:30 -> 00:37:30] was [00:37:41 -> 00:37:42] revolution [00:37:42 -> 00:37:43] and [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] so [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] they [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] figured [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] a lot [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] of [00:37:43 -> 00:37:43] things [00:37:43 -> 00:37:44] out [00:37:44 -> 00:37:44] that's [00:37:44 -> 00:37:44] what [00:37:44 -> 00:37:44] turned [00:37:44 -> 00:37:45] into [00:37:45 -> 00:37:45] novelle [00:37:45 -> 00:37:45] a little [00:37:45 -> 00:37:46] bit [00:37:46 -> 00:37:46] right [00:37:46 -> 00:37:47] and [00:37:47 -> 00:37:47] also [00:37:47 -> 00:37:48] which [00:37:48 -> 00:37:48] also [00:37:48 -> 00:37:48] led [00:37:48 -> 00:37:48] to [00:37:48 -> 00:37:49] word [00:37:49 -> 00:37:49] perfect [00:37:49 -> 00:37:49] and [00:37:49 -> 00:37:49] this [00:37:49 -> 00:37:50] virtuous [00:37:50 -> 00:37:50] cycles [00:37:50 -> 00:37:51] that's [00:37:51 -> 00:37:51] happened [00:37:51 -> 00:37:51] but [00:37:51 -> 00:37:52] your [00:37:52 -> 00:37:53] question [00:37:53 -> 00:37:53] is [00:37:53 -> 00:37:53] two [00:37:53 -> 00:37:53] sided [00:37:53 -> 00:37:55] from [00:37:55 -> 00:37:55] 19 [00:37:55 -> 00:37:56] call [00:37:56 -> 00:37:56] it [00:37:56 -> 00:37:58] 75 [00:37:58 -> 00:37:59] to [00:37:59 -> 00:37:59] 85 [00:37:59 -> 00:38:00] there [00:38:00 -> 00:38:01] was [00:38:01 -> 00:38:01] a ton [00:38:01 -> 00:38:01] of [00:38:01 -> 00:38:02] hardware [00:38:02 -> 00:38:02] and [00:38:02 -> 00:38:03] software [00:38:03 -> 00:38:03] being [00:38:03 -> 00:38:04] invented [00:38:04 -> 00:38:04] that [00:38:04 -> 00:38:05] was [00:38:05 -> 00:38:06] revolutionizing [00:38:06 -> 00:38:07] the world [00:38:07 -> 00:38:08] beyond [00:38:08 -> 00:38:08] and [00:38:08 -> 00:38:09] we [00:38:09 -> 00:38:09] were [00:38:09 -> 00:38:10] in that [00:38:10 -> 00:38:10] era [00:38:10 -> 00:38:11] where [00:38:11 -> 00:38:11] we were [00:38:11 -> 00:38:11] young [00:38:11 -> 00:38:12] bucks [00:38:12 -> 00:38:12] and [00:38:12 -> 00:38:12] we [00:38:12 -> 00:38:13] got [00:38:13 -> 00:38:13] to [00:38:13 -> 00:38:13] jump [00:38:13 -> 00:38:13] on [00:38:13 -> 00:38:13] that [00:38:13 -> 00:38:14] ride [00:38:14 -> 00:38:15] up [00:38:15 -> 00:38:15] and [00:38:15 -> 00:38:15] ride [00:38:15 -> 00:38:15] that [00:38:15 -> 00:38:15] ride [00:38:15 -> 00:38:16] up [00:38:16 -> 00:38:16] and [00:38:16 -> 00:38:16] that [00:38:16 -> 00:38:16] I [00:38:16 -> 00:38:16] don't [00:38:16 -> 00:38:17] know [00:38:17 -> 00:38:17] I [00:38:17 -> 00:38:17] think [00:38:17 -> 00:38:18] AI [00:38:18 -> 00:38:18] is [00:38:18 -> 00:38:18] the [00:38:18 -> 00:38:18] same [00:38:18 -> 00:38:18] thing [00:38:18 -> 00:38:19] I [00:38:19 -> 00:38:19] don't [00:38:19 -> 00:38:19] know [00:38:19 -> 00:38:19] if [00:38:19 -> 00:38:19] it's [00:38:19 -> 00:38:19] happening [00:38:19 -> 00:38:20] in [00:38:20 -> 00:38:20] Utah [00:38:20 -> 00:38:21] exactly [00:38:21 -> 00:38:21] the [00:38:21 -> 00:38:21] same [00:38:21 -> 00:38:21] way [00:38:21 -> 00:38:21] because [00:38:21 -> 00:38:22] Utah [00:38:22 -> 00:38:22] was [00:38:41 -> 00:38:41] it [00:39:12 -> 00:39:13] $800,000.

[00:39:13 -> 00:39:14] And to enter networking. [00:39:14 -> 00:39:15] Yeah. [00:39:15 -> 00:39:18] And they invented personal computer networking. [00:39:18 -> 00:39:19] And that was incredible.

[00:39:19 -> 00:39:26] And, you know, Tyler, to kind of double click on your question, you know, we can talk about the word perfects, the no vowels. [00:39:26 -> 00:39:33] You can either go back, even go further back to Evans and Sutherland and, you know, John Warnock that came out of the University of Utah. [00:39:33 -> 00:39:37] And the University of Utah was one of the four nodes on the ARPANET and all that kind of stuff. [00:39:37 -> 00:39:44] But when you pull it forward, you come through, you know, Gray Butterfield and Altaris and Landesk and the list goes on.

[00:39:44 -> 00:39:51] And then the next generation of Omnitures and then you have a Domo and a Pluralsight and, you know, we can list. [00:39:51 -> 00:39:55] And Omniture was big too, Tyler, because it was one of the first great SaaS companies. [00:39:55 -> 00:39:55] Yeah. [00:39:56 -> 00:39:56] Web.

[00:39:58 -> 00:40:06] Omniture, there was a leader for years called Web Trends that dominated the analytics industry and Omniture wiped them out. [00:40:06 -> 00:40:06] Yeah. [00:40:07 -> 00:40:09] I mean, it's crazy. [00:40:10 -> 00:40:11] Josh is a great friend.

[00:40:11 -> 00:40:21] I was sitting on the board of a company called NetObjects, which had a because you I think you were an investor in mycomputer.com, which had a term sheet to buy mycomputer.com. [00:40:21 -> 00:40:22] It was even publicly announced.

[00:40:22 -> 00:40:23] It was publicly announced. [00:40:24 -> 00:40:25] The Internet bubble burst. [00:40:26 -> 00:40:31] NetObjects market cap goes from like 1.5 billion to like 50 million dollars in like a week.

[00:40:31 -> 00:40:34] And we we have to. [00:40:34 -> 00:40:36] I didn't know you were on the board. [00:40:36 -> 00:40:37] Yeah, I was on the board. [00:40:37 -> 00:40:41] So I was I came down when the governor and Josh announced that publicly.

[00:40:41 -> 00:40:42] Yeah, I came down for the meeting. [00:40:42 -> 00:40:43] I'll never forget. [00:40:43 -> 00:40:45] This is an amazing lesson. [00:40:45 -> 00:40:48] I learned getting Mike Sisman, founder of Lotus.

[00:40:48 -> 00:40:53] So on this board with me and we had a million dollar breakup fee. [00:40:54 -> 00:40:55] NetObjects did. [00:40:56 -> 00:40:58] And so NetObjects was going to have to break up the deal. [00:40:58 -> 00:41:01] They didn't have the market cap to buy my computer.

[00:41:02 -> 00:41:06] And by the way, we only had like a couple million bucks left in the company. [00:41:07 -> 00:41:11] And so we were trying to figure out the CEO was sitting there going, how do I like I can't pay this. [00:41:11 -> 00:41:13] It's going to bankrupt my company. [00:41:13 -> 00:41:16] Mike Sisman goes, we have a commitment.

[00:41:16 -> 00:41:17] We made a promise. [00:41:17 -> 00:41:20] You send that kid 50 or a million dollars, meaning Josh. [00:41:21 -> 00:41:22] So we broke up the deal. [00:41:22 -> 00:41:27] We sent Josh a million dollars, kept him going and roll forward.

[00:41:27 -> 00:41:28] It became omniture. [00:41:28 -> 00:41:29] So roll forward. [00:41:29 -> 00:41:31] I joined UV Partners Pellion. [00:41:32 -> 00:41:33] Josh calls me.

[00:41:33 -> 00:41:38] I go to lunch with him at the Market Street Grill up in off of 215 by my old offices. [00:41:38 -> 00:41:46] And Josh is telling me about this great little thing he's developed that is on eBay, Tracks, all that kind of stuff. [00:41:47 -> 00:41:48] Three million bucks. [00:41:48 -> 00:41:50] I can own 30% of omniture.

[00:41:50 -> 00:41:54] I look at Josh and I go, Josh, I don't have the guts. [00:41:55 -> 00:41:57] Dude, I know where the bodies are buried. [00:41:57 -> 00:41:58] I sit on the board of NetObjects. [00:41:59 -> 00:41:59] So we passed.

[00:42:00 -> 00:42:00] Yeah. [00:42:00 -> 00:42:07] And when Josh went public, I call him on the phone and I said, hey, I'm calling so you can say I told you so. [00:42:08 -> 00:42:11] And he starts laughing on the other end and we started chatting. [00:42:13 -> 00:42:17] And he said, Blake, you were one of the only people who just told me no straight up.

[00:42:18 -> 00:42:21] And so then roll forward, Domo rolls around. [00:42:22 -> 00:42:26] I get a phone call from Josh and he says, look, I'm not inviting any VCs into this round. [00:42:26 -> 00:42:27] Do you guys want to invest? [00:42:28 -> 00:42:30] We were one of the original investors in Domo.

[00:42:30 -> 00:42:30] Yeah. [00:42:31 -> 00:42:32] So, yeah. [00:42:32 -> 00:42:34] That time you just took the shot. [00:42:34 -> 00:42:35] And the next time you took the shot.

[00:42:36 -> 00:42:39] I walk into my partners and I say, all right, Josh is doing something. [00:42:39 -> 00:42:42] I have no idea what the company is, but we have a chance to invest. [00:42:42 -> 00:42:45] They look at me and they go, go get us in the deal. [00:42:45 -> 00:42:46] I fly to California.

[00:42:46 -> 00:42:51] I meet Josh at the Rosewood Hotel at the top of Sand Hill Road. [00:42:52 -> 00:42:55] We're sitting out and there's Josh and Darren Thane. [00:42:55 -> 00:42:57] They explain what we're going to do. [00:42:57 -> 00:42:58] And I said, Josh, where do you want me to wire the money?

[00:43:00 -> 00:43:07] I mean, just to pull a little bit of contrast, you were also in the Omniture deal, right? [00:43:08 -> 00:43:12] And I know, obviously, that one burned a little bit on you where you could have put $3 million in. [00:43:12 -> 00:43:13] And who knows what that would have been today. [00:43:14 -> 00:43:15] I'm sure you've done the calculation point.

[00:43:15 -> 00:43:16] Hundreds of millions. [00:43:16 -> 00:43:17] Hundreds of millions. [00:43:17 -> 00:43:19] And I know you have a similar story where you were. [00:43:19 -> 00:43:20] Very successful.

[00:43:20 -> 00:43:22] The Omniture was very, very good to me. [00:43:22 -> 00:43:27] Yeah, but I'm saying you have a similar story where you even missed out with Nobu's piece, right? [00:43:28 -> 00:43:28] Yeah. [00:43:28 -> 00:43:35] After his story, if you want a quick story, is after Nobu, after that whole thing, I don't know if you know this.

[00:43:35 -> 00:43:42] So, Gary Williams and I, Josh and John, the valuation plummeted because your deal was $65 million. [00:43:42 -> 00:43:43] Yep. [00:43:43 -> 00:43:44] The net objects deal. [00:43:44 -> 00:43:44] I was there.

[00:43:44 -> 00:43:45] I was in there. [00:43:45 -> 00:43:53] After that, they were out, you know, even though they got the million from you, they had to lay off 40% of their people, 40% in one day, no severance. [00:43:54 -> 00:43:55] So, then they needed money. [00:43:56 -> 00:44:01] And we were going to do $400,000, Gary and I each $200,000 at a $9 million.

[00:44:02 -> 00:44:04] And I'm not going to say anything at a $9 million valuation. [00:44:04 -> 00:44:05] I'm not going to say anything. [00:44:05 -> 00:44:07] I let Gary kind of take the lead. [00:44:07 -> 00:44:16] And all I'm going to say is Gary kind of wanted a lower valuation, like $4.

5 million, and they turned us down. [00:44:16 -> 00:44:20] And I'm going, you know, I have to admit, I should have spoken up and been said, no, no, we'll do it. [00:44:20 -> 00:44:23] You know, 65 to 9, and he wanted $4.5 million.

[00:44:23 -> 00:44:28] Nobu comes in afterwards and does the $400,000 at an $8 million. [00:44:28 -> 00:44:29] Yeah. [00:44:29 -> 00:44:29] Okay. [00:44:30 -> 00:44:36] Fast forward to John Pasana's retirement party, you know, seven years, six years later, whatever it was at the retirement party.

[00:44:36 -> 00:44:38] John Pasana being the technical co-founder of Josh, right? [00:44:39 -> 00:44:39] Yeah. [00:44:39 -> 00:44:39] Good friend. [00:44:40 -> 00:44:42] And we're at his retirement party, incredible party.

[00:44:43 -> 00:44:44] Susan and I are walking out. [00:44:44 -> 00:44:45] We've been there a while. [00:44:45 -> 00:44:46] And Nobu and his wife are walking in. [00:44:48 -> 00:44:51] And Nobu goes, you know, and his, you know, he has a little accent, right?

[00:44:51 -> 00:44:55] But I won't mimic the accent, but he goes, he goes, John, isn't this great to be here? [00:44:56 -> 00:44:56] Everything's going on. [00:44:56 -> 00:44:57] I go, yeah, yeah. [00:44:57 -> 00:44:59] And he goes, hey, John, remember that $400,000?

[00:45:00 -> 00:45:01] He goes, I made $50 million. [00:45:03 -> 00:45:06] And then I go, yeah. [00:45:07 -> 00:45:09] And then as I'm walking in the car, Susan goes, what did you do? [00:45:10 -> 00:45:11] Totally.

[00:45:11 -> 00:45:13] So you guys both got a, yeah, you got some. [00:45:13 -> 00:45:15] We have a Josh story. [00:45:15 -> 00:45:21] So the reason I tell that story is I think what's changed is there's just more. [00:45:22 -> 00:45:23] Think about, think about this.

[00:45:23 -> 00:45:27] You got, you got Brandon Rodman, Blake Murray, Filevine. [00:45:27 -> 00:45:30] Like we can go down the list, Redo, Live View, Strider. [00:45:31 -> 00:45:32] We go down the list of these companies. [00:45:33 -> 00:45:39] There's more and more companies, which means there's more and more of these great founders.

[00:45:39 -> 00:45:43] You know, back in the word perfect days and the Novell days, there were two companies. [00:45:43 -> 00:45:46] Then you pull it forward, there's like four companies. [00:45:46 -> 00:45:49] Pull it forward, there's like, you know, maybe a dozen companies. [00:45:49 -> 00:45:52] Today there's like, I don't know how many, but hundreds.

[00:45:53 -> 00:46:05] And Tyler, to answer your question, so why I was kind of couching on that answer is because the opportunity for massive disruption, I mean, talking worldwide disruption, Utah really participated in 75 to 85 to 90. [00:46:05 -> 00:46:10] Now it's disruption more, I think, in business execution a lot. [00:46:10 -> 00:46:19] Like Utah's excellent at revenue generation and the ability, like if you look at even like Omniture, first SaaS company, what Omniture pulled off.

[00:46:20 -> 00:46:21] Let's take Podium, just one more thing. [00:46:22 -> 00:46:24] Podium is a sales machine, right? [00:46:24 -> 00:46:32] And what they've just done with AI to turn around after they missed the bubble opportunity in 21, I don't know if you've heard, but I've heard numbers of what they pulled off the last 12 months. [00:46:32 -> 00:46:33] It's amazing, right?

[00:46:33 -> 00:46:38] That crew, Eric Ray and all of them, crushing it. [00:46:38 -> 00:46:39] Yeah. [00:46:39 -> 00:46:51] And so, but so it's really, I think the answer is yes, they'll disrupt, but it's just not going to be like world changing stuff like what you saw in the early days of the computer revolution that happened starting in 75 to 80. [00:46:51 -> 00:46:58] But now it is, Utah's very good at taking technology and generating revenue and building great companies.

[00:46:59 -> 00:47:00] Qualtrics, look at Qualtrics. [00:47:00 -> 00:47:02] And what is Qualtrics? [00:47:02 -> 00:47:04] I have said this about Omniture and Qualtrics all the time. [00:47:05 -> 00:47:15] The first time I used their software, both Omniture, Site Catalyst and Omniture's, or I mean Qualtrics software, Omniture's, Site Catalyst and that, I sat down and go, this is Cadillac software.

[00:47:15 -> 00:47:21] This software's really, really good because it's not about they're just selling smoke. [00:47:21 -> 00:47:27] They're literally great sales execution with very great applications. [00:47:27 -> 00:47:28] That's what I see Utah as. [00:47:28 -> 00:47:29] Do you agree with that?

[00:47:29 -> 00:47:30] Oh, a hundred percent. [00:47:30 -> 00:47:33] I mean, we, we can go down the, I mean, good grief. [00:47:34 -> 00:47:36] Look at what Adam Edmonds is doing over there with Entrada. [00:47:37 -> 00:47:38] That's a massive company.

[00:47:39 -> 00:47:41] And I go, I don't, I was his first mentor when he was. [00:47:41 -> 00:47:42] Yeah. [00:47:42 -> 00:47:43] Shout out to Adam Edmonds. [00:47:43 -> 00:47:44] He's been on the podcast.

[00:47:44 -> 00:47:44] Yeah. [00:47:44 -> 00:47:45] And it's just fun. [00:47:45 -> 00:47:50] And then the stories of Adam and what went through with that is, and it boils down to this. [00:47:50 -> 00:47:52] And it's kind of funny.

[00:47:52 -> 00:47:56] BYU and this colleges in Utah do have some really special students. [00:47:56 -> 00:48:07] I spent 12 years there and these undergraduate students, what they've been able to pull off when they're taught a little bit of knowledge and told you can do it just like anybody else. [00:48:07 -> 00:48:08] They just go and do it. [00:48:08 -> 00:48:09] It's amazing, isn't it?

[00:48:09 -> 00:48:10] So fascinating. [00:48:10 -> 00:48:26] So I do want to contrast you two a little bit, just because I feel like it's important for the viewers and listeners that are trying to get into venture or trying to fundraise and trying to go to these venture firms and get their idea off the ground. [00:48:26 -> 00:48:31] Because there is a difference between like a Pelion and a startup ignition firm, right? [00:48:32 -> 00:48:34] And I think a lot of entrepreneurs like conflict the two.

[00:48:34 -> 00:48:37] They swap, oh, I have an idea. [00:48:37 -> 00:48:40] I'm going to go to Pelion and it becomes not a match at all. [00:48:40 -> 00:48:51] And they get shut down and they feel like their ego has been hurt and they get, you know, scared of VC or they get scared of fundraising and startups, right? [00:48:52 -> 00:48:55] And so because you do say, oh, we invest early.

[00:48:55 -> 00:48:56] And I know you do invest early. [00:48:56 -> 00:49:00] You've written very like small hundred thousands of dollars of checks, right? [00:49:00 -> 00:49:05] But at the same time, there is an ideal candidate and an ideal fit for what Pelion looks for. [00:49:06 -> 00:49:09] And of course, same with you with startup ignition ventures, right?

[00:49:09 -> 00:49:13] We're talking literally a $20 million fund versus a $500 million fund. [00:49:13 -> 00:49:20] And there has to be a little bit of a line in the sand drawn when an entrepreneur approaches each of those types of firms, right? [00:49:20 -> 00:49:31] And especially over the last two years, three years when the markets have been down and some of these kind of hurt and limping companies come to us for like a bridge round or a check of a smaller size. [00:49:31 -> 00:49:31] It's not what we do.

[00:49:31 -> 00:49:33] And we say that's just not a fit. [00:49:33 -> 00:49:39] Even though you fit our check size, like that's not the type of companies we invest in. [00:49:39 -> 00:49:40] And same thing for you. [00:49:40 -> 00:49:48] Like for someone to come off the street with an idea off of their napkin and say, Pelion, invest $10 million into my idea.

[00:49:48 -> 00:49:50] It's just such a shot. [00:49:50 -> 00:49:50] I don't know. [00:49:50 -> 00:49:52] Maybe I'm over speaking here. [00:49:52 -> 00:49:53] You're spot on.

[00:49:53 -> 00:50:08] But I think that's what I would like to go a little bit in this conversation is just so the viewers and listeners understand the stages of investment, the types of firms you're dealing with so that you don't just think every VC firm I can go and pitch and it's going to be a knock out of the park, right? [00:50:08 -> 00:50:11] So let's contrast that a little bit here. [00:50:11 -> 00:50:18] Like what is the ideal fit you're looking for and what is your ideal fit you're looking for that's like no brainer?

[00:50:18 -> 00:50:21] And yes, this is who I would love to work with. [00:50:21 -> 00:50:23] Yeah, I'll defer to you and you can go first if you want. [00:50:23 -> 00:50:23] Okay. [00:50:23 -> 00:50:24] Yeah.

[00:50:24 -> 00:50:25] No, sorry. [00:50:25 -> 00:50:28] That was a long explanation for my question. [00:50:28 -> 00:50:34] It's a great question because, you know, the entrepreneur needs to understand who we are. [00:50:34 -> 00:50:42] Like if you're, even if you're a seed stage, even though we say we do seed stage, we do, but honestly, we're a series A fund.

[00:50:42 -> 00:50:42] Yeah. [00:50:42 -> 00:50:43] Yeah. [00:50:43 -> 00:50:50] And like on the seed stage, we look at you guys and there's some others, other firms here in town that are great partners. [00:50:50 -> 00:50:53] That's almost like a validating component for us.

[00:50:53 -> 00:50:56] So we look at it and say, okay, have they been invested? [00:50:56 -> 00:51:01] You know, did they raise pre-seed or seed money from who are their advisors? [00:51:02 -> 00:51:03] Who's helping them along the way? [00:51:04 -> 00:51:13] And then like, if you cold call us, the likelihood is very remote because part of that is Utah is a small community.

[00:51:13 -> 00:51:22] You know, if Tyler or John pick up the phone or shoot me an email or a text and say, hey, we just funded this company, you guys should look at it. [00:51:22 -> 00:51:29] Or I met with this entrepreneur, they're series A, we like what they're doing, they're too late for us. [00:51:29 -> 00:51:31] That's the way to come see us. [00:51:31 -> 00:51:36] I can't tell you the number of LinkedIn cold email messages I get.

[00:51:36 -> 00:51:39] But the other thing I'd say is understand who we are. [00:51:40 -> 00:51:46] Like, I still get medical device deals coming at me, consumer products deals coming at me. [00:51:46 -> 00:51:50] And they may be amazing businesses, but we just don't do them. [00:51:50 -> 00:51:53] So understand where we invest.

[00:51:53 -> 00:51:59] Take the time to do the research on the community here in town because we're all a little different. [00:51:59 -> 00:52:00] We're all unique. [00:52:00 -> 00:52:12] Like, you know, and also look at the people that, you know, I'll just take us, for example, Ben Lambert, an amazing investor in the fintech space. [00:52:12 -> 00:52:15] Like, he led out on Divi for us.

[00:52:15 -> 00:52:19] He's actually invested in this company called Capital, which will do $700 million in revenue. [00:52:20 -> 00:52:22] Like, that guy understands fintech. [00:52:23 -> 00:52:26] Tyler Hogue, one of our other partners, understands fintech. [00:52:26 -> 00:52:29] So if you're a fintech, that's who you want to talk to.

[00:52:29 -> 00:52:30] You don't want to talk to me. [00:52:31 -> 00:52:35] Because I'll just, by the way, I'll refer you to Ben and Tyler because they have some expertise there. [00:52:35 -> 00:52:36] So anyway. [00:52:36 -> 00:52:36] Yeah.

[00:52:36 -> 00:52:39] And so I think what you're saying, too, is back to the venture returns, too. [00:52:40 -> 00:52:47] Pelion has gone from its first fund of $10 million 20 plus years ago, okay, to now $500 million in one fund. [00:52:47 -> 00:52:58] To get a venture return for your limited partners that makes you an all-star, you have to invest in companies that can get very big outcomes. [00:52:58 -> 00:53:07] You need very significant revenue in those companies so they can have great exits and you can get the returns.

[00:53:07 -> 00:53:10] Because you also double down and triple down along the way with these companies. [00:53:10 -> 00:53:12] It's not just the first investment. [00:53:12 -> 00:53:20] Your most successful companies, like you talked about that incredible return of $800,000, but you also put in tens of millions more over the life of the company, right? [00:53:20 -> 00:53:24] And so that means they have to have explosive growth.

[00:53:24 -> 00:53:27] They have to be disruptive to get that explosive growth. [00:53:27 -> 00:53:30] What you've been describing this whole podcast episode, that's what you're looking for. [00:53:31 -> 00:53:38] They could be, like you said, a great company, but they may not reach the heights that you need for your fund to get a venture return. [00:53:38 -> 00:53:40] I mean, you can just do the math.

[00:53:40 -> 00:53:44] $500 million fund, we need to turn that into $2 billion. [00:53:44 -> 00:53:44] Yeah. [00:53:44 -> 00:53:54] If our average ownership is 10%, that means we need to create $20 billion worth of market cap across our portfolio. [00:53:54 -> 00:53:56] And a smart founder knows that.

[00:53:56 -> 00:54:00] And so in answer to your question, I've recently made an infographic about our fund on what we need. [00:54:01 -> 00:54:03] So in contrast, you tell me what is the ideal candidate? [00:54:03 -> 00:54:11] Sometimes we're known at Startup Condition Ventures with the startups of our valuations are low, but if we don't get in at a low enough valuation and pre-seed, you can't make money. [00:54:11 -> 00:54:11] No.

[00:54:12 -> 00:54:15] Because we're going to be diluted one third to two thirds of whatever we go in. [00:54:15 -> 00:54:17] So let's call it half. [00:54:17 -> 00:54:20] We're going to be diluted half by the time there's a liquidity event. [00:54:20 -> 00:54:20] Half.

[00:54:20 -> 00:54:27] So that means we got to get that valuation at the right, or we're not going to get a return that makes a pre-seed fund successful. [00:54:27 -> 00:54:37] So for us, we're happy though, if we, you are very much more concerned about total addressable market and the bigness that it can be. [00:54:37 -> 00:54:40] For us, we have to say, we look at more than TAM. [00:54:40 -> 00:54:43] We look at, can this get to 10 to 30 million revenue?

[00:54:44 -> 00:54:45] 10 to 30 million is our sweet spot. [00:54:45 -> 00:54:53] If they can get up to 10 million revenue with this company, and it's a B2B SaaS and a vertical space, we're going to have a great exit. [00:54:53 -> 00:54:53] Yeah. [00:54:53 -> 00:54:57] Because we got in with a half a million dollars at a good valuation.

[00:54:57 -> 00:54:59] Does that make sense? [00:54:59 -> 00:54:59] Total sense. [00:55:00 -> 00:55:05] So there may be a company that's so appropriate for you guys, but not for us. [00:55:05 -> 00:55:06] Yes, absolutely.

[00:55:06 -> 00:55:07] That's what I'm trying to contrast. [00:55:08 -> 00:55:10] Because of the end outcome. [00:55:10 -> 00:55:11] Because you're right, John. [00:55:11 -> 00:55:22] I mean, I don't know how much you average per deal, but a successful company at Pellion, on average, we will invest between 30 and $50 million total.

[00:55:22 -> 00:55:22] Wow. [00:55:22 -> 00:55:27] What's your average first check size that you're giving in these A rounds? [00:55:27 -> 00:55:32] Right now, A rounds are between $7 and $15 million. [00:55:32 -> 00:55:33] Yeah, check.

[00:55:33 -> 00:55:33] Check. [00:55:34 -> 00:55:39] Well, the total round size, we can write that entire check. [00:55:39 -> 00:55:40] Or syndicate, yeah. [00:55:40 -> 00:55:43] So call it 10 to 12.

[00:55:43 -> 00:55:44] We actually did the math the other day. [00:55:44 -> 00:55:46] I was going to say, what is the average? [00:55:46 -> 00:55:52] Our average, right now, in our latest fund, our average initial check across everybody, $14 million. [00:55:53 -> 00:55:55] Yeah, see, that's our whole fund.

[00:55:55 -> 00:56:05] So to answer your question about us, is that what we'll do is we write a good sweet spot versus, let's call it $600,000, we'll put into a company, right? [00:56:05 -> 00:56:07] It has to be the right valuation in order for us to get out. [00:56:07 -> 00:56:10] But if it's a nice, this is not big. [00:56:10 -> 00:56:19] That company would probably never be big enough or have the breadth for you unless it shot out somewhere that is hard to predict.

[00:56:19 -> 00:56:20] Those would be our dragons if it did. [00:56:20 -> 00:56:22] That would be a great outcome. [00:56:22 -> 00:56:30] But like 4Up, which is a historical investment of mine, this is my number one angel investment of all time, was amazing. [00:56:30 -> 00:56:30] Uh-huh.

[00:56:30 -> 00:56:40] Okay, because I was involved in two tranches, okay, a very small tranche at a very low valuation, then later, a little bit more at a little bit higher valuation. [00:56:40 -> 00:56:52] And that company went on to get to $10 million revenue, sell for just under $100 million revenue, and I got, on the blended rate, I got $143X. [00:56:52 -> 00:56:52] Yeah. [00:56:53 -> 00:56:56] Okay, so that's what I did on that deal.

[00:56:56 -> 00:57:00] And that is a deal that never would have been fitting Pellion today. [00:57:00 -> 00:57:01] Yeah. [00:57:01 -> 00:57:08] If we both own 10% of a company that exits for $200 million, you guys return your entire fund. [00:57:08 -> 00:57:12] I return $20 million of a $500 million fund.

[00:57:12 -> 00:57:14] I don't even return 10% of the fund. [00:57:14 -> 00:57:15] Right, right, right. [00:57:15 -> 00:57:15] And so- [00:57:15 -> 00:57:17] That's starkly different. [00:57:17 -> 00:57:25] So this is what I'm saying is people, the Utah ecosystem needs to know where you fit and what you look for and what you need.

[00:57:25 -> 00:57:26] Exactly. [00:57:26 -> 00:57:26] And we're different too. [00:57:26 -> 00:57:30] Like some people are saying that we just are tough on valuation. [00:57:30 -> 00:57:30] Guess why?

[00:57:31 -> 00:57:35] Because we have 39 limited partners, okay, that we have to return. [00:57:35 -> 00:57:35] Yeah. [00:57:36 -> 00:57:36] Yeah. [00:57:36 -> 00:57:37] Okay.

[00:57:38 -> 00:57:42] Thank you for playing that black and white contrasting bit there. [00:57:42 -> 00:57:44] But okay, I'm going to close with some rapid fire questions. [00:57:44 -> 00:57:45] Yep. [00:57:45 -> 00:57:50] Like, okay, I want these to be one line, two lines, not a lot.

[00:57:50 -> 00:57:50] Okay. [00:57:50 -> 00:57:51] Here we go. [00:57:51 -> 00:57:56] One trait you bet on most in founders, best trait of a founder. [00:58:01 -> 00:58:09] You know, it sounds a little cliche, but coachable, kind, and driven.

[00:58:09 -> 00:58:09] Yeah. [00:58:09 -> 00:58:12] We, I would, what are you saying? [00:58:12 -> 00:58:12] You saying the same thing? [00:58:13 -> 00:58:13] Okay.

[00:58:13 -> 00:58:18] One thing every founder should be able to do. [00:58:21 -> 00:58:22] See around the corner. [00:58:22 -> 00:58:23] See, ooh. [00:58:23 -> 00:58:25] Be out, be looking at what's coming up.

[00:58:26 -> 00:58:26] Yeah. [00:58:26 -> 00:58:26] Yeah. [00:58:26 -> 00:58:31] They, they, they, they constantly need to be innovating themselves, their company. [00:58:31 -> 00:58:32] What is coming next?

[00:58:32 -> 00:58:32] Yeah. [00:58:32 -> 00:58:33] See around the corner. [00:58:33 -> 00:58:34] What do you say? [00:58:35 -> 00:58:36] I'm liking all of these.

[00:58:36 -> 00:58:36] Okay. [00:58:36 -> 00:58:37] Yeah. [00:58:37 -> 00:58:44] I mean, the three things he answered perfectly is that if you think about who are the best CEOs in our portfolio, that would describe that. [00:58:44 -> 00:58:44] Yeah.

[00:58:44 -> 00:58:44] Yeah. [00:58:45 -> 00:58:50] Uh, one thing VCs wish that founders understood. [00:58:53 -> 00:58:59] What's one thing you think a lot of founders are lacking or don't, are misunderstood? [00:58:59 -> 00:59:05] I, I, I, I think it's the misunderstanding and that is we're on your team.

[00:59:06 -> 00:59:06] Hmm. [00:59:07 -> 00:59:08] We are on your team. [00:59:08 -> 00:59:11] Our motivation is for you to be wildly successful. [00:59:11 -> 00:59:19] So when we're debating or discussing or pushing or pulling or what have you, we're on the same team.

[00:59:19 -> 00:59:26] And I think a lot of them do, but VCs do have a, uh, a native connotation. [00:59:26 -> 00:59:26] Yeah. [00:59:26 -> 00:59:27] Yeah, we do. [00:59:27 -> 00:59:29] And at the end of the day, we're on your team.

[00:59:29 -> 00:59:29] Yeah. [00:59:29 -> 00:59:34] What's the toughest part about being a VC, a venture investor? [00:59:37 -> 00:59:42] Um, like, what do you not like in your job? [00:59:44 -> 00:59:49] You know, probably having those conversations with the entrepreneurs, they're hard.

[00:59:49 -> 00:59:49] Right. [00:59:50 -> 00:59:50] Like what? [00:59:51 -> 00:59:52] This isn't working. [00:59:52 -> 00:59:54] We got to sell this business.

[00:59:54 -> 00:59:55] We got to shut this down. [00:59:57 -> 00:59:59] We need to add to your team. [00:59:59 -> 01:00:01] We need to bolster what you're doing. [01:00:01 -> 01:00:07] And we only say that because we're coming from a place of pattern recognition where we've seen it over time.

[01:00:07 -> 01:00:07] Yeah. [01:00:08 -> 01:00:08] Yeah. [01:00:08 -> 01:00:09] Like that's, that's a component. [01:00:09 -> 01:00:14] And then I'll say, just like entrepreneurs have to raise money, we have to raise money too.

[01:00:14 -> 01:00:19] It's unless your name's like Sequoia or Benchmark, that's easy. [01:00:19 -> 01:00:22] Like the rest of us, we actually have to go out and work and raise money. [01:00:22 -> 01:00:22] Yeah. [01:00:22 -> 01:00:23] We know.

[01:00:23 -> 01:00:23] Yeah. [01:00:23 -> 01:00:24] We know. [01:00:24 -> 01:00:24] Yeah. [01:00:25 -> 01:00:25] Okay.

[01:00:25 -> 01:00:25] Yeah. [01:00:26 -> 01:00:27] I was, it's interesting. [01:00:27 -> 01:00:30] He says the answers are just fantastic. [01:00:30 -> 01:00:31] Just keep going.

[01:00:31 -> 01:00:31] Yeah. [01:00:31 -> 01:00:32] Favorite part of the job. [01:00:33 -> 01:00:35] What's the best part about being a venture investor? [01:00:37 -> 01:00:41] Seeing companies get built that change the world.

[01:00:41 -> 01:00:41] Yeah. [01:00:41 -> 01:00:42] That dent the world. [01:00:42 -> 01:00:46] Like I will just double click on all of you out there. [01:00:46 -> 01:00:49] You have the ability to create something amazing.

[01:00:49 -> 01:00:53] And it's so fun to be sitting there part of those journeys. [01:00:53 -> 01:01:03] I could go down company after company and tell you what's going on with those businesses, but it's pretty fascinating to be part of that journey and cheering on those entrepreneurs. [01:01:03 -> 01:01:03] Yeah. [01:01:03 -> 01:01:05] That to me is one of my favorite things.

[01:01:05 -> 01:01:05] Love it. [01:01:05 -> 01:01:10] Blake, want to talk about one of the biggest deals that has ever happened to a VC in Utah? [01:01:11 -> 01:01:12] And that is Cloudflare. [01:01:12 -> 01:01:13] I mean, unbelievable.

[01:01:13 -> 01:01:19] Can you just run us through how you met those founders and how it went just in a couple minutes? [01:01:19 -> 01:01:19] Sure. [01:01:19 -> 01:01:24] All the way to going public and what that did for your fund and everything. [01:01:24 -> 01:01:24] Yeah.

[01:01:24 -> 01:01:27] So, so, uh, Matthew Prince is a Utah guy. [01:01:28 -> 01:01:32] He's, he's one of the founders, Matthew Prince, Michelle Zatlin and Lee Holloway. [01:01:33 -> 01:01:39] Matthew Prince went to, uh, middle school and high school with one of our interns slash associates, a guy named Ben Dahl. [01:01:40 -> 01:01:47] Matthew was at Harvard working on a business plan competition, calls Ben on the phone, says, Hey, I need somebody to talk to.

[01:01:47 -> 01:01:51] We pull in Carl Ledbetter because he understood the technology. [01:01:51 -> 01:01:52] We meet with Matthew. [01:01:53 -> 01:01:57] And, and the original setup was we're just being sounding boards for this business plan competition. [01:01:58 -> 01:02:00] What year was this?

[01:02:00 -> 01:02:02] This would have been 2009. [01:02:03 -> 01:02:11] And so Carl like listens to the story and he, after Matthew leaves, he looks at us and goes, dude, we got to be an investor in that thing. [01:02:11 -> 01:02:12] All right. [01:02:12 -> 01:02:14] Okay, here we go.

[01:02:14 -> 01:02:15] No revenue. [01:02:15 -> 01:02:22] Three founders at Harvard being incubated in Highland Capitals offices, and they're going to raise $2 million. [01:02:23 -> 01:02:27] So we invested $800,000 at a $6 million valuation. [01:02:28 -> 01:02:37] Then Carl negotiated in a super pro rata for the next round, which moved our ownership from 13% to 20% in the next round of financing.

[01:02:37 -> 01:02:46] So we got into it because Ben went to middle school and high school with, with Matthew, Carl understood the tech, Carl joined the board. [01:02:47 -> 01:02:53] And that company's original vision was just a firewall in the cloud. [01:02:54 -> 01:02:55] That's all they were. [01:02:55 -> 01:02:59] But I remember Matthew pitching us and he says, I'm going to power the internet.

[01:02:59 -> 01:03:01] Think about that vision for just a minute. [01:03:01 -> 01:03:02] I'm going to power the internet. [01:03:03 -> 01:03:13] So roll forward over the course from 2009 to 2019, when they went public, Pelion had a total of $124 million invested into that company. [01:03:13 -> 01:03:14] Wow.

[01:03:14 -> 01:03:19] Through our funds, through a co-investment vehicle that our LPs came in. [01:03:19 -> 01:03:22] That company goes public at $6 billion. [01:03:22 -> 01:03:24] Lockup comes off. [01:03:24 -> 01:03:25] It's trading at about $30 billion.

[01:03:27 -> 01:03:38] Our fourth fund, which is $120 million, we returned 10.1 times everybody's money in that single fund. [01:03:38 -> 01:03:40] Which is like best in the country. [01:03:40 -> 01:03:41] Best in the company.

[01:03:41 -> 01:03:42] That is an insane return. [01:03:42 -> 01:03:51] And it, we, by the time we got out, now we distributed shares, we had generated over $2 billion for our investors. [01:03:52 -> 01:03:52] Crazy. [01:03:52 -> 01:03:54] That's the Cloudflare story.

[01:03:54 -> 01:03:54] So, you know what? [01:03:54 -> 01:03:56] Matthew's an amazing entrepreneur. [01:03:57 -> 01:03:58] Michelle is unbelievable. [01:03:58 -> 01:04:03] Lee was just like, just a huge IQ.

[01:04:04 -> 01:04:06] And we got involved with those guys. [01:04:06 -> 01:04:08] It was just, they were sitting here today. [01:04:08 -> 01:04:12] Our CTO raves about Cloudflare all the time. [01:04:12 -> 01:04:12] I love it.

[01:04:12 -> 01:04:14] It's, isn't that crazy? [01:04:14 -> 01:04:14] Yeah. [01:04:14 -> 01:04:17] Well, half the internet runs through Cloudflare. [01:04:17 -> 01:04:17] No, yeah.

[01:04:17 -> 01:04:17] I know. [01:04:18 -> 01:04:19] Isn't that amazing? [01:04:19 -> 01:04:19] Yeah. [01:04:20 -> 01:04:20] Well done.

[01:04:21 -> 01:04:22] Thanks for sharing that story. [01:04:22 -> 01:04:23] That's a great story. [01:04:23 -> 01:04:23] Yeah. [01:04:23 -> 01:04:24] Okay.

[01:04:24 -> 01:04:26] Advice to your 30-year-old self. [01:04:26 -> 01:04:26] What are you saying? [01:04:29 -> 01:04:43] You know, I used to internalize and carry the weight of, for all you football fans out there, [01:04:43 -> 01:04:46] great cornerbacks get burned all the time. [01:04:47 -> 01:04:49] Somebody throws a touchdown, you get burned.

[01:04:50 -> 01:04:52] I used to carry that weight with me all the time. [01:04:52 -> 01:04:53] I'd carry it home. [01:04:54 -> 01:04:57] By the way, I have an unbelievable, amazing wife, which you both know. [01:04:57 -> 01:05:00] Like, sometimes I look back and I joke with her.

[01:05:00 -> 01:05:05] I'm like, how did you, like, not, you know, yell at me for the way I acted sometimes? [01:05:05 -> 01:05:10] I wish I could go back and go, dude, you got to let this stuff go. [01:05:10 -> 01:05:13] So, like, it's just part of the journey. [01:05:14 -> 01:05:16] Enjoy the journey.

[01:05:16 -> 01:05:16] Love it. [01:05:17 -> 01:05:23] But I also think, in the real sense of that, too, but knowing you, I say, because you care [01:05:23 -> 01:05:24] is why you feel that way. [01:05:24 -> 01:05:24] Yeah. [01:05:25 -> 01:05:26] It's way better than being calloused.

[01:05:27 -> 01:05:31] You don't want to be calloused, right, and just not care about other people. [01:05:31 -> 01:05:33] But there is a way to not let it eat you up inside. [01:05:33 -> 01:05:38] I think that's more what you're saying because I think a part of your success, Blake, is because [01:05:38 -> 01:05:45] you are a very pleasant person in business when a lot of people that have your role at [01:05:45 -> 01:05:50] other big, large, successful firms can be a little bit jerky, right?

[01:05:50 -> 01:05:54] I mean, you know what I'm talking about, and you don't need to be that way, and you've [01:05:54 -> 01:05:54] proven that. [01:05:54 -> 01:05:55] You don't need to be that way. [01:05:55 -> 01:06:01] You've become successful in a, you know, a lot of, you know, people in New York and [01:06:01 -> 01:06:06] San Francisco would look at what Pelion's done and go, unbelievable what Blake and his [01:06:06 -> 01:06:08] team have pulled off and have achieved here.

[01:06:08 -> 01:06:12] I mean, we're talking world-class achievement, and you didn't have to be a jerk. [01:06:12 -> 01:06:15] You didn't have to, you know, stick it to people and stuff like that. [01:06:16 -> 01:06:19] Sure, every once in a while, you're on a board, and the board has to replace the founder [01:06:19 -> 01:06:21] CEO, and that's not a pleasant experience. [01:06:21 -> 01:06:22] You said that.

[01:06:22 -> 01:06:25] And when you have to say, this company's not working, we either need to change the leadership [01:06:25 -> 01:06:26] or something. [01:06:26 -> 01:06:28] That's part of business, right? [01:06:28 -> 01:06:30] But yeah, I'm just saying, that's what I just. [01:06:31 -> 01:06:35] Letting it go does not mean that you still don't care about people.

[01:06:35 -> 01:06:36] You know, John. [01:06:36 -> 01:06:37] Does that make sense what I'm saying? [01:06:37 -> 01:06:38] Totally makes sense. [01:06:39 -> 01:06:42] There's abundance mentality, and there's scarcity mentality.

[01:06:44 -> 01:06:49] And at Pelion, if you have a scarcity mentality, you won't last long at our firm. [01:06:50 -> 01:06:51] You've got to have an abundance mentality. [01:06:52 -> 01:06:57] If we can't help, especially the Utah ecosystem, we're not doing our jobs. [01:06:57 -> 01:06:59] That doesn't mean we're investors in a company.

[01:06:59 -> 01:07:03] I mean, we've got incubation space, and I've got companies in there that we're not investors [01:07:03 -> 01:07:06] in, because I want to help those entrepreneurs build something. [01:07:06 -> 01:07:13] So you need to be thoughtful about having an abundance mentality, and how can we just be [01:07:13 -> 01:07:16] part of the greatness that is here? [01:07:16 -> 01:07:16] Yeah. [01:07:16 -> 01:07:18] That abundance mentality comes with it.

[01:07:18 -> 01:07:22] What you experienced in the first part of your career is that because you have an abundance [01:07:22 -> 01:07:25] mentality, you care about the other person on their side. [01:07:25 -> 01:07:27] So when they lose, you're feeling that loss. [01:07:27 -> 01:07:31] See, a scarcity mentality is indifferent to the other side, right? [01:07:31 -> 01:07:35] Where they're saying, one of us is going to be a winner or loser.

[01:07:35 -> 01:07:35] I'm going to be the winner. [01:07:36 -> 01:07:36] You're the loser. [01:07:36 -> 01:07:38] And I have to turn off my emotions because I don't care. [01:07:38 -> 01:07:38] Yeah.

[01:07:39 -> 01:07:39] It's no fun. [01:07:39 -> 01:07:41] I don't think you could ever be that one. [01:07:41 -> 01:07:41] No. [01:07:41 -> 01:07:43] It's no fun to win if somebody else has to lose.

[01:07:44 -> 01:07:44] Right. [01:07:44 -> 01:07:44] Yeah. [01:07:44 -> 01:07:47] That is like, I don't want to do it. [01:07:47 -> 01:07:47] Yeah.

[01:07:47 -> 01:07:48] It's no fun. [01:07:48 -> 01:07:52] I think this is a perfect segue to the final question that I alerted to you before the [01:07:52 -> 01:07:53] podcast pre-recording. [01:07:53 -> 01:07:56] I said, Blake, I'm going to ask you for the one last thing. [01:07:56 -> 01:08:00] So we always close with the final question, and we liked it to be the big takeaway.

[01:08:00 -> 01:08:03] Like, what do you want to leave these listeners and viewers with? [01:08:03 -> 01:08:08] What's the one piece of advice for the early entrepreneur who's building right now, trying [01:08:08 -> 01:08:11] to make a dent in the world, like you're saying, what are you telling them? [01:08:11 -> 01:08:11] Yeah. [01:08:11 -> 01:08:20] You know, what I'm telling them is you have the chance to shape your life, your family, [01:08:20 -> 01:08:21] the world.

[01:08:22 -> 01:08:27] Think out decades, what's going to be inscribed on your tombstone. [01:08:28 -> 01:08:34] And if what's inscribed on your tombstone, you don't like, change it, change it. [01:08:34 -> 01:08:45] You know, uh, we talked a bit about it is I hope that people think about us as we love, [01:08:45 -> 01:08:51] we, we, we, you know, kindness, love, generosity, all of those sorts of adjectives. [01:08:52 -> 01:09:01] And then I'd say, make sure your life at home is in sync with the way it should be.

[01:09:01 -> 01:09:02] You know what? [01:09:02 -> 01:09:06] I, I've mentioned my wife a couple of times. [01:09:06 -> 01:09:07] I would not be here. [01:09:07 -> 01:09:09] Pellion would not be here.

[01:09:09 -> 01:09:15] If I did not have that great foundation of my wife and my kids, make sure whatever your [01:09:15 -> 01:09:19] home looks like, you have it, you have yourself put together. [01:09:20 -> 01:09:21] And how long have you and Sandy been married? [01:09:22 -> 01:09:23] Got married in 1989. [01:09:23 -> 01:09:25] So what is that?

[01:09:25 -> 01:09:27] 36 years, 37 years? [01:09:28 -> 01:09:29] And I hit 43 yesterday. [01:09:29 -> 01:09:29] Wow. [01:09:30 -> 01:09:30] Congratulations.

[01:09:31 -> 01:09:33] Hey guys, I hit 15 next week. [01:09:33 -> 01:09:34] There we go. [01:09:34 -> 01:09:35] There we go. [01:09:35 -> 01:09:35] Yeah.

[01:09:35 -> 01:09:36] So, okay. [01:09:36 -> 01:09:38] Thank you, Blake, for coming on the podcast. [01:09:38 -> 01:09:39] It's been amazing. [01:09:39 -> 01:09:41] I think this has been an awesome episode.

[01:09:41 -> 01:09:47] Just giving insights of how found founders should, you know, treat VCs, how to understand [01:09:47 -> 01:09:51] that, how the game is played, the, the realness that you're talking about, what you look for [01:09:51 -> 01:09:55] investments that, you know, I really appreciate you coming on. [01:09:55 -> 01:09:56] It's been a great episode. [01:09:56 -> 01:09:57] So thank you for watching. [01:09:58 -> 01:09:59] We're going to wrap up here.

[01:09:59 -> 01:10:01] This has been the startup ignition podcast. [01:10:01 -> 01:10:03] Thank you, Blake, for coming on so much. [01:10:03 -> 01:10:03] Yes. [01:10:03 -> 01:10:04] We applaud you, Blake.

[01:10:04 -> 01:10:06] And thank you for doing everything you're doing in Utah. [01:10:06 -> 01:10:10] Obviously, you can tell this whole episode has been us fanboying around you the whole [01:10:10 -> 01:10:12] episode, but no, we are really believers. [01:10:12 -> 01:10:13] Thank you for being great partners. [01:10:13 -> 01:10:14] We've done a handful of deals together.

[01:10:14 -> 01:10:17] It's been great to work with you and that's it for the podcast. [01:10:17 -> 01:10:18] And thank you. [01:10:18 -> 01:10:19] We are out.