Nikki Lang: Why Genuine Connections Matter in Sales

Speaker A: You're listening to the Great Day in Sales podcast, brought to you by Alicia. All right, welcome everyone to the Great Day in Sales podcast. I'm very excited to have Nikki Lang here with me, who is all about sales mindset, keeping it human. She's been growing her brand on LinkedIn as well. So really excited just to talk to her about what that process has been like. Nikki, thanks for joining us.

Speaker B: Hey, Justin. I am extremely excited to be here. Thank you so much for having me. And yeah, this is a topic very near and dear to my heart, so I'm, I'm excited to talk about it today.

Speaker A: Cool. How, you know, we were talking before the podcast a little about your, you know, you grew up in a small town, you've actually moved your family out there. Now how. Now you're at Copy AI. Ah, really crushing it in the enterprise space. What, what's been that. How'd you end up@ copy AI for sure. But how did you get into tech sales? How have you kind of unlocked this? Uh, you know, obviously you have a plethora of soft skills to be successful in sales. So how did you kind of come across this, um, career?

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, that's such a great question. Um, so I kind of fell into sales right after college. I, I was selling my first sales job ever, which is not even on my LinkedIn profile anymore. Um, um, I was a membership director at a gym, like at a high end gym in Miami. I went to University of Miami and I had worked as a receptionist there during college. So after I graduated, I was like, okay, I'll start selling and, uh, selling memberships. And it turns out, like, I just really like talking to people and connecting with people and that, like, interaction of never knowing who you're going to meet and learning about their goals and what they wanted. Get out of a new, you know, gym or fitness experience was really, I just loved it. And then I was like, wait a minute, am I good at this? Like my good at sales, I really enjoy it. And turns out I did very well in the role. So I wanted, I was like, okay, if I'm going to be, uh, a seller, if I'm going to build a career in sales, then I want to do it the right way and get into an industry where, you know, I can really learn and hone my craft. And so I decided to go into tech sales. I started as a bdr, just like so many of us, um, at Blackbaud. And I was in office, and it was just such an incredible environment to be on a Team and I just fell in love. Like it was my, honestly like my time as a BDR was my, one of my favorite jobs I ever had. I um, was in that role for about six months and, and things just sort of kind of took off from there and I've been growing um, my career ever since. Um, I was with Hacker1, I was with Clary and now I'm at Copy AI and it's been quite a ride. Yeah. So I've been in the industry for about a little over a decade now.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. And I love how you're kind of building this platform of keep it human while working at a clear AI company, which I think is pretty intriguing. But it's true, right? I mean you can have all the processes, you can have all the AI to assist you in your sales role, but the reality is it's, it's a, it's a soft skills role. Right. It's you, you are face to face with people. So tell us a little bit about your keep it human. I know you're doing some. By the way, Nikki's great on LinkedIn. Go follow her. Um, she's also, she'll respond to a dm so reach out to her as well. She's doing coaching. Um, but yeah, walk us through like how you feel like it's so important to keep it human. What does that actually mean? Just walk us through kind of what, what you've been doing on.

Speaker B: Totally. I think now more than ever keeping the humanity in sales is such an incredibly valuable differentiator that if you figure out how to do this well, you will stand out from, you'll be in a class of your own. And that's for a couple of reasons. One, I think we've been so hyper focused on the formulaic sales process side of things like Challenger Sale, you know, medpic. Like the methodology side of it is important but I think we've over corrected a little bit. We've almost over indexed in that we don't even think about our buyer as a person anymore. We think about them as like their Persona. Right. Like they're a buyer. We have forgotten that they are a person with a whole life behind them. Um, and so we've over indexed on the process like the science of selling. And we have, we have kind of lost sight of kind of that art of, of selling which is that connection piece of it. The other part of it is the, you know, the rise of AI. You have to assume that everyone is going to question whether or not you are a real person or a Bottom, like, I literally saw a video the other day of a cold caller getting hung up on because someone thought they were a bot. Like, if you are so robotic in your cold calling that someone hangs up on you because they think you're a bot, like, you are missing. We're missing the mark, right? So you have to assume that everything that you write, every single email, every single phone call, every single interaction, people are going to be asking themselves, is this AI or is this a real person? And if you are like, toeing that line where people can't tell if you're an actual human, like, that is your value, right? As a seller, is your humanity, like your ability to, to have warmth and connection and exchange your energy with somebody. So I think right now there's like this shift that needs to happen back to focusing on the humanity because we listen, like, everyone's having the conversation. Like, is, are humans going to be taken out of the sales process? Well, guess what? Not yet. We're still here, right? So let's, let's outsource the pieces of selling that we can to AI, like account research, which is boring, or updating salesforce, because no one likes to do that. And let's refocus that time into the human connection part that is impossible to outsource to AI because, like, that's where your value is as a seller.

Speaker A: Yeah, I, I think that's great. And there was a word you said that hit me. Warmth. Unpackage that a little bit. Because I think in sales it's like, you'll hear, oh, you, you know, you need to drive value, value, value. And it has to be, you know, this no brain. Everyone's got their kind of own process. I love how you said the word warmth. I don't know that I've. I don't know that I've genuinely heard that as people kind of describe, describe their approach to sales and addressing prospects and things like that. You said warmth. Unpackage that a blip. Like, what does that mean to exchange energy, like you said, and really have some warmth with your, Your process.

Speaker B: Yeah, I'm glad that you. It's interesting that you picked up on that word. Um, so I made a post about this. It was, um, I thought it was going to be controversial, controversial post. But I literally said I care more about my buyer as a human than what I can sell them. Right. I view my buyer as a human first. And I think when you approach sales with a human first mentality and you remember that you're talking to a person, you start to care more about who you're talking to, you start to feel empathy and compassion. And when you feel those emotions towards somebody, it's much easier to connect with them. Um, it's much easier to find common ground. You know that, like, we're all supposed to build rapport at the beginning of a call, right? And they all tell us, like, don't talk about the weather, don't talk about where you live, whatever. But those minutes of rapport building are genuinely my favorite part of the call. I'm much more interested in just talking to somebody as a human. And then I'm like, okay, I guess we need to get into, like, the business part of it, right? And we do. We always end up getting there. But the most interesting part to me is who I'm talking to. Like, what is their story? Where are they coming from? Like, what's their perspective? Did they have a rough night last night? Did they, like, get stuck in traffic this morning? Are they having a good day or a bad day? I. I get really curious about my buyer as a person, and I think when you have that curiosity, you. You genuinely kind of exchange that. That warmth that I'm talking about, and it can't really be faked. Like, people are very perceptive, and they pick up on energies subconsciously. So it really needs to come from a genuine place. And I think when it does, buyers these days are so kind of taken aback by that because they're. It's. It's rare that they let down their defenses a bit. They become less protective and they. They open up to you. And it's incredible what a buyer will. How far a buyer will go to work for you when they feel that sense of connection and trust. I've gotten buyers that text me on the side, like, this is exactly what we need to do to get this deal. They're, like, giving me the code because we've made that connection, and they feel like I'm on their team, you know,

Speaker A: So I love that. And. And that.

Speaker B: And.

Speaker A: And I have a, um. What do they call? You know, I. I have a question for you around that, because I think right away you might get pushback, saying, well, why are you wasting time on the. How was your drive into the office today? How do you, you know, you're not getting. You're not doing the discovery questions that get you the information to be able to drive, you know, the pain in the. In the deal and then obviously offer the right solution that's going to solve for the pain. How do you confront that? Objection. Um, Because I'm on the same page. I totally hear what you're saying. I feel like especially with enterprise deals where you're at like you by the end of that sales cycle you probably know you're buyer. We have a couple of larger deals right now in pipeline for us and it feels like our entire team knows each one of these buyers and each one of the stakeholders and the champions. Right, right. Like we're always talking about how can we support them better. So how do you handle that objection of like you're wasting time talking about the drive in for five minutes and a 30 minute call or 10 minutes or whatever?

Speaker B: I mean it's all a matter of perspective. So I don't view that as a waste of time at all. I am always conscious of the clock. So I'm not going to spend 10 minutes of a 30 minute call talking about, you know, who we are as people like don't. Let's, let's not take it to the extreme. But I think like when you come from that genuine place of curiosity, you have more, you know, your, your line of questioning and the communication that you have in those rapport building, those initial moments are more effective. So it doesn't necessarily mean you have to do it for longer and like go into a therapy session. It just means you have to actually care when you are talking to them. And building rapport in the beginning of a call. The other thing is, I mean I would say like an enterprise building, it's M or an enterprise deals, it's much more important to build that trust and rapport upfront because we are going into very long sales cycles. You do become very close and work very closely with your buyers and enterprise deals. I think it's harder on the transactional side when you have less time and the sales cycles are shorter. But I still think that it's very important and there's always time for three to five minutes of genuine connection at the beginning of a call. It's just the matter of what energy you bring to that three to five minute time frame. Are you just like checking boxes like, oh, I'm supposed to build rapport? Let me ask you about this, this and this. Like people can feel that you're just rushing through to get to the next point. And trust me, you can lose a buyer in those initial three minutes if they think that you are just, you uh, you don't care about them, you're not listening to them, you're just rushing through to get, you know, to start talking about your product. They can feel that and they. Someone will shut down emotionally within and mentally within those first three to five minutes if they feel like you're just rushing through so that you can get your point across.

Speaker A: Yeah, that makes, that makes a lot of sense. And I, you know, discovery is important. You need information on the deal. Do you feel like you're weaving some of those discovery questions and you can, you know, we can break this up into like, first meeting scenario, second, third, fourth, whatever it looks like. But do you find that you're kind of weaving some of those discovery questions in or are you dedicated? When I talk to someone for the first time, I want them to feel human. I want them to know I care about their commute into the office today. How do you kind of think about, you know, doing those two things?

Speaker B: Yeah, it's. It's all like this beautiful, delicate dance.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: And that's why it really is an art form. It's like, I never stop discovery and I never stop building rapport with my buyer. It all happens simultaneously. I never stop caring about who they are as a person, and I never stop, you know, asking questions about their business. And, and, uh, they're, they're very closely aligned because a lot of times your buyers are, they care about their business, they. Or their job is on the line, or they like, this pressure is coming down from the executive team for them to get the right tool in place. And so empathizing with that and being like, man, that, that must feel like a lot of pressure to make the right decision. How is that affecting your buying process? Hello, I was just a human and asking about the buying process at the same time. Right. So it's like, it's about weaving that, that, that awareness, that emotional kind of awareness that eq, if you will, into the discovery process so that you don't forget or lose sight the fact that you're talking to a person. And if you do get too kind of formulaic or process oriented in your discovery, people feel that and they will, they'll just give you like the need to know. Right. They're not going to open up to you and tell you the rest of the dynamics that are going on in the team that can totally help you position yourself stronger in the deal. Right. Like, we don't always know the right questions to ask in discovery because we don't know the inner dynamics that are going on behind the scenes. So the more we can help a buyer feel safe and trusted, the more they'll kind of tell us. Okay, so you guys also need to know that this is happening. And we're like, oh, well, thanks for that. Right? Yeah.

Speaker A: Yeah. Uh, okay. Nikki, I love need to know. I've never, I've never thought about like, you're, you're either going to have an advocate and I want to unpackage to. You mentioned previously, you're going to get that champion that's texting you, hey, here's what we need to do in this deal. You're like, hey, we've got 30 minutes before the next meeting with the whole C suite. Let's, let's make sure you have this and this and this. And then there's the opposite of that where someone basically in your first few minutes of building some rapport, they feel like, well, I'm just going to give them the need to know. Like that's the, those are the two polar opposites. Obviously be working towards the other one. Um, when you do your coaching, is there, do you have like a framework we can leave with listeners today? Is there something kind of low hanging fruit everyone can go do and start doing tomorrow? Is it very case by case basis? Like how is, is there any nuggets you can kind of offer us today?

Speaker B: Yeah, but your listeners probably aren't going to like my answer to that. Okay, so, so my, my theory on all of this is that you cannot connect with your buyers if you are disconnected from yourself. And this is where it gets deep. Okay? This is where we get into the mindset stuff. You cannot connect with another human being genuinely if you are completely disconnected from yourself. And we're disconnecting from ourselves all the time. We're distracting ourselves with our phones. We're constantly engaged in distracting behaviors. Right. Or trying to escape our stress through, you know, unhealthy habits. So the place that I always like to start with my clients is, is getting quiet with themselves every day. You might call that meditation. You might call that like a moment of, of reflection. But you have to take a moment, not have to. I don't like the word have. But what I would recommend if you want to go down this road, is to take 10 minutes every morning to get quiet and center yourself and, and kind of check in with yourself and ask yourself, what kind of interactions do I want to have today? What do I want to focus on today? Kind of, I like mantras like, what am I going to repeat to myself today? To put myself in the right mindset, to keep myself grounded right there. There's a lot of kind of internal stuff that goes along with being able to genuinely connect with other human beings. And this is not for the sake of the sale. This is, like, for the sake of humanity. Right? Staying connected with yourself and connecting genuinely with the humans that you interact with throughout your day. And in sales, we're just given this beautiful opportunity to connect with strangers five, six, seven times a day.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: So I use, like, my sales practice is my opportunity to kind of shine a light and. And have these genuine connections with strangers throughout my lifetime. And so when you kind of see it, you zoom out a little bit and you give it kind of this greater meaning. It becomes incredibly exciting, and it. And it re. It can revive your passion and purpose within your professional sales career. Because those of us who have been in the game for a long time, we're exhausted. Right? It gets tiring. It's a lot of work. It's a lot of pressure. So being able to kind of tap into that greater meaning and what you're doing and why you're doing it, I think can really kind of be a, um, breath of fresh air.

Speaker A: I love it. And, um, this feels like right now would be when we read off the better help, um, advertisement in this podcast or something like that. Um, we obviously don't have that. Um, that is fantastic. I think, like, understanding yourself, why you're in the role. Sales is hard. Like, sales, and you can find a great role. You're hitting quota. You're going to Presidents Club. Fantastic. That, unfortunately, is becoming a smaller and smaller percentage of sellers out there. Um, um, so I love the fact that, hey, let's take some time, assess where we're at so we can be the best for our customers, potential customers.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: I think that is. I think that is a fantastic way to look at the role overall. And just how can I, you know, I mean, I love that we only have a few minutes together today. Nikki, I asked you, hey, what can you. What nuggets can you give to listeners? And you go right into five minutes. Work on yourself a little bit. You'll be better for everyone that you talk to throughout the day. Love it. Love it. We always ask the question, um, what does a great day in sales look like to you and I? I'm gonna love your perspective because we get, you know, hey, I want ink. I want the closed deal. That's a great day in sales. And then we get the far other end of the spectrum, you know, like, I want my team learning something every day. If it's a leader. Right. Or if it's an individual contributor. Oh, I just need to know that my deals are moving. You know, the Needles being moved. So lots of different answers over all of our guests. But for you, Nikki, what does a great day in sales look like?

Speaker B: I mean, it looks like this, Justin. It means having meaningful conversations with interesting people on a genuine human level. What, what more is there than that? Right? So, and, and though having those things tend to generate into massive deals. So guys, this is not like, like, you know, woo woo stuff. This all contributes to success down the line. So, and I think it makes it more enjoyable, uh, throughout the process. So yeah, that's a great dance for me.

Speaker A: I know, that's fantastic answer. And I know, I know a lot of sales teams that, you know, you get the, like, how many dials, how many emails, how. It's like very. Just these like numerical KPI. And then you get the ones who are like, how many conversations. And some will say like, oh, conversation over two minutes. No, leave it up to your reps to say, how many meaningful conversations did I have? How many? You know, I think that is where you can actually, you know, build a process around this very human approach. Around. All right, let's be humans talking to humans. And then obviously you can improve once you start, um, you know, tracking and applying some of these things. So, Nikki, want to say thank you for jumping on the podcast today. Fantastic, um, discussion and a very different approach. Like again, I told you this when we started the podcast. Lots of people come in. Here's the framework. I've been a CRO three places. Here's what we're doing. And then you come in and it's like, let's bring human back into sales. AI is great. And I think you laid it out well too. Of like, let it help you with prospecting, let it help you with deal prep, let it help you with, you know, uh, uh, analyzing your previous calls. You know, there's this long list of how effective AI can be when it's go time and it's one on one with your reps and bring that connection, bring the energy, bring the warmth. Um, I think that was it. So appreciate you. Any, Anything else you want to share? Uh, any parting thoughts? Again, Nikki's very available on LinkedIn. Reach out to her. Any other thoughts, Nikki?

Speaker B: No, I mean, I just, I, I also, I'm the self proclaimed mother of bdrs because I love the BDR community. Um, and I just am a real advocate for getting into tech sales in general, um, for any, any aspiring seller, especially women. Um, I think it's an incredible career and I just want to encourage everyone to keep going. Anyone that's trying to break in or trying to grow their career. Just keep going and, yeah, reach out to me. I love to connect on LinkedIn and I'm. I'm just honored to be here. Thank you.

Speaker A: Love it. Yeah. Anyone breaking into tech sales, you need a BDR mom. And Nikki.

Speaker B: Yes, exactly. Come under my wing.

Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Nikki, thank you so much. Appreciate you.

Speaker B: You got it. Thanks so much, Justin. Bye.

Speaker A: Thanks for listening to the great Day in Sales podcast. Check us out at Podcast Alicio AI or anywhere you stream podcast.