Impact of LEO Satellite Connectivity in Africa

Greg: Welcome to No Free Lunch, Africa's freshest business and tech podcast. With me, your host, Greg Stewart. And today's discussion is about the rapid growth of low orbit satellite connectivity and what this means for Africa. And with me in studio today is Wesley von Rain, product and solutions lead at Red Vine Networks.

Welcome to No Free Lunch, Wesley. Wesley van Rayne: Thank you, Greg. What a privilege to be here. Greg: Well it's good to have the chat about the whole satellite development and there's certainly lots of things happening in that space.

It's a lot of focus of news and media is of course around, especially in South Africa, around SpaceX and their satellite licenses that there's all sorts of nonsense around. But it's not just SpaceX that's in Africa. there's a whole bunch of them. So give us your overview about what's happening in that space.

your company has done some research and and has some interesting data on it. And tell us a bit about Red Vine and and what you do there. Wesley van Rayne: All right. Thanks, Greg.

so we've been around for almost a decade now, so nine years. We started as a S D wan company. So interconnecting large enterprises, especially multi site solutions, over multiple different links. over the the years, we've actually started gathering or storing all this telemetry on the last mile links.

So last mile links being your fiber, 3G LTE and now LEO satellite technology. And what actually triggered all of this is as you touched on briefly, is all the controversy around Starlink not being in South Africa and, you know, the reasons behind it without getting too much into the political weeds, you know, Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: Then we saw a a news article that Amazon's actually coming and bringing their Leo solution to South Africa early next year. And I discussed this with a team and I said, Who better to actually comment on all of this than us?

we sit with ISP agnostic data just unintentionally, you know, like we've been just been delivering redundant network services for businesses through our SDY and tech. But because of all that telemetry that we we gathered, we have insight. We've seen the trends. We've seen what it's done for businesses.

We've seen how it can potentially impact partners and customers. And not just potentially now you know what's happening out there because our coverage is throughout Africa. We do have some areas in Australia, Middle East, touching on Europe as well because a lot of our target market is big multinationals. And I just said to our engineering team, what if we had to just pull some stats on on what stalink specifically is doing and by extension any other Leo technologies out there.

And that's how we came about all these stats, and like we mentioned in our article, one of the biggest ones is that seventy percent adoption rate. And keep in mind that's just within our lens. that's not even including all just all the consumer driven adoption as well as enterprises that just have Starlink without our tech. So that adoption rate is very interesting but it also makes sense, you know, like with Leo, you're able to get coverage where you don't have any other alternatives.

But what's interesting because of our tech the technology that we deliver, it also becomes an option for one of your last mile links. So let's say you are in a developed area, but you just want some additional redundancy, then putting this consumer grade Leo link onto your business environment still makes a lot of sense because what our tech can do is actually enhance the performance of that link anyway, regardless. And again, Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: that's where we spoke about the improved uptime, the overall uptime of sites and businesses as a result of more of these Leo links being distributed across all these regions.

Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: there's a lot we can talk about. I think one of the key things yeah. Sure.

Greg: So let's sorry, I'm gonna interrupt you there just quick briefly, Wesley. So let's first talk about your telemetry shows 70% growth in active satellite nodes. I'm assuming that's off a smallish base though. and where does your data cover?

So I'm assuming it's data that covers outside of South Africa because there's no official Starlink nodes in South Africa, and of course Amazon hasn't come online yet. So where's that connectivity? Just clarify that Wesley van Rayne: Okay. Yeah, I think that's a good that's a good question to try and just make sense of all of this.

So the data that we have obviously excludes South Africa because we don't have Starlink in South Africa yet. It also excludes Namibia because they also have the same political issues when it comes to Starlink that we do based on the public articles that are out there. So Our data comes from everywhere else, largely in the Sadek region, sub Saharan Africa, all the way up to West Africa. Like I mentioned earlier, so the small pockets would be outside of Africa, where we've got a handful of instances in Australia.

The Australian one's quite interesting because it's actually on a ship. So the ship becomes like an office site. So that's that's quite cool. Greg: Okay.

Wesley van Rayne: But in Africa We've got hundreds of nodes out there. I don't know if that's large or small that that are running that are running Starlink. So with hundreds we've seen a seven seventy percent increase there. So again, like small, large, it depends on the the business or the the size of the enterprise you're talking about.

But when it comes to African coverage, yeah. largely across the SADIC and East African region is where we're getting the data from. So the data is because of the tech that we put down. Traffic flows through the devices.

The device collects and analyzes the telemetry regardless of the links. So the device doesn't care whether it's a Starlink or a fiber or it Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: just sees links and it sees telemetry. It then It does a look up on the public IP addresses to tell you who the service provider is, and that's how we're able to figure out who that link belongs to.

And besides this the the satellite stuff, what we also gain insight into is, you know, and this is this is also very interesting for us, is we can see who are the best performing ISPs for a specific region. And we can see Greg: Yes. Wesley van Rayne: it objectively. No sponsorships, no one feeding us information.

It's all just pure Greg: Yeah. No no PR. Wesley van Rayne: data. No PR, nothing.

We've just got raw data that can tell you in these pockets, these are the best performing ISP links. So, leveraging that, we're like, can we not use the same mechanism to look at the Starlink solution and see what's happening there? And so we just filter it out just for Starlink. and that's that's where we started seeing all these interesting stats.

Greg: and in terms of the data that you've seen, I would imagine that most major corporates now have more than one link as a backup. but are you seeing I'm assuming that what I'm reading out of the data is that adding this satellite low orbit satellite link into that mix. is improving the overall performance of the network. Wesley van Rayne: Yes, absolutely.

so with SDY and tech specifically what we provide, the more links you use, the better. We link agnostic. Greg: Okay. Wesley van Rayne: the tech runs an algorithm across the links, it load balances, it does go packets.

So the more you give it, the better it can calculate quality aware, best path selection across those links to another site. So Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: because of that basic mechanism When you add a Starlink or any Leo take to that, it just gives the solution more options, more load balancing Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: options and so on.

And then we can get into the micro details or we can control specifically traffic engineer types of traffic over specific link types. So let's say your Starlink is fairly stable, but there's a lot of packet loss on there. We can tell your environment not to steer packet loss sensitive applications like TCP or transactional traffic over that link, rather Greg: Show Wesley van Rayne: steer it over your main fiber lines and so on. So we can get very flexible when it comes to how we we use those links.

But in a nutshell, yes, adding an additional satellite link as a backup definitely gives a business more options. And again, looking at the data that we have. those options have led to an overall uptime average for each edge. So what's interesting is we almost have like this inverse graph where you have the Leo not necessarily being reliable for all sorts of reasons, weather availability and so on.

But where those Leo links attach to a site, the site's uptime actually improves still. So they've actually gained more uptime without necessarily having it inside the satellite environment. Greg: you raised something there that I actually that was going to be my next question to you was what effect does weather have? my experience of satellite is satellite T V and a dish on the roof and when it rains and it's cloudy you can't get signal.

is there a similar situation with connectivity via satellite? Wesley van Rayne: So it's an interesting question. I can't really comment on it because I'm not a satellite specialist. Like I said, I'm Greg: Okay.

Wesley van Rayne: more a traffic engineering specialist, but it Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: is definitely something that I'd like to correlate with with our team because we can Greg: Okay. Wesley van Rayne: we can actually get the weather stats and see if we can find a correlation between Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: that uptime and whatever.

So I say weather, I it's an assumption. I don't I'm not an expert on on whether Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: it's weather or not, but it could be. But definitely something we could look into with with raw data, yeah.

Greg: Sure. And of course in Africa with connectivity issues around having enough infrastructure. and infrastructure, if you're talking about rural areas where there's mines or there's agricultural operations and so on, it's really expensive to put in fiber or or some other, you know, grid. whereas with satellite connectivity, you've got that connectivity without all of those additional costs.

Is satellite connectivity cheaper Wesley van Rayne: Yeah. Greg: or is it likely to drive prices downwards? And also that with Starlink now talking about direct to satellite communication from cell phones, lots of discussions around cutting out existing grids and all that sort of thing. Talk Wesley van Rayne: Yeah we're gonna.

Greg: I know it may not be your purview, but but talk to us a bit about. how that looks and and how perhaps your company sees that going afford. Wesley van Rayne: So again, maybe this is something I can actually comment a little bit more on. Again, I've made a few comments on LinkedIn about this.

They very quickly turned political because again, the countries and the politicians catch wind of you talking Greg: Show Wesley van Rayne: about midterm, long term, short term implications, and they're like, so you don't care about the future of the country? And I'm like, I'm just talking about data that I see. So with Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: that disclaimer, what we've seen or what I've seen based on the feedback from from ISPs in country, enterprise ISPs that deliver enterprise grade services at a premium, and Greg: Yes.

Wesley van Rayne: how they have to compete with consumer grade links that are able to satisfy, I won't say perform as well as a as your enterprise link enterprise grade links. But can satisfy the business enough that it justifies that cost difference. Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: that has all sorts of implications.

so in the short term, ultimately the consumers benefit. Like you mentioned, mining operations can continue, especially if you secure the link with an SD UN overlay on top of that and the SD UN doing traffic engineering, it very quickly turns it into an enterprise class solution. And that's a large part of what we say to these ISPs is, combine it, use it as one of your tools to offer a holistic service so that you are not just in a race to the bottom model of trying to compete with consumer grade links that you're never going to compete with just because of the volumes.

you're competing with global volumes, you guys are in country, you you're never gonna compete on price. So it is very tricky and it is very awkward for incumbent service providers because the solutions also geared to cut them out, so to speak, because it's it's consumer focused. So, a big part of what I said, is look at it as a solution to an entire service, don't Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: Look at it as links.

don't just sell links, sell a solution, sell a story like Mr. Mining Customer. You are out in the sticks. Here's a portfolio of solutions that I can offer in that bundle.

you've got Leo, it may happen to be Starlink today. If Amazon moves into the same region, it could be why one or the other or both. You can throw Greg: Sure. Wesley van Rayne: in a fiber link there and just have the whole story.

So that's how we try and address or try and help alleviate that concern when it comes to consumer grade links. the other concern that we as Red Vine have is like the midterm, long term, and short term implications. Because our motto at Red Vine is modernizing Africa. And bringing more connectivity, whether it's through us or not, fulfills that motto.

Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: like Africa is modernizing. And we love stories where Africa can leapfrog a generation Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: of technology.

Instead of playing catch up and feeling like they lag behind, they just immediately become the most modern thing. And we love it. You know, our tech enables that. And besides our tech, stories like that are awesome.

So in the short term, Looking at it through that lens, we love the story because, like I mentioned, consumers benefit at the end of the day. They get connectivity. Midterm, you've got the pricing implications. You've got the competition between, you know, the B2B carriers and the B2C guys that are just reselling it.

And then just this global giant that can just come in and, take everything out money-wise. And then that that comes to the long-term implications. And that's where things start getting a bit political, And I'm Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: not a politician, I'm not a lawyer.

Greg: So Wesley van Rayne: But that's the big question, Mark, right? what happens at the end of the day? And I suppose this is why South Africa, Namibia are, you know, wrestling around with these things and somehow Amazon seems to have figured it out. But who benefits, does this benefit a country?

So in the short term, yes, it's great, my business can continue. But where's all that money going and who's benefiting from it? on the one hand, you've got the business, they can be taxed. If they can do more and generate more, you can tax them or you can tax the technology itself and hope that the money then finds its way back to the people that need it the most.

but on the other hand, if you don't do that. that money just goes directly to a big global Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: incumbent. So that's that's kinda it's a tricky one, but that's Greg: Yeah.

Wesley van Rayne: that's what we what I think we are wrestling with at the moment. Greg: Yeah, I think one could also argue that very similar things happened in the digital platforms in the world today the likes of the Googles and the Metas and so on, that are completely dominating the media and advertising space. I mean, that money is extracted out of every country. and and goes and sits in big Wesley van Rayne: I think Greg: corporates in America.

But that doesn't stop them from banning Google or Facebook or any of those. so you know, can't say, well we We're not going to bring electricity into the country because, the company that can bring that to us is from elsewhere, just as an argument. it Wesley van Rayne: It is Greg: seems a useless argument to me. what should rather be the question is can this benefit the economy and can it help the economy grow?

And we know that connectivity across Africa, the growth in connectivity has been always accompanied by growth in GDP. it just opens up markets, opens up opportunity for people to trade, for people to do business, for all sorts of other new products and services. so it seems a bit of a silly argument in my opinion, and perhaps it should be rather how can we benefit from this? You know.

We are we gonna w drive around in horse carts because we didn't invent the car. Wesley van Rayne: Yeah, Greg: it's seems like a superfluous argument to me. but certainly I think the way things are going, there's gonna be some impact. And of course, you might have some politicians sitting with interest in telecommunications companies they wanna keep Wesley van Rayne: Okay.

Greg: and that seems to be more of the driver than than the actual practical application. And the the practical application is how can we bring connectivity to Africa? And that should be the big question. And if whatever technology or company can do that, well, it seems to me that, unless they're a bunch of really evil, horrible people, we should actually try and embrace it and see how it can be used, in my opinion.

but I'm just an editor. So I I think Wesley van Rayne: Very smart editor. Greg: so I think that those kind of discussions hopefully will find some sensibility and and find some direction that actually you know looks at how do we benefit Africa as a whole rather than individual people. Are there constraints still with satellite low orbit satellite connectivities?

And have they still got some hurdles to overcome to make it realistically a viable option or or is it really there? Has it arrived? Is it good? just give us your view on that.

Wesley van Rayne: So based on again, based on the data and, speaking to those end customers that have it, it's arrived and it's and it's good. You know, looking at our data and it also touches on your previous point, which I agree with wholeheartedly by Is you know there'd be sites that would otherwise not be online if it wasn't for these satellite services, and it's not just that they're online, it's that they're connecting fairly well and conducting business, comparative to a site that has a fixed line.

So the tech is there, Greg: Okay. Wesley van Rayne: it works very well. and I think that's why there's all this, noise about it in their media, yeah. Greg: Last question for me, Wiz is just one of the big things today is obviously things like data sovereignty and data residency and security and so on.

personally I don't believe there is such a thing as data sovereignty or or residency, because well, I suppose you can. You can still have a server in your in your server room in your basement and have it there. Wesley van Rayne: Okay, yeah. Greg: But that's probably linked to some cloud backup anyway.

and so, it's an interesting but it's also one of these sticky points that people seem to be mulling over. In terms of satellites, obviously those satellites are linked to heaven knows where. well to heaven, I guess. And how does one deal with that perspective.

You obviously have clients in that when you talk about data residency and so on, how does that impact when you start adding satellites? Does that change the discussion? Wesley van Rayne: So the way I like to look at securing data, look we network engineers, network engineers move traffic around. So we build the roads and we manage how the cars drive on the road.

We're less so interested in who the drivers are, like a cybersecurity Greg: Yeah. Wesley van Rayne: person would be. But I use that analogy because you have to look at your cybersecurity in those two lenses, in my opinion, is How secure is the transport of the traffic? So, how safely are the cars driving on the roads and are they getting to their destination safely without someone interfering with the passenger or changing the passenger to something else or putting malicious cargo in your little car before it gets to its destination?

So, how safely is that transport happening? And then obviously, where you get into the real cybersecurity side of things is when you actually inspect what that vehicle is doing. So from a traffic engineering transport point of view, our solution encrypts the traffic the Starlink or any Leo or any internet public link is is open, you know, like everyone can see Greg: Yeah. Yeah.

Wesley van Rayne: what you're transmitting. And it really comes down to what mechanisms or what software applications or hardware devices are running on top of that link. So what Greg: Right. Wesley van Rayne: we do is we will secure and encrypt that traffic and control where the flow goes.

Like make sure that if you have a Starlink that's intended to only interconnect two sites together, then we'll ensure that there's an encrypted tunnel that doesn't allow traffic to ever deviate from that path. So I think to answer your question, how we address the sovereignty point of it is through a traffic engineering where we through policies can control and steer how traffic enters and exits a network, regardless of what the last mile link is doing. So for us, the LEO is just another last mile link in that equation.

But of course, there's a lot more to data sovereignty and security than just the transport. We look after the transport predominantly as a first step. And then there's other technologies that we can lay on top of that to inspect specific traffic types like AI is a big one and AI is generating all sorts of interesting new traffic flows where traffic flow has predominantly been largely big downloads with small uploads and that kind of shifts And it's becoming a bit bursty as someone dumps a file into their chat GPT, which they shouldn't really, but dumps a f corporate file in and then that gets uploaded and that messes with the way links, especially consumer grade links, were designed to handle bandwidth.

So obviously securing the payload information inside that becomes as equally important as, delivering the data. I hope that answers the question. Greg: That certainly answers the question. And Whesiford Rain, it's been a a fascinating discussion and hopefully we get to chat a bit more about Leos and other armored car deliveries for data somewhere along the line.

but I think that certainly clarified a lot of what's happening in that marketplace. Thank you for the insights and thank you for joining me on No Free Lunch. Wesley van Rayne: You're welcome. Thanks for having me, Greg.

Cheers.